Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2005:January:31 Monday <Sunday, Tuesday>
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2005/1/31 [Uncategorized] UID:35986 Activity:nil
1/30    jwang, what is your problem? Why are you nuking out of order?
        \_ jwang's been deleting political trolls, you should thank him
2005/1/31 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iran, Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Others] UID:35987 Activity:nil
1/30    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/4217703.stm
        Halliburton pulling out of Iran. I smell a new war in the future.
2005/1/31 [Politics/Domestic/911, Reference/History/VietnamWar] UID:35988 Activity:high
1/31    New York Times 9/4/1967:
        "WASHINGTON, Sept. 3-- United States officials were surprised and
        heartened today at the size of turnout in South Vietnam's presidential
        election despite a Vietcong terrorist campaign to disrupt the voting."
        \_ What would you identify as the Iraq equivalent to the Vietcong?
           \_ VC is easy, it's the NVA that's missing.  -John
              \_ Iran is Cambodia!
                 \_ Err, stop thinking, man -- you're not very good at it.
                    \_ What's wrong with that?  "No we're not doing anything
                       there, wink wink".
                       \_ Heh, okay -- fair enough.  I take it back, then.
        \_ Gyah, you're giving me hives.
2005/1/31 [Reference/Tax] UID:35989 Activity:nil
1/31    Turbotax for the Web: Worst.  Tech.  Support.  EVAR!!!!
        \_ Hey it's free.  Stop complaining.
2005/1/31-2/1 [Computer/SW/Editors/Vi] UID:35990 Activity:kinda low
1/31    What the fuck is wrong with you people who use emacs in "vi mode"?
        Why don't you just use vi???  I hate it when some loser asks me
        to help debug something and I see an emacs window and expect basic
        things, like C-n, to work!
        \_ Just a guess, but I assume people who utilize this probably
           want the additional features of emacs but were trained under
           vi. I personally use both, since you can't always get emacs
           but vi is virtually guarenteed through a telnet session. I,
           however, never utilized vi mode in emacs. I agree with you,
           might as well learn the fricking bind keys to emacs if you're
           going to use it. Emacs and vi are different enough that you
           can differentiate between the two in your brain during usage
           and switch modes accordingly.
        \_ In general I agree w/ you but I really love the elisp that
           lets me use % for paren-matching.
        \_ To taunt people like you...
2005/1/31 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:35991 Activity:nil
1/31    I thought it was interesting how NYT in earlier reports painted a very
        rosy picture on Sunni turnout, and LAT later came out with numbers
        which didn't fit the picture:
        Quoth NYT: "The figure [55 to 60 percent] was based on national
        returns, Mr. Ayar said, and included the provinces of Anbar and
        Nineveh, which have large Sunni populations.  The predicted low
        turnout in Anbar, a hotspot of Sunni resistance to the American
        occupation, was exceeded to such an extent that extra voting
        materials had to be rushed to outlying villages, where long
        lines were formed at polling stations, Mr. Ayar said...
        Even in the so-called Sunni Triangle people voted, too.  In
        Baquba, 60 miles north of Baghdad, all the polling stations that
        reported indicated a huge turnout.  In Mosul, the restive city
        to the north, large turnouts were reported, even in the Sunni
        Muslim areas, and despite threats and scattered attacks with
        bombs, mortars and small arms fire."
        http://csua.org/u/aws
        \_ Updated news --
           The fact that polling stations indicated a "huge turnout" in
           Baqubah, "large turnouts" in Mosul, and other Sunni areas
           most likely came from there being few polling centers there:
           "Voting was almost nonexistent in the largely Sunni provinces
           of Al Anbar, Salahuddin, Nineveh and Diyala, Western
           officials said. For instance, in Baqubah, a city of 300,000
           north of Baghdad that has a substantial Sunni population,
           just 17,000 people voted." [~ 12% turnout, Baqubah]
           http://csua.org/u/awu (LA Times, 1/31 Monday)
           "But some U.S. officials estimated that 175,000 had come out
           in Nineveh province, of which Mosul is the capital. About
           54,000 voters were said to have turned out in the city of 1.8
           million." [~ 6% turnout, Mosul]
           http://csua.org/u/awv (LA Times, 1/31 Monday)
           (If you say half the people in each city are kids, then you'd
           have 12% and 6% turnout among Sunnis.)
