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| 5/27 |
| 2006/9/16-19 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Computer/SW/Apps/Media, Computer/SW/Security] UID:44403 Activity:nil |
9/15 Software in China helps w/ sentencing:
http://news.com.com/2102-1012_3-6115154.html?tag=st.util.print
"The software can avoid abuse of discretionary power of judges as a
result of corruption or insufficient training."
\_ What about the verdict part?
\_ That's easy:
if(political_activist || causing trouble) guilty=true; |
| 2006/9/5-7 [Reference/Celebration, Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Uncategorized/Profanity] UID:44280 Activity:moderate |
9/5 Who is Tawei Liao?
\_ http://www.csua.berkeley.edu/~tawei
http://ucsee.eecs.berkeley.edu/~tawei
\_ Nice fake web sites.
\_ Uh, aren't these 2 different people named Tawei?
\_ These two pages above are owned by the same guy who is
trying hide his embarrasing past from his clients by
creating ficticious characters and displaying pictures
that don't resemble him. Google for his full name and
you'll see the truth.
\_ What's his full name? Googling for "Tawei Liao" is not
turning up anything interesting.
\_ That's because he's not particularly interesting.
\_ A fag.
\_ How do you know? Have you fucked him?
have you watched him fuck a man?
\_ Yeah. I watched you get buttfucked by him. Huh huh.
Huh huh. Huh huh. -beavis & butthead |
| 2006/8/30-9/3 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:44202 Activity:moderate |
8/30 I got invited to a Chinese wedding. I'm a white boy. What are
the protocols, especially with regard to gift giving? I know
about the red envelopes, but how much money and when? Anything
else I should know?
\_ What color is their wedding invitation?
If the wedding invitation is white or ivory, then, you can just
buy something in the wedding registry treat them as "American."
If the wedding invitation is bright red, then, you should seriously
consider give out cash.
The color wedding invitation is a good indicator how "traditional"
the couple wants their wedding to be. Being completely red is a
good indication that they are going for the "traditional" route.
Being completely white is a good indication that they are going
for American style, as Chinese usually reserve white for funerals.
If they have wedding registry somewhere, you could just buy
something from there without offending anyone regardless the color
of invitation. If you hunch is telling you should give cash, the
the general rule of thumb is between $100 - $200+. Avoid $250,
$140, $240. As for how you dispense the cash. The hard way is
go to a 99 Ranch Market and buy red envelops and put money in there.
The easy way is just buy a wedding card and stuck money in there.
The money is usually collect right before the banquet starts.
Contrary to what most of posting on motd, there is not much
serious taboos here. China is a vast land and regional culture
within China differs a great deal. Again, it depends upon the
the color of invitation. If you sense that this is going to be
a "traditional" wedding, Some of more serious things are:
1. don't give knives or weapons for gift. Instrutment of the death
is generally regards as unlucky by nature for the Chinese.
2. avoid clocks
3. if you give away cash, REMEMBER to BRING IT. one of the big
taboo not mentioned in motd is that Chinese don't take raincheck
for wedding gifts. it is consider unlucky.
4. it is ok to wear white or black, just not *ALL* white or
*ALL* black (white suit with colored tie is ok)
kngharv
\_ Thanks for the response. As below, the invitation is a red
traditional-looking one. So I should give $99 ideally?
\_ that is fine. good enough. really appreciate the fact that
you are being sensitive about other's culture.
As for suits, what if I wear a black suit with a colored tie?
\_ The fact that you're asking so many questions is an
indication that you're intimidated by the culture. I can
assure you that you're probably over doing it. Just give
cash in red envelopes (which you can buy from Ranch 99) and
give 99, 88, 188, 288, whatever. If you REALLY want to
impress the parents, write a few words in Chinese and learn
a few phrases. By doing so, they will be pleasantly
surprised and remember you as the smart white kid who
is knowledgeable and appreciative of the Chinese culture.
They'll also probably remember your face and name forever
since very few whites even attempt to understand them. Make
sure you learn the right tongue though-- don't speak
Mandarin if they're Cantonese, and vice versa.
BTW "9" rhymes with longevity which is a blessing. 8 is also
very good. Everything should be in pairs. You want to pair
99 or 88 or some sort. Keep in mind that Chinese banquets
usually cost between $500-$1000/table (depending on seafood
quality, how exotic the seafood is, how prestigious the
place is), and each table sits 10 people. Assume $500/table,
that's $50/person, so you should give at least that much if
you're attending yourself, and double the amount if you're
bringing a guest. As long as you can help them break even,
you're totally cool. And if you can learn a phrase or two
and show her parents that you're a cultured, smart,
sophisticated multilingual man and not some horny white
dude, they'll wish their daughter is marrying you instead.
Good luck and tell us how it goes ok? -Chinese
\_ I'm not intimidated. I just like to do as the Romans
do when I'm in Rome. I find it interesting. I don't
know much about Chinese culture.
\_ Is it better to say I dont know any Chinese than to
speak fake Chinese? A friend of mine used to speak
to his chinese girlfiend's parents in fake Chinese
to his Chinese girlfiend's parents in fake Chinese
over the phone.
\_ need more info from you. Are the hosts white washed asians or
traditional asians? What type of Chinese?
\_ http://csua.com/?entry=42989
\_ Search for Wedding Tips: http://tinyurl.com/kzsav
\_ need more info from you. Are the hosts white washed asians or
traditional asians? What type of Chinese (HK/Mainland/Taiwan/
Singapore/Malaysian)? If you assume all Chinese people are the
same YOU ARE IGNORANT.
\_ I have no idea. I know the groom, who is also caucasian. I
don't know him that well either. His bride-to-be's parents
mailed me a traditional-looking red invitation and the
reception will be at a traditional Chinese seafood restaurant.
\_ You have an easy case. Her parents are already disappointed
and thus their expectations will be very low. I mean their
rebellious daughter married a whity! They will expect
every single thousand-year-old traditions to be broken by
white people who are known to break them over and over
again. So you're cool. Go ahead and do whatever you want.
I recommend you buy them nice knife sets, preferably with
FOUR sharp knifes that are easily accessible in the
kitchen. The knives will be handy when they get into fights
7 years from now. -Chinese
\_ thousand year old traditions? you know Chinese is made
of hundreds, if not thoussands of tribes, right? you know
inter-racial marriage has been going on for 3000-4000
years, right? virtually all Chinese are mutts of some
sort.
\_ Then how come they all look the same to me?
\_ But traditions are passed down the male line. When a
woman marries a man of a different "race", she adopts
the tradition of the man's "race".
\_ So you're saying that her tradition will soon be
replaced with "Beer and football on Sundays"?
\_ Bravo! Bravo! That was magnificent.
\_ Fuck you, you racist piece of shit.
\_ Calm down, whitey. It's all true.
\_ No, fuck you. Seriously. There are plenty
of white supremacist christians, black
supremacist muslims, nordic supremacist
pegans, racist japanese nationalists, and
so on and so on out there in the world,
but *none* of them ever appear on the motd,
or anywhere else in civilized company in
this country. Yet somehow when the racist
is Chinese, it's ok? Not in this country.
\_ Take a deep breath and re-read that post
that set you off. I took it as being
ironic and tongue-in-cheek (but with a
hint of truth as to the actual view
probably held by the bride's Chinese
parents). The fact is that the parents
probably do have lower expectations for
white people when it comes to following
Chinese traditions, and they probably are
disappointed in her for out-marrying.
Simply observing that other people likely
have prejudiced views doesn't make your
observation racist. If you think it does,
you obviously have never experienced
racism.
\_ Didn't we already do this one? Chinese related subjects are
probably the most effective trollbait on the motd, but not when
they're recycled.
\_ I wasn't paying attention then. Should the gift of dollars
end in and 8 or a 9?
\_ 8's are lucky, 4's are unlucky. Don't give either knives or
clocks/watches.
\_ This is Chinese tradition, but do all Chinese people
really care. I mean if I was Chinese, I'd realize this
is silly and just give whatever amount I want. I mean is
it really that big of a deal, like if someone gets a watch
as a gift, they believe their marriage won't be happy?
\_ watches are okay, no clocks though
\_ Yes 8's are lucky in general. But for weddings you should
give an amount with a lot of 9's, e.g. $99.99 or $199.99.
That's because "9" sounds the same as "long-lasting" in both
Cantonese and Mandarin, and I guess they sound similar in
other dialects too. OTOH "clock" sounds the same as "end",
and "giving clock as a gift" sounds the same as "sending
someone off in a funeral". -- Cantonese
and "giving clock as a gift" sounds the same as "seeing off
the deceased in a funeral". -- Cantonese
\_ What if I want to use Hex? So, then I'll give
$99 Hex, which is $153 in base 10. But that has a
3 and a 1 in it and 3+1=4, so I'm screwed. But then
again, 1+5+3=9, so I'm good. Or, I could just use
binary and give $111111111, which is $511. On the
other hand, $9 in binary is $1001, which is 4
digits, so it's unlucky.
\_ Since binary and hex have not commonly been used
in Chinese business transactions in the past
couple of centuries, it does not matter, nor do
combinations of numbers, etc.
\_ Yawn.
\_ what about the case of a mixed white/chinese where they had
a registry and included things like knives and clocks on it?
\_ Then it depends on the the relative open-mindedness /
bitchiness of the in-laws on both sides. Some in-laws
are kind-of open-minded these days. For example, they
don't object the bride wearing a gown in white, which is
traditionally a color of bad luck and is only worn in
funerals.
\_ Get something from the registry. Then bring a red
envelope with some small amount of money.
\_ Unrelated, but tangential:
Why do Asian girls walk differently from every other
race? It's a sort of shuffle. Latinas, caucasians, etc.
\_ Footbinding?
do not walk like this and it is distinctive from a distance.
\_ I think you saw Japanese girls. Girls in Japan do walk
in certain way, and those who came to US recently walk
the same way. I don't see how Chinese girls walk
different than other races. -- Cantonese
\_ Japanese girls walk bow-legged because they are
into anal sex. Those women are not inhibited by
stupid Judeo-Christian views on morality.
\_ Ooh. When's the next flight available to
Japan???
\_ Dude, that's French girls. Not Japanese girls.
Japanese girls are into kinky bondage sex. It's
the French chicks that dig it up the old Hershey
highway. |
| 2006/8/28 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Domestic] UID:44172 Activity:nil 80%like:44165 |
8/27 hey meth fans read this:
http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/articles/060828fa_fact2
\_ Thanks! great article. -meth fan |
| 2006/8/27-29 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Computer/Theory] UID:44165 Activity:nil 80%like:44172 |
8/27 hey math fans read this:
http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/articles/060828fa_fact2
\_ Thanks! great article. -math fan |
| 2006/8/23-26 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign] UID:44117 Activity:kinda low |
8/23 http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/news/la-fi-radio20aug20,0,5923744.story?coll=la-home-entertainment "Country music promotes patriotism and family values, and they've replaced it with something [hip-hop and hop] that just promotes money and hate." "If radio executives can focus on urban and Latino listeners, why can't they focus on white America?" \_ Because that's not politically correct. \_ Bullshit. It's because young white America is listening to hip hop and sporting bling. \_ The invisible hand of the free market is at work. \_ Yeah, no shit. News flash: with a few fringe exceptions, white America's music sucks ass. People all over the world have gotten into hip hop, both in terms of spending large sums of money on American music and making their own. "White America" buys more hip hop than anyone, and yet getting anyone who isn't a white American in a very specific educational and economic set to buy a country music album will simply never happen. \_ Your love of country music seriously undermines your credibility as a 'music critic'. \_ Kenny Rogers was very famous in Hong Kong two decades ago. He even held some big sold-out concerts. So was John Denver. Glen Campbell was famous there three decades ago when I was a little kid. \_ Please don't call this P.Diddy, 50 cent crap that white Americans listen to "hip hop." It's [c]rap. \_ Isn't like 50% of country music "my woman done left me"? \_ It's more like "my mom/sis/gf done left me and I miss *her*". \_ "...And then I lost my Job." \_ And crashed my pickup truck into my dog and totalled both \_ In the rain \_ I was drunk the day my mom got out of prison And I went to pick her up in the rain But before I could get to the station in my pickup truck She got runned over by a damned old train. \_ It ain't country if there isn't a train somewhere |
| 2006/8/22-23 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:44097 Activity:moderate |
8/22 A while ago someone said that in Mexico, one will see signs on doors
that say, "No Indios." It was claimed that "they" will say this is
not racism. How does one even begin to claim that it isn't racism?
I'm curious to hear the argument.
\_ How about "no strawmen"? -tom
\_ Hey, welcome to the rest of the world where racism is every day in
every way status quo.
\_ When the west occupied China a century ago, they put up signs at
buildings and parks that read "No Chinese or dogs allowed."
\_ The debate on the authenticity of this is by no means over:
http://pekingduck.org/archives/002522.php
\_ Do employment ads in Japan still say "no gajin (sp?)"?
\_ Not as such, but it's implicit more often than not. Mind you,
you can specify male or female, young or old, and no fatties,
no uglies in help wanted ads in Japan. Hell, you can even
specify blondes or non-blondes even if the job has nothing to
do with looks. Note that "gaijin" refers to non-Asian
foreigners; there are other words for Asian foreigners.
\_ One can only hope so. |
| 2006/8/16-18 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:44037 Activity:nil |
8/16 I used to speak decent Mandarin, many many years ago, and I want to try
to pick it back up. Can any motd mandarin speakers recommend any
Mandarin language podcasts? I'd rather listen to something that's
actually cool where I have to work a bit to follow it than some
instructional "learn Chinese" type thing. News? Entertainment? u
Anything that might be interesting. Thanks.
\_ Date an authentic FOB Chinese girl like the rest of us Sodans
\_ picsP
\_ Pimsleur's is really really good.
\_ The mandarin dramas on Channel 26. |
| 2006/8/15-17 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/Taiwan, Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:44006 Activity:nil |
8/14 Is there any racial issue within the Hispanic group? E.g. do the
Hispanic blacks and Hispanic whites consider themselves different, just
like the English-speaking blacks and whites?
\_ Yes. Lighter people always look down upon the darker, lower class
people. -albino
\_ There are many places where "Indios" are not allowed. They will
tell you "It's not racism", but it is.
\_ http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&q=indio,+ca
\_ Ever notice that everyone on Mexican TV is white?
\_ I don't watch Mexican TV, sorry.
\_ I'm on the Mexican radio...
\_ Yes, there are. Not just skin color either.
\_ Read Octavio Paz's collection of essays, Labyrinth of Solitude.
Much good information here concerning Mexico's struggle with its
own history as a former colony and the legacy of race.
\_ I don't know of any large group of people that doesn't teach or
encourage ethnic superiority. Just look at China, Hong Kong,
Taiwan, Malasia, Singapore. For example certain types of Taiwanese
people are taught or hinted to be superior over other types of
Taiwanese. Certainly, the division is even sharper amongst the
different Chinese ethnicities in the pacific. Heck, even left
liberals think they're superior over the country music beer
drinking gun toting right wing neocon nuts, and vise versa.
I think it is just a nature of human beings to discriminate and
hate one another.
\_ That's why the Cylons hate us.
\_ I don't watch Mexican TV, sorry.
\_ I'm on the Mexican radio...
\_ We must resolve to better understand our Cyclons brothers so
we can have a mutually beneficial discussion of our
differences and through our diversity of opinion thereby
grow stronger for it. Call back the fighters and power down
the cannons so they understand we're not a threat so we can
have peaceful dialog. We must have done something to them
for them to hate us so. I feel so guilty about my ancestor's
cruelty to the oppressed Cylon peoples! We must make amends! |
| 2006/8/2-6 [Politics/Domestic/Crime, Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:43869 Activity:kinda low |
8/2 Lawrence Livermore Natl. Lab employee arrested on child porn
charges.
http://www.insidebayarea.com/search/ci_4120530
The thing I think is iteresting here is that the Lab has gone into
damage control mode. (Press releases that say things like, "We
are fully cooperating with the police," etc.) Do you really need
damage control in a case like this?
\_ I don't know what grant or funding politics are like for
that sort of organization, but I assume there is quite a bit
of nastiness that goes on when competing for govt. money. It
would be pretty easy to insinuate shit like "well, their people
are just surfing for kiddy porn on taxpayer dough" to the press.
I've seen worse. -John
\- Livermore is an employer with +10k employee ... dont you think
this is just a matter of statistics? It's not like they were
running a massive bittorrent p0rn server. Resources spent
playing Big Brother costs real money, and imposes real costs
[should the computer security people run "find *.jpg"
in people homedirs and have somebody spend 10hrs a week
looking these over?]
\_ You're preaching to the saved. Pr0n at the workplace, if
you consider it a problem, is not something you can solve
technically, and I argue this constantly (it's a management
issue.) Unfortunately, there's a combination of factors,
such as many managers not wanting to take ownership of
talking to employees whose work is being affected by non-
work stuff, over-zealous HR people, legal guys worried about
harassment suits and senir management who see this sort of
thing in a very binary manner, that often results in demands
for excessive "pre-emptive" measures. But in this case I
was just commenting on the logic behind the "damage control"
that op asked about--I don't know the politics that surround
LLNL, and was assuming that this was just pre-emptive to
avoid the case being misused by someone overly zealous or
with a political agenda. -John
\_ It's odder than that, all the porn was at home, none
was at work. So to my mind, LLNL has absolutely nothing
to do with this. Never the less, I think John has a
point about politics. (Digression from above: LLNL DOES
put a lot of man power into watching out for porn at
work.) -op
\- i didnt look at the details carefully, but if what you say
is true, this is a good example of "if the press wants to
do a hatchet job on you, no matter what steps you take,
thay can allways paint it as unreasonable" [save the
thay can always paint it as unreasonable" [save the
children, your tax dollars at work etc]. which isnt to say
"do nothing" but dont let "the standard of care" be "what
will satisfy a reporter with a small brain". [at various
times i have been involved in "appropriate use" compliance
issues and there is a very strong correlation with the
overall resonableness and cleverness of people working in
this area and their distate for being involved ... the one
person who was enthusiastic about this was a lying, incom-
petent sack of shit, who did a lot of underhanded political
things here, had no respect of anybody reasonable and some
what creepily made it part of his job to visit some of
the tagged WEEB site to make sure they were perverted/
pornish.]
\_ Wen Ho Lee got reamed for far less. -proud American
\_ To be fair, leaving around diskettes of nuclear secrets
is a lot worse than child porn.
\_ And your basis for saying he did is...?
\_ I thought he pled guilty to carelessly copying
classified nuclear crap to data cassettes and leaving
it in unclassified areas, probably for a job interview?
I don't think he was out there selling our secrets
to the Chinese, he was just really careless. Feel
free to prove me wrong.
\_ No, he didn't plead guilty to that.
\_ he was being single out because he is Chinese.
There are plenty of people in the lab do exactly the
same thing or worse but they end up in... hmm...
\_ I bet they don't anymore!
lecture hall of MIT instead of solidary comfinment
for 23 hours a day, shackled from waist down, for
9 month. May be you should really work for Christopher
Cox (author of "The Cox Report", now Chairman of SEC).
\_ and dude I don't know Chinese but I KNOW your
English is better than this, what is your problem? |
| 2006/8/1-6 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Recreation/Pets] UID:43862 Activity:nil |
8/1 County officials in one Chinese province decide to club to death all
non-military/police dogs due to rabies outbreak. Check out the photo.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14139027
\_ Why USA codemn mainland china for beat dog when Iraq Guataanimao
no China USA brutal Israel@!
\_ American care more about dog than they cares about non white.
\_ That's not true. As a proud American, I care deeply
about all black and Mexican women...at least when I'm
just about to climax on them. -proud American
\_ I was going to make a dumb joke but that's just sad.
\_ did you delete the existing joke(s)? that's sad...
\_ No.
\_ I love my cat, I club my dog
\_ they should of use lethal injection, just like what USA does.
\_ They probably deserved it. -proud American
\_ Those filthy dogs deserved everything they got. -proud Chinese |
| 2006/8/1-6 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/Asia/Taiwan] UID:43858 Activity:nil |
8/1 Does anyone know if foreign Mandarin accents irritate Mainland Chinese
as much as Beijing Chinese accent irritates say, the Taiwanese? In
another word do Mainlander discriminate as much as the non-Mainlanders
based on non-local Mandarin accents?
\_ The answer is "No" with almost absolute certainty for several
reason. While Beijing is more or less being the capital for
past 800 years, Chinese government traditionally ran by Mandarins
selected by sheer examination scores. This means government
up to cabinent members can came from anywhere. As result, there
is little geographical sense of superority. The situation changed
somewhat during Manchu Dynasty, mostly due to ethnic tensions
between royal desent (Manchus) and Hans who made up majority of
government body. The funny things is, those royal family based
their pride on proper Mandarin (specifically, "inner city" Beijing
accent, oppose to "outter city" and "outside of city"), instead of
Manchurian, a native Manchu tongue which almost no one speaks.
Fastforward to today,like any other metropolitans,bulk of Beijing's
14 million resident came from outside of the city. Consider that
China has several thousands of dialects, most people don't hold
anything agaist you if you speak with an accent.
\_ Short answer: No. While Beijing has been the capital of China for
more or less 800 years, majority of government officials, e.g.
Mandarins were selected by examination, thus, no particular
geographical ties. Today's Bejing, just like rest of major
Metropolitians, more people are from outside of Beijing than
the true native. While people do praise those who speak
with proper accent, very few, if any, are being discriminated
because of his/her accent, as there are at least 1.2 billion people
speak Mandarin with some sort of accent. -kngharv
\_ I don't know about accents, but my wife served as a tour guide
at the Salt Lake Temple Square, and generally the Taiwanese
tour guides did not give tours to the mainland Chinese. She
wasn't quite sure why, but it seemed to have to do with
tensions over Taiwanese independence. -jrleek
\_ jrleek. The root cause of this tension is because
pro-independent Taiwanese plays racial politics. Race, by
their definition, is based upon where one's parents were born.
As result, myself, born in Taiwan and currently working in
Taiwan, is considered as "Chinese Pig" by those Taiwanese.
(by the way, "Chinese Pig" was the exact term they use.)
Right now, Taiwan's democracy is completely engulfed by racial
politics that anything deemd "Native" (i.e. those people who
came to Taiwan prior to First Sino-Japanese War in 1845) is
justified. Politicians are judged based upon his blood line,
not by how well he/she has been ruled. kngharv
not by how well he/she has ruled. kngharv
\_ It is true. The Taiwanese people resent the Mainlanders
and their government. I'm wondering if the reverse is
also true. Do Mainlanders hate the Taiwanese? -taiwanese
\- there are some pretty crazy shenannigans between
china and taiwan. do you know about the crazy panda
diplomacy trick? i understand there is some either
pro-chinese or pro-taiwanese radio talk show in LA
and people get so worked up when calling from cell
phones in cars, they get into accidents. china also
does some wealsey things like objecting to a USA visa
for taiwanese officials truing to come to things like
college reunions.
\_ We should bomb Taiwan. Why the hell does this
tiny country even exist? -proud American
\_ To provide us with motherboards, DUH!
\_ You misunderstand. The tour guides didn't have the
problem, the guests did. In otherwords, from this one
data point it seems like mainlanders might have a
problem with the Taiwanese. One third hand data point
ain't much though. -jrleek
\_ nope, jrleek, that is not correct. People from mainland
tend to have problem with people from Hong Kong for one
reason or another, such resentment toward people from
Taiwan virtually non-existent. Majority of problem
lies upon Taiwan side. -kngharv
\_ I don't know Chineese, but I do know people, so I can pretty
confidently say, "Yes." Yankees hate southern accents.
Swiss hate Austrian accents. Sri Lankans hate Indian Tamil
accents. Limeys hate Gringo accents. People everywhere are
convinced that their way of speaking a language is the one true
way and everyone else is wrong. So it goes.
\_ That's not always true. Some accents get classified as "sexy"
or "sophisticated", along with associated stereotypes(I'm talking
about English here).
\_ Southern accents are great. Northern ones are ugly. -Yankee
\_ You guys are right. The corollary is that people
everywhere hate their own accent and like other accents.
\_ I don't know man. I use to dislike Cantonese (and I am a
Mandarin speaker), but there was this cute sexy girl who
I swear speaks the most sexy sounding Cantonese I've
ever heard. After that, I don't find Cantonese so
offensive sounding. ;) |
| 2006/7/25-28 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Computer/Rants] UID:43788 Activity:nil |
7/25 I guess China is really pissed at North Korea's missile test.
Again, I don't think China has full control of N.Korea, but it
does have a bag of tricks dealing with N.Korea:
http://tinyurl.com/r5fu8
\_ No one said they had "full" control.
\_ Did North Korea return the trains that it seized from China?
\_ NK printing US money at will, nice. Hadn't heard that one.
\_ I heard Iraq did the same.
\_ At Abdul's nuke shack we sell an awful lot of goodies ...
but we don't take dinars. |
| 2006/7/18-20 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:43718 Activity:nil |
7/18 So, we call that guy a "chicom", but isn't that sort of a misnomer?
Isn't chinese communism extinct, just like communism everywhere
in the world except Cuba? I mean, with all the market reforms
in China, haven't the leadership admitted, in essense, that
communism doesn't work, that the market does, and that they're
retaining political control nakedly just for the sake of
holding power? And so, shouldn't we rename "chicom troll"
after some abbreviation of "Chinese totalitarian governmental
pawn" instead?
\_ How 'bout: Chipotle?
\_ I started using chicom because it's so absurdly anachronistic
(like half of his rants.) I think heil cherman john guy left
because I didn't have a good name for him. I think every good
troll breeder should know his trolls by good names, so feel free
to suggest. -John |
| 2006/7/18-20 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:43707 Activity:nil |
7/18 Racist polls. Which ethnicity/race/people love money the most?
-Chinese: .
-Jew: .
-Swiss: .
\_ If we loved money so much, we wouldn't be so damn bad
at business. -John
\_ We as in Swiss or Jew? You are a Jew aren't you?
\_ Awesome, I never knew. Hmm. -John
-Nigerians:
\_ Jewish ethnic Chinese living in Nigeria
\_ Is there such a thing as Jewish Chinese or Chinese Jew?
\_ Why not? Just like there are many Chinese Muslims in China,
and many Chinese Christians and Chinese Catholics in Hong
Kong.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Jews_in_China
\_ So they have the best of both ethnicity, where they're
super rich and super stingy?
-English: .
\_ Remembering how my former classmate who was a Chinese FOB seemed
to worry mostly about what else she could possibly do in her spare
time to make even MORE money despite the fact she already had a
well-paying 60hr/week programming job, $0 debt, and that her living
expenses were not much higher than those of a typical UCB student,
I'd say Chinese.
\_ Who has all the old money in the world? How do you think
they got it, by not caring about money? WASP's love to complain
about how everyone else are only interested in money, while
they seem to have all of it. It is a subtle form of putting
down the nuevo riche. |
| 2006/7/17-19 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:43695 Activity:nil |
7/17 If Chinese immigrants live everywhere in the world, why don't they
live near the coastline? For example, Fremont is full of Chinese
people and it's far away from the coast. Ditto with Monterey Park
and Alhambra. Why don't they live near say, Noe Valley, Pacific
Heights, Seacliff, and Marina? Why don't they live in West LA?
All of these areas are along the coast, and are predominanatly white.
Do Chinese people in general not like living near the ocean?
-Chinese and curious
\_ I'm sorry to say this bitterly but in reality, it's
because the whities control the best real estates. For
hundreds of years they suppressed the minorities and took up all
because the whities control the best real estates. For hundreds of
thousands of years they suppressed the minorities and took up all
the good land and left the Indians, blacks, and latinos
shitty land. Case in point, when the Japanese were too successful,
the whities took away their properties and put them into
internment camps. Do you remember the Euclid co-op on
1777 Euclid? It used to be owned by Japanese students until
the whities took it away from them. It's all about power and
control, and the whities have both.
\_ Perhaps the whities own all the good land because they have a
solid work ethic and sharp minds with good educations -- whereas
all the little non-whities like yourself are lazy, uneducated,
greedy second-class citizens that can't even learn english.
God rewards those who work for their rewards, and he punishes
greedy, lazy, uneducated non-whities like yourself. I may
not be a minority, but at least I can speak english.
\_ "The whities" do not control all the good land. A very small
power elite controls all the good land, as it does everywhere.
In the U.S., that small power elite is mostly(but not entirely)
white. I'm reminded of the old joke about the jew in tsarist
russia who says he always reads the anti-semitic newspaper because
it's all good news: it says he controls the banks, the land,
the government, etc. when in fact he's a poor peasant like
everyone else. All the good land everywhere is being bought up
by rich speculators, squeezing out those of us who work for a
living. The fact that most of the speculator class is white
does not make this a race issue.
\_ No, no -- the whities do because they're clearly superior
than their mentally disadvantaged little cousins.
\_ it's because being near chinese grocery stores seems to be the
being outdoors, so the higher cost of coastal living isn't
justified, since chinese people like money.
\_ Which race/ethnicity doesn't like money?
\_ Why is this even a race based question? Can't there be
individuals of every background who have their own
personal belief systems?
\_ Exactly my point. -- PP
\_ They buy moderately priced real estate where there is an existing
Chinese community they can buy Chinese groceries at?
\_ The Richmond and Sunset Districts in SF have a lot of Chinese
residents. Both are coastline districts.
\_ Is it a feng shui thing? I know that Chinese like San Marino
because of wide, straight streets. Beach towns don't usually
have that.
\_ San Francisco? Boston? Hong Kong?
\_ I thought it's because of their lack of driving ability
\_ San Francisco? Boston?
\_ Everything is determined by price. If Chinese immigrants
are rich, then they will buy up all the coast-line
properties and China Town will not be where it is today.
Most are not, so they settle for something in between. It's
like asking, how come the black people lives in shit place
like New Orleans? How come they don't buy up the
coast-line properties?
\_ What's weird is that in the SF neighborhood where I grew up
(Miraloma, attached houses, nothing special), several
Chinese families bought houses, built huge in-laws and
extra stories, and moved in. Judging by their cars, most of
them were loaded and could have afforded nice places in way
more upscale parts of town. I never figured that out. -John
\_ Don't judge wealth by cars.
\_ "How come engineers/geeks don't like pretty girls? Why do
they always go for the below average ones? Do geeks in
general not like cute/sexy/pretty girls?" |
| 2006/7/10-11 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:43611 Activity:nil |
7/10 Just a reminder that the CPC is an illegitimate government that
seized power through force of arms, and that the PRC illegally invaded
and continues to occupy Tibet, suppresses the basic human rights of
the Uighurs, installs its own political appointees to key positions
in religious institutions that it does not recognize as legitimate,
and continues to sell the organs of political prisoners.
\_ I liked it. You are stupid. Keira Knightley is still flat.
\_ Uighurs? Are you implying that they respect the basic human rights
of anyone else, including Han?
\_ Tibet was conqured by Manchurians in the late 16th century, some
90 years before the 13 states declare independent from the Crown.
\_ Difficult for the Manchurians to do since they didn't conquer
China until the mid 17th century.
\_ What is CPC? |
| 5/27 |
| 2006/7/9-10 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:43603 Activity:low |
7/8 Just a reminder that it was USA and USSR divided the Korea.
China had nothing to do with it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Division_of_Korea
A little historical fact that is unknown to most of Americans:
1. Foreign minister at the time, Zhou EnLai of PRC, via India,
warned USA about not cross the 38th parallel or PRC would have no
choice but defend itself. US Army decided to go all the way. Mind
you that at the time, US does not recognize the government in Beijing
as legitiment representitive of China. There was geniune fear among
Chinese that US would use this opportunity to get involved and perhaps
restore the Nationalist government.
2. Historical documents from China reveal the fact that China (yes,
across the Yalu river) was continuously being bombed by Americans.
At the time, many thought it was the prelude to American invasion.
Korean War, from China side, was more of a war of self-defence than
an ideological war. Unfortuntely, American never see this conflict
outside its "Communist" lens. The sad thing is, American still view
the world using this kind of broad-brush, jus that the lens has
switched from "Communist" to "Terrorism."
\_ Self-defense? What a silly chicom troll.
\_ US acrossed the 38th parallel first. US could of driven
N.Koreans out of South Korea and stopped there. But
McArthur decided to go all the way. We all know now that at
the time, his intension was going to Beijing. You can't say
Beijing was paranoid because its fear turned out to be true.
\_ Yes, after nearly being driven off the peninsula by invading,
Chinese & Soviet-supported North Korean hordes. Good troll,
Have a troll snack! -John
\_ N.Korea attacked S.Korea without (Communist) Chinese's
knowledge. At the time, Mao Zetong was busy preparing
for invasion of Taiwan. last thing Communist Chinese want
was draw any excuse for US involvement.
\_ Maybe because they were sending several hundred thousand guys
across the Yalu (including many "volunteers" before the PRC was
officially involved) and allowing massive amounts of supplies to
enter N. Korea. Silly chicom troll. -John
\_ The bombing taken place before China gotten involved (i.e.
before million of people were send across the Chinese border).
When I read those documents, I was suspecious it was a Communist
propaganda myself. Then, 20 some years later, I saw the same
tactic used in Vietnam. It does seems that this is
a common practice of USA to escalate the war. Few tend to know
the fact that US forces were bombing China/Vietnam. When
China/Vietnam respond to such hostile act, US President can
turn to congress and ask for proper "response" as if US was
being unfairly provoked.
\_ Good troll, another troll snack! Next week we move on to
Adult Troll-Gro. -John
\_ I don't see this as a troll, merely stating an
opinion that many people do not want to hear.
1) US did not recognize China as a legitimate
government at the time.
2) China has warned NK not to attack the south,
because the US will get involved and the Soviets will
not back them. But NK choose to listen to the Soviets
instead. And sure enough the soviets chickened out.
3) China does not want a conflict on the Korean
peninsula because it wants to focus on Taiwan. Having
US entering from the North and engaged in a conflict
would give substantial advantage for Taiwan to attack
from the south.
4) McArthur has stated more than once that he will
chase NK (terrorists using current terminology)
across the border, if necessary.
5) Factor all these into consideration, it became
clear it is in China's best interest to be
"PREEMPTIVE" about the war and make sure it doesn't
get to its borders. So it decided to get involved.
The "voluntary army" is just a cover.
6) The Korean war, and then the Vietnam war, is
basically how the international community, especially
the US, came to recognize China as a legitimate
government. It really take WARS to establish
yourself, like the wars we've fought with Mexico.
