11/4    If you haven't read it already, you should:
        George Orwell, "Politics and the English Language," 1946
        http://www.mtholyoke.edu/acad/intrel/orwell46.htm

11/3    vi vs. emacs: which is for liberals and which is for conservatives?
        \_ Fuck you earthlings and your stupid bipolar politics. We are Borg,
           we use MS Visual Studio. We are the .NET, we are the collective.
           You will be assimilated. Resistance is futile.
        \_ ED IS THE STANDARD!
           \_ IFILE!
        \_ With (s)ED! and awk you don't need anything else.  vi & emacs are
           for l0sers!
        \_ emacs is definitely the epitome of liberal government.  It's a great
           OS, if only it had a good editor.  vi's philosophy is more like the
           do one job and do it well approach (smaller government).
           \_ glad to see you've fully bought into the ridiculous political
              mythology.
           \_ is vim the neocon approach?  We pretend to be small, but we
              keep doing stupid shit just to drive you crazy?
              \_ Pretend to be small?
-rwxr-xr-t  2 root  wheel  3172672 Dec  8  2001 /usr/local/bin/emacs*
-rwxr-xr-x  1 root  wheel  1146252 Dec  2  2002 /usr/local/bin/vim*
-r-xr-xr-x  6 root  wheel  279020 Jan 21  2003 /usr/bin/nvi*
                 -geordan
        \_ libertarians just cat directly to the device

11/1    I understand how a US trade deficit translates to a downward
        pressure on the US dollar, but does a big US budget defict
        also put downward pressure on the dollar?  How?
        \_ budget deficit solution is usually issuing bonds.  A strong
                supply of US-currency based-bonds means we would have to
                work extra hard later to pay that debts.  Pretty much
                like what happens to companies which sells bonds to
                stay alive - their stocks tank.  The Federal government
                has an obligation to pay interest first before spending
                on the citizens.

11/1    How many of you libertarian fuckheads are planning to go try to
        ruin the great state of New Hampshire?
        http://www.nytimes.com/2003/10/27/national/27LIBE.html
        \_ I loved the major party reactions.
           GOP: "Great to have you, guys!  Come on over!"
           DNC: <trembling voice> "The best way to describe these people is
                                   anarchists..."
             -- libertarian fuckhead
        \_ What's so fucking great about NH?  Their only claim to fame is
           voting second in the primaries and being almost the smallest
           state.  Is there *anything* they do right?
           \_ Libertarians have a hardon over the slogan on their license plate:
              "Live free or die"
              \_ And the lack of state income tax makes them ejaculate.
                 \_ Lye, is that you?
              \_ I'm guessing all the rightwing assholes at Dartmouth
                 have something to do with it also. It's probably the most
                 right-wing of the Ivy League colleges.

10/25   Does anyone here have a good video newsfeed for the fires down in
        San Diego? I've got family down there, and local news has been
        depressingly lacking.  --erikred
        \_ no, but here are some photos from hillcrest:
           http://www.plocktau.com/temp/fire
        \_ No but every morning my car is covered in ash. -50 miles from fires.
        \_ maybe they'll burn down a few nice Republican houses and let us
           poor schmucks have a chance at getting property in the nice
           SD area.
           \_ Talk about flame-bait...
              \_ Someone needs to break your legs.  Nothing personal.
           \_ yeah, the Berkeley Hills fire really made for cheap real
              estate in Hiller Highlands.  -tom

10/18   Jerry Springer may run for governor of Ohio
        http://csua.org/u/4qa
        \_ I know a lot of stupid people who've done a lot of stupid things,
           but i've never even heard of anyone else stupid enough to bounce
           a check to a prostitute.

10/7    url for exit polls?
        \_ just about any news site on the net over the next 8.5 hours?
           \_ If its so easy, find a url.
              \_ genius, it takes time to gather data and report it.  this
                 is an election, not an episode of your favorite reality
                 tv show.  it'll happen, just shut up and get back to work.
        \_ exit poll data is not reported until 8pm.
           there was some controversy in a past election.
           but I think you'll see it appearing on the major news sites then.
           \_ much more useful info. Thanks.
              \_ no, that was a national problem caused by the media in FL.
                 useful but inaccurate.  bite me.

10/2    Why does Rush lose his job while Dusty Baker gets to keep his
        after saying:
        "Personally, I like to play in the heat. It's easier for most Latin
        guys and most minority people because most of us come from the heat.
        You don't find too many brothers from New Hampshire and Maine and the
        Upper Peninsula of Michigan, right? I mean we were brought over for
        the heat, right? I mean, ain't that history? Weren't we brought over
        here because we could take the heat?"
          http://www.illinoisleader.com/columnists/columnistsview.asp?c=6946
          http://www.jewishworldreview.com/0703/page071503.asp
        \_ If you thought about this you'd figure it out. Well, maybe you
           wouldn't, since you're pretty committed to your premise.
           \_ Why bother posting?  Ooooh, you're so mysterious and all knowing
              and wise!  You have Greater Wisdom you can't reveal to us
              peasants!  The truth is there's a double standard.  That's the
              answer to the OP's question.
        \_ umm... Dusty is black. Rush is white?
           \_ So it's ok for a non-white to be racist and say racist things?

10/1    http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_822534.html
        \_ I heard a story about this on NPR. The picture is better.
        \_ lol. The Russian text says: "A magazine about how money's made"
                                                Now, -thats- funny. _/

9/30    Is it me, or Westley Clark is more of a Republican than Democrat?
        \_ Your choice, bad R or wannabe D.  Probably just (S)elfish mostly.
           \_ I think you're "probably an (A)sshole mostly". What does this
              comment add to the debate? Incredibly prejudicial.
              \_ And your ad hominem is SUCH an improvement.
                \_ Ah, but the evidence that the 2P is an asshole is right
                   there in front of us, while there's no evidence given
                   for 2P's assertion.

9/29    I keep having people tell me they prefer Republicans because the
        Republicans have "principles".  What "principles" do Republicans
        have?
        \_ Conservatives.  Republicans may or may not have principles.
           Conservatives have principles.  They are well documented.  No
           need to troll here.
           \_ Sigh.  Some people are principled.  Some people are not.
              Their political affiliation has nothing to do with it.
              Also, what's so great about principles if they are awful
              principles?  I hear Tom Metzger is quite principled.
              \_ Who said anything about great?  The question asked about
                 existence.  It was answered.  The op can draw his own
                 conclusions.  Move along, no pile-on here, lefty boy.
              \_ Also, saying some people are principled is true but unhelpful.
                 Being a conservative implies a certain philosophical
                 commitment, hence having certain principles.  It's what
                 being a conservative MEANS.  Being a republican entails nothing
                 except membership in a certain org.  Sheesh.  Why does this
                 need to be explained?
           \_ Well done.  -conservative and only sometimes republican
           \_ What principles do Conservatives represent?
              \_ "You can never be too rich."
        \_ Democrats have principles too.  Just not Davis, Clinton, etc.
        \_ From WordNet:
  conservative
       adj 1: resistant to change [ant: {liberal}]
       2: opposed to liberal reforms
       3: avoiding excess; "a conservative estimate" [syn: {cautious}]
       4: unimaginatively conventional; "a colorful character in the
          buttoned-down, dull-gray world of business"- Newsweek
          [syn: {button-down}, {buttoned-down}]
       5: conforming to the standards and conventions of the middle
          class; "a bourgeois mentality" [syn: {bourgeois}, {materialistic}]
       n : a person who has conservative ideas or opinions
           [ant: {liberal}]
       \_ Clearly this dictionary needs to be burned.
         \_ clearly this entire thread is pointless and uninteresting. - danh

9/25    Motd restored, motd n00ker foiled.  Huzzah, men!
        \_ The enemies of Freedom shall not prevail -Dubya
           \_ Yes, let's pray it goes the other way and the enemies of freedom
              prevail so the Democrats have a good issue in the next election
              cycle.  It's good to have priorities.
              \_ if the enemies of freedom truly prevailed, there would be
                 no 'next election cycle'

9/21    US Army caught red handed using racist, anti African-American
        recruiting methods.
        http://www.nytimes.com/2003/09/22/national/22RECR.html?ex=1064808000&en=221b26ead28a15a5&ei=5062&partner=GOOGLE
        And a big FU! to whatever racist deleted this!
        \_ troll
        \_ "The drop in black recruits may be tied to the Army's increased
            focus on the college market, military officials say." Wtf? Perhaps
            it's because black college students are less likely to want to
            fight for Uncle Whitey's Army.
        \_ how sad, a long ass trolling url non shortened url
           i am far too lazy to click on.
           \_ http://csua.org/u/4fc
        \_ What's racist?  The fact that they "focus on the college market"?
           Are you implying black people don't go to college?  What?  Man,
           some people on soda are weird.  -John [restored by erikred]
        \_ you're all weird, especiall those who call "troll" but haven't
           read the link from the NYT of all places.  Exactly what is the
           right place one is allowed to post a link without being a troll?
           Maybe from your favorite politician's personal website? -!OP
                \_ I'm not weird.  I think OP is crying 'racist' (meaningless
                   word, that) without giving a reason why.  And I read
                   the article, is there a problem?  Weirdo.  -John
        And a big FU! to whatever racist deleted this!
        \_ Hm I just replied to this asking what is racist about it, and got
           deleted.  Are you a racist?  You *are* weird.  -John

9/15    What are good 17"/18" LCD displays? The viewsonics seem popular
        and cheap. Any gotchas? Are 18" displays worth the $100-$200 premium
        they're currently going for? -saarp
        \_ Solarism
        \_ Samsung
           \_ You mean Samsuck?  I have one.  I also have a Viewsonic.  And
              I also have an Eizo.  Samsuck has decent panel, but supporting
              electronics is crap.  Viewsonic's panel is not that great
              (VX800) and the electronics is also hit or miss.  Viewsonic
              VE170 uses old technology panel, but otherwise, it's just fine.
              I love my Eizo in every way.  Conclusion is that I recommend
              Eizo.
              \_ Eizo?  It's more popular in asia than over here right?
                 Haven't seen them around for some time.
                 \_ Eizo is part of Nanao Japan.  They don't seem to care
                    about the "cheap is everything" consumer market.  You
                    can really see the quality in these things.  They're
                    somewhat expensive than others, but you get what you
                    pay for.  Newegg has them cheaper than most others, but
                    you pay tax in CA.
                 Never seen them around for some time.
        \_ There's only about 3 LCD manufacturers for the screen part.  The
           rest you'll have to compare the features vs price vs warrantee.
           Find out what the dead pixel replacement policy is and if you
           can live with 10 dead or semi dead pixels before it kicks in.
        \_ I service other people's computers, so my experience is that
           Viewsonics are very hit and miss. One customer had two consecutive
           replacements fail on her (bad capacitor and a bad inverter). Other
           customers have had similar problems. About half the installs never
           report any problems. Perhaps this is a batch issue. Quality is
           so-so (according to my eyes), not as vibrant as others I've seen.
           Samsung, Sony, etc. seem to have less problems, but I've seen
           failures on all brands at least once. LG-Phillips/Hitachi/Sharp
           are the ones I know in terms of LCD manufaturers. LCD quality
           AFAIK is dependent on batch. If they produce a good batch you
           get a good vibrant screen. If you get a crappy batch you tend to
           can live with 10 dead or semi dead pixels before it kicks in.
           get washed out colors. YMMV.