2005/1/31 [Reference/Military, Politics/Foreign/Asia/Others] UID:35992 Activity:very high
1/31    Can anyone recommend a good book on the Vietnam war?  I'm realizing
        I don't actually know much about it.
        \_ "On Strategy", by Harry G. Summers Jr. for a purely military
           analysis of why we "lost".  -John
        \_ "In Retrospect : The Tragedy and Lessons of Vietnam"
           by the architect of it all, former Ford exec, Cal grad,w/zero combat
           exp. , and so-called "Whiz Kid" Robert Strange (REAL MN)McNamara
        \_ <deleted> - chicom troll pretender
           \_ deleted by real chicom troll
              \_ WTF? -the REAL chicom troll
                 \_ Will the real chicom troll please stand up....
                 \_ You are ALL lying! -ilyas
                    \_ [ sign my name for me at your peril, bitch. -- ilyas ]
                       \_ Or what?  You're going to nuke the motd....*again*?
                          \_ Well I can learn John's baseball bat method, if
                             you prefer. -- ilyas
                             \_ Smith and Wesson beats baseball bat more often
                                than not.
                                \_ I have a 1945 issue Remington-Rand M1911
                                   too.  -John
                                   \_ Yeah, and I've got a baseball bat also.
                                      So what?
                                      \_ 1942 issue Remington-Rand M1911 beats
                                         baseball bat more often than not.
                                         \_ No, goddamnit, no!  No recursion
                                            is allowed!  Eat my exit-condition,
                                            beyotch!
                                \_ I d never buy Smith and Wesson, those
                                   wusses bowed down to the anti-gun lobby
                                   pressure.
                                   P.S.  My fans are starting to scare me.
                                     -- ilyas
                                   \_ Uhm, I don't think Smith and Wesson
                                      makes baseball bats, so that might be
                                      moot.
                                   \_ Speaking of baseball bats and BULLDOZERS,
                                      is browning any good when it comes to
                                      pistols?  Hipower?
                                \_ Don't make my hero bust out with the
                                   BULLDOZER!!!  Yeah, that's right.  You're
                                   all quiet now.  -- ilyas #1 fan
                                   \_ RPG beats BULLDOZER!!! more often than
                                      not.
                                \_ Assault rifle beats RPG.
                                   http://www.christophor.com/vids/iraqi.mpeg
                 \_ OMGLOL
           \_ Simple, the US got more than what it bargained for. Got
              its ass kicked by the PRC army in Vietnam. Nixon had to
                \_ PRC army in Vietnam?  -John
                   \_ Yes, one of my uncle actually fought in Vietnam.
                      It wasn't like the Korean war where the PRC dumped
                      millions of soldiers in it, but it's also more than
                      just weapon supplies. -someone from mainland
                      \_ are you sure your uncle wasn't fighting in
                         the sino-vietnamese war which happened after
                         the americans got kicked out of vietnam?
                         \_ Oh, come on.  Read a fucking history book.
                            Yes, there were PRC soldiers fighting
                            Americans in Vietnam.
                            \_ Maybe a couple, but considering that the PRVN
                               was primarily Soviet-aligned, and the USSR and
                               ChiComs weren't getting along to well (not to
                               mention long-festering border incidents which
                               ended up as a full-on war in the late 1970s)
                               the whole thing about "PRC KICK YANKEE GI OUT
                               VIETNAM!" is pretty silly, especially given
                               that the US didn't lose a single decently
                               sized conventional engagement.  -John
              abandon Taiwan and go to China to establish diplomatic
              relationship with the PRC precisely because of the
              Vietnam War, because they come to realize during later
              stages of the war that one of their main base has been
              completely surrounded by the PRC army, despite their day
              and night of non stop bombing in the surrounding area
              (which you can find references to in the history channel
              but they stop short of telling you what happens
              afterwards), they've come to realize they cannot prevent
              the inevitable and will be overrun. The loss of life
              will be unacceptable to the US public. So Nixon sends
              you know who secretly to the PRC to negotiate. In the
              end the PRC withdraw its forces and the US pulled out,
              leaving everything behind including their beloved K9
              dogs. To those who think the US pulled out because of
              public pressure, its all bullshit, but surely sounds
              better than telling the public, look, if we sacrifice
              Taiwan, we will have XXX less body bags to bring home.
