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| 5/19 |
| 2007/6/5-10 [Politics/Domestic/President/Clinton] UID:46859 Activity:kinda low |
6/5 Pathetic liberal attempt to sway borderline Republican voters:
http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/06/05/democrats.religion.ap
\_ Because everyone knows all libruls are godless atheists, duh..
\_ Informal poll: who thinks Hillary Clinton is genuinely religious
in a sense her quote meant -- someone who uses her faith in God
to overcome difficult situations. -- ilyas
to overcome difficult situations. (Yeah that's what I thought)
-- ilyas
\_ What, other than antipathy, leads you to think she doesn't?
What about the others? If you believe in a strong separation
of church and state, does that invalidate your personal faith?
Too many people, IMO, would say yes. This is a real asshole
comment.
\_ This is an amazing comment. It's true I don't much like
Hillary Clinton, but I certainly don't dislike religious
people. I find it amazing, though, that some folks can
seriously consider her earnestly religious. That's just
not in her background or 'life trajectory' if you will.
Before this turns long and boring, yes I realize that
Hillary's religiousness is not a logical impossibility, but
statistically it's pretty unlikely. -- ilyas
\_ Antipathy toward HRC and/or liberals, not toward
religious people. "Statistically"? You're gonna need
to explain yourself. What percentage of Democratic
congress members would you guess self-identify as
Christian? Or of Democrats in general?
\_ That percentage would certainly be very high since
being an admitted atheist is political suicide in
the United States. I would guess the percentage of
genuinely religious people (in the sense of Hillary's
quote) is very low (it's not even all that high
in the general population). Politicians lie to get
elected, fyi. -- ilyas
quote) is very low. Politicians lie to get
elected, fyi. Someone can lie about religiousness
and get away with it because it is extremely difficult
to falsify if you are careful. The way I would
go about falsifying this claim is to look at the
people with similar life stories as Hillary, but who
chose to pursue careers other than politics. If the
percentage of 'genuinely religious' people among
that population is low, then the professed religious
feeling is based on constraints of the job (politics)
not actual feeling on the matter (unless you feel
that pursuing secular power makes people turn to God).
Finally, I have never disliked someone based on
their politics. -- ilyas
\_ Because everyone knows that Hillary is a shameless
self-serving carpetbagger who will do/say anything to get
votes.
\_ then you stopped at the headline. edwards "lives with sin
\_ She won her last election in New York by 2 to 1. Claims
of carpetbagging get a bit dull after the people have ignored
it twice..
\_ She's not from New York. She moved there so she could
run for Senate in a race she could win. Whether her
constituents are happy with her or not, the term
"carpetbagger" seems appropriate to me. Why do you think
it isn't? --alawrenc
\_ It may have been in 2000. She represented the state
for 6 years after winning 55%. She pulled down 67%
in 2006. I think you're missing the point to call her
a carpetbagger the second time around. The whole idea
of the carpetbagger is that it's someone who doesn't
represent the people. The electorate spoke vociferously
in favor of her representing them. How many terms has
Louise Slaughter served in New York? Is she a
carpetbagger? --scotsman
\_ I see what you mean, but disagree. I think the term
captures (appropriately) that it describes someone
to whom geography is merely a matter of political
expediency. Frankly, I'm surprised we don't see more
of this from both parties (prominent politicians
moving to other states to get elected), given that
politicians tend to be very wealthy (mobile) and in
professions that aren't tied to particular areas
(not the way wealthy landowners were tied to their
home states 200 years ago, at least). --alawrenc
\_ Because it takes time to build up a local name.
In her case she New York was an easy target with
an open seat and no competition from either
party. She hasn't had to run in a real race
until now.
\_ So how many terms would she have to serve with
landslide victories before "carpetbagger" wouldn't
apply? And back to the original point, how is
saying you relied on your faith to help you
through a difficult point in marriage shameless
and self-serving? Maybe it would be if you had
spent the last few decades bouncing from spouse
to spouse.. --scotsman
\_ I don't think any number of elections would
change that she moved to New York as a matter
of political expediency. I find it odd that
you think the appellation should go away after
two (and not one). As for the rest, I think
you're confusing me with the original poster
(I just thought the claim that she's not a
carpetbagger because she got reelected was
interesting). --alawrenc
\- i hate hillary clinton and i agree she
is a carpetbagger, however in the great
chain of scum, carpetbagging is a lot
less bad than corrupt, hypociritical,
torturing evil cyborg. in fact just
\_ You don't like Arnold?
focusing on hillary, being sanctimonious
and a soulless panderer are worse faces
of her than her cappetbagger self. if you
want to criticize hillary, focusing on
"she went venue shopping for a senate
seat" is lazy and proably just mindless
labeling.
