Reference BayArea - Berkeley CSUA MOTD
Berkeley CSUA MOTD:Reference:BayArea:
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Berkeley CSUA MOTD
2022/01/17 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular

2004/2/26-27 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley] UID:12421 Activity:nil
2/26    If you have comcast in berkeley, would you please do some fast
        pinging and find out at what rate do you start to get packet loss
        (of ICMP ping packets). I moved out of state and can only send 2
        pings a second.  I want to tell the comcast folks here what the
        ping rate in berkeley is. If I remember correctly, it was much
        higher. Thanks.
        \- 2ping/sec ... you arent hitting the sun icmp throttle are you?
           why do you need to send pings faster? --psb
            \_ To rapidly gather network link quality statistics.
                I can _send_ pings faster than 2/sec, but they get
                dropped by the comcast equipment upstream.
                What's the "sun icmp throttle"?
                    \- you have exceeded your anonymous privilages --psb :-)
                        \_ Why do you care?
                           \_ Falls under the "self righteous prick" policy.
                \_ comcast will not let you "rapidly gather network link
                   quality statistics."  That's their job, and there's no
                   reason they'd want to let you hose their network.
                   \_ In berkeley I could ping > 2/sec.
                      In portland I can not. Same comcast company.
                      A network cannot be hosed by 50 pings /second.
                      I'm not doing anything malicious. When the network
                      has problems, I like to run mtr.  Would somebody in
                      berkeley please run a short test to determine what
                      the icmp limit is there?
                      \_ What if all 200 people on your local net sent 50/s?
                         \- the throttle is probably an anti-DoS measure in
                            part. i dont think this is too unreasonable.
                            blocking all icmp echo/echo_reply would suck.
                            again, you can use tcp/udb echo ... it might be
                            intersting to see if you can basically write ping
                            with getnetmask --psb
                         \_ Would you be concerned if they raised it to 20/s?
                         \_ Would you have a problem if they raised it to 20/s?
                         \_ Hey, they didn't have this low a limit in
                            Berkeley, and the sky did not fall. Could you just
                            find out what the Berkeley limit is. That's all.
2004/1/28 [Reference/BayArea, Consumer/Audio] UID:11984 Activity:nil
1/28    I have a pair of Sennheiser headphones that I've had for a long time
        and I really like but recently I've had a problem where the sound in
        one ear (or occasionally both) cuts in and out. I think it's a
        problem with the connector and not the headphones themselves... I can
        order replacement connectors online but is there somewhere in the bay
        area I can take these where i can try out new connectors before I
        buy them and make sure that's the problem? (South Bay would be great
        but I'll go to SF or East Bay if necessary).
        \_ Fry's?  Some audio-video place?  Try wiggling the connector
           around to see if the sound changes.
        \_ Take it to Magnolia Hi-Fi across from Valley Fair. They carry
           Sennheisers, and I'm sure they'd let you connect yours to one of
           their cables. But don't buy from them... way overpriced (i bought
           my HD-590's for over $100 cheaper online)
2004/1/24-25 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley] UID:11918 Activity:kinda low
1/23    My wife heard there was a big buddhist temple in Berkeley. If
        any of you know of one, please let me know (Name, address). TIA!
        \_ She may have been talking about
   which is right next to the
           infamouse "Thai Brunch," served out of another temple.
           You can get yummy Thai food, one block north of the Ashby BART
           station on Russell.  Brunch is every Sunday morning, opens at
           10am, runs out of food around 12:30          - brain
        \_ I don't know the address, but it's in the Berkeley Hills behind
           frat row somewhere.  I used to be able to see it from my window
           in the co-ops.
           \_ Do you know the street or a nearby street?
              \_ somewhere around here:
                 didn't you used to be able to move the star on these things?
                 back by CCRP, behind Prospect somewhere.
              \_ dude, just stfw.
        \_ You don't mean the Nyingma institute, do you?
        \_ Thanks for all yer suggestions. We'll check some out today.
           If you know of anymore, lemme know. -op
2004/1/18 [Reference/BayArea] UID:11821 Activity:nil
1/17    What's a good store to buy a watch? SF/Berkeley. Looking to
        spend <$100, mens watch. Either sporty or elegant, but not
        oldfashioned boring, not digital Casio type.
        \_ I don't know a good watch for <$100.  I know a good watch for
           less than <$300 (might be able to get it for <$200 now).  -- ilyas
        \_ What is a "good" watch for you anyway?  They'll all keep proper
           time.  Just set to the clock tower and don't worry about it.  Who
           are you trying to impress with this <$100 decent watch?
        \_ Macy's.
        \_ Swatch chronographs are ~$100... somewhere from $90-130. There are
           some nice sporty ones you can get.
        \_ Skagen watches have a nice sense of design and there are ones that
           clock in at less than $100.
        \_ seiko automatic dive watch.  a little more than $100, but never
           buy stupid stinking batteries for your watch ever again.
        \_ I like Mondaine watches. Simple and nice.  $125 and up.
2004/1/11-14 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley] UID:11747 Activity:nil
1/10    Lenscrafters sucks. Any recommendations for places to buy
        frames and lenses? Berkeley or downtown SF.
        \_ Costco is pretty cheap.
        \_ I like Dr. Harlan Wong, but he ain't cheap. -ausman
        \_ Focal Point Opticians, Ashby ave in Berkeley.
        \_ Dr. Stephen Chun, Berkeley Optometric Group, Shattack & Haste.
2004/1/1-2 [Reference/BayArea] UID:11643 Activity:nil
1/1     Any SF/Berkeley store where I can try out a headphone amp? I'm
        suspicious about them, but all the reviews I've read rave about
        \_ Order one from  There's a 30-day return policy.
           Just make sure that your headphone is worthy of an amp.
2003/12/9 [Politics/Domestic/California, Reference/BayArea] UID:11369 Activity:high
12/8    If you are a San Franciscan, vote today. This is going to be
        a very close race and every vote will count.
        \_ soda poll?
           Gonzalez: ....
           Newsomm: .
           !psb: .
           \_ poll of those who wish they could vote
              Gonzalez: ..
        \_ Yes, your choices are A) drive businesses out in 5 years
           or B) drive businesses out in 1 year
           \_ You don't know much about SF, do you?
2003/12/9 [Reference/BayArea, Recreation/Food] UID:11365 Activity:nil
12/8    Top Dog in San Jose opens this Wednesday, 10:30 a.m. to 9 p.m.
        11th St. and San Carlos.
        \_ Barf.
           \_ You won't appreciate how good Top Dog really is until you
              have been away from Berkeley for a while.
              \_ hmmm. i've only been away for five years, so that must
                 be why it sounds nasty.  Maybe in another five years
                 i'll understand.
                 \_ It took me ten years to be able to appreciate Top Dog.
              \_ Again, barf.  Retch.  Try Rosamunde in the Lower Haight, SF,
                 for a real sausage.
                 \_ That's a bit of a drive from San Jose.
        \_ When do we get a Top Dog in downtown SF ??
2003/12/6-7 [Reference/BayArea] UID:11340 Activity:low
12/6    Boston protests >> SF protests
        \_ Many ugle people in that photo.
2003/11/20 [Reference/BayArea] UID:29646 Activity:very high
11/19   So how many of you Berkeley educated Bay Area sysadmins are going
        to make more than $107k this year:
           I'm not a sysadmin, and my salary is less than 107k, but it's
           worth more because of lower cost of living here: .
           I am 3133+: .
           Not me: .
        \_ How many of your Berkeley educated Bay Area non-sysadmins have a
           bigger dick than this guy?  I'm guessing all of us.
        \_ what is 3133+e, spell it out, don't use uncommon wire messages.
           you are not an alien.  If sysadmins get paid $107k/yr, should
           software engineers get paid more than that?
                \_ Depends on yer benefit to the company. If everyone
                   depends on you to keep yer servers up, might be worth
                   more than a programmer...
                   \_ Supply and demand. Good people of any type are hard to
                \_ what makes you think a programmer is worth more than a
                   sysadmin, other than your being a programmer?  the schools
                   are cranking out good coders.  they're not making sysadmins.
                   it's also pretty hard to outsource your sysadmins to india.
                   programming is getting easier every year.  sysadmining is
        \_ is that adjusting for public sector being 20-50% under industry?
        \_ What's special about 107K?  I guess it's your salary.  Well,
           I happen to earn more than that.
2003/11/12 [Reference/BayArea] UID:11044 Activity:insanely high
11/12   What is America's shittiest city or metropolitan area? vote now!
        Bay Area in General: .......
        \_ ugly girls, lack of girls, overpriced housing, pay sucks relative
           to cost of living, gas expensive, car maintenance expensive,
           Chinese restaurants inferior to Los Angeles
           \_ Lack of girls?  Someone needs to get out of the 3rd floor of soda.
              \_ They're there, but they are ugly. On the plus side, they are
                 less picky than the princesses in LA.
                 \_ Yup, and they give it up a lot more often.
        Berkeley, CA: ...
        \_ you guys haven't seen shit then.
           \_ Let's see, 4 years in Berkeley and I have had:
                bank robbery: 1
                break in: 1 (stolen VCR, etc.)
                thefts: 4 (2 bikes plus 2 bike wheels, 1 leather jacket)
                car jack at gun point: 1 (ok, not me but my friend)
                con job: 1 (got conned for $50, ok, I was a dumb freshie
                         then. did catch the con man trying to con
                         another student several weeks later, and told
                         him to fuck off.)
                \_ brother of my friend got hit with a fucking iron pipe on
                   the head from behind, while he was walking home from Soda
                   along that dark little diagonal passageway with bushes all
                   around.  Managed to come to later, and crawl to the
                   hospital.  Yay Berkeley!
                \_ I've lived in Berkeley all my 23 years and the only crime I
                   was a 'victim' of was living with a screaming crazy person
                   for 3 months.  Are you guys just really unlucky?
                   \_ more likely just really naive easy targets
                      \_ If walking along dark little paths after dark is
                         indicative, then I'd have to say 'Yes'.
                \_ My friend was offered a pile of human feces on wax paper.
                   \_ I don't think stealing my stories works with cable modem.
                \_ lock both bike wheels to the bike/post, don't leave leather
                   jackets unattended in the library/cafe
                \_ what was the con?
                \_ first summer, broken into and tied up in bed with electric
                cords from alarm. Chased down in my own complex's court yard
                by Police who broke the fence into a secured apartment
                complex and  chased me into my own apartment for standing
                outside in my own courtyard.
        Anywhere in Utah: .
        Cleveland, OH: .
        Detroit, MI: .
        Houston, TX: .
        Oakland, CA: ..
        Washington, DC:
        San Francisco: ..
        \_ What are you crazy?  Oh right, motd people only like bland suburbs
           with spacious parking and plenty of franchise restaurants.
           \_ Are you wearing enough flair?
           \_ I work and socialize there.  It's a dump.  It was semi decent
              about 15 years ago but is shit today.  So yeah, SF gets a vote.
              Why do you assume I prefer bland?  I prefer not stepping around
              homeless people shitting on the side walks or seeing the
              aftermath of my friend getting a gun put in his face after they
              pistol whipped him and stole the few things he had on him.  So,
              yeah, did I remember the "fuck you!" part of this?  I think I
              didn't.  Here comes!  Fuck you!
               \_ How about Compton?  Surely SF can't be worse than Compton?
                  Even if you think they are both dangerous or have too
                  many homeless people/social problems, at least SF also has
                  many good points, good restaurants, culture, public
                  transportation, etc.
                  \_ I added my city.  Go add compton if you want.  I've never
                     been there.
              \_ Hey, how about fuck YOU?  All urban areas have problems.  Go
                 to the suburbs if you don't want to see them.  San Francisco
                 has lots of nice neighborhoods and tons of incredible culture
                 and residents.  If you just hang out in SOMA with the rest of
                 the clubbers, and downtown with the rest of the office drones,
                 yeah, you'll think its a dump.  Get a life, Mr. Bridge and
                 Tunnel, and try some of the other parts of the city.  You might
                 even learn something.  Fucker.
                 \_ I've lived in several big cities, and I think San Francisco
                    is below average.  I like the Bay Area, but not San
                    Francisco.  - yet another poster
                    \_ I love surface judgements.  When I used to live in
                       Oakland, people would talk mad shit about how horrible
                       it was, and yet most of them had never done more than
                       drive through it once or twice and maybe had lunch
                       downtown or been to a party or three.  They just listened
                       to other people's preconceived notions or whatever bs
                       the chronicle published.  Once you got to know it, it
                       was a really interesting place with lots of buried
                       little secrets.  And best of all, there weren't any
                       morons around because they were too busy listening to
                       people's stupid attitudes about the place.  Yeah, its
                       got big issues, but so does any place that isn't a bland
                       suburban nightmare.  I can also say that though I lived
                       in a supposedly "bad," working class neighborhood of
                       Oakland for four years, the ONLY place I was ever a
                       victim of crime was in Berkeley.  As for San Francisco,
                       once again, most of the places that "visitors" flock to
                       are for sucktards.  I live in Hayes Valley now, just
                       north of the Lower Haight, and I wouldn't want to live
                       anywhere else.
                       in a supposedly "bad," working class neighborhood for
                       four years, the ONLY place I was  ever a victim of
                       crime was in Berkeley.  As for San Francisco, once
                       again, most of the places that "visitors" flock to are
                       for sucktards.  I live in Hayes Valley and I wouldn't
                       want to live anywhere else.
        Reno, NV: .
        Carson City, NV: .
        Las Vegas, NV: .
        Kenner, LA: .
        Baltimore, MD: .
        Philadelphia: .
        San Bernardino, CA: .
        Wherever It Is You Fuckwits Live: .
        \_ you know where they live.  just put "california." see above.
           \_ I'm glad you tards are staying out of California.  Housing prices
        Reno, NV: .
        Carson City, NV: .
        Las Vegas, NV: .
        Kenner, LA: .
        Baltimore, MD: .
        Philadelphia: .
              are high enough as it is with you and your larvae.
              \_ the idiotic housing shortage isn't caused by overcrowding,
                 dumbass.  I'd say something about what the problem is, but
                 your genius governor would make me do 400 situps.
                 \_ Talk about missing the point.
2003/11/3-4 [Reference/BayArea] UID:10920 Activity:nil
11/3    Is there a site similar to for the south bay
        area?  I think the site is really useful, especially the medical
        professional recommendations and stories.  Thanks.
        \_ motd subtle-grammatical-error corrector
           \_ I don't think this can be considered a correction... the
              sentence was grammatically correct before: "I think the site
              really useful..."  This grammar bullshit is really getting
              out of hand.
              \_ if it were "I consider the site really useful", I'd agree.
                 \_ forgive, he's EFL.
                    \_ oh, definitely.  My point in correcting was
                       distinguishing between subtle points of dialect (which
                       I'm happy to ignore or clarify) and the kinds of verb
                        conjugation problems / plurality disagreement
                        that plague, apparently, only one unnamed Sodan.
        \_ Maybe check stanford's site / Craig's List for a start
2003/10/27-28 [Reference/BayArea, Recreation/Media] UID:10813 Activity:nil
10/27   Support your fellow Sodans!  watch their movies!
        "Xtremely Xtreme" starring scotsman and shac will be playing at
        the Roxie Theater in SF, tonight (Monday) at 7pm and 9:30pm
        and again at 7pm on Wednesday.  Tickets are $7.  See you there! -brain
        \_ Is it anything like Extreme Teen?
           \_ it's kind of like the E! True Hollywood Story, about a reality
              show called "Xtremely Xtreme."  it's 10 minutes long and has
              screaming and a lesbian beat poet.  Try it you'll like it!
              Note that it WILL sell out so plan to arrive early.  There will
              of course be other shorts playing as well.  But vote for mine
              anyway!                                   -brain
2003/10/22-23 [Reference/BayArea] UID:10738 Activity:nil
10/21   For South Bay folks: Top Dog opening in San Jose.
        \_ Finally!!
        \_ Now you can get ill in two counties!
        \_ Wow, you should hurry to apply!
        \_ Life. is. good.
2003/10/10-12 [Reference/BayArea, Computer/SW/Security] UID:10580 Activity:nil
10/10   Any recs. for the cheapestpossible cell service in the bay area that is
        more-or-less decent?  Only need for occasional use.  Want to minimize
        the $/month.
        \_ Never used it myself, but they say MetroPCS is good if you only
           call within bay area.
           \_ Thanks, but I am looking for the CHEAPEST.  MetroPCS is $35/mo
              \_ I don't think you're gonna find any cheap plans below $30
                 these days with most providers.  My gf's sister and parents
                 have a really old plan of $10 a month, and Verizon's gonna
                 kick them off the plan in few months.  Perhaps you should
                 look into prepaid cells.  AT&T and Virgin has 'em.
                 \_ Cingular also has prepaid.  $0.35/minute for peak time
                    and $0.10/minute at off peak.  Prepaid card starts
                    at $10 and must be refilled every 30 days.  $20 and
                    above card expires 90 days.  I think you get to keep
                    any leftover $ everytime you refill your account.
                    \_ Thanks, that's what I was thinking of
                           You can get wireless for as low as $10/45 day
                           period. Minutes will roll-over if you recharge
                           your acct before the minutes expire.
2022/01/17 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular

2003/10/8 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/Others, Reference/BayArea] UID:10523 Activity:nil
10/7    Despite being hit the hardest in terms of the economy, 60% of Bay Area
        voters voted no on the recall.  Now the movie begins.
        \_ What gave you the idea that the BA was hardest hit?  H1bs going
           back to India don't count.
              \_ Most of them came here specifically for dotcom jobs when the
                 rate was under 2% and when they go home the rate will look
                 normal again.
           \_ do you count jobs going to India?
              \_ Jobs not here are jobs not here.  I really don't understand
                 what you're getting at.
2003/10/3 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley] UID:10439 Activity:high
10/2    I just met a Cal alum who told me that in the 80s it was legal to
        carry up to 4 rolled joints in Berkeley.  True?  When did that change
        and why?
        \_ When I was an R.A. in the early-mid 90s, we had a training/info
           session with UCPD.  One of the topics was drug use/possession in
           the Res Halls.  As I remember, the officer told us to not bother
           calling them about a student in possession of marijuana in the
           amount of 1-3 joints.  They said they just would not bother with
           it, and told us to write it up, and just flush it down a toilet.
           I am not sure if it's "legal" to have a joint, just that they
           are not going to enforce it.  --chris
           \_ Well the story as told was that he saw 2 guys walking down
              telegraph smoking, and 2 cops coming from the other direction.
              Instead of busting them or frowning, one cop took a quick puff.
        \_ It's not legal. However, you can't get charged with the felony
           "possession with intent to deal."
        \_ In the early 90s the Berkeley City Council passed a rule telling
           the PD that marijuana enforcement was their "lowest possible
           priority." It still wasn't legal, but almost.
        \_ Pseudo decriminalised as one of the above posters says.
        \_ Marijuana possession was decriminalized so that small amounts
           are ok so that most users (i.e., white ppl) won't be jailed, but
           most dealers (ppl of color, i.e., not the middle ppl dealers)
           are jailed. You don't want your pot smoking in college to catch
           up with you when you get into the real world, right? If it wasn't
           decriminalized, you couldn't run for governor or president or
           hold a decent job.
          \_ Not only dealers of color but homeless users are regularly
             prosecuted as well.  How many frat boys do you see charged
             with public intoxication?  How many homeless people?  -sky
             \_ Somehow I don't find myself really sympathetic to "drug dealers
                of color" as some sort of protected class.  How unfortunate
                that "drug dealers of color" are prosecuted.  How many do I
                see charged with anything?  I've been living in Berkeley for
                several years longer than you and I've never seen *anyone*
                charged with public intoxication or much of anything else.
                Crime has been decriminalised in Berkeley.  It's unfair to
                the criminals to prosecute them!  We don't prosecute the
                non-criminals, right?  So why punish just the criminals?
2003/9/10-11 [Reference/BayArea] UID:10140 Activity:nil
9/10    What's a good store in SF/Berkeley to buy good, cheap sunglasses?
        I used to get them at Bancroft Clothing, but their selection
        sucks now.
2003/9/8-9 [Reference/BayArea] UID:10112 Activity:nil
9/8     Voight-Kampff the mayoral candidates:
        \_ i found it moderately annoying that they moved the movie to LA
           even thought the book was in SF.  stupid hollywood.
        \_ even though SF is more cosmopolitan than LA and more built up, LA
           is more of a shithole in the present.  Plus the smog is already
           really bad; it's less of a stretch.
           \_ I was there last month.  Smog was near zero.  The air smelled no
              different than SF.  15 years ago was another story.
                 \_ But was that supposed to be smog or permanent SF overcast?
                    I always thought it was just rainy.
              \_ Things were getting better for a while, but this year
                 has reversed that trend:
                 There is no way that the air is as good as SF. San
                 Jose, maybe.
2003/9/6 [Reference/BayArea] UID:10097 Activity:nil
9/6     Any classes in Berkeley/SF that will help me improve my kissing?
        \_ Any woodwind class
           \_ playing a woodwind gives you a firm embouchure. Does that
              actually help kissing technique?