(yeah, we did fight the Mexicans, imagine that huh?)
If you tell me US have no intention of aiding Taiwan
and stop once they captured the NK leaders inside
China territory, or think the US would not have done
the same if the situation is reversed. You are even
a bigger troll. ;) -chiry
\_ At least we're agreed about the "voluntary army" being
a cover for PRC involvement in the Korean War. Now we
need to get you to realize that PRC could have defused
tensions by not allowing the North Koreans to retreat into
China to begin with. After that, we'll work on the party
line about pre-emption being the PRC's only means of
avoiding invasion by MacArthur. --erikred |
| 2006/7/5-7 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:43575 Activity:kinda low |
7/5 NK stealing Chinese aid trains. How pathetic.
http://www.strategypage.com/qnd/korea/articles/20060705.aspx
\_ "While everyone's attention was focused on North Korean missiles,
the real story is the North Korean economy. It continues to fall
apart, and more North Koreans are unhappy about that. Worse yet,
more North Koreans are finding out how badly they have been
screwed by their leaders."
This is a dangerous estimation of the current situation. North
Koreans are not some sort of democratic people who have been mis-
led by their duly elected officials; they're hostages of a
totalitarian regime that starves them and keeps them down through
malnutrition and force of arms. There is little chance of a popular
uprising in NK. The best you're likely to get is disaffection among
the generals and a coup.
\_ There have been food riots in the past, and a few
assassination attempts on the dear leader, but yeah, you're
basically right. It doesn't hurt that China is very
interested in propping the regime up.
\_ fuck you. Neither China nor South Korea is interested in
completely disintegration of N.Korea for one simple reason.
Neither China nor S.Korea knows what to do with millions of
half-starved refugees. There are already tens of thousands
of N.Koreans inside China illegally, and Chinese is not sure
what to do with them. US is 6000 miles away from N.Korea
of course won't suffer any consequences of its complete
disintegration. To say China is trying propping the regime
up is either one of those anti-China propaganda, or you are
just completely clueless on what the fuck is going on in
this part of the world.
\_ Well China propped it up in the first place (1950).
\_ nope. Korea was partitioned by US and USSR, buddy.
China was left in the dark in the Yelta Conference.
Again, you have no clue what is going on in this part
of the world.
\_ motdpoll: Who is more clueless? The guy who
thinks Yalta (1945) was in 1950, or the guy who
thinks China was involved in the Korean war?
Yalta in 1950 guy: ..
China in KW guy:
\_ China was fighting us by proxy in the
Korean war by providing the father of the
current Dear Leader with massive logistical
support.
\_ This is from a thirty-second google of "china
'korean war'":
http://www.kimsoft.com/korea/cn-korea.htm
I'll go with Yenta.
\_ Yes, China was involved in the Korean war,
they kept the US from unifying Korea
under the SK government. The "poll" was
just supposed to be a funny way of
pointing out what an idiot and blowhard
Chicom is.
\_ I think the motd is too clueless to
get this humor. -China in KW guy
\_ Uh, why "fuck you"? You've just confirmed that "China
is very interested in propping the regime up." -John
\_ there is a difference between prevent a regime from
completely disintergration versus propping it up.
Yes, China ships food and fuel to N.Korea every week.
But this is about the only leverage China has over
N.Korea. How much leverage does US have?
\_ So, you don't disagree with the fact, you just
don't like how I stated it? Well, screw you
too.
\_ Cheap shot: The PRC knows what to do with NK refugees--
keep them the hell away from other countries' consulates
lest they claim political asylum.
\_ Chinese is doing US, Japan, and other European nation
a huge favor in this regard. China could of just throw
its hand and say "hey, consulate is your soverign
territory, ain't my problem, so, you deal with these
North Koreans."
\_ This is nonsensical; US, Japan, and the Euro
nations have no problem with granting political
refugee status to North Koreans who ask for it.
To say that the PRC is doing these countries a
favor by sending police into consulates to remove
these refugees is like saying that the Sudanese
government is doing the rest of the world a favor
by murdering Darfur refugees.
\_ Not trying to argue with you, but apart from the alleged
explosives plot in '04, can you point me toward these other
assassination attempts?
\_ I'm having trouble finding them now. I read one where
an artillery group loaded a live shell at a parade and
took a shot at him.
\_ A "popular uprising" in the modern world requires outside
assistance for weapons, etc. I'm unaware of any attempts to
create or fund the non-existent popular uprising in NK, but a
coup might happen if some colonel gets greedy and I'm sure a
random NK colonel is going to be so much better for the world
than the random NK in charge now. It's hopeless.
\_ A lone colonel is not going to be enough to install himself
as generalissimo. If there's a coup, a military junta a la
Burma is much more likely. |
| 2006/7/5-7 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/Asia/Japan] UID:43569 Activity:moderate |
7/5 What's the big deal about NK testing firing some missiles? I mean
don't we test fire missiles all the time? We must've test
fired thousands of missiles, heck, we still drop bombs
wherever we feel like, and that's all fine. But another
sovereign nation can't test fire a fucking missiles? Last I
recall NK hasn't dropped bombs on anyone except Korea. We have
dropped Nuclear Bombs, Cluster Bombs, all kinds of fucking
bombs everywhere around the globe, but I guess it's ok because
we are the good guys, and we never attack unless being
attacked, ops, I mean we never, never mind.
\_ You're right, it's about international prestige. NK wants some,
the U.S. doesn't want to give it to them.
\_ It's not just the US; Japan's objecting to NK testing missiles,
too. That's not about prestige, that's self-preservation. If
NK can target Tokyo, Japan believes NK will use this to blackmail
Japan for more economic/agrarian aid. Japan has reason to think so;
cf. NK's abduction of Japanese citizens and subsequent denial of
such.
\_ Plus the fake fishing boats in Japan waters.
\_ Plus the underground tunnels across the 38deg parallel.
\_ The funny thing is, there is little symphathy toward Japan
across Asia. Japanese need to think a bit hard on why being
targeted by N.Korea doesn't yield any symphathy among its
neighbors.
\_ In other news, Japan was dressed like it wanted to be
targetted.
\_ Dude, from the *U.S.* perspective Japan is very important,
our 4th largest trading partner. We don't want to see them
nuked or blackmailed.
\_ China is the 3rd largest trading partner, but US doesn't
mind China being nuked or blackmailed at all. In fact,
US probably going to nuke China when it got a chance.
what does trade has anything to do with all this?
\_ No one (apart from the Uighurs and some militant
Tibetans in exile) wants to nuke China. The US is
pursuing a policy of encouraging the PRC to abandon
its ersatz Communism in favor of capitalism (which
many people think will somehow lead to democratic
reform; I disagree on the basis that the people in
power in the PRC are much more likely to use the
economic miracle to consolidate their own power at the
expense of the serf class they rule). Also, DPRK
cannot blackmail PRC because PRC controls the oil
pipeline that leads into the DPRK; when DPRK last tried
to get snarky with PRC, there was an "accident" that
shut down the pipeline for nearly a week. DPRK backed
down.
\_ economic propsperity will lead to political reform.
The Chinese government today is, believe me or not,
a lot more transparent than 15 years ago. But
don't put your bet on full western-style democracy.
it has been tried and didn't work. Another history
lesson of the day, China is the first country in
East Asia that established a Democratic Republic
with 5 branch of government.
\_ Despite Sun Yat-sen's idealistic intentions,
the Republic of China was never a Western-style
democracy; it was an oligarchy, and it quickly
devolved into a military dictatorship. It was
disaffection with the KMT's stranglehold on the
ersatz democracy that fueled Mao & Co.'s rise to
power. After the founding of the PRC, democracy
became something less than lip service; cf.
Gang of Four.
\_ They just fired a 7th (!!). I wonder how many NK comrades literally
starve for every compensatory phallic NK missle launch.
\_ You do know these missiles are called "Nodong," right?
\_ Yeah!!! We should all quick picking on poor little NK. After all
it was Western agression that provoked them into starting the
Korean War! Get you fcking head out of the sand. NK perfects
missile technology, it'll be nuclear yellow mornings for you
libs in the West coasts all the time. And please don't give tell me
you don't know about the thousands of conventional arty pieces
pointed at Seoul, ready to level it at the first sign of attack.
\_ As the only nation on this planet in the history of
mankind that have used a nuclear weapon against millions
of civilian lives, and wants to develop "bunker busting
nukes" against an enemy so weak they can't even fight us
face to face, we really have no right to tell anyone
what to do about nuclear weapons. Just remember, what
goes around, comes around. 75% of the world agrees that
the US is the biggest threat to world peace. It is time
you get your head out of the sand and ask "why".
\_ Why if 75% say so then it must be true! I can see how the
sun never sets on the U.S. flag! I can see English being
forced on the locals. Yes, sirree! We are threat to world
peace with all the food we give away, all the money we
give away to those who play ball with us, my gawd, all that
"shame" from Hiroshima (100k dead vs. 2mil USGI possibly
dying) has lead us to the warpath! You know we wanted
to rewrite the Vietnamese lang. just like the French did.
You know we wanted to go all the way to Beijing. By golly
you have us pegged as conquering squatters we are.
\_ The US did go all the way to Beijing in 1900.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eight-Nation_Alliance
\_ Nice. Maybe they think we're a threat because of what we
actually HAVE done, largely supporting and funding
destabilizing influences the world over.
\_ you mean how we've been the most generous and pacifist
power the world has ever seen?
\_ US is neither most generous (in the percentage of
is GDP) nor pacifist. We've been overthrown
democratic governments, founding garallias,
and invade soverign nation against UN charter.
Exactly what make you think US is a pacifist?
\_ Generous: we give more. We also give a lot more
\_ nope. per pecentage of GDP, US doesn't give
more.
in private donations. Pacifist: name any country
\_ private donation doesnt count as Nation's
donation. good try to spin the way through
in the past with any amount of power that didn't
try to form an empire. I can only name one that
has more power than the rest of the world
combined and barely uses it. This is a very
pacifist and passive country.
\_ Do you want to talk about Iran in 1953?
Guatamola? Chili? and latest Iraq? If you
want to talk about neighbors, you want to
talk about our invasion against Canada?
our advanture with Mexico? I haven't start
talking about all these Indian nations because
inferior race doesn't count as humans.
\_ And Kenneth Lay was a great philanthropist.
\_ Snarky. Ignorant.
\_ He was! How's that ignorant?
\_ More generous and pacifistic than Sweden? Canada?
The Netherlands? I think not.
\_ I was unaware Sweden, Canada, and the Netherlands
were super powers. I apologise to you and the
rest of the motd for not recognising these three
great nations for the super powers they are.
\_ The phrase was "power" not "super power." But
yeah, if you want to claim that the United
States is the most generous and pacifistic
superpower in the world, that would be hard
to argue with, since we are also the only
superpower in the world. We are also,
incidently, the greediest and most warmongering
superpower in the world. But in either case,
you aren't saying a whole lot.
\_ Split any hairs lately? Use Power or Super
Power. No nation with power over their
neighbors has ever been as generous or as
pacifistic as the US. How's that? No
nation has ever had the power the US has
now and pray they don't ever because it's
only down hill from here.
\_ Okay, I agree with you on this.
\_ you are sooooooooooo ignorant of history.
google the term "pax sinica."
\_ Hello, the Middle Kingdom invented
gunboat diplomacy before there were
gunboats. Also, if the MK had an
economic dispute (i.e., if you didn't
pay your tribute), they'd invade and
destroy. This would seem to invalidate
the pacifist requirement.
\_ you have no idea what you are
talking about. tribute is more
similar to trade agreement than
what you think it is. But since
you are clueless beyond help, I
am not going to elaborate further.
\_ LOLicious! You have nothing to
back up your revisionist view
of the Middle Kingdom as last
benign military force, so you
accuse me of not knowing what
I'm talking about. -10 points
for House ChiCom Troll!
\_ Hey, don't forget the kindness of
the Islamic empire. As long as
you agreed with them on
everything, they wouldn't murder
everyone and rape all the women!
What elightenment!
\_ hmm... let see... why all the
fucking Jews seeking refuge in
those Islamic empire if they are
being murdered and raped?
\_ 1) Because they had _less_
chance of being raped in Islamic
world than in Xian world; google
Pogroms. 2) Because pp has
overstated the case even more
than revisionist ChiCom Troll.
\_ Yeah, each of those countries can airlift
people after tsunamis, hurricanes, earthquakes
easily. Why they protect thousands of miles
of land that's not even theirs!
\_ Overseas Development Aid as a percentage of GDP
Denmark 0.96%
Norway .89
Sweden .83
Netherlands .81
Luxembourg .77
Belgium .43
Ireland .40
France .38
Japan .23
United States .13
\_ Are you including private donations? No.
I think you'll be surprised at just how
generous Americans really are if you
bothered to check that instead of just
looking at government funded programs, but
Americans are all greedy and selfish and
insular and stupid so don't worry about it.
\_ Give me the facts then, instead of just
spouting your opinion. Including private
donations, who is the most generous?
Cite your source, please.
\_ Fighting the war on terror is equivalent
to development aid, because terror impedes
development. The defense cost and the Bush
War in Iraq are greater than any dev aid
we've ever seen, and therefore the US is
the most generous nation on the planet.
God Bless! -Bush Cheney Lay Skilling #1!
\_ what about china?
\_ China is not exactly in the position
to help anyone. If China can leveage
millions of people out of poverty, it
will be considered an act of huge
favor toward humanintarian cause.
\_ Seeing how many super powers on this list: 1
\_ screw this percentage of GDP crap, and show
us the real absolute numbers. Do you think
the needy will be more grateful for $100
from a rich man than $1 from a pauper?
\_ No, but Jesus taught that the latter
is a bigger gift.
\_ Who?
\_ Jesus Holy-shit Christ.
\_ What?! I learned on the motd
that His middle name was
"tapdancing". Is this a
different guy?
\_ Oh come on, he was doing a good job
lying with statistics. Don't try to
bring hard numbers into it.
\_ How is percentage lying? I believe
the claim was "most generous"
Generosity is a measure of sacrifice,
not absolute dollar value.
\_ The US did go all the way to Beijing in 1900.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eight-Nation_Alliance
\_ US is the leading superpower. If it wasn't US, it would be
Spain, France, Holland, Germany, UK, China, Japan, or someone
else. Don't think that w/o the US the power vacuum would be
filled with some peaceloving nation. As world powers decline,
others rise to take their place. Only the names change.
\_ Those people should be asked their definition of "World
Peace." I don't see how we have World Peace now, so how
can anyone threaten it? Is Dafur (and other such places)
not the automatic biggest threat to world peace, since
they keep it from existing in the first place?
\_ Darfur doesn't count to these people. They're brown,
they're foreign, they have a different religion/culture/
language/everything and worst of all, they're poor so if
they're getting slaughtered hey let's just have another
UN meeting in a few months to discuss the exact definition
of genocide. Once the UN's Human Rights Commission's
sub-committee on the definition of genocide gets back to
us next year we can then decide if that definition fits
Darfur but only after the government there releases figures
telling us how many they're killing per day and why each
one was killed.
\_ We didn't kill *millions* with nuclear weapons, more like
300,000. Not to justify it or anything, just pointing out
that you're off by a factor of ten.
\_ Agreed. About the same number of civilians the Japanese
killed in the Rape of Nanjing alone.
\_ Agreed. About the same as the number of civilians the
Japanese killed in the Rape of Nanjing alone.
\_ I know where you're coming from, but believe me, Kim Jong Il is not
the guy you want to defend on this sovereignty issue. |
| 2006/6/20-24 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Israel] UID:43438 Activity:nil |
6/19 Why have the Christians turned against our soldiers?
http://www.godhatesfags.com/photos/2006/20060607_arkansas.html
\_ In fairness, looking at Fred Phelps and Westboro Baptist and asking
why Christians hate US troops is a bit like looking at the Nazis
and asking why socialists want to exterminate the Jews.
\_ The Nazis were facist, not socialist.
\_ Uh what? You know what socialism is, right? They were
socialists.
\_ Uh no they weren't. Facism and extreme socialism can
look simaler, but there are huge differnces. And just
because Nazi had socialism in the name doesn't make them
socialists. Just like calling yourself El Presidente
doesn't make your dictatorship a democracy.
\_ And Phelps may call himself a Christian, but his
actions would paint him otherwise.
\_ So in what ways were the Nazis not "extreme socialists"?
\_ The Nazis believed in State control of the economy?
Really? Also, why did the Nazis kill all the Communists
and Socialists the first thing upon seizing power???
You historical revisionists always crack me up...
\_ Are you saying the Nazi economy was something other
than state controlled? Could a Jewish company owner
have done good business in Nazi Germany? If you don't
know that communist != socialists....
\_ Ignorant != Revisionist
\_ Fascism is a mixture of corporatism and state
syndicalism in a highly nationalist context. It very
much postulates a very regimented economic environment
whose primary function is to serve state interests. In
this sense it is very similar to socialism, although it
generally allows for private ownership of the means of
production, as long as these shut up and put up. Sort
of like China today. -John
\_ Since state interests in China = PRC leadership
interests these days, it's hard to tell if this is
socialism, fascism, or oligarchy.
\_ Yes. |
| 2006/6/5-8 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:43280 Activity:nil |
6/5 YHOO, worse than GOOG and MSFT in terms of helping Chinese authorities
http://news.zdnet.com/2100-9588_22-6079478.html |
| 2006/6/3-8 [Politics/Domestic/California, Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:43267 Activity:nil |
6/3 I took several years of Chinese in Berkeley. Ranch 99 in Albany has
\_ 99 Ranch
quite a few wanted ads posted in Chinese for tenants, many requiring
you to be female or be of Chinese ethnicity. This makes me very
angry. Isn't this clearly DISCRIMINATION and can I sue them?
Do I have a case? ACLU claims this is not legal:
http://www.aclunc.org/language/lang-report.html
\_ Honestly, I'd rather face direct discrimination in this case
than hidden discrimination. I mean, all they have to
do is say "no" to whomever they don't want and not explain
why, and it is difficult to make a case. At least
this way you don't waste your time. --PeterM
\_ The ACLU doesn't seem to say it's illegal in housing. -tom
\_ But CA law does. See below.
\_ Unless this is a roommate situation, it's illegal to advertise for
female-only tenants. Sue 'em on that.
\_ California's FEHA is the primary state law which prohibits
discrimination in the sale, rental, lease negotiation, or
financing of housing based on a person's race, religion,
national origin, color, sex, marital status, ancestry, family
status, disability,sexual orientation, and source of income.
http://www.shastafairhousing.org/California2001.pdf
\_ I don't know how they phrase it in ranch 99, but I usually
state my "preference" on my craigslist ad. If you are a
business managing an apartment complex, then you probably
shouldn't say "female only", but if someone's just looking
for a roommate, then I don't see what the big problem is.
\_ This stuff has gone on in Berkeley for decades.
\_ Well then, we need to sue Berkeley. Reverse discrimination
is bad for our superior Ayran race! |
| 2006/5/22-28 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Domestic/President, Politics/Domestic/President/Bush] UID:43142 Activity:nil |
5/22 http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20060522/od_nm/leisure_nixon_odd_dc First they made an opera called Nixon in China. Maybe we'll see an opera called Bush in Iraq in the future. One can only hope. \_ Nixon ineptly invaded China on false pretenses leading to civil war and shattering what little stability was left in the region? I need to keep up on my history! \- ObTrivia: the "they" that did the NIXON IN CHINA opera is composer JOHN ADAMS, who happens to live in BERKELEY. He is also the fellow that did the DOCTOR ATOMIC opera about fmr UCB Physics Prof ROPPENHEIMER, which you may have heard about last year. ROPPHENHEIMER's brother FOPPENHEIMER is the "they" behind the EXPLORATORIUM who both went to the same high school in NYC as my friend whose bday is today. ok tnx. |
| 2006/5/9-10 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Finance/Shopping] UID:42989 Activity:low |
5/9 Dear motd. Suppose a friend wants to maximize his wedding plans and
would like to get the biggest bang for the bucks. He would like to
invite as many people to the banquet as possible without
losing too much money and without pissing people off. The only way
to do so is by having the wedding back in Asia, which is not an
option for him since most of his friends are in California. He's
thinking about inviting as many close friends as possible so that
red envelopes would recoup some of the costs, while minimizing
the number of non-Asian people since they rarely give red envelopes.
By the way I don't want to get into the whole topic of why many
Americans we've met are so culturally insensitive, ignorant,
careless, and rude that they give gifts instead of traditional
auspicious red envelopes with amounts that at least recoup the
cost of the wedding banquet. We especially want to avoid inviting
non-Asians people who may unknowingly give really really cursed
items like clocks, knives, and things that end up with the number
four, or uneven number of things-- one more reason to not invite
non-Asians. Anyways, depending on the quality of food and where he
holds the banquet, each table is ~$500 for 10 people, and if he
invites too many non-Asians he'll end up losing a lot of money and
have bad luck. What's the best way to go about this? Is it ok to
invite everyone to the vow thing and then exclude non-Asians to the
banquet as to decrease bad luck and increase overall fortune of
the year? Thanks so much for any advice.
the year? Thanks so much for any advice.
\_ This is clearly a simple optimization problem with several variables
and a few unknown constants. We who study this problems cannot help
because your unknown constants cannot be determined without the a
certain about uncertainty (how odd), and perhaps a cultural anthropoligist.
If offending your non-Asian friends costs you more money in terms of lost
gifts than would be recouped by Red Envelopes, then you must avoid
inviting Asians at all. Don't forget you could always sell the gifts
on E-bay. The tricky part comes when analyzing the bad-luck gifts.
Just how much income will you lose from dieing early if given a small clock
vs. a large clock. This we cannot know. Now to be serious.
Weddings are for your family and friends, not yourself you selfish bastard.
certain about uncertainty (how odd), and perhaps a cultural
anthropoligist. If offending your non-Asian friends costs you more
money in terms of lost gifts than would be recouped by Red
Envelopes, then you must avoid inviting Asians at all. Don't
forget you could always sell the gifts on E-bay. The tricky part
comes when analyzing the bad-luck gifts. Just how much income will
you lose from dieing early if given a small clock vs. a large clock.
This we cannot know. Now to be serious. Weddings are for your
family and friends, not yourself you selfish bastard.
\_ 80 column your ass, you inconsiderate bastard.
\_ Your friend's mentality is completely fucked up and completely
misinterperate the tradition.
The way it suppose to work is actually rather simple. At the
front of the benquet, there is typically a team of three or four
that acted as account receivable. As soon as the guest give out
the envelope, the account receivable will 1. OPEN THE ENVELOPE,
COUNT THE MONEY HE/SHE GAVE, and 2. write down how much he/she gave
out in the "income statement."
Why keep such record? because when it's his/her turn to get
married, you typically give the same amount back as SOCIAL NORM
dictates.
In other word. The tradition is designed to, effectively, lend
the money to the new couples, when they need the money the most,
and return the money to him/her when it's their turn to get married.
The only exception to the rule is that you happened to have some
rich friends and you happens to be poor. The tradition allow
the wealthy to channel the funds to those in needs without having
the recipein losing face.
The social norm dictates that if you are out of town and have little
chance to attend other's wedding, then, don't have such banquet.
or says flat out in the invitation that red envelopes will NOT be
accepted. and Yes, having such statement in the invitation is not
as uncommon as you think.
In short, stop being a cheap bastard in the name of tradition.
kngharv
\_ Hang on--this doesn't make sense. So let's say I'm single and
I "lend" $100 to my newlywed friend in his time of greatest
financial need as a wedding "gift". If I ever get married,
according to your setup, he would simply be "repaying" me if
he gave me $100 as a gift, not "lending" to me in my time of
greatest financial need. How about, if you're going to give
a cash gift, just look at it as just that, a gift? -John
\_ You are right. It is cash gift. But there is an unspoken
rule that when it's your turn to get married, he/she will
also gives you the money in return. How he determine
how much he is going to give you? he digs out the income
statement and look at how much you gave the last time and
start from there. There are a lot of factors involved and
I was simplifying it to make a point. What are other factors?
the place where he/she held banquet, for example. Normally
we try to rough guess how much each head cost in a particular
place and try to make sure the margin I made on my wedding
is roughly the same margin he is going to make. There is no
hard rule here. People is not going to hold anything against
you if you forgot to factor in, for example, inflations.
Because a wedding invitation == money. There is a phenomenon
which you may find interesting. It is typically for a bride/
groom to have couple extra tables, and there will be people
come to the banquet uninvited. The logic behind such
uninvited guest is following:"you may think you and I don't
know each other well enough for you to ask money for me, but
I felt I am good enough friend for you and thus I will attend
your banquet, give you my blessing and of course cash gift."
fun? kngharv
\_ Ok let's say I give $100 to my friend and 10 years passed
and it's my turn to get married. Should he give me $100 plus
inflation rate? Also what if I get married 10 times, is that
fair?
\_ If you get married 10 times, you need all the help you
can get...
\_ Don't invite these people to the wedding at all. Instead,
hold a party for all your friends a few weeks afterwards (or
whenever you're recovered from the wedding). It'll be much
cheaper, they won't feel obligated to give you gifts you don't
want, and everyone will probably have more fun anyway.
\_ Yes but in the Chinese tradition, the more the merrier.
\_ There are really two things at work here: a) you're a cheapass
bastard, and b) you're a superstitious bastard. Why should the
motd work for you if you're not going to do anything for the motd
in return?
\_ You should have listened to your mom: Study more and stop hanging
around with those white folk. Bad for grades!
\_ Now that I'm older, I know better :( Mommy says the whities
I hang around with blow all their incomes on pleasure instead
of real estate, do drugs, and don't study. I'm a bad son. -op
\_ True (sad) story:
I gave a set of really expensive knives as a wedding gift to
one of my best friends. Within a year his wife had filed for
divorce and shortly after that (before the divorce even went
through) she died in a car accident. I am not superstitious,
but lots of people told me knives are 'bad' gifts. I won't try
that again. By the way, your post is a poor attempt at a troll.
\_ Is your friend Chinese? Whether it's your fault or not, one
thing is certain: the Chinese community gossips a lot, and
most of them by now think that you're an yang chi idiot and
will not invite you to their weddings.
\_ Jesus H. Christ are really such an egotist that you think
any of this bad luck had anything to do with what YOU bought
as a wedding gift?
\_ "I am not superstitious". No, I don't. However, when
there are so many other gifts to give, I won't chance it.
\_ "I'm not superstitious, I just won't step on cracks in
the sidewalk." -tom
\_ I did once and my mother's back broke. Why chance it?
\_ The only reason I wouldn't give someone a knife as a
wedding gift is think how bad I'd feel if there was
a really bad fight and a spouse stabbed the other
with the knife I bought. Don't give weapons as gifts.
\_ Ditto above about the troll, but generally, a lot of us hairy
barbarian gwailo gaijin types don't know about these superstitions,
and I find it pretty interesting to learn this sort of stuff.
Maybe include a little primer or something? Or would people find
that condescending? And not to sound insensitive, but do you (pp)
really blame the knives? -John
\_ Red envelopes are very auspicious. But you can't just put in
ANY money, you have to put in nice clean bills, as a sign of
purity. The amount must be even number, and the term
"double happiness" should be reflected. $22, $222, $2222 are
extremely good. Also ba, the number 8 is VERY VERY good. $88,
$888 are very good. Never, ever, give things that have 4 in
them, because it is just one tone away from the word death.
Wedding registry gifts-- they're ok if the Chinese guy is a
total ignorant banana in which case anything goes, so better
ask if the groom/bride are ABC bananas. NEVER, EVER give knives
and clocks unless you want the gossipy Chinese community
to hate you for the rest of your life. Clock is the same tone
as "your demise", or "RIP". And BTW it's not uncommon to not
invite whities to Chinese banquets because often they have
exotic food that piss off foreigners, or that the foreigners
start to become annoying and authoritative and ask silly
questions about the food (you just don't question their
culture, just accept it at the wedding ok?). So if you're a
whitie and you're invited, you should feel proud of yourself
for making it in the inner circle. Lastly the Chinese culture
says if you have a vacation home in Santiago Chile you are
obligated to offer them to use it any time they want. Ok
that's all I've got for now. -Motd Culture Consultant #2
\_ Haha this is actually pretty good, thanks. As for "not
inviting whiteys", I turned the "let's gross out the gaijin
for fun" around on a whole Japanese restaurant in Tokyo
once, where they all somehow felt honor-bound to choke down
the live-fish-in-sake they served us just because I chugged
them instead of making a face and sending them back. That'll
show 'em, HAH. Anyway, I thought not inviting gwailos was
just because we're funny looking and weird. So what would
be kosher non-monetary gifts then? -John
\_ So what if you give them four knives? Do they run away
screaming? ;-)
\_ This is very helpful. I kind of knew this stuff but my
Chinese friends never actually explained it. Those assholes.
They just let me infer it. So I'm gonna give them a set of
4 knives which each have a little digital clock in the handle.
Actually, they probably wouldn't give a shit. So I'll send
them to their mothers ;)
\_ Yes. Most ABC bananas today don't give a shit. But
their parents will probably have a heart attack.
So, be nice.
\_ I think John's hit this one on the nose. Turn this into an
educational experience. If some westerners consider giving
money too crass, then they shouldn't come. The point of a
wedding is to celebrate your love, not their cultural comfort
zone. Also, those red (or, in Japan, white) envelopes really
help with the cost. --erikred
\_ FYI, Japanese gives out red envelopes on weddings too.
\_ have a wedding you can afford. Your guests aren't there to pay
for your wedding you cheapass asian. -frugal asian
\_ why don't you have two banquets, Eastern and Western style
invite each guest to the appropriate one.
\_ Best idea I've seen so far. Invite friends and family to
the nice exclusive banquet with exotic gourmet shark fins,
dog meat, intestines, liver, and bobas while excluding
foreigners who may feel offended or grossed out. Then invite
the white people over to your backyard for BBQ, cheap beer,
and football. Great idea!
\_ Gwailo not appreciate gourmet shark fin. All gwailo eat
roast cow. And treat black people bad. -John
\_ I had a Vietnamese/white wedding and my wife's family all gave
red envelopes and my family all gave gifts from the registry.
But we returned almost all the gifts and got store credit, which
is almost as good. In white culture you are supposed to give a
gift which is approximately the same value as the cost of your
seat at the banquet plus wedding costs, so it is the same tradition,
almost. -ausman
\_ What the hell is "white culture"? Is that like yoghurt? -John
\_ why the heck are you registering for items you don't want? I
find these fundraising weddings to be really, rather crass.
\_ I agree, and I think Miss Manners would dispute any
inference that you are "supposed" to give any certain
value of gift. If you attend the wedding, you're supposed
to send a gift (not *bring* a gift, *send* a gift to
the couple afterwards), and as with all gifts, the giver
gets to decide how much to spend. -tom
\_ http://tinyurl.com/z8t6t
How are these numbers determined. I'm afraid that, as
romantic as weddings may be, arriving at the appropriate
value for a wedding gift tends to be based on cold, hard
economics. If you are attending the wedding, you want to
ensure that the value of your gift will cover the cost the
hosts will incur by having you in attendance. Think in
terms of the type and style of wedding, and where it will
be held. What amount do you think will be required to cover
the cost of your meal? Obviously, a cake and punch
reception in the couple's back yard will cost less than a
formal sit down meal in the city's swankiest skyline
restaurant. Once you've estimated what it will cost to
cover your meal, you'll want to add another "bonus" amount
so they actually get a gift in the end, and don't simply
recoup the cost of hosting you. Etiquette queens of days
gone by would claim that guests should never have to
consider the cost's of their host in determining what to
give as a gift. True enough, you don't have to run these
calculations, but a truly gracious guest is naturally
inclined to do so, out of their genuine desire to treat
the bride and groom, and to be generous on, what is to the
couple a very special occasion.
But there is also:
http://tinyurl.com/zwcxs
"Guests will choose a gift based on their budget and on how
well they know you. They are not obligated to cover the cost
of their meal and they should not even know how much you paid
for your reception. To give out that information is considered
bragging and has no bearing on what your guests will give."
So I guess there are various schools of thought on this one.
\_ I would not truest a website's advice on gift giving,
especially one from a industry that profits from such.
\_ We already have a house we had bought three years before,
but lots of people coming to the wedding wanted to buy
us gifts anyway. We had to come up with something. We found
a few that we actually wanted, but mostly we wanted gift
cards, but almost no one in my family gave that, because
they have that save attitude as the anonymous flamer that
it is really, rather crass. Is it better to have an attic
full of stuff you don't want? I really don't see what the
point of that is. But yeah, I didn't tell anyone I returned
their gift. No point in that. The truth is, there is no
"one size fits all cultures" answer to the question. -ausman
\_ Until they come over to your house for Thanksgiving and
wonder why you are dining on Ikeaware instead of the
Limoges china you returned for a big screen TV.
\_ If someone gives you Limoges china, why would you
not use it? Unless it's butt-ugly, of course. -John
\_ I know a lot of people who would say that the
china is nice, but that they need x and that
they can buy x (and probably y and z, too) if
they return the china that they will use only
twice per year. I think it's low class and
tacky (plus, I *like* to break out the china
unlike a lot of people) to return expensive
gifts in favor of gift cards and that, I suppose,
is my point. |
| 2006/5/8 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:42974 Activity:low |
5/8 Teaching taiwanese traditional chinese characters (30 million)
vs Communist China simplified chinese (1.3 billion):
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2006/05/08/MNGJLINAOP1.DTL - danh
\_ haha: "creator of Hanzi Smatter" |
| 2006/5/4-5 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:42933 Activity:nil |
5/4 China's unsavory friends
http://csua.org/u/fpj
and a cartoon on the same
http://www.filibustercartoons.com/archive.php?id=20060503
\_ Replace Mao with Uncle Sam, and Sudan oil with Iraq oil:
"Why hasn't the U.S. done anything to help Darfur?"
\_ think Rwanda... then, you see some consistency. I think the
only reason why US talked about Darfur is because US want to
pick fight with Arabs anyway they can.
\_ nah, the only reason why US talked about Darfur is because
talk == cheap
\_ I'm sorry you didn't read the article.
\_ I'm sorry the comic didn't summarize the article.
\_ You expected to get complete and fair treatment from a
one-panel cartoon? I guess that explains a lot about
your opinions. BTW, the cartoonist is Canadian.
