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| 2004/7/1-2 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:31118 Activity:high |
7/1 Polish troops find wmd:
http://tinyurl.com/2fakx (story.news.yahoo.com)
\_ NO WMDS! FALSE PREMISES!
\_ Oooh. 16 warheads filled with mustard and sarin gas...Definitely
one step away from a mushroom cloud.
\_ This is the funniest thing about the "Bush lied" crowd.
"Sure he was breaking his treaties and UN laws, but he
wasn't breaking them ENOUGH." As if there was some sort of
objective measure of how much you can break a law before
you're considered a criminal.
\_ Nobody disputes that he was a bad man and a criminal. What we
on the left dispute is whether it was worthwhile to invade,
and if it was, we question the motives behind the invasion in
light of the fact that there were lots of other bad men to
go after. One of them was named Osama something...
\_ Which country is this Osama guy in charge of?
\_ Another false premise: that we can only go after one guy
at a time.
\_ No, it's not a false premise. We don't even have enough
troops to properly secure Iraq, so we're leaving the
new government of Afghanistan to fend for themselves.
As a result, they control only the capitol and the
Taliban is regrouping in the countryside.
\_ so you want another 130,000 troops in Afghanistan
so we can piss off people in two islamic countries
at the same time and surround iran with large forces
on both sides so we really would look like we're
ready to militarily take over the rest of the middle
east. please say you don't work in PR.
\_ That's not what I said. I said we don't have the
resources to take on two countries at once. We
shouldn't have invaded Iraq while we were still
busy with Afghanistan. There was not any
urgent need to invade Iraq. Except for political
reasons, it could have waited indefinitely.
\_ 16 here, 5 there, 7 over there and a few others everyday and
suddenly you've got a WMD program. What surprises me about
the Bush lied crowd is it makes no sense. If there were none,
and Bush knew it, why would he use that for the reason to
attack? They had several options, WMD wasn't the only reason
we could have attacked. So why choose something if you know
it isn't true?
\_ Because he arrogantly believed that it wouldn't matter after
the Iraqi people welcomed us with open arms and united to
create a perfect democracy in the Middle East. They didn't,
so it ended up mattering. As for the WMD program, wait for
the analysis of the warheads before making any judgements--
if they turn out to be relics of the Desert Storm age, you're
going to look very silly.
\_ As a "Bush lied" person, this is my take on it: He used WMD
as a casus beli because it garnered much more popular
support than removing Saddam and doing the "nation building"
Bush disavowed in the persidential debates. Bush knew there
would be leftovers from the Iran/Iraq war. He suspected there
were nastier weapons but didn't have any proof, but he
figured proof would turn up after the invasion. So he said
they had WMD based on a false hunch. That makes him a liar.
If he said "We think they might have WMD." that would have
made him not a liar, but it makes for a lousy speach. |
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| tinyurl.com/2fakx -> story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/afp/20040701/pl_afp/us_iraq_rumsfeld_weapons_040701212619&e=5 "He pointed out that his troops in Iraq had recently come across -- I've forgotten the number, but something like 16 or 17 -- warheads that contained sarin and mustard gas," Rumsfeld told Newradio 600 KOGO of San Diego, California, in an interview aired Wednesday. web sites) released a transcript of the interview Thursday. In Warsaw, Szmajdzinski confirmed the report, "Military intelligence officers obtained information from their sources resulting in the discovery of more than 10 missiles," he told Trojka public radio. "They were equipped with warheads containing substances which were subjected to analysis. "We didn't want to talk about this before the Americans determined what chemical weapon they were," the Polish defense minister added. The head of the US-led hunt for weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, Charles Duelfer, had reported in a June 24 interview with Fox television that 10 to 12 rounds containing sarin or mustard gas had been found. Pentagon spokesman Larry DiRita said Rumsfeld apparently was referring to be the same warheads that Duelfer had mentioned. A US official, speaking on condition of anonymity, said the number could have gone up since Duelfer spoke about them. Rumsfeld added that he had not seen the weapons or the results of the tests, but noted that the Poles believed they "in fact were undeclared chemical weapons -- sarin and mustard gas -- quite lethal." "And that is a discovery that just occurred within the last period of days," he said. Rumsfeld also said there had been "a lot of intelligence speculation and rumors and chatter about the fact that Saddam Hussein may have placed some of his weapons of mass destruction in Syria before the war. "Until that can be validated and proved, you'll find people in the administration not talking about it," he said. The question of what happened to Iraq's weapons of mass destruction -- or indeed whether it had any hidden stockpiles at the time of the war -- remains intensely controversial. David Kay, the former head of the weapons hunt, said on stepping down in February that it was unlikely there were any large stockpiles of weapons when US-led forces invaded Iraq last year, and no evidence had been found of even small stockpiles. web sites)-era mortar round with mustard gas that had been rigged to explode in a median of a road west of Baghdad. Two weeks later, soldiers found a 155mm artillery round that tested positive for sarin gas, a deadly nerve agent. Duelfer said that since then other sarin and mustard rounds have been found, some of them in southern Iraq in areas that were former weapons depots. web sites) were wrong, Duelfer said he could not say Iraq had hidden a "militarily significant" stockpile of chemical weapons. Nevertheless, he expressed concern that anti-coalition insurgents such as Abu Mussab al-Zarqawi, were trying to tap into the expertise of former Iraqi weapons scientists. The information contained in the AFP News report may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed without the prior written authority of Agence France Presse. |
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