                \_ Your history is hilarious.  You should write a book.  -John
              \_ you got your history all backwards and confused.
                 we chicom didn't fight in vietnam.  if we did, you
                 wouldn't have lasted that long.  it's only our little
                 sister the vietcong fighting there.  stop imagining
                 things.                - real chicom troll
                 \_ e.g. http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/ops/vietnam.htm
                    In short: both trollers and John are wrong.  China did
                    send a sizable number of soldiers (>~ one army division)
                    and though it wasn't convered extensively by the media, it
                    was never even a secret.  It didn't kicked US ass nor was
                    it ever intended to.  It's role is somewhat similar to US'
                    role in SK today: to convincine US not to attack with
                    ground force as it did in Korea.  Also worth noting: US
                    built SV into the world's 4th largest AF and army, and 5th
                    largest navy.  It is rather moot to say you never lost a
                    single conventional engagement.  That Austrian dude had the
                    world finest killing machines and still lost in the end.
                    \_ Thank you, good reading.
        \_ Watch "Fog of War" on DVD.  It's a very interesting one-on-one
           interview with the guy who was SecDef at the time.
           \- you might want to specify what you are looking for ... there
              are books by military people, journalists, photographers,
              political scientists/historians, intelligence people, and
              famous fictional works like The Ugly American or The Quiet
              American. --psb
                \_ Is _The Quiet American_ as good as _The Ugly American_ ?
                   \_ The book is nice, the movie's pretty but sort of
                      Graham Green Lite.
        \_ We Were Soldiers Once...And Young
2005/1/31 [Politics/Domestic/911, Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:35993 Activity:very high
1/31    Is Al Qaeda ineffective? I ask this because despite spouting so
        much bile and hatred they haven't really done much of anything.
        As the train accident in LA showed, it's easy to stage simple
        attacks and yet all they have to show are a train bombing in Spain
        and the WTC. I am starting to think the WTC was more lucky than
        good. Is Al Qaeda as large of a threat as most of us thought on 9/11?
        \_ Oh.  It's only 1300+ and counting.
           \_ 1411 to be exact.
              \_ Your number is old.  1435.
        \_ Al Qaeda is effective in the Russian guerilla warfare sense -- they
           are using very limited resources to tie up a LOT of resources of
           the enemy. -- ilyas
           \_ Understood, but I guess the surprise is how limited their
              resources really seem to be. Even Hamas seems to be a
              stronger, better-backed, and better-funded organization. They
              make the most of what they have, but what they have seems to
              be 'not much'.
              \_ Al Qaeda may well be smaller and less funded than Hamas.
                 Their only claim to fame is pulling off an attack on US soil.
                   -- ilyas
                 \_ And on US embassies.  And on US warships.  Not to mention
                    MASSIVE loss of US civillian life.  And the first WTC
                    bombing.
                    \_ All of this was on or before 9/11, no?
                       \_ Mostly, yeah -- I was responding to the notion that
                          WTC II was their only claim to fame.
                       \_ Bali nightclub bombing was after.  weren't there
                          refinery explosions in germany or something claimed
                          by al qaeda?  American compound in riyadh in may 03.
                          daniel pearl
        \_ This is almost stupid enough to call troll on it, but it's dim,
           so i think it's sincere.  Coordinated embassy bomings in africa,
           uss cole, etc.  now have expanded their presence to over 60
           countries.  they're dispersed, and growing, and bush hasn't done
           a thing to actually work on it.
           \_ Wow, now THIS is a troll. Since 9/11 there hasn't been one
              successful attack on U.S. soil. If your Al-Qaida was so
              powerful why haven't they done even one suicide bombing in
              America? Oh, I guess you're going to blame the LA train wreck
              last week on some sort of government cover-up. Tinfoil hat
              time.
              \_ As ilyas points out above, they've done an incredible job
                 costing the US billions of dollars, thousands of lives,
                 and tying up a HUGE portion of the US's military power with a
                 trickle of resources.  What should be obvious is that if we
                 didn't tie up those resources, then it's far more likely that
                 rather than military personnel lost in combat it would
                 probably be as many civillian lives somewhere else.  Your
                 observations are accurate, but your standards of evaluation
                 are all wrong.