\_ a friendly reminder. Saudi Arabia still chop people's hands off
and gauge people's eyes out. I wouldn't consider Saudi any
better than Uzbekistan. *FURTHER*, you may or may not remember
Uzbekistan was US's friend in the war on Terror.
\_ Not to mention publically beheading adulterers and gays.
The USA has 0 credibility on these matters as long as
Bush is holding hands/french kissing King Abdullah.
\_ Further, I would actually prefer China's position of respect
UN charter on self-determination... something that imperial power
in Europe and Americas can hardly understand.
\_ Yeah, China's ALL ABOUT self-determination, like in Hong Kong
and Taiwan.
\_ Hong Kong and Taiwan part of China. It different. You
not understand, gwailo. American treat their black
people bad. -John
\_ Get used to it, John. Japan lost the war and China
gotten Taiwan back. And one day, China will make sure
Ryukyu get back their independence from Japan.
\_ Good please be self-determine oppressed Inuit as well
(Alaska historically part of Han China.) -John
\_ Wow, I didn't realize murdering half your population was
covered under "self-determination." I'm sorry, are all the
black people in Sudan self-determining themselves to death?
\_ hey, US supplies arms to Turkey to crack down on Kurds, no?
how about Spain and Basques? how about UK and Northern
Ireland?
\_ This has got to be a troll. No one on soda is really
this stupid, are they? |
| 2006/4/6-7 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Computer/Rants, Academia/Berkeley/CSUA] UID:42719 Activity:nil |
4/6 Police in China (si-chuan) in action:
/csua/tmp/kngharv police_chongqing.jpg |
| 2006/4/2-4 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:42613 Activity:nil |
4/2 http://tinyurl.com/qfcxv (seattletimes.nwsource.com) China shuts down Rolling Stone |
| 2006/3/28-30 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Recreation/Food/Alcohol] UID:42504 Activity:high |
3/29 http://www.viceland.com/int/v13n3/htdocs/coffee.php?country=us Another choice is Chinese food. Chinese-food restaurants above 96th street are as ubiquitous as Starbucks coffee shops are in the rest of the city, but they look like Mao designed them. A table or two, a metal grill door, and two or three gas jets is all you're getting. Also, the employees are actually Chinese, and by that I mean two weeks ago they were in China. I always feel bad for these guys. Their average height is about 5'3", they weigh maybe 95 pounds, and they speak no English. And these are the DELIVERYMEN! Not surprisingly, they get robbed with alarming frequency. Hell, most women could kick their asses. I always like to speculate what these guys' lives are like as I take a report and try to find the kids who took their $42 and BBQ spare ribs. One day you're in China, kicking around the countryside, checking on your crops, then three days later you're on the 25th floor of a housing project with a bleeding lip and no money, trying to explain to me what happened with the 25 English words you know. They keep coming over, though, so I can't help but think, "Damn, Communist China must really, really suck." \_ aspolito has a huge ass. \_ Most of the Chinese restaurant workers who came here illegally are from Fuzhou, China. I read a wsj article a year or two ago saying that the Fuzhou people no longer care to come to the US, because China's economy is booming and there are better opportunities there. That's why these days, I noticed they are being quickly replaced by Mexicans. At its height, the Fuzhou guys have a really good network. Dump one of them in Fuzhou-nese have a really good network. Dump one of them in any US city, and he would be able to find someone from his hometown, and thus find work and housing, and make a living, albeit a not very good one, relatively speaking. hometown, and thus find work and housing, and survive. Their superb overseas network was one of the reasons why many of them were able to come the US to work for a while, make some money, and then go home. money, and then go home. Fuzhou is part of the Fujian province. The Fujianese, together with Cantonese, Hakkas, Teochews, make up a big part of the Chinese diaspora, and dominate the economies of Taiwan, Hongkong, Thailand, Malaysia, Indonesia, Singapore and Filipines. These dialect groups are all from poor fringe coastal regions of southern China, though the Hakkas always believed they have royal northern bloodlines, and migrated south when northern China was invaded. The poverty of these regions resulted in a tradition of emigration and entrepreneurship. \_ That's nice. So which group has the prettiest women? \_ Are you angry because even they have a job, while you don't? \_ Are you angry because they have a job, while you don't? \_ I'm not angry. I thought it was a funny writing piece. I hope the recent Chinese immigrants assimulate into my country and lead productive satisfying lives but something tells me they won't. \_ You are easily amused. \_ That's what people always say about new immigrants. What usually happens is the first generation doesn't assimilate very much and ends up middle class but their kids do fine. \_ I would settle for "ending up middle class". Nothing wrong with that. \_ Not to Chinese. Haven't you noticed how hard they make their kids study and they all have to be doctors and lawyers? Middle class is failure. \_ Yeah but 1st generation don't end up doctors and lawyers, but a helluva lot better than when they were FOB. \_ Actually, I've been meeting quite a few first generation doctors and lawyers lately. Seems like they have made it easier for foreigners to become doctors in the US. This is bad. These jobs should be reserved for Americans, and first generation foreigners should stick to restaurant work. \- i think the AMAs efforts to make it harder for indian and russian doctors to practice here is well known. \_ Foreign doctors need to pass the same board exams everyone else does to practice here. \- See e.g. particularly section on physicians: http://www.cepr.net/publications/professional_supplement.htm I didnt know about the clinical skills exam that is only given in Philadelphia. Also, a tricky part of this is how to "distinguish" between american who went to foreign medical schools because they couldnt get into med school here and foreigners trained in their home country who want to come here. in addition of visa-obtaining issues, and language testing, there is the "fifth pathway" program. I am not an expert on this but it's well understood that self-regulating bodies like the ABA and AMA engage in "income protection" plans under the guise of "public safety" [yes, irconic reference to french rev], see e.g. the nolo v texas case. BTW, I am not suggesting foreign trained doctors are as well trained, but this is an area where the outcomes area heavily dictated by regulation rather the "free mkt". http://www.cepr.net/publications/professional_supplement.htm \_ Sorry but those comments just spew of complete ignorance. If 1st generation-ers are competent and contribute in a meaningful way, there should be nothing wrong with that. Do you somehow believe you should have natural right to having everything spoon fed to you? \_ I hope they do well too, but I like them doing their own thing, which adds diversity and spice to my country. \_ Sorry, but I have more sympathy for our kids who get sent to places like Vietnam and Iraq, and come back missing a leg, a ball, and half a dick, angry and confused as to how they got their arse kicked by 80 pounds, 4'9" vietnamese peasant hags and stone age desert tribes. Just browse through the "Names of the Dead" ... 18 years old ... 21 years old ... all tender, fresh and innocent. What a waste. \_ Good one. It's sad to see our brave soldiers maimed there and then come back to the states and wait on the freeway with the sign "Vietnam War Soldier Spare a Dime." In addition I have to say that these tiny little Viet soldiers on the other side did quite a bit of damage despite their lack of equipments and trainings. If tiny little men can do big jobs, it makes you go hmmmmm. Lastly on my rant I'd like to commend these tiny little men who reproduce really hot Vietnamese women \_ I am glad you've found solace with tiny little men. Vietnamese girls are not my cup of tea, but hey, if they are a fit for you, whom am I to object. At least you didn't become a pedophile. \_ If it weren't for tiny little women there would be more pedofiles in America. -op \_ thanks for sharing your sexual disposition with us. \_ I don't think they were confused. I think it's pretty clear that a 4'9" 80 lbs stone age vietnamese desert tribe peasant can kill you when armed with modern weapons in a proxy war fighting on their own turf. Angry? Probably. Confused? Not likely. A waste? Yes, of course, big time. \_ Maybe I didn't phrase it right, but I meant confused in the sense of "WTF am I doing in this hellhole getting killed?! I don't belong here. I want my mom!" \_ Not the ones I know who have been in combat. \_ Really? How then did so many of them beoome depressed, suicidal, alcohol and drug addicts, etc.? \_ What is "so many"? And how does that percent compare to the general population who was never in the military? Obviously it is an anecdotal sample set but all the ones I know are normal people who came back and got on with their lives. We've sent millions overseas in the 20th century. Our society is not overrun by millions of depressed, suicidal, alcoholic drug addicted ex-soldiers. (But is overrun by millions of depressed, drug addicted civilians). \_ "percent"? "general population"? "sample set"? Sorry, this is too hard. I am American. I watch teevee, and teevee says they're depressed and suicidal. \_ You are right. I am wrong. |
| 2006/3/28-29 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Computer/Rants] UID:42497 Activity:nil |
3/28 "This nonsense of 'jobs Americans won't do' is an age-old lie that's
been around as long as the republic. Prior to the illegal alien
problem, the same excuse was applied to the perpetuation of slavery.
Georgia Representative James Jackson rose in opposition to a Quaker
petition to end slavery in 1790 by fuming 'that rice cannot be brought
to market without these people [slaves].' William Loughton Smith added
that slavery was an economic precondition for prosperity of his
constituents, as author Joseph Ellis noted in his book, Founding
Brothers . 'Such is the state of agriculture,' Smith said, 'that no
white man would perform the tasks.' "
http://www.philvalentine.com/IllegalAlienMyth.htm
\_ this is stupid. everyone knows 'jobs Americans won't do' means
'jobs Americans won't do at the current wages'. There will be
people willing to do almost anything if the price is high enough.
\_ And yet that keeps getting dropped in conversation. And people
keep acting as if "Americans" won't do the jobs under any
circumstance.
\_ yea, but the question is "why pay a higher wage when
someone is willing to do it at a lower wage?". It's
laws vs economics. The biggest loser? Probably black
males whose plight has been deteriorating even during
the prosperous 90s. Unemployment isn't high for other
ethnic and gender groups. If you didn't graduate from
high school, yes, your livelihood would likely be
affected by the many illegal aliens, but otherwise,
you likley won't be affected and may even benefit from a
cost standpoint.
\_ This post seems like a non sequitur to me. The point
is that the employment at the lower wages is illegal,
and talking about "jobs Americans won't do" implies
all sorts of things which is why people say that. I've
seen it raised on the motd, as in "how are you gonna
get fresh produce???!11/??"
\_ yea, and slavery was legal, so please explain
how the comparison with slavery makes sense.
\_ slavery was an abomination and is now outlawed
everywhere in the world but places you'd never set
foot in. what does the legal status of slavery in
this country 150+ years ago in _some_ states have to
do with whether or not slavery is ok or the price of
berry picking or anything else today?
\_ exactly, thus the quote op posted is stupid.
\_ So the point is 'Jobs American's won't do (for how little we want
to pay )'. However, if the employery were to offer to pay what
it would take to get Americans to work them, would those jobs
still exist?
\_ If they need to exist. Some would and some would not. The
net effect is more jobs for "Americans", although perhaps
fewer jobs overall.
\_ nah, it will further increase cost of doing business in
the US, and trigger more outsourcing, and moving of
factories and jobs overseas.
\_ You can't outsource most of these kinds of jobs or
that would've already been done. These people are
maids, day laborers, farm hands, and the like. Some
businesses will fold because of the increased cost of
doing business and some won't. Mostly, I think it
will be the same amount of $$$ spread out across
fewer employees in aggregate.
\_ I don't know. The janitorial and cafeteria
people at my company are all hispanics. So are
the people keeping the company's lawn looking good,
as are the movers, drivers, etc. Cost of
doing business will increase as living costs
increase. Nobody is talking about outsourcing
these jobs, but the rise in cost of doing
business. As it is, we aren't having an
easy time competing with China and India.
\_ Well, someone above *did* write "trigger more
outsourcing" and "mov[e]... factories and jobs
overseas." I imagine the cafeteria staff at your
company is not comprised of illegal aliens.
Gardeners may be. I know that it costs a lot more to
have a gardener in places w/o a lot of illegals,
even in places where the cost of living is much
lower. So fewer people will have gardeners and the
gardeners that are hired will make more money, but
will probably be better gardeners. I know an
old-time tree trimmer and his company has been
driven to the brink of bankruptcy by competition
with illegal aliens who aren't arborists, but who
charge 1/3 the price for the work such as they
do it. The cost of doing business will increase,
but so will the average wage. More money will
stay in the USA, instead of being sent to family
abroad. Somehow Europe manages to stay competitive
despite higher wages and a higher standard of
living. Competing with China and India on price
alone is a recipe for disaster, anyway. Maybe
people wouldn't need to shop at Wal-Mart for
Chinese-made crap if they had more money in
their pockets.
\_ Yes, the costs will rise. Or they won't. And we'll
go on with life.
\_ life's pretty good as it is today.
\_ life was pretty good with slavery.
\_ slaves did not come voluntarily. |
| 2006/3/27-28 [Politics/Foreign/Europe, Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:42481 Activity:kinda low |
3/27 Poll asks if "the free enterprise system and free market economy is the
best system on which to base the future of the world".
China: 74% agree
US: 71% agree
France: 36% agree
"Large companies have too much influence over our national govt"
France: 86% agree
US: 85% agree
China: 47% agree
http://csua.org/u/fcp
\_ this is a reflection of these nations' standard of living gradient
\_ Or their competitiveness.
\_ this is a reflection of these nations' standard of living gradient\
\_ Or their competitiveness.
\_ Pretty funny to see a higher acceptance in China than the US...
\_ even more funny when these guys are calling China the Communist
evil empire. |
| 2006/3/17 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:42295 Activity:high |
3/17 http://www.othercinema.com/otherzine/?issueid=15&articleid=38 Hu Jintao presented a number of new initiatives, which are very important for all the people of China. \_ "The goal is to produce white/asian babies of IQ 120 or higher." Assuming IQ is averaged among two couples, and assuming Hu's sending outstanding Chinamen which we can presume to be IQ 140 or higher, then these Chinamen need to breed with a lot of white women that have IQ 100 or higher. Isn't that hard to do considering the dearth of smart white blond women, and secondly the obvious abundance but distracting ditzy airheaded valley girls and blondes in the heart of religious Go-George-Bush America who are obviously lower than 100 IQ? \_ Please tell me this is a parody. My craziness sensor for what China would actually attempt to do leads me to believe there is a chance it is not. \_ "Hu Jintao then revealed that on its next mission, the Shenzhou spacecraft will carry 200 kilograms of the purest and highest quality Chinese sperm" \_ This, of course, is Hu Jintao's sperm. He has been quite busy in preparation. (By the way, shouldn't they also send up some eggs, so the ETs can reconstruct some humans? |
| 2006/3/7-8 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:42119 Activity:high |
3/6 Government monitors spending patterns as a flag for
possible terrorist activities: http://csua.org/u/f5u
\_ A friend of mine sent money overseas to his family in Asia. It
was only $10,000USD but it's a lot in that part of the country.
A day later he got a call from the FBI asking what the money's for.
I thought the US gov only cared about money coming in (to fund
fundamentalists) but I guess they care about everything.
\_ Where in Asia? My wife sent back $40k (inheritance) from Japan,
but I don't think that's that unusual for Japan <> USA.
\_ YMMV. My wife and I have received >> $10k from Hong Kong
\_ YMMV. My wife and I have received >> $10m from Hong Kong
with nary a peep from Govco.
\_ YMMV. My wife and I have repatriated >> $10m from Hong Kong
with nary a peep from Govco. --cpatten
\_ $10m? WTF are you doing posting on soda's motd?
\_ Dear motd re-editor, case sensitivity matters.
\_ I think "where in asia?" is a valid question in this case.
\_ I write one $1k check per month from my B of A checking account
to my dad's B of A checking account, and he regularly withdraws
the money in Hong Kong. We've been doing it for over seven
years, and neither of us have ever heard from the FBI.
\_ oooh HK, I bet the US government's really afraid of
angry yellow Cantonese Muslims trying to do something
little yellow Cantonese Muslims trying to do something
bad to us good Christians.
\- I endorse the OLD MANDARIN MUSLIM CHINESE RESTAURANT
\_ now you are making me hungry. sour cabbage mutton
soup clay pot and thick fat breads. yummy!
\- you may enjoy ball hot pot then:
http://csua.org/u/f60 |
| 2006/3/2-5 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Health/Women] UID:42075 Activity:nil |
3/2 sham acupuncture is as effective as traditional chinese acupuncture
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20060302/hl_nm/acupuncture_dc
hahahaha that is hilarious.
\- Sham acupuncture: Ancient Chinese Secret. |
| 2006/3/2-4 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Domestic/Election] UID:42060 Activity:nil |
3/1 http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060301/ap_on_fe_st/china_spitting_crackdown Beijing is launching a campaign to stamp out widespread public spitting in an effort to clean up its image for the 2008 Olympics. It also promised to allow spitting after the Olympics is over. |
| 2006/3/1-4 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/Asia/Others] UID:42054 Activity:nil |
3/1 ACM has produced a significant new report on the impact
of offshoring/outsourcing on the IT industry:
http://www.acm.org/globalizationreport
Executive Summary and Findings:
http://www.acm.org/globalizationreport/summary.htm
Bottom line: not nearly as bad as some had thought.
http://CCNMoney.com article
http://money.cnn.com/2006/02/23/news/economy/jobs_it_offshoring |
| 2006/3/1-4 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Finance] UID:42043 Activity:nil |
3/1 Private equity funds are raping people, laying off thousands
and spreading enough misery around the people who actually
have to work for a living before our Chinese masters
really screw with us, and all the San Francisco Chronicle
can do is send some dude to Google and photograph ultra rich
nerds eating? Fuck.
\_ KILL THE BIRDS
\_ Spew much?
\_ Amusing but if you're using the SF Comical as your primary source
of serious news you get what you pay for. For 25 cents/day I got
the comics and their trimmed down version of AP news on BART. |
| 2006/2/23-27 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Health/Men] UID:41980 Activity:nil 74%like:41979 |
2/23 How come mainland Chinese people say number 1 as "Yao1" instead of
the standard "Yi1"? Also why do they say "we" as "zhai2 men"
instead of the standard "wo3 men"? Are there subtle semantic
differences?
\_ First of all, this is not a "mainland China" thing. The orgin
of this prounciation came from military, as they discover
the prounciation of one and seven (yi1 and qi1) sounds too similar
over the radio. Note that this is not some sort of cryptic code,
as military in Taiwan uses the same prounciation as well :p
It merely a military way of prounciating number in a more distincted
manner: 1 become yao1, 7 become guai3, 0 become dong4, etc.
Americans do something similar with prounciation of alphabets over
the radio too.
There is a subtle differences between "zai men" and "wo men."
"zai men" is a more narrowly defined and strictly used when
yourself as a person is included. So, a wrong way to use "zai men"
is in the context of, let say "we the nation of Chinese..."
Having said that, "zai men" is more of an oral lingo (mostly
in Northern part of China) and should not be used in formal writing.
- kngharv
\_ Do you know what does "lao4 ke'er1" mean? I heard it
said b4 but don't know what it means. |
| 2006/2/15 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:41857 Activity:kinda low |
2/15 http://www.iht.com/articles/2006/02/15/business/yuan.php China says the US should relax export restrictions of high tech if it wants to fix the trade deficit. \_ "In a complex and challenging time, the road of isolationism and protectionism may seem broad and inviting -- yet it ends in danger and decline." -GWB \_ What? Are they tired of stealing everything? \_ china's trade surplus with the US is overrated. most of the exported goods have componenets made in other asian countries. china only does the finally assembling. that is why china has a big trade deficit vis-a-vis other asian countries. essentially the other asian countries "exported" their trade surplus with the US to China. The overall US trade deficit with asia also decreased recently. so don't blame china, blame our wonderful allies like japan, taiwan, south korea, singapore, etc. \- bilateral trade deficits dont mean anything. meanings of aggregate trade deficits open to debate. \_ the other thing is many of the products are made by US companies in China, and these companies will send the profits back to US (or are owned by US investors, anyway). \_ trade deficit with S.Korea, EU, Japan, Mexico and Canada also reached record high. I think it's time to pressure these countries to re-evaulate their currencies. \_ yes, these countries (except Mexico) make products that compete with us, unlike China. We should keep the yuan cheap so we can buy cheap stuff, and rein in inflation. |
| 2006/2/8-10 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Industry/Startup] UID:41774 Activity:low |
2/8 Shame! I'm glad I don't work there anymore.
http://today.reuters.com/news/newsarticle.aspx?type=internetNews&storyid=2006-02-09T030219Z_01_PEK27612_RTRUKOC_0_US-CHINA-YAHOO.xml&rpc=22
\_ Did you get rich from your stock options though?
\_ No. I got my paycheck and quit after a short time because
working there sucked. All the dirty stuff came out after I
quit and only makes me feel that much better about having quit,
so I don't have to convince myself everyday that my place of
work isn't evil.
\_ Where do you work now? |
| 2006/2/8-10 [Politics/Foreign, Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:41773 Activity:low |
2/8 http://money.cnn.com/2006/02/08/technology/yahoo_china/index.htm YHOO more fucked up than GOOG "The choice is not whether to comply with law enforcement demands for information. The choice is whether to remain in the country. We believe that the Internet is a positive force in China." -Mary Osako, Yahoo! Director of Communications \_ What don't you agree with in that quote? That makes sense to me... I'm not talking about the case as a whole, just that quote. --dbushong \_ Well, I think it would have been more honest of Ms. Osako to say: "By complying with law enforcement demands, we can remain in the country, and we believe that Yahoo!'s presence is a positive force in China." What she has said reeks of dishonesty and marketing bullshit, IMO. \_ ...if you say so. \_ Do you expect them to say the really honest thing "By complying with law enforcement demands, we can remain in country X, and we believe that Yahoo!'s presence in country X is going to bring in huge profits for the company. If it just so happens that Yahoo!'s presence is a positive force in country X, that's good."? \_ nah, i like my quote better. it offers the "hope" of being honest \_ i want a plausible lie, not one that says, "you fucks, why are you making me lie, i'm going to say something ridiculous so you know i'm lying" |
| 2006/2/1 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Troll/Jblack] UID:41638 Activity:nil |
2/1 Where is jblack these days?
\_ Why do you hate America?
\_ Obviously you've never served.
\_ Are you chinese? Do you understand the effect
the opium trade had on China?
\_ I bet BUD DAY understands the effects of the opium trade!
\_ Not after a GUN DUEL he won't.
\_ um, RIDE BIKE! |
| 2006/1/25-26 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:41510 Activity:kinda low |
1/24 "Google Agrees to Censor Results in China" http://csua.org/u/erf \_ "Do no evil!" \_ if you want to do business there, then, follow the local law. if you want to bring changes there... well... that tend to be less profitable. \_ So why don't they follow the "local law" here? \_ [learn to indent] \_ They do. They have a reasonable belief that the American government's request for search records is illegal. If they lose their court case they WILL hand over the searches. That's what law is all about. \_ They are. Refusing to comply with a request can be done within the law. \_ Those who would sacrifice integrity for a little temporary prosperity deserve neither integrity nor prosperity. \_ This is all a sideshow, meant to distract you. Someone should really be asking Sergey: "What will you do if the Chinese government asks you provide identifying information for specific searches, or the capability to obtain thereof, or have you done so already?" |
| 2006/1/23-25 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:41487 Activity:nil |
1/23 Is there a URL that can tell me what the proper strokes are
to write Chinese characters? MS Chinese recognizer doesn't
recognize words when you write with wrong strokes. Thanks.
\_ it's going to be a bit hard to find those. There are
certain stroke rules. and beyond that, everything follows
the rule. Chinese tend to take these rules for granted so
there is hardly any literature about it. |
| 2006/1/19-21 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Computer/Rants] UID:41439 Activity:nil |
1/20 http://finance.yahoo.com/columnist/article/futureinvest/2237 India and China to enjoy prosperity for the next few decades. \_ Possibly. Or possibly not. Especially in China's case. They have some serious issues with food supply/arable land. *SEVERE* water pollution and a few zillion less than entirely happy peasants in a constant state of low level revolt. India is a better bet now that they appear to have resolved their issues with Pakistan such that nuclear war isn't very likely and they're working on modernising their internal structure, legal system and education system. They are still a third world country by any measure but are working on it. \_ Just OOC, not disagreeing with you, what would pessimists have said in a similar vein about the prospects for the US in, say, 1940? (and _why_ would they have ended up being wrong) \- IMHO, the india-pak threat was never both of them going to nuclear war, it was pakistan having a meltdown. and that is still possible and that is a problem for more than india. \_ The US became a power because of its natural resources. While China and India also have lots of natural resources, their populations are much larger. |
| 2006/1/16-18 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:41384 Activity:moderate |
1/16 Life in China
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/16/international/asia/16cnd-china.html
"'The police arrived at 8 p.m., and then started beating people from 9
p.m., trying to disperse the crowd,' said a schoolteacher who spoke by
telephone, giving her name only as Yang. 'When this happened, the crowd
got very angry and lots of people picked up stones on the ground and
threw them at the policemen. After being attacked, policemen were
furious, they just beat up everyone, using their batons.'"
\_"The police are not here to create disorder,
they're here to preserve disorder."
\_ "Indeed, demonstrating residents of Panlong village said their anger
had been sparked by a government land acquisition program they had
been led to believe in 2003 was part of a construction project to
build a superhighway connecting the nearby city of Zhuhai with
Beijing. Later, the villagers learned the land was being re-sold to
developers to set up special chemical and garment industrial zones
in the area." This doesn't just sound like China...
in the area." When life (here) imitates China...
\_"The police are not here to create disorder, they're here to
preserve disorder."
\_ "Indeed, demonstrating residents of Panlong village said their
anger had been sparked by a government land acquisition program
they had been led to believe in 2003 was part of a construction
project to build a superhighway connecting the nearby city of
Zhuhai with Beijing. Later, the villagers learned the land was
being re-sold to developers to set up special chemical and
garment industrial zones in the area." When life (here)
imitates China...
\_ my friend in Beijing told me that he witnessed a protest
turned mobs. What he found amusing was that the mobs, with no
appearent organization structure, burn the police station to the
ground but left surrounding shop intacted. No looting occured at
all.
\_ Sounds like the Volleyball Court riots. |
| 2006/1/12-17 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:41365 Activity:kinda low |
1/12 http://www.economist.com/books/displaystory.cfm?story_id=5381851 Chinse world map discovered. Wow! I thought Gavin Menzies is a kook, but it seems like he may have a case. Chinese might have circumnavigated the world and "discovered" the Americas before Columbus, and the western maps might have been derived from the Chinese sources. \_ Even if the Chinese did already know that the earth was round, would they have had the sailing ability, sans steam engines, to have found and map Antartica by 1418? \_ not to mention the Arctic Sea \_ The Greeks knew the world was round and even calculated the circumference. That doesn't mean they visited the Americas. \_ Wow! URL please. \_ Google: greeks world round \_ Better: Eratosthenes \_ very cool link. Thanks. \_ I would like to add one thing. The common notion is that Chinese were looking for "barbarians" to pay tribute to the Ming empire. AFAIK, Chinese were never interested in "barbarians." They only interested in foreign nations has decent degree of civilization. This is one of the reason why Chinese were never interested in Austrilia eventhough they are well aware of its existence since the Song dynasty (12-13th century AD). \_ More to the point, they were only interested in either trade or plunder. Australia offered neither. \_ Nah, they were neither interested in trade nor in plunder. \_ Yeah, they were interested in both trade and plunder. \_ Ahhh, but what about ASS-plunder? --!aspo |
| 2006/1/10-12 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:41332 Activity:nil 85%like:41328 |
1/10 China to sell $, buy Euro and Yen:
http://tinyurl.com/8tt7a tiny URLed
\_ This would be good for American workers, but may not be so good for
people planning to buy a home.
\_ Good. We're entirely too comfortable with China.
\_ And too comfortable with dollars actually buying something
\_ It's more like you are too comfortable with deficit spending. |
| 2006/1/10 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:41328 Activity:high 85%like:41332 |
1/10 China to sell $, buy Euro and Yen:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/01/09/AR2006010901042_pf.html
\_ This would be good for American workers, but may not be so good for
people planning to buy a home.
\_ Good. We're entirely too comfortable with China.
\_ And too comfortable with dollars actually buying something |
| 2006/1/6-9 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:41263 Activity:nil |
1/6 Last 'Gang of Four' member dies
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/4586896.stm
\_ I don't understand: didn't the group that this group represented
effectively "win"? Why was he still in prison until recently?
--historyless
\_ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gang_of_four
\_ ah hah. thanks! should have RTFWP.
\_ That's too bad, they were a pretty good punk band in the 80s.
How did they all die so young?
\_ I knew Vlissides was dead, but I thought Gamma, Helm, and Johnson
were all very much alive.
\_ Good fucking riddance. May he enjoy doing snap rolls in his
murderous commie hell. -John
\_ China really should designate end of cultural revolution as a
national holiday. |
| 2006/1/6-9 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:41262 Activity:nil |
1/6 Microsoft Shuts Down Chinese Blog
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060106/ap_on_hi_te/china_blog_shutdown
Commie Gates. |
| 2005/12/19-21 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:41082 Activity:nil |
12/19 http://www.chung-hoon.navy.mil USS Chung-Hoon: US destroyer named after Chinese-American Rear Admiral. \_ Is "Imua e na Koa Kai" Chinese? It sounds like Japanes to me. \_ It sounds hawaiian, actually. |
| 2005/12/19-21 [Politics/Domestic/SocialSecurity, Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:41081 Activity:high |
12/19 http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051220/ap_on_go_co/congress_high_tech_visas Bye bye high-tech VISA, HELLLLLLOOOO outsourcing! Hello CS majors who are still in school, it's not too late to change your major. If you already graduated, it's not too late to go into other useful things, like real-estate. Fuck CS. Fuck tech. \_ Let me ask you this question. Do you have problem with GM workers with a high school degree making $60-80k a year with full benefit? You commands a higher wage than China and India, you need to think about what makes you worth your pay. If you can't compete, then find something else to do and stop blaming everyone. \_ Um. High-tech VISAs are a form of outsourcing. \_ My preference would be to allow more visas especially for US educated foreign students, but to slow down or educated foreign students, but at the same time, to slow down or stop "real" outsourcing - the moving of jobs overseas. This will attract the best talents from abroad, maintain critical mass of talented workers here, and also force companies to invest in their US based workers. US companies should be given incentive not to outsource but to adapt and move up the technology food chain, especially in critical industries. Outsourcing means companies do well in the short term while US workers lose their jobs. In the long term, however, it means transfer and loss of critical technology to countries like China and India. Unfortunately, US business leaders mostly have short term views. China, OTOH, plan for the long term, and almost always request technology and knowledge transfer before agreeing to a business partnership with foreign companies. -!op partnership with foreign companies. The way it's going, US will have fewer and fewer engineers and even scientists, while the outsource recipient countries will have more and more, and they will be doing more and more interesting work, while there will be less and less interest for students in the US, be they American or foreign students, to do science and engineering, and less incentive for those who did, to stay here. -!op stop "real" outsourcing - the moving of jobs overseas. This will attract the best talents from abroad, maintain critical mass of talented workers here, and also force companies to invest in their US based workers. US companies should be given incentive not to outsource but to adapt and move up the technology food chain, especially in critical industries. Outsourcing means companies do well in the short term while US workers lose their jobs. In the long term, however, it means transfer and loss of critical technology to countries like China and India. Unfortunately, US business leaders mostly have short term views. China, OTOH, plan for the long term, and almost always request technology and knowledge transfer before agreeing to a business partnership with foreign companies. The way it's going, US will have fewer and fewer engineers and even scientists, while the outsource recipient countries will have more and more, and they will be doing more and more interesting work, while there will be less and less interest for students in the US, be they American or foreign students, to do science and engineering, and less incentive for those who did, to stay here. -!op \- it may not be a matter of short term views but elite interest diverging from rank and file interest. \_ Are you seriously going to claim that it's in the longterm best interest of owners of American companies to have America lose its competitive edge in science and engineering? That's ridiculous. I would argue that American science is so good for the world that anything that hurts American science hurts the whole world at all economic levels. This is not a zero sum game. \- i'm not suggesting it is 0 sum. i simply think if you have say $10m today, you are not especially affected by say the dollar weakening, poor public schools, pensions failing, social security having problems etc. i.e. people who "get their own" early, can route around a lot of problems in the future. rather than thinking only temporally, you might consider thing "spatially" ... meaning you stand where you sit. more formally some of the incentive problems are those that come from principal-agent issues. i think part of the issue is corporate governance not just globalization. globalization in mfgring has been going on for decades. i also think factors like amaerica's 0 agg private saving rate are going to play a role in shaping the future as well as "globalization". \- oh and i think your discussion has some status quo biases. like when you say "american science declining hurts everybody". well you are a poor person exposed to say cholera and malaria and poor nutrition and no clean water supply, advances in ass-related plastic surgery or botox or the erectile dysfunction treatment meds arent your priorities. yes i relalize a lot of important research behind the Green Revolution or techniques for purifying water with UV and such have come out of the US, but it's also true relatively frivolous stuff is often vastly better rewarded than stuff that kills poor people. again compare the spending on ED drugs [i think there were something like a dozen in the pipeline [npi] in the last couple of decades, but almost no work on common orphan diseases. much of the economic logic behind free trade and free movement of the factors of production and capital also apply to free movement of labor, but nobody is seriously proposing something like that to max overall efficiency. if anything the recent EU negotiations over the CAP/refund and the US pushing IP negotiations over the CAP and the US pushing IP issues in the WTO negotiations show how far people will go to protect their parochial interest and ignore all the ideology when it doesnt go their way. just out of curiosity, do you drive and american [sic] car? do you have an american TV ... oh never mind ... an american stereo? TV ... oh never mind ... and american stereo? where are your shoes made? do you support negotiations over the CAP/refund and the US pushing IP issues in the WTO negotiations show how far people will go to protect their parochial interest and ignore all the ideology when it doesnt go their way. just out of curiosity, do you drive and american [sic] car? do you have an american TV ... oh never mind ... an american stereo? where are your shoes made? do you support sever penalites for those employing illegal aliens, or should we just keep deporting the persons themselves? \_ Who says that science and technology will decline in the US? Why wouldn't they increase as Americans spend more effort on research and diving into more technically challenging roles to become more competitive than an outsourced counterpart? to become more competitve than an outsourced counterpart? \_ Because the competitive advantage from the discoveries you have made, that is the fruits of your labour, will be knowledge transferred to your counterpart in China and India, and they are 10x cheaper than you, and just as smart as you. With globalization, there is now no incentive for companies to build up a technology gap between US and foreign countries, there is no longer much incentive to invest in technology development in between US and foreign countries, there is less and less incentive to invest in technology development in the US. Also, China and India are constantly encouraging US companies to invest in R&D over there with all kinds of tax incentives and business partner- with all kinds of tax breaks and business partner- ship lures. Is this bad for the world? I don't know. What I do know, is that it's good for China and India, but bad for the US. Anything to do with research and that is "technical challenging" is not hard to but bad for the US. Anything to do with research or that is "technically challenging" is not hard to outsource. All you need is top local talent, of which India and China has plenty, a technology transfer so they get up to speed, which US companies are happy to do, and lots of money for the research facilities, which US companies are happy to invest. \_ Says who? All evidence I've seen so far shows that outsourced work, while cheaper, is significantly inferior too. Outsourced code sucks. Speedy communication still remains an issue. If you're good at what you do, then I maintain that you're not expendible and your job won't be shipped overseas. If that isn't the case, then it's time for you to improve your skills and make yourself more marketable. \_ Even with outsourcing, I'd like to know which major should one choose other than business administration or engineering in order to have the jobs with comparable salaries that are as readily available as in CS. \_ I am in 3G wireless infrastructure, and my employer is systematically moving the whole division to China. It doesn't matter if I am good or bad. Even if I am good, I would be good or bad. Either way, I would be forced to either move to a different field, move to a different part of the country, stay move to a different part of the country, or stay on and do peripheral type work. As for foreign coders, it is the same as over here, some are idiots, some are good, but they are improving fast. And of course, 3G wireless has lots of military applications, pretty kool for China. pretty kool for China to have a large pool of engineers with experience in this area. \_ Even with outsourcing, I'd like to know which major should one choose other than business administration or engineering in order to have the jobs with comparable salaries that are as readily available as in CS. \_ Anything that gets you into law school or medical school. \- self-regulating indistries are in better positions to protect themselves. there was a large influx of indian and russian doctors in the 70s i believe and i assume the AMA either ahead of time or in response took steps to keep them from competing. typically they do so by insisiting on certifications [we are here to protect you] and then defining the area of practice very broadly. see e.g. the nolo v texas case. my understanding is dental hyginists must work for a dentist and cannot operate a $19.95 only-teeth-cleaning service. i believe there are regulations on opticians as well. civil engineers, ME, software engineers either missed the boat or were never in a position to similarly dictate competition terms. \_ Actually, engineering is probably a good choice if you want to go to law school. IP lawyers (patent and copyright) are generally paid more and have better working conditions that the pol sci majors. \_ I can feel nothing but pity for people chosing majors based ONLY on how much they're gonna make. It's gonna take 5 to 10 possibly best years of your life spent on learning something that you're not passionate about before he/she can even start earning money. Of course, most of them are probably too dumb to make it into and through the medical or law school or a rigorous CS program like at UCB anyways but I pity both kinds. \_ Law school doesn't require being smart. \_ Just learn to say "would you like fries with that?" like all th PolySci/English majors have been doing for decades. \_ Actually, I say "Have you rtfm?" these days. -English major |
| 2005/12/19-20 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:41069 Activity:moderate |
12/18 Dear Chinese people. In what context do you consider yourselves
to be Han-ren, Tan-ren, Manchu, Hwa-ren, and finally Zho-Quo-ren?