9/12    Someone quoted The Economist, but didn't provide a reference. I just
        came across it, so here it is: The Economist, September 6th-12th, 2003
        On Pg. 28, "Would you like your class war shaken or stirred, sir?"
                Interestingly, Americans are usually over-optimistic
        about their chances of promotion. An opinion poll a couple
        of years ago found that 19% of American taxpayers believed
        themselves to be in the top 1% of earners. A further 20%
        thought they would end up there within their lifetimes.

        Also interesting stuff like:
                Take wealth rather than income, and America's
        disparity is even more startling. The wealthiest 1% of all
        households controls 38% of national wealth, while the bottom
        80% of households holds only 17%, according to the Economic
        Policy Institute (EPI). Around 85% of stockmarket wealth
        is held by a lucky 20%.
        \_ So you'd rather live in a country where people think there's no
           hope of ever advancing and just suck off the public teat?  I think
           that was tried.  We called it communism.  We called it socialism.
           \_ Holy shit, look at that knee jerk!

9/8     I guess it's too late now, but why didn't the republican party
        have primary to select someone to go up against davis before
        the real election to save themselves and everyone else from
        some of this circus?
        \_ Because the recall doesn't work that way.
        \_ As the above said, this isn't a standard election.  There's no
           primary, there's no cut round, no parties, no nothing.  Everyone
           with 65 names and $3500 gets the same shot at it all at once as
           per the recall laws.

9/2     Tom McClintock
        http://republican.sen.ca.gov/web/mcclintock/issues.asp
        A Citizens' Guide to the State Budget Mess"
        http://republican.sen.ca.gov/web/mcclintock/ppt/cgsbm_1995.pdf
        \_ An 8 year old "guide"?
           \_ Some things never change.
              \_ It was stupid and ignored then and now?

9/1     Just found out that CHPs use BMW touring bikes. Whatever happened to
        law enforcement agencies buying American?
        \_ Maybe law enforcement is starting to realize what kind of crap
           the American automotive industry produces.
           \_ If not for the SUV craze, the American car makers would go
              bankrupt and beg for government support/protection in the 90s.
              Though, I think the rise of SUVs simply delayed that.
                \_ Mini-vans probably helped out too.
           \_ Like germans don't produce crap. A BWM is much worse than
              a hog.
        \_ They took flap for using cheaper Kawasaki's. I guess buying
           German is ok.
        \_ BMW made a bike specifically to the CHP's specifications.  It
           has a lot of nice saftey feature. (ABS, etc.) The Kawasaki's
           are nice and run for a long time, but are very basic bikes.
           as for Harleys... what idiot would want to have to maintain
           those beasts for a cop force?  WAY too much money and matinence..
           \- i understand oaklands large fleet of harley's was a way to
              attract talent --psb
           \_ Not entirely the whole truth. CHP has a much larger budget
              than most PD. CHP bikes don't need to turn on a dime on
              surface streets - those BMW have horrible turning radiuses.
              most PD that have Kawasakis like them most for that ability
              to turn corners. BTW, Kawaski isn't American.
              \_ Budget is irrelevent - the R1150RTPs came is as the cheapest
                 bid, *and* had ABS.  Any BS about turning radius is funny
                 when HD was the other candidate.

8/25    "U.S. Troops Use Confiscated Iraqi AK-47s"
        http://csua.org/u/40q (Yahoo News)
        Americans don't like American cars, and now Americans don't like
        American guns.  Sigh, American engineering sucks.
        \_ Okay, a couple things here.  First of all, the M4 is a lamefuck
           fad -- it's a carbine of the m16.  This means the short barrel
           reduces the velocity of the rounds below their functional
           velocity, seriously degrading the weapon's effectiveness.
           Using the M4 as point of reference for the M16a2 is misleading.
           Also, as another poster said below, what in the world are tankers
           doing patrolling on the ground?  They're taking ak's because tank
           crews aren't equipped to do infantry work, so they have to make do.
           As a last point, neither the M4 nor the M16a2 have full auto --
           so the scout talking about selecting the AK for its full auto
           capability over the M4 is deceptive.  I think this is more of a
           statement about the tanker's (lack of) training, and less about
           the weapon itself.  When it comes small arms, look at what the
           elite forces guys use as a better metric -- not some non infantry
           trained jeep jockey.
           \_ WTF??!?  I 0wn3z A11 UV U with S1L3nc3D M4A1 in CS 411 7H3
              71M3!  F*CK1NG AK47 WH0R3Z!!1!
        \_ We still have the best porn in the world! -AC
        \_ American logistics planning sucks.  I can't believe they're
           forcing tankers to do infantry work.
        \_ they say that AK47s jam less. Less than WHAT? M4? M16? Out of
           curiousity is there a benchmark for firearms like the ones for
           CPUs (SPEC INT/FLOAT), where we can look at the stopping power
           rating, jam rate, so on so forth?
           \_ They weren't quoting specs.  They were quoting soldiers, and
              the comments were based on reputation.  And yes, "less than
              the m4 or m16" is probably a decent reading of it.  And if
              you want benchmarks, try google
           \_ The AK series is just a well designed, rugged, simple to
              operate and simple to assemble machine-rifle. There are
              only half a dozen parts to the whole assembly, which is
              why it's cheap to manufacture, and easy to take care of.
              The concept is the same as  the T80 tank. However, it
              doesn't have the same stopping power as an M16.

8/25    Blood money funds racism at Columbia.  Why does Berkeley do the same
        \- would you agree "american taxpayer money" in part funds the
           ~30,000 houses built on palestinian occupied territories? --psb
        thing for free?  We should charge for the institutionalised racism
        and hatred spewing from certain departments and professors.
        http://nypost.com/postopinion/opedcolumnists/4015.htm
        \_ nothing is free. every time one of us gets a grant to do some
           useful technical research the University charges overhead.
           your tax dollars at work.
           \_ and I'm sure the research never requires administrative
              support
              \_ a million dollar grant does not require 400,000 dollars
                 of administrative support. it's a tax to support the useless
                 departments.  period.

8/21    Anyone else watch Arnold's press conference? Comedy gold.
        \_ BTW, now that Arnold's going into politics, did he say that he won't
           be making any more movies?  I don't have much confidence on him as
           a governor, but I sure love his movies.
           \_ What sucks is that True Lies 2 is on the shelf again cuz of
              America's newfound sensitivity to terrorism.
        \_ Does Arnold promise to show his ass if he's governor, or let state
           senators put out burning cigars on his hand?
        \_ Anyone else watch Davis's "I have a dream" speech?  Comedy gold.
           I don't care at all who replaces Davis but he has to be replaced.
           The rest of the bums we can get at the next election cycle.
           \_ What?  He thinks he's MKL Jr?  Oh, he has a dream indeed then.
           \_ It is hard for me to imagine anyone voluntarily watching
              Davis speak. Was it really that enjoyable? -motd liberal

8/10    Most recent poll: 54% in favor of dumping Davis, 35% opposed.  Not a
        whole lot of voter passion for saving his ass.
        \_ And in a month, when people come to their senses...
        \_ 35% seems high to me. I guess there's a silent minority here.
           \_ 35% means the support is very weak and dispassionate and thus
              unlikely to bother defending anything on an aggressive forum
              like the motd because they just don't care that much.
        \_ And this from today's news but they don't say when the poll was
           taken so you get what you pay for: 64 percent said Davis should be
           removed from office, including 40 percent of Democrats.
        \_ Great.  This just means that the election is Arnold's to lose.

8/6     Everyone blames the governor. Don't you have to also look at the dumb-
        asses in the state legislature? I think no one really knows who their
        state rep is or what he/she does. That's the problem when there are too
        many people for voters to worry about.
        \_ Don't worry, this whole thing is just a bake sale for the state.
           At $3,500 per candidate we'll pay of the deficit in no time.
           \_ LOL this is cool
           \_ I know!  We can just tax people for voting!  We can have a poll
              tax!  That'll fix the economy right up!
        \_ The legislature is and has been controlled by the dems.
        \_ I blame the legislature.  I just don't currently have the option of
           dumping any of them and with the gerrymandered 'safe' districts all
           over the state, I never will.  There's no point in voting in most
           CA elections because whoever is assigned by the Democratic party to
           run in each district gets it.  The primaries are just the Dem way of
           telling us who is going to run that region for the next few terms.
           The only reason I show at the polls is for the national vote which
           usually doesn't matter and the initiatives which still do.

7/28    Bob Hope. 100. RIP.
        \_ http://suck.com article on him from 2000:
                http://csua.org/u/3qt                   -brain
        \_ Oh shit.  All week we're going to have tributes to him on TV.
           Time to go find a nice book to read.
        \_ Beat me to it.  What you didn't do was the "YEE HAA! BOB HOPE IS
           DEAD!" part.  No one who knows him will miss him.
           \_ As his closest friend and confidante, would you care to
              share some anecdotes to support your thesis?
              \_ google pig farm neighbors "bob hope" and see what you find
           \_ Unlike the dancing on your grave when you go.
              \_ yeah yeah whatever.  i know who bob hope is.  you know
                 nothing about anything about me.  why even bother posting
                 something like this?  did it make you feel manly or smart?
                 \_ does it make *you* feel manly and smart to dance on
                    bob hope's grave?  or just cool.  yeah, you
                    probably think your pretty damned cool all right.
                    look how cool i am, i can so painlessly hate and be nasty!
                    anyway, that person (and i) know eenough about you to
                    think you're a class A asshole - your post about bob
                    hope.  i mean, i've never thought bob was funny, at all,
                    but i'm not happy he died.  you've said enough about
                    yourself for me to know you totally suck.
                    \_ if you knew more about bob hope you'd be happy he was
                       dead, too.  it has nothing at all to do with his career
                       or talents.  i've judged bob hope on his life.  you've
                       judged me based on my statement about someone else you
                       could know about if you chose to but you instead choose
                       ignorance and the easy road.  its understandable.  its
                       easier to stand up and claim the moral high ground from
                       a position of ignorance and it probably feels good too.
                    \_ When I die feel free to throw a party.  I won't mind,
                       I'll be too busy being dead.