                 \_ You seem to be suggesting that if we had not invaded Iraq,
                    the US would have suffered around 14,000 civilian terrorist
                    casualties in the past 2-3 years.
                    \_ [This is now incoherent because PP backed off of his
                        absurd assertion]
                        \_ [PP was too busy trying to beat the motd spinlock
                            and didn't think all the details through.]
                            \_ Motd spinlock never happens!  Someone who posts
                               way more than me says so! -- ilyas
                               \_ That claim was never made.  Reread the
                                  archive, dude.   -4 hp for poor reading
                                  comprehension.
                                  \_ Ilya was being sarcastic.  Now who's got
                                     poor reading comprehension?
                                     \_ Sarcastic...you keep using this word..
                                        perhaps it doesn't mean what you think
                                        it means.
                                     \_ You can be sarcastic AND wrong.
                                        Sarcasm is fun; being misquoted is
                                        irritating.  Crap.  Ilyas trolled me,
                                        didn't he?  DAMN YOU ILYAS!  -4 hp to
                                        me for being gullible.
              \_ Before 9/11 there hadn't been a us attack for many years.
                 And now there are all those nice soldiers in Iraq to blow
                 up instead.
                 \_ Attacking military targets isn't a particularly good
                    way to terrorize the US populace at large.
                    \_ You know the goal isn't terror.  Terror is just one
                       of many tools.  The goal is to further an agenda.
                       This isn't a Bond movie.
                    \_ No, but it terrorizes the Iraqi population, which makes
                       our job there harder, more expensive, and with higher
                       casualties to boot.  If they hurt the populace enough,
                       the US may even be forced to withdraw which would be a
                       PR disaster (not to mention a massive ideological
                       failure).  Also, if it gets bloody enough for our
                       troops, the government may even lose popular support,
                       which gives further validation to the effectiveness of
                       terrorism overseas impacting domestic policy (ie, the
                       US populace at large).
                        \_ so Saddamn didnt terrorize the iraqi populace?
                           \_ ???  Are you responding to the correct thread?
                    \_ But it is a good way to 1) drain our resources and
                       2) solidify and "train" their people.
           \_ On the other hand, if all of the attacks happen in the Middle
              East (e.g. Cole) then they fade into irrelevance. Same thing
              if the attacks come decades apart. You'd think there would be
              more attacks in the US, Japan, or Europe and yet nothing. To
              me this indicates they have a severe lack of resources and
              thus spend a lot of time planning to use them efficiently.
        \_ I get the impression that they have a few smart people at the top
           who move very slowly, and a lot of low level poor ignorant angry
           men.  Rember that 9/11 was years in planning and only then it was
           the second try to destroy the WTC.  I don't think they have
           the resources to make chem or bio weapons, but given enough time an
           a state-sponsor they could put them into use.
        \_ Yeah, I'd have to agree. That's why I was and continue to be
           surprised that people believe that that 9/11 has changed the world.
           Staging an attack on U.S. soil is *very* hard, but anyone can
           get lucky once in a while. There will not, however, be another
           attack on U.S. soil of any substantial magnitude (over 50
           casualties) masterminded by Islamic fundementalists in the next
           15 years (you heard it hear first).
           \_ I guess the idea is that they shouldn't have gotten lucky --
              US had gotten too lax in its handling of terrorism.  The
              World Trade Center was a wake up call.  It was the wake up call
              that serves as the 'changed the world' part.  That's just a
              guess on my part though.  You're probably right about the 15
              years part.
        \_ If Dubya didn't start the practice of scanning checked-in luggage
           for bombs, you can bet there would be a synchronized commuter
           plane event.
        \_ Yes, but how many unsuccessful attempts at terrorism has there
           been since 9/11?
        \_ why make a move when the great satan imperialist is sending
           its running dogs all over the place.  let them run around raging
           mad doing stupid things and waste money and get tired, making
           their friends turn away, and making new enemies, then when they
           are broke and exhausted and got kicked out of iraq with tail
           between their legs, then add insult to injury and start
           bombing and terrorizing them at their home again.  by then their
           will would be totally broken, and they will cry like girl.
