Berkeley CSUA MOTD:Entry 35749
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2025/04/04 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
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2005/1/17 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iran, Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Others] UID:35749 Activity:insanely high
1/17    Iran is next!
        http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/?050124fa_fact
        \_ And Hersch (and his informer) should be executed for treason.
           Didn't people complain that our intelligence in Iraq was faulty
           because we didn't have human intelligence on the ground?
           \_ HOW DARE HE QUESTION OUR LEADER!
           \_ Let's execute all dem "newsjournalists" for tippin' off the
              enemy while our boys are behind enemy lines! </troll>
           \_ What is treasonous about this article? Specifically,
              I want you to point out something that was published in
              there that the enemy doesn't already know. Are you against
              the Freedom of The Press now?
              \_ *laugh* take a look at the right wing republican track record
                 on any subject relating to freedom of the press and decide
                 for yourself.  Of course they don't support freedom of the
                 press.
              \_ I did not know that we had boots on the ground in Iran.  I did
                 not know they were the next target (thought it was Syria).
                 Freedom of the Press does not include shouting fire in a
                 crowded theater.
                 \_ You have to consider the possibility that some of
                    Hersch's sources might be feeding him disinformation.
                    \_ That doesn't change the fact that he shouldn't be
                       printing it.
                       \_ I know we have boots on the ground in North
                          Korea and Pakistan, unless the SEAL who told
                          me he had been there in the last year was lying
                          to me, a distinct possibility. I assume we
                          put Special Ops or CIA agents in places like this.
                          That is their job, after all. And Hersch job as
                          a journalist is to make sure we have a national
                          coversation about war against Iran before we
                          say, bomb the crap out of them. If Hersch had not
                          exposed the Abu Gharib torture, it would probably
                          still be going on. Would that be the best thing
                        \_ do you really thikn we have forces in NK
                           right now?  do they disguise themselves
                           as bowls of gruel?
                          \_ Are you a moron?  The Army had already started
                             their investigation.  Why do you think it would
                             still be going on?  The process was working.
                             \_ If you think it's not STILL GOING ON RIGHT
                                NOW, you, sir, are the moron.
                                \_ So there are still people being abused in
                                   Abu Ghraib right now?  What is your proof?
                                   \_ hey guys, I'm confused, are you talking
                                      about waterboarding, pyramid pileups,
                                      forced masturbation, sexual humiliation
                                      in general, or forced positions?
                                      thanks
                                      \_ I think he is talking about the gang
                                         raping of minor boys.
                                         raping of minor boys. Cons always
                                         hate sodomy, except for the non
                                         consensual kind.
                             \_ I don't know, are you ? We were still
                                toruring people at Gitmo for quite a while
                                afterwards and the only reason we stopped
                                was because of the public outcry over Abu
                                Gharib.
                                \_ Please show a reputable reference that there
                                   was continued abuse at Abu Ghraib after the
                                   military began its investigation.
                                   \_ I meant that torture would still be
                                      going on, not necessarily torture at
                                      Abu Gharab. We continued to torture
                                      at Gitmo. If we had not had that national
                                      conversation about torture, where even
                                      "Torquemada" Gonzalez repudiated it, it
                                      would still be going on.
                          for America? How bad would it have gotten before
                          it was exposed then?
                          \_ do you really thikn we have forces in NK right
                             now?  do they disguise themselves as bowls of
                             gruel?
                 \_ Syria isn't dangerous. There's no point wasting time with
                    them. By the way this article is the first time I've
                    noticed the use of an umlaut in words like cooperation and
                    preemptive (pree:mptive). Is that an established thing?
                    \_ It's a New Yorker mag thing, don't worry about
                       it. - danh
                    \_ Doesn't Syria have WMDs?  Aren't a non-negligible number
                       of insurgency leaders in Syria?
            \_ So you think Hersch should be executed for treason
               because he published a report that the US was sending
               Special Ops teams into Iran. Is that your serious
               contention? I think you are a loon.