7/24    Want to waste a little time?  http://www.emode.com/tests/uiq
        It's a 2 page IQ test.  When it asks for email address at the end,
        just give any fake address.  You'll still get the results after you
        submit the form.  My score was 135 and rated "visual mathematician"
        \_ 160+ here.
         \_ liar
        \_ I scored 136 and was a "visionary philosopher"
        \_ doesn't IQ test depend of age also?
           \_ Technically yes -- but the emode people claim to use a
              different method to arrive at similar results.  *shrug*
        \_ 135, Facts Curator
        \_ 135, Visual Mathematician. -ucla cs guys
           \_ Ditto.   -mice
        \_ too many people getting 135.  I think there's something wrong with
           the test.
           \_ I think 135 is perfect score minus one. This test is too easy
              for sodalites. We need one where the middle is higher.
              \_ 138, visionary philosopher.
              \_ Then it isn't an IQ test.
           \_ My understanding is that anyone can completely legitimately
              make a test with any scale and call it an "IQ test".
              For a standardized test you have to go for specific ones,
              i.e. "Wechsler IQ test."  I'm not certain, though. -niloc
           \_ It could be timed, hence all the "philosophers" and "curators".
        \_ 136, "visionary philosopher"
        \_ Ack! Only 133.  Must be the chocolate for breakfast.  I'm a Word
           Warrior.  I have exceptional verbal skills and easily make sense
           of complex issues and take an unusually creative approach to
           solving problems.  My strengths make me a visionary!  Even without
           trying I'm able to come up with lots of new and creative ideas!
           That's why I waste my time posting on the motd and wall all day.
           I'm just waiting to pop my next creative idea on you and take over
           the world and be the next Netscape!
        \_ 140, eh hem!
        \_ 84, Precision Processor!
        \_ 140, Visionary Philosopher
        \_ 129, precision processor -ax (I get from 129-14X on these sort
                of tests, but I've never put much faith in IQ tests.)
                A question- What is your IQ on this test vs how much
                money do you make?
                \_ IQ doesn't mean anything! It is bullshit! You can be
                   a dumb ass and still make tons of $. I know I do, cuz
                   my EQ is very very high                      -mr liao
                \_ I never took an IQ test, but you can be the Leader of the
                   Free World with the right connections! -dubya
                   \_ Although you don't see it you are actually making a very
                      good point.  Not the one where you attack the President
                      mindlessly but where you point out that with the right
                      connections you can do anything and be anyone.  "It isn't
                      what you know, it's who you know" will always be true.
                      \- hello i think the main problem with the "IQ test"
                         is that it isnt timed. e.g. someone who can do the
                         nasa alien question in 10 sec vs. 30 sec.
                         i didnt spend a lot of time on the pattern match
                         questions for example.
                         ok tnx --psb 138/fact curator
                         \_ I like how you use the example of a part of test
                            on which you happened to do particularly well.
                            What if other people used the same argument about
                            the verbal or math portions?  Your capability to
                            perform pattern matching does not impress anybody
                            with half a brain.  And may I ask why you thought
                            the alien NASA question was particularly difficult
                            that it should deserve special merit for finishing
                            quickly?
                            \- that's not what i meant about doing the
                               pattern matching quickly ... i probably did
                               lousy at that because i didnt spend much time
                               on those. i dont think you can compare a
                               135 in 10 min and a 140 in 20 min. how much
                               time you spend on the "which one doesnt
                               belong" type Qs i think also makes a diff.
                                                            --psb
                               \_ I am not defending the validity of any test
                                  which claims to be able to categorize all
                                  of human intelligence with any accuracy or
                                  precision by asking 40 simple questions.
                                  However, IQ tests in general do not test
                                  your ability to think quickly, but your
                                  ability to concentrate, visualize an answer,
                                  and verify the answer.  Hence, no time
                                  limit.
                      \_ Who's attacking the President?  If they have a
                         problem, they should tell that to me in my face!
                         -dubya
        \_ 140, but it recorded one of my answers incorrectly and scored it as
           wrong.  How is the IQ of the people who made the test?
        \_ 136, Visionary Philosopher, and no idea what the heck the answer
           was to the "rose" question. What is it?
           \_ tempting.  Look up the phrase on google.

7/14    Einstein "Crop Circle": http://csua.org/u/3m9

6/26    Does anyone knows where I can get a copy of the following:
        http://analyst.sourceforge.net
        This is a parser which parse 10K SEC filing, and it was taken
        off because of PWC's patent on parsing number or something
        obvious.
        I am hoping that the project simply went underground instead of
        being completely dead.                  -kngharv
        \_ I want a copy of this software partly for parsing 10k filing,
           but now, I want it mostly for the sake of violating what I
           considered as abuse of intellectual property laws.
                        -- OP
        \_ PWC should be allowed to defend its patents by destroying
           the computers of anyone running this 'analyst' theft
        \_ If they weren't in violation of the law the project would still be
           there.  Are you one of those "the information wants to be free!"
           fanatics who think other people's work should be made available to
           you in exchange for *nothing* from you?  So selfish, so stupid.
           Patents expire.  Childish stupidity does not.
           \_ It is heartening to see one with such abject faith in the system.
              btw, you are right about childish stupidity. -crebbs
           \_ excuse me? patenting parsing?  please.
              \_ nonsense.  did you *read* the patent?  are you qualified to
                 do so?  maybe you've seen LA Law a few times?
           \_ "It was never the object of patent laws to grant a
              monopoly for every trifling device, every shadow of a
              shade of an idea, which would naturally and spontaneously
              occur to any skilled mechanic or operator in the ordinary
              progress of manufactures. Such an indiscriminate creation
              of exclusive privileges tends rather to obstruct than
              to stimulate invention. It creates a class of speculative
              schemers who make it their business to watch the advancing
              wave of improvement, and gather its foam in the form of
              patented monopolies, which enable them to lay a heavy
              tax on the industry of the country, without contributing
              anything to the real advancement of the arts. It embarrasses
              the honest pursuit of business with fears and apprehensions
              of unknown liability lawsuits and vexatious accounting
              for profits made in good faith." --U.S. Supreme Court,
              Atlantic Works vs. Brady, 1882
              \_ motdformatd
              \_ Yes and this is incorporated into the "obviousness" clause
                 used by the PTO to deny many patents today.
           \_ Patents used to expire. The current crop is getting extended
              faster than it is expiring. This does nothing but enrich
              the patent holder, usually long after the inventor is dead.
              \_ I do not think that word means what you think it means.
                 \_ which word? they look good 2 me. -phuqm/nottheposter
                    \_ patent.
              \_ No. Sorry.  Just wrong.  Patents used to be 17 years from the
                 date of issue.  A few years ago they changed to be 20 years
                 from the date of application.  Since it can easily take 3 or
                 more years to issue, patents are actually shorter now.  I'd
                 *love* to see a URL backing up your false and ignorant claim
                 that patents are "getting extended".
                 \_ he's probably getting trademarks and patents confused
                    \_ probably.  that doesn't excuse his clueless scribblings
                       and droolings all over the motd.
                    \_ I do not think that word means what you think it means.
                       In this case, the word would be trademark.
                 \_ Given the pace of (I).technology, particularly things like
                    that which is being discussed, it would be reasonable to
                    cut the patent protection time, not increase it.
                    (even if it is only a nominal increase)  Of course, there
                    is no perfect solution.  It is all a kludge -phuqm

6/23    Justice O'Connor is a disgrace.  Souter and Stevens are morons.
        The court ruled that 'diversity' is a compelling state
        interest.
        \_ You don't agree, so they are morons.  Compelling.  This was states'
           rights decision-making at it's finest.
        \_ Well, the old boys network is still like 200 million to 2.
        \_ i think Grat came out great. It says diversity is a state interest,
           but the university's policy is not narrowly enough construed. it
           strikes a really nice balance, in my opinion. -ali.
        \_ Dear Troll, real conservatives don't believe the judges serving
           the American people on the Supreme Court are morons because they
           didn't agree with *your* personal philophy.  As a real conservative
           I'm more happy than unhappy with the ruling.  Next time you try to
           make conservatives look like idiots, please make some minimal
           effort to get it right.  Thanks!  -rc
           \_ The Freepers disagree with you.
        \_ yeah AA is really based on "race" - esp when Asians are a smaller
           minority but get no preferences. Don't forget the first race to be
           discriminated against in this country were the Chinese. Any policy
           with AA is racist pure and simple.
           \_ got some revisionist history going on there?
           \_ at one point asians were outscoring the ethnic majority at
              Cal, they had to sue to allow more in. How's that for racism?
              Sounds like AA for the ethnic majority. And it wasn't so long
              ago. Also, the first race to be discriminated against in this
              country were the native americans.

6/18    http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20030616/ap_on_re_as/japan_us_military_10
        Yet another american soldier raping the local population. If our
        soldiers are raping allied civilians, what do you think they're doing
        to Iraqi women?
        \_ Buying them cheap. The starving and hopeless give the best bang for
           the buck.
        \_ the main issue is that US Military is pretty much immued to
           the local jurisdiction.  And that USA tend to be very protective
           of her own subjects.   This is nothing new.  A century ago,
           British nationals could pretty much get away with anything in
           China for the same reason.

6/4     U.S. property laws allow millions to thrive, prosper
        http://www.adn.com/opinion/story/3234120p-3264116c.html
        \_ WRONG! Its all because the evil oppressor polluter
           gun-owner rapist white man raped, murdered and stole
           the Native American's earth and foisted upon it a
           vile capitalist materialist system designed to keep
           the poor people down.
           \_ I am curious. Does anyone but the guy who posted
              this think it is funny? It was midly amusing
              the first time, but it is pretty boring now.
              \_ well the ridiculous thing about the above attempt
                 at comedy is that s/he's trying to be sarcastic,
                 but that is, more or less, the true story.
                 \_ This one is much better.
                 \_ "That's not funny!"  --best punchline
        \_ This is a nice story, but only half of it. Land reform,
           aka The Homestead Act created the rural middle class,
           while Labor allowed urbanites the chance to escape
           poverty. Without legal protection, it would have
           been unsustainable though, I agree with that.
        \_ Hernando DeSoto is generally regarded a crack pot. and
           I dont know if I would consider this "news"... his
           views have been around for a while now, and I'm sure
           there's tons of stuff about him on the web. While
           many "objectivist" top-dog sympathizing libertarians
           will no doubt orgasm at the site of this, he is
           basically an economic advisor to latin american
           politicians grasping at straws to save their economies
           ... and I think he's declining in popularity at that.
           its just scary how much thsi philosophy has caught on.
           \_ There is that passive tense again.  'Regarded' by whom
              exactly?
              \_ Ya know, regarded.  By uhm people.  People who uhm think
                 exactly like the poster does in his 'cell'.

5/20    http://www.rrstar.com/localnews/your_community/rockford/20030520-4814.shtml
        More right wing nutters who don't understand free speech.
        \_ Dear Mr. Pot, this is mr. Kettle.
           \_ God Bless America!!
        \_ You have to sound more enthusiastic to be a believable liberal.
           \_ I'm working on it. I've got the basic vocabulary down and I got
              the talking points off the fax each morning.  If I can nail the
              delivery I'll be able to drool with the best of 'em!  -op
              \_ First of all... "nutter"? What are you some kind of fucking
                 limey or something?
        \_ aww, but the speaker made the little Education graduate CRY!
           \_ This rocks. We need more liberals that can make the
              conservatives cry like that.
              \_ Because that will convince her to vote your way?  Okey dokey!
                 Good planning!  Because you can convince people of the
                 correctness of your philosophy by abusing them. I like it!
                 \_ Why not? This has been conservative-talk-show-host strategy
                    for the past decade or so. The approach has won these,
                    er, entertainers, a legion of fans, many of whom post
                    regularly on the motd. Go Michael Savage!
                    \_ The radio personalities that bring you to tears aren't
                       making new conservative voters which is all that counts.
                       Stop crying about Rush and Savage and whoever and *do*
                       something to convince people of the correctness of your
                       philosophy and you'll make it happen.  Upsetting voters
                       never got anyone anything.  Savage is light
                       entertainment.  Sometimes he's even correct.  If you
                       say enough stuff, that will happen sometimes.  Rush is
                       nothing more than repeating RNC talking points.  There
                       isn't anything original in his show.  It's 100% party
                       platform stuff.  Shows like theirs are not at all where
                       conservative strength is.  --conservative
                       \_ Your argument is tangent as well as incorrect.
        \_ This is akin to giving an Oscar to Michael Moore and then
           not expecting him to make a political statement.  Get over it.
           \_ and I imagine all the Academy members would throw their caps
              into the air, go back to live with their parents, then look for
              jobs.