                \_ brass has a more finely controlled embouchure than reed
        \_ such classes are easily found on castro. here, try this.  stand on
           a streetcorner with a sign that says "in need of kissing classes".
           wait for one of many qualified, mostly male, instructors to
           approach you. some will inquire about what fees you are willing to
           accept for such a class, etc. just tell them it's free. so simple!
           \_ Don't forget Tanesha on any Oakland street corner!
2003/8/25 [Reference/BayArea] UID:29458 Activity:very high
8/25    Justice League in SF : did they shut down? is there a www site with
        their schedule? any other cool ambient/techno lounge places in SF?
                        \- try the Kennel Club. --psb
        \- try the Kennel Club. --psb
                \_ url ?
        \_ Oh My God!  The JL shutdown?  What will we do when Lex Luthor next
           tries to take over the world?!
           \_ As long as the Wonder Twins are still around, evil shall never
2003/8/11-12 [Reference/BayArea] UID:29308 Activity:nil
8/11    Flash Mobs:
2003/6/3 [Reference/BayArea] UID:28617 Activity:nil
6/3     Today's SF Comical has a chart showing exactly which media companies
        own which radio, tv, and newspapers in the greater SF Bay Area.
           Useful, but not as important as the audience percentages.
2003/5/28 [Reference/BayArea, Finance/Investment] UID:28566 Activity:very high
5/27    i need a job!  if anyone knows of any sort of clerical/administrative
        (or really anything else non-programmer, non-sysadmin, non-sales/mktg)
        jobs in the east bay or sf, please let me know...       -lila
        \_ There's an opening at the local Wendy's, want me to inquire?
        \_ Why are you asking for a nontechnical job on Soda? Do we look
          like a bunch of nontechnical people? When did Soda become
           \_ technical people work at companies that also employ other people
              \_ Yeah, riight, when was the last time you went over to the
                 secretary pool and asked them how they were doing in terms
                 of staffing? Geeks hang out with geeks, sales with sales, etc.
                 That's why there are depts.
                 \_ depends on size of company ... when I was at a small
                    company, I mixed with and dated hot sales and
                    accounting girls.  now i am at 100k company, and
                    things are bad.
                    \_ Sales&mktg... aaah... how I miss those days....
        \_ Are you deliberately trying to under-employ yourself?  A BA
           degress from berkeley doing clerical work?
           \_ my degree doesn't actually qualify me for anything...  i don't
              know what i really want to do yet, but i do need an income.
              \_ Perhaps you missed the point of your Berkeley degree.  Very
                 few Cal degrees qualify the student for any particular
                 trade.  This isn't a trade school.  You've (hopefully) been
                 taught to think and how to learn so you can do almost anything
                 that comes your way.  Meta skills are superior to specific
                 trade skills over the course of your life.  Now stop pissing
                 away your Cal degree on shitty retail and clerical work and
                 diminishing the value of everyone else's degrees.  Go figure
                 it out and get a real job.
           \_ sometimes, a job is just a job.
           \_ need I mention the Physics PHD's formerly from JDSU that I work
              with in airport security? -ERic
                \_ you work in airport security?
                  \_ unfortunately, yes.
2003/4/30-5/1 [Reference/BayArea, Health/Dental] UID:28268 Activity:very high
4/30    I know there are some grad students here.  How much do you end up
        paying per year in Union dues, if you are on a unionized campus?
        Has anyone found a way to get out of paying the dues if they don't
        want to be in or support the union? How much to the union people
        interfere in your everyday work?  Any informaion, prefereably
        with links is appreciated.  We are trying to stop a union on our campus.
        \_Just go up to the Union rep and demand your dues back if
          they've been garnished. This Union crap is garbage since
          grad students in different majors have nothing in common with
          one another. Why would an MBA student want to join a union?
              \_ There's dental plans and dental plans. My fiance, a UCB
        \_ The union at UC Berkeley is responsible for the grad students
           finally getting a dental plan. Does that help?
           \_ Are dental plans ever actually worth the hassle of finding a
              doctor in the system just for a tiny cut in price?
              \_ almost all dentists are in Delta.
              \_ There's dental plans and dental plans. My fiancee, a UCB
              \_ There's dental plans and dental plans. My fiance, a UCB
                 grad student, can now afford dental work where before
                 she couldn't. YMMV.
              \_ "Tiny cut" is 50% or more?
        \_ In general, liberal arts programs/students are poor and want
           unions more than those in the engineering disciplines
           \_ To some degree that treatment is deliberate. America already
              has plenty of history and sociology PhD's. So we tend to
              treat the PhD students pretty poorly ... reduces demand
              (and there's still too many of them). Engineering and hard
              sciences, on the other hand, can find jobs elsewhere so have
              to be treated well, AND we need more of them. At most schools
              RA/TA salaries for eng/sci are much higher (and eng/sci grad
              students usually have a much lower teaching load over their
           unions more than those in the engineering disciplines
              graduate careers).
2003/4/28-29 [Reference/BayArea, Politics/Domestic/President/Bush, Politics/Foreign/Europe] UID:28252 Activity:low
4/28    Am I the only one who's noticed that if you compare the map of
        Middle Earth to the U.S. Mordor is right where Texas is?
        \_ It's New Zealand
        \_ And if you compare it to Europe, it's France.
           \_ No, it's more like ... Austria.
        \_ Yes, you are because it would take some serious drugs and a hard
           core blind hatred of a passing political figure to see that.  If it
           was the bay area, it'd be San Jose.  So what?
           \_ my hatred of Bush is not so blind, I have plenty of
              valid reasons.
           \_ passing political figure?  you mean Bush?  pah!  I'd associate
              him as much with New England as with Texas.  Texas just really
              really sucks.  Try actually spending some time there, and
              you'll see that people don't hate texas because of some
              "passing political figure," they hate it because it's a
              fucking pit(except Austin).
2003/4/23-28 [Reference/BayArea, Computer/SW/Languages, Academia/Berkeley/CSUA] UID:28197 Activity:nil 53%like:28769
4/23    C++/Oracle programming job located in SF:
2003/4/5 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley] UID:28003 Activity:nil
4/5     When people hear about U.C. Berkeley, they think "Liberal", "Activists".
        Is it true of Berkeley Engineering?  Berkeley Computer Science?
        \_ They think of apolitical no-life no social skills nerds.
2003/3/31-4/1 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley] UID:27917 Activity:moderate
3/30    Anyone know where I can buy a Berkeley Engineering window sticker
        for my car? If it isn't possible to get them these days, I'd
        settle for an alumni sticker or one of those Cal stickers. tia.
        \_ Try the student union or whatever they call it these days for the
           generic stuff.
           \_ Any place online? I'm a couple of hundred miles from berkeley.
        \_ I got a bunch of them the last time the alumni society was giving
           them out - send me an email, and I'll take a look at home to see
           if I can find them and send you one. -mds
           \_ are these the cal football stickers that go on the helmet?
              I'd pay top dollar for one of those.
              \_ I wasn't aware of football players putting "berkeley
                 engineering" stickers on their helmets, but if you want
                 to pay top dollar for a yellow square and the words
                 "berkeley engineering" in blue, email me!  OP, never
                 heard from you, but I found the stickers, so if you want
                 one send me your mailing address - mds
2003/3/21-22 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley] UID:27783 Activity:high
3/20    i have a friend going over to the berkeley for a wedding in may.
        she wanted to know a good road to check out the hills in a car
        since she will probably have 3-4 hours of spare time before
        she has to fly back, etc.  can anybody give any good suggestions?
        thanks.  its been a while and i don't remember very much any more.
        \_ Take Spruce up to Grizzly Peak; then either cross over to
           Wildcat Canyon, or turn right on Grizzly Peak and take it up
           to the top.  (But she should ride bike, not drive).  -tom
           \_ while running linux and using ed of course.
                                            \_ sed.
           \- there are some pretty crazy roads in the mount tam,
        \_ Is she h0t?
              st. francis drake area ... not the main roads. --psb
        \_ Is she hot?
           \_ You wanna check out the Twin Peaks on her while she checks out
              the hills in Berkeley?
2003/3/20-21 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley] UID:27771 Activity:high
3/20    Stuck in the City today? (SFGate article on today's protests)
        \_ I'm in the city today.  Hardly stuck.  It's just silly.  It's
           amazing how ~2000 people sitting in just the right set of
           intersections can bring downtown to a near halt.  Dumping news
           stands and chanting random shit like it matters.
                  \_like you matter.
           \_ like you matter.  [formatd even though you're a knucklehead]
              \_ knucklehead, I never said I mattered.  neither do they.
           \_ I've got word from a friend that there are some pretty amusing
              riots happening.  He's going to take pictures and to buy
              fajitas from Taco Bell to give to the cops in riot gear.
              \_ It's ok.  Nothing special.  I've seen Berkeley riots that were
                 far better in all ways.  Mostly it's a bunch of mindless kids
                 who are taking the day off HS.  I know a good riot when I
                 see one and this wasn't it.
                 \_ Heh, Berkeley riot = chance to loot the Gap.  There's
                    no real activism in Berkeley any more.
                    \_ There wasn't much real activism in the city today either
                       where I was (market and parts of 3rd).  It was mostly
                       HS kids dumping over news stands to block the streets
                       and then they'd stand on them and take pictures of the
                       crowd while yelling random stuff and the crowd would
                       take pictures of them.  It was just silly.
2003/3/19-20 [Reference/BayArea, Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:27758 Activity:high
3/19    Any war protestor in Berkeley? -alumni
        \_ "alumni" is plural, dumbass. I doubt you are multiple
            people. -aaron
            \_ Well, specifically it means a group of male graduates if
            you want to nitpick. If you ever used the terms data and media
            as singular then you're being hypocritical.
            In modern usage alumni to refer to singular or plural in
            conversation is fine. I assume you're one of those anal people
            who insist on accenting the e in resume.
            \_ you're just wrong.
            \_ Resume is probably too pedestrian for them.  I'm sure
               they favor Curriculum Vitae instead.
        \_ no, we're all for the war here in Berkeley - danh
        \_ there is a protest at 5pm at powell and market
           in SF - danh
            \_ where you there, danh?  I passed by the protest on my way
               back from the IETF meeting at the Hilton.
        \_ Forget the protest.  When does the looting start?  I need a new
           pair of sunglasses.
           \_ why wait for looting?  if there's a real riot, and someone
              sees you looting, you might actually be shot.  if you go
              steal a pair of sunglasses now, before the riot, the potential
              for getting shot is zero.  just don't steal from Fred's.
           \_ Sir, I admire your honesty and realism.
        \_ So here on Wilshire, the street was shutdown and the cops were
           beating up protestors. Whatever happened to the hippie movements,
           it migrated to LA?           -happy UCLA CS student
2003/3/19-20 [Reference/BayArea, Recreation/House] UID:27752 Activity:low
3/19    Is anybody a bonsai expert or a manzanita expert here? Can manzanita
        be used as a bonsai tree, or are they too difficult to keep? Thanks.
        \_ near grand lake in oakland there is a bonsai garden and club
           (in the park area) and they know a shitload about this stuff.
           \_ Is that its exact name? I'm not in the bay area. -op
              \_ dunno the name, I suspecta google search would
                 but then again a google seach would probably get you
                 the answer to your question in the first place.
              \_ It's in Lakeside Park.
        \_ All of your questions are answered in the Karate Kid, part I, II,
           and III.
           \_ The KK is my life's philosophy and source of guidance in dark
        \_ The "small" clipped manzanita plants I've seen are too large to be
           considered bonsai. I think the leaf density isn't high enough to
           keep the plant going. They are darned pretty though.
2003/2/28 [Reference/BayArea, Computer/SW/Unix] UID:27571 Activity:nil
2/28    Most of your friends are married.  They have settled down and bought
        a house in the suburbs.  Some have children or are planning to have
        children.  Meanwhile, you still hang out at berkeley or SF.  Taking
        classes and pretending to be a student all over again.  Becoming or
        trying to become another pathetic 30 year old first year grad student.
                                 \_ why is going to grad school later in life
        Chasing after 18 year old coeds.  Or still playing computer games
        and fiddling with your unix box all weekend.  When are you going to
        settle down?
        \_ oh god not Berkeley or SF!  it's worse than Juarez?
        \_ what's the point? freedom is wonderful. oooo, the suburbs. i
           feel so sad that i'm not in the suburbs. ha ha ha.
        As soon as I find the right man/women/bovine:
        Until I become 40: .
        Why?: .
2003/2/12-13 [Reference/BayArea, Recreation/Dating] UID:27384 Activity:low
2/12    Any recommendations for local flower shops that in downtown
        SF that deliver?  Looking for roses delivery for V-Day.
                          \_ oh that's original
                             \_ As original as expecting sex on VDay
        \_ Chase Flowers at one of the exits at the Embarcadero BART Station.
           I used it once four years ago, although not on Valentine's day.
           They even wrote a card for me over the phone.
2003/1/28-29 [Finance/Banking, Reference/BayArea] UID:27226 Activity:high
1/28    Recommendations for credit unions for a Berkeley resident or
        someone who works in SF?  Patelco is almost worse than a commercial
        \_ I comparison shopped CalState9 and USE and chose CalState9. I
           would recommend them based on my experience but YMMV.
        \_ Try BofA, and you'll gladly switch to Patelco. No complaints
           after being with Patelco since '88 for basic services.
           \_ I get charged for using COOP ATMs so I can only use Patelco ATMs.
              ATM use at the store with cashback also incurs a $0.90 charge.
              Also, I can't use the ATM at CalState9 at Shattuck Square.
           \_ BTW, what are the advantages of using credit unions? I was using
              the one that has an office on lower Sproul when I was a student.
              I always hated that they had nearly no ATMs.
              \_ I have CCFCU.  I haven't been charged a single fee since 1998.
                 Also, the deal with ATMs is that you use ATMs of the credit
                 union network, in addition to the ones provided by your
                 own credit union.  They even reversed some finance charges
                 on my credit card for me.  I used to have BofA but then I
                 got sick of them charging monthly fees,  selling my name to
                 telemarketers, and generally looking for ways to make money
                 off of me.  I can at least trust that my credit union is
                 looking out for my interests and not some random shareholders.
                 \_ I agree.  I hate BofA, Bank One, etc.  They may be
                    ok if you are rich and likes to put big chucks of
                    dough in your checking account, but they are
                    definitely not for people like me.
            \_ I get better CD rates at Patelco than anywhere else.
        \_ Banks are evil under any name.  Use pillow.
           \_ Thanks for the sarcasm but why should I keep my money with
              someone who wants to take as much of it as possible?
              On top of that their rates suck and my fees will be used by
              them to build more branches and buy ad space.
              I've banked with a bank before and I got tired of having to
              watch my back all time.
2003/1/28 [Reference/BayArea] UID:27219 Activity:nil
1/27    When would you take a paycut?  Would you move to another job
        if you were getting less money than before?
        \_ The last two years I've taken paycuts due to no raise (company
           wide, except executives) and increased benefits costs. It sucks.
           \_ That's not a paycut.  That's inflation.  Only gubermint
              employees have COLAs as a birthright.
                \_ so why are employees at Berkeley paid 20% less than
                   the industry average?
        \_ If the alternative is to have no job, yes I would.
           \_ would you move jobs for less money if the other job
              is "better"?
              \_ That question presumes alot, but yes.
           \_ Here's a good example, My brother-in-law worked in San Jose,
              making quite a pretty penny.  He ditched that job for one
              with 2/3 the pay in Northern California.  Why?  San Jose
              is Hell, and considering the change in living costs, it
              wasn't that big a pay cut...
        \_ I just turned down a job paying $80k and I make $63k. I'm in SoCal
           and don't want to move back to the crappy ass Bay Area.
           - LA #1 fan
           \_ You rejected a 27% raise while others are lining up for
              unemployment checks?
              \_ Sometimes there are other priorities.  Though it would be
                 nice to hear that he could refer a friend. -- not a fan of LA.
        \_ annoyed at my previous employer, so i resigned without a job
           offer (indeed i had not even sent out my resume).  this was
           last summer.  annoyed at my current employer, so i am letting
           my current contract run out in feb.  i have refused to renew or
           even to discuss a renewal.  again, no job offer and i have not
           even begun to look for another job.  my wife prefers that i
           hang out at home for a while or maybe travel for a bit.
2002/12/29-30 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley, Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Troll] UID:26934 Activity:high
12/28   Hey old people, what was in the building Wall Berlin
         used to be in?
         \_ I think it is still empty
         \_ yes it's empty . what was there BEFORE?
            wall berlin has been there about oh 7 years probably.
            what was in the building pre wall berlin ?
                \_ I'm pretty sure 9-10 years. -aspo
                  \_  damn.  thats about right.  sightimeflies.  and
                      while we are at it, has that space that used to
                      be the jean store that burned down been built up
                      yet, or is it still an empty, fenced off lot?
                      i find it so weird that the owner of that lot
                      never developed it.  he must be some rich fuck
                      to just let it sit like that.  -hahnak
                      \_ If you're referring to the lot on Telegraph
                         across the street from Amoeba then, yes, it's
                         still an empty fenced off lot.  I've heard rumors
                         that folks wanted to build housing there at one
                         point or another, but decided not to after running
                         up against fascist Berkeley city council policies.
                         Of course, that's purely rumor and hearsay -dans
                        \_ my sources say shirley dean blocked
                           the last development proposal - danh
                         \_ It's not rumor and hearsay to those of us around
                            at the time.  The details are pretty stupid but
                            put the following words into a sentence and you've
                            got it: affordable housing, berkeley city council,
                            empty lot, dilapidated & later burned down hotel,
                            telegraph avenue, homeless activists.  Voila!  A
                            permanently empty lot on prime location!  Welcome
                            to Berkeley.
                            \_ After the fire and before they tore the place
                               down, the men's store on the bottom floor had
                               a fire sale going. It lasted about three years.
                \_ fine, so what was there?
2002/11/22-23 [Reference/BayArea] UID:26599 Activity:high
11/21   My brother is coming to visit me in Berkeley with his car. He wants
        to stay here for a week. He's never been on West coast before. Please
        list fun and interesting places to visit in the Bay Area and beyond.
        \_ touristy but not too touristy stuff in the city: lombard st.,
           chinatown, golden gate park (japanese tea garden), palace of the
           legion of honor, china beach, palace of fine arts / exploratorium
        \_ Just go to Oakland or SF and pick up some TV hookers.  That'll be
           a lot different than he's used to.  If not then your bro needs some
           outside professional help.
        \_ three of my favorite "views" of the City: Twin Peaks,
           Treasure Island, Carnelian Room (the first two are quick drives
                            \- i think that is a bad place to eat, price-perf
                               wise ... "dont eat at restaurants with a view
                               or that move"
           you can do(<15min. out of your way). the last is good for a drink).
        \_ touristy but not too touristy stuff in the city (this is kind
           of my 'routine for visiting relatives'): lombard st, chinatown,
           golden gate park (japanese tea garden), palace of the legion of
           honor, china beach, palace of fine arts / exploratorium area. Take
           him to some good restaurants, but that's a whole other thread.
           \_ Fisherman's Wharf, GG bridge, you forgot that.
              \_ And Alcatraz.
        \_ Drive down to Half Moon Bay/Moss Beach to visit tidepools.  Go
           to the moma, legion of honor.  Up to Napa, drink some wine.
           The aquarium in GG park.  Drive to Santa Cruz or Monterey.  Eat
           on the median by the Cheeseboard.  BART someplace at least once,
           even if just to go to a museum.  Get him drunk on sake and make
           him sing karaoke in Japantown.  While you're at it, convince him
           to get a tattoo.  Of a giant fish.  On his forehead.
        \_ Mitchell Brothers.
           \_ You know if you want non-generic advice beyond "go to
              alcatraz and napa" it would help to give some idea about
              what vague kind of thing you are looking for.  Going to the
              Monterey Aquarium vs. shoeshoe in Yosemite vs. Burrito in
              the Mission are pretty different kinds of trips.
              \_ LA is also west coast. Go to SoCal, Disneyland, San Diego
                 Hollywood, Rodeo Drive, Santa Cruz, Santa Barbara.
                 Oops you said fun and interesting, sorry.
                 How old is he? What's he interested in? Ethnicity? Native?
                 Where from? East coast? or just school there?
        \_ Does he come from some conservative part of the country?  If so,
           Telegraph might be enough for a shocking experience.
           \_ Hardly.  I came from a conservative part of the country and was
              in school when telegraph was much more fucked up and it was
              just this really dirty crime ridden street to my eyes.  They have
              those all over.
        \_ Also Muir woods for the redwoods and hiking.
        \_ Take him to the power exchange and tie him to a rack and let
           everyone there have their way with him. I bet that is something
           he wouldn't find in Kansas.
           \_ You'd be surprised what you can find in Kansas.  SF doesn't have
              a lock of kinky sex.  They're just more insecure about it so
              they need to make a big flashy show out of it.
2002/10/29-30 [Reference/BayArea] UID:26357 Activity:low 80%like:26351
10/28   Are the porn purveyors in the Bay Area pretty much the adult book
        stores or are there any dedicated stores?