\_ Huh? I consider myself an American.
\_ You're most likely an ignorant, apathetic, and
pathetic ABC banana. And no, I'm not a FOB, thank you.
\_ bad troll.
\_ I prefer the term Twinkie.
\_ If you don't even consider yourself an American, then how
can you expect other people to treat you like one?
\_ Exactly! I've been wanting to say this to my uncles and
aunts and in-laws. But I dare not since they are senior
to me. BTW I am a 16-yr FOB and I'm not a citizen yet.
\_ OTOH, please don't mis-characterize all first
generation immigrants to be like your uncles and aunts.
\_ Most people consider themselves Han, eventhough a lot of them are
not aware of their minority ancestory. Certain Last names are
popular with minorities and thus, if you have that last name, there
is a good chance that somewhere in history you were once a minority.
Example: Jin, Bao, Mu (Mu Rong), Ma (Mohammad). Due to 2000
years of mixing, the notion of being a pure Han has become a very
silly idea. That is why we have the term "Zhong Guo Ren."
In Taiwan, pro-independent minded people demonized the word
"Zhong Guo." They want to replace it with "Hua," which is even
more silly because even though the Han culture originalted from
the tribe of Hua 3000-4000 years ago, Han has constitute a lot of
minor tribes other than "Hua."
So, in a way, being a Chinese has more to do with the Han-dominated
culture than what runs in your blood. This notio of "define race by
culture than color of skin" only start to surface in the Western
world sometime toward the end of 20th century.
\_ i guess no one would think about this kind of stuff unless
he or she is a purist. as in hk, i think 99% would tell you
they are hongkonger or chinese.
\_ The young Chinese pianist Lang Lang is a Manchu. In fact he's a
distant descendant of the royal family of the Qin Dynasty.
\_ so is the actress/singer wang2 fei1. I have a acquaintance
whose last name is wan2 yan2, and falls under the yellow
banner of the eight manchu banners.
\_ ohh my gosh, minority exists... so what?
\_ it's often kool to be minority these days. |
| 2005/12/9-11 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:40949 Activity:nil |
12/9 "20 Reported Killed as Chinese Unrest Escalates"
http://csua.org/u/e90 [nyt]
\_ This is apparently just outside Shanwei:
http://csua.org/u/e92
Not too far away from Hong Kong.
\_ My favorite part is "there were 74,000 riots or other significant
public disturbances in 2004". Wow.
\_ Only 20? In a country of 1.6(?) billion.... |
| 2005/12/8-11 [Transportation/Airplane, Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:40925 Activity:nil |
12/8 Anyone who flew international recently. Did the check-in luggage limit
got decreased from 70 pound to 50 pound? I'll be flying to China soon.
\_ Great. Encourage more people to carry on luggage that they should
be checking in.
\_ Found it, it is 50 pounds now. Damn.
\_ I want a passenger + luggage < 250 lbs limit NOW
\_ I've been asked my weight when buying plane tickets before. No,
I'm not a fatass, but in single engine planes every pound
matters.
\_ This is for fuel calculation though. -John
\- when did it change? i checked +65lbs last week of Nov.
although i heard something about this the ticket i looked
at had the old weight limits.
\_ Why?
\_ So I get more luggage allowance. It doesn't matter if the
airplane is burning fuel to move fat or luggage. Make the
400 pounders pay up instead of penalizing the rest of us.
\_ Yeah, I just can't wait for all those 110 pound women to
start bringing an extra 70 pounds of shit on the plane
to make up the difference with us 180 pound guys.
\_ To hell with you. I'm 7' tall and 250lbs, and I'm still under-
weight. Eat a sandwich and get over it. --erikred
\_ I travel very frequently, and it's always been 32kg due to US
labor laws. I hope you live in the big ciy in China, though,
because domestic flight within China has maximum weight of
something like 20 or 25kg per lugguage, *ONE* lugguage per person.
So, if you intent to transfer, don't bring too much stuff! |
| 2005/12/6-7 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/Taiwan, Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:40873 Activity:kinda low |
12/6 I am going to Taiwan in January. Haven't been there in a very long
time. I need to bring some gifts, but can't think of much that's
either uniquely available here or significantly cheaper here. I
need to buy gifts for kids, cousins in their 20s, and also lots of
aunts and uncles. What do people bring when they go back to
Asia? Ideas and suggestions? Please help!
\_ Bring back nice traditional wife from rural China since most
Taiwanese women have Westernized and modernized, meaning they
don't cook, they don't clean, and they bitch all day.
\_ You mean Taiwanese women are more like Hong Kong women now?
\_ 2 months ago my sister had to bring back 150 bottles of Centrum
Silver we bought from Costco. I really don't understand it.
\_ Centrum vitamins. At least my parents did 20 years ago... -oj
\_ Hmm, my mom still does that.
\_ Beef jerky or dried mangoes from Costco.
\_ Also pistachios from Costco. My dad buys a lot of this from
Costco to bring back to Hong Kong when he visits me.
\_ We've brought viatamins and beef jerky back to Korea. Probably
the most popular thing for us has been honey. It's very
expensive in Korea, and my father-in-law loves it. They also
liked Macadamia nuts. I don't know about Taiwan, but Koreans
don't like overly sweet candy, so even chocolate covered rasins
didn't go over well. American alcohol can be good too, but
check the customs regulations. -jrleek
\_ American ginseng from Wisconsin. In Chinese medicine and culinary,
American ginseng serves different purpose than the ginseng from
American ginseng serves different purpose from the ginseng from
Korea and north China. -- yuen
\_ or some Polo / Calvin Kline shirts from Cosco. I think it's more
suitable for people in the 20s. -live in TW. |
| 2005/11/30-12/2 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:40776 Activity:nil |
11/30 I've been looking up Comcast and Adelphia to see if they play
Chinese channels. However, the descriptions only show the names
of the channel (KCSI, etc etc). How do I find out if they
play Chinese stuff? Thanks.
\_ It's a bit low tech, but you could use an audio transmission
and reception device and actually 'talk' to another human
being at one of the two companies. Do you really want to deal
with companies that support such a low tech method of primary
communication with their customer base, though?
\_ Cable phone operators might be less than savvy about the
exact details of their foreign language program choices.
\_ Are you the original poster? If so, you clearly don't
deserve an answer to your question.
\_ I once sent e-mail to Comcast asking about Jade channel (Ch262 in
Fremont) and got a reply in a couple of days. |
| 2005/11/28-29 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:40740 Activity:high |
11/27 Apex, Changhong, and the perils of doing business in China. Good
reading for those MOTDers so bullish about finding their fortune
in China. http://csua.org/u/e39 [nyt]
\_ what is your point again? those MOTDers who are so bullish about
China are as foolish as those who think China is a economic /
military threat. This is one of the reason why I am so pissed
at USA for their constant pressure on China's currency, textiles
and the trade surplus. Using texitile as an example, China may
have 5 years of competitiveness on their texitile products, yet
China was forced to bow to EU and American pressure to impose
quota on their textile product due to the fact that neither EU
nor America has bothered to phase out the texitile quota
incrementally according to the agreement reached a decade ago.
- Just came back from mainland last week
\_ Just a cautionary tale about how business deals can go very
wrong in China. Did you think China is a country governed
by the rule of law? I'm sure stuff like that happens in all
the best corrupt totalitarian states.
\_ I am sorry, if those who doesn't even have that degree
of common sense, then, he/she shouldn't do business in
China at first place. It's a wild wild west out there,
and the real tragic part is that China is not the worse
country in terms of laws, corruptions, and goverance.
If you are trying to do business in the hyper-growth
area (e.g. Vietnam), you will have to play the local rules.
Just put things in perspective, some of stuff in USA
is pretty messed up too, just that you and I have gotten
used to it and accept it as law of the universe.
\_ things are slowly improving, but at this stage, if you
are hoping to depend on the rule of law, you shouldn't
go.
\_ It's pretty hard to predict when you might suddenly
need to rely on the rule of law.
\_ rule 1: don't get into trouble with powerful
people, unless you have someone even more powerful
behind you. instead learn how to identify and
build good relationships with these bad dudes.
This is unfortunately the price of doing business
in the prc. why do you think rupert murdoch and
chris galvin spent so much time schmoozing with
chinese leaders?
\_ Apex guy lesson 1: Eventually you'll piss off
someone big enough to seriously fuck up your life.
\_ That Murdoch are Galvin are protected doesn't mean
schmucks on motd are.
\_ I'm not worried about Murdoch or Galvin. I'm
worried about the average motd schmuck.
\_ The same rule applies, except at a lower
level.
\_ That worked real well for the Apex guy.
\_ didn't apex guy run afoul of rule 1, which
is why he's in trouble?
\_ Your rule 1 is useless, since expectations
for your behavior may be unknown and may
change over time. Also, the perception
of your behavior may be unknown and
unknowable, and that perception may
also change in unknown or unknowable
ways. One the other hand, a written
set of rules agreed to by both sides
and adjuged in an impartial (or at least
predictable) way can stand the test of
time and changes in persons and
perception.
\_ can we agree that china is a location
where you cannot get rules "adjuged"
in an impartial/predictable way which
can stand the test of time and changes
in persons and perception -- if the
other player is allied with powerful
people in china and you don't have an
equivalent ally?
(btw, you could have shortened your
response to: "rule 1 sux, get a
real contract not a 3-page invoice!")
\_ Is any of this worse than, say,
Russia? How many countries in
the world have what someone used
to doing business in the U.S. would
call the "rule of law"?
\_ i don't know if it's as bad in
russia and to what degree it's
the same/different. that's
another very long thread.
but does "rule 1 is useless"
guy agree that china is
a location where [blah blah]?
\_ The World Economic Forum gives
China a corruption ranking of
71, meaning there are 70
countries less corrupt than
China.
\_ There is a difference between
"rule 1 sux" and "rule 1 is
impossible to meet over the long-
term". Rule 1 is impossible to
meet over the long-term.
\_ so what's your long-term
solution ... a detailed,
sensible contract or something
like that?
\_ The rule of law. I think
that's where this discussion
started.
\_ and how does rule 1 figure
in locations where the
rule of law is relatively
weak?
\_ We're going in circles.
Do you think it is
possible to meet rule
1 over the long-term?
\_ first you answer
my question.
how does rule 1
figure in locations
where the rule of
law is relatively
weak?
(The answer to
this question is the
core reason why
rule 1 is relevant
in the first place.)
Let me answer it for
you:
Rule 1 applies where
the rule of law is
relatively weak.
Where the rule of
law is relatively
strong, the
relevance of rule 1
decreases.
\_ now is when you make money,
not when the system matures.
as they say, "go west, young
man".
\_ Right. Because no one
makes fortunes in the
U.S. anymore.
\_ you still do, but it's
harder.
\_ I imagine that's what the
Apex guy thought too.
\_ why do you care about
long term. take your money
and run. that's how taiwanese
do business. constantly change
and adapt.
\_ Ah. I take it this means
you agree that Rule 1 is
impossible over the long-
term. When is it long-
term? Is it possible
to meet Rule 1 over the
medium term? Is it ever
possible to win a game
where the rules are hidden
and invented on the fly for
the benefit of one side?
\_ I am not sure what you
are trying to say. Can
a relationship lasts a
long time? sure. With
rule of law, you have
the law's protection.
With relationships, it
depends on how the
relationship holds. It
could be all back
stabbing and self
interest. It could be
one that lasts while it's
mutually beneficial, and
a happy parting when that
no longer holds, it could
be like you and your
best Harvard roommate
buddy with total trust,
etc.
\_ I read somewhere
that Hitler was
psychologically
incapable of hav-
ing a loving rel-
ationship!
\_ china currently is like the wild west combined with 19th century
capitalism. an uncle of mine has spent a decade and a half
there. some of the things he had to do include:
* after a plan to start a business school fell through, they had
to sneak in at night to truck out all the computers and other
invested equipment, which would otherwise not be returned to
them. people from the other side were literally chasing after
them. people from the other side were literally running after
the trucks when they left.
* because property rights laws were vague, land acquired where
their factory was to be built was problematic when beijing
their factory was to be built was problematic when it was
decided that a lot of farmlands were improperly taken away
from farmers. To avoid inspections, they had to
replant the land with a big rice padi field for a while to fool
people, until the proper permits can be worked out. Lots of
ethical questions, but the factories did eventually provide jobs
for hundreds of workers from poor inland provinces.
\_ The New York Times is biased liberal trash.
\_ except when they say Saddam has WMDs. Go Dubya!
\_ I wonder who's going to import those TVs now? |
| 2005/11/14-15 [Politics/Domestic/California, Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:40589 Activity:moderate |
11/14 http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051113/ap_on_re_us/asians_bullied Asian harassment up in other parts of the country. Time to move back to my motherland, the Bay Area, the land created by our people, for our people. -Asian \_ Funny, I experienced exactly the reverse in SF, until I got in a fight with the Korean bullies at my school--then they were nice to me. Maybe AZN bullies are just more pragmatic. -John \_ pragmatic you mean this Korean knows the chance of him relocated to ghetto or something? \_ Is "relocated to ghetto" some sort of "in" slang for "getting your ass kicked"? If so, yes. -John \_ Last week there was a news article about the same problem in Skyline High in Oakland. \_ Here's a way to solve the problem: Let the Asian community randomly select a certain percentage of kids among themselves. Force them to score low in tests and exams (by otherwise starving them, for example.) Make them go loitering instead of learning. Drop them example.) Make them to go loitering instead of learning. Drop them off at parties and lock them out of public libraries. Buy them video games instead of violins. Teach them street fighting instead of studying. This will bring down the average achievement of the community and will remove it from the bad guys' radar. example.) Make them to go loitering instead of learning. Spend time at parties instead of public libraries. Buy them video games instead of violins. Teach them street fighting instead of studying. That will bring down the average achievement of the community and will remove it from the bad guys' radar. Another way to solve the problem is for the other communities to do the opposite. \_ Nah, too complicated. Let's just create 2 sets of standards: 1 for Asians and 1 for non-Asians. Then you can just adjust the 2 standards to get whatever result you want. the 2 standards to get whatever result you want. You probably want to tweak the definition of "Asian" so that some populations with roots in Asia are included and some are not. |
| 2005/11/10-12 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:40535 Activity:moderate |
11/10 Top state Dem in FL proposes mandatory Spanish in K-2 in FL schools:
http://www.nbc-2.com/articles/readarticle.asp?articleid=4859
My favorite quote: "I've heard it the other way that English was the
language here and that's the way it's going to be. On the other hand,
there **is** [emphasis mine] a lot of Spanish people here. No, it
doesn't surprise me. I just don't like it," said parent Ed Barrick.
Looks like they need more English teaching first.
\_ Spanish or Latino?
\_ Yeah, let them all learn Spanish, so that those of us who speak
Asian languages will be in higher demand and can ask for higher
salaries.
\_ When everyone in the US speaks Spanish you will be at a
*disadvantage* when you cannot.
\_ Yeah, if you want to work at Walmart.
\_ You will when Walmart is the only industry left in the
US! (Which will be about the same time when everyone
in the US speaks Spanish)
\_ Uh....right, but that brings us two levels back up to
the thread to where us Mandarin speakers will still
be employed. Of course, I don't seriously believe any
of that anyway. Spanish will never replace English
anywhere that matters to tech people.
\_ Wow, I don't think I could've telegraphed that
sarcasm anymore clearly. -pp
\_ How can you possibly perceive Mandarin to ever
be more important to US business than Spanish?
Even with all the trade with China, Spanish is
the more useful language in the USA.
\_ Uhhh... He never said that it would be more
important, just that rarity confers value.
\_ Yes, I am sure your tech company is
willing to pay so much more for you if you
can speak some rarely used language like
Inukitut. Rarity doesn't confer value as much
as demand does in this instance.
\_ You are correct. That's supply and
demand. Sorry I didn't state it more
clearly.
\_ There are, what, a billion people who speak
Mandarin natively? In the end, jobs that will
stay in the US will require good English
communication skills. It's much easier to
find someone who speaks Mandarin well than
someone who speaks English well.
\_ I had thought this conversation was a
dumb as it could possibly get, but you
have brought it to a new low.
Congratulations.
\_ I'm guessing you don't work in the
industry. This article reflects
reality quite well.
http://www.slate.com/id/2126685
When we were hiring a FAE in China, we
hired one that could speak English best.
The marketing guy the FAE reported to
(who owned the Huawei account) is a
mid-30's white guy who couldn't speak a
word of Chinese. When we hired him,
we were looking for a guy who could help
us formulate and communicate a strategy;
Chinese was not even on the list of
requirements.
\_ you gotta becareful with your
decision. FAE requires to talk to
engineers, and engineers in general
don't have good foreign language
skill. Be able to speak Chinese
is much more advantageous. But such
advantage won't be seen by those who
don't interact with customers at
their native language level.
-system engineer work in ASIA
\_ Right. Whhat I meant was we chose
the Mandarin speaker who could speak
English best. For us, Chinese is a
requirement for firstline in-
country types, but it is at best
a low nice-to-have for higher-
level jobs.
\_ And so you continue to make an
irrelevent point.
\_ No, the point is that Chinese gets
you jobs in China. English gets
you jobs here. This will be even
more true in the future, if you
assume that globalization is
efficient.
\_ And speaking both well will
get you jobs in both.
Which was the orginal point.
\_ And my point is that it's
much more important to speak
English well, if one is
interested in employment
in the States. I've
observed that the vast
majority of the Mandarine
types here don't speak English
well at all. There is a vast
difference between being able
to communicate in a language
and being able to communicate
well in a language.
_\
I don't know about tech, but I know many BA/
MBA friends getting sourcing/purchasing type jobs
where Chinese either helps or is essential. One
just got sent to Beijing with a really nice
package including a US$5000 per month housing
allowance to setup operations there (John Deere).
My gf also does sourcing for her
small US employer, and she says she has already
saved her employer $500k per year after working
for a few months on switching to China sources.
As for tech, I am not sure if it would always
be doing management here, and tech stuff there.
I think China is only just getting started.
Knowing English and Mandarin well is a good
advantage. The fact that most Chinese here and
in China don't speak English well just means it's
even more valuable that one speaks English well,
AND knows Chinese.
\_ My guess is that marketing and mid+ management will
stay here, first level management and individual
contributors will ultimately all get outsourced.
Definition will stay in the States, design and
manufacturing abroad. All of which says you'd
better be able to communicate well if you want to
prosper here. Chinese may get you a job, but
prosper job here. Chinese may get you a job, but
English gets you ahead. In the end, knowing
Chinese may be no more useful than knowing C for
someone in tech. How many mid or senior management
types actually know C or think it matters? How
types actually know C or thinks it matters? How
many marketing types? Now consider what that means
when coding and first-level management is outsourced
to China.
\_ Marketing depends on where the market is.
For instance, cell phones, the China market
is huge, and I doubt you will know how
to market there if you don't know Chinese.
As for management, as China develops from
a manufacturing base to a more mature
economy with big demands for imports, the
number of good jobs requiring Chinese will
continue to grow. Sure, if you are the
stay home type and want to remain in the US,
and get ahead, you need to be good at English.
Nobody is arguing about that. But even
if staying here, knowing Chinese is an
added advantage, that will likely become
more and more valuable going forward, again,
in terms of the number of jobs where Chinese
helps or is a requirement.
\_ The problem is we are finite beings. There is
a limit to how much we can know and how much
time we have to learn. Knowing Chinese is
valuable. So is knowing Spanish, or French,
or Swahili. Some things are more useful than
others. Given you cannot learn everything,
you have to decide what to learn. So learn
Chinese? Sure. So long as you make sure
you know English well first. Now, how many
of you chest-thumping Chinese speakers speak
English well?
\_ Learning a new language from scratch is
tough. On the other hand if you
already speak English and Chinese well,
you should gloat over your superior
you should gloat about your superior
language abilities, and rub it in on
people who seem bitter about it.
\_ Uh, you do realize there are regional differences in
vocabulary and grammar in English (as well as most languages).
\_ I'm a bit disappointed that nobody here seems to have even thought
of the positive implications of teaching the kids _any_ foreign
language (Spanish, Chinese, who gives) just to get them used to the
idea of learning something unfamiliar and getting them to think
a bit more internationally. The Chinese and Indian kids coming to
the US speaking English, and the European students who've been
learning English/German/French/Spanish/whatever, some of them from
grade 1 (however badly they speak it is another issue) should tell
you something. -John
\_ In general Americans, esp. the isolated, non-coastal Red states
don't really give a damn about thinking internationally. At any
rate they (freepers) should learn their own language first.
\_ International thinking is fine and all but frankly most of them
will never set foot outside the country or ever have a need for
a second language. I'd prefer they learn to read/write English.
Hey, maybe knowing some basic math without a calculator would
be nice, too.
\_ I have a feeling that USA is going to become to what happened to
Roman Empire in the good old days, where the official language
(Latin) is different than what is more commonly spoken through
out the empire (Ancient Greek).
\_ The US doesn't have an official language.
\- Ave. some comments: 1. the greek of homer != the greek of
polybius or the biblical writers. the Koine greek was sort of a
lower vernacular or sloppy greek. i believe "ancient greek"
usually refers to an older version of the language 2. latin and
the koine were the second languages for a lot of people distant
from rome or athens. 3. the koine while somewhat common to the
east, a legacy of alexander...and indeed would later be adopted
by the eastern roman empire,was not common in the western
empire, where latin would be used more than the koine (and of
course the church of rome in the west would go with their own
brand of latin). FYI, probably the top scholar on the
flavor of latin). FYI, probably the top scholar on the
relationship between Rome and the Hellenic/Hellenistic world(s?)
is E GRUEN/UCB History. you may wish to see say Chapeter V
http://csua.org/u/dzh and Chapter 2,7 in http://csua.org/u/dzi
Graecia capta ferum victorem capit. --Horace. ok vale. |
| 2005/11/7-8 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/Asia/Japan, Politics/Foreign/Asia/Korea] UID:40471 Activity:nil |
11/7 The Three Kingdoms comic. Stupid in-jokes about the Romance of
the Three Kingdoms. In English, Japanese, Chinese, Korean, and,
what is that, Cambodian?
http://www.shiji.cc/san/index.php?mode=main
\_Close to Khmer...it's Thai. -scottyg |
| 2005/11/7-8 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Industry/Jobs] UID:40464 Activity:nil |
11/6 1590: http://files.deviantart.com/f/2004/188/8/7/gridgame.swf \_ 2016 -mice \_ is there any actual skill component to this? \_ um, well if you are really patient (bored) you can line them up beforehand in chain reactive patterns. that said, I'm still just 1037 \_ ok, now 2193. - pp \_ If I see any scores being posted on Monday, that will be indicative of how much work you have at your job. \- 3574, but i outsourced to a CHINESE VILLAGE \_ hope you got a screenshot or those poor little guys worked for nothing \_ There are bugs in this. |
| 2005/10/31-11/2 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Recreation/Stripclub] UID:40357 Activity:kinda low |
10/31 Naked women on the streets of Hong Kong in PETA protest: http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20051031/od_afp/environmenthalloween_051031171302 \_ KFC ain't going to torture this chick: http://news.yahoo.com/photo/051014/ids_photos_ts/r1925397729.jpg \_ I'm sure Hooters is just as bad to its chicks. \_ Hooters serves fried chicken menu also? \_ http://www.hooters.com/menu/Hooters_Online_Menu.pdf \_ No prices? \_ where are the pictures of naked PETA girls? \_ People Eating Tasty Animals. \_ The caption said the two lying in the fake coffins were naked. \_ url? |
| 2005/10/24-25 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:40241 Activity:kinda low |
10/24 I'm reading The Romance of the Three Kingdoms, and I have a
question about Chinese Names. For example, Liu Bei. Liu is
his family name, Bei is his given name, and he seems to have a
third name, Xuande. What's this third name? The translation
refers to it as a "style." What does that mean?
\_ It is typical for Chinese to have at least two "First names."
in the past. What we call "first name" is roughly equivalent of
"birth name," the name that goes to the family tree, and in the
imperial time, not very polite to be called upon unless you
are a very close friend or a member of family. One tend to use
"school name" or "zi" as the name to be used commonly. In this
case, "Liu" is the last name, "Bei" is the birth name, and
"XuanDe" is the "school name" which everyone call him upon.
It is not uncommon for well-established Chinese to have a 3rd
"first name" or "hao" roughly translated as "as known as."
So, in short, Chinese tend to have three first names. I am from
a very traditional family, and we managed to keep most of that
tradition even today. kngharv, the guy who has two
first names as well.
\_ It just means he's friggin' sweet.
\_ Liu not Lui unless you are still using some non-PRC standard
romanization.
\_ No, just a typo. Fixed.
\_ How did you find the book? Did you like Liu Bei, or thinks
he's a weenie? How about Cao Cao, the evil but cool dude?
\_ I haven't gotten all the way though it yet, I just read
about Liu Bei crossing the Tan. (I'm pretty busy these
days) So far it's been really good. I don't think I can
really pass judgement on either of them yet. Liu Bei is
possibly a little over restrained sometimes though.
\_ I'm surprised no one has mentioned the video game yet.
\_ I recognized the name from "Destiny of an Emperor" an old
NES RPG.
\_ There must be at least a dozen games based on the story.
Which one are you thinking of?
\_ The one called "Romance of the Three Kingdoms".
\_ There were several PC versions with the same name, and
now there are few versions of PS2 as well.
\_ The Romance of the Three Kingdoms is huge in Japan as well; I
used to get drunk at an izakaya called SanGokushi (Three
Kingdoms). --erikred
\_ The third name is used among friends, sort of similar to the use
of tutoyer in French.
\_ Ok, this seems to jibe with the other stuff I've heard. As
I now understand it, everyone is given a formal and an
informal name at birth. In this case, Bei is his formal
name, and Xuande is his informal name. Ok, does anyone know
why the translator chose to call the informal name the
"style?"
\_ Because the translator's Chinese-fu is weak?
\_ wikipedia is your friend. "Chinese style name":
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Courtesy_name
\_ wikipedia is your friend:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_style_name |
| 2005/10/12-13 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Recreation/Food] UID:40054 Activity:low |
10/12 4,500 year old noodle to go please!
http://news.yahoo.com/s/space/20051012/sc_space/worldsoldestnoodlesalterviewofancientdiet
\_ Man, Chinese food can survive 5000 years? This explains
something about my indigestion problems.
\_ Just more proof of the Flying Spaghetti Monster's greatness |
| 2005/10/5-7 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:39994 Activity:nil |
10/6 I think Chinese should celebrate today: end of Cultural Revolution
in 1976
\_ Celebrate Double Tenth Revolution in four days. End of Imperial
China in 1911.
\_ Double Tenth Revolution in 1911 in four days. End of Imperial
China. |
| 2005/9/28-10/3 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/Asia/Taiwan] UID:39912 Activity:nil |
9/28 http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20050928/od_nm/australia_births_dc Be patriotic, produce more kids! \_ Singapore has had similar policy for over a decade. Recently Hong Kong followed too. \_ I once met a fellow in Siena who was paid by the Singapore government to go on vacation so he can meet women and reproduce. He's a dual-PhD director of some Singaporean museum and the government really wants him to pass on his genes. He's also flaming gay, but supposedly the Singaporean reproduction program doesn't recognize homosexuality officially. \_ Taiwan also has this policy. But get this. The policy of encouraging more kids does *NOT* apply to 1. non-Hans, which includes: a. Taiwan abroigine b. mail-order brides that is Vietnam/Indonesia/Philipine orgin 2. Han Chinese that came from mainland China. Cool, huh? \_ Singapore encourages good genes by giving tax incentives. How about Taiwan? There's a difference between what the culture/ media promote, and what the government actually advocates. \_ Gee. Then this is one thing that Commie China is better. Just the opposite, the one-child policy in Commie China does not apply to minorities. \_ There are Hans that didn't come from Mainland China? \_ you pointed out a very interesting point. Those Hans who came to Taiwan prior to Japanese occupation considered themselves the true owner of Taiwan island (while performing genecide toward the abroigine). They tend to be hostile to Hans who came to Taiwan after Japanese occupation. \_ Where did Chewie come from? Or is it Chuy? \_ Kashyyyk \_ World pop would be something like 15 trillion in 200 years if today's growth rate continues -- it's going to have slow down today's growth rate continues -- it's going to have to slow down some day. Now, are the problems with a graying population easier to cope with if you have a large population or a small population? \_ that's why we need to terraform the moon and mars. \_ take a trip to China and step out the city. My conclusion from it is that population will be limited by available fresh water. and deep down, I suspect there will be a plague/pandemic that will make Spanish Flue of 1919 looks like a child play. \_ But the problem with a plague at this age is that, with today's travelling, a plague will probaby spread around the world easily. \_ yup. the result of pandemic would mean mass reduction in population world wide, not confined in given region. |
| 2005/9/19-21 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/Asia/Korea] UID:39759 Activity:moderate |
9/19 Oh look, North Korea is saying they won't be disarming until they get a
light water reactor
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1487719/posts
\_ obviously the got the idea from the motd...
\_ The U.S. better get moving with a robust NPT prohibiting uranium
enrichment, plutonium creation, and a catch-all clause
prohibiting technology which can lead very quickly to a bomb.
The excuse I read 6-12 months ago with not doing a real NPT was
"it would take too long".
The U.S. has the answer, but just needs to follow through.
\_ Yes, clearly the problem with Iran and North Korea is that
the language in the non-proliferation treaty isn't complete
enough.
\_ dude, this latest agreement is not about N.Korea and its nukes,
it's about dubya get some headline with a positive spin.
\_ Interestingly this is the FIRST freerep. link that I have found
useful. I agree with many of the comments that basically state
"the north koreans will just use material in the reactors to
build more weapons and get another concession from the US."
-mrauser
\_ You need thousands of centrifuges to weaponize the enriched
uranium fuel used for light water reactors into a single bomb.
And, the enriched uranium would be fed to North Korea peacemeal,
given more as it used up more in the reactor.
On the other hand, North Korea already has enough plutonium for
eight bombs: As many as two bombs while they were playing with
their graphite reactors in three separate incidents '89-'91,
and six more since inspectors were kicked out in '02-now since
six bombs: As many as two bombs while they were playing with
their graphite reactor in three separate incidents in '89-'91,
their graphite reactors in three separate incidents '89-'91,
and four more since inspectors were kicked out in '02-now since
Dubya didn't want to finish building the light water reactors
Bubba promised back in '94 that would be done by '03 -- because
Kim Jong-il had confessed to a secret nuke program earlier in '02
(violating NPT) and Dubya didn't know what else to do.
\_ And this way they get FREE REACTOR. Do you believe that the
moment they unpack their shiny new peaceful toy, they're going
to spontaneously erupt into bursts of nuclear-abhorring song
and dance? (No, I can't see the Chinese doing anything but
pressuring the US into giving the reactor _before_ NK does
anything in return.) Bombs or not, they're a bunch of evil
little pests. -John
\_ You need thousands of centrifuges to enrich enough uranium
from light water reactors for a single bomb.
That's why people say that even if Iran kicked out all the
inspectors and went full-bore for bombs, it would take them
5-10 years for a bomb.
Bubba promised back in '94 that would be done by '03.