5/8     Gee W and his lapdog Tony Blair nominated for Nobel Peace Prize.
        Take that you commie liberals!
        \_ There are three nobel prizes that are worth a shit, and the
           "peace prize" isn't one of them.
        \_ http://csua.org/u/e6f (asia.reuters.com)
        \_ So is Bono from U2. So what?
           \_ I'm not the op, but I think the op makes an interesting point.
              \_ "Take that you commie liberals!" is an interesting point?
                 What "point" are you talking about exactly?
                 \_ I took it to be a point about the meaninglessness of the
                    NPP and various EU .orgs in general.
                    \_ I'd say it certainly deflates the seriousness of the
                       nomination process.  Whether it invalidates the NPP
                       will depend on whether GW and Blair win.
                       \_ Arafat didn't do it for you, huh?
                          \_ or Kissinger?
                          \_ Getting the prize for hugging Rabin on the
                             White House lawn > getting the prize for
                             making peace by prematurely launching war.
                             \_ If you get the NPP for hugging someone then
                                it means nothing.
                             \_ More like getting the prize for killing
                                Jews.

5/7     What is the difference between a conservative and a neo-conservative?
        And why does the Self Appointed Motd Censor keep deleting this?
        \_ samc has a small penis, and so he needs the feeling of power
           that splattering motd entries gives

5/1     Do all credit cards get spammed with solicitations for budget saver
        programs, life insurance, credit protection fees, etc, or did I just
        happen to get a card that does?
        \_ Congratulations.  Now that you have their card, you now have
           an existing relationship with all of their affiliates, which
           means that the junk mail and telemarketing phone calls you're
           getting are yours legitimately.  Good luck opting out.
           \_ *sigh* yup.  I usually toss all the junk mail, but somehow I
              still got signed up for some budget saver crap, and I was
              charged on my account. argh. And a prior incident, it took
              several phone calls to get them to seize their life insurance
              several phone calls to get them to cease their life insurance
              charges.
        \_ yes I do get spammed.  They did send out Privacy Letters so you
           can opt out.  Also, some of the spam mail is useful -- great
           credit card rates/deals.

4/29    Stupid boring crap deleted since all the interesting stuff was gone
        we might as well make it short if it can't be worth reading.
        \_ "Stupid boring crap == message of liberal views  ??
           \_ No.  Stupid boring crap == what was left over after anything and
              everything non-technical was deleted.  Why do you assume that
              someone of any political stripe would delete only the
              alternative viewpoint's threads?  Quite the opposite in fact.
              The left posting is an opportunity to correct and educate
              because leftists don't have views, they have feelings.
              \_ Right on! Conservatives always argue from logic and
                 never resort to personal attacks like those weepy liberals.
                 \_ the vast majority of everyone is a moron.  there are a
                    few well-informed people on both sides of most issues.
                 \_ I don't speak for other conservatives.  I'm the one who
                    purged the other crap so I'm replying for myself.  You
                    asked a question about what was purged, the person who
                    did it told you.  Don't like the answer?  Tough shit.

4/7     Can someone report the link about Japanese Unit731 experimenting
        on living American soldiers?
        \_ http://csua.org/u/c3e
           <DEAD>www.ipsystems.com/powmia/unit-731.html<DEAD>

4/4     So why do people debate politics on the motd anyway?  Is it just
        three people who stupidly fall for each other's trolls?  Do you
        think that you are going to bring people around to your opinion
        by posting absurdly leftist or rightist propaganda, and flaming
        the hell out of people that disagree with you?  Are you just
        bored at work?  Are you naive enough to think that, in spite of
        the fact that you've been doing it for YEARS, shooting your
        mouth off in a small private online forum is going to make a
        whit of difference?  Are you just idiots? -genuinely curious
        \_ I don't know about you, but I learn things by reading and
           considering other people's points of view. The axis of
           considering other people's points of view. The range of
           political ideas is considerably more complicated than the
           binary leftist -> rightist axis you describe and while I
           am not a conservative by any means, I have probably become
           more moderate by reading ideas here. Sometimes I am just
           trolling, sometimes I am bored at work, yes, but more often
           am interested in exchanging ideas with other people. As
           far as the "small private ... forum" part, what are the
           alternatives? Have you tried posting to other online forums?
           90% of the stuff is puerile insults. There are plenty of
           insults on the motd, but at least most of them are clever
           or backed with some kind of reference. -motd liberal
           \_ agreed.
        \_ From a conservative: There are several reasons for posting on the
           motd.  First, all of us are here posting due to boredom to some
           degree or another and I don't mean just the political posters.  As
           far as why the political postings, on my part it is because this is
           one of the few places on campus where one can have a political
           discussion which doesn't instantly turn into "well, you're just a
           nazi fascist racist so there!".  And lastly my long term goal is to
           see people such as the motd liberal posting above say they have
           become more moderate by reading ideas here.  Compared to the
           typical Berkeleyan or San Franciscan I'm very conservative.
           Compared to the rest of the country I'm anywhere from moderate to
           liberal.  This leads to the last reason for my posting.  I find the
           extreme left postings funny and amusing.  They don't seem to have
           any idea just how far left they really are.  As source material for
           my discussions I read multiple websites from the entire spectrum.
           I read foreign websites.  I read the left wing weeklies in the City
           which call the Chronical and NYT a bastion of right wing oppression
           and ultra conservatism.  I have a reasonably decent understanding
           of the thought process of the left and the right and those z-axis
           folks as well and am perfectly happy to bag on any of them when
           they get really stupid or use poor rhetorical techniques.  Anyway,
           what would you rather be all over the motd?  Sports scores, stocks,
           and when the next kernel update will be ready?  You can get that
           crap anywhere.  Politics is about people.  People are way more
           interesting than that other stuff.  I ignore the things I find
           boring.  I don't delete them.  I don't comment on them.  I simply
           page down over them unread.  If the politics bothers you so much, I
           suggest you do the same.  Oh yeah, it isn't just 3 people.  It's
           *very* easy to track who is posting to the motd using user level
           available system tools.  Start tracking for yourself.  --motd cons.
           \_ I couldn't have said it better myself(although perhaps I could
              have been more brief.) I'm really amazed that poeple can see
              all these interesting politics threads and actually prefer
              some shit about pine, followed by a personal attack on pine
              users.  Why don't they just go to usenet? -another motd liberal

4/2     Do tanks (American ones?) have cooling systems such as air
        conditioners for its crew?
        \_ maybe they should have AM/FM radio, CD player, and a DVD screen
           to go alone with it?
           \_ it does get very hot in the desert and in those things, people
              must be cooking.
        \_ How about internet access in the tanks?  Surf porn while waiting
           for orders.
                \_ Yes: http://slate.msn.com/id/2080955  (Solaris x86 even)
        \_ HAHA. No. Ever been to a naval ship/tank museum?
           \_ Abrams M1A1 has air conditioning.  In fact, more is true --
              it has air filtering, as it was designed to operate in
              environments where chemical, biological and nuclear weapons
              were used.  Russian soldiers often mock the americans 'because
              their tanks have air conditioning.'
              \_ last time i checked, Russian tanks and jet planes also
                 have air conditioning.  like all weapons, none of it was
                 designed for soldier's comfort.
              \_ Russia still has soldiers?  Do they mock ours for getting
                 paid regularly, too?
                 \_ Puny weak american materialistic capitalist consumer
                    pig dog! Real Solider does not need pay to fight!
                    Vodka for self and tank is enough!
                    \_ I see the flaw in my argument now.  Russian is great.
                       America is weak.  We'll be crushed any day now!
           \_ No?  How do they survive the heat in a summer desert together
              with the heat from the engine and the cannon?
        \_ Yead a hatch to open and let the cool desert air in.
        \_ Abrams are pressurized.
            \_ Really? pv=nrt
           \_ What for?
              \_ to keep out water, posion gas, sand, etc, etc?
                \_ Who TF deleted my correct response. ALL modern tanks have full
                   NBC protection.
                   \_ use motdedit
                   \_ Nuclear Biological Chemical

3/22    I've decided to boycott American products as a protest against the war.
        \_ If you are serious about this how about suicide?
           \_ Immolating yourself in public is said to make quite an
              impression.
              \_ not since they started using flame-retardent asphalt.
        \_ Don't forget to turn in your citizenship!
        \_ I'm a little on the spineless side and just decided to stop
           voting
           \_ you are also on the stupid side if you're trying to prevent
              shit like this to happen by not voicing your opinion
              constructively.
        \_ Move to Iraq and volunteer in Saddam's army.
        \_ Definitely renounce your citizenship and go somewhere else.  You
           won't be able to boycott American products living here.  It just
           isn't possible.  I'm with you brother!
        \_ I think boycotting American products is the best means for me
           to protest against the war.  Will I boycott every single
           American product.  Nah, but enough to make a difference.  I
           think people all over the world should do the same, and I think
           many are.  It won't make a big impression, it's only minorly
           inconvenient, but it hits where it hurts.
        \_ There're American products again?  Did I miss something?  When
           did that happen?  I thought everything was made in China these
           days.
           \_ Jokes, aside, yes.  eg. United Airlines, GE, Coca Cola, etc.
              and many many others.

3/21    Fuck self-righteous motd censoring assholes. You know who you are.
        \_ There's one person who's just removing all the long political msgs.
            \_ not all of them, just the non-peacenick ones, leaving
              the antiamerican ones and liberal ones. this is berkeley,
              no freedom of speech except for the elitist liberals
              \_ that's total bullshit.  the only thing that doesn't get
                 censored around here is discussions of sendmail.
                 sex, leftist politics, right-wing politics, and random
                 interesting things about life are all  too controversial
                 if you're a fragile-ego dickhead sysadmin.
                 \_ ooh!  I have a sendmail question...
                    \_ does it involve sex?
                       \_ It does involve yermom.
              \_ Aww. Can I get you a hanky? We'll make it all better for you.

3/18    Pictures before and after of how the American girl was bulldozed.
        http://electronicintifada.net/v2/article1248.shtml
        \_ This reminds me of the famous picture of a man standing in front of
           a column of tanks in Tianmen square.  I guess Israeli soldiers
           have the power of will.
           \_ It just proves that they are less than human.
        \_ This reminds me of the scene in Spies Like Us when Chevy Chase
           yells out "Don't Shoot, We're Americans!"  DUH. do you think your
           american rights have any importance in other countries?
        \_ So basically, the guy who took the pictures watched someone get
           run over and his first thought wasn't "maybe I should help",
           but instead, "I should be taking pictures!". sweet.
           \_ Are you that same asshole that was claiming she wasn't
              deliberately run over, but she tripped and fell?
           \_ Err ... 3 other people were trying helping her, as can be seen
              in the picture.
           \_ ... and the pictures show when she was "safe" and when she was
              already run over.

3/13    In all these pictures of military guys lately, the soldiers have
        have a backwards American flag patch on their arm.
        What's that all about? Symbolize anything?
        \_ http://www.ushistory.org/betsy/flagetiq.html#3
           The last question.
           \_ Someone ought to tell Old Navy that it has been
              violating Section 8d for the last 5 or so years.
        \_ It's so the Iraqi's can see it facing the right way in their
           rear view mirrors as they flee.
        \_ omg! you're right! someone notify the pentagon.
        \_ It's a secret message from the skull and bones crowd
           to the novus ordo seculorum people.
           \_ you got it.  this is why the bank of England flys their flag
              backwards also.
              \_ especially when the wind is in the wrong direction.