        \_ When you say "porn" what do you mean specifically?  Do you
           videos, comics, or merchendice?  If it's merchendice then there
           is a place at the parking structure on Durant and Telegraph in
           Berkeley, and "Kimono My House" in Oakland.  But I don't know
           the address for that
           \_ Kimono My House:
        \_ LAME.  Can't you find something better to do with your time
           rather than editing other people's motd posts?  Isn't there a
           a hospital you should be bombing?
           \_ hey, it's a real question.  what are some of the better
              anime/toy stores in the area?
              \_ Japan Video on Post St in Japantown has a huge collection.
2002/10/29 [Reference/BayArea] UID:26351 Activity:high 80%like:26357
10/28   Are the anime purveyors in the Bay Area pretty much the comic book
        stores or are there any dedicated stores?
        \_ Yes.
           \_ ok, this joke is REALLY REALLY old. seriously. Yes, we all
              know you are a kewl cuhmpyuter siyence d00d and you know
              booleyuhn lahjik real g00d.
        \_ When you say "anime" what do you mean specifically?  Do you
           videos, comics, or merchendice?  If it's merchendice then there
           is a place at the parking structure on Durant and Telegraph in
           Berkeley, and "Kimono My House" in Oakland.  But I don't know
           the address for that
2002/10/18 [Reference/BayArea] UID:26239 Activity:moderate
10/17   I want to have a digital image printed on a coffee mug as a present.
        I know there are places to get this online (clubphoto,,
        etc) but I was wondering if there's anywhere in the bay area that
        do this so I don't have to wait for shipping. any ideas?
        \_ almost any photo store maybe?
           \_ I called around and people I talked to didn't know what I was
              talking about...
              \_ Check around the big malls.  Vallco in south bay had a little
                 store that would take pictures and put them on mugs, tshirts,
                 etc.  Those stores are probably your best bet.
                 \_ lots of places do it - walmart, office depot - but do they
                    all just send them off to the same mail order places?
        \_ There's a place called Keepsake Factory, in the Newpark Mall
           in Newark. They do everything onsite, they do not send it out.
           Phone: 510-792-0192.
2002/10/7 [Reference/BayArea] UID:26120 Activity:insanely high
        Longshoremen and you!  Intro to feeling bad for the oppressed working
        \_ Minor bit of trivia, but the longshoremen's strike in SF ("On
           the Waterfront") is one of the major reasons why a lot of
           manufacturing and shipbuilding moved out of SF.  Too expensive,
           too regulated, too prone things like $100,000/year longshoremen
           striking, for better of worse.  -John
           \_ And here I thought it was because the railheads from LA and
              Seattle were faster and easier to traverse the country than
              they are from Oakland/SF and land was cheaper. Too bad they
              don't have those cheap workers in Seattle and LA.
           \_ It's funny but I heard this same one from my Dad. I suspect it's
              become the stuff of West Coast folk history even though it makes
              little sense. Think about it. Where did that stuff go? I haven't
              read up on it but the ILWU control every port on the West Coast.
              Had they not taken control of Seattle, Long Beach, Alameda and
              San Diego yet? Moreoever, this stuff (except for US military) all
              moved offshore.
              San Diego yet? This stuff (except for US military) all moved
              offshore in another decade or two anyways. Sure the ILWU resisted
              containers, but for how long? That's how the whole world works,
              now. The rail corridor/land cost explanation makes more sense.
2002/10/3 [Reference/BayArea] UID:26083 Activity:very high
10/02   I know there are grad students here.  what good/bad things do people
        have to preport as far as dealing with UAW representation?
        \_ Yeah, good idea, join a mobster controlled union.  You need to
           understand that *all* unions' first thought is about what is good
           for the union.  If that also happens to be good for a union member,
           that is just a pleasant side effect for the member.  If you ever
           have to file a complaint with your union about work conditions
           the union will make everyone's life a living hell without actually
           doing anything to improve your life.  Unions as they exist today
           are no longer the benevolent pro-member entity they began as.
           \_ You have no idea why the Mob controlled unions and apparently
              have no idea why someone would join one now. Too bad.
              \_ And you've done *nothing* to correct my statement, just
                 added a zero substance comment.  Too bad.
              \_ oh, mr. union expert, could you please enlighten us then?
                 what are these good-for-nothing, lazy, and corrupt
                 organizations good for?
                 \_ Are you the same guy who was griping about how overpaid
                    union dockworkers are?
                    \_ One of many I'm sure.
                       \_ So you see the obvious logical flaw in complaining
                          how overpaid union members are and then claiming
                          that unions don't do anything, right?
              \_ Someone is forced to join a union because the union controls
                 the jobs.  If someone doesn't join, (s)he can't work in that
           \_ This hits so close to home. Unions can be helpful if you have a
              real gripe against your boss (he's making you work late or go
              to his house or whatever)... you file a grievance, and he gets
              slapped on the wrist. Then you don't listen to him... you're in
              a union, he can't do much to you...
              \_ Or the union makes a lot of noise but doesn't do anything for
                 you, your boss hates you and treats you like shit (all within
                 union rules, though) and your life becomes a living hell, and
                 the union chalks up another victory because they gained more
                 space on the hallway cork board for union fliers at your
                 expense.  Gotta love that union!
              \_ My father-in-law works at the bakery in a Safeway.  He said
                 what the union does best is collecting union dues.  He often
                 has dispute with his boss on schedules, overtimer, missing
                 pay, raise, promotion, seniority, etc, and the union aren't
                 helpful on those issues.
                 \_ Where I work, we in the union don't let our boss treat us
                    unfairly (other than the shoddy pay)... we've filed so
                    many grievances against him that he's scared to act against
                    us... but he's been here only 3 years and we've been here
                    for over 20 (average, I've only been here 5 years).
        \_ The union over here does things like: recently the medical coverage
           became much crappier than it was before, more out-of-pocket and so
           on.  Instead of letting this just happen, the UAW is negotiating
           for us to not be so badly screwed over.
2002/10/2 [Reference/BayArea, Industry/Jobs] UID:26075 Activity:insanely high
        "... full-time longshoremen earn an average salary of $80,000 a year,
        while the most experienced foremen average $167,000."
        And they still shut down all the west coast docks and tumble the
        already bad economy in order to demand more.
        \_ hmm, if they so importent that the can hurt the economy that
        \_ hmm, if they so important that the can hurt the economy that
           simply maybe the DESERVE high salaries.
           \_ The work is important, the workers are not.  It's grunt work.
              Any high schooler with 4 hours training could do it.  People who
              stock grocery shelves are important, too.  You think they should
              get $80k starting and $167k for 'experienced' stock shelvers?
        \_ The docks locked out the workers, not the other way around.
           Train harder.
           \_ You really buy that "we didn't slow down; we were just trying to
              follow the safety procedures" crap?
              \_ And you really buy the "there was an undeclared slowdown"?
           \_ With average pays at $80K and $167K, why do they deserver
              immunity to competition from non-union workers?
                 \_ Duh.  Go read *anything* on the net about union tactics.
                    This is classic strategy.  The counter punch lock out is
                    a new response, though.  Jeeze, I know it's the motd but
                    if you know *nothing* about a topic, take 5 seconds to
                    look on google before posting and wasting all those bits.
              \_ They cite the death of five workers over the previous
                 months. You know what? If my boss started hedging on my
                 contract, I'd start following all of his stupid rules too.
                 \_ They're OSHA rules.  If all OSHA rules were followed, the
                    economy would collapse *and* people would die on their
                    job trying to follow them.
        \_ You're missing the point. They don't necessarily want more money,
           they want to keep their jobs. The companies want to hire nonunion
           folks to handle some of the new tech going in. The new tech will
           eliminate union jobs. The union want the company to put union
           folks in those new jobs instead of having them laid off.
           \_ With average pays at $80K and $167K in this economy (and I bet
                 \_ sure I'd prefer that they trained me.  Hell, I'd prefer that
                    they paid me for doing nothing at all.  But why should
                    they *have* to?
              they get OT pay as well), why do they deserver immunity to
              competition from non-union workers and layoff?
              \_ Ignore the union bit for the moment.  Would you prefer that
                 your employer trained you for new technology or just outright
                 hired someone else instead?  okay, bring the union back into
                 this, they work to make sure this doesnt happen, to make sure
                 you are not just discarded because your employer doesnt want
                 to provide relevant training.
                 \_ sure I'd prefer that they trained me.  Hell, I'd prefer
                    that they paid me for doing nothing at all.  But why
                    should they *have* to?
                    \_ so you dont mind being disposable.
                       \_ He didn't say that at all.  He said he'd prefer not
                          being disposable, in fact but doesn't see why they
                          should be *forced* to not dispose of him.  Please
                          learn to read basic English.  Thanks.
        \_ my parents are/were both union workers, so I'm biased,
           I wonder if the rest of you feel this way?
           \_ That you're biased?  Sure!  Why not?  Ok, I feel you're biased.
              Happy now?
        \_ I'm a union (tech) worker, but I hate the goddamned union. It's
           retarded that these fat fucks can get by on their skills that havent
           been updated since the DOS days and havent bothered picking up
           skills that theyve been taught in training. and since we have the
           same job title, we get paid the same, so i get paid the same as
           lazy fat fucks.
           \_ You know nothing and more nothing about this issue but it's the
              motd so who cares?
2002/9/11-12 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley] UID:25849 Activity:high
9/11    What I love about Berkeley:
        * cheeseboard pizza
                \_ cheese board cheese >>> pizza
                   \_ no, both are fantastic. the cheese is just more eleet.
        * No need to wear trendy clothes.  (I couldn't afford them anyway.)
        * no fake tits.
        * the weather

        What I hate about Berkeley:
        * stinking bums on telegraph asking for change (damn you paolo!)
        * no hot chicks.
        \_ But fake tits > flat tits.
                \_ Not the ones that stick straight out.  Nothing wrong with
                   flat;  hairy is the problem.
        * the weather
        * mountain biking in the berkeley hills

        What I hate about Berkeley:
        * stinking bums on telegraph asking for change (damn you paolo!)
        * no hot chicks.
        \_ There were a TON of hot chicks at the 9/11 memorial today on
        \_ Really?  Try the CSA/CSU/TSA/HKSA booths at Sproul around noon.
           \_ Not an AZNophile.
        \_ Berkeley, while still sub-optimal, has made MASSIVE strides in
           attractive female breeding and thong technology.  Someday (I
           estimate ca. 2135) it will catch up to some of the lesser cities
           around the world in that regard.  -John
        \_ It's already better than SJSU.
2002/9/7-8 [Reference/BayArea, Recreation/Media] UID:25795 Activity:kinda low
9/6     Is there a good non-chain video store in the south bay? I'm looking
        for something with a big selection of nonmainstream movies, the
        equivalent of Movie Image in Berkeley or Le Video in SF...
        \_ Any other laid-off silicon valley folks want to start one up w/ me?
           \_ You got angel funding?  bwahahahahhaa!
2002/8/30 [Reference/BayArea] UID:25739 Activity:high
8/29    To save money, my company is moving from Santa Clara to Menlo Park.
        I can commute from Oakland or San Jose. What should I do? Quit?
        Wait for the layoffs? Stay in Oakland? Stay in San Jose? Move to
        San Francisco? How is the commute from each?
        \_ Oakland to Menlo Park?  hahahahah good luck.  SJ to MP is ok.
        \_ Fremont to MPK could be painful, just because of the bridge.
        However, it does have a bicycle path and you could Ride Bike
        to work.
           \_ 2 cyclists have been hit by cars there this past month.
              Palo Alto is not a safe place to ride through.
2002/8/27-28 [Reference/BayArea] UID:25709 Activity:very high
8/27    SF and NY chosen as the finalists for 2012 Olympic sites. SF
        is a shoe in!
             \_ shoo-in
        \_ Oh God.. give it to NY.  The last thing the bay area needs is more
           traffic and special reasons for blocking it.  It won't be the SF
           olympics anyway because SF is too rinky dink to deal with it.
           \_ the same can (and will) be said of NY.
              \_ Traffic was awesome during the 1984 Olympics. I think
                 NYC will get it based on sympathy. --dim
                 \_ Yeah it almost worked for the World Series.
           \_ And the second last thing the Bay Area needs is terrorist
              \_ bay area = huge muslim population. No terrorist attack.
                 \_ Jerusalem has a higher Muslim population.
                 \_ But those are "coward" muslims who come to the States to
                    "join the evil American Empire".
                 \_ uhm yeah these are the same people who are killing
                    themselves for the _chance_ to maybe kill others they view
                    as their eternal enemies.  you're in fantasy land.
                    \_ When is the last time you heard of a suicide bomber
                       in the Bay Area?
                       \_ That's not a logical argument.  It's the same
                          line of reasoning that goes: my car has never been
                          broken into, so it will be safe to park unlocked in
                          downtown Oakland.  The fact that no suicide bombers
                          (rare in the US to begin with) have struck before
                          means little or nothing.        -mice
                          \_ look, go move to Wyoming if you want to live
                             somewhere nothing interesting ever happens. -tom
              \_ I heard that in Utah multiple terrorist attacks of
                 public coffee, cola, and alcohol consumption almost
                 destroyed the social fabric of Salt Lake City.
2002/7/4-5 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Troll] UID:25275 Activity:insanely high
7/3     Not sure if everyone here already agrees Berkeley is a pretty
        fucked up city with Mayor Jackass Shirley Dean running the show,
        but now Berkeley wants to make sure you only drink fair-trade, shade
        grown, organically grown coffee and will have a task force roving the
        cafes, making sure no one is selling "the bad coffee", and putting
        cafe owners a possible 0.6 months in jail + fine.
                            \_ Jailterm shrunken by the motd jailterm shrinker.
        \_ Don't get involved.  Leave.  They'are all insane.  -John
        \_ most of us are alums, and you should post a url explaining
           what the hell you're talking about.
           \_ This was in the news a few weeks ago.
        \_ I was at the meeting where this was brought to the table (I was
           there for another issue). You may want to get your facts straight.
           I'm no fan of Mayor Dean but she didn't have anything to do with
           that initiative petition.
           It was presented by a "member of the general public" - in this case
           an individual freshly out of law school.
           If you care that much, CM Breland had the matter postponed for
           consent discussion until next week. You can have your 3 minutes next
           Tues, 7/2 at 7PM in the Old City Hall.
           Please do show up, actually. I'll be out of town and somebody needs
           to be a voice of sanity in this town from time-to-time. -- ulysses
           \_ Uhm, next Tues, 7/9, or yesterday, Tue 7/2?
           \_ Hmm, sounds tempting, but the fact that they are even taking
              this seriously, is just so disturbing, Im not quite sure
              if they are even reasonable... I mean, this is the same
              council that wants to make the speed limit 15mph(?or was it 20)
              and put flowerpots and posts that make all neighborhoods
              ridiculously tricky to get through. I posted the article
              my friend sent to me @
           the place would be a complete shithole.
              \_ Ever driven south side?  They already have those cement
                 blockers there specifically to fuck up traffic.
        \_ Berkeley residents should realize, if not for the University
           the place would be a complete shithole.  Wait, it still is
           \_ Actually, it'd be a nameless boring lower-middle-class suburb
              on the outskirts of Oakland. Which, by the way, would also not
              be a particularly happenning place, having not had as much reason
              historically to detract activity away from SF.
              \_ I always figured it would have never actually become a city in
                 the first place since the university was there before anything
                 that looked like a city was.  It'd just be called "North
                 Oakland" or something like that.  There'd be no Berkeley.
              \_ it'd just be a boring non-city like albany or elcerrito.
        \_ Good for Berkeley. Someone has to lead the way.
2002/7/3-4 [Reference/BayArea] UID:25271 Activity:kinda low
7/3     I heard there was some sort of "hostage situation" on 24 and 580
        this morning. What exactly happened?
        \_ front page on
        \_ The perpatrator is upset that SF outlawed public urination.
        \_ URL shrunken by the motd URL shrinker.
2002/6/28-30 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley] UID:25237 Activity:high
6/27    If you care that Berkeley intends to close West Campus pool (city
        swimming pool at Addison & Browning in West Berkeley), please contact
        \_ Since I never even heard of it....
        \_ Oh my god, no!  If they fill in that pool where will I drown all
           my victims!  Then again, if I time it right, I'll have a good place
           to move all the bodies permanently so they're never found... hmmm.
           \_ do you actually think this is clever?  -tom
              \_ Yeah, I don't think you are getting this year's Tommy award.
                 -- judge tom's #1 fan
              \_ Who are you to care, judge, or ask?  As they say, go stick
                 your head in a pig.
                 \_ I'm just curious why someone would go to noticable effort
                    to post something so insipid.  -tom
                    \_ self-referentiality is kewl
2002/5/24-26 [Politics/Domestic/California, Reference/BayArea] UID:24937 Activity:kinda low
5/24    Anyone knows a good place to play squash in San Jose area?
        \_ on a related note how about badminton in east bay/SF (excl fremont)
           \_ South San Francisco High School.  Mondays ~6:30pm.  -- yuen

        \_ how do people who wear glasses play sports such as
                badminton or squash -- contacts, special goggles, surgery?
2002/5/16-17 [Reference/BayArea] UID:24860 Activity:nil
5/16    Any recommendations for getting automobile glass replaced
        in the Berkeley vicinity? Thanks.
        \_ Maz, if you have the time to spare. They make you wait.
        \_ Go through the phone book and call the places that match prices.
           When my side window got broken into, the first place I called quoted
           $85 while another place in oakland quoted $55.  Since the the first
           place was able to come by the same morning, I called them back and
           they did it for $55.  And remember, many places come to you at no
           extra charge.
2002/5/14-15 [Reference/BayArea] UID:24823 Activity:moderate
5/14   We will be back visiting Berkeley and SF in July and October for
       about ten days at a stretch with another couple. Any suggestions
       for where to look for a decent short-term rental? 2br clean safe
       area, but nothing chi-chi.  - larson
        \_ will you be throwing orgy parties?
           \_ who wants to know?
              \_ who doesn't?
2002/5/10-12 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley, Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Troll] UID:24786 Activity:high
5/10    Who represented Berkeley at this year's ACM prog contest?
        \_ Is this the team that came in 23rd behind Kentucky State?
        \_ {mgoodman,pad,lior}@soda. STFW...
          \_ why didn't chialea and the other two guys go?
             \_ Won't speak for chialea&twohey; I didn't make the top team,
                and was on the 3rd Berkeley team at the regionals, which scored
                4th after a 'furd team and the other two berkeley teams. If
                you want to hear excuses about having a bad case of stomach flu
                during the qualifying round, you're welcome to email me, but I
                doubt you care. -alexf
                \_ so did you tell the admission committee that you have
                   problems with health/etc, and got sympathy points?
                   \_ While this shouldn't probably be dignified with a reply,
                      I'll bite -- the few times when I actually bothered
                      putting ACM stuff on the grad apps, it was in some remote
                      corner of the application that I thought nobody would
                      give a flying fuck about. And no sympathy points were
                      requested or expected above -- it was simply a partial
                      explanation for doing worse last year than in
                      2000, since you seemed to be excessively curious about
                      the subject. -alexf
             \_ Stalkers prevented them.
             \_ hahahaha "the other two guys"
             \_ Programming is not the beggining and end of CS.
                \_ so the ACM doesn't have anything to do with CS? sounds like
                   someone has a little vendetta with the ACM and/or the
                   Berkeley team that went to the finals.
                   \_ Uhm, have you ever actually participated in the ACM
                      contest? It's hardly representative of even
                      "programming" as a field, let alone CS at large. It's
                      a rather specialized form of sport involving coding
                      tiny snippets of mediocre code really fast.
2002/5/7-8 [Reference/BayArea, Consumer/Audio] UID:24736 Activity:kinda low
5/6     And if you can't make it to Berkeley for your IP fix, the meeting
        topic of the Silicon Valley WebGuild ( is on
        intellectual property with a panel of speakers, including a
        representative from the  EFF.  Same date (5/8) at Cypress
        Semiconductor in San Jose. 6:30pm. See website for details. - cathyg
        \_ Are there any speakers on why patents are good or is this one
           sided advocacy from the EFF?
           \_ It will be a panel.  I'm not familiar with the other speakers,
              but they are listed on the website. [formatd]
2002/4/8-9 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley] UID:24378 Activity:high
4/9     Does anyone know if there are fields of grain (rye, barley, etc)
        growing near Berkeley?  Where are they?
           Search on "Celebrities"
2002/4/2 [Reference/BayArea] UID:24293 Activity:high
4/1     anyone know the name of the receptionist for college of chemistry
        419 Latimer?
        \_ Laura Palmer. --Bob
           \_ i need her email addres, but it's not in directory.. any ideas?
             or the receptionist's desk phone number
             this is really important.. thanks
             \_ Laura Palmer is dead.  -- Cooper
        \_ got the hots for her?
        \_ there was this one really hot UC receptionist at the uhm... uh...
           oh nevermind.  there wasn't.
           \_ Lemme guess, you just remembered that she's a fat, old, dumb,
              aggressive memeber of
        \_ What's her cup size?
           \_ Would it matter?  She's uc staff....
        \_ you can't actually visit her?
           \_ just don't make a pass on her the first day you go to see her.
