5/10 I've been having a hell of a time finding any summer jobs.
Is anyone here hiring programmers for the summer?
\_ Unfortunately not. I've been trying to push our company
to hire a few interns this summer and its almost impossible.
No one wants to spend money on *anything* including interns.
\_ No.
\_ shit is tough right now, I've been looking as well...
\_ Think, "dotcoms bomb, programmers everywhere". Kid there are so
many unemployed and underemployed coders out there with years more
real world experience than you that you should forget about any
sort of technical job this summer and just find a nice beach. In
fact there are plenty of very talented and highly skilled people
out of work right now willing to take almost anything.
You just can't admit to yourselves that you are not that bright.
\_ Stupid dotcom programmers everywhere. I don't know a single
intelligent programmer who is having a hard time finding work.
The last time smart people had problems with work was 1930s.
\_ I think it has less to do with how smart the person is and
more to do with how "on the money" the company itself is.
if the company is a loser, it doesn't matter how "useful"
you could be because you're expending your smarts on stuff
that really doesn't matter to the people paying the bills,
which is ultimately the customers. Of course, it's harder
to get a job at a good company because you're competing
against the other smart people. And obviously, this is
because smart people look at the business plan and don't
go work for a loser. Ergo, dotcommers are NOT smart. QED.
I guess I just contradicted myself. Whatever.
\_ Yes, it's easy to use 20/20 to say what was good and what
was bad. If I was employee #1 at Netscape or Yahoo or
others I'd be a genius, right? No. There's a lot of
luck involved. Research and business plan examining only
goes so far. If it was that easy, then every business
plan would be a success as no one would ever have a bad
plan. You're not making sense.
\_ Well, Netscape had a crappy business plan; they were
a stock only company. I for one never saw anything
to it, it was clear early on that the value of the
browser was only strategic; since Netscape didn't
have anything to leverage the browser with it was
pointless. Yahoo is a decent company because they
actually have a business model and are useful.
But it's a web site; they don't need armies of
developers. Most of the failed dotcoms were hyped
bullshit and many people said as much at the time.
\_ Netscape was selling the server, not the browser.
You *could* buy the browser but that wasn't their
point. Yahoo is just a web site? You've never
actually looked at all the different shit Yahoo
offers, then. Go look around their site at all
the services (whether you find them personally
useful or not) and tell me that doesn't take a
lot of coders to write and maintain?
\_ it was the browser that had the value. since
they didn't take advantage of it when they had
the chance, i attribute it to poor management.
those "servers" obviously weren't demanded by
the market. the browser was; but it doesn't
make money on its own. i guess it's true that
microsoft killed them, but then who didn't see
that coming once IE 1.0 came out. as for yahoo,
it's a portal, they are a good one with a large
customer base, but that business model just
doesn't support a big overhead. how many is
"a lot" of coders to you? most of it looks like
monkey work.
\_ How many is "an army of developers" to you?
This is all beside the point. The front office
girl at NS retired a multi millionaire. Was
she a genius or she just get lucky? The point
being that you can't *know* for certain if a
small company will make it until it's all
hindsight and the post-analysis geniuses crawl
out from under their rocks and claim they knew
it all along.
\_ Yes, you rule the universe.
\_ No, but we are smarter than you.
\_ No, I'm certain you rule the universe. Afterall,
it's a fact that anyone who ever worked for a
company that did layoffs or went out of business is
a no-talent moron, right?
\_ You are making a clumsy strawman, no wonder you
can't find work. No, smart people get laid off
too, but unlike mediocrities like you, they can
easily find another job.
\_ I didn't make the strawman. Just rewording
the one that was already there. And because
I know you're concerned, I'm gainfully
employed. Thanks for showing concern. Are
you one of the academic employees here who
mistakenly believes that skilled people
always easily get a new job and lesser
talents don't? The world isn't like that.
\_ No I am not, I am merely a programmer
who was not laid off (because I was
actually useful to my company).
\_ Silly boy. A lot of programmers who
are useful to their companies got the
axe. No one is immune. You honestly
\_ I am immune.
\_ Only if you
work for a
company of
one and maybe
not even then.
--------------/
My company is an obvious
counterexample (60). The basic
point you seem unable to
comprehend is, despite what
managers tell you, in times of
belt tightening the fat, not
the muscle, gets eliminated.
If you were eliminated you
were not useful. If you are
still working, you are useful.
End of story. Stop
hypothesising (incorrectly)
about the possible state of
my company, or else continue
sounding the fool.
\_ 60 people? You work for a
tiny blip of a company and
think your company is immune
to the economy and the
marketplace? I've seen
perfectly good people get
axed at several companies.
You're fooling yourself if
you think your tiny little
speck of a company is some
magical wonderland immune
to a bad economy, management
mistakes, overhiring,
changes in the market which
make your product/service
obsolete or unnecessary or
any of a million other
causes of company downturn
and layoffs. Is this your
first job? You sound a lot
like my friends who thought
their first job was magic,
too.
\_ My first job sucked.
\_ If times get too tight
even you will go.
\_ Sure, along with the
whole company. This
will happen if we have
another 1930s style
recession, then it will
suck for everyone, even
smart people. Right now,
however, only idiots are
let go.
\_ That's all I ment
by the statement
that no one is
immune.
\_ 1930s was a depression.
\_ What's the name of
this special place you
work for (currently)?
I'd like to judge for
myself how long you'll
have a job.
\_ I ll know in a year
if the company
succeeds.
\_ *laugh* Not if
you get laid off
first!
\_ No way!
think the people doing the cutting
even know who the hell you are or that
you exist as anything more than an
employee number, a title, and a number
on their salary spreadsheet? You'll
figure it out one day. No one
important at your company knows who
the hell you are or gives a damn.
\_ Everyone important knows who I am.
It's not a large company, of
course. Stop hypothesising
(incorrectly) about the possible
state of my company, or else
continue sounding the fool.
\_ URL, please?
\_ Not quite. The large number of idiots currently in the job
market make it harder for employers to spot the worthwhile
job applicants. Also, many companies are currently under
hiring freezes, which make it more difficult for them to
hire worthwhile people when they *do* identify them.
\_ Kid, I hear the mall is hiring. Try Mrs. Field, they're always
hiring.
\_ And think of all the free cookies you and your friends can
get. Since your friends won't have jobs either, they'll
really appreciate the free cookies.
\_ In Portland all my friends had retail food jobs. Rent was
very low (less than $300) and we never had to buy food
due to our network. Our rent may not be low here, but
remember it pays to make lots of friends and always give
out free things if you can afford it. It will help you
through tougher times. -brain
\_ It's a good summer to do research and take summer school...
\_ I'm hungry. Go make me some fries.
\_ I'm not just making a burger. I'm making your burger.
\_ go work in las vegas.
\_ Those fishing boats up in AK might hire.
\_ Slave labor is always available in good times and bad, yes. |
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