           \_ Wow!  This r3wl5!!1!
           \_ You WIN!
           \_ I would suggest that the 'kicked out of Iraq' part isn't
              going according to plan.
2005/1/31 [Politics/Domestic/Abortion, Politics/Domestic/President/Clinton] UID:35994 Activity:moderate
1/31    Yeah!  That's what we think of you and your PROTESTERS!
        http://www.townhall.com/columnists/thomassowell/ts20050127.shtml
        \_ This guy's like William Safire huffing gas fumes.
        \_ You have been classified as: curmudgeon
        \_ He is spot on, point out one thing wrong w/ what he said.
        \_ Sowell is great, Visions of the Anointed is an outstanding
           book.
        \_ If we have more opinions for him than against him, the article
           will somehow stop being crap.
2005/1/31 [Politics/Domestic/California, Consumer/Camera] UID:35995 Activity:moderate
1/31    Brain Washing 101
        http://www.brain-terminal.com/video/brainwashing-101.html
        \_ All that brainwashing, and he's still a knee-jerk dittohead.
           How depressing.
2005/1/31 [Politics/Foreign/Europe, Politics/Foreign/Asia/Japan] UID:35996 Activity:moderate
1/31    I take it back, German socialism has my approval:
        http://csua.org/u/ax9
        \_ That's really sick.  No one ought to be forced to sell his
           or her body for other people's sexual jollies.
        \_ Mmm.  Emergent behavior.
        \_ Ok this is really funny.  An obvious fix to this insanity is to
           add male prostitute as a "forced job" -- Those laws will get fixed
           instantly.  Kind of like how in Japan the government was dragging
           their feet for 10+ years on the abortion pill (is it legal yet?)
           but Viagra was instantly approved.
           \_ The Japanese govt. was dragging its feet on _the pill_, not
              Plan B. As in, omgwtf?
                \_ Right, it's even worse than I remembered.
2005/1/31-2/1 [Health/Disease/General, Health/Skin] UID:35997 Activity:nil
1/31    Which motd people are trolls and which are...porcupines?
        http://csua.org/u/axc (contentious.com)
        \_ Man, I think I've been on the motd too long.  Their example of
           bad behavior sounds completely normal to me.
           \_ Agreed. More to the point, I find myself thinking that people
              who can't distill the essence from the blather are just as bad
              as the porcupines themselves. A sure sign I need to stop reading
              the motd.
2005/1/31-2/1 [Computer/SW/Languages/Java] UID:35998 Activity:nil
1/31    Is Java reflection the same as receiving RMI objects and then loading
        them dynamically? Is it a difficult mechanism to use? Can someone
        point out tutorials and comment on using reflection? Thanks.
        \_ No.  Java reflection is just a way of calling a function/creating
           a class/whatever when all you have is the name and signature.
           If you've used objective C it is a lot like how you can find
           a selector by name.  It really isn't a complicated api or
           concept.  Look at the javadocs for Class and the java.lang.reflect
           package.
2005/1/31-2/1 [Uncategorized] UID:35999 Activity:nil
1/31    Any place still give out free fax numbers?
        \_ http://efax.com still gives out incoming-only fax # with 20 pages /
           month limit.
2005/1/31-2/1 [Academia/Berkeley/CSUA] UID:36000 Activity:nil
1/31    Six system administrator positions available at Idetic (mobitv) in
        Berkeley: /csua/pub/jobs/idetic
        \_ Any idea of the pay scale?  They put a lot of low year-count
           numbers, but seem to be looking for senior IT.
           \_ Sorry, no idea--posting for a friend.  -tom
2005/1/31 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:36001 Activity:kinda low
1/31    Curious: what do you think the percentages are for Cal's Chinese
        student population, in terms of mainland PRC vs. Taiwan vs. ABC?
        \_ Don't forget Hong Kong.
           \_ HKG is PRC.
              \_ nah, they are culturally different, and unique enough
                 to have their own category. and don't forget us sporeans
                 and other se asian chinese.
                 \_ And, say, Shanghai or Shenzen (sp?) aren't culturally
                    different from each other or from the rest of China?