           \_ just don't go down on her the first day you make a pass at her.
           \_ im in san jose
                \_ just don't be in san jose.
                    \_ some of us have to work
                        \_ I was only kidding
        \_ the power of google:
        \_ the problem with so much of the UCB administration (financial aid,
           clerks, form processor people,etc.) is that they all come from
           \_ uh... why is that a problem?
                \_ People from Oakland are all stupid and ugly.  -John
2002/3/7 [Reference/BayArea] UID:24053 Activity:nil
3/6     My company is offering a half-day off for me to go volunteer in the
        community. Any suggestions? Preferably something that doesnt require
        me to speak, but just maybe help in the background/low-key.
        Berkeley/Oakland area.
        \_ my probation officer made the same offer, and i cleaned up
           trash in people's park.  it rules. er...ok, so i didn't get
           time off from my job.
        \_ SPCA.
           \_ You get to clean out the dog/cat stalls/cages.
        \_ You can come clean my house and wash my car.
        \_ Habitat for Humanity, BNC (berkeley neighborhood computers),
           the church across the street from the RSF which at 5pm turns
           into a soup-kitchen type place (this one is fun), and more...
        \_ Does the half-day have to be the time you actually go volunteer?
           Or can you volunteer on a weekend and get a half-day on friday
           or monday? If so, look at -- I've been
           going to their events for over 1.5 years now and it's a damn
           good way to spend a Saturday every now and then. -alexf
        \_ Berkeley Free Clinic or the Suitcase Clinic seem to be two
           pretty good organizations in the Berkeley area. I have friends
           that work at the Free Clinic and they really like it.  - rory
        \_ if you want to teach math in an oakland school, email me.
           you could probably just ask an elementary school in your area,
           they would love to take you.  wait is this just a half
           day one time deal or recurring thing?  - danh
2002/3/7 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley] UID:24044 Activity:kinda low
3/6     Berkeley Critical Mass 9th birthday ride this Friday
        Gather 5:30 on to ride after 6 pm, Downtown Berkeley BART
        Wild party with bands to follow
        \_ don't get shot by police like jmeggs!
            \_ since when did jason get shot by anyone?
        \_ I ride a push scooter, can I attend?
        \_ I ride a push scooter (and use OS2 Warp), can I attend?
           \_ no you may not!
        \_ will we be riding over the new bicycle/pedestrian bridge over I-80?
2002/3/6-7 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Troll] UID:24033 Activity:high
3/6     "Phantom Planet", band containing Rushmore's Jason
        Schwartzman, today, noon, Sproul.  The giant crowd
        will probably be interesting for people watching. - danh
        \_ standard bullshit berkeley band.  if you've seen greenday
           you've seen them all.
                \_ dammit paolo do you ever let up?  this band has
                   nothing to do with berkeley.
                   \_ cept that they are playing in berkeley to a bunch
                      of berkeley freshmen idiots and so are going to
                      - by marketing tactics - spout off pro-berkeley
                      rhetoric for 1 hour.  Yeah,  sounds like a bunch
                      of berkeley bullshit to me.
           \_ wait-- Is this band really from Berkeley? (Because that
              would mean the Rushmore guy lives in our own town!!)
                \_ Berkeley?  Keep it.  It's yours!
        \_ anyone remember the frat party near the beginning of the movie
           "roadtrip"? the band that was playing, they say that was a
           berkeley based band. anyone know if that's true?
         \_ it was the oakland band "The KGB".  they were supposed
            to get huge but i don't think anyone cares anymore.
   - danh
           \_ Get stoned enough and they're all berkeley based bands.
2002/2/16-17 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley, Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Troll] UID:23886 Activity:high
2/16    What's a good place in Berkeley to buy alcoholic beverages after 11pm?
        Berkeley Market closes at 11pm on weekdays ;/
        \_ bah! be glad you don't live in New England.  Where I live it
           is illegal to sell alcohol outside a bar after 8 pm.
           these laws used to be moral things in the old days, but
           are now corporate wellfare for the liquor stores so they
           don't have to compete against grocery stores with hours.
           everytime it comes up, the liquor store lobby and the bar lobby
           make sure the law stays and the rest of us just have to go out and
           buy booze at 7:45 or head to the bar. fucking socialist cocksuckers.
        \- safeway ... decent prices generally too.
        \_ Raleigh's
2002/2/1-2 [Reference/BayArea] UID:23745 Activity:high
2/1   Your tax dollars at work!
       \_ What the hell are you talking about?
          \_ Read your history book, fool. Back in the 80's we gave
             money and training to terrorists^H^H^H^H^H^HFreedom Fighters
             in Nicaragua.
             \_ I don't see anything there that shows it's from the
                the US or that it's from Nicaragua.  It doesn't even look
                like a manual.  Just a flyer of some sort.
                \_ Go up a level, or click on sabotage in the frame.
        \_ These are old Union tricks.  I've read this stuff before in terms
           of how the proletariat can fight back against the fascist elite,
           etc, blah.  This is ancient shit.  If the CIA said, "stab your
           boss right here in the neck for best effect" then I'd be worried.
           But promoting union activities in central america?  oh no, fear,
           what terror the cia is inflicting, blah blah blah.  Get a Dell.
           \_ Union tricks? What are you smoking?
              \_ You know, bombing, destruction of infrastructure, advocating
                 the overthrow of the government. Damn those Union folks! And
                 now that they won, we can't fly the Stars and Bars anymore.
              \_ You know, slowing down the work flow, annoying the bosses with
                 phone calls, destroying documents, working slowly, shit like
                 that.  I've been smoking reality and reading pro-Union
                 materials and history on the web.  It isn't my fault if you're
                 unaware of these things.  As for the person above talking
                 about overthrow of the government and bombings, etc, go read
                 the link instead of mouthing off at random after only seeing
                 the knee-jerk letters "CIA" in a thread.
        \_ people interested in the history of unions and terrorism, as
           well as the u.s. goverment's over-responsiveness to such,
           check out the latest smithsonian magazine and/or look up the
           "palmer raids" c. 1919 in a reputable historical source.
2002/1/21 [Reference/BayArea] UID:23614 Activity:moderate
1/20    Where does one go to buy wallet-type things?  (East Bay/SF)
        Is there a place online?
        \_ What is a wallet-type thing? You mean a wallet? Money-clip?
           \_ billfold, leather thing to put calling cards/creditcards in,
              basically men's leather item store; buying present for
              corporate uncle. (birthday)
              \_ Your local Macy's then. tube into union square or zip
                 over to Richmond, or go down 880 to Hayward-ish, can't
                 remember exactly where, or better, goto Newpark Mall
                 (can get there in 20-25 mins). If those Macy's don't
                 work then there are stores near them. Online too risky
                 since you can't see/touch it and likely not cost-effective
                 unless you want to buy a cartier billfold for $150
                 but it's so-so (i got one)
        \_ ObCoachLeather
2002/1/18 [Reference/BayArea] UID:23595 Activity:high
1/18    How to pick up all the 30-something women in SF:  Sit in a BART
        station in SF when BART stops running trains to the East Bay for
        some random reason at West Oakland.  I was looking like crap but
        still had 3 different women strike up conversations with me and two
        of them invited me out for drinks.  If I wasn't married I would've
        been in a hotel last night with those two.  Sigh... I love desperate
        but still attractive 30-somethings.
        \_ And if you weren't married, they'd have avoided you like you
           were packing a piece. Funny about that.
           \_ I don't wear a ring.
        \_ Those two are probably prositutes looking for easy money. LOL
           \_ Nah, I went to Berkeley.  I know what hookers look like.
        \_ Sigh.  Things like that never happen to me.  I envy your good look.
           \_ My good look?  :-)  Stop shaving.  Dress down.  Waaay down.
2002/1/1 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley, Politics/Domestic/President/Bush] UID:23426 Activity:nil
1/1     Isn't it amazing that in Berkeley, land of the Free Speech Movement,
        any critisism of the Bush administration and its policies is immediately
        deleted? How far we have fallen.
2001/12/31 [Reference/BayArea, Recreation/Computer/Games] UID:23417 Activity:nil
12/30   Where's an arcade in the South bay that has Megatouch Maxx games?
2001/12/27-30 [Reference/BayArea, Transportation/Car] UID:23387 Activity:kinda low
12/27 Any car wash places that will also clean insides up here in Berkeley/
      Oakland/El Cerrito/etc, other than Touchless on Oxford?
        \_ Broadway and 40th in Oakland.
        \_ seriously... Touchless sucks. You're better off just hosing your
           car down for five minutes.
2001/12/27-28 [Reference/BayArea, Recreation/Dating] UID:23385 Activity:high
12/27   Jesus talks to GWB via Stephanie Salter.  Says to use love against
        terrorism.  WWJD?  I love the SF Comical and the SF Left.
        \_ Hey, the Right Wing Nutjob is back from Christmas vacation!
           \_ Hey great come back.  You have *nothing* to say in response to
              this drivel so you attack the person posting it.  Good call.
              \_ Why did you delete all your Free Republic black helicopter
                 conspiracy stuff? I like having that stuff in the motd.
                 It makes my point better than anything I could say.
                 \_ I didn't post the freerepublic stuff.  I don't even read
                    it.  I also don't censor other people's postings.  You'll
                    have to ask one of the self appointed Annointed Ones who
                    does that why the black helicopter url is gone.  Still,
                    the original point remains: Stephanie Salter thinks she's
                    channeling God/Jesus and says love is the answer to
                    multi national fundamentalist terrorists.
        \_ I hope he had a nice holiday with his family
        \_ i think the above 4 or 5 things were written by the
           same guy
        \_ so do i!
        \_ I thought Jesus wanted us to reform the gays and abortionists
           to stop terrorism.
2001/12/19 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley] UID:23301 Activity:high
12/18   We are berkeley residents continuing an ongoing grass-roots vigil
        against the war.  We are currently in our 6th week--we've been
        going rain or shine.  We can use more people to make this thing
        grow-- particularly in the minds of onlookers.
          The peace walk + vigil happens every Wednesday @ 7:30pm--without
        a lot of rhetoric--just visible protest in unity against the
        killing of innocents.  we're trying to raise questions in the
        minds of people in our community and we can use all the people we
        can get.  everyone is welcome.
          We walk from the NORTH BERKELEY BART STATION up University Ave
        and through downtown Berkeley to the MLK Civic Center Park.
          We have a steady supply of signs and candles but more are
        certainly welcome.  Anyone interested in helping or pregnant with
        questions, please email us at
        \_ Do you people just protest for the sake of protesting?
        \_ I hope you get hit by a bus.
           \_ A mean bus.  A mean, ANGRY bus!
        \_ I think this is a good thing.  Walking is good for you and this
           sort of grass roots campaign keeps you visible where the rest of
           us can easily keep watch.  I admire your power.
                \_ the great thing about not signing your posts is that you
                   can not sign your own responses to them.  -tom
                   \_ What?  I see a post, a followup, and you.  What are
                      you talking about unsigned responses to responses for?
                      Are you feeling ok today tom?  Maybe you could explain
                      for those of us with lesser intellectual capacity than
                      \_ it's called trolling.    -mice
                         \_ whats trolling?  tom or the 99% of unsigned posts?
                            is it ok when tom deletes or changes other people's
                            posts without signing?
2001/11/7 [Reference/BayArea] UID:22967 Activity:insanely high
11/6    Wednesday at 7pm in 2050 VLSB.
          The question is (paraphrased, perhaps):  What is the
        responsibility of the government in the current crisis and how
        should that responsibility evolve over time?
          Here's what happened at the meeting:
          ACLU and the Green Party are no longer showing up, so now it's
        just SWC, the Afghan Student Association, the Muslim Student
        Union, the Cal Democrators, the Berkeley Republicans, and
        Berkeley USA.  Every group is going to give a 6 to 7 minute
        speech, and then each group will be able to ask one other group
        ONE question.  After that comes audience questions.
        the order of speeches:
          1. Berkeley College Republicans 2. Cal Berkeley Democrats 3.
        Afghan Student Association 4. United Students for America 5.
        Muslim Student Association 6. Stop the War Coalition
          The other thing is that the three USA groups are trying to get as
                                        \_ which obviously suck!
        many people as possible since they were so frustrated with the
        biased crowd during the last debate.  They say they've been
        publicizing a lot, and they expect to have the majority.  I think
        we should make sure this doesn't happen, or at least make sure
        there is a balance!
        \_ Webcast?
        \_ So how hard did you work to make sure that there was a balanced,
           bias-free, no-particular-majority audience at this *last*
           meeting?  Uh-uh.  That's what I thought.
2001/11/3 [Reference/BayArea, Transportation/Car, Transportation/PublicTransit] UID:22919 Activity:high
11/2    Anyone crossed the San Mateo Bridge or the Dumbarton Bridge today?
        How's the situation there?
        \_ Seemed normal. A couple of CHP cars on either side. Traffic was
           about average for a Friday.
        \_ I was so paranoid this morning that I took 880S -> 237W -> 101N to
           go from Hayward to Foster City.
           go from Hayward to Foster City to avoid any bridges.
           \_ THAT must've sucked. it must have added 1-2 hours to your
              morning commute. 880S from Union City to 237 is horrid, tho
              101N should've been ok.
              \_ It took me a whole 1.5 hours, but that was because there were
                 one construction site running a jack-hammer and one accident
                 on 880S, and two accidents on 101N, all of which caused
                 moron drivers to slow down and look even though no lanes were
        \_ stayed home altogether and will do bart next week. Better safe
                than dead..
                \_ you're a moron.
        \_ got laid off this week. No bridges for me. Can't afford the toll.
2001/10/30-31 [Politics/Domestic/California, Reference/BayArea] UID:22872 Activity:insanely high
10/30   I have a lot of pennies, and although they are non-ass,
        I would like to exchange them for a more socially acceptable
        form of money.  Are there any specific locations with those
        mythical money changing machines that will accept a huge
        collection of coins and (while taking a percentage) return
        useful change?  In Berkeley?  In the Bay Area?  Thanks.
        \_ I have heard that the wieght of the zinc in a penny is
           worth more than one penny.  i'm not sure if this is true.
           check the price of zinc, and weigh a penny, and melt
           them down to be sold as scrap.  this is illegal, though.
                \_ a get rich quick scheme
                   debasing legal tender
                   zinc worth more than cash
           \_ But isn't there something else other than zinc that gives it the
              bronze color?  How do you get rid of that?
                 Copper, of course.
           \_ The penny continues to be legal tender solely becauswe of the
              mining lobby.
              \_ How else do you pay for a 99-cent item without tax?
        \_ The Safeway on Solano near Santa Fe has a machine; commission is
           something like 15-20%.  --pld
                \_ If it's a Coinstar machine, it only takes 8.9 cents
                   per dollar. And it's fun to use!
                   \_ for locations.
        \_ AC Transit machines count pennies.
        \_ I'd just keep on using them whenever I go shopping.
        \_ The Cala Foods at Hyde and California has one. -ausman
        \_ The parking meters in San Mateo accept them. heh.
           \_ but do they accept dimes? that's where the fun starts
        \_ Why not take them to the bank? They'll make you roll them first,
           but they'll take them. I just exchanged $2.00 in pennies that
           way. --dim
           \_ Do they actually check what you put in the roll between the
              first and the last pennies?
                \_ My bank did.  It's a bank.  They do money.  They only do
                   money.  They've been doing nothing but money for 100+ years
                   since before you were born.  What are the odds you're going
                   to pull a fast one and get away with it?
2001/10/22 [Reference/BayArea, Transportation/Airplane] UID:22800 Activity:nil
10/22   Salon has a nice bio of Mark Bingham, the former Cal Rugby player
        who probably had a hand in the counter-hijacking of United Flight 93.
        He's become something of a hero in SF and they're talking about a
        memorial for him in the Castro district.
        \_ otoh, the chron has an opinion piece circulating a rumor that
           the usaf shot down flight 93.  god bless america.
           \_ there was a second debris field, which isn't consistent with
              the theory that passengers overpowered the hijackers and forced
              the plane into the ground
              \_ Maybe it went down like this:  passengers stormed the
                 hijackers, who really DID have a bomb.  Blammo.  No
                 F16 required.
           \_ If this were true, why would the govt want to cover this up?  It
              would've been good press for Bush that they acted fast.
                \_ Because the concept would have sickened most Americans at
                   the time before the full depth of the day had sunk in.
           \_ The Chron has actually gotten worse since the merger.
                \_ No shit...bringing in mediocre examiner people
                   brought down even further this already mediocre
                   paper. And "shitty" doesn't even begin to explain
                   the new examiner. I'd rather "keep SF" a one
                   newspaper city.
                \_ It costs 25 cents to keep me busy on BART all the way to
                   work and back.  Hard to beat that.
2001/10/15 [Reference/BayArea] UID:22740 Activity:nil
2001/10/9-10 [Reference/BayArea, Recreation/Dating] UID:22671 Activity:high
10/8    anyone been to one of those SF clubs like Mitchell Brothers?
        Is it fun or worth it? Just wondering, got some buds coming
        in for the weekend...
        \_ $100 cover.
        \_ are you interested in hot chicks or lots of physical contact for
           the dollar or stripper sex? Deja Vu and Mitchell Brothers are
           expensive, but quality. Crazy Horse and other places on market
           have cheap ho's, but they'll rub you until you're done for a $40.
        \_ Gold Club on Howard & 4th Street. It's affordable, so to speak.
           Cover charge may be $10 but if you print out coupons from
           <DEAD><DEAD> and show up before 10pm, you get in for free.
           Lap dance is $20, and they seem to go the extra mile if the mood
           is right. It's cheaper than any of those clubs on Broadway, IMO.
           \_ How much to get them in the mood?
              \_ Mood can't be bought. You can pay them extra, but then you
                 aren't getting the "good deal" that makes the lap dance extra
        \_ Any such clubs in the South Bay? Silicon Valley?
            \_ Dunno much about South Bay but what about Pink Poodle?
            \_ Brass Rail, T's Cabaret, Pink Poodle, Kit Kat Club, Candid Club.
               Table dances so no contact.  Some are nude some are bikini.
        \_ What is the deal with the place next to the Sunnyvale train
           station that charges you $20 to get in and $20/drink? Some
           cute girl comes up and talks to you while you drink it, but
           there is no lap dancing or anything like that going on.
           \_ Hostess bar?
2001/9/23 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Troll] UID:22597 Activity:high
9/20    Berkeley, as seen from New York:

        \_ Very intellectual, balanced, and thoughtful.  Have a look at this
           week's Economist for some surprisingly reasonable articles.  -John
        \_ wow, this is SO much like watchmen.  I mean, was the
           NY Post what they based the "New Frontiersman" on?  Anyone
           else draw parallels to the recent events to the end of watchmen?
        \_ what-evah. there are idiots everywhere. if some of berkeley's idiots
           fall on the extreme opposite end of the political spectrum from the
           idiots in most other areas, then so be it.
           \_ I believe idiots in Cornell or Yale has banned students from
              hanging flags from their dorm rooms. <insert ivory towers
              comment here> Sometimes I feel ASHAMED of graduating from
              Berkeley. I read the article and feel DISGUSTED about the
              crap that goes on in that silly place. Where are the
              patriots in Berkeley?  Rise up and be heard!
              \_ I'm in New Haven now, and there are flags all over all the
                 official Yale stuff, including the residential colleges
                 where the undergrads all live.  If there is a specific
                 dorm room window ban, I'm sure it's some stupid fire
                 hazard thing, not political.
        \_ All of it is accurate and correct.
           \_ [contentless ad hominem blather purged]
        \_ the whole thing was blown out of proportion.  the nypost
           sucks ass anyway, did you read their little tirade blaming
           the bombing on the united nations?
           \_ What was blown out of proportion exactly?  It's all true,
              accurate, correct, and precise.
              \_ Barbara Lee is not a Communist. Neither is Ron Dellums.
                 Ron Dellums was chair of the House Armed Forces committe.
           \_ the world is collapsing, manhattan is about to generate
              a giant sinkhole and all of lower manhattan could fall
              into the hudson river, and they're concerned about
              bfd not putting flags on their trucks?   I'm looking
              at the site and I see a column by John Gotti's daughter.
              Here's a great factual 100 percent correct column
              for you:
        \_ I hate to break it to you, but the New York Post is the paper that
           New Yorkers who are too poor to subscribe to the New York Times
           read.  It's a pretty sensationalistic, entertainment-first, news
           second kind of paper.
           \_ It has nothing to do with wealth.  The Post is _the_ paper for
              New Yorkers.  It's the local paper in the same way The San
              Francisco Comical is the bay area paper.  Anyway, yes the paper
              is trash but the article is still 100% correct regarding
              Berkeley.  Go ahead, correct something in the article and let
              us know where they went wrong.
              \_ The NY Post is like a real newspaper in the same way Hard
                 Copy is like real news.
                 \_ No, it's exactly like the SF Chron.  Anyway, no one has
                    yet said exactly what is inaccurate in the article.