\_ The fun part is they don't need nukes to serious screw
with the world. A couple of hundred artillery shells would
put a serious damper to South Korea's economy, which
affects the US economy, and force the US to engage in
a third war front. It's goes downhill from there. In truth
the nukes or threat of nukes is what is keeping NK an
independant state.
\_ Personally, I think, without nukes, NK is a paper
tiger. Unlike Iraq, where are continued
unrest, resistance and bloodshed, for NK, once the
Kim regime is removed from power, the NK people
will happily welcome the SKoreans. The initial
attack could be destructive due to the
destruction could be destructive due to the
proximity of Seoul, but I wouldn't overestimate
\_ yup, who cares about civilian casualties
when they are not white.
the NK conventional forces. The conventional
war would probably last a little longer than
Iraq but not much. But yes, US will be really
stretched, but it won't be for very long. The
PLA would gether along the border in case of
unrest, etc., but it won't cross the Yalu. China
stretched, but it won't be for very long. China
would want to play a role in terms of establishing
influence, but really, there isn't too much that
it can do, without appearing very bad since
it can do, without appearing rather very bad since
the NK regime is morally, and literally, bankrupt,
and because China would want to maintain good
relations with S. Korea. Unfortunately, with
nukes, things become very scary. Mr. Kim knows
the above, that's why he will always keep his
nukes, unless and until he can transform NK, and
be viewed as some sort of authoritarian modernizer in
the mold of Deng, Putin, Chiang Chingguo, Lee
Kuan Yew, etc., but I doubt he has what it takes,
and because unlike the other countries, there is
a dynamic, succesful, equal-sized South Korea whose
existence make a mockery of the legitimacy of his
regime. Still, with nukes, the prudent thing for
the surrounding countries to do, is to find a way
out for Kim somehow. China will probably offer
him a villa somewhere in China if his regime falls,
but it would still be a hot potato for China if
a united Korea demands his arse back.
\_ They've been selling rockets like hot cakes,
I thought. I would imagine that Pakistan
proved pretty conclusively that states which
want to be evil little shitbags will be so,
regardless of "rational". I don't understand
why the US doesn't just walk away from the
table and let Japan, the Chinese and S. Korea
handle it--they seem to think themselves well
capable of it. -John
\_ NK will only negotiate with the US for
some crazy reason.
\_ The thing is, China, S.
Korea and Japan doesn't care as much as
the US as to whether Pakistan has
rockets or not.
\_ Exactly, and that's part of the problem-
China wants to play regional superpower,
and uses N. Korea as a check to US power.
S. Korea/Japan need US protection on a
strategic level, but not on an immediate
level, so they don't realize the importance
of a balance to the Chinese, and India
seems like they find the US pathetic. The
logical conclusion seems either to leave
them to sort their shit out, or to let
themselves blow each other to kingdom come.
If the US can resolve (ha ha) the tiny
issue of energy dependency on the middle
east and central asia, pulling out would be
the best option. -John
a united Korea demands his arse back.
\_ genau und der ist ein Teil des Problems
China regionalen Superpower spielen möchte
und benutzt N. Korea da eine Überprüfung
zur US Energie. S. Korea/Japan
Notwendigkeit US Schutz auf einem
strategischen Niveau, aber nicht auf einem
sofortigen Niveau, also sie verwirklichen
den Wert einer Balance nicht zum Chinesen,
und Indien scheint, wie sie die US
pathetisch finden. Die logische
Zusammenfassung scheint entweder, sie zu
lassen, um ihre Scheiße heraus zu
sortieren, oder lassen Sie sich zum
Königreich sich durchbrennen kommen. Wenn
die US (ja ja) die kleine Ausgabe der
Energieabhängigkeit auf dem Mittler-Osten
und dem zentralen Asien beheben können,
würde das Ausziehen die beste Wahl sein.
Heil Hitler! - John
\- demurring on the paper tiger question, they can
still sell stuff to non-paper tigers. and they dont
have to sell fully functioning nuclear icbms to be
a problem. say the regime falls aparts and somewhere
you find a receipt for delivery of a couple of kg
of highly radioactive material to Mr. Albert Queda
(i dunno if they have made ricin or other low tech
chem/bio agents) what happens then? this would not
be the rational behavior of a state, but the side
effect of anarchy.
\_ Come to think of it, yes, things could be
a little thorny especially since it's not just
Kim, but an entire NK generals, officials
ruling class. As much as it's a pain to see
justice compromised, it's always a good idea
to assure them their safety, and a role to
play in a united korea. Not doing that for
the Baath Party members and Iraqi Army officers
is one of the biggest mistakes US made.
the Baath Party / Iraqi Army officals is one
of the biggest mistakes US made, in my opinion.
Still to the people of NK, South Koreans are
their brothers, unlike the relationship
between Iraqis and Pax Americana, so there
won't be much resistance once the regime
falls.
out for Kim somehow.
between Iraqis and Pax Americana.
\_ You know that the capital of S.Korea is
within the artillery range of N.Korean, right?
can you imagine what would happened to S.Korean's
economy if they suffered just a hour of bombardment?
(~60% S.Korean population lives in Seoul)
Do you care if hundreds of thousands
of refugee across the Yalu river to Chinese border?
Do you really think S.Korea has the will and economy
to absorb N.Korea? Chances are, you don't care.
Since the Korean War, US only wanted one thing:
the collapse of N.Korea regime. Mean while the
Chinese/S.Koreans, being at N.Koreans, has a lot
of pratical things they need to worry about. This
is why S.Korean's stance is more aligned with the
Chinese. US need to think about WHY S.Koreans,
being an ally with USA for past 5 decades, is
deviating from USA in terms of N.Korea policy.
*FURTHER* I was hoping Iraq would taught USA
a lesson of post-war planning...
\_ You know that the capital of S.Korea is
within the artillery range of N.Korean, right?
can you imagine what would happened to S.Korean's
economy if they suffered just a hour of bombardment?
(~60% S.Korean population lives in Seoul)
Do you care if hundreds of thousands
of refugee across the Yalu river to Chinese border?
Do you really think S.Korea has the will and economy
to absorb N.Korea? Chances are, you don't care.
Since the Korean War, US only wanted one thing:
the collapse of N.Korea regime. Mean while the
Chinese/S.Koreans, being at N.Koreans, has a lot
of pratical things they need to worry about. This
is why S.Korean's stance is more aligned with the
Chinese. US need to think about WHY S.Koreans,
being an ally with USA for past 5 decades, is
deviating from USA in terms of N.Korea policy.
*FURTHER* I was hoping Iraq would taught USA
a lesson of post-war planning...
\_ That was sort of my point above--the Chinese
have a stake in what happens, while the US is
obviously just playing neo-imperialist games.
Maybe China should be left to figure out how to
deal with N. Korea. Regarding refugees, they
generally tend to stream away from the direction
the artillery's coming from... -John |
| 2005/9/15-17 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:39693 Activity:nil |
9/15 Does anyone know how to use the "Chinese (Hong Kong S.A.R.)" input
language in XP? When I tried to add it in Control Panel, there are two
options under "Keyboard layout/IME". One is "Chinese (Simplified) - US
Keyboard" and the other is "Chinese (Traditional) - US Keybard". I
tried both, but I can't figure out how to enter any Chinese characters
in either layout. No matter what keys I press, it still gives me
English characters. Entering Chinese characters in "Chinese (PRC)" and
"Chinese (Taiwan)" works fine on my XP, but I want to use Cantonese
phonetic. TIA.
\_ I use a Tablet PC, it's more natural and easier.
\_ But I only have a desktop PC running XP Pro SP2.
\_ You need to provide more information, son.
1. You need to decide what encoding you are going to use.
Most people in Hong Kong uses Traditional Chinese and
Big 5+HK extension internally.
2. Assuming you are using T.Chinese + Big5, you simply
get this package:
http://www.microsoft.com/hk/hkscs/default.aspx
3. If that package didn't work, then, you need to look for
IME specific to Hong Kong.
If you have more questions regards to CJK issues, email me.
-kngharv |
| 2005/9/11-13 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Computer/SW/Security] UID:39626 Activity:nil |
9/10 One more data point that libertarianism leads to chaos:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/click_online/4227578.stm
\_ "It can be used for many good things, like giving the oppressed a
voice, but users can also preach race-hatred or share child
pornography with complete impunity." Gee, what else does that sound
like to you... I know! Speech! Hands! Computers! Brains!
Ban them all!
\_ Any politcal/economic system can be a problem if unchecked. That
why we have limits on speech, captialism, etc. |
| 2005/9/9-11 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Computer/Blog] UID:39591 Activity:low |
9/9 Most of you have probably seen this blog before (translations of
chinese tattos) but today's top post is pretty funny.
http://www.hanzismatter.com
\_ http://www.cantonese.sheik.co.uk/essays/tattoos.htm
\_ This site has exactly the same layout as http://bustywebshots.blogspot.com.
Interesting.
Interesting. Are they related?
\_ Are you an idiot? They're both blogger templates. |
| 2005/9/5-6 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Domestic/Immigration] UID:39508 Activity:low |
9/5 Say you're really old and you're going to die in 10 years. You don't
care about your credit rating. Isn't it possible that you borrow a
big sum from the bank and then declare bankrupcy later on? Or
don't even bother with it since you're going to die?
\_ If you die any debts are paid out of your estate, so anyone
who lent money to you would get it back providing you didn't
just waste it. And I doubt they would lend to the elderly who
didn't have money to really cover the loan. -mrauser
\- a think a better scenario is if you have a terminal disease
or are contemplating leaving the country ... in the leave
the country case, after liquidating assets, i wonder if you
can avoid your last tax bill. that could be like a million
dollars on cap gains.
\_ Owing the gubmint a million bucks would make it difficult
and dangerous to visit the States afterwards. Obviously this
would not be a concern for the terminally ill. I do know
people with large amounts of untaxed and unknown to the US
foreign investments. They can only spend the money outside the
country and actually live somewhat shabbily (relative to
their total available means) in the US.
\_ It worked for Marc Rich. -John
\- well i mean a scenario like an immigrant from china or
india sells their million dollar real estate and stock
portfolio and moves back home and happily settles there.
\_ I assumed that those Chinese or Indian immigrants who
might escape with the tax-free millions might still want
to visit the US later or to send their kids to college
here. The US is quite a pleasant place to live or just
to visit, and it will take a bit of money to compensate
for the permanent inability to enter the US.
\_ The person would need to avoid investing with US based
financial institutions or those who share banking treaties
with the US. Frozen assets suck. |
| 2005/9/3-4 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:39470 Activity:nil |
9/3 Is there a Chinese tradition that the best man/bridesmaid must be
single and not married? How often does this tradition get followed?
And is there a thing about the NUMBER of best man/bridesmaid for
not having bad luck (4 is a bad number for example)? Someone with
experience with Chinese traditions please shed some light. Thanks!
\_ Traditionally (imperial time, or during the day of my grand
parents). There is no such thing as best man /bridesmaid.
Best man / brides maid is 100% western idea. I don't know
about mainland China, but in Taiwan, people kept adding all
sort of Chinese twist to it. Typically (i.e. socially acceptable
norm), there is only one grooms man and brides maid. And yes,
they are usually single. You want to avoid those who are
divorced. *AND* given the choice, make sure groom man /
brides maid's parents are not seperated and still alive.
Further, you want to make sure bride maid is not born in the
year of ferocious animal, such as Tiger, etc.
Honestly, if I were you, I'll go 100% western. Very few
does 100% Chinese any more, which I find it pity. I really
hate the idea of bride wearing white for two reason. 1. for
Chinese, white is reserved for funeral. and 2. white supposely
symbolize purity in Wstern culture. Can you find any "pure"
bride nowadays? - bitter Chinese
\_ yeah, I did! -happy Taiwanese |
| 2005/8/29-30 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:39334 Activity:high |
8/28 50,000 maidens vie to become Swazi King's 13th wife. What the hell?
Are they still living in the 15th century? Also, I wonder if the
princess was listening to rap or hip-hop:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20050829/od_uk_nm/oukoe_uk_swaziland_whipping
\- now the modern amercican 21st century approach would be to turn
it into a REALITY SHOW.
\_ Big win, since it would raise the number of minorities on
prime time network TV.
\_ I find this entire thread unbearably depressing. -- ilyas
\- maybe you were happier in the Age of Aquarius?
Ilyas Inquiry: Are you familar with Jamie Robins?
Is he one of your masters?
\_ Harvard Epidemiology Robins? I site him a lot. My
Dark Master likes him too. I used an example of Robins'
in my last IJCAI paper. -- ilyas
\_ go to bed dude
\- yes, Jamie Robins who looks like Spalding Gray
and who may ride a teenger's bike.
and rides a teenger's bike.
\_ I don't think SWAZILAND has that many TVs. -John
\_ The lucky girl gets a BMW and a cellphone!
\_ But no TV. Go figure.
\_ [format police]
\_ Well, the government is implementing "intelligent design" in
schools across America. What the hell? Are they still living in the
15th century?
\_ What does this have to do with the 15th century? More like
4000 B.C.
\_ One wonders what sorts of social organization were prevalent
in 4000 BC.
\_ Chinese didn't have law prevents brothers and sisters
sleeping on the same bed until something like 1000 BC
or later. just tell you how primitive
Chinese society was at the time... and I assure you
there aren't that many civilization which was as
advanced as Chinese at the time.
\_ Huh?
\_ Interesting. Partha would say that the rule of law is
the basis of civilized society. Ilyas would say it's
property rights. Apparently, you're saying it's the
prohibition against conjugal relationship with one's
siblings. I like the way you think!
\_ I knew I was born too late!
\- just a small point: i think "rule" is
a prior condition for "society" beyond
small family/tribal type units. "rule of
law" often suggests a sense of justice and
adding "civilized" also puts a slightly
editorial spin on things. i'm making an
empirical claim [you need non-anarchy
for society to get beyond a Hobbesian
state of nature. not a normative claim
about "what is good", like is depotism
worse than the SoN, i.e. taking a position
for or against "Live Free or Die"]. --psb
\_ Wow, you've gotten both me AND psb wrong. I like the
way you think! -- ilyas
\_ I knew I was born thirty centuries late!
\- The darkness drops again; but now I know
That twenty centuries of stony sleep
Were vexed to nightmare by a rocking cradle
\_ dude, let them be. There is nothing wrong with their way of life.
\_ Polygamists make baby Jesus cry.
\_ Ok fine. Uh, 2000-1500 BC.
\_ really? would you change places with any random person in their
society? would you want our society to emulate theirs?
\_ Why is the king's own daughter in that party?
\_ Why is the king's own daughter in that party? He must be a fan of
<DEAD>www.daddydoesdaughter.com<DEAD>
\_ "... a country where 40 percent of adults live with HIV." Wow. |
| 2005/8/29-30 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/Asia/Taiwan] UID:39330 Activity:nil |
8/29 Anyone has any experience with IPTVs? Do they work ok? In
particular, I am interested in mixed China/Taiwan/HK offerings.
Recently got a mail offering from http://kylintv.com but it seems to
be pure PRC serials / HK movies. I also want Taiwan variety
and political shows. I am in the midwest, so I don't get
any chinese channels, and I am getting free cable, so I don't
want to go directtv. |
| 2005/8/25-26 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:39264 Activity:nil |
8/25 Vancouver has a lot, I mean A LOT of massive planned communities
which include really nice looking affordable high-rise condos like
the ones you'd see in HK or Taiwan. Does Bay Area have something
similar?
http://www.concordpacific.com/inourhomes/in_our_homes.html
http://tinyurl.com/a3o8t (Do we have this "social housing" thing?)
\_ Wow. Those taglines sound like stuff out of the 80's.
\_ I wasn't born till the 80s. What's so special about those
taglines? And is that GOOD 80s or BAD 80s?
\_ These are owned, developed, and sold by HK's wealthiest man,
Li Ka-shing. His vision was to transform parts of Vancouver into
a completely walkable city, with shops, restaurants, work places,
affordable home, and luxurious homes. It is no wonder many
Canadians take pride in the HonKouver.
\_ "About half of the 1,200 condominiums built so far have been sold
to Hong Kong investors, who do not live in them. "
http://www.nytimes.com/specials/hongkong/archive/0214hongkong-vancouver.html
\_ Doubtful the BA will develop these. SF would be the ideal location
but there is a general distrust against developers and skyscrapers.
Recent residental towers in SF demonstrate that distrust and the
results are unappealing. The punchline would be "the food is
horrible AND such small portions too." |
| 2005/8/15-17 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Computer/Rants] UID:39123 Activity:high |
8/15 India's IT companies emulating Toyota to combine low cost and
talent with discipline, quality and continuous improvements.
Man, you guys are deadmeat.
http://yahoo.businessweek.com/magazine/content/05_34/b3948443.htm
\_ "Think of any job that can be done remotely, by computer or
telephone, and you're looking at a job that can be done by an
Indian" and therein lies the crux of the problem. How long do you
think these guys are going to want to do the backoffice out-of-sight
shit work? They'll start outsourcing the outsourcing to China.
And at some point you're going to get enough local demand there for
consulting know-how to absorb all their cheap excess capacity. At
the same time, you'll see companies in other parts of the world go
for competitive advantage through knowledge of their local markets.
I'm not weeping, nor am I worried. -John
\_ that's just your wishful thinking. the answer to the question
"How long ...." is there are 1.4 billion indians, pakistanis
and bengali.
\_ Yes, and another 1.x billion Chinese, and another uncounted
hundreds of millions of Indonesians, Malaysians, Thais and
other smart, educated and ambitious folks. So? It's a
peculiar sort of arrogance to assume that these people will
all be happily living in mud hovels while they evolve
economically. Power to them. Likewise, the more advanced
local economies become, the more demand you'll see there for
goods and services of the sort that American and European
firms were happily providing to each other for decades. Go
join a union or something, the rest of us will be working to
adapt and compete with these guys on increasingly equal terms.
It's called "progress". -John
\_ This reminds me of Hong Kong. While virtually all textile
and electronic industries, once the dominant driving forces
of its economy, have relocated to the nearby SE China,
people in Hong still managed to survive somehow. What do
people do to make a living these days?
people in Hong Kong still managed to survive somehow. How
do people make a living these days?
\_ err ... it's much easier for a hong konger to go
start a business or go work in shen zhen, etc., then for
your american worker to go work in bangalore. the
relationship between hong kong and its south china
hinterland is very different from that between US and
India / China. another example is taiwan where the
starting salary for university graduates has been
dropping, and unemployment rates rising, while the
rich business men of taiwan are doing well in china.
\_ When it gets down to it -- talking trade balances here --
once we've brain-drained all our technology into other
countries, once things have evened out, they're making
cars in Bolivia and microwave ovens in Tadzhikistan and
selling them here -- once our edge in natural resources
has been made irrelevant by giant Hong Kong ships and
dirigibles that can ship North Dakota all the way to New
Zealand for a nickel -- once the Invisible Hand has taken
all those historical inequities and smeared them out into
a broad global layer of what a Pakistani brickmaker would
consider to be prosperity -- y'know what? There's only
four things we do better than anyone else:
music
movies
microcode (software)
high-speed pizza delivery
And I guess all the Hong Kongers are into banking or
similar now. Remember that all the Guangzhouers or what-
ever they're called also want the shiny cars. -John
\_ John, I never would have guessed you were a
Stephenson fanboy.
\_ Language barriers will still be an isssue with many of
\_ language barriors will still be an isssue with many of
the outsourcing efforts.
\_ really? check out the trade statistics with US among
the more advanced countries of asia. "progress"? sure.
american capital, know-how and expertise flowing freely
to china and india most certainly will help them progress,
and help the rich capital owners in the US prosper.
big loser? american workers, who are getting screwed in
so many different ways.
\_ So what do you suggest?
\_ Apparently not. "barriers".
\_ I suggest a career change.
\_ I work for the government. My work is not
outsourceable.
\_ thanks for sharing.
on a national basis, globalization meant
that the corporate response to the
opening of china and india is simply to
move operations there. the burden thus
falls entirely on US workers to adapt.
there is little incentive for US corporations
to change in terms of investing in
automation, R&D, worker training and
education, etc. In fact there may even
be less of an inventive than before since
they can just obtain their labor source
from china and india, abundantly. thus
US workers would receive little help
from US corporations. this would be
different if capital does not flow as
freely and US corporations and workers
must compete as a unit. Is this a
case where government provided
incentives are called for? in the form
of incentives for corporations to invest
in the US on R&D, workers training,
equipment, etc., and perhaps also more
direct government help with education and
training of US workers? these would
help mitigate the transition, without
stifling free market and competition, and
are done by countries in asia and elsewhere.
\_ Part of the problem is not just that
corporations are moving abroad without any
penalty (which they should be free to do) but
that they're being stupidly subsidized while
doing so. A good start would be to encourage
SMEs by reducing regulatory and tax burden
on small companies, so people don't feel
beholden to large outfits for jobs. -John |
| 2005/7/31-8/3 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:38901 Activity:low |
7/31 Nee how! Better start practicing Mandarin to remain competitive
in the business world: http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/uschinaeducation
\_ 1.5 billion in federal money for Chinese instruction? Why not just
get rid of all that time-wasting French and use *that* money to
teach useful languages?
\_ but speaking French make me feel high class and better than
everyone else, and it sure impresses the hell outa hot
looking blond chicks! And it makes me feel like John Kerry.
\_ If someone tries to say that learning French is more useful
for meeting and impressing women than learning Chinese, the
appropriate response is to point at them and laugh.
\_ not everyone is an asian-loving white nerd boy.
\_ You got that right! Only brain washed white nerd boys
in the Bay Area love Asians. The pure Aryan race still
wants pure white blond bimbos for master domination.
\_ That...is why you fail to troll. Because you do not
believe.
\_ The pure Asian race still wants pure white blond bimbos
for masturbation.
\_ My (Chinese) wife was more impressed that I could speak
French.
\_ Troll...or do not. There is no try.
\_ you can try learning, but you shall fail, or at best, speak with
a silly accent. I suggest learning to understand indian accented
english instead. or try hindi.
a silly accent. mandarin is an inscrutable language. I suggest
learning to understand indian accented english instead. or try hindi.
learning to understand indian accented english instead. or try
hindi.
\_ Bullshit. In short phone conversations, I've been mistaken for
a native speaker. I started learning when I was young, which
would obviously be true of kids if we taught it properly
in the schools. -white guy
\_ I am the Little Chinese. I am still here! |
| 2005/7/25-27 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/Asia/Korea] UID:38813 Activity:kinda low |
7/25 http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20050725/od_nm/china_suicide_dc China suicide rate climbing. This is going to solve their high men/women ratio, a cause for major frustration. \_ Man, that must be depressing for the parents. They can only have one kid, so they go to a lot of trouble to produce a boy to carry on the family line. Then he kills himself. Oops. \_ Well if you're a gay Chinaman it's a really good thing. \_ Maybe if you're a necropiliac gay Chinaman... \_ No, I mean this trend is good because straight men kill themselves out of frustration, so most of the men left are either straight&married, or gay, which makes them easier to find. \_ It's funny how you use "gay" so you don't offend homosexuals, and yet you don't care about offending us "Chinamen". Thanks. \_ iirc, the new policy is that if both you and your wife are the only child of your family, you can have 2 kids. \_ There are a lot of innovative solutions China should embrace to prevent this societal epidemic caused by sexual frustrations. 1) Implement rent-a-girlfriend service. If your parents visit you and nag about it you can rent a girlfriend to shut them up. 2) Allow more brothels. A man can't jackoff all his life, he has to release his sexual urges somehow or else he'll go crazy and kill himself, and in some cases (like the Iraqi loners) kill others with them. 3) Allow more economic incentives for having girls. 4) Discourage marriage between pretty native Chinese women and extremely wealthy, old, and ugly Hong Kong and Taiwanese lords who already have 3rd and 4th wives. This has been going on for a while and is really really causing a lot of resentments and pissing off a lot of natives whos lives are changed drastically [for the worse] by these foreigners. \_ yea, but they can just go to vietnam, like what many taiwanese are doing. \_ So are Koreans. There were tons of billboards saying "Marry Vietnamese! We'll set you up!" Word on the street was that Vietnamese ladies work harder. -jrleek Addendum: Oddly, I watched a sort of Korean Hard Copy with my wife tonight, and it had a segment on Koreans mail ordering Vietnamese brides. It was mostly about a 37-year old lower-middle class Korean batchelor who scored himself a pretty good-looking 22 year old Vietnamese bride. Still, she didn't really speak much Korean, and nobody in the family liked Vietnamese food. \_ Let me get this right, YOU [white American] understand Korean? How? Why? \_ maybe cuz he...married a korean? \_ Is he sky? \_ I spent 2 years in Korea as a missionary, which is some pretty intense language training. Then I married a Korean, we speak a lot of Korean around the house. \_ So dorky white guy takes Korean women, forcing Korean man to take Vietnamese women... \_ #1 already exists. Someone posted a link about this on the MOTD a year or so ago. #3 is quite doable in China. \_ #2 is pretty much a free market (or free-for-all market) already. there are an estimated 5 million prostitutes in the PRC. \_ #3 is easy. just learn from singapore. prc already followed singapore's model on its new yuan exchange rate policy - pegging to a basket of foreign currencies based on trade with those countries. \_ Maybe china could provide a economic incentive for sex change operations. That way chinese guys wouldn't have kill themselves and they could make some white guy w/ yellow fever happy. \_ If thats the goal, sex change isn't necessary. Lots of gay white guys have yellow fever as well. \_ So you might need a sexual orientation change operation instead. \_ sigh ... why you worry so much? just go import some women from russia lah. or just offer your own pasty arse, maybe there will be some takers. |
| 2005/7/25-27 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:38809 Activity:nil |
7/25 Max Boot thinks China can produce earthquakes
http://hnn.us/roundup/entries/13305.html
it's a reprint of a LA Times editorial from
July 20th that I don't feel like making you all
get a login from bugmenot. - danh
\_ I've heard that if a billion men jump up and down at the
same time the evil nation on the other side of the globe may
feel it.
\_ hmmm ... isn't the things he is accusing china of doing the same
ones the US and the west have been perceived as doing to other
countries through history? Let's see:
financial warfare - asian financial crisis triggered by soros
drug warfare - opium war, alcohol for the indians
psychological and media warfare - pro-US propaganda radio stations
all over the world
resource warfare - countless examples of this.
ecological warfare - okay, this one is debatable. but here's
Jack London's biological warfare proposal against china:
http://sunsite.berkeley.edu/London/Writings/StrengthStrong/invasion.html |
| 2005/7/20-22 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:38729 Activity:low |
7/20 Do you care if the Chinese buy Unocal/76?
\_ No. As long as gas price is not affected and my tax is low
I don't care if the Chinese takes over.
\_ Hah! Your poor grammar gives you away as a FOB Chinese.
\_ You should just go all Deadwood on us, and call them
"Celestials and dirt worshippers."
\_ It really doesn't matter. In the next 5-10 years, all that will
matter who has the best military outpost in the mideast to secure
oil supplies.
\_ Let's rename Iran to New Texas when that happens!
\_ Just out of curiousity, why were the Chinese all upset that we
might have a problem with this transaction? Is it even possible
for one of our large corporations to buy a large Chinese
corporation?
\_ where did you get the impression that the Chinese were all
upset? it seems to me it's the US who got all upset.
\_ There were stories about the Chinese being upset that
we have a problem with THEM buying a US company.
\_ url?
\_ Where did you get the impression that the Chinese are into
fairness? |
| 2005/7/16-18 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/Taiwan, Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:38654 Activity:moderate |
7/16 What in the FUCKING WORLD is wrong with the ppl in tw? They report
Harry Potter plot spoilers as news events... Headline in bold on
news sites printing so and so was killed in book 6. WTF!?!?!?!?!?!?
\_ I know a little Chinese, but never read taiwanese news sites. I
definitely appreciate the warning. Thanks. BTW, I propose a 1
week potter book 6 blackout on the motd, if not longer.
\_ Damn, and I wanted to tell the world that Harry finds out
that James Potter isn't really dead but is masquerading
as the Dread Pirate Sith Lord LeChuck.
\_ Geez, it took you this long to understand why the heroic PRC wants
to invade the place and put paid to this outrage? -John
\_ believe me or not, there are plenty of denizens in TW are
looking forward for this day. and the number is growing.
\_ Too bad. It's a good thing I can't read Chinese.
\_ Maybe there is no real news to report?
\_ You're saying someone was killed in book 6!?!? Oh no, a spoiler!! |
| 2005/6/23-25 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/Europe] UID:38269 Activity:nil |
6/23 Yeehaw! Dubya don't give a fuck about world perception:
The United States' popularity in many countries - including longtime
allies in Europe - is lagging behind even communist China.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/worldlatest/story/0,1280,-5094510,00.html
\_ bbc (somewhat liberal slant) >>> guardian (ultra liberal slant)
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4124164.stm
\_ The Free Republic >>> bbc
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1429190/posts |
| 2005/6/22-25 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:38237 Activity:nil |
6/21 Competition For Jobs, Partners Sparks Height Craze In China.
Height Stretching Machines:
http://www.local6.com/money/4574140/detail.html
\_ I will be as a god! --erikred
\_ Oh you know you already are, big boy. -John |
| 2005/6/13-15 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:38103 Activity:nil |
6/13 "Microsoft joins efforts to censor Web in China"
http://csua.org/u/cc5 (Yahoo! News)
Commie Gates!
\_ The Chinese govt used to be anti-MS. Guess they'll change their
position now.
\_CommieIE 1.0 (builtin censorship into the OS) |
| 2005/6/12-14 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:38092 Activity:moderate |
6/12 Why don't I hear any leftists whining about US imperial
oppression of Mugabe these days?
Mugabe's L1m Party As Millions Face Starvation
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1421595/posts
\_ Nothing to do with leftists or rightists--the man's a shitbag,
deserving of government-sanctioned assassination, and it'd be nice
to hear from _anyone_ (including the US govt., see AIUSA thread
below) that "something" should be done about him. -John
\_ it has everything to do with leftists. He is a leftist, he
is adored by leftists.
\_ Either I'm being (badly) trolled or you're an idiot. I
suspect both. -John
\_ is this projection??? even the left leaning
wikipedia acknowledges hes a Marxist
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mugabe
\_ You've come from "you leftists are stupid, ha ha,
you adore Mugabe" to "wikipedia calls Mugabe a
Marxist." He's a shitbag, decent people of all
political stripes loathe him. Did you have a point?
No? Next then. -John
\_ I don't understand your vitrol. Mugabe is
a Marxist and, though you may have missed the
news reporting it, was cheered by the left during
his ascendence to power. This same Marxist
scenario has played itself countless times and
yet there are always people like yourself
pretending he is something he is not. Strange.
\_ Whatever pretenses he had to Marxism were
in line with his leadership role in the Rhodesian
civil war against the Smith regime, which was a
reasonably noble undertaking. Overthrow of
bad governments is as laudable if they are white,
oppressive and racist as if they are black,
oppressive and racist. Mugabe has given up any
"revolutionary credibility" by being a vicious
shit. I'm defending neither marxists nor thugs;
I do, however, make allowance for people of any
political persuasion to change their view of a
tyrant once his true colors show. Would you say
that anyone calling himself politically xyz is
automatically xyz? Was Joe Stalin a communist?
What would Marx have said? You tell me. -John
\_ Why don't you hear any? Probably becuase you don't bother to
read anytyhing outside your carefully circumscribed circle.
Slate and The Nation have been griping about this guy for
almost a decade. Glad you finally noticed he was a bastard.
The Right used to love him, because he was anti-Soviet.
\_ The fact that Trotsky disliked Stalin and Mao disliked
Ho-Chi Minh does not preclude them all from being Marxists.
But you are right Mugabe is really more a Maoist, having
received the most support from China.
\_ Oh, that's all right then. I got a newspaper in Berkeley
that talks all about how great Mao was. |
| 2005/6/2-3 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:37950 Activity:high |
6/2 Christopher Cox is nominated to be head of SEC:
http://tinyurl.com/aju4p
I remember he is the guy said that *ALL* Chinese Americans
are potentially spy for the communist China. Thank god
9/11 happened, or Chinese will be the one who are being
targeted.
\_ He's also on record as saying that he didn't see anything wrong
with Enron's accounting practices.
\_ Is it not true?
\_ just think that broad statement like that is racist,
nothing more. and he is close to Bush's inner circle.
\_ Not that I particularly have strong feelings either way
on any of this, but I just wanted to make a meta-comment
about people's propensity to care more about whether something
is racist or not, rather than whether something is true or not.
-- ilyas
\_ There's this nuance to human interaction that involves
intent and inflection, which can radically change the
information being transmitted. In these situations, it's
clearly possible that while understanding the meaning
of the words, the content of the message is entirely lost
upon the strict logician/semanticist.
\_ It's too bad that people have become so concerned about
racism, that they've somewhat lost the ability to
distinguish between general stupidity with no malicious
intent and genuine hatred based solely on race. Of
course, evaluating a statement based solely on its truth
can yield information that falls very short of the intent.
There's a bigger picture here than pure semantics, ilyas.
\_ It's fairly clear that the fellow in the original post
wasn't interested in stating a near-tautology, but was
more interested in stirring up some sort of xenophobia
towards Chinese-Americans. I probably didn't explain
well enough that I wasn't commenting on that specific
line at all. I am more interested in people unwilling
to start discussions on things like aptitude differences
among ethnic groups (since such things are 'racist').
The followup which responded to the question of whether
the line was true with the implication it was racist
reminded me of this dynamic playing out (regardless of
how well justified it may be in some cases). I hope you
weren't implying I have Asperger's or something. -- ilyas
\_ Are you also saying intent and inflection is
generally transmittable across the Internet, or are you
just making a general remark? Or perhaps that
someone, somewhere might be having a mild case of
Asperger's syndrome... -- ilyas
\_ "All humans are potential spies for communist China" is a
true statement as well. It is clearly not a racist
statement, but it is a stupid one. From a purely strategic
point of view, paranoia about Chinese scientists has the
potential to harm our country more than any Chinese spy.
In fact, I believe it is doing very real harm to our country
right now.
\_ Some additional 'racist hypotheses' from our friends at
http://economist.com:
http://economist.com/displaystory.cfm?story_id=4032638
I am sort of glad these sorts of things can even be
printed these days without being laughed out of the
room. -- ilyas
\_ "On average" vs. "All"
\_ As I said, neither of my comments have been
really about the original post. -- ilyas |
| 2005/5/28-31 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/Asia/Korea] UID:37871 Activity:nil |
5/27 I read couple Chinese newspaper saying that 15 of F-117A is now
in South Korea. Does any of you knew about this?