        \_ "I'm absolutely convinced that the threat we face now, the idea of
           a terrorist in the middle of one of our cities with a nuclear
           weapon, is very real and that we have to use extraordinary measures
           to deal with it." -VP Cheney
           \_ Was that the line against Iraq or Iran?
              \_ VP debate, Oct 5 2004.
        \_ I don't think that he should be executed, like the loony Con up
           there, but I think he should have kept his mouth shut. It is not
           like he is exposing government wrongdoing, like at Abu Gharib or
           in the OSP case or numerous other times. -liberal
        \_ Does the article say whether any special ops teams are there in
           Iran right now?
           \_ "The American task force, aided by the information from Pakistan,
                has been penetrating eastern Iran from Afghanistan"
              \_ thx! -khamenei
                 \_ Next time RTFA!
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www.newyorker.com/fact/content/?050124fa_fact
home THE COMING WARS by SEYMOUR M HERSH What the Pentagon can now do in secret. Issue of 2005-01-24 and 31 Posted 2005-01-17 George W Bushs relection was not his only victory last fall. The Presi dent and his national-security advisers have consolidated control over t he military and intelligence communities strategic analyses and covert operations to a degree unmatched since the rise of the post-Second World War national-security state. Bush has an aggressive and ambitious agend a for using that controlagainst the mullahs in Iran and against targets in the ongoing war on terrorismduring his second term. The CIA will continue to be downgraded, and the agency will increasingly serve, as o ne government consultant with close ties to the Pentagon put it, as fac ilitators of policy emanating from President Bush and Vice-President Di ck Cheney. Despite the deteriorating security situation in Iraq, the Bush Administra tion has not reconsidered its basic long-range policy goal in the Middle East: the establishment of democracy throughout the region. Bushs rel ection is regarded within the Administration as evidence of Americas su pport for his decision to go to war. It has reaffirmed the position of t he neoconservatives in the Pentagons civilian leadership who advocated the invasion, including Paul Wolfowitz, the Deputy Secretary of Defense, and Douglas Feith, the Under-secretary for Policy. According to a forme r high-level intelligence official, Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld met with the Joint Chiefs of Staff shortly after the election and told them, in essence, that the naysayers had been heard and the American peo ple did not accept their message. Rumsfeld added that America was commit ted to staying in Iraq and that there would be no second-guessing. This is a war against terrorism, and Iraq is just one campaign. The Bush Administration is looking at this as a huge war zone, the former high- level intelligence official told me. Weve declared war and the bad guys, wherever they are, ar e the enemy. This is the last hurrahweve got four years, and want to c ome out of this saying we won the war on terrorism. Bush and Cheney may have set the policy, but it is Rumsfeld who has direc ted its implementation and has absorbed much of the public criticism whe n things went wrongwhether it was prisoner abuse in Abu Ghraib or lack of sufficient armor plating for GIs vehicles in Iraq. Both Democratic and Republican lawmakers have called for Rumsfelds dismissal, and he i s not widely admired inside the military. Nonetheless, his reappointment as Defense Secretary was never in doubt. Rumsfeld will become even more important during the second term. 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He added, If they cant comply, Israel cannot live with Iran havi ng a nuclear bomb. In a recent essay, Patrick Clawson, an Iran expert who is the deputy dire ctor of the Washington Institute for Near East Policy (and a supporter o f the Administration), articulated the view that force, or the threat of it, was a vital bargaining tool with Iran. Clawson wrote that if Europe wanted coperation with the Bush Administration it would do well to re mind Iran that the military option remains on the table. In a subsequent conversation with me, Clawson suggested that, if some kind of military action was inevitable, it would be much more in I sraels interestand Washingtonsto take covert action. The style of th is Administration is to use overwhelming forceshock and awe. There are many military and diplomatic experts who dispute the notion tha t military ...