        \_ "They would be rotting in jail for their political heresies,
            tortured with cattle prods. Or buried up to their necks in sand
            and stoned to death." - THis is the concluding thought,
            which to me, seems almost to say he wishes this is what happened
            to us "Berkeleyites".. We should demand an apology....
            im not even sure though if the paper is worth asking an apology
            \_ "...which to me, seems almost to say he wishes this is what
                happened to us..." is a matter of your opinion and feeling.
                The fact remains that what he said is true.  You'd be killed
                or permanently in jail in many countries for the same behavior.
                You live in the freest nation on the planet.  Enjoy it, but
                don't piss on it.  You've got no where better to go.
        \_ If this article is correct, then I think people in Berkeley are
           being idiots.  However, I suspect that the writer is biased and
           more interested in insulting Berkeley and liberals in general
           than providing a reasonable opinion.  For example, the writer
           refers to Rep. Lee voting against the resolution supporting the
           use of force.  I saw a clip of Lee's speech on TV, and she
           wasn't arguing that we shouldn't use force.  Instead, she was
           saying that we shouldn't act hastily in the heat of the moment
           and do something we might later regret (e.g. kill lots of
           innocent people).
           \_ Opinions are just that: opinion.  There's no such thing as a
              reasonable or unreasonable opinion.  Why is it so hard for
              some people to separate fact from opinion?   I read Lee's
              comments about her vote right after her vote and "not act too
              hasty" was not her agenda.  "Not act" was her agenda.
2001/9/18-19 [Reference/BayArea] UID:22506 Activity:moderate 70%like:22465
9/17    I'm looking for more females around the bay area.  I found four in San
        Jose with large fruit.  I'm collecting the phone numbers to give to
        family and friends.  Thank you.
        \_ Very funny.  He's looking for female ginko trees.
        \_ if youre interested, i know where a few are in berkeley.
           send me an email  -hahnak
           \_ Females in Berkeley?  Mooooooo.
2001/9/16 [Transportation/PublicTransit, Academia/Berkeley, Reference/BayArea] UID:22480 Activity:nil
9/15    I have a room to rent near North Berkeley BART for
        $400/mo. It's a bit of an improvised affair but fully
        furnished and good for a temporary situation. Email
        me if you're interested. --ulysses
2001/9/15-18 [Reference/BayArea] UID:22465 Activity:kinda low 70%like:22506
9/17    I'm looking for more female ginkgo trees around the bay area.  I found
        four in San Jose that have a lot of fruit.  I'm collecting the seeds
        to give to family and friends.  Thank you.
        \_ there are at least two trees near the front of school, to the right
           of asuc.  both are female, with lots of stinky, sticky fruit.  also
           on fulton near channing there is at least one female tree with another
           one nearby.  write me, hahnak
2001/9/13 [Reference/BayArea] UID:22422 Activity:nil
9/12    Instead of arguing about all this terrorism crap, do something
        good and donate some blood.
        \_ Or money, if you happen to be sick for the time being like me.
2001/8/23-24 [Reference/BayArea, Reference/Military] UID:22222 Activity:high
8/23    My brother with his friend are coming to town and he wants me to show
        him interesting places in Bay Area. What are the good places
        to take them to? I have no clue myself. I haven't come out of
        Berkeley in ages ..
        \_ Winchester Mystery House - 1 hour drive, but very worth it
           It's the goth-geek-freak-hipster-nerd guide to SF, worth a look
           for this sort of thing.
        \_ Golden Gate Park, Koit Tower, Lombard Avenue, Haight/Ashbury,
           Jack London Sq, Sony Metrion, ...
           \_ twin peaks, mount tam, stinson, sausalito.. the metreon is
              far from interesting..
        \_ drive to monterey
        \_ Boys Toys in North Beach.
        \_ What does your bro likes to do? I mean, you could start with
           'regulation-standard' touristy places such as Pier 39, Ghirardeli
           Square, Golden Gate Bridge, and the likes. If he wants something
           unique, drive down to Santa Cruz Beach Boardwalk. Ditto on the
           Monterey, not to be missed. If he likes museums, plenty of that too,
           including the SF Exploratorium. Ask them for specifics. - jthoms
        \_ maybe you can show him the homeless on telegraph.
           \_ The homeless one Telegraph? You mean history majors, right?
           \_ Heck, you can see homeless anywhere. The ones on telegraph are
              just more in the way.
        \_ I've always liked going to Napa Valley.
              \_ I think this is part of Fort Baker in Marin.
              \_ I'm looking into it, but here's a URL that might be somewhat
                 useful.    -mice
        \_ Mitchell Bros.  in SF.
                 army lookout points.  These links point to the primary sites.
        \_ You can take him to the abandoned WWII-era army bases in Marin.
           They're open to the public.  History, hiking, beautiful
           California coastline, etc.  -mice
           \_ is there a formal name for this place?
              \_ Fort Barry, probably.   -mice
                 The whole area is stuffed with old gun emplacements and
                 army lookout points.  If you do end up going, remember to
                 bring warm clothes.
                  \_ Is there places to camp around there?
           \_ Also the USS Hornet or USS Jeremiah O'Brien
        \_ Take them to a club so they can pick up some nice women.
        \_ Show them both Telegraph and U. Ave at $tanfurd.  Then they can
           see that college cultures can be very different even for schools
           that are close to each other.  How old are they and where are
           they from anyway?
           \_ Telegraph avenue is good for being asked "spare change for pot"
              and smelling urine or feces that ocassionally graces the
              street, but not much else.
              \_ before you can accept Telegraph avenue, you must come to
                 grips with the telegraph avenue within yourself.
2001/8/17-19 [Politics/Domestic/California, Reference/BayArea] UID:22147 Activity:kinda low
8/16    I need a few grams of magnesium.  Are there any chemical supply
        stores in Berkeley? -mjm
        \_ Alfa Aeser: they will send you what you need fast.
        \_ Get a cheap Cube case on ebay.
        \_ Making your next bomb?
2001/8/15-16 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley, Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Troll] UID:22123 Activity:high
        "Police Search Massage Parlor in Connection With Prostitution"
        So much for the local bordello.
        \_ only in berkeley would people be stupid enough to go to
           a place like that expecting a massage and "be shocked to find
           that massage was not the primary service offered."
        \_ That place has been in business for at least 10 years, when I
           first heard about it from a female-friend and probably
           before then. I think that's the place that always has
           the windows covered.
                \_ Established 1973
        \_ I had a good time there, that's one of the few things I'm going
           miss about Berkeley.
           \_ Like always, it'll be back. Just waiting for the heat to die down
              Come and visit later
              \_ not if those punks at rent out the space
                 from under them!  Seems like every time a house of ill
                 repute goes down, adjectivity is there in it's place.
          \_ Can you elaborate on your experience there?
             \_ search google for "golden gypsy", find an interesting story.
             \_ You could close down Kip's,
                Or the Golden Bear,
                And nobody would care,
                But the heart and soul
                Of Berkeley's in
                Our Maison Derriere!
                \_ To shut it down now would be twisted,
                   We just heard this place existed!
                \_ oh, you mean the White Horse?
2001/5/22 [Reference/BayArea] UID:21319 Activity:high
5/21    Bay Area sucks
          \_ I agree.  I can't believe we're all getting triple-butt-fucked
             what with the energy snafu, the gas snafu, and the housing
             snafu with no end in sight.
             \_ i'm talking about the so-called "expressways", food prices,
                weather, people, grass, dirt, underwear, infrastructure, et al.
                \_ Yeah, I hate it when girls wear underwear. Especially when
                   they're wearing skirts.
        \_ then leave, ya' whiny-ass apathetic loser!
        \_ I used to think that the BA was better than LA, but LA actually
           has more culture than the BayArea (with the exception of SF,
           Oakland, and Berkeley of course).
              GO TO TEXAS!
           \_ Oakland has less culture than LA.
              \_ crack.  you are on crack.
2001/3/12-14 [Reference/BayArea] UID:20758 Activity:high
3/11    Random question for Bay Area csua-ers:  when you're driving on the
        San Mateo-Hayward bridge there are these signs with numbers on them
        in the center divider that start at 1100 or so, then decrease as you
        head westward until you hit the high-rise where they change entirely.
        does anyone know what their purpose is?
        \_ I saw similar signs on Golden Gate Bridge.  My guess is they're
           there for maintenance purposes.
        \_ Body count.
           \_ Body Count??  Wasn't that Ice-T's crappy punk/metal band?
              Didn't they break up or OD on heroin or something?
                \_ Yeah.  On the San Mateo bridge.
                   \_ 1100 times!?!?!
                        \_ About that many.
2001/1/19-20 [Reference/BayArea] UID:20377 Activity:nil
1/19    is there anywhere to buy crickets in berkeley/oakland aside
        from the east bay vivarium?
        \_ The bone room on solano. -- ilyas
2001/1/16-17 [Reference/BayArea, Industry/Jobs] UID:20334 Activity:very high
1/15    Anyone know who is hiring in SF ??
        \_ Castro Street Brothels.
        \_ Five Finger Discounts on Castro St.
        \_ (/csua/pub/jobs/Epicentric)
        \_ *EVERYONE* in SF is hiring.  Go do a jobs search, sheesh.
 ,,,, etc.  C'mon, put
           the tiniest effort into it.
           etc.  C'mon, put the tiniest effort into it.
           \_ no, i'm a fucking lazy whore.  pimp for me.
              \_ If you're fucking, then obviously you're not a lazy whore.
        \_ McDonald's
           \_ McDonalds? Never heard of them.
              \_ What, you do not know the company that makes iMacs?
                 \_ ... and eMacs too.  -- yuen
                 \_ They also make airplanes.
2000/12/22-23 [Reference/BayArea, Politics/Domestic/SIG] UID:20155 Activity:high
12/21   Why are people anti-union? Every human product is ambiguous, that
        doesn't mean we forbid ourselves from creation. Liquor is good
        (relaxation, thinning blood), liquor is bad (insert standard args).
        What it means is simple to state, but difficult to enact: we must
        be aware of both sides of the story, and relaize that both have
           \_ Communism, socialism, naziism, totalitarianism and right wing
              fanatics are bad. They are evil. They have no redeeming
              qualities. There is no two sides to this story. Supressing
              the rights of the one in favor of the rights of the many is
              wrong. There is no two sides to that story. Get you head out
              of your arse.
              \_ Union != Communism.
                 Union != Socialism.
                 Union != Naziism.
                 Union != Totalitarianism.
                 Banning unions requires you ammend the constitution to
                 nullify the freedom of assembly. That is one of the
                 elements to communism, socialism, naziism, and
        \_ As a concept I'm not opposed to unions.  I think people need to
           have a place to go to make sure things like worker safety are
           taken care of.  The reality is that unions today really only focus
           on themselves as a political entity and not worker safety, rights,
           or anything else unless worker benefits just happen to coincide with
           the betterment of the union.
        \_ Unions are based on socialistic principles about "collective"
           power and "workers" rights. These things are directly opposed
           to individual freedoms and the free market system.
        \_ "Big business is based on capitalistic principles about "profit"
           and "corporate" rights.  These things are directly opposed to
           individual freedoms and the free market system (since it's not
           in business' interests to have free markets--c.f. Microsoft)"
              \_ Monopolies are opposed to individual rights, but
                 in a true free market a monopoly will not last for
                 Microsoft got to where it is at because its competition
                 made mistakes. Microsoft is slow losing ground,
                 and its not because of the government. Its because
                 they have made missteps in strategy allowing competitors
                 to gain ground.
                 If you don't like MS vote with your $s. That's what
                 I do.
           \_ Nah.  Unions are not necessarily bad.  Unions empower the
              individual against the collective power of big businesses.
              Critical to the health of democracies is the ability and
              freedom for individuals to form various organizations
              including religious organizations such as churches,
              professional organizations such as IEEE, recreational/
              hobby organizations such as your local Linsux chapter,
              and finally organizations like the Sierra Club or
              NRA and also labor unions.  These organizations give
              individuals support and a collective voice in the issues
              they care for.  The membership should be at will.
              Observe that dictators and authoritarian regimes hate
              these kind of organizations and will always try to
              destroy or control them.  The Walesa-led union was
              hated by the Polish communist regime back in the Soviet
              era, and the china commies hate the local churches and
              even the falungong.  Authoritarian and undemocratic
              Singapore does not allow unions except for a government-
              controlled one.  Without such organizations, the
              individual is isolated, and powerless, and subject to
              abuse and oppression by the only organization left -
              the government.  Unions help to balance the power of
              another type of organization that sometimes abuses
              the individual - i.e. big businesses.  Come to think
              of it, it is arguable that Singapore and present-day
              China are two countries when an authoritarian government
              and big businesses collude to abuse and exploit the
                     Big Business helps individuals generate _/
                     wealth. Unions don't help anyone generate
                     anything. Big Business is what powers the
                     countries prosperity, not Unions. Unions
                     leach the profits of Big Buiness. Business
                     free and unrestrained by bureaucrats and
                     union bosses is critical for the health
                     democracy, freedom, liberty, prosperity.
                     Unions seek to destroy what good Business
                     has created.
                     \_ Yes. Because we all know that unions
                        segments.   Thanks.
                        have a vested interest in destroying
                        good business. Pull you fucking head
                        out of your ass and grow a brain you
                        moron. Unions are a vehicle for
                        bargaining. Everyone bargains for
                        employment compensation, not just
                        UAW workers and other blue collar
                        workers. No shit, unions aren't
                        designed to generate profits the same
                        way water isn't used to fuel cars.
                        Maybe if looked "union" up in a
                        dictionary you'd understand. Unions are
                        guaranteed by the first ammendment. If
                        you're suggesting banning unions then
                        you certainly have no respect for our
                        democracy and freedom.
                     \_ Please don't break what I wrote into
                        segments.   Thanks.  I agree with you
                        that big business is great, generally
        \_ "Big business is based on capitalistic principles about "profit"
           and "corporate" rights.  These things are directly opposed to
           individual freedoms and the free market system (since it's not
           in business' interests to have free markets--c.f. Microsoft)"
              \_ Monopolies are opposed to individual rights, but
                 in a true free market a monopoly will not last for
                 \_ Ah yes, the magical invisible hand of the market.  Do you
                    *ever* use your brain?  -tom
                 Microsoft got to where it is at because its competition
                 made mistakes. Microsoft is slow losing ground,
                 and its not because of the government. Its because
                 they have made missteps in strategy allowing competitors
                 to gain ground.
                 If you don't like MS vote with your $s. That's what
                 I do.
              \_ they try to hurt scabs and that is anti-competitive.
                 \_ That's wrong and the people who practice such
                    should be shot. But that's not the premise of
                    unions or collective bargaining.
              \_ Membership in a Union is different than membership
                 in the IEEE or the NRA or a given religious institution.
                 1. In no industry is IEEE or NRA membership required
                    for getting or keeping your job. Try to be non
                    union in the automotive or trucking or teaching
                    industries and see how long you last. (They will
                    force you out or get you to join).
                    \_ Please don't compare IEEE to the NRA. There's
                       a stark difference in the practices in civility
                       and political influence between the two groups.
                       \_ sidenly i am wondering how many IEEE members are
                          in the NRA...Based on what ive seen i'll bet its
                          alot more than the average number for a random
                          group of people.
                          \_ Probably not. IEEE members are not the
                             "I love god and my family and go to church
                             with ma girlfriend every Sunday. On weekdays
                             my ma and pa come to ma school and watch
                             me play football cause I'm the star
                             quaterback. Then me and ma buds hop in my
                             Chevrolet and guy hunting on the weekends.
                             When I go to Texas A&M Iam going to go
                             join the Army ROTC and serve ma country and God.
                             Ma idol is George W. Bush. Because he
                             believes in family values." type people.
                             How many IEEE members do you know have the
                             Hank Hill personality and aspire to taking
                             over the family farm?
                       \_ The NRA doesn't advocate threatening
                          or maiming non-NRA members in times
                          of dispute. The IEEE doesn't either.
                          Unions do. That's the point.
                          \_ Some unions do, others don't.  That's
                             the point.
                 2. The IEEE and the NRA do not engage in activities
                    like strikes, picketing, mass violence. These are
                    anti-competitive terrorist measures designed to
                    exploit business owners.
                    \_ Union == organization that provide a means of
                       collective bargaining.
                       Union != terrorism
                       Union != strikes (sometimes they do but that's
                         not the premise)
                       Union != Mass violence
                       Everyone pickets. Republicans picket, democrats
                       picket, pro-lifers picket, pro-choicers picket,
                       hippies picket, anti-gays picket.
                       \_ The means of bargaining is terrorism,
                          strikers, mass violence. Union bosses
                          uses thier lazy bum union members to
                          incite violence against management and
                          customers so that management will pay
                          thier ransom quicker and all the Union
                          members can get back to sitting on thier
                          arses. Wonder why all the jobs are going
                          overseas? Its because most US workers
                          hate hard work, they all want to get paid
                          sitting around being idle. Business can't
                          afford this.
                          \_ I didn't see any violence in the United
                             Airlines union.
                             \_ which one.  pilots,flight attendants,
                 \_ I dare you to say that to a UAL Flight Attendant.
                                mechanics, etc have separate unions.
                                additionally, UAL flight attendants are
                                represented by a different union than say
                                Delta, for instance.
                 3. Union derived benefits for workers are like ransom
                    derived from hapless kidnap victims. The market
                    provides sufficient working conditions, Union
                    employees would prefer to sit on thier arses and
                    get paid rather than work, which is why they are
                    always striking.
                    \_ I dare you to say that to a UAL Flight Attendant.
                 Unions are a unholy menace to liberty and freedom
                 populated by lazy bums and lead by communists and
                 socialist who want to do away with the free market
                 in favor of state control of everything. They want
                 a world where every man is equal because every man
                 is a poor pathetic slob without hope. I prefer the
                 American dream, where every man is equal because
                 every man is rich with the hope of achieving all
                 that he wants.
        \_ Unions are bad because the mob tends to control them.
        Enuff said.
           \_ As opposed to presidential elections.
        \_ In a perfect world, Unions would form to empower the workers
           and make the workplaces more tolerable, and then they would
           dissolve until they were needed again.  In our world, unions
           form to solve problems, then their officers get used to the
           power they wield, and they refuse to dissolve the union,
           seeking instead to increase their power and influence.  More
           often than not, what we need are unions to depose the corrupt
           and corpulent unions that now exist.  --erikred
            \_ but of course none of the businesses are corrupt or coruplent.
                \_ Bingo!  Give that man a prize!
           \_ You've been watching too many movies. People don't like unions
              because the "traditional" union supported promotion and benefits
              by seniority as opposed to skill/performance. Think "tenure."
              Plus unions try to get the most from their employers which
              sometimes means they conflict. Most people would accept some
              pain to avoid conflict. A repo man spends his life getting
              into tense situations.
        \_ MORE! MORE! MORE!
2000/11/27 [Reference/BayArea, Recreation/Food] UID:19919 Activity:high
4/240   Can anyone tell me where "Little Taipei" is?  It's supposed to be a
        plaza somewhere in the Bay Area with many Chinese restaurants.  Thanks
        in advance.  -- yuen
        \_ Take 880 and exit on warm springs.  It will be on your right side,
           \_ What city is this in?
           can't miss it, it's a big plaza.  There's a Lion supermarket in that
           mall.  Champion Teppanyaki in that plaza is the best teppanyaki
           place I've been.  They don't do a lot of shows like Benihana, but
           the food is excellent.
           \_ do they make you sit next to strangers there?
           \_ The Benihana show is kinda lame and the food so-so anyway.
              \_ The food smells better than it tastes.
        \_ lots of good lookin' young Asian women, you'll love it    -aaron
           \_ And some of them are even legal!
           \_ Are you kidding?  Good looking women in the Bay Area?  Good
              looking _Asian_ women?!  Are they as good looking as those
              in LA?
                \_ Depends on if you prefer them "au natural" or
                   "au mac/bebe/etc..."
                \_ The term "good looking" is a relative statement.  Good
                   looking, compared to say, Berkeley chicks in physics.
                   \_ When I graduated, there were a couple of reasonably
                      good looking women in astrophysics.
                      \_ In my day, we had a CS student who posed for Playboy.
                         Nice gal.
                \- what city is this in?
                   \_ Fremont.
2000/11/21 [Reference/BayArea] UID:19869 Activity:insanely high
11/20   What are some things to do with a visitor to the Bay Area in early
        December [so outdoorsy things are out]? This is someone who used to
        live here, so I dont mean things like GG Bridge and alcatraz. --psb
           \_ make a fry's run!
        \_ Napa, Sonoma, Coastline, Point Reyes, Concerts, Musicals, Plays,
           good restaurants, Muir Woods, Bay Cruises, Fishing
           \- these are mostly outdoorsy suggestions ... anything specific
           in the plays/bands area going on around dec 9,10? restaurants
           i can handle. i was thinking maybe the chinese exhibit at the
           oakland museum and the SFMOMA. anyone been to that new observatory
           in the oakland hills? --psb
           \_ The Anderson Collection is on exhibit through the first week
              of January at the SFMOMA.  If you can get tickets to "Late Henry
              Moss" go for it.  They are sold out, but might have more
              seats in the upcoming days.  I haven't been to Mamma Mia (is it
              any good?) but that's another possibility -- it's playing at
              the Orpheum.  The Vagina Monlogues looks good, too, although
              I haven't read up on reviews yet (I am thinking of going
              myself).  --chris
              \_ isn't Monologues some stupid feminist play where the
                 ugly chicks refuse to get naked in order to assert thier
                 womanhood or some bs like that?
                 womanhood or some bs like that? As if ugly chicks could
                 get laid by anyone other than other ugly chicks (and its
                 not really laid either if its two chicks without a guy).