\_ http://www.airforcetimes.com/story.php?f=1-292925-869425.php
\_ This article implies over 100 F-117A are deployed around the world
when only 54 remain. http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/aircraft/f-117-specs.htm
when only 55 remain. http://www.af.mil/factsheets/factsheet.asp?fsID=104
\_ I read a lot of things in Chinese newspaper, some don't get
reported in American media until a few days later. Why? |
| 2005/5/20-23 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/Europe] UID:37787 Activity:moderate |
5/20 Has any republic in the history of the world lasted longer than 300
years?
\_ Is the English Commonwealth a republic?
\_ No. There is a monarch.
\_ To be precise, it's a Constitutional Monarchy.
\_ If you mean 'country' then sure. If you mean 'continuous
government' I'm not so sure.
\_ I mean continuous government.
\_ The Chow dynasty in ancient China lasted ~800 years under a
continuous govt. But it's not a republic.
continuous govt. But it's not a republic. Switzerland has been a
republic as the Swiss Confederation since 1291.
\_ Confederation, not Republic :) -John
\_ According to http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook
(yeah, the CIA), it's a federal republic. I don't know what
the difference is.
\_ Uh, erm, but they haven't broken our yodel code! -John
\_ Zhou Dynasty had total of 23 successions (e.g. 24 Emperors),
most numerous successions in China's 5000 years history.
In many ways number of successions is a better guage than
number of years when one judge the length of regimes.
\_ Rome.
\_ 510 BC to 44 BC according to Wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_republic
But wasn't the period from 133 BC on pretty much a mess?
\_ The Thousand Year Reich lasted 12 years. |
| 2005/5/12-13 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:37650 Activity:high |
5/11 Debunk Walmart Myths, go to http://walmartfacts.com See, they're not as bad as people think they are. \_ Walmart is probably not as evil as a lot of people seem to think. Walgreens on the other hand is infinitely more evil than almost anyone realizes. \_ Really? My wife worked for six years at the pharmacy dept. in a Walgreen store, and she didn't think it was evil. Walgreen store, and she didn't think it was evil. I don't shop there often, but that's because prices are not low. \_ According to WalMart, did the holocaust happen or not? \_ What does the holocaust have to do with Walmart's business? \_ If WalMart says it happened, then maybe it actually didn't. \_ Wal-Mart is worse than most people think they are. It's not because of how they treat their employees, but because of how they treat their suppliers and how ruthlessly they compete with their competitors. \_ competition, oh the humanity. \_ There is competition and there is ruthless competition. For instance, Wal-Mart charges companies for display space (as do a lot of companies) but with Wal-Mart is it extortion. Wal-Mart often sells products for below cost in a bid to drive others out of business, because they have the leverage to do so. That is not good for consumers or the economy. It is not healthy competition. It is the systematic destruction of competition and suppliers at the same time. \_ Why don't you go file an anti-trust lawsuit then? \_ I think someone ultimately will, but I'm certainly not equipped to do so. \_ The government files anti-trust lawsuits, not private parties. \_ You know, Wal-mart have been sued for predatory pricing before. AFAIK, they have won in every case. Care to provide research to back up your claim? \_ Which claim? That Wal-Mart extorts money from \_ Predatory pricing. Wal-mart has never been successly sued for predatory pricing, i.e. selling products below cost to drive out competitors. I assume it would have been clear from the context. Mea Culpa. \_ Wal-Mart has settled lawsuits, though, including one in Wisconsin. They were also ordered by a German court to stop selling items for below cost. suppliers? My dad worked for a big supplier to Wal-Mart and Wal_mart said "If you don't pay us x Wal-Mart and Wal-Mart said "If you don't pay us x $$$ cash we will not stock your product. We don't care if it sells or not." In this case x was a number larger than the revenues generated and Wal-Mart didn't give a shit. Wal-Mart then sets its own price to move the product, which might possibly be less than cost. They can "sell at a loss" because of the cash they received up front and of course people will buy the product at Wal-Mart because it is cheaper there - nevermind it is bankrupting an American company building product in America with Americans labor. Target, on the other hand, doesn't do that bullshit. American labor. Target, on the other hand, doesn't do that bullshit and so the company took their business there. However, Wal-Mart is gradually putting competition out of business and *then* where do you distribute your product? Mom and pop store? No one will buy it because they can buy cheap Chinese knock-offs at Wal-Mart for less. Wal-Mart doesn't care if it bankrupts suppliers as long as they have the cash. There will be other suppliers - an endless stream - right? \_ Predatory pricing. Wal-mart has never been successly sued for predatory pricing, i.e. selling products below cost to drive out competitors. I assume it would have been clear from the context. Mea Culpa. \_ Wal-Mart has so much leverage over suppliers that it is driving entire industries to China. They force prices so low that the ONLY way for a company to keep going is to oursource to China. Furthermore, they force every other retailer to do the same thing or go out of business because it allows them to sell hair dryers for $2 cheaper. Not to mention all the money they suck out of the public treasury. One good result from peak oil will be the end of WalMart. Their whole business structure depends on 10,000 mile supply chains which will become uneconomical in about 5-10 years do to oil scarcity. \_ Did you read the page at the URL above? It countered the China and the public treasury claims. Please point out what part of the page is lying. \_ The URL doesn't really refute anything. It just states facts. Pretty smart, actually. There is no concept presented of what the facts really mean. \_ Do you prefer counter-claims with no facts instead? From the site: in 2004, $18b merchandise from Chinese suppliers vs. $137.5b from US ones. Does that say something? \_ Not about my argument it doesn't. However, what if it was true (I'm making this up) that the numbers were higher/lower in 2003? While their facts might be true, it doesn't identify a trend. For all we know, that year was a anomaly. --dim \_ Look at the way they word it; I'm sure all their bicycles are made in Asia but if they buy from Huffy it's a "U.S. supplier." -tom \_ The way they word it is that the $18b includes "about $9 billion imported from direct sources and about $9 billion from indirect sources". So your hyperthetical Huffy bicycle would be in the second $9b of the $18b. \_ Bullshit. -tom \_ Which part of the above quote from Walmart is a lie? \_ Maybe it's just me, but "they force every other retailer to do the same thing [force prices so low that their suppliers must outsource to China] or go out of business because it allows them to sell hair dryers for $2 cheaper" is a pretty amazing statement. Most monopolists force out the competition so they can extract higher rent. But *not* Walmart! Those bastards force out the competition so they can charge *less*! That's just perverse. I hope Walmart doesn't try to branch out and sell gas or something. God knows I want to spend *more* on a fill up! \_ Do you think once WalMart has totally eliminated the competition their prices will remain low? Or are you kind of dim? \_ Oddly enough, I couldn't find any indication that Walmart charges higher prices once it has come to dominate a market -- and I've looked. There are lots of people saying Walmart *could*, or even Walmart *did*, but there's a complete lack of data. There's nothing that says anything to the effect that, in market N, after Walmart has come to dominate, prices increased by x%, or even the magnitude/frequency of price drops decreased. Since you're so sure this happens, do you have a reference? Not accusations, mind you, but research. Or is your claim just so much groundless MOTD propaganda? groundless MOTD bluster? \_ It's not about charging higher prices. It's about declining quality and destruction of the environment in the pursuit of lower prices. Suppliers are having their profit margins squeezed. Some are going offshore. Others are cutting benefits to their own employees or downsizing. It's hard for those suppliers to tell Wal-Mart to F*** off when there is no other channel to distribute since Wal-Mart has driven them all under. \_ Are you the "will prices remain low" poster? If so, I take it that you don't have research to back up your claim. \_ No, I'm not. \_ So who's pursing lower prices? Is it Wal-mart or the consumers? \_ Wal-Mart, in pursuit of consumers. However, it's not about the lowest price. Say, for example, that generic cola is cheaper but dangerous. Wal-Mart has an obligation not to sell dangerous cola. Wal-Mart is pushing lower prices, but consumers don't always know what went into that bargain. Now that people are finally educating themselves Wal-Mart is not as popular. \_ Is that true? Yes, I know that they just announced bad financials. However, the market seems to think that Wal-mart's problem is a bad product mix plus financial discomfort amongst Wal-mart's target market, rather than some kind of popular uprising against the company. Here's a link of market research on Wal-mart in Oklahoma City, which the company dominates. It shows that Wal-mart's *detractors* in fact are the 2nd largest group of Wal-mart customers (15% of total Wal-mart shoppers, 5.6 visits in 4 weeks, spending $289). http://csua.org/u/c18 \_ It is true in California and other places where Wal-Mart has fought big political battles just to get their stores built. There are lot of people opposed to Wal-Mart - a lot more than, say, 20 (or even 10) years ago. \_ People (would-be customers) in favor of a store generally don't put on a political battle for it. \_ Yes, they do. Have you followed the news at all? Supporters of Wal-Mart pitted against people opposed to it, sometimes on the same city councils. \_ Do you seriously expect me to believe that even when Walmart can raise their prices because they have a monopoly, they chose not too out of the goodness of their hearts? You are the one making the extraordinary claim here. \_ Well, I can't prove that they never do it. Impossible to prove a negative, you know. However, Wal-mart corporate dictates prices nationwide, and then individual stores set deltas from the national price. It's not clear whether local managers have the power to do * +/-n%, or whether the local authority only extends to "specials". In any case, I have not found *any* credible research that shows Wal-mart extracting monopoly rent, though there are plenty of accusations. I will repeat my challenge. If mine is such an incredible claim, it should be trivial to find evidence against it. There are many markets where Wal-mart is dominant, after all. Can *you* find any example of Wal-mart raising prices *after* forcing out the competition? And if you cannot, then is my claim really so incredible? Here's a ref. to market research on Wal-mart in Oklahoma City, where Wal-mart has 10 supercenters, 6 discount stores, 7 neighborhood markets, and 4 Sam's Clubs. The study found Wal-mart to champion low prices. In fact, "its low prices and quality merchandise translate into 'looking out for me--the shopper'". http://csua.org/u/c18 \_ I don't have the time or inclination to do a cross market study, but if someone had done it and it supported it, you can bet Wal-Mart would trumpet it. Just admit it, you have to evidence your opinion, other than your feelings. your feelings. BTW, referecing that bit of obvious marketing PR as evidence doesn't really do much to prove your case or improve your credibility. \_ Like I expected, just so much MOTD bluster without evidence or research. Amazing as it seems, Wal-mart seems to maintain low prices even after it achieves dominance in a market. \_ Just a lot of MOTD bluster without evidence. Wal-Mart "seems" huh? Great thread of argument. \_ Look, this is not isolated to Walmart. It is just what super mega corporations do. They care about the bottom line-- PROFIT. They will do whatever it is profitable. Do you think corporations actually have a soul and care about their employees? In reality, they will do whatever it takes to be profitable, including cutting benefits, hiring non-Unioned workers, squeezing other businesses out, and buying imports instead of American. If one day, they can replace all of the workers with cheap robots, they will not think twice and do it, because it's profitable. It's already happened in the outsourcing of Detroit, the entire outsourcing of VISA/Mastercard support lines, etc. It's not just Walmart. It's what big corporations do. And that's the bottom line. \_ No, not every corporation operates like this - even big, profitable ones. Example: Petco versus Petsmart. One is vaguely aware of social issues and the other is oblivious. \_ There was a debate about this on CSPAN recently: rtsp://video.c-span.org/60days/ap050705.rm I think there are serious problems with Wal-Mart, but more important are the underlying issues with China trade. \_ Wow. That Liza Featherstone is the most condescending bitch I've ever seen. "Unions aren't a special interest" indeed. |
| 2005/5/10-12 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/Asia/Japan] UID:37610 Activity:low |
5/10 Today's title page engrish is pretty good:
http://www.engrish.com
\_ Six years of living in Japan, and I'm still astounded at how
clueless Japanese people are about inherent racism. --erikred
\_ "What do you mean? There's no racism in Korea!" --most
Koreans. (jrleek)
\_ There was a brand of toothpaste in Asia called Blackman or
Blackie toothpaste that had a picture of a black dude on it
with a big white smile.
\_ I used to use it exclusively when I was a kid in Hong Kong.
The brand name used to be Darkie and the Chinese name was, and
still is, "Black People's Toothpaste". Then Colgate bought
the brand and renamed it Darlie and changed the logo. The
idea was that most Hong Kong people had an impression that
black people's teeth look very white (probably because of the
contrast to the skin color), so if you want your teeth to look
like black people's, you'd better use Black People's
Toothpaste. It was very popular because of the brandname.
You need to understand that it was not racism against
Africans. I'd think of it as "positive racism", if there's
such a thing.
\_ No we don't need to understand that. To say that ignorance
of this sort is not grounded in racism is to misunderstand
racism.
\_ Okay, at least please don't think that this is racism
*against* Africans in this case.
\_ Okay, raised with a cultural icon like that, what
is the immediate gut response when meeting a black
man for the first time? It's as racist as the
portrayal of Chinese in Hollywood for decades.
\_ I checked out his teeth. Yeah, it's funny.
\_ See, racism is about disrespect of a person or
people because they don't look like the people
around you. It doesn't have to be "negative"
to be hurtful. If it puts up a wall or causes
objectification when you interact with someone,
it's something to fight against.
\_ BTW, some other common impression in HK on black people
are "black people are better at jazz, rap and other
rhythm-centric music forms" and "black people are better
at sports that need either explosive power and very
short endurance (100m), or very long endurance
(marathon)". On the other hand, the common impression
among Americans that "black people have big penes"
wasn't widespread in HK.
among Americans that "black men have big penes" wasn't
widespread in HK.
\_ OTOH, the sterotype of black men having larger
genitalia is alive and well in Japan. --erikred
\_ If it's any comfort, there's also a brand of toothpaste in Taiwan
called Whiteman. I have a tube of it.
\_ Is that condom?
\_ yes |
| 2005/5/10-12 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:37603 Activity:nil |
5/10 More grist for the Chicom/troll/reply/motd/debate mill:
http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2005/05/10/china_riches/index.html
China - reinventing capitalism? or feudalism? |
| 2005/5/5-9 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:37543 Activity:low |
5/5 Investment time: I'm looking for a mutual fund that is the best
approximation of a "Chinese S&P500". Does such a thing exist?
Ideally the fund would be based in the US so that it's subject to US
reporting requirements.
\_ No. Most Chinese companies are not really in the stock market
yet, and those that do are so-called "Red Chip" stocks that
don't really give you many shreholder rights. Stick to Hong
don't really give you many shareholder rights. Stick to Hong
Kong and Taiwan for now.
\_ I did some more research and found that FXI is probably
the closest to what you want. It is 25 red chip and H
series shares traded on the Hong Kong stock exchange.
But the Red Chip stocks are all minority shares in
companies run by the Chinese government.
\_ pp is right. china is doing well, but chinese firms are
not well regulated and can steal your money. There are
a couple of china mutual funds like MCHFX, but they have
not been performing as well as the Pacific ex-Japan funds,
which benefit from China's growth but do not have the
drawbacks of investing directly in China's companies
\_ I'd recommend Vanguard's Emerging Markets Stock Index Fund. As of
March, the top five countries in its holdings by percentage were:
Korea: 20.2%
Taiwan: 14.8%
South Africa: 11.5%
Brazil: 11.0%
China: 8.4%
Thus, taken together, China and Taiwan represent over 1/5 of the
entire fund's holdings. -dans |
| 2005/5/3 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/Asia/Taiwan] UID:37497 Activity:nil 52%like:37467 |
5/3 http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/4507681.stm 1626 : "24 bibelots pour Manhattan" 2005 : "2 pandas vraiment mignons pour Taiwan"le \_ sont eux les carottes agricoles d'offre à Taiwan parce que many des fermiers de Taiwan sont-ils les défenseurs de Chen ? |
| 2005/5/3 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Science/GlobalWarming] UID:37496 Activity:nil |
5/3 http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7693580/site/newsweek/concensus de "Pékin" : La Chine out-maneuvering politiquement etles USA diplomatically déplacés.le démuni japonais de \_ "s'est comporté parfaitement, mais ils ont fait des excusestemps several pour leur agression de temps de guerre."le Also, ma lecture de l'article est que, politiquement, la Chine a been maladroit. Saying ils sont meilleurs que Dubya n'indique pas beaucoup. |
| 2005/5/3 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Computer/Rants] UID:37472 Activity:nil |
5/3 http, dig dis://<DEAD>www.msnbc.msn<DEAD> 'S coo', http://bro.com/id/7693580/site/newsweek/consenso "Beijin'": China out-maneuverin' polÃtico ylos E.E.U.U. diplomatically ineptos.japoneses del \_ los "no se han compo'tado puh'fectamente, sino que se han several para su agresión del tiempo de guerra. Sheeeiit."el Also, mi lectura del artÃculo es que, polÃtico, China tiene been to'pe. What it is, Mama! Sayin' son mejo'es que Dubya no está diciendo mucho. |
| 2005/5/3-4 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Uncategorized/German] UID:37469 Activity:high |
5/3 http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7693580/site/newsweek "Beijing Concensus": China out-maneuvering politically and diplomatically inept Bush-led US. - Chicom Troll \_ "Japanese have not behaved perfectly, but they have apologized several times for their wartime aggression." Also, my reading of the article is that, politically, China has been clumsy, or at least, average. been clumsy. Saying they're better than Dubya isn't saying much. \_ Alright. Not to agree with chicom troll, but I have to. Sure, China is acting politically, and certainly the great leap forward killed more Chinese than the Japanese did. Neither of those negate the virtue or lack thereof of Japan's actions. Again, I ask you[motd], what would the reaction be if Germany changed their textbooks to play down the atrocities committed during WW2? What would the reaction be if the German president visited and paid his respects to national cemeteries where Nazi commanders were buried? -nivra \_ this kind of statement really angers me. Japan never issue formal apology in writing. Japan, as a government, never address the issues such as "comfort women." Company profited from the war, and active participation of war crimes never set up a trust fund for its behavior. And, more importantly, much of Chinese national treasure were taken by Japan Imperial Army and never gotten returned. Much of these treasure are sitting in Tokyo's Imperial Palace today. Chinese wanted to search the Imperial Palace but it was denied by American. If Japan is not interested in the seat in the security consoul in UN, Japan would NEVER issue some of those half-hearted apologies at first place. Then again, Japan could never get away with any of these crime without American's backing. (Unit 731, and its largest biological / chemical warfare in history of mankind... example) Most Chinese don't realize that half of the blame lies upon USA \_ So where's all your righteous indignation over the atrocities committed against the Chinese people by the Chinese communist government? Unlike the pre-war Japanese government, those bastards actually still have power. Does that really not bother you? \_ Separate issues, the Japanese really should just issue a written apology and get it over with. That said, the whole "IT USA FAULT!" thing is horseshit, and you might ask where the Chinese apologies for illegal intervention against 3 sovereign countries (S. Korea, Tibet, Vietnam) are... -John \_ sollten unterschiedliche Ausgaben, der Japaner eine schriftliche Entschuldigung wirklich gerade herausgeben und sie mit rüber erhalten. Das sagte, das Ganze ", das ES, BEMÄNGELN USA!" Sache ist horseshit und Sie konnten fragen, wo die chinesischen Entschuldigungen für ungültige Intervention gegen 3 souveräne Länder (S. Korea, Tibet, Vietnam) sind... - John \_ sollten unterschiedliche Ausgaben, der Japaner eine schriftliche Entschuldigung wirklich gerade herausgeben und sie mit rüber erhalten. Das sagte, das Ganze ", das ES, BEMÃNGELN USA!" Sache ist Pferd ScheiÃe und Sie konnten fragen, wo die chinesischen Entschuldigungen für ungültige Intervention gegen 3 souveräne Länder (S. herausgeben und sie mit rM-CM-<ber erhalten. Das sagte, das Ganze ", das ES, BEMM-CNGELN USA!" Sache ist Pferd ScheiM-Ce und Sie konnten fragen, wo die chinesischen Entschuldigungen fM-CM-<r ungM-CM-<ltige Intervention gegen 3 souverM-CM-$ne LM-CM-$nder (S. Korea, Tibet, Vietnam) sind... - John [restored. i have no problem with transcoding John to german, but please fix the formatting.] \_ If you have a chance, do some home work. Find out why Japanese Emperor was never being tried in the numerberg trial. I bought up Unit 731, something that is totally googable if you actually give a shit about those yellow skin's lives. You just might find that American let those who conducted the largest chemical/biological warfare in history of man kind gotten away with their crime in exchange for those experimental data obtained by using live human subjects so USA can design better chemical/biological weapons themselves. and... Tibet is not a sovereign nation since late 17th century. If you dont' care about this subject, then, don't bother have an opinion on it. If you do, then, do your homework before calling things "horse shit" and make fools of yourself. \_ Nice post nuke. Oh by the way, did I say you're an idiot? -John \_ No, really kngharv. Why are you pretending to be Chinese? be Chinese? -jrleek \_ do mormons all act the same way? \_ Further proof that mormons are ______ \_ Take a look at this, retard: http://www.eecs.berkeley.edu/~tking \_ How does a guy named "Harvey H. King" come to have such bad english? \_ She sure looks like MLK's daughter. \_ I am lost, what does this have to do with anything? \_ Proving to me that King is a chinese name. Apparently kngharv really is Chinese. He's still full of crap, but at least he's a legitimate chicom troll. \_ Uhm. Tsu-Jae is Korean. \_ Sigh. That one King is Asian doesn't prove that all Kings are Asian. I guess they don't teach logic at Cal anymore. \_ That's true, but I also googled him. \_ Whoah, cool. I thought kngharv looked liked a Eastern European name but I was wrong. \_ Go Chicom! |
| 2005/4/28 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/Japan, Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:37393 Activity:kinda low |
4/28 "In FY04 the U. S. Government spent $322 Billion of your money on
interest payments* to the holders of the National Debt. Compare that
to NASA at $15 Billion, Education at $61 Billion, and Department of
Transportation at $56 Billion."
So who are the "holders of the National Debt."? Bankers?
http://www.federalbudget.com
\_ Central banks of other countries (Japan, China, ...)?
\_ What is the interest rate? I mean, it sounds to me like it's
worth investing your money at banks that lend to U.S.
\_ Mo' money, mo' money, mo' money!
\_ Not very high interest. I think new T-bills are around 4.3%.
\_ one of the lowest you can get. but sure it is a lot safer
to finance the US govt. as opposed that of some other country
like Argentina..
\_ And how much more was borrowed, leading to larger interest payments
the next year? Isn't borrowing to pay for your interest a sign
that you're on the verge of bankruptcy?
\_ no.
\_ Heh, the US should declare bankruptcy and be absolved of all debt.
\_ Read "Interface" by Neal Stephenson
\_ Well by a pen name. And that book really feels like it is missing
about 100 pages in the middle. |
| 2005/4/22-25 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/Asia/Japan] UID:37322 Activity:very high |
4/22 I haven't read much on the news, what do the Koreans think about
the current situation between China and Japan?
\_ Aren't they mad about that book that got approved that took out
references to comfort women?
\_ The Koreans are pretty mad about the books as well, but they
haven't attacked anything Japanese over it. (2 people cut off
fingers and one guy lit himself on fire) The protests over
comfort women in front of the Japanese embassy are practically
standard by now. The Koreans are also mad because one of the
new text books claims Dokdo, a tiny pair of Korean held
islands, is illegally occupied by the Koreans. -jrleek
\_ Wow, there's still arguments over that island? I remember
learning about it when I was a kid. Koreans actually have a song
that proclaims how Dokdo belongs to Korea.
\_ Yeah. My wife can sing that song. "Dokdo-nun oori ddang!"
I reserve judgement a bit, because I've never heard the
Japanese side of the story, but my understanding is that
the only time the Japanese ever controlled the island was
1905-1945. Since Korea was occupied by Japan in 1906, I
don't really think that counts. -jrleek
\_ This is pretty correct, but those who cut off their fingers did
so because of Dokdo, not because of the history books. Also,
I think there's generally a lot more anger in China and Korea
than over just the issue of sex slavery; there were a whole slew
of war atrocities commited by imperialist Japan--sex slavery
simply appears to be either the only one well vocalized or the
only one covered by the media.
\_ You're right, although I kinda see those as related since
a lot of the Dokdo hubbub is over the textbooks, but
there's also "Takeshima Day" which pissed off a lot of
Koreans. As for the comfort women, I think they get
covered the most because some of them are still alive
(80, I think) and actively protesting. Most war
atrocities result in dead people. Dead people are very
poor at active protesting. -jrleek
\_ My personal opinion is that the best way to resolve the
situation would be for Japan to revise it's text books, and for
China to pay for the repairs to the Japanese embassy. I don't
really think Japan has to continue to atone for it's past sins,
but it shouldn't try to deny them either. However, by allowing
it's citizens to riot and damage the Japanese embassy, China
was in direct violation of it's signed treaties. -jrleek
\_ The problem is that 1) The "honor" thing is very important in
Japanese culture than in mordern Chinese and western cultures
\_ The problem is that 1) The "honor" thing is more important in
\_ FYI it's "its" not "it's" in the context you're using it.
\_ The problems are that 1) The "honor" thing is more important in
Japanese culture than in mordern Chinese and western culture
(don't know about Korean), 2) The monarchy is a continuation of
the one in the past. So it's very hard to make Japan admin they
were evil.
\_ 3) Is Chinese your first language?
\_ Yes. Your point?
\_ Perhaps your opinion might be biased? In any case,
you stereotype of the Japanese is unfortunate.
\_ But in this situation probably pretty accurate, at
least relating to this situation. Putting aside
the whole Yasukuni thing (as there's at least _some_
point to it), what other reasons could you think
of for Japanese schools not wanting to adopt a text-
book which owns up to prettty hideous war crimes?
(and don't start with "the-US-did-this, the-other-
colonial-powers-did-that, there's (a) an order of
magnitude of difference, and (b) most western
countries have or are coming around to admitting
having caused some bad shit. I'm not saying the
Chinese approach is anything less than reprehensibly
opportunistic, but there's sure a lot of potential
for Japan to take the moral high ground. -John
\_ So how do the Germans deal with their history
textbook issues? How is WWII presented in
German schools?
\_ "We really really fucked up and did lots of
bad shit and we have to make sure that it
never happens again". Although the situation
with them is a bit different, as the Japanese
committed widespread wanton brutality, not
really genocide per se. And yes there is a
lot of resistance to the constant guilt thing
in Germany. -John
\_ BTW, your English could still use a bit of work.
\_ When this thing is eventually settled, China WILL pay
for the damage to Japanese properties. Whether Japan
will alter the text book or not, it remains to be see
(highly unlikely).
\_ nah, I doubt China will pay a cent.
\_ what are you willing to bet? -chiry
\_ Didn't the Chinese govt pay for the damaged US embassy?
Of course, that doesn't compare to the laser guided
bomb that landed on the Chinese embassy.
\_ They need to pay for that bomb.
\_ yea, but US is scary country. PRC always try
to avoid conflict with US. Also, US didn't
murder millions of Chinese civilians, or use
them for medical experiments.
\_ No, the PRC has done enough of this themselves.
Also, see recent stories on Uighurs.
\_ Ask people in PRC, and they will say GLP
and GPCR sucked. They will also say the
last quarter century of economic reform
and prosperity was good. What's your
point?
\_ That the PRC is manipulating medium-grade
anger over a text-book written by Right
Wingers in a foreign country to push for
greater bargaining power over oil fields in
ambiguously owned waters while continuing to
stifle any criticism of the PRC's own
atrocities, some of which are ongoing.
Physician, heal thyself.
\_ err ... I think everyone knows that
already.
\_ on a related note, 100 youngsters (in their 20s) came to the
street of tokyo protesting against the textbook. (from hk
newspaper)
\_ Native students or Chinese?
\_ natives plus foreigners from around the earth. |
| 2005/4/22-23 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:37315 Activity:kinda low |
4/22 China is not playing by the rule? how about USA?
http://www.economist.com/agenda/displayStory.cfm?story_id=3905158
\_ Bad Chicom troll.
\_ We're not. Unfair subsidies, trade barriers, etc. But we're
a lot lot lot less worse. Bad Chicom troll. -John
\_ The content of the url does not match well the title given by
op, but come on, this is the motd. The article's point is made
across when the like of John say "We're not" "bad chicom troll"
without even attempting to make an argument. Of course Americans
have the right to be self-righteous, just like citizens of any
country. But self-righteousness alone rarely lead to progress.
The mental picture of Chinese government being a superefficient
evil planner scheming to undercut fair American market prices
through currency manipulation and subsidy is a figment of idiotic
imagination. The government doesn't decide the price and and
exercise little control over the amount of export. Subsidy
is small. Very very few Chinese companies directly export to
the US market. The low prices are dictated on them by large
US companies like walmart. I have Chinese acquaintances in export
who are desperate to hike the price but cannot, because they have
no leverage against the American middleman. For various reasons,
they cannot bypass the later and enter US market directly.
\_ OK I'll use complete sentences, since you seem to have had
a liberal helping of thicko juice for breakfast: The op's
trollish argument is nonsense. Although he has a point that
the US violates a lot of international trade treaty rules,
through mechanisms such as subsidies and unfair tariffs, what
we do by no means even starts to match up against Chinese
continued refusal to float currency, functional restrictions
on FDI, hideous labor practices and, and engaging in legally
"bad" stuff such as industrial espionage and completely
disregarding IP rights (talk to any westerner who's ever
opened a factory/plant/office in China to see what I mean.)
You may now go on trolling about "oh n0es, poor China) -John |
| 2005/4/21-22 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/Europe] UID:37298 Activity:high |
4/21 Buh, duh, huh?
http://www.dw-world.de/dw/article/0,1564,1559253,00.html
France Backs China on Taiwan
\_ The French gov't makes me feel icky.
\-C HITCHENS had a great comment about J CHIRAC:
"a man, like the banker in Flaubert's Sentimental Education,
'so corrupt that he would willingly pay for the pleasure of
selling himself".'
--psb
\_ It's wrong for France to back the Anti-Secession Law, especially
when France is going against the countervailing current of world
opinion that the law was unnecessary and increased tensions.
As for the EU trying to convince the U.S. that it's okay for them
to sell arms to China, the argument is:
Russia is selling them the h07 sh17 w34P0N5 tech, so why aren't you
blaming them?
Then again, two wrongs don't make a right, so I consider the EU
selling advanced arms to China as also wrong.
\_ The US has been selling weapons to the world's worst people
for a generation. It is amazingly hypocritical for us to
complain about the EU doing the same thing.
\_ Which country is not hypocritical? France and other European
countries had been colonizing much of the world. China
annexed Tibet and Xinjiang hundreds of years ago. Taiwan
(the Nationalists) were oppressing the native Taiwanese
decades ago.
\_ So the French are simply following in their own best
self interest, instead of doing what we want them to
do. Is that your complaint? Especially after all the
cheese-eating surrender monkey crap, they probably feel
like we are not really an ally anymore. What a surprise.
\_ The term Taiwanese, used by the pro-independence groups,
actually refers to Chinese who settled there before
Japan annexed Taiwan, rather than the aborigines, whom
the pro-independence groups want to wipe out. But it
was a very clever invention perfect for eliciting knee
jerk "Taiwan belongs to Taiwanese" slogan.
\_ Before the law was passed, Taiwan's defense minister proposed
arming missles with chemical weapons and its legistators boasted
developing nukes. That stopped after the law is passed. Seems
like a good law.
\_ increased tensions, yes, but why is the law unnecessary?
\_ China doesn't need a law passed by the People's Congress
saying they can invade to invade.
\_ With a maturing government, China is becoming more reliant
on legal codes and protcol than short term political whim.
Every country goes through different periods. Dont' forget
until < 100 years ago CA was the WWW and "the law" was a
joke.
\_ This url goes to a pair of enormous floppy breasts.
\_ And the above posters are just bots who react to the word China
the way I have programmed them.
\_ Fixed. |
| 2005/4/13-15 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:37184 Activity:low |
4/13 More biased journalism against our glorious workers'^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H
capitalist paradise! We do not repress our own population! We do
not arrest journalists! Everyone is happy in China, and we hold
spontaneous group sing-alongss to celebrate our good fortune and
our beneficient leaders! This is nothing but Western propaganda!
"Rural Chinese Riot as Police Try to Halt Pollution Protest"
http://csua.org/u/bot
\_ I can only imagine how hellish the country side is given that I
almost threw up just sitting in traffic in Shanghai. The vehicle
fumes were terrible and this was only in January. We visited a
rural tourist area and I'm sure it's pretty good by rural
standards, but the people there still looked pretty damn desperate.
\_ Yes Chinese media are still under wide censorship though state media
for years have been reporting on corruption, pollution and other
problems, often bravely testing, sneaking around, and pushing open
orthodox limitations; yes freedom to assembly in China is still an
illusory dream although demonstrations are becoming quite common.
If you think censorship is wrong, I fully agree with you. I also
think it is a shame that most western journalists so readily succumb
to the worship of ego, money, power and their own tunnel vision,
when in theory they are so far from real peril or hardship.
But if you are just bearing a grudge because your own dirty laundry
is being aired, you deserve to live in North Korea. And if all the
junk news you are fed with causes you think mainland China today is
a rigid society where everybody dance in unison everyday to one dear
leader, your closed mind is just wasting away.
\_ No! There is no censorship! There is no corruption! We are
free to assemble! And we burst out in song to sing praises of
the party (in scenes oddly reminiscent of a '50s musical)! You
have been systematically misinformed by your biased Western
media that put a negative spin on everything about China!
\_ Woah! It's llorTmocihC! |
| 2005/4/13-14 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:37173 Activity:high |
4/13 What an extremely misleading title.
"China Accuses Japan of Distorting History"
http://tinyurl.com/5l7yt (yahoo news).
\_ China bashing at its best, wow.
\_ What is the author trying to say? That the collective Chinese
people should not protest against Japan because of Chinese govt's
wrongdoing? Sure, Chinese govt has its share of wrongdoing in other
areas, and for that let the Indians and Vietnamese and the Hong Kong
people protest against it. But that doesn't mean the Chinese people
shouldn't protest against Japanese govt and people. It's one thing
when people in an oppressive country are forced to agree with its
govt's wrongdoing, but it's another thing when people in a
democratic country agree with its govt's wrongdoing.