                    When I fill out official documents, I use "HKG, CHN",
                    not "HKG, HKG".
                    \_ Shanghai and Shenzen are culturally different, but not
                       as different as Shanghai and HK or Shenzen and HK.
                       \_ I think you forget that PRC is agrarian and third
                          world outside the special economic zones.
                          diff(non-SEZ CHN, Shanghai) >> diff(HKG, Shanghai).
2005/1/31-2/1 [Computer/HW/Laptop] UID:36002 Activity:kinda low
1/31    Which laptop brands are available with those eraser-head mouse
        pointer things in the middle like IBM Thinkpads? I know Dell offers
        it but I think I don't like the Dells. IBM is so pricy and uncool.
        \_ Is a ThinkPad T42 (sub 5 lb., 14" LCD) for $1,430 before tax
           on http://newegg.com too expensive?  Solid build quality and good return
           service.  See the Fujitsu S7010 on http://newegg.com too; Fujitsu
           has good reliability, but if it does break, expect a wait unless
           you buy on-site support.  (Buy only with Crystal View.)
           The S7010 and the Dell D600 both have a problem with leaving
           keyboard impressions on the LCD; the T42 does not I believe.
           \_ I prefer a bigger hdd, 512MB RAM, better gfx chip etc.
              I briefly saw this Sony at Best Buy and it seemed pretty nice.
              http://csua.org/u/axd
              Actually it was the higher end version. I would like to be able
              to play newer games on it but don't want a heavy one. I may
              have to wait a while yet. This Sony can almost fit the bill,
              only has max 64MB VRAM though and I want 128. Yep, I want my
              laptop to be a toy since that's about 70% of its value to me.
              \_ From my experience over the past couple years using and
                 repairing laptops (my own and other people's):
                 1. All laptops eventually break/fail. The average life of
                    a laptop is about 3 years. The fact that they're carried
                    around a lot and have consumables in the form of rechargable
                    batteries and they're not upgradable limits their
                    long term usefulness, so don't plan on getting the most
                    expensive laptop out in the market. Get what you need.
                 2. They also get stolen, obviously.
                 3. In terms of featureset I've found that Sony offers the
                    most features, followed by Dell, Toshiba, Compaqs,
                    HPs, and then IBMs.
                 4. In terms of price the they usually rank IBM, Sony,
                    Toshiba, Compaq, HP, Dell (depends on which models of
                    course).
                 5. In terms of reliability I've found that they're not that
                    much variation. I suppose the IBM, but it's just that
                    they have better service than the others, not that their
                    machines are more reliable. I think over the years it's
                    the couple of companies in Taiwan/PRC that manufacture
                    them so the quality has been pretty much the same across
                    the board, roughly though: IBM, Dell, Compaq, Toshiba,
                    and HP and Sony bringing up the rear.
                 6. In terms of service, well, again, it's somewhat across
                    the board mediocre except that IBM has pretty good service,
                    although I found Dell to be acceptable.
                 Also, whatever you do, do not buy a 256 mb machine, and
                 it's actually somewhat of a good idea to get a machine
                 with a multi-bay, because cd/dvd players do fail before
                 the main unit, especially if they're burners.
        \_ I once used a laptop with that kind of mouse, and after a few days
           my fingerhead started to get irritated.  I ended up plugging in a
           regular mouse.
2005/1/31 [Politics/Domestic] UID:36003 Activity:very high
1/31    Looks like liberals can look forward to losing the next
        generation, too:
        http://msnbc.msn.com/id/6888837
        \_ I blame the TEACHERS.
           Oh, that's funny.  That's exactly who the article blamed.. GOD.
        \_ This is hardly a surprise.  High School students don't have any
           Freedom of Speech, why should they see any need to protect it?
        \_ Think about it, teenagers have parents who limit what they
           can do, what they can watch, where they can go, what they can
           say, and who they hang out with. Same thing in school.
           In addition, the rights afforded to an adult are not present
           for an infant, so the first amendment doesn't even really apply
           to them. The survey should've been done in college campuses, not
           in high school.
           \_ You're right, for both the above reason, and because college
              students are less likely to lie because they think it's
              funny.  (Really, did you ever tell the truth in High School
              when the survey asked how often you had sex?)  The only
              problem is that college campuses may not include the
              uneducated.