           \_ coffee places, check out concerts at Davies Symphony, check
              out concerts at the <DEAD><DEAD> site (don't remember
              exact), Museums, Metreon, Yerba Buena, Bowling, Ice Skating,
              and others.
        \_ netrek with Uncle tom and the GBs?  It's always a joy.
        \_ Skiing at Tahoe, musicals in SF, wine tasting in napa.
           Tech Museum & IMAX in SJ.
        \_ O'Farrell Brothers, El Cid in San Francisco.
           \_ Kit Kat Club in Mountain View
                \_ It's in Sunnyvale!
2000/11/2 [Reference/BayArea] UID:19634 Activity:high
11/1    Anyone know where I can get a PS/2 splitter for under $20?
        Net, SF, or Berkeley preferred.
        \_ find someone who already has one and kick him in the nuts.
        \_ Radio Shack.  Some assembly required.
        \_ Fry's
        \_ $15 at Target?
2000/10/31-11/1 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Troll] UID:19612 Activity:high 61%like:19626
10/30   Are there any 24 hr oil change places in/around Berkeley?
        \_ It's called the San Francisco Bay.  Stop driving already.
        \_ No. Berkeley's retail stores as a set can be considered as
           a vast outdoor mall which closes at 11:30, after which the
           mall security (Berkeley PD) come to beat up and generally
           harass any remaining shoppers and/or loiterers (homeless).
           Thank you for shopping Berkeley!
           \_ being pissed about berkeley's businesses closing early
              is fine, but do you really want a 24 oil change place
              in your neighborhood?  I've never even seen one
                \_ Fuck NIMBYism.
           \_ AROUND motherfucker, do you know what it means?
                \_ No. Now fuck off.
2000/9/15 [Reference/BayArea] UID:19254 Activity:nil
9/15    So, is it "the Bay Area" or "Bay Area"?
2000/8/25-27 [Reference/BayArea, Reference/RealEstate] UID:19098 Activity:very high
8/25    Any place in the bay area where I can find a house < $300K?  Don't
        tell me East Palo Alto.  I'll settle for townhouse, but not condo.
                \_ just come heavily armed with a shotgun and a kevlar vest..
                        \_ Power armor.  Have it developed.
        \_ don't hold your breath.  what we need right now is a massive
                \_ I actually looking.  It's true.
           10.0 earthquake to physically destroy most of the computer
           industry around here before prices go down...just enough
           destruction to drive a large part, but not all, of the tech
           companies out.   *sigh*
                - (racially insensitive, mood swings)
        \_ You think you can get a house in E Palo for under $300k?  Don't
           be stupid.  They're not giving them away in EPA anymore.
           \_ Yeah, nowhere can you get a perfect view of 35mm shells flying
              by your window at 2am in the morning.
                \_ I was actually looking.  It's true.
                \_ 35mm? Either you are trying to shoot down aircraft, or are
                   watching big-screen films or have robots in teh streets.
        \_ You won't find a house of under $300K in the bay area.
        \_ a friend of mine bought a 2br 1ba with bay view and backyard,
           in East Oakland a couple months ago for $250Kish.  It's not in
           an elite neighborhood, but it's on the "good side" of High Street
           by the 580.  It's possible, you just have to compromise.  Another
           friend of mine bought a 3br 2ba house for $330K in Clayton (by
           Concord/Walnut Creek -- and yah, it is one of those 70s style homes
           with frightful orange and green walls inside, but she figures she
           can easily fix that) two weeks ago, so my guess is that there
           are 2br 1ba houses for less than $330K out that aways, too. --chris
           \_ The compromise being that you fear for your life and your wife's
              well being at all hours, but gee the house was such a bargain.
        \_ There are still houses ~ 300K in Newark/Union City/Hayward
           (~ 500k new) Other places you might want to look are milpitas
           (alviso), downtown (getto) sunnyvale, e sj. Town homes in 300k
           are still available in the w sj & cupertino area, but these are
           really small (~ 900 sqft).
        \_ Well, if you consider Pittsburg still in the Bay Area, my gf's
           sister bought a 2-story 6-bdrm house out there for $350k.
           \_ I don't.  Might as well live in Texas.
           \_ Pittsburgh is in Pennsylvania. That's not Bay Area.
                \_ pittsburgh, california, you fucking dweeb
                        \_ Pittsburg, CA, versus PittsburgH, PA
        \_ back in november I saw a house go for 150K in oakland on
           MLK in between ashby bart and and childrens hospital.  Right next
           to bart tracks.
           \_ There are a lot of houses in flatland north Oakland (not
              Rockridge) that go for less than $300k.  Of course, a trivial
              search on would have told you that.  -tom
              \_ or
                                 Mark my words: a new 2bd/2.5bath townhome
              \_ yeah and spend $60K just to make it reasonably livable.
                 when you could spend a little more on a new home in Newark
                 and have that house appreciate MUCH faster. And a new home
                 wont suck up all your time to get it fixed.
                        \_ When I moved into my place, we redid the foundation,
                           electrical, plumbing, heating, and floors, and
                           it cost, in total, about $30K.  And it's way the
                                 places to buy(i work in Palo Alto), unless
                                 you have a well-paying job in SF or Contra
                                 Costa, then you can buy in North
                                 Oakland/Rockridge for cheap and stay
                                 near some nightlife/culture. But if youre
                                 buying a house, you probably cant afford
                                 to go out anyways,heh.
                           hell nicer than anything you can buy in Newark.
                           \_ not now.
                           \_ And Oakland sucks and it'll never appreciate.
                              I think you made the wrong choice.
                              \_ actually oakland will appreciate, but NOWHERE
                                 near as fast as Newark will the next 2 years.
                                 Mark my words: a NEW 2bd/2.5bath townhome
                                 in Newark purchased today will appreciate
                                 nearly $100K in the next 12-18 months.
                                 I'm looking at that area ASAP, but also
                                 considering an older townhome/house in
                                 S'vale, just to keep my commute sane.
                                 I am screwing myself by generating
                                 competing buyers, but really those are the
                                 places to buy(esp if u work in Palo Alto
                                 like me), unless you have a well-paying
                 Would you like to pay for a detailed study? or is
                 complaining less expensive? THINK about how the govt
                 tracks this data and you'll see.
                                 job in SF or WC, then you can buy
                                 in North Oakland/Rockridge for cheap and
                                 stay near some nightlife/culture. But if
                                 youre buying a house, you probably cant
                                 afford to go out anyways,heh.
                                \_ ooh yeah, Oakland sucks, it's so horrible
                                   to have a dozen real restaurants, a
                                   good grocery store and a movie theatre
                                   within 3 blocks of my place.  It would
                                   be so much better if I had to drive 5
                                   minutes to get to the Taco Bell/Burger King/
                                   Applebee's strip.  Not to mention an
                                   hour drive to get anywhere with any kind
                                   of nightlife or culture.  As for
                                   appreciation, I bought it for $265K,
                                   similar houses in the neighberhood are going
                                   over $400K, 1.5 years later.  -tom
                                   \_ You have a funny idea of 'good'.  If I
                                      want what Berkeley, SF, or anywhere else
                                      has to offer, I can drive to the slums,
                                      and then *go home*.  I don't have to
                                      *live* in that shit.  And how often do
                                      you _really_ enjoy that really great
                                      Oakland nightlife chill'n' on da korna
                                      wit da homeez?  Asking price != selling.
                                      People in slums always talk about how
                                      great the culture is.  They have nothing
                                      else to talk about.  Check the crime rate
                                      and let us know.
                                        \_ gee, racist trolls from reiffin.
                                           how original.  -tom
                                           \_ As usual, "whatever you say tom."
                                              I've asked you before to just
                                              add my standard reply to your
                                              garbage for me to save me the
                                              effort.  Is it that hard?  I'm
                                              not a racist but if it makes you
                                              feel better to think so, that's
                                              ok with me.  Whatever.  -reiffin
                                                \_ how about, we'll just
                                                   imagine your replies and
                                                   you can just go away.  -tom
                                                   \_ "We" who?  You speak for
                                                      all motd readers?  Or is
                                                      that the "royal we"?  The
                                                      truth is I'll never go
                                                      away as long as you're
                                                      around.  You're so easy,
                                                      I can't help but bait
                                                      you.  You take yourself
                                                      so seriously when no one
                                                      else does.  -reiffin
                                   \_ Purchased a new home in SJ for $530K
                                      10 months ago. Now similar homes
                                      in the area sell for nearly $900K. And
                                      the new homes in area with larger lots
                                      are being offered at $1.1million (as
                                      a *starting* bid). Problem w/ Oaktown
                                      is that the good parts are built up.
                                      But SJ and UC/NWK have *new* homes
                                      being built, which are of course more
                                      expensive, but drive up the price
                                      of neighboring homes a lot more than
                                      usual. LOCATION LOCATION LOCATION!
                                      And all my neighbors drive lexus,
                                      porsche, bmw, mbz and there's 1 ferrari
                                        \_ uh, when you add supply, the
                                           price goes down (relatively).  -tom
                                           \_ tend to agree with tom on this
                                              thread.  i wouldn't call his
                                              decision to buy a house in
                                              oakland stupid.  a friend of mine
                                              bought in oakland for $100K 2
                                              years ago, and the house is now
                                              worth $300K.  Yah, he had to fix
                                              it up, but he likes everything
                                              he put in, instead of having to
                                              put up with someone else's decor.
                                              plus, I don't particularly care

                                              for a permanent living situation
                                              in Newark/SouthBay. --chris
                                                 \_ i think you all would
                                                    both change your
                                                    mind if you were the
                                                    one who got mugged
                                                    or even killed in the
                                                    area.  not the
                                                    preferable place to be.
                                                    not to be racist either,
                                                    but those things happen,
                                                    and with greater freq.
                                                    \_ Believing in crime
                                                       statistics isn't racism.
                                           \_ price should go down but they
                                              do not, because the new
                                              prices for neighboring lots
                                              go up, while supply still
                                              strips demand (until the stock
                                              market crashes that is).
                                              If someone wants to live in
                                              the same area, they HAVE to pay
                                              similar prices. You do not
                                              understand BA RE very well.
                                              It more complicated than Econ 1
                                              The homes are not worth that
                                              amount of money, but that's
                                              the market, and people have/had
                                              "free" money to toss around
                                              so what do they care? Yes, BA
                                              market is all topsy-turvy. And
                                              Oakland simply has a bad rep
                                              so it can never grow as fast.
                                              Even though it's the best
                                              place to live for many reasons.
                                              Sigh, I lived in Rockridge for
                                              5+ years and would still be
                                              SJ & it's too hot and stuffy.
                                              there if the commute was
                                              reasonable. The water sucks in
                                              SJ. Weather too hot and stuffy.
                                              Gasoline is 20 cents higher.
                                              BIKE is near useless.
                                              No cool movies. But they
                                              do have fewer bums and a Fry's
           \_ You want these numbers by city, not by county.  Some of these
              counties are a mix of very nice cities and shitty slums.  County
              numbers are misleading.
              \_ Breakdown by city would be misleading too. i.e. oakland.
                 \_ That's true.  A lot of these cities are large and have
                    very varying areas and prices.  The county numbers are
                    completely worthless, however.  Cities numbers still
                    have _some_ value.
                    \_ Gee, County numbers have _some_ value too. The only
                       thing that is worthless is your all-or-nothing attitude.
                       Anyways, I was trying to help answer the poster's Q.
                        \_ Your call.  I don't pay attention to misleading
                           numbers that clump *huge* areas together under a
                           single heading.  You can if you'd like.
                           \_ You cannot find the numbers.
                                MEDIAN PRICE
           County          July '99   July '00  Pct. chg.
           Alameda         $278,000   $340,000    22.3%
           Contra Costa    $250,000   $269,000     7.6%
           Marin           $438,000   $550,000    25.6%
           Napa            $199,000   $269,000    35.2%
           San Francisco   $375,000   $470,000    25.3%
           San Mateo       $425,000   $503,000    18.4%
           Santa Clara     $390,000   $483,000    23.8%
           Solano          $162,000   $195,000    20.4%
           Sonoma          $249,000   $290,000    16.5%
           Source: DataQuick Information Systems
2000/8/23-24 [Reference/BayArea] UID:19073 Activity:high
8/22    Silicon Valley Living situation poll.  How many housemates?
           \_ What do you mean by "housemates"? Does that mean
              other people living @ the same address? Do your
              parents/siblings count?
              \_ yes to both
                \_ People you mate with in your house.
                      \_ So the people who responded to 2 & 3
                         below are some kind of sex fiends. Wow.
                   \_ 538. #539-551 only come occasionally.
                   \_ Does Miss Real Doll (TM) count?
        \_ Living Alone         1
           1 other              1
           1 other              2
           2 others             1
           1 other              3
           1 other              4
           2 others             2
           > 3 others
           3 others             1
           > 3 others           1
           592 Illegal Stinking Thai Refugees and their Screaming Kids     9
           living at home and enjoying the extra $$$    4
              (hey...fuck you tom or whoever wants to make a commentary)
        \_ Please do not include workstations in this count, as much
           as you may argue that each has its own "personality."
           \_ If you include personality, you need to subtract 1 for the nerd.
        \_ Use 0.5 for a halfwitted person.
           \_ Use -0.5 for the poster of the above
        \_ Does Berkeley count as "Silicon Valley"
           \_ only if milpitas counts as "cunt of the bay area"
           \_ berkeley counts as "oakland north"
           \_ No.  Berkeley had its own rent problems long before SV existed
              in its current form.
2000/8/22-23 [Reference/BayArea, Computer/Networking] UID:19069 Activity:high
8/22    Silicon Valley == Santa Clara Valley.  However, when we say
        Silicon Valley, what are the border towns on the north, south,
        east and west?
        \_ I think there's no clear boundary, just like "Bay Area".
           \_ yep, generally San Jose/Santa Clara/Palo Alto, but as far
              north as San Mateo and parts of Alameda/Contra Costa
              north as parts of San Mateo/Alameda/Contra Costa counties,
              and as far south as Santa Cruz even.
              Some say Silicon Valley is not a place but a cultural mindset.
              It includes where Sun, HP, Cisco and Oracle are located.
                        \- it should be referred to as "the silicon valley".
                        leaving out the "the" isnt as bad as leaving out the
                        "the" in "the internet" but is bad --psb
                                \_ get a life.
                                \_ okay, i shall now call you "The psb"
           \_ well, I wouldn't consider SF part of Silicon Valley.
                \_ Others do.  Got the message?
                   \_ There was this trivia question on one of those
                      morning shows several years back (Today, I believe),
                      and they asked where SV was, and the answer was SF.
                      Apparently they got numerous angry calls so the next
                      day they retracted their answer.
        \_ Entertainment Alley == San Mateo
           Multimedia Gulch == SOMA
2000/8/11 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley] UID:18968 Activity:nil
8/11    Berkeley Critical Mass is tonight!  5:30 Berkeley BART, leaving after
        6 PM.  Party, music, libations to follow.
2000/7/31-8/2 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley, Computer/Networking] UID:18836 Activity:high
7/31    Need recommendation for decent DSL provider in Berkeley/Albany
        area.  Preferrably static IP, free install. <$40-50 per month
        \_ Try firstworld. They should be available in Berkeley/Albany.
           \_ I just started using them. I've had to call tech-support
              about 15 times in the past two days, but they are pretty
              friendly, hold times are short, and they seem somewhat
              \_ I had the same experience, i.e. once you get past setup
                 glitchfest, it's smooth sailing. They are not bad. --aaron
                 \_ you live in Berkeley/Albany, Aaron?
                \_ This stage will last about 3 weeks until they get too
                   many customers for tech support to handle.  Sign up fast
                   if you want to use them.  This applies to all good things.
             \_ I've only called them 3 times in 7+ months. Everytime the
                people I spoke to were resonalbly competent and friendly.
                My ave. wait times have been less than 10 mins. My setup
                was glitch free but the technician was at my house for >
                6 hours. I know several people who use them for business
                access as well, no incidents thus far. YMMV ----ranga
        \_ How about earthlink?
2000/7/13-14 [Reference/BayArea, Transportation/Bicycle] UID:18669 Activity:high
7/13    SQUIRT RIDE TOMORROW!  Berkeley Critical Mass takes to the
        streets with waterpistols, bike cart sound system, couch on
        wheels and more!  gather 5:30 PM downtown Berkeley BART
        every second Friday to leave around 6-6:15 PM.  Dinner
        and bike videos after.
        \_ When I was 18 I could squirt up to 8 times a day. Now at 30 I
           can only squirt 3 times a day. Is this decrease of performance
           normal for a guy?
           \_ it's quality not quantity that counts             -30 year old
                \_ tom, is that you?
                   \_ I'm 32 and I sign my posts.  -tom
                        \_ Which doesn't add anything to the quality or
                           usefulness.  Being 32, that is.
           \_ Gee, are you sure it's a decrease in performance?  Maybe
              your masturbation is more effective now.
           \_ Only 8 times at age 18?  See a doctor.
           \_ The more you squirt, the earlier it rots.
                \_ This is a use-it-or-lose-it deal.
2000/7/8-9 [Reference/BayArea, Science/GlobalWarming] UID:18612 Activity:very high
        composting workshop tomorrow in San Jose.  Come and learn about ways
        to reduce and compost your garbage.  Keep America beautiful.
        \_ beautiful and San Jose jsut don't work together
        \_ beautiful and San Jose just don't work together
           \_ What's wrong with San Jose. - living in SJ since 82
                \_ yeah, what's wrong witb San Jose? -  since 74
                \_ yeah, what's wrong with San Jose? -  since 74
                   \_ San Josans are embarrassed to sign their names.
                      \_ that's San J0Z3RZ!!!!
        \_ Since the purpose is to help the environment, why don't they also
           post the workshop material on the web site so that people can
           choose not to burn gasoline to drive there to learn about it?  (I
           don't know if public transportation is possible.)  --- yuen
           \_ check out that site.  it has a lot of info already.  The workshop
              goes into more detail and has demos.  And they bring sample
              materials.  Composting is a see, touch, and do kind of thing. :)
              BTW, pro-environment doesn't mean "don't drive yer car".  Even
              the president of the sierra club has a car.  Since I started
              the president of the sierra club has a car.
                \_ the Sierra Club is concerned with hiking trails; they
                   don't give a shit about the environment.  -tom
              Since I started
              composting I've reduce my solid waste by about 70-80%.  If you
              are a recyler we want to turn you into composters as well.
              Check out "worm composting" you can do that in an apartment,
              without a backyard.
                \_ Uhm, I'm not sure I want to hear about your "solid waste
                   reduction....  That's nasty.
2000/6/22 [Reference/BayArea, Computer/Networking, Academia/Berkeley] UID:18525 Activity:nil
6/22    When is Berkeley ditching Sprintnet?
        \- Since someone touched the subject, what is a *good* backbone
        provider? I see a lot of Sprint/Global-One advertising, but can't
        really tell who's good, who's not.   -leblon
        \_ RSN - see
        \_ Depends on what you mean by 'good' and how much you're willing to
           pay for it.  MCI used to be good, but with Cable&Brainless buying
           their internet operations, I'd expect them to tank in a year or so.
        \_perhaps page of recommended providers should be maintained, similar
          to the cs books page -nesim
2000/6/19-20 [Reference/BayArea] UID:18499 Activity:high
6/19    Is there going to be fireworks in the Oakland Area on this July 4th?
        \_ of course not.  Why would they ever do that?  Just because every
           past year they've had them at the Coliseum, Jack London Square,
           AND the Berkeley Marina?
2000/6/12-15 [Reference/BayArea, Reference/RealEstate] UID:18449 Activity:low
6/12    Looking for 2-3 bedroom house in Berkeley/Albany/Emeryville/Oakland
        area that I can be very very noisy in w/o disturbing neighbors.
        Under $2K a sky if you know of any and I shall shower
        you with gratitude.  -sky
        \_ hopefully not of the amber-colored kind
           \_ My urine is glow in the dark orange -sky
              \_ "drink my yellow spray!"
        \_ I don't know any home owners in that area I dislike.
           \_ Ok.  But how about areas where you want the property value
              to depreciate?  -sky
                \_ Liability is a big concern for me.
        \_ I think there are probably a few charming places within walking
           distance of West Oakland BART.  -John
2000/6/11-14 [Reference/BayArea, Recreation/Food] UID:18445 Activity:kinda low
6/11    Can anyone recommend a good barber to go to in the Berkeley
        (east bay) area?
        \_ The barbers at the Barber College in Oakland do a great job.  I
           went there for years until I started cutting my own hair.
           MacArthur & Howe.
           \_ So what sort of cooking pot do you put on your head to get the
        \_ shear perfection right next to yogurt park.  ask for jenny.