\_ What if you're a Chinese citizen and you want to protest jailings
of pro-Democracy students or protest the Tiananmen Square
massacre?
\_ As with any country, you can only protest what the
government allows you to protest. Try protest to
overthrow the current government, as in "form armed
militia" like the original constitution allows. See
what the US government will do.
\_ It's good to be a member of the People's Congress!
\_ It's better to be the Speaker of the House.
\_ Then I'll go to jail. Yes, the Chinese govt is hypocritic (in
that it does it share of histroy distortion and in that its
people's "constituional right to protest" only applies to
protests that it favors) and this is its wrongdoing. But like
I said above, the Chinese govt's wrongdoing does not
un-justify the Chinese people's protest. |
| 2005/4/12-14 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:37161 Activity:high |
4/12 HAHAHA! HA...heehehe...ahem...
http://csua.org/u/bo3 (engrish.com)
\_ boy, that's funny. I'm sure your Chinese is much better. -tom
\_ http://www.engrish.com rules so much happy toilet joy for someone
\_ What does this have to do with Chinese? -- dumber than tom
\_ Nothing at all. In fact, I'm not sure tom posted that since he
usually has more clue. http://engrish.com is a great place for
something that everyone I know who has been to Japan for more
than a couple of days appreciates. We used to compete for who
could find the pencil boxes with the most bizarre phrasing.
No where is erikred when we need him? Incidentally, if you
want a good cultural parallel, try what Americans do with
Chinese/Japanese characters - particularly as tattoos.
-- ulysses
\_ http://www.hanzismatter.com
\_ There's also the menu with "Fried Crap with Spicy Sauce" and the
"Thundercrap" brand fireworks...
\_ It's very easy for a Japanese to confuse "L" with "R", since both
sounds "map" to the same sound in Japanese. This excuse doesn't
apply to Chinese.
\_ Some Chinese also cannot pronounce "L". My friend from Taiwan
went to a place called SuFa for some kind of Christian program.
Took me a while to figure out she was referring to "Sioux Falls"
\_ that's something different: not being able to end a word
with a consonant. not quite the same as mixing up L/R
sounds. in Thailand, you get both of these problems plus
a difficulty with adjacent consonents. "central" for example
is pronounced cen-tun because the "tr" is too hard and
Thai words can end on "n" but never on "l". for Thai, and
I think Chinese, much of the meaning is communicated in
the vowels and tones, and the consonents are almost
superfluous. the listener can sort out mistakes and noise
in consonants better than vowels, and people get sloppy
with consonants because of this. |
| 2005/4/10-12 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/Asia/Japan] UID:37134 Activity:high |
4/10 So, I'm hearing all this crap about social security becoming insolvent
because we won't have enough taxpayers to support the baby boomers.
What I haven't heard anything about is, why not allow more *skilled*
immigrants into the country? Why not allow people educated here to
stay in the country? We spend all this money on educating these
foreign nationals, and then make them leave, even if they'd like to
stay. Allowing them to stay would obviously make for more taxpayers,
more consumer demand, etc. And it's not really like we don't have
the land; Japan can cram well over half the population of the US into
a space smaller than California. The drawback is of course national
security "concerns", and the notion that foreigners will be competing
for our jobs. What do you people think?
\_ The US's prosperity was built largely on brain drain from
foreign countries with poorer conditions than here. Hindering
the brain drain in the name of national security is going to
bite us in the ass bigtime. Having poor schools in this country
is going to bite us in the ass bigtime too. It's a pity we
have to suffer through cowardly leaders who only care about
short term gain.
\_ Nice sentiment, but where did the obsession with ass-biting
get mixed into this?
\_ The US's ability to brain drain will probably be more
impacted by effective competition from foreign schools.
We'll probably still have the top schools, but the top 100
schools won't be 90% in the US.
\_ The U.S. taxpayer just finished spending a quarter of a million
dollars to pay for my Mainland Chinese friend's phd in solid state
physics. Due
to laws that almost redefine the phrase "government idiocy" she
may be unable to work in this country where we can benefit from
her education because all of "nanotechnology" has been declared
sensitive, and everyone in solid state physics wants to call their
work nanotech to get on the funding gravy train. Dumb dumb dumb.
I don't know the details of the ban, but it extends to the private
sector. "Sorry, you can't contribute to our economy. We're just
going to spend a quarter of a million dollars training you, then
force you to go back home and compete with us economically."
\_ you should consult a mental health professional
\_ Well, thanks for that ad hominem attack. BTW, I'm actually
born in the states, and this is not a troll. It is
practically a certainty at this point that our population will
not grow fast enough to support the boomers. It seems like the
obvious way to grow the population is to bring in other people,
very preferably ones who can contribute to our economy instead
of ending up on welfare.
\_ I have an idea that will help: ban abortion.
\_ See the welfare argument.
\_ It is my opinion that lots of skilled immigrants are already
ending up here. They are indeed taking jobs from Americans,
because they are willing to work for less. I fail to see how
this benefits the country. Do you really want to import doctors
from former Soviet Republics, like Spain is doing?
\_ Well, it is not clear if their presence here creates more jobs
than they take. Do dumb hicks contribute much to our economy?
In one sense, yes, since they fuel consumer demand by living
beyond their means. In another sense, no, because they're stupid
and don't increase our competitiveness. I'm not saying it should
be a free-for-all, or that foreign nationals should be allowed
in all fields, especially when we are not sure what their
education is relative to the standards in this country. But
especially for foreigners who got college or graduate degrees
in this country, not allowing them to stay seems rather silly.
After all, you can say that they deprived some US citizen of a
spot at whatever school they went to, so what's the big deal now?
\_ Is there evidence that lots of people who earned graduate
degrees here are not able to stay? Observationally, I
don't see that problem in the fields I am familiar with
(aerospace engineering, software engineering, hard
science, and entertainment).
\_ Yes. Please read my post about Chinese physicists in the
U.S. above. Admittedly, my evidence is also anecdotal, but
since most of the people I know are physics grad students,
and since about half of them are foreign, I think my
anecdotal evidence is relevant. What I see is unthinking
visa policy directly harming American science. It's not
that the *numbers* of foreign scientists wanting to be
in the U.S. will go down any time soon, it's that the
*quality* is going to start going down as the top people
pass up U.S. offers. -!pp
\_ Why does quality matter in terms of Social Security?
The reality is that there are more PhDs being graduated
than there are jobs to employ them.
\_ Fuck social security. The republicans are going
to destroy it anyway. I was just talking about
issues affecting American science in general.
\_ It might not per se, but the point is we would
probably rather have immigrants quality enough to
stay off welfare, and better yet, contribute to
innovation.
\_ It's difficult to stay these days. You need a H-1B to
work in the US, and these get used up in less than
a day everytime new quotas become available (in April
and October). From a company's standpoint, that's
a lot of uncertainty and cost for hiring a foreign
student graduate from US universities. The whole
PR process is also a huge pain and takes forever.
\_ It's difficult to hire foreign nationals. On the
other hand, plenty of them seem to be getting jobs.
Some of them marry Americans, but I have seen no
shortage of PhDs from India, China, and Europe working
here in the US. In fact, I see more than ever before.
Some real statistics and less anecdotal evidence would
be nice.
\_ It's not just difficult to hire, it's also a
pain to stay, so might as well go home,
especially given the opportunities abroad.
\_ There are no opportunities abroad. Maybe in
China. Definitely not in Europe, for
instance. I'd like to see some statistics.
\_ actually there are lots of opportunities
abroad. china, india, hongkong, singapore,
taiwan, korea, japan, ...
\_ Japan is okay, but are there really
that many opportunities for, say,
physicists in India or Singapore?
\_ I grow tired of seeing these posts about how we, as a US
economy keep getting hurt by offshore jobs, brain drain, etc.
All the posts seem very Nationalistic and people fail to take into
account the big picture, we are a global economy. That person
who leaves with a Physics degree eventually may invent
something in China that benefits someone in the US and
globally. You can always go micro and say "Contra Costa is losing
jobs to San Fran", but eventually we all benefit from knowledgeable
people no matter what tax bucket their income falls in.
\_ Are you the "Little Chinese"? |
| 2005/4/1 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:37024 Activity:nil |
3/31 Hey small Chinese guy. Did you know you could add 5 inches in one
year for only $6K? (of height, not length) http://csua.org/u/bjo |
| 2005/3/31-4/1 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:37004 Activity:low |
3/31 Looking for a decent (and preferable free/cheap) English to Chinese
and Chinese to English translation program. A while ago I saw this guy
moving his mouse to select CNN articles, right click on something and
a pop-up comes up with full translation. That guy is gone and now
I'm wondering what he uses, and if it's free. Thanks.
\_ http://babelfish.altavista.com
\_ http://www.google.com/language_tools |
| 2005/3/25-26 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:36887 Activity:high |
3/25 Is Ping an Asian last name?
\_ No. But it is a common Chinese first name. -emarkp
\-YMWTS: The Story of Ping --psb
\_ Do you mean "The Story About Ping"? Read an old beat-up copy
when I was a child. Have a nice new copy that I read to my
kids. -emarkp
\- I mean the "insightful and intuitive explanation of one of
Unix's most venerable networking utilities ... The book
describes networking in terms even a child could understand,
choosing to anthropomorphize the underlying packet struc-
ture." --psb
\_ Yes I found http://yyz.us/ping.shtml Same book. -emarkp
\_ Yes, it is one of the 100 Chinese last names.
http://www.chinapage.com/biography/lastname.html , 6 rows down, 2nd from the right.
http://www.chinapage.com/biography/lastname.html
6 rows down, 2nd from the right.
\_ So is there a Chinese man named Pong Ping?
\- No, but there are 500k Chinese names Lo Fat, and sloda
has its own Hi Fat Pet. |
| 2005/3/22-24 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Computer/Rants] UID:36814 Activity:nil |
3/22 Interesting. China can put a man in orbit but needs to buy night
vision goggles from EU?
\_ Who said they *NEED* to? Maybe the EU sells better ones and China
hasn't gotten around to ripping off their technology yet.
\_ The US put a man in orbit 50 years ago. When were night vision
goggles invented?
\_ China wants to buy offensive weaponry from the EU, e.g., the
Tiger attack helo, being built by a joint French-German-Spanish
venture. 80% of the airframe will be constructed of lightweight
composite materials. First deliveries are this year with 80 for
France and 80 for Germany.
\_ We can put a man on the moon, and we need to buy computers from
China.
\_ We invented the Internet, and we download Japanese pr0n.
\_ Regardless of whether China really needs the night vision goggles
and other European-made weapons (they have been buying pretty much
anything they want from Russia throughout the last 10 years), the
lift of the European weapons sales ban would certainly be a very
significant political victory for PRC. |
| 2005/3/22-23 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Computer/Networking] UID:36813 Activity:nil |
3/22 Chinese Wifi: http://www.engadget.com/entry/1234000510037092 |
| 2005/3/8-10 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/Europe] UID:36589 Activity:nil |
3/8 Curious, did UK ever pass an anti-independence bill back in 1700's?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/4331443.stm |
| 2005/3/3-4 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Israel] UID:36513 Activity:moderate |
3/3 The top post is awesome
http://littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog
\_ Well, now it's the second post.
\_ I see more posts dated today than I'm willing to read on a
Shithead(tm) site. Please identify exactly which post you
think is "awesome."
\_ I'm betting this one: http://tinyurl.com/5bpuc |
| 2005/2/24-25 [Reference/Languages, Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:36407 Activity:high |
2/24 How do people who use a pen to write in Arabic and Hebrew avoid
smudging the letters as they write? This seems like a design flaw.
\_ I'm left handed and manage English just fine. Although when learning
Persian (also right to left), I did like the fact that there was
less smear potential.
\_ I'm amazed that my totally random post was replied to by a
lefty who's studied Persian. Go motd!
\_ Yeah. Sometimes I think we need to step back and truly
appreciate the utility of the motd.
\_ When I was little I would end up with the side of my hand totally
filthy with graphite. Now I don't have problems except with
particularly slow drying ink. Now that I think about it, my hand
position when writing looks a little contorted compared to most
peoples'. So I guess that's how I avoid smudging. -lefty
\_ I don't have preferences in terms of right or left hands. So,
when I start to learn how to write Chinese, I choose to write with
left hand for this particular reason.
\_ Does your handwriting look different from right-handed people's?
My brother's starting to write Chinese, and he keeps complaining
that the characters don't look right when he writes them with his
left (preferred) hand.
\_ huh? I thought Chinese is written left to right in PRC,
and it's top to bottom, then right to left, (so you get
more drying time) in Taiwan. Even people in Taiwan
go left to right when writing in horizontal rows as
opposed to traditional vertical rows. In fact, I have
a friend who is a lefty but writes Chinese with right
hand, because Chinese is more easily written with right
hand, as each character is written diagonally from top
left corner to bottom right corner.
\_ Pick up any Chinese book, and it's top to bottom, right to
left. That's why the cover page is on the bottom of the
book or the binding to the right, depending on your
perspective. And, yes, smudging was an issue when I learned
to write with the brush (or whatever it's called in English).
Though caligraphy was done on a very porous and therefore
quick-absorbing paper, and that ameliorates the problem
somwhat.
\_ In calligraphy, isn't your hand and arm not supposed
to be resting on the paper irregardless?
\_ Yep. The correct way to hold the pen has your hand
and wrist elevated above the paper. However, one still
has to account for jacket sleeves or just incorrect
posture.
\_ Chinese has been traditionally written top to bottom then
right to left for thousands of years. It was the PRC who
imported English-style writing to Chinese, together with
English characters for phonetics. Taiwan sticks with the
the traditional way of writing and phonetics.
the traditional way of writing and phonetics. -- Hong Kong
Chinese
\_ I am aware of that. I don't mind top to bottom but
why right to left (column wise)? It's inconsistent
with the top-left to bottom-right manner where
each character is written. - tainan taiwanese
\_ Good point. I have no idea. -- Hong Kong Chinese
\_ THERE ARE NO LEFT HANDED CHINESE.
\_ Haven't you seen when the 1.2 billion people in PRC clap their
hands, they clap their left hands over their right hands?
They are all left handed. -- troll
\_ Well, traditionally, left-handed kids are "trained" out of
their tendency to use their left hand. After all, the left
hand is the hand sinister. |
| 2005/2/17 [Recreation/Dating, Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:36215 Activity:high |
2/17 "As Girls 'Vanish', Chinese City Battles Tide of Abortions"
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/02/17/international/asia/17china.html?hp
Whatever happened to a woman's right to choose? Why aren't we all
up in arms about this?
\_ Chiense police come to beat the shit out of you right now!!!11
\_ Just wait till their son grows up and tries to find a
woman. Ignorance is best paid this way.
\_ Only if he joins the CSUA.
\_ You don't need to wait. This is already a problem at present.
\_ S. Korea the same problem, although not nearly so severe, since
you can still have as many babies as you want there. They
outlawed doctors telling the sex of the baby to parents before
birth completely. This seems to have improved things. The
current birth rates are more or less back to normal, although
the 20 year olds are out of wack. It also meant that my wife
really wanted to know the sex of our daughter before she was
born just because she couldn't if she was in Korea. -jrleek
\_ So, what sex _was_ your daughter?
\_ same for Taiwan, and India. The problem should slowly
go away as a country industrializes.
\_ The answer is technology. If you could offer couples to
chose any baby's sex, FOR FREE (subsidized by the gov),
would this problem still exist?
\_ huh? most of them would choose "male" at this
point in time, which would be a problem.
A simple solution would be to offer some artificial
incentive for giving birth to baby girls, such as
say $3000 bucks.
say $3000 bucks. I don't understand why China
doesn't do something like that.
\_ 40 million unmarried men = nice "peoples" army
\_ coming to beat the shit out of you RIGHT NOW@%5!1
\_ All coming to steal our women...
\_ SERVES YOU WHITE MEN RIGHT! -Hoyt Sze
\_ In a way, that kinda sounds like slavery. |
| 2005/2/16-17 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Computer/Rants] UID:36207 Activity:kinda low |
2/16 Do TVs and VCRs in China use NTSC format? If I record a tape with my
VCR here, can someone in China watch it? Thanks.
\_ A lot of VCRs there are dual format. Most likely they will be able
to watch it.
\_ nobody here has VCRs. Only DVD and VCD players.
\_ I have 2, shut the fuck up. -!op
\_ I have betamax! |
| 2005/1/31 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:36001 Activity:kinda low |
1/31 Curious: what do you think the percentages are for Cal's Chinese
student population, in terms of mainland PRC vs. Taiwan vs. ABC?
\_ Don't forget Hong Kong.
\_ HKG is PRC.
\_ nah, they are culturally different, and unique enough
to have their own category. and don't forget us sporeans
and other se asian chinese.
\_ And, say, Shanghai or Shenzen (sp?) aren't culturally
different from each other or from the rest of China?
When I fill out official documents, I use "HKG, CHN",
not "HKG, HKG".
\_ Shanghai and Shenzen are culturally different, but not
as different as Shanghai and HK or Shenzen and HK.
\_ I think you forget that PRC is agrarian and third
world outside the special economic zones.
diff(non-SEZ CHN, Shanghai) >> diff(HKG, Shanghai). |
| 2005/1/27 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:35941 Activity:very high |
1/27 ilyas, as a libertarian (ie fuck government, help thyself)
what do you think about the Chinese culture? For many centuries,
the Chinese culture has had internal problems which it dealt
with via means other than government solutions. For example,
the core of the Chinese culture is a family, where one
gets financial support (family=business) as well as retirement
plans (parents always live in the same household), food
(family cooks/eats same food together), etc. This is a cycle
of course, where young men know that they have to be a
productive members of society so that they could raise good
families so that their children would take care of them in the
future.
\_ Let me ask you this, what do Chinese people think about their
history and culture (the totalitarian/collectivist, or if you
prefer a more positive word, communal bits)? -- ilyas
\_ I am not sure I agree that "collectivist" and "communal"
should be applied to Chinese history and culture,
at least not until the founding of the PRC. Where did
you get the idea?
\_ I think there are strong communal elements in Chinese
culture itself (as well as Russian culture), which is why
I think communism was able to take hold there. -- ilyas
\_ what communal elements, pray tell us?
\_ it was doing pretty well, IMHO until the white men brought over
'things' that changed people's mentality and ultimately
destabilized the country.
\_ If you call millions dying every once in a while
"pretty well".
\_ relative to Europe in the Dark Ages, YES.
\_ Well that's not a good time to compare. Europe
was doing really well until the damn Jews
fucked it up with their religion.
Anyway your example of the Chinese family unit
isn't very good. Most other cultures had to rely
on that before modern times, and most still do
in a basic way. What other examples do you have
of Chinese non-government solutions?
\_ Not just the Dark Ages. The Chinese Empire
fared reasonably well from around Roman times
till the 1700s.
\_ what things? opium?
\_ ideologies. physical goods. drugs. envy.
\_ There was no envy in China?
\_ not sure I speak for most Chinese people but I'm pretty proud
of the history from its beginning to about 200 years ago. Sure
there were wars and disease and famine and <stick in whatever
negative thing you can think of> but the empire flourished
because of its hard working people who believe in family
values, stability, education, hard work, self-reliance,
family-reliance, and traditions. In fact these are traits that
many Chinese people still have, and will still honor for
centuries to come.
Now tell us what you think about the Chinese culture and
if you see parallels in your ideology.
\_ I am going to split your question into two.
(1) I have a profound respect for Chinese culture, I think
it contributed immensely to humanity as a whole.
(2) I think a glib way to describe what I view as a chief ill
in society is an 'unmeritocratic hierarchy.' Humans need
hierarchies to scale their activities, but all sorts of
problems come up if these hierarchies don't let the cream
rise to the top. This can happen in business, government, and
family. This is what I think the problem is. I don't know
how to structure a society that avoids 'unmeritocracy' from
creeping into naturally arising hierarchies a society must
have. I am not sure if this is a coherent answer to what you
were asking. -- ilyas
\_ In China, it's called the dynastic cycle.
\_ don't forget the concubines
\_ that's definitely good. definitely. -liberal
\_ that's evil, pure evil. -conservative |
| 2005/1/27 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:35939 Activity:moderate |
1/27 MANIFEST DESTINY!!! Just as we freed the Tibetan plateau
with our generosity (free red Mao books laden with Communist
teachings), we should free the Taiwan province for
better use for Chinese. MANIFEST DESTINY!!!
\_ Bring the Gospel to China. Free China! |
| 2005/1/26 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:35902 Activity:high |
1/26 Boston Terrorists a Hoax:
http://csua.org/u/au9 (Reuters)
In other news, you can win an iPod if you send email to
president@whitehouse.gov with the subject "I Will Kill You."
\_ they did say (at the same time the photos were being splashed
and freepers forums were in pandemonium) that the tip was
completely uncorroborated
\_ That was just an escape clause to disavow any responsibility.
How about shouting fire in a crowded theatre and add that it is
uncorroborated? Even after 9/11, the fed is not supposed to
announce false rumor or slander using government priviledge and
prestige, and it hasn't until now. It was always the press who
went to the fed to ask for details of some actions taken, but
this time the fed went to the press time and again to promote
a tall tale. One has to be very naive not to conclude this is
deliberate at some level of the government. How many "anonymous
tips" as far fetched as this got daily joint press announcement
by the US attorney office and fbi? They are more vigilant at
checking out all the rumors, they are raising alert level without
specifying terror threats, but it is extraordinary to turn a 6th
grade joke into a worldwide man hunt. A lot people (including
those outside US as this was a BIG news everywhere) now mentally
associate China/Chinese with terrorism on account of that news
alone. The revelation that this was a hoax was published much
less extensively, with no fanfare. Many of those who did notice
it, from Safire to washtime to freeper to libertypost would just
complain that Chinese have an easy way around the justcie system,
and they have Wen Hoo Lee, the army chaplain, the LA businesswoma
and now the "nuclear oxide" as "proof." Intended or not, this
is the consequence, and somewhere some people are celebrating.
\_ Who? You're saying this is a government conspiracy to make
Chinese people look bad?
\_ Isn't the motd full of idiots that hates Chinese?
\_ You make it sound as though motd needs an excuse to
hate you.
\_ Be grateful for Bin Ladin, if it weren't for him,
Bush might be invading China right now. Without a public
enemy, how can he fuck with all those budget surpluses?
\_ Awwwwwwwwww. |
| 2005/1/25 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:35885 Activity:very high |
1/25 Why was Mainland China willing to give up outer Mongolia before but is
not willing to give up Taiwan now? Thanks.
\_ Republic of China lost Mongolia because CKS made a deal with Soviet.
Give up Mogolia, in return, stop assistance to Communist in China.
Of course, Soviet never kept their end of bargain. Thus, Republic
of China revolked its recognization of Mogolian's soverignty.
Until this day, Republic of China (e.g. taiwan) still claim
soverignty over Mogolia. When Communist overran the mainland,
as part of cozy up with Soviets and the fact that majority of
nations already recognize Mogolia as a nation, PRC gave up the
soverignty. This is one of the most shameful part of
the Republic's history. And for this reason alone, The Republic of
China deserved to be overthrowned. kngharv
\_ Wow, using this logic, I could argue that the PRC giving up
Mongolia to cozy up with the Soviets was one of the most
shameful parts of PRC's history.
\_ I am not happy with that, but remember unlike ROC, PRC never
had Mongolia. ROC literally handed it to Soviet red army
and then later when it changed its mind it rewrote history
to pretend otherwise. CKS also cozied up to Stalin for quite
a long time and never rose up to the soviets (except for
kidnapping a wrecked civilian ship). PRC on the other
hand fought a very bloody skirmash with the soviets.
\_ Give up? When was Outer Mongolia part of China? Are there even
very many Chinese people living there?
\_ Depends on how the communist party like to define "Chinese".
\_ From what I read, Outer Mongolia broke away from China in 1921
under Soviet backing. The ROC govt never released claim to
that land, but the PRC did. After 1949, Taiwan's version of the
map of R. O. China still included Outer Mongolia while Mainland's
version of P. R. China didn't.
\_ But the population is less than 0.1% Chinese.
\_ Depends on your definition of "Chinese". The common
Chinese (Han?) definition includes more than the Han.
\_ Most americans (left and right alike, except the neo-nazis and
klansman) would find it very offensive/ignorant if someone tell
them only the whites are Americans, but are utterly eager to make
the same statement about other multi-ethnic countries. Why?
\_ Is it that not obvious in terms of geography and economy of each
country?
\_ "Why" doesn't matter. "Whether" matters.
\_ The soviets occupied Outer mongolia by force. As for the later
posts, outer Mongolia was expelling large number of Chinese living
there all the way into the 80's, so yes, at least the outer Mongolia
government thought there are many chinese living there.
\_ There was a revolution. Previous government withdrew to Taiwan.
New government stayed in China. Previous government is not
currently in Mongolia. Duh. |
| 2005/1/18-19 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Computer/SW/OS/Windows] UID:35775 Activity:very high |
1/18 And now, a non political question. I want to do semi-transparent
on a bitmap. Is turning every other bit transparent and staggering
this on every line effective?
\_ It does work, but it doesn't look great. As the poster below
suggested, use a bitmap format with real translucency (like PNG)
if you can.
\_ Are you chinese? Do you understand the effects opium trade
had on china?
\_ Fuck you and your bitmaps. How much did Karl Rove pay you to
to say that about bitmaps?
\_ Obviously you've never served.
\_ Uh, you mean a checkerboard pattern? =P Sure, it's fine, except
that if by "bitmap" you mean a "Windows bitmap", then you don't
get any transparency.
\_ This can make nasty moire patterns on CRT monitors, in case that
matters to OP.
\_ use png files if you can
\_ The easiest way is to create a layered image in whatever tool you
prefer (photoshop, psp, gimp, etc.) and set the transparency. Do
you want to simply make 1 bitmap? Many? Programatically?
\_ I want to have a floating bitmap as a window (already
accomplished) that is semi-transparent so that you can see
everything behind the window. Other option I suppose is to
take a clipped screenshot of everything behind the window
and do an alpha on the two bitmaps, but that seems
to be somewhat difficult to accomplish.
\_ On Windows 2000 or XP, why not use normal alpha? |
| 2005/1/12 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:35674 Activity:high |
1/12 ChiCom troll, at least they didn't call Hu a running a dog:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/4165209.stm
\_ No, no. Hu's on second. What's on first.
\_ That's what I'm asking YOU!
\_ I don't know!
\_ Third base!
\_ (... continued at the end of motd ...)
\_ wow.
\_ Most excellent. Copied to /csua/tmp/husonfirst to
save motd space. |
| 2005/1/10-11 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:35644 Activity:high |
1/10 This is sad. An equivalent will be someone renting out a room
for 1 million $ in the US to aid workers. This is a country
where $5000 can last you years.
"While thousands live in makeshift camps, residents not
affected are renting out homes for $5,000 a month or more to
the hundreds of aid workers flowing in."
\_ In China these people will be put in jail. Man I wish East
Palo Alto and Oakland were part of China, then those black
fuckers will get what they deserves, nothing less will fix
the problem. -pissed off living in these areas
\_ whee. chicom turns teeth-gnashingly racist!
\_ Are you laughing from your rich neighborhood? -aap
\_ Why don't you just move idiot?
\_ Why do you hate the free market? This is ilyas' dream!! |
| 2005/1/9 [Politics/Domestic/California, Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:35617 Activity:high |
1/8 Chinese American who spies for US and then arrested for sleeping with
her handler freed. Judge accuses presecution of serious misconduct.
http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-katrina7jan07,1,3939111.story
\_ http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1316268/posts
\_ Thanks. It is almost always amusing to read the comments
by the freepers. It is also very informative -- not about the
original article but about the freepers themselves. They appear
mostly to be poorly programmed robots. Despite all their
mistrust of the government all but one seemed to know for sure
the fed is right and she is guilty of spying for China. In fact
they seem to know the right answer to everything. If only we
could have a regime change to put them in power.
\_ This is an old case....
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/894913/posts
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/890235/posts
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/889352/posts
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/889197/posts?page=1,50
http://www.cis.umassd.edu/~gleung/nacaf/nb9a.html
\_ But dismissed only now. BTW, what is the special relevance of
the pics on the last link? to the case? Any pics of her is
evidence of guilt? |
| 2004/12/31-2005/1/2 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/Asia/Japan] UID:35506 Activity:high |
12/31 350 million, now that's more like it!!
\_ How much have China, Japan, and Korea donated?
\_ After the tsunami, China was the first foreigh country to send
money, goods, and rescue team to Thailand and probably others
as well. They pledged 2.62M US$ then added an extra 60.46M US$
yesterday. Incidentally, judging by GDP per capita, China is
poorer than two of the countries to which it is donating money.
Its rank is 123th (below average), quite a bit behind
Thailand (97), Malaysia (86). cf Korea (50), Japan (17), USA (3)
\_ Damn fucking US media, I find no mentioning of this.
Yeah, balanced and unbiased, my ass.
\_ So naive, little boy. Go back to drinking your kool-aid.
\_ *IF* USA has pledge to donate let say, $50 million within hours
of diseaster (instead of days), it would of made differences
in opinion poll. China's aid is minute compare with USA, Japan,
and Germany, but China was one of first nation which send out
aids to them.
\_ They didn't spend billions invading another country.
\_ hopefully they buy American first, gotta pump up our economy
\_ they already are. buying cigarrets :p |
| 2004/12/21 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:35379 Activity:very high |
12/21 Hey, chicom troll: is it just me, or was "Hero" a huge propaganda
push for the reunification of China?
\_ John, stop using racist slur. we all know what that "chi" in
chicom stands for.
\_ "reunification" imply china ever not unify. This is lie of
USA diplomacy.
\_ Oh christ. My granny could spoof chicom troll better than you.
\_ typical arogant USA troll. I like to see you spoff chicom
trol better!
\_ whta's chicom?
\_ Not sure. I once posted a quote from the Simpsons and some
anon. motd coward accused me of being chicom.
\_ Chinese communism? *shrug*
\_no, OP meant "Chink Communist"
\_ http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=chicom
\_ Isn't that what the fuck we are doing to Iraq? You fuckhead?
\_ China's propaganda machine pales in comparison to what
BushCo tells to the Iraqi people. You want to hear what real
propaganda is like? Go to Iraq and see what the US is
capable of. And shut the fuck up.
\_ I don't know who to believe, chicom troll or capitalist
scumbag... neither is better than the other. China has
Mao, US has Cheney/Rumsfeld. Evil is what evil does. At
least Mao led China to independence from western aggression
and tells the world don't fuck with us. What the fuck has
Cheney and Romsfeld done other than pocketing billions from
the Iraq war and fucked California during the energy
crisis? The US has sunk to a new low and all the while you
are still chewing out chicom troll jokes? You are hopeless.
\_ Haha, you are my hero! -- ilyas
\_ Mao told the world don't fuck with the Chinese because he's
fucking them himself.
\_ Yeah, just like how the US fucked millions of
native americans, but its ok when WE do it because
we got bigger guns!!
\_ What's the casualty during the Cultural Revolution? How
did Cheney and Rumsfeld fucked millions of native
Americans? (Not that I like Cheney or Rumsfeld, but they
were compared to Mao above.)
\_ http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/marerror.htm
Mao: Great Leap Forward 1959 25.6M
Mao: Cultural Revolution 1965 1.1M
Gulf War 1991 .08M
\_ This is as accurate as some site claiming US killed
billions of native americans.
\_ Iraq war casualty is about 1K U.S. + 15K Iraqi = .02M
\_ Mao: Let's kill our own people for our future
Bush: Let's kill everyone else for our future
Seriously, I don't know what is worse...
\_ Both are bad, but I think the former is worse. A
country's leader is supposed to put his/her countrymen's
interest before people of other countries.
\_ you are, of course, speaking from the perspective
of a narrowminded American. Switch Bush/Mao and
see if your statement is still valid in the
perspective of the mass.
\_ how many chinese would there be (given birthrates)
if mao hadn't eliminated 30 million?
\_ You must be Taiwanese and believe all the lies the
Taiwanese media says about China. |
| 2004/12/21 [Politics/Foreign/Europe, Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:35372 Activity:high |
12/21 http://tinyurl.com/3hwmn US Slips in Attracting the World's Best Students \_ The article indicates a decline in number of students (nothing new there) and does *not* in any way make statements about the "world's best". Quoting the article title (even from the nyt) is inappropriate here because the claim isn't backed up. \_ As far as graduate study, the US has always attracted the best. Therefore, any drop in students means the best are looking elsewhere. \_ Was every grad student who came to the US from abroad "the best"? Your logic is weak. \_ Heh. Some I've met were very good. Most were just willing to take more abuse from their advisors than homegrown students who can walk and get paid better elsewhere. \_ You're already limited by self-selection. When's the last time you visited the campus of say Golden Gate University or St. Mary's? \_ I apologize for being dense, but I'm not getting your point. What is it about those schools? \_ The foreign student population at less selective universities are most likely even less bright than the dullards you've met at your school. Then there are the lowest tier "colleges" where education play second fiddle to the primary task of providing foreign "students" with paper work so they can enter the US. \_ I'm constantly amazed at the number of Japanese attending Jr. college in CA. \_ JC is positively Harvardesque compared to some of the most egregious visa mills. http://brandoncollege.com for example. Are we losing visa mill students or are we losing MIT students? The distinction is important and unaddressed. \_ As is your grasp of the obvious. \_ Unfortunately, your grasp of subtlety is even weaker. \_ From TFA: "Other countries are just starting to expand their capacity for offering graduate education. In the future, foreign students will have far greater opportunities." This is good news for non-US students--they won't necessarily have to come to the US for grad studies (because it's no longer the only game in town). \_ That's ok, those best students are never the right races. \_ The dirty Arabs want to corrupt our precious bodily fluids. \_ You say that like it's a bad thing...http://csua.org/u/agp (NWS) |
| 2004/12/15 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:35301 Activity:very high |
12/14 Say goodbye to Bittorrent you hax0rz!
http://money.cnn.com/2004/12/14/news/fortune500/piracy/index.htm
\_ Have you even looked at Bit Torrent model? Put up a few trackers
in China and see if the MPAA can touch them.
\_ For once, Chicom troll have point. Thank you, China! -John
\_ chicom troll? you must be an old fart john! ;)
\_ John, for some time you have been crying "Chicom troll"
whenever there is any mention of China free of vitriol
on the motd. Did some Chinese abuse you in some way?