3/13    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A18071-2003Mar12.html
        for the UN lovers among us
        \_ It's too bad that the UN and its legitimacy seem bound to the
           notion of liberal or convservative; republican or democrat.  The
           UN is a terrible holdover from the previous century -- with no
           checks, balances or accountability.
        \_ Expect this to be deleted.
           \_ Still waiting.

3/5     http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/news/news-iraq-usa-shirt.html
        \_ It's unfortunate that both NYT and CNN are running the same
           Reuters article since that article doesn't mention anything
           about the resulting demonstrations and protests after this arrest.
           \_ Protest what?  There is no freedom of speech in private
                   enterprises you twit.  A private business can choose
                   its customers.
              enterprises you twit.  A private business can choose its
              customers.  Here's the unbiased article title: 'Belligerent lawyer
              arrested for trespassing'
              \_ are you that stupid?  Ever see a mall with a sign that says "no
                 niggers allowed"?  Or "colored only drinking fountain"?  If the
                 place is open to the public, it's subject to all the
                 laws/regulations just like public land.
                  \_ Wearing a tshirt does not fall under the jurisdiction of
                     equal protection, twit.  Please don't argue about the
                     Constitution from a position of complete ignorance - you
                     make yourself look stupid.  But maybe thats inevitable.
                     Under your logic, maybe we should now extend special
                     protection for crimes against people wearing certain
                     tshirts, and maybe relaxed admission policies or hiring
                     practices for those who wear the politically correct
                     tshirt.
              \_ It's their right to toss the guy out (if a bit pathetic), but
                 the way they treated him was pretty pathetic.

3/2     Anybody here buy/sell US treasury bills, notes, etc?  I'm wondering
        whether I should buy the auctions from etrade or directly through
        the US treasury.  Treasury direct has a website and online management.
        Any positive/negative experiences with either etrade or treasury
        direct?  Thanks.
        \_ What's the advantage of buying treasury bills as opposed to just
           savings bonds?
           \_ Treasury bills are federal saving bonds, actually. The advantage
              is that T-bills have a much larger market (international,
              especially places like Japan, Taiwan, China, Hong Kong).  So the
              prices are almost impossible to manipulate.  Thus you don't have
              to pay state tax.
          \_ the biggest difference between bills, notes, and bonds vs
             savings bonds is that it's marketable.  You can easily buy/sell
             them before maturity in an open market.  Can't do that with
             savings bonds.

2/21    The Mythical Crowd Count:
   When told of The Chronicle's survey, Alex S. Jones, the director of
   Harvard University's Joan Shorenstein Center on the Press, Politics
   and Public Policy, said, "The number of people (in a crowd) is a
   mythical number, and now you're going to turn it into a fact, and that
   won't be welcomed."
   http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2003/02/21/MN240732.DTL
        God fucking forbid we should really know how many people showed up
        at a protest anywhere.  It's much better to feel good about a made up
        number.  Facts aren't welcomed.
        \_ none of this will ever make both sides very happy, it's all
           a guessing game.  There wasn't a single hour period where
           everybody who went was there at the same time, it was over
           several hours.  Some people arrived late, some early,
           some (like me) bailed on the actual rally.  Even if you
           put up turnstiles to count people you're not going to
           get an accurate count.  I do think it's interesting
           that the chronicle devoted a few column inches to sunday's
           events, but published over 2 and a half pages on
           their big "overcounting" story.  Maybe the ChronWatch
           guy has their children hostage?  - danh
           \_ Oh man, please don't tell me you're a column inches counter
              like Mr. "Manufacturing Consent"?
        \_ gee, a counting method that apparently has never been used before,
           and is based on eyeball estimates of the number of people in
           photos taken at one specific point in a 4-hour event.  Great
           "facts," for sure.  -tom
           \_ Read the article.  Your description of the method is simply
              wrong.  Is that intentional?
              \_ they divide the photo into boxes, estimate (eyeball) how
                 "full" the box is, and estimate how many people would fit
                 in the box if it was full.  This will not give you a
                 "factual" count.  It's just another method of estimation. -tom
                 \_ No.  They count how many are in a box.  The Chronicle did
                    their own count using the same photos and came up with
                    similar numbers.  They also reported BART, bridge and ferry
                    traffic as compared to the week before.  It sounds a hell
                    of a lot more accurate than "200k makes us feel good so
                    don't mess with us!"
                    \_ what was that about "Read the article"?
                        "Overlaying the photographs with a grid,
                        surveyors from Air Flight Service estimated
                        crowd density in the plaza and along the
                        route. Each grid was evaluated and assigned a
                        density of people, from 10 percent to 100
                        percent full.  Most were judged at 25 percent
                        or 50 percent full. This is the first time the
                        firm has used its equipment for crowd estimation."
                         -tom
                        \_ Nice way to extract just what you wanted out of
                           context.  Those who read it will get it.  Those who
                           don't aren't reading this thread anyway.
                    \_ no, you're wrong.  it's inconceivable that 200k people
                       did not attend the demonstration.
                       \_ no, you're wrong.  it's inconceivable that 200k
                          people attended the demonstration.  (see how your
                          grade school quality 'logic' works?)
                          \_ see, i'm a well-meaning idealistic lover of
                             peace who gets lots of high-quality liberal
                             pussy, and you're a fascist pig.  of course
                             i am right and you're wrong.
                             \_ I get fascist pussy.  Fascists shower.
                                \_ It's so cute when two conservatives pretend
                                   to argue with each other. Get a room you two!
           \_ So tom, you've never heard of polls?  Statistical sampling?  This
              has never been tried before?
        \_ Jebus.  It's the Chron, and what interest do they have in
           publishing an article which repeatedly asserts an accurate
           low count?  What, they want to cash in on the new Republican
           wave overtaking the country?
           \_ Dude, repeat after me.  The press is an unbiased reporter
              of events.  It has no political agenda, and it does not
              bias its reporting to favor one political ideology over
              another.

2/20    Do BNO passport holders need a visa to visit Japan for short-term?  The
        web site only says British passport holders are exempted.  I tried
        called the Consulate but it's closed.  Thanks.  (Yeah I can wait till
        tomorrow.)
        \_ yes.
        \_ BNO officially means second class.  It is all insult no benefit.
        \_ Just curious, what is "BNO"?
           \_ British National Overseas
              \_ Thanks.
        \_ I called the consulate: (415) 777-3533.  The answer is yes.

1/24    Can't get a law passed through Congress?  Just make it an executive
        order!  President allows our tax dollars to fund the construction
        of churches in a fairly clear establishment of official government
        religion.  Go Conservatives!
        \_ What the hell are you talking about?
        \_ The question is still funding. Just saying it's so is great if
           it doesn't cost anything. Congress has to appropriate funds.
        \_ I believe the quote was, "Stroke of the pen, law of the land, cool!"
           It's amazing how cool it is when it's your molestor-in-chief doing
           it, but how much it sucks when the opposition does things you don't
           like and how quickly some of us blather on about the constitution
           when we were perfectly happy to ignore it the previous 8 years as
           a "living changing document".  Welcome to the conservative side
           with your new found belief in strict constitutionalism.
           \_ well, to be fair, the dems never considered the constitution
              to be some sacrosanct document that is not open to deconstruction
              and reinterpretation.  so it's only galling when the republicans
              do it.
              \_ no, it's galling when leftists fall back on a strict
                 interpretation when it is convenient to claim a violation and
                 want to ignore and twist it the rest of the time.
                 \_ So it's okay when you do it but not okay when someone
                    else does. Right-o.
           \_ Who said anything about recent democrats being faultess?  To
              be fair though, where's the special investigator who should
              be looking into our current president's alleged drug use? I'm
              sure that given enough money he could find some kind of dirt
              on W that the conservative media won't be able to easily spin.
           \_ Never been a strict constitutionalist, never will, but I
              want a chance to vote on the X-ianization of the govt.
           \_ The government ALREADY funds private sectarian schools
              with Federal loans.  The USSSC decided this is allowed provided
              the choice is made by an individual.  At at least be honest
              honest about your intentions - the U.S. government is
              historically Christian, a fact easy to verify.
              What you want is secularization.
              Government giving handouts corrupts the exchange and eliminates
              any moral virtue of the exchange.   Read Dinesh D'Souza for
              example, http://www.dineshdsouza.com

12/27   It's a CSUA republican's dream:
        <DEAD>andyh.mirkk.net/bilderbok/picput.php?id=12<DEAD>
        \_ Uh huh.  Whatever.  I'll ignore the obvious paint-em-all-with-one
           brush and do the same instead in the name of humor:  *This* must
           be a CSUA democrat's dream:
http://us.news1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/rids/20021227/i/1041007082.537870376.jpg
           \_ You bastard!  I don't give a shit what your political leanings
              are -- this is just  *fucked*  *up*.
              \_ *laugh*  It's a standard yahoo news item photo on the cloning
                 thing currently in the news.  What's the problem? *snicker*

12/19   Follow the money:
        http://csua.org/u/70f
        \_ But your link doesn't say the important parts: who gave all this
           money to the two parties and what was the payback?
           \_ http://opensecrets.org

12/3    Tombstone Militia Leader Says Group Will Risk Arrest
        [Citizens Arresting Illegals on Public Lands]
        http://www.azstarnet.com/star/today/21203MILITIATRAINING.html
        \_ It's ironic that the government might arrest citizens for trying to
           enforce the law by using the same people who are supposed to be
           enforcing the very same law themselves.
        \_ Wouldn't it be easier to issue lots of temporary work visa to
           Mexicans bother crossing illegally?  If people have an easy way of
           getting in, they'll be more likely to go back home (since the cost
           of returning is not high).  Furthermore, they'll keep their
           families at home if they can see them regularly.
           \_ Because as soon as Maria pops out a kid she's magically created
              a new voter and suddenly has the 'right' to my pocket for food,
              medical care, housing, and general cash welfare.

11/7    Not all of us on the left are happy with the Dems:
        http://csua.org/u/507
        \_ He had me for awhile. Then he started being Geov Parrish again.
           Two years in Seattle listening to him whine was enough for me.
           I switched to reading The Stranger and haven't cracked the
           Seattle Weekly since. Like most "progressives", he laments the
           loss of power to control Supreme Court appointees and harangues
           the one guy the Demos have elected to the presidency in 20
           years in almost the same breath. No wonder the right doesn't
           consider the left a threat.
        \_ I disagree with the 'facts' upon which he bases his argument(s) but
           at least he follows logically from his non-facts to his conclusions
           unlike most leftists who simply spout opinion-as-fact.  He's a step
           up from your typical lefty, but his denial of reality leads me to
           believe as the above says that the left is not a serious threat if
           this is the way their clearer thinkers are going.

11/6    Cool.  Did you know that by purging the motd of all political topics
        you can actually keep pretending to yourself that your party didn't
        get crushed nationwide?  4 more years!  (Of course if your party had
        won you'd be crowing from the roof tops about it and reminding us how
        you have a mandate going into '04....)  Got your spot in the sand
        prepped for head placement?
        \_ the word for people who delete other peoples' political posts
           isn't "democrat" or "republican", it's "asshole".
        \_ 2004, my fine young troll.  See how the Repubs do when they
           can't blame the Dems for anything. And if you're such a brave
           young republican, sign your posts.  --erikred
        \_ I've already been planning to move from this fucked country.
           \_ Where to?