        \_ the brothel right next to yogurt park.  ask for jenny.
        \_ oh no, not more shaving threads
        \_ crap crap crap crap
              line straight?  Or rather:  do you have any trouble with
              sunburns on your scalp after it's shaved?  I have a feeling
              that the original poster was looking for a haircut, not a
              hairhacknslash.  -John
           \_ Do they cut hair "down there"?
           \_ Formatting corrected.  -!motd formatting god
           \_ Jenny at shear perfection does a good job (the place
              next to yogurt park).  but that's only if you have stiff
              asian hair  -- slanty-eyed soda bastard
2000/6/4 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Troll/Kinney] UID:18408 Activity:nil
6/4     Fugazi + Sleater-Kinney + Invisible Scratch Pickles +
        lots of other things going on, today, Dolores
        Park, between 14th and 15th and Guerrero and Dolores, SF, 1-6pm.
2000/5/29-31 [Reference/BayArea] UID:18362 Activity:kinda low 66%like:17561
5/27    Where's a good place around here (berkeley) to get a kite?
        \_ telegraph
        \_ GoB?
        \_ there's a guy at the marina who sells kites out of a trailer...
           yeah, they have some crummy ones at games of berkeley...
           if you want more selection you should look online...
        \_ Some of the guys at the SF marina also have pretty good insider
           tips of custom places, either around here, or per mail order
           in various parts of the country.  I'd cruise down there and
           start chatting with some of the more clued-looking ones.  -John
2000/5/23-24 [Reference/BayArea] UID:18320 Activity:nil
5/22    JavaOne: June 6th-9th at the Moscone Center, SF. If anyone is
        interested, I can get you in "for free"... my friend's dad is
        taking his software company ( and is looking for
        some Berkeley CS-type people to stand around and talk to
        would-be execs about how great his product is. The good side
        is that you would get paid and you get a few hours each day
        to walk around, look at cool stuff, and get lots of little
        toys. Email me for questions/details.               - rory
        \_ JavaOne!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! d00d!!!!!! -blojo
2000/5/22-23 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley] UID:18311 Activity:very high
5/21    Any suggestions for a gym to join?  I'm thinking quality of facilities
        (e.g., new machines...pool and things like racquetball court are
        plusses) classes (frequency, variety of aerobics classes), proximity
        to Berkeley.
        \_ 24 Fitness.  It's got a million locations so I can work out close
           to home or at work.  They've got TV and obscene amounts of equipment.
           They've got beginning weight training sessions.  Whatever you do,
           though, don't sign up for a personal trainer; it's like being
           chained to a used car salesman.
           to home or at work.  They've got TV and obscene amounts of
           equipment.  They've got beginning weight training sessions.
           Whatever you do, though, don't sign up for a personal
           trainer; it's like being chained to a used car salesman.
           \_ some of them have a pool and a sauna
        \_ if you just want to lose weight, it's better to just go out and
           start jogging. All that fancy equipment won't help much. Jogging
                   chair around will really build upper body strength and it's
                   good for your heart, too.
           is free too.  Join a gym only if you do serious weight training or
           you really need a place to play ball.
                \_ Ride Bike!  -tom
                \_ You mean blow out your knees?  Good idea.  Rolling a wheel
                   chair around will really build upper body strength
                   and it's good for your heart, too.
                        \_ uh, biking is way better for your knees than
                           jogging.  -tom
                                \_ Was talking about jogging, but I do know
              \_ Gold's is now a 24 Hour Fitness.  They have really good rates,
                                   people who killed their knees biking, too.
                   \_ Most people aren't that fragile.
                        \_ Idiot.  People aren't fragile.  They simple wear
                           out from over use.  Why didn't your parents have
                     \_ Don't forget:  You're good enough, you're smart enough,
                        and gosh-darnit, people like you! =)
                           a tile kitchen floor or take you to pet the tigers?
           \_  Look, I'm asking for a gym, not weight loss advice.
               \_ Don't be shy.  You are amongst your self-loathing brothers
                  and sisters of geekdom.  We all want ... need to be buff.
                  \_ I have poor self-image too.
                  \_ We do?  I'm happy the way I am, thanks.  Always have been.
        \_ When I was at Berkeley, Gold's Gym was really nice.  - mikeym
           \_ Yeah, but what about GOD's Gym?!
                \_ Praise His Name!
           \_ Wasn't Gold's in Downtown Berkeley taken over by 24 Hour
              still a wait for everything?  do they have special accomodations
              \_ Gold's is now a 24 Hour Fitness.  They have really good rate
                 but the Berkeley one isn't great on facilities -- no pool or
                 courts.  they do have aerobics classes.
        \_ What about Ironworks on Potter St.?
                \_ What about it?
        \_ answer: whatever is the cheapest, and closest to you.
           having "all the latest" is useless, if its so inconvenient that
           you never go.
           \_ Note that few gyms actually have pools, if swimming is what
              you want.  The Y in berkeley is actually decent.
           \_ What _is_ the cheapest gym in Berkeley?
        \_ If youre a student or alum, the RSF is both cheap and has
           everything youre looking for
                \_ I want hot easy babes!
                   \_ and 1-800-HOT-EASY
                        \_ Thanks for the URL!
           \_ Do they still have lines for everything in there?
                \_ Not for the hot easy babes
           \_ this seems like the best bet -- they've got everything i need
              there (weights, machines) racquetball courts.  is there
              still a wait for everything?  do they have special accomodatio
              for paying meembers?
                \_ Paying meembers?  You want a special meembership?  You
                   think you're too 318 to stand in line like the poor student
                   meembers do?
2000/5/17-18 [Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Troll, Reference/BayArea] UID:18285 Activity:very high
5/16    Any home owners here in soda?  What area is still 'reasonable' to buy
        property these days in the East Bay?
        \_ Oakland (Temescal/Piedmont Ave/Grand Lake), Berkeley flatlands. -tom
        \_ I got a house last year in El Cerrito. -- jsjacob
        \_ What is your price range?  And are you able to tolerate long
           commutes?  Would you settle for a townhouse or it has to be a
           single family house?  Is this a house for investment?  How long do
           you plan to live there?  Is school district important for you?
           There are a lot of questions that you have to answer before you
           can decide on an area.
           \_ a townhouse is settling?
                \_ Yes.
           \_ Exactly.  Any answer would be worthless without knowing these
              things.  Here's yet another example of an anonymous person
              having something more important to say than the two signed
              people who just babbled.  I deleted those comments to save them
              from the embarrassment of a comparison to the anonymous reply.
                 Also, I don't embrass easily. -- jsjacob
                 Also, I don't embarass easily. -- jsjacob
              \_ I answered the first question, not the second.
                 Also, I don't embarrass easily. -- jsjacob
                 \_ 'Reasonable' is a matter of opinion and circumstance and
                    can't be answered properly without more information.
                \_ get a fucking clue.  -tom
                   \_ Learn how to format your fucking motd posts so I don't
                      have to guess who the fuck you're addressing.
                \_ the moron who deleted actual answers to the question
                   in favor of his anonymous idiocy.  -tom
        \_ You have to ask? A General answer to your General question:
           Q:East Bay A:Oakland
           Cheaper, close for most commute, near BART/bus/freeway
        \_ Anonymous cowards aside, you can get good deals on nice houses
           in good neighberhoods in Oakland, particularly Temescal, Piedmont
           Avenue, and Grand Lake.  Other nice areas in Oakland (Rockridge,
           Montclair) are very expensive.  Berkeley flatlands can be OK
           though they vary from street to street.  -tom
                \_ to the anonymous coward who keeps deleting this: get
                   a fucking life.  -tom
        \_ forget about san francisco.  even the crappiest neighborhoods
           are no longer reasonable. -- joeking
2000/5/13-14 [Reference/BayArea] UID:18254 Activity:moderate
5/13    How big do you think is the union between wall users and motd posters.
        \_ Who cares?  What a stupid question.
           \_ How big do you think is the union between people who care
              and stupid questions?
2000/4/20 [Reference/BayArea] UID:18065 Activity:moderate
4/19    What's the going rate for Berkeley 1 br apts these days?
        Just want to compare with south bay rents.
        \_ $1000000000000000000000000000 (without parking)
        \_ close to SF rents.  it is insane
                \_ Drugs are cheaper and easier in Berkeley.  Sex is better
                   in SF.
                   \_ if going over the bridge to say hi to sky is too hard for
                      you then you not cut out to be a druggie
                        \_ I don't need sky's third rate shit.
                   \_ Depends on which drugs and what type of sex
                \_ Girls are cheaper and easier in Santa Cruz. Sex is better
                   in SF.
                   \_ I don't pay for girls in any city.
                      \_ If you're so proud of this, sign your name.
        \_ Serious answer: $1100-$1400 is probably just about the
           interquartile. Still somewhat higher than most parts of south
           bay. -alexf
2000/3/24-25 [Politics/Domestic/California, Reference/BayArea] UID:17843 Activity:high
3/23    CSUA donutsP trip to the new Krispy Kreme in Union City.
        When should we go?
        \_ Why should we go?
        \_ Krispy Kreme == decent donuts with alot of hype...
           not any better than Kingpin in my opinion.
           \_ Cold, they're not, but still warm, they crush Kingpin (even
              warm Kingpin). -dans
        \_ i might be cajoled into driving -brg
        \_ suggestion: call ahead and find out their hours for the "hot light"
           krispy kreme is in general just okay.  _except_ when they are "hot"
           then their donuts are exceptional and like nothing else out there.
           they are "hot" only during certain hours (eg between 6 am - 11 am
           and again at 6 pm - 11 pm).  what "hot" means is that they give you
           donuts that have just come out of the fryer and have just been
           glazed.  they really are _warm_ and you can still taste the eggs
           that went into them.  there is no better snack than these "hot"
           krispy kreme donuts.  they are soooo fresh! -hahnak
           \_ Is this some kind of joke or porn reference?
                \_ I was wondering the same thing....
                \_ in all likelihood it's just the initial KK elation syndrome
                   you'll be the same way once you've had your first KK donut
        \_ A few friends of mine went down there the other day and waited
           in line for 2+ hours until one guy just went up and bribed the
           first person with a dozen donuts to buy him a dozen... it seems
           like this is the way it always is there. My point: I dont think
           this warm/not-warm thing is really an issue since it seems like
           they are always making donuts to try and satisfy the huge hordes
           who could just be going to Kingpin.
                \- my guess would be the KK operation has fewer cockroaches
                than KP. seriously. the donuts are much better but that is
                admittedly a matter of taste ... unlike cockroaches, i assume
                        \_ hey nice job associating their donuts with the
                           filthiest creatures alive.  Asshole. - #psb#1h8r
                           \_ You are beneath the lowest of the lowliest of
                              the lowest of cockroaches!  How dare you even
                              think about the possibility of offending the
                              psb?!  When caught, you'll die by your own
                              words, you fiend!  A thousand KP cockroaches
                              force fed down your throat!  --psb #1 Fan
                              \_ !psb for president!  Why vote for a lesser
                                 \_ Bah! You're reusing the Cthulhu line. Try
                                    "Vote !psb. Isn't 12 years of psb enough?"
                                        \_ It's been more than 12 years and
                                           I've been loving every minute of
                                           it!!!  --psb #1 Fan
        \_'s a DONUT.  Why all the excitement?  There are
           plenty of good places for donuts if you know where to look
           without having to go to a specialty chain like KK!  Even
           that hole in the wall place on Euclid has yummy stuff to
           eat...(is it still there?)
                \_ But... but... oh nevermind.
2000/2/26 [Reference/BayArea] UID:17635 Activity:nil
2/25    Harmony Sweepstakes, Bay Area Regional.  Saturday night.  Palace of
        Fine Arts in San Francisco.  I'll be one of the people wearing
        nothing.  8pm.  Come say hi if you come to the concert.         -chaos

You people are on such serious crack. GET A FUCKING CLUE.
\_ can you give me a nickel to go buy some?

        hey asshole, wanna play?
2000/2/23 [Reference/BayArea] UID:17598 Activity:moderate
2/23    I'd *really* like to get into zoophilia sometime soon.  Anyone have
        any websites, tips for beginners, good local zoophiliac hangouts to
        visit (I'm in the SF Bay Area)?  Thanks a lot!
        \_ Try <DEAD><DEAD>  They usually have some good locator
           links.  Enjoy!
2000/2/19 [Reference/BayArea] UID:17571 Activity:nil 79%like:17560
2/18    Looking for a good contractor to do some modeling in the south
        bay area.  I'm thinking of starting a pornography publishing
        company but I've heard of some horror stories with contractors.
        Love to get some names from people who had good experiences.
        \_ I know a good plumber and an electrician but don't know any
           carpenters for your table and remodeling.
2000/2/18-21 [Reference/BayArea] UID:17560 Activity:nil 59%like:17568 79%like:17571
2/18    Looking for a good contractor to do some data modeling in the south
        bay area.  I'm thinking of removing a table and redoing the PL*SQL.
        I've heard of some horror stories with contractors.  Love
        to get some names from people who had good experiences.  Thanks.
        \_ I know a good plumber and an electrician but don't know any
           carpenters for your table and remodeling.
2000/2/16-17 [Politics/Domestic/California, Reference/BayArea] UID:17524 Activity:high
2/16    more disturbing than the other la story:
        \_ Yeah.  And the California politicians are trying to get
           handguns out of the hands of private citizens so THESE
           bozos can protect us (!?).  "Uh, I dunno, I just shot him."
           Apparently one needs a gun not only to protect oneself
           from the criminals, but from the police as well. -- ilyas
           \_ Thank you for another impecably reasoned post, ilyas! You
           \_ Thank you for another impeccably reasoned post, ilyas! You
              are an inspiration, an example for the rest of of us
              \_ It's 'impeccably,' my illiterate, cowardly friend.
                 At any rate, feel free to trust the police and the
                 government if you wish.  I am sure they have your best
                 interests at heart. -- ilyas
              motd slobs to aspire to! Thank you! -- ilyas' #2 fan
        \_ This is all libertarian propoganda from the anti-police LA media.
           You don't seriously believe the LA Times can get a story like this
           right, do you?  --long time LA resident and LA Times reader
                       \_ ignore paolo.  he knows nothing about anything, yet
                          jumps at any chance to display his ignorance.
                 \_ It says that you *DELIBERATELY CHOOSE* not to live in a
                    crime-free, corruption-free, pollution-free, traffic-jam-
                    free ecotopia like the beautiful San Francisco Bay Area!
                    So you must be brain-dead and you deserve every bad thing
                    you get, you yuppie-scum, urban-sprawling, single-
                    occupant-vehicle-driving Southern Californian, you!
                    \_ traffic-jam-free?  Has the Bay Area changed that much
                       since I was at Cal? -emin
                        \_ That was sarcasm and deserved paolo bashing.
              \_ wow paolo, you almost managed to eke out a tiny and entirely
                 personal attack which completely ignored my point about the
                 trash that is the LA Times.  Come back when you have mastered
                 something beyond the "sticks and stones".
           \_ I wouldn't trust the police if I were you.  The police is not
              your friend. -- !sky
                \_ Sky?  Is that you?  I thought you were in Europe with the
                   guys you met in prison?
           \_ the fact that you choose to live in LA speaks alot about
              yourself. -paolo
              \_ It does? What does it say? --dim (also LA resident)
                 \_ It says paolo is the kind of person who says "alot".
                 \_ But whatever its faults, the LA Times still beats out the
                    SF Comical.  The only time I was ever thankful for the
                    Chron/Ex combination was during the two summers I lived in
                    New Mexico and my only choice of paper was the *Albuquerque
                    Journal* (which consisted entirely of AP/Reuters pieces and
                    "local color" articles -- "This Sunday: 10,000 More Things
                    You Can Do With Chili Peppers!")
                           and other lesser places.  Other local pieces focus
                        \_ I cancelled my Comical subscription years ago.  They
                           dump a free one on my door every time the delivery
                           guy changes and the paper never gets any paper.  It
                           isn't much different from the Albuquerque Journal.
                           The Comical is AP/Reuters pieces shredded to fit
                           and local color articles about how SF is the
                           greatest city in the world (according to local
                           pollsters :-) ) and much better than NYC, SJ, LA,
                           and other lesser places.
                           \_ but they're right on that one.
                           Other local pieces focus
                           on the politcally correct and evils of the center
                           and right wing.  I'd rather read about chili peppers.
                           At least that would be informative.  Does the AJ
                           deliver out here?  :-)
2000/2/9-10 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley] UID:17467 Activity:very high
2/9     Is there any moving company besides U-Haul that I can rent enclosed
        trailer for in-town moving?  U-Haul says their enclosed trailers are
        for one-way moving only, and only open trailers are available for
        in-town moving.  Thanks.
        \_ try the yellow pages under "moving" or "rental"
        \_ there's probably someone better than u-haul to go to, but
           the person you talked to at u-haul was lying or an idiot;  they
           do have in-town rentals of enclosed trucks available in berkeley.
           \_ I did call the Berkeley center at 2100 San Pablo Ave.  Strange.
              By the way, if I rent the trailer from Berkeley, tow it for 100
              miles round-trip, and then return it to Berkeley, does it count
              as in-town at $14.95/day?
                \_ Of course it does.  Because you're smart and not telling
                   them it's for out of town.  Return it to the same place.
                   \_ What an idiot!  Today I called the Berkeley center again,
                      trailer for in-town moving.  Thanks for pointint it out.
                      and this time the guy said I could get an enclosed
                      trailer for in-town moving.  Thanks for pointing it out.
        \_ Doherty's in El Cerrito on San Pablo Ave.  By the DMV.
        \_ WTF are you talking about?  I just rented an enclosed U-haul
           trailer for my move from berkeley to richmond.  No problem at
           all, aside from the usual trailer wirin issues.  -ERic
           \_ The guy who answered my call yesterday lied.
2000/1/28-29 [Reference/BayArea] UID:17361 Activity:kinda low
1/27    Moving to oakland, am loud and noisy, want to get a "musicians' pad"
        like a converted warehouse "loft".  Any suggestions/ leads? - erikba
        \_ It's Oakland.  Move into the cheapest shithole you can find and
           make all the noise you want.  Your crack head neighbors will be too
           fucked up to notice.
           \_ in a way I wish this were true.  Oakland isn't the cheapass
              shithole it used to be. Hail Jerry.
           \_ Crackheads don't call the cops because they want you to not
              call the cops, not because the don't hate your noise.
                \_ Who said cops?  I was thinking about them kicking in your
                   door and shooting you after gang raping you a few times.
1999/12/27 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley] UID:17107 Activity:nil
        what the heck is up with the "berkeley web servers will be offline"
1999/12/20-23 [Reference/BayArea] UID:17073 Activity:low
12/20   Can somebody tell me if there's an ice rink in Union Square in the
        city?  There was one a couple of years back, I don't know if it's
        there every year.  Thanks.  -southbay h0zer
        \_ i don't remember the union square one, but there is one
           at Embarcadero as always this time of year, and year
           round at Yerba Buena Gardens[:wq
                                        \_ vi fu lacking
           round at Yerba Buena Gardens
1999/11/29-30 [Reference/BayArea] UID:16966 Activity:moderate
11/30   If anyone who works  or will be in the santa clara area can pick up
        a briefcase being held at the Santa Clara police station for me,
        and can get it to SF/berkeley, I will compensate you for your
        trouble.  It's legit.  --
        \_ use linux. ride bike. problem solved.
           \_ U53 W1ND0Z3 MAN. W1N98 15 50 KRAD. 1T CAN RUN 3V3RYTH1N6
              THAT L1NUX CANT MAN. SO USE W1ND0Z3 CUZ 1T5 C00L
        \_ Smells fishy.
        \_ damn furners
        \_ The one with the bloody hand and the crack?  Or the other one?
           \_ Or the one that has the tag "T. Kaczynski"?
1999/8/18-20 [Reference/BayArea] UID:16335 Activity:low
8/18    I have a friend coming to SF for 3 weeks at the end of september.
        Can someone give me tips of where he and his gf could shack up
        for reasonably cheap somewhere not too far from SF by BART?  -John
        \_ There's a hostel on Market near BART
        \_ Globetrotter hostel near Glide Memorial in the city is cheap. The
           neighborhood is about as sketch as SF gets outside of Bayview/
           Hunter's Point, though. There is also the Green Tortoise hostel in
           North Beach. It's a much nicer location, but a bit of a haul to BART.
           I don't know what is in Berkeley. - ulysses
           \_ Ram Hotel. Rooms by the day, week or month.
                \_ How much for just an hour or so?
1999/7/12-13 [Reference/RealEstate, Reference/BayArea] UID:16114 Activity:high
7/12    Save 1015! Preserve the SF House Meat Market from gentrification! -sameer
        \_ Meat market? hardly, unless you crave chaste asian booty. if
           you really want to get laid, go to 1984 and stand in one
           place for awhile.
        \_ for the record, the housing next to 1015 is a public
           housing project --caliban
           \_ shhhsh.  stop actually being informed about anything you
              rave about.