You used to be more reasonable, or so I thought.
\_ Isn't http://suprnova.org hosted in the Ukraine or something?
\_ whois says netherlands.
\_ so if I host an anti-Bush site out of US, I will not get
a visit from the CIA? How about child porn and drug
trafficking and prostitution ring? No CIA no FBI? Hmmm
\_ No, you'd probably get a visit from your local law
enforcement community (for the child porn/drug/whore
wite.) Civilized countries tend to frown on that sort
of thing. -John
\_ Do people generally consider Switzerland a
civilized country?
\_ More to the point, do people in Switzerland
consdier Switzerland a civilized country?
\_ Yes, and we get machine guns. -John
\_ Still bitter about the gun debate?
\_ You can take my bulldozer when you
pry it from my cold dead fingers!!
- ilyas #1 fan!
\_ Yay! I finally have a #1 fan!
-- ilyas
\_ Why don't I ever get nice things?
-geordan
\_ Because you are already
pverpowered. -- ilyas
\_ Your proposal is accepted.
\_ You know, for once, I actually agree with Dvorak, "You can
download movies on the internet??", woohoo, thank you MPAA. |
| 2004/12/7-8 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:35197 Activity:insanely high |
12/7 Does anyone watch the Chinese-dubbed Korean TV drama on Ch32 10pm
weeknights? Is there an English name for that drama? Thanks.
\_ I've never seen it, but if you describe it, I might be able to
figure out which one it is. Just as a guess, it could be
"Autumn Tale" which was very popular in Japan recently. -jrleek
\_ Thanks, but "Autumn Tale" is the one running on Ch26 about two
years ago, also dubbed in Chinese. It's not the one on Ch32 now.
I watched "Autumn Tale" and liked it. The one on Ch32 now is a
comedy. A guy M1 and and woman W1 lives together in a hut on a
roof of a building. M1 is a jerk. W1 likes M1. M1 likes his
good-looking college friend W2. W2 likes her family friend and
a corporate manager M2. M2 likes his sub-ordinate W1.
\_ While we're at it, what about the one that's the reverse of
Autumn Tale? Ie. a guy and a woman are in love, and eventually
it turns out that they are half-siblings. Anyone knows the name
of that drama? It was also Chinese-dubbed on Ch26 a couple years
ago.
\_ Man, I didn't realize that Korean dramas were so popular.
\_ In Hong Kong, Korean dramas have overtaken Japanese dramas in
the past few years. Consider this: in the Bay Area, there are
three drama time slots in the Chinese TV hours in the evening,
8-9 and 9-10 on Ch26 and 10-11 on Ch32. Two out of the three
slots run Chinese-dubbed Korean dramas, and only one slot
runs Chinese-made drama.
\_ Korean drama is a lot better than the shit that's
produced by Taiwan and HK. Mainland China's produces
extremely good historical dramas, but modern day dramas
can get a bit sensitive, and therefore not that many are
that good. Korean dramas have very good story lines (and
they do it pretty well that they are not lame). Most made
for teen Taiwan dramas especially those with silly and
low class jokes lacks substance. The bar has been raised
by historical (especially JinYong) drama from China, and
Korean dramas. I hardly see any Taiwan drama playing on
the two Chinese stations now, because they just don't
produce anything worth watching.
\_ You call JinYong "historical drama?" I'd call it wugong
action. Not drama.
action. Not drama. And definitely not historical.
\_ I meant historical, AND JinYong dramas...
\_ You may have meant it, but you didn't say it right.
Your language implied JinYong is a kind of historical
drama. -- random English nazi
\_ Hey! I learned all my Chinese history through
JinYong!
\_ Several years ago there was a historical dramas from Taiwan
about Empress Ci Xi, and another one about the old Bao Gong.
Both were very good.
about Empress Ci Xi, and another one about the old judge Bao
Gong. Both were very good.
\_ Cat on the Roof, according to http://tv.yahoo.com
\_ Thanks! That's the one! |
| 2004/12/4-6 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:35175 Activity:kinda low |
12/4 More funny. A translation page for Kanji tatoos.
http://www.hanzismatter.com
\_ Every time I see some dingbat hood with hanzi tatoos, I think of
Nadsat speak from A Clockwork Orange. Uncanny similarities.
I'm just waiting to hear them start mixing mandarin into their
English.
\_ I was at the police station filling out a report once, when
some black lady came in to visit her boyfriend in jail. She
had "China" in simplified chinese on her ankle. Why would some
Oakland ghetto queen tatoo "China" on her ankle? I'm still
wondering.
\_ I don't see what the big deal is. Maybe it's exotic to her,
maybe it represents something from her past, or as the poster
below states, maybe it's her name or nickname. I don't see that
as something worthy of ridicule. Now, if her tattoo had been
"rice-dung-flea" or "dog-mat-beans" or "east-behind-whore" or
something....
\_ If it's "east-behind-whore" it could be a form of advertizing
\_ Maybe her boyfriend in jail is Chinese.
\_ It's her name or nickname? |
| 2004/11/10-11 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:34818 Activity:insanely high |
11/10 130-year-old Chinese fire put out
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/3978329.stm
\_ Are you Chinese? Do you have any idea what the effect of
a 130 year old coal fire was on China?
\_ In SOVIET CHINA fire puts out YOU!
\_ Are you Chinese? Do you have any idea how much opium you could
puff with that 130 years of coal fire?
\_ Gives China a nice bonus for the Kyoto treaty. That's one big
source of pollutions shut off.
\_ Isn't that just one of many burning?
\_ John Kerry's grandfather set it.
\_ Uhm, before or after he enjoyed benefits from the effects of
the opium trade in China?
\_ Why do you hate John kerry's grandfather?
\_ Actually, it came from a flicked-away match after
lighting up a fat opium spliff.
\_ Cool! Xinjiang has 1.8 trillion tons of coal reserves.
We must remember to always quash the Islamic separatist
terrorists there.
\_ We don't have to. The Chinese have been doing that. |
| 2004/11/9 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:34792 Activity:insanely high 66%like:34786 |
11/9 Whoever posted it, explain it to me, what's the effect of the
holocaust had on Yehudah? (And what does it have to do with the
context for which it was posted for?)
\_ BUD DAY wouldn't ask such unpatriotic questions!
\_ and who the fuck is "BUD DAY"?
\_ MoH winner, former POW, anti-Kerry, http://www.swiftvets.com
\_ Some motd poster made a plea for some respect for Day.
Apparently that is not the will of the motd.
\_ I have plenty of respect for Mr Day. It's the boob
that turned his name into some kind of prayer or
hysterical invocation that's being mocked.
\_ He earned respect for somethings, but derision for other
reasons. Then some people invoked him as a knee-jerk
criticism of anything pro-Kerry or anti-war, at which
point he became a motd cliche'.
\_ If you have to ask...
\_ Are you Chinese? Do you understand the effect the opium
trade had on China?
\_ I know the history of China and opium addiction is just
another salient in the motd war between the liberals and the
conservatives, but you should at least know a little of the
tragedy you're belittling in your post. It might be some
quaint historical artifact for you, but at one point almost
half of China was addicted to the drug, and quite likely every
Chinese family have had to deal with opium addiction in its past.
http://www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/History/om/om15.htm
\_ But I don't understand the point the poster is trying to make
when replying to something about BushCo.
\_ It is your insistence that Kerry must pay the price for the
sins of his maternal grand-relative that renders your point
ridiculous and turns the entire comment into a farcical
slogan a la WDYHA and such. The Opium Trade was terrible,
and the British Govt., the perpetuators and only living
beneficiaries of that trade, are the ones you should be
approaching for repapration.
\_ You have your "you"s confused. Whether Kerry inherited
the blame for his grandfather's sins is someone else's
argument. Try to imagine the tragedy if half of China's
population were addicted to opium, and you'll understand
why the drug and the humiliation connected with it is still
a sensitive issue to many Chinese. There are less repugnant
ways for your 2 sides to argue. -pp
\_ You should have weighed in while the damage was being
done. Alas, the other guy made it into a motd cliche.
\_ I ll be the first to admit that drugs can have a deleterious
effect on society, but as someone who opposes the Drug War,
and favors the legalization of all drugs, I find it difficult
to oppose the opium trade on principled grounds, even if it
did present a kind of OCP for China. Perhaps someone could
provide a history lesson I am missing? -- ilyas
\_ simple. people in Qing dynasty China are mostly
uneducated and uninformed about the effects of
drugs. Western medical knowledge and care was
non-existent. For example, will a particular
drug be detrimental to the fetus during pregnancy?
I can assure you, the drug goons (some of whom
were Jewish) of Britain and US didn't give a fuck.
It's good that they have long since been kicked
out of China. Partial thanks go to some of the
Christian missionaries who spoke up against the
opium trade after seeing the human catastrophe
first hand in China.
\_ I am sure the drug goons didn't give a shit.
However, the Qing dynasty era chinese were not
stupid. While they may not have been aware of
the harmful effects of opium initially, at some point
before HALF OF THE POPULATION was addicted, something
must have tipped them off. At that point, you can't
really beg off on ignorance anymore, and it becomes
the fault not of the dealer, but of the junkie for
becoming a junkie. -- ilyas
\_ Why do you hate America? |
| 2004/11/9 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:34786 Activity:nil 66%like:34792 |
11/9 Whoever posted it, explain it to me, what's the effect of the
opium trade had on China? (And what does it have to do with the
context for which it was posted for?)
\_ BUD DAY wouldn't ask such unpatriotic questions!
\_ and who the fuck is "BUD DAY"?
\_ If you have to ask... |
| 2004/11/5 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:34693 Activity:high |
11/4 Can anyone give me some tips on how to, where at, and how much it costs
to learn country dancing and horseback riding the state of California?
I want to be less narrow minded and want to try out everything.
I feel this should not be strictly a hobby of the elite right.
\_ Are you Chinese? Do you understand the effect the opium
trade had on China?
\_ You've obviously never served.
\_ Why do you hate swift boats?
\_ of course you realize this could destabilize the opium
trade for generations to come |
| 2004/11/4 [Politics/Domestic/Election, Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:34674 Activity:high |
11/4 I finally had time to track this down after the frenzy of the election.
Francis Blackwell Forbes [Kerry's maternal great-grandfather] was a
China merchant, opium trader and botanist. He and other members of
the Forbes family were active in the Opium trade and China trade
during the Opium Wars, amassing a large fortune. http://csua.org/u/9tm
My (Chinese) wife is now extremely sorry she voted for Kerry.
\_ Are you Chinese?
\_ Yes.
\_ And the actions of Kerry's ancestors matters because...?
And voting for a war-monger like Dubya is better because...?
And it matters even though Kerry lost because...?
\_ Are you Chinese? Do you understand the devestation the opium
traders wreaked on China? Did Kerry enjoy the benefits of
Forbes' opium trading? If not directly monetarily, how about
in terms of access, connections, vacations in family compounds,
etc.? Why would *any* Chinese vote for someone who extracted
(and continues to enjoy) benefits from the opium trade?
\_ Maternal great-grandfather... that's a pretty long time
ago. Let's try a little closer to home. Bush had
economic dealings with Osama.
\_ Did Kerry enjoy benefits from the fortune Forbes made from
the opium trade? Yes or no please.
\_ What if he did? Is that his fault?
\_ Jefferson owned slaves! Get rid of that damn constitution
and never vote Democrat again! -John
\_ And if you were black, and if Jefferson's decendent had
enjoyed benefits from the fact that Jefferson owned
slaves, then I would say that you would be justificed in
condemning Jefferson's decendent. So the question is,
did Kerry enjoy benefits because he was descended from
Forbes?
\_ The election is over. Kerry lost. Get over it.
\_ Yes, I am Chinese. Are you? Let it go. Move on.
\_ The question remains. Why would any Chinese vote
for anyone who enjoyed benefits from opium trader
money?
\_ Because of the 'markov moral property' --
Kerry just used money. That the money might
have been gotten in questionable ways by
his ancestors is not relevant. They are
dead, and conditioned on the money, the
actions of Kerry and their actions are
independent.
\_ Are you Chinese? Do you understand the effect
the opium trade had on China?
\_ Your argument style and bloody minded insistence
is suspiciously similar to Swift Boat guy. Yay
Swift Boat Guy!!!
--swift boat guy #1 fan
\_ Are you Chinese? Do you understand the effect
the opium trade had on China?
\_ Did it turn chinese people into raging
idiots?
\_ Are you the Swift Boat Guy?
\_ Because Bush is an even bigger ass who has
commited repugnant acts in the modern day?
Look, the choice is between douche and turd.
I choose douche.
\_ Are you Chinese? Do you understand the effect
the opium trade had on China?
\_ Are you an idiot? Do you understand that
typing the same question in three different
places on a thread makes you look like
one?
\_ You can't answer the question, can you?
\_ Yes, I can. That has no bearing on
Kerry, however. You really should
go back to ranting about Bill Clinton.
At least he was actually the
President for awhile.
\_ Uh, I already answered. Yes, I am Chinese.
Are you? The opium war is in the past,
okay? Let it go.
\_ Bush deceived the American people, embroiled us in a war based on
lies, and funnelled American taxpayer dollars into corporations that
donated heavily to his political party. Why would any American
vote for Bush?
\_ You need to read up on the history of the opium traders.
\_ You really need to open your fucking eyes.
\_ And the Bush fortune was based on trading with the Nazis. Which
was worse? The opium wars or the holocaust?
\_ It is this kind of crap that is destroying America. Your guy won.
Stop taunting and rubbing salt in the wound unless you want us
to block your every action for the next four years. |
| 2004/10/29 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/Europe] UID:34425 Activity:nil |
10/28 Gulliver's travails: The U.S. in the post-Cold-War world
http://www.newcriterion.com/archive/23/oct04/osull.htm
Yearning to be liked
http://www.newcriterion.com/archive/21/nov02/derby.htm |
| 2004/10/22 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:34287 Activity:high |
10/22 what books/tapes best to learn mandarin?
\_ Can you already read Chinese? If you can read Chinese, you can
learn by watching Channel 26 every weekday 8-10pm and then Channel
32 10-11pm.
\_ Pimsleur
\_ Practical Audio/Visual Chinese >> Pimsleur
Plus with the videos you can ogle h07 42n ch1x.
\_ thanks guys, you guys rock.. |
| 2004/10/18-19 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:34207 Activity:nil |
10/18 Here's a nice scam: selling a process to guarantee that someone's
child will be the gender they choose. When it works, $5000+ from
eager Chinese couples! When it doesn't, no biggie just give back the
money (which you earned a few months of interest on).
http://csua.org/u/9jm |
| 2004/9/18 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:33612 Activity:nil 62%like:33608 |
9/17 PJ O'ROURKE: Why Americans hate foreign policy
http://csua.org/u/93j (Daily Telegraph)
\_ Cf. Orson Scott Card's conversion post-9/11. |
| 2004/9/17 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:33608 Activity:nil 62%like:33612 |
9/17 PJ O'ROURKE: Why Americans hate foreign policy
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1219406/posts |
| 2004/9/17-18 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Domestic/Crime] UID:33579 Activity:insanely high |
9/16 Captain Yee given an HONORABLE DISCHARGE.
\_ And his commander thanked him for all the muslim p0rn he brought to
the military.
\_ Do you even know who Yu is?
\_ I think the OP is talking about Captain YEE, who was the Muslim
chaplain at Gitmo who was charged with espionage. The case was
dropped and it looks kind of like a Wen Ho Lee repeat.
\_ wen ho actually misplaced classified documents. i think
he was acting weirdly and stupidly but didn't deserve
solitary for a year
\_ Yeah, but they made a big case about how he was spying
for the Chinese, and when it turned out they were totally
wrong, they charged him for the only minor thing they
could get him on.
Oh, and before someone says "misplacing classified
information isn't minor" I'll admit it's important, but
it's a crime lacking in criminal intent.
\_ Dropping charges for national security reasons which
happens all the time is not the same as him not being
a spy for the Chinese.
\_ what was he doing then? it's just odd that he deliberately
stored all that stuff on some of disk media, then
some how lost it. was he just looking for another job?
\_ what's so odd about it? some people are careless or
absent-minded. einstein even forgot where his home
in princeton was.
\_ i bet when you work for a NUCLEAR LAB you get trained
to not do the above. what do you think?
\_ I bet you always follow every one of your
employer's regulations to the letter.
\_ You haven't been in one of the labs. If you had
you wouldn't be so flip about it.
\_ If I worked in a government NUCLEAR LAB, I would follow
the "don't copy random secret shit to floppy disks
and leave them lying around at Starbucks please
IF IT'S NOT TOO MUCH TROUBLE" employee worksheet
\_ Yeah I know, but wasn't he charged with adultery and storing
p0rn on army computers?
\_ And those charges were dropped this week and he's being
given an honorable discharge.
\_ Yeah, after the treason and espionage case was shown to be
a crock of shit.
\_ Not true.
\_ Oh, really? They why did they never determine he
passed any classified information? Why did they drop
the charges? To drop a serious national security
case and then press on with some minor unrelated
stuff seems like major ass-covering by the people
prosecuting him.
\_ Would you care to elaborate?
\_ I believe that person thinks Yee did mishandle
classified documents. The Army said national
security concerns prevented them from seeking
a court-martial in open court.
\_ An honorable discharge in this sort of
situation is practically an apology (as
close as he'll ever see). The pp is flat out
wrong.
\_ Which is a BS excuse, because they could use
lawyers with security clearances, have the
evidence sealed, and have a closed courtroom.
In other words, use the same system they're
planning on using on the Gitmo prisoners. |
| 2004/9/14-15 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:33529 Activity:high |
9/14 http://tinyurl.com/4gvhg And you thought the US was bad China executes 4 for bank fraud \_ So? There are a lot of people here that I think should get executed. Go China! One less scumbag to worry about. \_ Execute the Enron guys! \_ Scumbags needs to be executed, just like all those fuckers in Oakland that shots people on the street. Before you start loud mouthing about China executing people, I challenge you to go to ANY major city in the US at the middle of the night, and then do the same in China. \_ Don't be absurd -- I've been out at the wee hours in many us cities and have never been shot at or mugged. I'm sorry Mr Chicom Troll, but your hatred of the us hasn't made our urban areas into war zones. \_ yea, we know kokomo, indiana is safe at night. \_ And that's relevant, how? -4 hp for poor reading comprehension and analytical skills, grasshopper. Train harder. \_ NOOO! It's INT, not HP!!! \_ The point isn't to make him stupider; it's about cleaning up the genepool. \_ He's already got a low enough INT. \_ while the challenge is kind of dumb, the poster does make a point. \_ No he doesn't. He creates a strawman with a specious example applied with no context. \_ is the INT low enough that he's a moron, an imbecile, or an idiot? \_ Yes. \_ I am not afraid to go out at night, I have my AK47 now!! \_ I accept the challenge. I was in Beijing one night and a cab driver tried to take advantage of my gf and I by driving through unbelievably sketchy, unpaved back alleys. Only when he realized I was about to hit him in the back of the head did he "suddenly" find a major road and we got out. \_ yea, my beijing ex-roommate and best buddy says beijing is pretty bad these days. otoh, stealing people's money is bad, and without a safety net like in the US, poverty can make life very difficult or even impossible. \_ What's wrong for taking a short cut? \_ nothing wrong with the cabbies in Beijing, unless you are from shanghai... I'm in Beijing now - have been here several times - never had an issue with the drivers. Had one start chatting to me about Taiwan and all, but nothing offensive. Perhaps it would behoove you to carry a map of Beijing and learn a tad of mandarin next time you come? |
| 2004/8/30 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:33220 Activity:high |
8/30 Anyone watched the Olympic closing ceremony? Those ten or so Chinese
women dancers in short skirts playing Chinese musical instruments were
very hot!
\_ I concur.
\_ pics? |
| 2004/8/26 [Politics/Domestic/President, Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:33159 Activity:very high |
8/26 Kill me now. This is incredibly stupid.
http://csua.org/u/8rv
\_ Old news. My dad (public high school teacher) was grading in green
ink 10 years ago to avoid irate parents and administrators saying
he was psychologically scarring them.
\_ The funny is the stupid psycho babel the use the justify
purple as the perfect pen color for corrections. I prefer
green myself.
\_ Soon they'll do away with grades, since they're so scarring.
Why are American kids such wimps?
\_ I had no grades until middle school and I did fine, by all
accounts.
\_ Your mistake is blaming the kids.
\_ OK fair enough. It actually IS the adults, for
considering the child's complaint int he first place.
\_ RED INK! RED INK IS THE STANDARD BITCHSLAP!
\_ In Hong Kong all school teachers use red ballpen to grade. |
| 2004/8/24-25 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Computer/SW/OS/Windows] UID:33114 Activity:very high |
8/24 Before one moves to a foreign city (or another U.S. city for that
matter), is there a way to find out which neighborhoods are nice,
run down, safe, or dangerous if you don't know someone already
living there?
\_ Many county and municipal Law Enforcement departments publish crime
statistics in a variety of formats. Contra Costa has a clickable
map on its website.
http://www.cocosheriff.org/crime_statistics/crime_statistics.htm
http://www.cocosheriff.org/crime_statistics/crime_stat_maps/stats_clyde_un_concord.htm
http://tinyurl.com/4w668
\_ For inside the U.S., go to http://msn.com, click on Buy a House -> Compare
Cities.
\_ It's very odd in LA, it's hard to tell by looking sometimes.
-- ilyas
\_ Check the housing prices.
\_ Concur. It's not a 100% indicator when comparing downtown to
a suburb (the suburb may actually be nicer and cheaper, but
obviously farther) but it's a good start when comparing apples
to apples.
\_ Most of these methods operate on at most a per-zip code granularity.
So none of them work well when there is variety within a zip code.
In Sacramento, for example, conditions vary on an almost street-
by-street basis.
\_ And the houses on the better streets will cost more.
\_ Just look for those minorities around. If you see em, you know
it's a bad neighborhood. Man this is a boring motd entry.
\_ Most of the residents in the Sunset and Richmond districts in SF
are Chinese Americans. Neither district seem to be bad
neighborhood.
\_ The Chinese are not a minority. Just ask UC administration.
\_ Asians - the other white people! |
| 2004/8/22-23 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/Europe] UID:33068 Activity:insanely high |
8/21 Why is it that a miserable 3rd world nation such as China has
more number of GOLD medals than USA, the world's wealthiest and
most technologically advanced nation in the entire world? We
spend billions and billions on advanced training,
advanced technology, and advanced scienticfic research on
our atheletes, and yet only 20 gold? For example, the runners
get to try out the altitude tank to simulate oxygen deprivation,
ball players try out really advanced computer simulations
on strategies/etc, and the scientists/nutritionists customize
the intake and monitoring of the atheletes based on advanced
instrumentations and advanced nutritional science. With
everything on our side, a low-tech nation such as China still
gets more gold medals. WHY?
\_ Because "western" nations do not treat 10 year old children like
fucking science lab test subjects. You'll note that the US wins
way more medals than other "civilized" countries like, say, France
or Japan or the UK. -John
\_ perhaps you should ask the chinese athletes whether they like
to be where they are as opposed to planting sorghum at
Big Cow village. US dominance of track and field, etc. is itself
the result of a big science project of selectively breeding
african slaves.
\_ Troll harder. I didn't realize Kim Collins was US? How
about Hailegebre Selassie? El Gerrouj? And as for field,
don't make me laugh. -John
\_ a few exceptions here and there doesn't make it
untrue. it's your characterization of china's
sports program that's laughable. many of them
are talented kids from poor villages who would
have ended up poor farmers for the rest of their
lives otherwise. Their parents are only too glad
to let them have the opportunity. they always
have the choice to refuse to let their children
go. if what you said is true, how come the
aussies hired two coaches from china, and
immediately they win gold and bronze at 10m diving?
the aussies must like being lab test subjects
then?
\_ We Japanese has less than half the population of US, but
half its medals. We are superior.
\_ W00t! Better invade China 'n prove it.
\_ Billions? We don't spend a penny of tax payer dollars on them.
\_ Using technology isn't always the best way to train. Haven't you
seen Rocky 4?
\_ They have 4 times as many people.
\_ Why do you care?
\_ Pretty sure this is a troll, but ...
- We're going to have more gold medals when the Olympics are done.
Much of the early standings are simply because of scheduling
(Australia, for instance, halfway through the Games has already
won most of the medals it'll win, because they're done with the
events they're good at. We tend to do well at, say, track and
field, which is only just starting.)
- The US spends no tax dollars on athletics (this is almost
unique among nations).
- Our govt. doesn't select promising kids at age 6? 8? 10? and put
them into special sports schools, as does China.
\_ Yes, in America we have overzealous parents that do that.
-dans
\_ You know the difference between tax dollars and parent's
personal dollars, right?
\_ Yes, the parents' dollars will not be wasted. -- ilyas
\_ Then the parents will probably not put their kid in
these types of programs, because most of these things
aren't economically viable in themselves. The effort
China puts in its programs appears to have national
prestige and propaganda as the primary purpose and
these are not things that parents would normally
spend their own money on for their country.
\_ That's sort of what I was driving at, yes. -- ilyas
\_ actually it's more and more like the US in China.
athletes get big endorsements, etc. But it's
still a good idea to get the government involved,
otherwise poorer kids with talent from the small
towns and villages would not have any chance to
succeed since the facilities simply ain't there.
- And as the previous poster pointed out, they have 4x as many
people (and are wholly willing to put large amounts of resources
into training them). Our athletes, when they reach world-class
level, have access to the best training methods in the world,
as do China's and 20 other countries ... we certainly have no
advantage over China or Australia or the UK or dozens of other
countries.
\_ as far as I know, our govornment doesn't really intervene
_at_all_ in most sports. I knew a guy in highschool who was
training as an olympic figure skater, and as far as I know
he never interacted with the U.S. government in any way.
\_ Son, that's why god invented athletic scholarships and
corporate sponsors.
\_ Yeah, but those usually don't come into play until you're
ALREADY real good; it's hard when you're ages 10 to 18
and are only just getting good. There's some sports that
are going to be really difficult for the US to continue
to compete internationally. How many universities in the
entire US sponsor men's gymnastics? 20. With ~10 gymnasts
per team, a 200-person pool for your entire national team
is not a deep pool at all (all US men's gymnasts went
to US universities; also many universities host foreign
students, making the pool even shallower ...).
\_ The olympic sports and college (i.e. NCAA) sports are
disjoint. Scholarships are not available for
non-collegiate sports. Corporate sponsorship is
basically a marketing play which means that in order to
be sponsored for a non-token sum, you must be an
established athlete with wide name recognition. -dans
\_ i hope my tax dollars never go into training athletes. get
over your stupid nationalism.
\_ I strongly agree with you, but I suspect that the pp
you're responding to would also agree that this is
a good thing.
\_ Well, consider the costs. Let's say we sent 500
athletes to Athens. Let's say we paid them each $200k/
year. That's $100M, or a little more than a quarter
dollar per American. Would I pay a few bucks to win a
few more medals? Yeah, probably. I'm philosophically
against funding the athletes, but in the eyes of
government, it's pocket change.
\_ but we don't do it, and we still win golds, so why
do it? Also, if they did it, don't expect it
to be given out evenly accross the sports. As a
fan of some of the more obscure sports, it would
really piss me off to see skiing get disproportionately
subsidised. If someone wants to subsidize sports
that people like to watch on TV, let the networks
who make all the money off of it do it.
\_ I wouldn't pay 1 penny to make the US teams win every
gold medal every time.
\_ there is plenty of information out there about
the societal benefits of athletic programs for
kids.
\_ Absolutely. Agreed. Sports in schools and
for kids in general is a great thing. Just not
subsidies for advanced sports research shit so
"we" can win medals in some over-commercialized
and corrupt dope-a-thon. -John
\_ http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5635973/site/newsweek
"17,000 full-time athletes supported by provincial and city
governments" (compared to zero in the US)
\_ Because we are an imperial power in decline. Every time I point
this out, I get called an America-hater, but I just like to
see the world as it really is, not some Hollywood fantasy of it.
Expect China to pass us in many other things in the next 20
years.
\_ *laugh* There has never been a greater power on the planet. The
only power that is likely to ever be greater is if one day there
is a true single world government that supercedes all national
governments.
\_ Don't be so proud of your technological terror. The
ability to have a single world government is insignificant
next to the power of the Force. -geordan
\_ I haven't called you America-Hater but I am wondering if you are
the same guy as the 'nuanced worldview' guy who claims 90% of
stuff in the 'real world' is personal stuff and vendettas. You
sound like spiritual soul mates, and are both liberals, most
likely. And both wrong. America is stronger now than it has
ever been. America is stronger now than any imperial power at
any time in history, including Rome, Britain, HRE, Habsburg
Austria, anything. You are either a troll or an idiot.
\_ Nah, I will take the British Empire over America in terms
of power and accomplishments.
\_ Such as going to space and the moon, better health, longer
lives, a standard of living for the average citizen that
makes British Royalty of the past look like the lower
classes here now, no real enemies, safe to walk the streets
at night in most places, access to affordable and often
free education generally available, and a safety net the
British Empire never dreamed of. And that's just off the
top of my head. What were the British Empire's accomplish-
ments? Turning both Afirca and the Middle East into hell
holes intentionally? Thanks British Empire!
\_ errr ... the idea is to compare with contemporary
rivals. also, a lot of the things you mentioned
are not good benchmarks of strength and power.
Switzerland also doesn't have enemies, and has
safe streets, free education, safety net, etc.
That doesn't make it a powerful country.
\_ Playing Victoria teaches you a lot about power
dynamics at the time of the British Empire (even if
it's just a silly game). As Britain you did NOT want
the next 2-3 powers to gang up on you. Britain had
a pretty light touch as an imperial power, because
they had no choice. Britain had structural
weaknesses, foremost of which was their small
population and size (compared to the vast geographic
area of their holdings). US has no real weaknesses,
except for oil, and that's only a weakness because
there is no will to make it go away. -- ilyas
\_ US has plenty of weaknesses. Its power is
dependent on an economic system that requires
the willing participation of allies and other
countries in Europe and Asia. With the
introduction of guerilla warfare, occupying
other countries has also become prohibitively
expensive for America, as shown in Vietnam
and Iraq. Then there is still Russia, which
can wipe out the US with the push of a button.
\_ Fuck powerful countries. Their only use is to counter
other powerful countries that might fuck you over.
The nationalist bullshit even in the olympics annoys
the hell out of me, all those national anthems after
every event. To me it actually takes away from the
individual achievements, the way the athletes are
made to personify their countries. Ideally, most team
sports should be eliminated from the Olympics and
the focus put on individual performances like it was
in ancient times.
\_ I've seen you post this a number of times, and I've never
seen anyone call you an America Hater. Especially since
this has little to do with the subject, I think you're a
troll. How about, Neo-con Troll?
\_ neo-con troll? have you ever listened to NPR? maybe
they're all neocon trolls as well. what you've just seen
is the typical NPR listener in action.
\_ Yes, but he's trolling FOR Neo-Cons. Although, sure.
NPR Troll? Empire Troll?
\_ I think it has everything to do with the subject. China
is no longer a pissant third world country anymore. And
I detest the Neocons.
\_ All 7 of them? It isn't a huge movement. And yes, China
is still very much a pissant third world country. They
can't even retake their own break away province much less
pose any sort of threat to the US. If we were a brutal
conquering nation like they are we would have stomped
them decades ago.
\_ we ain't? where are all the indians then?
\_ Getting rich with their casinos.
\_ Good idea. Let's turn the Potala Palace
into a big casino.
\_ WTF does anything this guy is saying have to do with
conservatives, neo or otherwise?
\_ See above reply. The guy sounds like the's trolling
to make Neo-Cons angry. If you don't know why, look
up the definition of Neo-Con.
\_ The only reason China is ahead of America is because
America gave them a free gold:
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/08/23/sports/olympics/23shooter.html
\_ What happened to the csuamotd/csuamotd login?
\_ The whole premise is false. For whatever reason, China has always
been strongest at the the items that got competed earlier, and
whichAmerica (and the west) by and large do not care and hardly
even consider as a regular sports (TABLE tennis???). If you
go back to olympic history, you will see the Chinese team get
a bunch of medals at the start, then get stuck there for the
rest of game, while the 3rd reich, the USSR , and Amerika
will have a steady and linear increase. They are the really
competitors in the olympics.
\_ yes but at least they dont have table tennis to 15 points,
to 21 points, 50 points and 100points.
\_ china is good at sports that require skills, intelligence
and precision. us is good at sports that require brute
power, cause us has lots of africa athletes.
\_ So basically any sport where you don't have to sweat or
move much.
\_ you do have to sweat. it's just that sweating like
a dumb mule won't by itself win you any medal.
\_ extremely weak troll.
\_ it may be a troll but it's also the truth. besides
the message it's replying to is also a troll.
\_ For the same reason lots of inner city kids are good in some sports.
It's a way out. 'nuff said. |
| 2004/7/14-15 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:32288 Activity:high |
7/14 ipod owners, http://www.apple.com/ipod/specs.html says it has Chinese. Does it just mean the menus are in Chinese? or can it display Chinese song names? Thanks. \_ I left mine at home but I remember being able to change the menus to various languages like French and Spanish. I think Chinese might be one of them. \_ My dad had a bunch of songs in his iPod in Chinese. Menus were in English. \_ everything will be in Chinese (unicode). The menu and the songs (when input in Chinese) will be displayed properly. Both simplifed & traditional supported \_ what kind of unicode transformation? utf-8? ucs-2? \_ FWIW, Persian/Arabic script didn't show up on my iPod even though iTunes displays the song titles correctly. \_ they are more complicated than Chinese. they tend to be the last thing be supported. \_ Chinese pop sounds like cats in heat anyway. Get some real music, like Britney. \_ I wouldn't say it's cats in heat, but I do think there is no variaty in Hong Kong pop. They all sound the same. After a variety in Hong Kong pop. They all sound the same. After a while you get bored. Taiwan pop seems to have a little more variaty. --- HK guy. variety. --- HK guy. [variety, not variaty. spelld] |
| 2004/7/8 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:31219 Activity:moderate |
7/8 Post editorial:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A35539-2004Jul7.html
".. Chinese hero -- that of a conscientious scholarly official who
puts himself on the line to tell the corrupt emperor the truth for
the sake of the people and is ordered punished"
\_ The Motherland shall crush your splittist treasoners! |
| 5/27 |