           \_ Except I had those same conditions when I was in HS, and I doubt
              this would have been the result back then.
              \_ High school students are almost always going to be more
                 conservative than college students. People's views can change a
                 lot during the period from 14 to 24 (or so). Polling high
                 conservative than college students. People's views can change
                 a lot during the period from 14 to 24 (or so). Polling high
                 school students is not useful for this purpose.
           \_ Looking back when I was in High School, I think I was pretty
              clueless about freedom of speech issues, but I think I knew
              a lot more than the average student.  This article isn't that
              bad.
        \_ Why is this a liberal vs conservative issue? Liberals believe
           in censorship and suppression of alternate ideas as much as
           conservatives do (they are just different ideas, ex. print
           something about global warming is a sham theory or some other
           liberal sacred cow and the pot head profs come out in full
           force claiming that you are "misrepresentin'").
           \_ Do you seriously not understand the difference between getting
              pissed off over something someone publishes and trying to
              get publications banned by the government?  You bastards are the
              ones who mouth the words "small government" and then try to
              pass laws using the MEN WITH GUNS, to borrow your jargon, to
              restrict people's right to free speech.  Can you name a single
              instance of a book that liberals hate getting banned in a blue
              state?   Why don't you go picket outside the spongebob square
              pants studio with your fellow freedom lovers?
              \_ No, I really don't. It is the same damn principle. Both
                 sides want to keep ideas and information away from the
                 people. On one side it is stuff about science v religion,
                 the war, whatever, on the other it is stuff about global
                 warming, pollution, race, gender equality, Israel v
                 Palestine, &c.
                 The smart person knows that both sides are lying to him
                 and evaluates all information he recv based on this
                 presumption.
                 BTW, who is spongebob and why should I picket him?
                 \_ You are a complete fucking idiot if you think a scientist
                    criticizing some kind of global warming article is the
                    same principle as the government banning it.
                    \_ Global warming is just one example. Do you really
                       think that the liberals would let you print an
                       article describing the Palestinians as a bunch
                       of thugs and hoodlums who are killing the innocent
                       Israelis?
                 \_ Please list the books that liberals have had banned.
                    Wanting to ban is not the same thing as actually banning.
                    The only way your viewpoint has any merit has to do with
                    the preperation of course material.  The PC (liberal)
                    police has totally watered down course material to the
                    point of extreme blandness while the fundies are always
                    trying to push creationism down kids' throats.  I'm not
                    aware of liberal groups banning books though.
                    \_ I wasn't commenting on book banning. Frankly I don't
                       care who bans what book or if liberals ban one book
                       and conservatives ban another. It is ideas that I'm
                       talking about. Both sides want to make it so that
                       really only have one pov, theirs. So what if the
                       current gov wants to vet the newspapers? Except for
                       the Fry's ad and the comics they are full of trash
                       anyway. So they want to edit tv shows, tv is full
                       of trash anyway. There are very few things worth
                       knowing in this world and nothing can prevent you
                       discovering those things for yourself.
2005/1/31-2/1 [Computer/SW/WWW/Browsers] UID:36004 Activity:kinda low
1/31    Is there an easy way to wrap text at 72 columns in Mozilla?  Thanks!
        \_ Do you mean in HTML you're writing for a page or in <textarea> tags
           or while viewing source... More details, please.
           \_ Sorry--when viewing plain text with no line wraps.
        \_ <div style="width: 72em">....</div>
           Put the text in the div.  This will sort of work, but not great in
           a proportional font.
2005/1/31-2/1 [Reference/Law/Court] UID:36005 Activity:high
1/31    I got called for jury duty today. If I'm a student, what can I
        do to delay this summons? Thanks.
        \_ Most jury summons by mail will allow you to postpone your duty due
           to student obligations (school, etc).  Just set your postpone date
           to something after school is out for the semester and check the
           "student" box in the postponement section.  They even accepted a
           late postponement request from me (postmarked after the deadline)
           due to school obligations (they wanted me during finals).
           - jvarga
        \_ From what I understand you're not excused, but they'll take into
           account the fact that you're a student by assigning you a short
           (1-2 day) case if selected.  I'm not sure whether you can pick
           another day to show up.  The Orange and L.A. County web sites say
           full-time students can postpone jury duty to "school breaks".