        \_ why the hell should i sign a petition that gives me absolutely
           zero info on the issue?  (and on a website that consists of
           nothing but shockwave for that matter)
        \_ Wow... I read the site and the shockwave crap and this place sounds
           like a nightmare!  Is there a petition I can sign in support of
           closing it down forever and preventing another such menace from
           popping up elsewhere in the city?
                \-1015 has got to be one of the most obnoxious places in sf.
                i cant believe i have given my money repeatedly in the past
                to people that treat you that rudely. --psb
                \_ i was there once and remarked only that it was really
                   dirty and they charged twice as much for halfsize drinks.
                   and their website is an atrocity.   -lila
           \_ 1015 does completely suck ass in all the ways mentioned
              here.  however:  there are a couple of worthwhile events
              that happen there, people renting the place out for a night.
              usually weeknights, i would stay the HELL away on a weekend.
              more importantly though, and why people like sameer and i,
              are heavily involved in throwing underground parties that
              have as their goal to provide quality, inexpensive experiences,
              contrary to the typical 1015/club scene, is 1015's role in
              city politics.  the city will be able to shut more clubs
              down, based on noise/bullshit, if 1015 loses this battle.
              it'll be like a preceedent, and those of us involved with
              the club scene don't want that to happen.  it's already
              impossible for certain types of people to throw certain types
              of events with certain types of music - the city has thrown
              up a vast array of obstacles, and even if you surmount those,
              you wind up needing to charge $25/person (unacceptable in our
              circles for a one-night event) and sfpd can march right in
              and shut it down for *no reason*.  so it's not about 1015
              as a great, swell club, it's about the future of soma, and
              the ability for new tenants to push old tenants out, crushing
              established businesses.  there's a good article in the
              /sf weekly/ regarding this phenomenon:
                                                                -- caliban
                \-what happened to the old "coming to a nuisance" defense?
                an appropriate name in teh case of 1015. --psb
1999/6/29-7/1 [Reference/BayArea, Recreation/Media] UID:16033 Activity:nil
6/28    "After Life" is finally coming to the Bay Area.  The movie opens
        July 23th.  See for details.
1999/5/6-7 [Reference/BayArea] UID:15764 Activity:very high
5/6     Want to earn a referral bonus?  Need to find a System
        Administrator or Network Engineer for your company?
        I have a friend who's looking for a job in System
        Administration or Network Engineering, primarily in the Bay
        Area but would also consider other parts of the United States.
        More info in ~nickkral/pub/raj.resume -- nickkral
        \_ So does he want the job in India or did he have a specific
           place in mind to relocate to?
           \_ he's primarily interested in jobs in the Bay Area, but
              would also be willing to consider jobs anywhere in the
              United States. -- nickkral
        \_ What's wrong with this raj guy and why does he need you to
           pimp for him?
           \_ He's in India and can't pimp for himself. -- nickkral
           \_ You'd pimp for your lover, too.
1999/3/10-11 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley] UID:15577 Activity:high
3/9     Red Darwf Season 8 aired this past Sunday. Is KTEH airing the
        season again? Thanks --marc

3/\d+   BIKE PARADE FRIDAY!!!  As reported at Berkeley City Council
        last night, the Berkeley Bike Parade will be celebrating its
        SIXTH BIRTHDAY.  Party to follow the ride.  Meet 5:30 PM
        downtown Berkeley BART to leave at 6 PM.  (every 2nd Friday)
        \_ Get a life, jnat.
           \_ Hmm... what do you mean?  I keep very busy and despite
              negative people (case in point) and corrupt corporations
              and the like I have a great time and am doing a lot of
              good work.  How about check my personal web pages
     and tell me what's missing.
                \_ Perspective on your useless existence.
                   \_ I don't get it, I mean, I have some philosophy
                      and everythiiing...what's the URL?
1999/2/25-3/30 [Recreation/Food, Reference/BayArea] UID:15480 Activity:moderate
2/25    Whats the best restaurant for Ribs, preferably in SF?
        \_ Tony Roma's is always good but not specific to just SF.
        \_ I Want My Baby Back ribs - tpc
        \_ I've heard of the Buckeye Roadhouse near Stinson. Anyone been
        \_ The Salt Lick, Austin TX (baby backs that melt in your mouth)
           Dixie's BBQ, Bellevue WA (meet The Man)  --tsang
                \_ I met "The Man" at Dixie's --vchang
                \_ I met "The Man" at Dixie's. He melted my mouth --vchang
                \_ The Man was the hotest thing I've ever tasted.  The smallest
                   dab turned an entire sandwitch into hot death. - seidl
                   \_ Are you talking about the spiciness or the temperature?
1999/2/8-10 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley] UID:15372 Activity:high
02/08   Berkeley Critical Mass this Friday Feb. 12 -- rain or shine --
        Gather 5:30 to ride at 6 PM from the downtown Berkeley BART
        \_ Will Critical Mass ever lobby the City of Berkeley or the
           County of Alameda or the appropriate governmental body
           for better paving of roads? --Jon
           \_ No, they won't, because cars would also benefit from such
              an improvement.  --sky
              \_ Oh, that's right, Critical Mass is composed of a bunch
                 of idiots, like Jason Meggs. --Jon
          \_ Well, see, Critical Mass is a bicycle the extent that
            it makes bicycles visible, it lobbies for just about anything
            bicycle-related...but other groups such as BFBC and BCLU lobby
            for better paving  on major bicycle routes (which is only fair as
            bicyclists subsidize repaving and suffer more for poor paving--
            the primary reason roads go to hell is heavy vehicles, and the
            pavement comes from general funds).  --idiot Meggs
            \_ California is building roads faster than they can be fixed.
        \_Sixth Birthday party in March!  (March 12th, 1999)
1999/1/26-27 [Reference/BayArea] UID:15293 Activity:moderate
1/25    Hi, is there one site where I can find out all the volunteer
        opportunities around the bay area?  Everything from inner city to
        environmental, etc.  I'm trying to see what I can do in the south
        bay, but I don't have a specific activity in mind.  If there is
        no one site, how about some of the big ones?  Thank you!  I'm
        eager to help out in the community, but just need to be pointed
        in the right direction.
        \_ in college I worked in AmeriCorps in Eshleman Hall at the offices
           of Cal Corps the public service center and volunteer coordinators
           for the campus.  Give them a call at 643-0306, ask for Lisa. - tpc
           \_ thanks, but I was looking for a website or something in the
              south bay.  I graduated and live in San Jose now.
        \_ Volunteer Exchange, main office (408) 247-1126
           south county (408) 683-9061.  Don't know URL
        \_ You can clean my kitchen floor, take out the trash, and then scrub
           the bath tub at my place.  <DEAD><DEAD>
1998/12/31-1999/1/1 [Reference/BayArea] UID:15158 Activity:kinda low
12/31   Anybody in SF know if the ice rink in Union Squre is still there?
        If so, when is the last day that it'll be there?  Thanks!
        \_ It's at Justin Hermann Plaza, not Union Square. That's over by
           the Embarcadaro area (at the east end of Market Street) It's
           open until February 15th. See
           You're welcome.
           \_ it was at union square a couple of years back.  I haven't
              been to SF in a while.  :)  Thanks.
1998/10/28 [Reference/BayArea] UID:14843 Activity:low
10/27   Does anyone know a place in the south bay that would welcome a
        donation of an old 286 and two 386's?  Thanks in advance.
        \_ If you can manage to get up to Berkeley with them, perhaps
           Berkeley Neighborhood Computers would like them; see their page at
           ""  They also have some lists of, and
           information about, similar organizations.  Generally, they look like
           a worthwhile organization.  -- schoen
1998/10/15-16 [Reference/BayArea] UID:14782 Activity:moderate
10/15   Anyone know of a decent art supply store in the South Bay?
        McWorther's doesn't have what I need.
        \_ University Art Center, in Palo Alto and San Jose.  -- kahogan
           \_ thx!
           \_ Do they sell condoms?
1998/10/1-5 [Reference/BayArea] UID:14712 Activity:nil
9/30    Why isn't UPN showing the new season of DS9???
        \_ The UPN stations in LA, SF, & San Diego all got their contracts
           screwed up - see rec.arts.startrek.current or
                \_ The Friday morning SF Chronicle has an article about it
        \_ Technically UPN never showed DS9 - it's syndicated to stations
           around the country - UPN affiliates in SF & LA; WB, ABC, Fox, etc.
           in other cities
1998/8/18 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley, Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Motd] UID:14481 Activity:nil
8/17    Sorry for my ignorance.  But what happened to the parking
        meters in Berkeley?
                \_ Starr was investigating my improper relationship with MOTD,
                   too.  That asshole!!!
        \_ Berkeley(tm) realized that they couldn't keep up with
           the vandals so they're gonna replace them with super-duper
           robo-mega-indestructo-meters that can still be ruined with
           bubble gum or a caulk-gun.
        \_ A junior high kid did a school report where she timed the
           meters for accuracy and found that the digital meters are far
           more accurate (only 1 in 10 of the old ones were deemed
           accurate). It made the news and got a lot of publicity, so
           Berkeley is going to replace all their meters with digital
        \_ The real answer is they got stolen because the old meters were
           fucked and ripping people off and some good citizen didn't want
           to get fucked anymore so took justice into their own hands.  My
           only regret in my entire life is I wasn't a part of the meter
           theft.  -been roobed by Berkeley meters too many times
           \_ Well, the girl's report actually showed that the meters
              were roobing the city, not the other way around.  You just suck.
1998/6/23-25 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley, Computer/Networking] UID:14239 Activity:nil
6/22    When is Berkeley ditching Sprintnet?
        \_ Since someone touched the subject, what is a *good* backbone
        provider? I see a lot of Sprint/Global-One advertising, but can't
        really tell who's good, who's not.   -leblon
        \_ RSN - see
        \_ Depends on what you mean by 'good' and how much you're willing to
           pay for it.  MCI used to be good, but with Cable&Brainless buying
           their internet operations, I'd expect them to tank in a year or so.
        \_perhaps page of recommended providers should be maintained, similar
          to the cs books page -nesim
           \_ yes, and you know that there are just a ton of cs students
              who are looking around for T3 connection providers.
1998/4/15-16 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley, Academia/GradSchool] UID:13964 Activity:kinda low 52%like:13959
4/15    Where can I find stat/info on the GPA average of the entire Berkeley
        campus (ugrad/grad) and comparisons of GPA w/other schools that
        either have same or different grading scales? Thanks.
        \_ i don't know about the gpa average, but i've heard that the
           curve for some of the more impacted classes are as vicious
           here as anywhere else
                \-"as vicious"? berkeley, after UChi, MIT, and CalTech probably
                has about the hardest grading around. --psb
                  \_ CalTech?  Gimme a break.  I know some people who have
                     various cs/engineering type degrees from there who don't
                     stand a chance here.  They'd be lucky to figure out how
                     their phone worked to call TeleBears.
                \_ Sure, everyone has rumors from these schools, but what are
                   some actual numbers to prove it, psb boy???
                        \-grad schools have implicit modifiers for GPAs from
                        various schools. they know a 3.6 at berkeley > 3.6 at
                        the 'fraud. unfortuantely some people with less exp.
                        in looking at lots of grades and correlating to perf
                        dont realize this and just go with the higher gpa.
                        i have visited all of the schools in question, i know
                        what textbooks they use in depts i am familiar with,
                        i know a lot of people from all except UChi so i think
                        i know what i am talking about here.
                        people also look at the department. i think mass comm
                        and "human biodynamics" have the highest GPAs here.
                        i guess that is where all the smart people are, as
                        opposed to say physics. --psb
                        \_ "Human Biodynamics" is no longer a department or
                            major; it has been split into Phys Ed and the
                            actual human biodynamics stuff is now part of
                            Integrative Biology.  -tom
           \_ Side question: after Stanfurd brought back the D and F grades
              a couple years ago, has overall GPA dropped from 3.5?
                \_ You can still drop after the final so I doubt the avg
                   GPA dropped noticeably.  "I was too stoned to drop after
                   the final!  Can I drop now?"  - Farm stoner 6 months later
        \_ From all the discussions, I can just tell you that in real life
           there is no single equation that schools use. It is mostly based on
           "feeling", "intuition", and "historical reputation". As with all
           things in life, yes, this is totally unfair.
                \-that isnt the case. some institutions have the knowledge
                and incentive to correlate f(GPA,school)->clverness-in-reality,
                others are either lacking in the info, and yet others lack
                the incentive. --psb
1998/4/13 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley] UID:13943 Activity:nil
4/12    They're arresting Berkeley Grads!
        \_ Awww, didnt know DanH graduated.
        \_ I read this, didn't see anything about Berkeley grads.
1998/4/6 [Reference/BayArea, Health, Computer/Theory] UID:13907 Activity:nil
4/6     Re: PBS starts new series -> Teletubbies
1998/3/18-19 [Reference/BayArea] UID:13826 Activity:high
3/17    Is the SF rendition of the "Phantom of the Opera" worth
        seeing?  - curious
        \_ For god's sake, it's Andrew Lloyd Webber.  Spend your money
           on some real theatre.
        \_ As long as it's not the understudies. They weren't very good.
        \_ SF's Phantom is not even worth $5 to see. Forget it   -disappointed
        \_ Agreed.  Yet I was the only one who remained seated at the end.
           It was the most wholly undeserved standing O I've ever seen.
           \_ So I'm assuming you're comparing it to some other production,
              say the Broadway version.
           \_ Or the LA version with Michael Crawford
        \_ When they took out the pliers and the blow torch, I said,
           sheeet! They are going medeival on the Phantom and
           and it's gonna get nasty. I left just when the screaming
           started. Worst $1.75 I ever spent.
        \_ Don't bother seeing *anything* in SF.  I have yet to see anything
           that I didn't leave feeling ripped off at any price.  It's a loss
           of time even when the tickets are free.
           \_ Come see my shows.  at least they're cheaper.
              and often we're better.  -- scotsman
           \_ This applies to many a city. What do you expect in SF? Its
              No. 1 industry is tourism.
1997/4/25 [Reference/BayArea] UID:32132 Activity:nil
4/25    I'm trying to get a cell phone in south bay area.  Any suggestion
        about which phone/what service should I get?
        \_ Wait 3 months, if you can.   Market should change a lot this
        summer.  Else, get short term committment.  C1 PCS might be best
        right now, assuming they are actually doing it.  -jor
1997/2/26 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Troll] UID:32085 Activity:nil
2/25    Anyone have a .ps (or any other format) for the City of Berkeley
        parking permits?  I was hoping someone else had already done the
        2 week temp. permit.  thanks (yes I know its illegal)
         \_ Real men don't pay for parking you dick.  Paying for
            parking is like paying for sex.  It just doesn't feel
        \_ Not to mention rather hard for the new ones with the City logo
         embossed in a circle of gold foil.
         \_ Actually the the gold circle just looked like a glued
            on kinda golden thingy.  No big deal to make my own.
        \_ Because of a special agreement, you can place Berkeley Farms
           milk cartons on your dashboard instead of the permits.
        \_ Is all the time you're going to waste really worth the $2 you save?
         \_ I don't live in Berkeley.  I thought that even a 14 day
            permit required CDL and car registration in Berkeley?
                        \_ only some proof you live in berkeley - CDL, phone
                           bill, cable tv bill, whatever - and unless you're
                           a complete dweeb you should be able to find someone
                           who lives in the area of Berkeley you want.  Of
                           course they have no reason to help a shmuck like
                           you steal parking from their neighbors just because
                           you're a lazy selfish cheap asshole
           \_ Yeah, I suppose all the taxes, shitty roads,
              tickets, and other BS isn't punishment enough for
              working in Berkeley.  I should pay $10/day at
              some overpriced garage or get fucked in a variety
              of other ways.  A real city wouldn't have the
              idiotic parking scam Berkeley has.  Thanks for
              info.  I know plenty of people who would help
              out.  Oh yeah, where does "lazy" "selfish"
              "cheap" or "asshole" come in this?  Only a loser
              or a schmuck (learn to spell Yiddish words before
              trying to use them) would submit to the Berkeley
              parking insanity.
              \_ Cars suck, and people who steal money from
          cities and then complain about the roads suck
           \_ "lazy" == take BART/buses or RIDE BIKE!
           \_ so get a f*cking job with an employer
              who'll get you parking (companies *CAN*
              get parking stickers for employees).
              Besides - YOU DON'T PAY ANY TAXES that
              go to the City of Berkeley moron.  (And
              parking is hell everywhere, not just here)
              \_ Pardon me, but where the f*ck do you
          think sales tax goes?  You might be
          surprised to learn that the city
          gets quite a bit of it.
          \_ Yeah the ten years I lived here did a lot to
          improve the roads, not.  Ride a bike?  Yeah right,
          over the bridge, under the freeway, blah blah blah.
          And no parking is not Hell everywhere.  Only in
          Berkeley and SF for the most part.  And yes I have
          and still do pay various taxes to the city of
          Berkeley.  But maybe you're right.  I should join
          the hordes of idiots in Crit. Mass and ride my
          bike 2 hours each way everyday.... or golly I
          could get a job next to where I live for half the
          pay, but it would be good for the environment. Yeah
          right.  When Hell freezes over, plus a day.  As I
          said before thanks for the 14 permit tip.  All
          pro-CM flames to /dev/null.  I couldn't care less.
          \_ Over the bridge?  You're coming from San Francisco
             to Berkeley and you're *driving*?  they should
             charge you extra
           \_ Actually no.  I just had a particular song in
              mind when I wrote that.  I'm on this side of the
              bridge.  "Over the hill and through the woods".
1996/12/18 [Reference/BayArea] UID:32015 Activity:nil
12/17   Does anyone know any good Beatles imitation band holding
        concerts in the bay area in the near future?  - choice
        \_ and there's yer self-cancelling phrase for the day
           \_ which part of the phrase is self-cancelling? - choice
         \_ i believe the implication was that "good" and
            "Beatles imitation" do not belong in the same sentence
         \_ Actually, the contradiction is "Bay Area" and
            "Near future". CALIFORNIA IS GOING TO TURN OVER
            STRIFE! DOOM! DOOM! DEATH! TRAGEDY! DOOM! - thepro
1995/1/5 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley] UID:31698 Activity:nil
1/3     berkeley magic players:
        body of message "subscribe berkeley-magic"
1994/4/11 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley, Transportation/Bicycle] UID:31560 Activity:nil
4/8     For a draft of the new City of Berkeley bike plan, get one mailed
        to you from: (City planning dept.) The
        next bicycle planning meeting is: Wed. Apr. 20, 7:00pm @ North
        Berkeley Senior Center, Hearst @ MLK Jr. Way.           -- Marco
1993/12/10 [Reference/BayArea, Computer/Theory, Computer/SW/Unix] UID:31442 Activity:nil
12/7    There is some sort of showing of a work in progress of a movie
        of the book 'Neuromancer' at Mills at 9pm on Friday.
        Anyone interested in going with me? -danh
        \_ Currently, we're thinking of pub trans... anyone drive? -marco
              \_ sparky's
        \_ anyone willing to risk the Payam-mobile can go with me
           \_ 1 space left
        \_ It is showing at 9pm at Mills College Concert Hall,
           5000 MacArthur Blvd., Oakland, CA.  Supposedly AC Transit
           bus lines 57 and 58 N stop directly in front.
           mail for even more detailed info.  -danh
        \_ Mebbe we should meet someplace in Berkeley so the AC Transit
           clueless (like myself) don't get hopelessly lost in Oakland.
        \_ I can pick up and take 1-2, or 3 really uncomfortably but,
           it's free and not that long a ride. -thorn
        \_  I'd be willing to drive a load out, too. --ERic
        \_  Anyone have enough room to give me and my email babe a ride? - danh
              \_ How fat is she?
              \-this a virtual babe?
        \_ I might be able to make it.  If so, I can drive people. -phr
        \_ if i can't find a spot in a car, i might offer a spot on the back
         of my Suzuki.  -hh
1993/9/1 [Reference/BayArea] UID:31390 Activity:nil 52%like:31337
8/31    The Second CSUA Bike Ride will be this SATURDAY, 9/4, leaving
        Evans at 10:00, destination is the scenic San Francisco
        waterfront/coastline.  There will once again be 3 planned
        routes for various skill levels.  Mail tom if you are interested
        and/or need more information.
        \_ Is there anyone besides tom for whom this is a good date? -ERic
        \_ I have to work Saturday evening, you know.  If you have a better
           idea, I'm all ears.  -tom
           \_ Haven't several of us suggested Monday?!
           \_ No good for me, and San Francisco will be a zoo. -tom
1993/8/10 [Reference/BayArea, Recreation/Food/Alcohol] UID:31382 Activity:nil
8/7     I'm looking for a good liquor store in Berkeley/Oakland/SF
        that carries reasonably expensive imported wines and other
        sorts of stuff.  You know, the kind with snooty cashiers.
        If you know of one, let me know or something.  --blojo
        \-seriously, liquor barn in albany is actually pretty good. --psb
        \-if its snooty wines you want, theres a wine store right near
          Chez Panisse up on Shattuck. --karlb
        \-there are quite a few good quality, reasonably priced wines
          at Whole Foods (at the corner of Ashby and Telegraph). --ausman
        \- Also a wine merchant or two on San Pablo, near Gilman I think -payam
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