11/6    Yeehah! The Dems are out of power! Lets see, what acts of unmitigated
        evil can we commit today now that we're drunk on our own power?

11/2    http://www.nytimes.com/2002/10/20/magazine/20INEQUALITY.html
        Ok freepers out there, you can all start ranting about this now.
        \_ Why would anyone bother ranting about a NYT article?  It's the NYT.
           Everyone knows in advance what they're going to say on any topic,
           so why bother?
           \_ and the same isn't true for the Free Republic? what's your
              point, anyway?

10/14   is there a news magazine that *doesn't* suck?
        \_ no.  by definition news magazine = pre-digested safe news for the
           ugly uneducated masses.
        \_ economist
           \_ capitalist tool. Well written, though.
              \_ Aren't they generally on the balance?  The world news coverage
                 is pretty good compared to most American news.
        \_ The Week

10/11   http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/news/archive/2002/10/02/MNblue.DTL
        This is why we need govt. To protect idiots from themselves.
        Libertarian turns himself into a SMURF.
        \_ posted last week.

10/6    Communists won the elections in Brazil.  Very bad news for the US.
        \_ maybe if you are McCarthy
        \_ Bad news?  Why?  It's an election.  As long as the country continues
           to have elections and they're (reasonably) honest, I see no issue.
           \_ How many countries continue to have elections after communists
              gain power?
              \_ Depends.  How many got elected as communists which is the
                 situation here as opposed to a violent overthrow which is
                 the standard communist take over method since no one in their
                 right mind would let the typical violet communist take over
                 anythign more than a bus stop?
              \_ Even if they got rid of elections,  how would it be
                 very bad news for the US?
        \_ Da Silva isn't a communist--he's realized he can't afford to be.
           Nor will he back out of Cardozo's reforms significantly--he's
           agreed to keep the country's commitment to a $30 billion IMF loan.
           Wait and see...

9/28    http://www.washtimes.com/national/20020928-28971472.htm
        Zogby says Dems going to lose the Senate.

9/24    Hehe... an entire generation of young conservatives about to enter
        college... leftists at Cal should prepare to become a minority.
        http://www.sacbee.com/state_wire/story/4528885p-5548378c.html
        \_ not too suprising.  Kids grow up and realize that their little
           sheltered world isn't the real thing.  Notice all the things
           children were more conservative about were relgious.
        \_ the 80's and 90's were already pretty conservative.
        \_ Decepetive headline. It's that damn liberal media distorting
           the truth again!
        \_ The only thing worse than some snotty whiny badly dressed child
           who labels himself a "liberal" is a snotty whiny J-Crew-dressed
           child (usually with large glasses) who labels himself a
           "conservative".  If this is the same crowd that was in my high
           school jr. republicans debating club, caveat berkeley.... -John
           \_ Difference being these kids didn't label themselves.  These are
              just kids in bulk, not political activists.  It's not the same
              crowd from your clique.  It's just kids.  Lots of kids.

9/23    Normally, are guys supposed/allowed to go to bridal showers?  And, is
        one supposed to give a gift at the bridal shower and then another one
        at the wedding ceremony, only at the bridal shower, only at the wedding
        ceremony, or something else?  Usually, what kind of gifts are
        appropriate at the bridal shower and at the wedding ceremony?
        \_ Dude, look, it all comes down to "weddings are for women". Period.
           The rest is bullshit.  Avoid it as much as humanly possible.
        \_ BDG!!!!!  Where art thou!!!  -your most loyal fan
             \_ I applaud you for not saying "wherefore".
           \_ Just as the poor hapless accused were never allowed into the
              closed door deliberations of the cardinals overseeing the
              inquisition, men are never allowed into the clossed door
              sessions known as bridal showers. These are activities where
              women gather together to share the torture techniques they have
              honed through the ages.
              In any case, as a man the OP should not participate in the
              undoing of a fellow man. But if you (OP) truly wish to give
              a gift, then give the gift of life to your fellow man by
              preventing this marriage and the living hell that will follow
              it.
              \_ Thank you for coming through.  Keep the faith bro!
                                -BDG's #1 fan
                 \_ If I can save one other soul from the eighth hell of
                    marriage then the suffering that was my married life
                    will have been worth it.
        \_ Gifts are NEVER appropriate at the wedding ceremony.  - Miss Manners
        \_ Guys do not go to bridal showers.  Gifts should be mailed to the
           couple after the wedding.  -tom
           \_ What?! It doesn't really have to be after the wedding does
              it? I'm about to mail mine to the couple, 3 weeks before
              the wedding. Should I put off on it?
              \_ It should be after the wedding--what if the wedding doesn't
                 happen?
              \_ Not really. It's more a hassle thing is how I've heard it. You
                 send them after the wedding so the couple doesn't have to cope
                 with the presents (and returning of said presents for cash)
                 while simultaneously preparing for the ceremony.
                 \_ Ideally someone else is taking care of the presents (best
                    man, maid of honor, co-ordinator). Even sending them after
                    the wedding has its problems (ie. long honeymoon, both
                    working, delivery trouble). 'Sup to the couple to let
                    folks know if one method is preferable.
                 P.s., co-ed bridal showers are beginning to happen. I've been
                 to one. -- guy
                 \_ It's a new way to torture guys. Like the baby shower thing.
              \_ hapless twinks - they are given at the reception after ceremony
                 \_ not according to Miss Manners.  -tom
                    \_ ceremony != reception twink
                        \_ Miss Manners explicitly says that presents should
                           be mailed to the couple afterwards, seeing as how
                           they are supposed to be heading off on a honeymoon
                           and they probably didn't bring a U-Haul to transport
                           all the gifts home from the reception.  -tom
                           \_ umm. that's what the bride's maids, best men,
                           and close relatives are for. Who's goign to stay
                          at home and wait for packages to arrive? are they
                          going to leave valuables on your doorstep until
                          your honeymooon is over. That's stupid. Miss Manners
                          is a liberal bitch.
                          \_ I've seen her called many things, but never
                             "liberal".
                             \_ She's about common sense and treating people
                                with due respect, no more and no less.
                                \_ That sounds suspiciously like something
                                   a liberal would say.
                                   \_ Say what?  MM is great.  No one here is
                                      less liberal than me.
                 \_ Chinese usually do it this way.
                    \_ Chinese usually give hongbaos (or angbaos).

9/5     I majorly regret attending that commie liberal "institution" known
        as Berkeley. I'm ashamed of the U.S.Representative there and all the
        pathetic things they tried to do in the past. Displaying the American
        flag is not divisive. It falls under "love it or leave it."

8/18    Middle East Forum - policy analysis
        http://www.meforum.org
        \_ Well written. Pro-Isreali, in a thoughtful way. -soda liberal
           \_ Read the discussions after the articles.
           \_ Does being liberal automatically mean not pro-Israeli?  Is
              that a part of being on the left?  Is that a plank in the
              Dem platform?
              \_ One could only hope, but the truth is quite the opposite.
              \_ No you are very confused.  liberals are ~anti-Isreal
                 liberal has little to nothing to do with Dems./Repubs.
                 \_ E.g., Dem. Sen. Leiberman, Feinstein & Boxer are
                    about the most hardline Israel supporters in the
                    Senate. It helps that all three are Jewish.
                 \_ But I thought Republicans are conservatives and Democrats
                    are liberals.
                    \_ Return thee to thy slimy cave without cookie, thou
                       pitiful troll!

8/9     'Were economic data manipulated?'
        No I don't believe it - more conspiracy.
        http://csua.org/u/143
        \_ If you continue to post myth smashing facts on the motd you're
           going to get purged by the self appoint motd star chamber of one.
           going to get purged by the self appointed motd star chamber of one.
        \_ What makes you think they are telling the truth now?
        \_ What makes you think they are telling the truth now? It seems just
           as likely to me that the economy flew higher and crashed harder than
           the government wants to admit, so they are trying to lower the
           baseline a bit to hide the deep recession we are in now and
           try to keep us out of a depresssion.
                \_ ie. we need tax cuts, not increases in taxes ala
                   Gray Davis
                   \_ are you a "free market"er as well?

8/2     http://www.opensecrets.org

7/20    Aaah, a Kinneyless motd.  Thank God.  We should be thankful that
        kuro5hin lets anyone blog.
        \_ Who the hell is Kinney anyway?
        I have recently turned my thoughts to capitalism and how we DO
        NOT live in a capitalist market place. There is a lot of talk
        about how competition drove corporations into the ground
        (particularyly telecom!) however why is it that some suceed and
        some don't? In real competition everyone suceeds which drive
        innovation and improvements, however in american competition the
        gains are not in effectively competeing the gains are when you
        have gained market power.. ie you have become a monopoly. This is
        mainly why we had such large appreciations in equity pricing.
          Fundamentaly that had no changed.. Most corporations in america
        will in the long run enjoy monopoly power, this will continually
        allow american corps to grow. however they are doing so by
        violating what economists think of as competition. Firms gain
        market power through the use of contractual terms, end user
        agreements, legislation, regulation, and also through the use of
        advetising(marketing). And most importantly they utilize the
        PATENT.
          My train of throught has led me to believe that patents and
        copyrights are a serious drag on the long run economy.
           \_ just look at /csua/tmp/motd.kinney
        \_ [ kinneydrivel deleted. ]  Go away.

7/8     what's the real difference between the 11 dollar skateboard bearings
        and the 30 dollar skateboard bearings(for a set of 8)?
        is it worth buying the expensive ones?   -cheapskate
        \_ If you don't know then it wouldn't matter to you anyway.  Save your
           money until you know what you're doing.
           \_ i just bought the 7 dollar set.  if they wear out four times
              as fast as the 30 dollar ones, they're still a good deal.
              the set of bearings on my current board has been getting hard
              use for about three years now, and they're pretty much
              shot.  sure beats car maintenance.
        \_ only things you wud prob notice are how fast they wear out
           and get gunked and possibly how fast they are or how much
           you gotta kick.. -shac
        \_ Wear, noise.  Loud bearings suck.  -John
        \_ You pay for the ABEC rating, which determine the smoothness of the
           bearing.  Bones are prob ABEC 7 or higher (they don't say), while
           those $11 dollar set are prob ABEC 1.  Also, Bones are sealed on
           both sides of the bearing while some are sealed on one side and
           others none at all.
           \_ thank you for the only useful response.  the 7$ ones i got
              are ABEC 3.  oh well.  i'll get the fancy ones if
              they wear out too fast.
        \_ Good ball bearings are not trivial to make.  Ball bearings
           factories are targetted during WWII.
                \_ interesting fact but how is this relevant?
                        -motd relevance god
                   \_ European ball bearing factories are newer than those
                      in the US? Personally I feel the author was acting as
                        \_ Huh?  What prompted you to ask that question?
                           \_ It was a nonsensical conclusion created in the
                              face of a pointless fact.
                      a know-it-all with no sense of grammar and tense.
                   \_ It, like all things, involves yermom.