        \_ As a teacher once told me. Write them and tell them that you
           can't come in during the stated times, but that you can make
           it up during a school break. Whatever happens, don't show up in
           person because once you do "they gotcha" (i.e., you may have to
           serve on a jury). Usually they are pretty reasonable with this
           kinda thing, they certainly don't want to arrest ppl for not
           showing up unless you are really trying to evade your civic
           duty.
        \_ Did you get the letter in the mail or were you notified that
           you would have to be available this week and were selected?
           If the former, you can get a letter from the dept saying
           that you are a full time student until may, which will get
           you out of service till summer.  If the latter, you will
           have to show up and tell them that you a full time student
           and would like to have your service postponed b/c of a mix
           up re dates for winter break.
        \_ or you can do what I do and just ignore it.
                \_ I don't mind postponing it, but the problem is that
                   they amazingly picked the first day of my spring break.
                   I'd like to postpone it until summer. Should I just
                   lie and say I'm in school that day, or would they
                   actually check up on my school's schedule?
                   \_ Don't lie, just tell them that b/c you only have
                      a week off, you probably won't be able to serve,
                      and you would rather do it during summer when
                      you can server.
        \_ In Alameda County, you can take care of all of this online, and
           you get two postponements per Jury Duty notice no questions asked.
           Read your notice carefully.
                      \- tell them you are a law student
        \_ ObJoke: "I believe I'd make an excellent juror.  I can tell if
           someone is guilty just by looking at them."
2005/1/31-2/1 [Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Troll/TJB] UID:36006 Activity:very high
1/31    After hearing a rumor about a CS student posting angry messages to
        the course newsgroups, a little googling turned up the name
        "Trevor James Buckingham", including an elusive reference to
        TrevorBuckingham.txt.  Does anyone have a copy of this document,
        or other Buckingham lore? -jenk
        \_ TJB was actually mentally ill at the time.  That makes it
           a lot less funny if you ask me.  --PeterM
           \_ At the time?  I'm pretty sure the dude is mentally ill
              period.  I think the particular strength of his wackiness
              may have been brought on by stress and/or drug use.
        \_ Perhaps an entry in the CSUA encyclopedia is appropriate.
           http://www.csua.berkeley.edu/encyclopedia.html
           --dlong
           \_ whoah! need major updates.
        \_ ah, tjb, that brings back memories.
        \_ AH HAHAHAHAHA... Oh man, I actually used to have a copy of the
           write-up somebody did about tjb, but sadly I don't know where it is
           at the moment.
           \_ You mean this?  /csua/tmp/tjb-reply.txt
              IIRC, this was after tjb got hit with a spam or something, and
              yelled at CSUA, only to have csua shrug him off -- then he sent
              that long ass rant to a csua-wide mailing list (I might be off
              on the details -- someone correct me if I am).
              Many thanks for Mr. Rosariet for his cruel wit   >:) .   -mice
              \_ That is but a brief moment in the complete and unabridged
                 saga of TJB. -dans
        \_ Yeah, so this actually happened twice, once in 61B when Clancy was
           teaching, and the following semester in 61C when Culler was
           teaching.  I was actually the one who compiled it, but since I was
           TA'ing 61C at the time I wasn't able to post it.  Fortunately,
           someone else did.  I'm trying to dig up a copy.  You might also
           consider tracking down the archives for ucb.class.cs61b and
           ucb.class.cs61c thought, for the life of me, I can't recall exactly
           which semesters that was. -dans
           \_ All hail the mighty internet archive:
              http://web.archive.org/web/*/www.gelatinous.com/danh/trevor
              Okay, so there are actually a fair number of holes, but some
              archive is better than none. -dans
        \_ ilyas VS. tjb, FIGHT!!!
           \_ Criple fight! Criple Fight!
        \_ whatever happened to tjb?  did he ever come back to ucb after
           northwester (?)?
        \_ There's an archive dedicated for tjb:
    http://csua.com/Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Troll/TJB
        \_ Don't forget jsampson actually partnered with TJB.
2017/09/22 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
9/22    
Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2005:January:31 Monday <Sunday, Tuesday>