\_ then you stopped at the headline. edwards "sins
every day". does that mean he's gay?
\_ "Edwards is uncomfortable with gayness"
\_ no, it means he's human. "He that is without sin among
you, let him first cast a stone"
\_ "It's a joke, son... Laugh..." |
| 5/19 |
|
| www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/06/05/democrats.religion.ap -> www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/06/05/democrats.religion.ap/ Clinton: Faith got me through marital strife Story Highlights Democratic presidential candidates discuss religion at evangelical forum Clinton: "I'm not sure I would have gotten through" marital strife without faith "I sin every single day," says Edwards. "We are all sinners" Obama says there is a risk in viewing the world as good versus evil Adjust font size: Decrease font Decrease font Enlarge font Enlarge font WASHINGTON (AP) -- In a rare public discussion of her husband's infidelity, Democratic presidential candidate Hillary Rodham Clinton said Monday that she probably could not have gotten through her marital troubles without relying on her faith in God. Clinton stood by her actions in the aftermath of former President Clinton's admission that he had an affair, including presumably her decision to stay in the marriage. "I am very grateful that I had a grounding in faith that gave me the courage and the strength to do what I thought was right, regardless of what the world thought," Clinton said during a forum where the three leading Democratic presidential candidates talked about faith and values. Video ) "I'm not sure I would have gotten through it without my faith," she said in response to a question about how she dealt with the infidelity. The forum, sponsored by the liberal Sojourners/Call to Renewal evangelical organization, provided an uncommon glimpse into the most personal beliefs of Clinton and rivals John Edwards and Barack Obama. The three candidates were invited by Sojourners founder Jim Wallis; most of the other Democratic candidates appeared on CNN later Monday to discuss their faith. The most intimate question came about the Clintons' relationship, one of the world's most debated marriages but one that the husband and wife rarely speak openly about. Clinton said she's "been tested in ways that are both publicly known and those that are not so well known or not known at all." She said it's those times when her personal faith and the prayers of others sustain her. Video ) "At those moments in time when you are tested, it is absolutely essential that you be grounded in your faith," she said. Edwards: 'I sin every single day' Edwards revealed that he prays -- and sins -- every day. The crowd gasped loudly when moderator Soledad O'Brien asked Edwards to name the biggest sin he ever committed, and he won their applause when he said he would have a hard time naming one thing. "I sin every single day," said Edwards, the 2004 vice presidential nominee. Edwards, wearing a purple tie to match Sojourners' signature color, promoted himself as the candidate most committed to the group's mission of fighting poverty. He said he doesn't feel his belief in evolution is inconsistent with his belief in Christ and he doesn't personally feel gays should be married, although as president he wouldn't impose his belief system on the rest of the country. "I have a deep and abiding love for my Lord, Jesus Christ," Edwards said, but he said the United States shouldn't be called a Christian nation. He said he has been going to church since he was a child and was baptized as a teen. He said he strayed from his faith as an adult and it came "roaring back" when his teenage son died in 1996. Video ) "It was the Lord that got me through that," Edwards said, along with both of his wife's cancer diagnoses. Clinton acknowledged that talking about her religious beliefs doesn't come naturally to her. "I take my faith very seriously and very personally," she said. "And I come from a tradition that is perhaps a little too suspicious of people who wear their faith on their sleeves." Each candidate was given 15 minutes to appear before the packed auditorium at George Washington University's Lisner Auditorium and a live audience on CNN. They were questioned by O'Brien and by church leaders across the country. Good verses evil Obama's appearance focused more on policy than the personal. Asked whether he agreed with President Bush's portrayal of the current global struggles in terms of good verses evil, Obama said there is a risk in viewing the world in such terms. Video ) He said he believes that the terrorist attacks on September 11, 2001, were the result of evil. But he said that the United States' treatment of prisoners at Abu Ghraib and Guantanamo Bay is unjust. "The danger of using good verses evil in the context of war is that it may lead us to be not as critical as we should about our own actions," Obama said to applause. Republicans battle on Iraq, immigration, energy Republican presidential candidates directed as much of their firepower at President Bush as they did at each other in Tuesday night's debate. |