6/14    i have a question for all you conservative freeper types out there.
        are you all creationists who hate the evil liberal consipiracy
      to teach evolution in the schools, or do you not buy into that
      part of it?  i just want to know how many science degreee recipients
      from my alma mater are part of this creationism thing.
      \_ Didn't take much to bring them kooks out, did it?
         \_ When you ignorantly slam a huge segment of the population, you're
            going to get corrected.  This is obvious to anyone who still
            retains half the brains they were born with.
      \_ Sir Issac Newton, creationist, Bible scholar fluent in Greek,
         Hebrew, and Latin, wrote extensively on the prophecies of Daniel.
         He also happened to do a few things in math, physics, and optics.
         \_ I thought he invented apples. -geordan
            \_ yeah, but he was selling blue boxes first.
            \_ I though that he invented "the fall" because of the apple
               \_ No. Mark E. Smith invented "The Fall" in Manchester in
                  1977.
      \_ You can seriously refer to yourself as possessing a "science" degree
         and doubt the existence of something more than primordial
         soup?  You sound to me like a mass media/culture
         puppet who has never considered the history of
         of civilization and your current existence.
         \_ Is anyone else having a hard time parsing this.
            \_ I think it is perfect as it stands. It is a classic
               semi-coherent tendentious rant. Leave it be.
               \_ Shrug.  It parsed in English to me.  It wasn't much of a rant
                  either.  It was a single question and a single statement.
                  Where's the rant?  I suppose it's easier for some people who
                  have trouble parsing anything longer than Jack'n'Jill to just
                  proclaim the whole thing is a rant and write it off.
      \_ 1) Not all conservatives are freepers.  I only read freeper stuff
         when it gets posted to the motd and mostly not even then. 2) Not
         all conservatives are creationists or even christians.  3) Not all
                                                    \_
                                      And not all Christians are
                                      conservatives.
         conservatives think there's an evil liberal conspiracy.  Some of us
         understand you're just confused and brainwashed.  Time has been
         known to heal this affliction in many cases.  Rarely has a mature
         adult ever become infected with the liberalism disease later in
         life after they're learned to think and respect others.
         \_ amen!
         \_ Not only that, not all people who have problems with the theory
            of evolution are 'creationists' in the usual sense. -- ilyas
         \_ mature? or have gotten old?
            \_ Mature.  "Adult" implies having reached a certain age *and* a
               certain level of maturity.  "Mature" in this context is using
               the primary meaning of the word.  I wanted to emphasise both
               age and opposite-of-childish but with extra weight placed on
               opposite-of-childish.
      \_ Most Freepers are dropouts or trolls (one of the latter).
         \_ I do not understand this sentence. Please clarify.
            \_ Which word did you have trouble with, dropout or troll?
               \_ Freepers
      \_ In the end today's liberal polity reduces to one distinguishing
         trait - victimhood.  That is what the left is selling.
         \_ stop oppressing me!
            \_ After I'm done taxing you to death (and then tax you for dying)
               I'll stop oppressing you.  -modern liberal

6/7     http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=573&ncid=757&e=1&u=/nm/20020607/od_nm/fake_dc_1
        "BEIJING (Reuters) - Beijing's most popular newspaper has unwittingly
        republished a bogus story about U.S. Congress threats to skip town for
        Memphis or Charlotte unless Washington builds them a new Capitol
        building with a retractable dome."
        \_ Go go yellow journalism!
           \_ racist.
              \_ moron (or troll).
                 \_ racist.

5/13    What's a TN1 visa for?  Thanks.
        \_ Similar to H-1B for temporary foreign workers, TN-1 is created for
           workers from the NAFTA countries (Canada, for example). It has a bit
           less restrictions from the usual H-1B visa.
        \_ Another way for foreigners to steal our jobs.
          \_ it's not yours untill you own it.  If you don't have what it takes
             to own it I guess you can only whine about it. hahahah

5/4     God bless George Carlin:

        I Am Your Worst Nightmare. I am a BAD American.
        I am George Carlin.

        I like big cars, big hooters, and big paychecks. I believe the money I
        make belongs to me and my family, not some midlevel governmental
        functionary with a bad comb-over who wants to give it away to crack
        addicts squirting out babies.

        I believe that if you are selling me a Big Mac, you'd better do it in
        English.

        I'm not in touch with my feelings and I like it that way.  I believe
        that it doesn't take a village to raise a child, it takes two parents.

        I think owning a gun doesn't make you a killer.

        I want to know which church is it exactly where the Reverend Jesse
        Jackson preaches. And where does he get his money. And why is he
        always part of the problem and not the solution.

        I believe if she has her lips on your willie, it is sex, and it is sex
        for both of you. This even applies when you are President of the
        United States.

        I think that being a student doesn't give you any more enlightenment
        than working at Blockbuster. In fact, if your parents are footing the
        bill to put your pansy ass through 4-7 years of college, you haven't
        begun to be enlightened.

        I believe everyone has a right to pray to his or her God or gods, just
        leave the rest of us out of it. This also applies to sexuality.

        I believe it's called the Boy Scouts for a reason.

        I don't think being a minority makes you noble or victimized.

        I don't use the excuse "it's for the children" as a shield for
        unpopular opinions or actions.

        I think fireworks should be legal on the 4th of July.

        My heroes are John Wayne, the Simpsons, and whoever canceled Dr.
        Quinn, Medicine Woman.

        I don't hate the rich. I don't pity the poor.

        I know wrestling is fake and I don't waste my time arguing about it.

        I think global warming is a big lie. Where are all those experts now,
        when I am freezing my ass through a long winter?

        I've never owned a slave, or was a slave, I didn't wander forty years
        in the desert after getting chased out of Egypt, I haven't burned any
        witches or been persecuted by the Turks and neither have you, so shut
        up already.

        I think the cops have every right to shoot your sorry ass if you're
        running from them. I also think they have the right to pull your ass
        over if you are breaking the law, regardless of what color you are.

        I think if you are too stupid to know how a ballot works, I don't want
        you deciding who should be running the most powerful nation of the
        world for the next four years.

        I think if you are in the passing lane, and not passing, your license
        should be revoked, and you should be forced to ride the bus until you
        promise to never delay the rest of us again.

        I think beef jerky could quite possibly be the perfect food.

        I think tattoos and piercing are fine if you want them, but please
        don't pretend they are a political statement.

        I think Dr. Seuss was a genius.

        I'm neither angry nor disenfranchised, no matter how desperately the
        mainstream media would like the world to believe otherwise.

        If that makes me a BAD American, then yes, I'm a BAD American.

        If you too are a BAD American please forward this to everyone you
        know.

        We need our country back!

5/2     http://www.religioustolerance.org/nat_mott.htm
        \_ Indeed.  For all you who feel like hanging on to the "separation
           of church and state isn't about 'no prayer' in government," go back
           and look at who instituted the idea.
           \_ Yes indeedy!  Dead Rich White Men, WASPS all, are trying to take
              over the country by adding the word "G-d" everywhere!  Gadzooks!
              The end is near!  --a real atheist, not an alt.conspiracy fan

3/5     http://penguinppc.org/~hollis/personal/bergeron.shtml
        HARRISON BERGERON by Kurt Vonnegut, Jr.
        \_ What the fuck?  Is this supposed to make me vote Republican?
           Give me a fucking break.
           \_ No, moron.  It's a classic work of literature.  This is one of
              those great free-beer things the net has to offer which I'm
              sharing with your stupid ignorant empty headed addled low-browed
              self.  There's nothing in there about Republicans.  So stupid,
              so blind, so young....
              \_ go fuck yourself.
                 \_ *laugh* well you sure showed me wrong about you!
                    \_ go fuck yourself.
                       \_ ouch, now _that_ hurts my feelings.  gosh, can't we
                          just all get along?
        \_ I read that in a high school reader.  It was before I had read
           Slaughterhouse 5, and before I had any idea that Kurt Vonnegut
           was a name to remember.  Thanks.
                \_ is Slaughterhouse 5 a good read?
                   \_ yes.
        \_ This reads like a cheap Ayn Rand imitation, and that's not a
           very high standard.  I hope this was a draft and Vonnegut had
           planned to turn it into a real novel some day.
           \_ My silly friend, you are not in a position to critique Vonnegut,
              or state what a 'real' novel is.  Rather than trying to put down
              Vonnegut's work, which will not get the attention of most people,
              why not accept the fact that intelligent people like Vonnegut
              have politics that disagree with your own?
              \_ QUIT making strawmen.  I have no beef with his politics.
                 I just hate when people try to pass off hyperbole as theme.
                 This is like 4th grade writing.  Why not just write an
                 essay complaining about affirmative action or talk about
                 life in socialist countries?  More effective and less tongue
                 in cheek.
                 \_ What I am trying to say is that this ISN'T 4th grade
                    writing.  You didn't write like this in 4th grade, and
                    neither did I.  Good writing is difficult, and this was
                    good writing, even if the subject matter rubs you the
                    wrong way.
                    \_ This story was terrible. It reads as if it was
                       written by a student in 9th grade english class.
                       The basic idea is fine, but the treatment very
                       poor.
             \_ He knows how to read that makes him just as valid a critic
                as anyone else.
        \_ It's just a short story.  I don't know if there's a novel in
           there.  It makes its point fairly well, and succinctly.
        \_ When it's convenient for me to feel fatalistic, I like to read
           _Sirens of Titan_.

3/1     Shadow Government in operation:
        http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A22615-2002Mar1.html

        Somehow this shadow government business makes me want to buy
        guns, lots of guns.
        \_ is it still a "shadow government" if everyone knows about it?
        \_ Would you rather they had NO contingency plan?  If you want to
           go shoot someone, why do you need to wait for an excuse.
           \_ The contingency plan can easily get out of hand. What is to
              stop the shadow gov. from declaring martial law and abridging
              our rights under the constitution and the bill of rights?
              If the gun control idiots happen to prevail, we will have no
              way of fighting back either.
              If you think that martial law can't happen in the modern
              world, it happened less than 30 yrs ago in India.
              \_ Xfilers knew about this several years ago... it's called FEMA,
                 and they can declare martial law.  It's a conspiracy with
                 aliens.
                 \_motd formatting Nazi was here...
              \_ I'm opposed to gun control and a staunch conservative but
                 you're just sounding like a whacko.  What stops them from
                 declaring martial law?  How about the fact that there's
                 still a Federal Government stomping around and these people
                 all answer to it?  Did you even read the article?  Troll.
        \_ All Hail Caesar!
           \_ Et tu brute?
                \_ Although some would say the actual words were really
                   "And you, too, my son?" which means a lot more if you
                   understand the relationship between Julius and Brutus.

1/25    Filipinos react to arrival of American military.
        http://sg.news.yahoo.com/020127/1/2d1go.html

1/24    Say the president dies: the VP becomes president, right? What then,
        is a new VP elected, or does everyone else in the cabinet move up
        a post?
        \_ The President appoints a new VP.
        \_ The president nominates a new VP.
           Congress needs to approve. See 25th Amendment.
           \_ which is how we wound up with a president who was never voted
              on by the people with Ford (not that they ever are voted on,
              due to the stupid electoral college system).
              \_ So you prefer a pure democracy?  Maybe you should go read
                 some what the founders of this nation had to say about that.
                 They said it much better than I ever could.

1/1     Happy New Year!  Welcome to a renewed cycle of growth and prosperity!

12/27
"So what ties us together? We're tied together by our belief in
political democracy. We're tied together by our belief in religious
freedom. We're tied together by our belief in capitalism, a free
economy where people make their own choices about the spending of
their money. We're tied together because we respect human life. We're
tied together because we respect the rule of law. Those are the group
of ideas that make us Americans."
        \_ When are you going to learn to format properly? Let me guess,
           this is from George "What election law?" Bush.

12/17   http://www.smh.com.au/breaking/2001/12/14/FFX058CU6VC.html
        This is for you "I love the UN" types.  What comes after this?  Do
        we tatoo a number on your arm at birth?  Oh wait, the arm-tatoo
        thing was already done by a different European empire....
        \_ It was never about "I love the UN" and all about "I hate the UN".
           Nowhere in the UN charter does it say we should have universal
           identification. This URL talks about one member state proposing
           something equivalent to what Sun Microsystem's CEO proposed
                Don't you mean Oracle? _/
           for America, but on a much larger scale (which, I might add,
           is supported by many Republican law makers).
           \_ No where in the UN charter does it say a zillion other things
              voted in by the General Assembly or the Security Council.  WTF
              does the UN Charter have to do with anything?  That's a lame
              red herring point.  Republican law makers and the *ORACLE*
              CEO also have nothing to do with this.  It is evil.  The very
              concept of recording and databasing people at birth is wicked
              beyond belief.  This doesn't bother you at all?
           \_ Don't you mean Oracle?
              \_ Don't let facts get in the way on the motd.  Rule #1.
        \_ What's wrong with the UN?  This seems impractical and probably
           ineffective, though .
        \_ Not to mention the mind control lasers and Bangladeshi secretly
           impregnating our women with their Black Helicopters...
           \_ You meant Bang-lades-hi?
        \_ The part that bugs me most is not the bit about stamping everyone
           at birth.  It's the attitude of "to control something you must
           measure it or register it in the case of people".  After reading
           shit like this you get all warm fuzzy about the UN?  That it would
           even get seriously proposed at the UN?  What's *not* to hate about
           an organisation formed from people like this?

12/9    http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/20011209/od/life_sweden_sperm_dc_2.html
        go liberals go
        \_ This sounds more like a conservative Law and Family ruling to me.

11/6    http://www.greenparty.org/bangor.txt
        Military detains Green Party leader for speaking against war.

10/21   Jam Echelon Day!
        \_ Do you reallly believe the NSA cares about you? Send out
           hundreds of emails with the keywords BOMB KILL  PRESIDENT or
           whatever and see what happens - nothing!
          \_ What is that movie with Gene Hackman called? "Enemy of the State"
          maybe? According to him in that movie, if you have a phone
          conversation and say the words "Alah", "Bomb" and "President",
          you're nailed.
          \_ oh no! the NSA will read my hardrive!  wait a muinute.. they
             paid for this hardrive! -ARO researcher
        \_ What does Jam Echelon Day mean?
           \_ I believe it is an international rock competition.

10/16   There's an old saying: A conservative is a liberal who's
        been mugged. Well, a hawk is a liberal who's been targeted
        for death by al Qaeda.
        \_ Well no.  A liberal that's been targeted for death by a terrorist
           group is just a dead liberal.
        \_ A liberal is a conservative who has lost $1M in the bubble.
                \_ Yeah investing in the market between 96 and 2001 was
                   strictly limited by political affiliation.
                   \_ Yeah, like breaking everyone's political affiliation
                      into one of two groups is any less stupid.

10/4    Someone please tell me why making airport security screeners to be
        federal employees going to help? I've seen government employees and
        they're still underpaid, laid back, and don't give a damn about you.
        \_ as opposed to airline employees?
        \_ just look at it this way: they can't get any worse.
        \_ Federalizing security means that the employees have to go through
           a basic security check, get paid on a wage scale, get benefits,
           and can make it into a career. It's also a draw for those just
           leaving the military. Crimes against airport security become
           federal crimes and can draw on the resources of the military.
           \_ The law also allows the fed to conduct polygraphs test on all
              Federal employees.
           \_ I thought the US military is not allowed to act against US
              civilians even if the civilians are criminals.
              civilians even if the civilians are criminals.  Is it written in
              the constitution or something?
        \_ You have made an unpatriotic statement. Report to the termination
           vats immediately.
           \_ ^termination vats^Al Qaeda training camps
              \_ how is this statement relevant? -jon
                 \_ The previous poster said "...... federal crimes and can
                    draw on the resources of the military."
                    \_ A better response might be "why is this bad engrish"?
                       anyway, the US Military has been called upon to commit
                       acts against US citizens before.  EO 9066 --jon
                    \_ I had also meant to write ".. draw on the resources of
                       the federal government." I was thinking of the FBI and
                       the newly created Office of Homeland Protection. Better
                       resources than the local politzi.
                       resources than the local politzi. Plus federal money
                       to fund better security toys.

8/29    KABUL, Afghanistan (August 26, 2001 12:53 a.m. EDT) -
        Afghanistan's Taliban militia banned the Internet on Saturday and
        ordered the religious police to punish users according to Islamic
        law, the official radio station reported.
        \_ "Sharee don't like it. Net in the Casbah, Net in the Casbah."
           \_ Sharif, shereef, or sherif but definitely not Sharee. --dim
                \_ not to mention it DOESN'T FUCKING SCAN!
        \_ Which Islamic law did the Internet violate?
           \_ More like, The State will decide for you what ideas you
              may be exposed to, what information you may access, so that
              The State can be assured that people will think the way
              The State wants.
              \_ I see.
        \_ "Thou shall not believe anything not provided by the STATE"
        \_ I think there could be a big market selling nazi-ass filtering
           software to the Chinese and Afghanistani Gvt's..
           no one's registered <DEAD>nazisoft.com<DEAD>
        \_ Can you believe this? US has supported Taliban militia through
           out the 80's, to overthrown Socialist government.  I think
           American should be happy that US policy, our tax dollars has
           worked the way it was intented.

8/17    http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/20010816/wr/leisure_angry_dc_1.html
        ANgRY little asian girl from UCB
        \_ Somehow I don't find this cartoon very humorous, its just
           lame like UserFriendly.
           \_ UserFriendly sucks.  Their jokes have the humor level
              of "Yeah, like Windows crashes."
        \_ Tell me this doesn't remind you of psb and make you chuckle:
           http://angrylittleasiangirl.com/comicstrip43.htm
        \_ Tell me this doesn't remind you of every heavy-handed dumb liberal
           at Berkeley and make you grimace:
        \_ Tell me this doesn't remind you of every heavy-handed dumb
           liberal at Berkeley and make you grimace:
           http://angrylittleasiangirl.com/comicstrip47.htm
           \_ There are no dumb liberals in Berkeley. Dumb liberal is an
              oxymoron. Dumb Republican, on the other hand...
              \_ WTF are you talking about? How about BAMN?  Berkeley
                 liberals are the reason I have to label myself as
                 neither, even though I agree with most leftist values.
                 These stupid people and their identity politics have
                 ruined everything.  Locke would be turning over in
                 his grave.
                 \_ bamn are cointelpro, look at their funding srcs
                \_ BAMN are detroit trotskyist transplants, even
                   Berkeley liberals realize they have a hidden
                   agenda and shun them.  if you really care I can
                   send you a bunch of articles on the subject.  -danh
                   \_  Today, I saw a dog,
                       Yes, a dog.
                       Talking to a pig,
                       Yes, a pig.
                       They were on the pavement,
                       Discussing Trotsky.
                       Not brotsky or crotsky or drotsky or frotsky.
                       But Trotsky.                  - The People's Poet.
           \_ What's wrong?  That non-whites are Americans is a PC idea?
           \_ Liberals don't like the pledge, the flag or people acting
              patriotic in general. After all these things were conceived
              in the minds of dead white male oppressors. I think that
              this particular cartoon would make the PC people more
              unhappy than anyone else. Oh the humanity of children
              making an affirmation to GOD! Oh the horror!
              \_ Liberals just don't like the comic because it's not funny.
                 We like pledge just fine.  It's lemony, and you can get
                 high off it when you're in a pinch.
              \_ Liberals dislike patriotism because conservatives are so
                 full of it.  Patriotism is basically a conservative's
                 way of saying, "I'm right and you're wrong. Get the heck
                 out of this country because you don't agree with me."
                 Talk about undemocratic. --jeffwong
        \_ Another reason why women (that includes angry little asian
           girls) >> men.  Women for the most part are level-headed enough
           not to get sucked into these quality political "discussions".

8/16    http://ap.tbo.com/ap/florida/MGAJ6W8YGQC.html
        Let the hacking being!  C'mon, I want to see yermom as the next
        governor of Florida.

7/25    http://www.wikipedia.com
        Contribute your E190 research paper to posterity

7/25    Democrats get tough on M$:
        http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/4/20620.html

7/12    Why are democrats so stupid?
        http://www.techcentralstation.com/GuestColumnist.asp?ID=53
        \_ The guy who wrote this is a democrat??? You are right, he
           sure is stupid.
        \_ TEXAS. GO TO TEXAS. ALL YOUR PROBLEMS WILL BE SOLVED WHEN
           YOU GO TO TEXAS!
                \_ Wake up and realize dems are screwing you
                   and this country.  WAKE UP! ALL YOUR PROBLEMS
                   WILL BE SOLVED IF YOU WAKE UP!
        \_ Yet another "I'm bored, I'll think I'll go googling for
           anything anti-Democratic and post it on the motd even
           though it may be full of logical fallacies and inundated
           with nothing but ad hominems" post.

7/4     http://www.sfgate.com/energy/texasblackout
        but we should be setting them on fire, not just powering them off.
        \_ BUT TEXAS WILL SOLVE ALL OUR PROBLEMS. JUST GO TO TEXAS.
        \_ Why can't we just build more power plants in their state?
           Personally, I would be really happy to buy electricity from them
           knowing that they'll have their money _and_ emphysema.
        \_ Texas is responsible for California's problems like I'm
           responsible for you being a complete liberal fuckhead.
           \_ the fact that morons exist who will defend the "right" of
              faceless corporations to gouge consumers just because they
              can, is a great reason to be a liberal.  -tom
              \_ wow this particular argument is even stupider than all the
                 others on this subject. the problem isn't the gouging
                 it's the stupidity that led to the lack of competition.
              \_ You are a moron, Tom.  Unlike the government, corporations
                 do not force (i.e. at gunpoint and threat of jail) people to
                 give up their money.  They are providing goods and services
                 in exchange.  Compare and contrast with the government, which
                 takes your money simply because it can, to spend on things you
                 may, or may not, approve of.
                 \_ spoken like a true sarariman.  Tell me, do you really
                    believe corporations do things for the wellbeing of
                    humanity? That aside, the point is that utilities are
                    shared resources.  It would be a bit silly to put
                    you and your whole family on a spacestation and then
                    have a corporation charge you for air without putting
                    any regulations on what that corporation can do.  Have
                    you taken econ 1?  Maybe you should look up from the
                    cubicle you somehow managed to getyourself squeezed into
                    at whatever http://stupid.com bullshit geek fuck-hole place hired
                    you.  Get a life, and look around.  Life's not the 2nd
                    floor lab of soda, son. But it's useless to argue with you
                    isn't it, you're all about the Ideology of the Oppressor.
                    Yeah i bet you think that the indians were put on
                    reservations for their own good, and LBJ had the democracy's
                    interests at heart in vietnam.   - paolo
                    \_ The corporations are trying to make money, generally
                       honestly.  LBJ's exploits and reservations are
                       government's doing.  Corporation are amoral, the
                       government is generally evil.  You need to stand in
                       DMV lines more, or get (randomly) audited, Paolo.
                    \_ what interests did he have at heart? and what's a
                       sarariman?
                 \_ You have a fairy little idea about the altruistic
                    nature of corporations.  The goal of corporations
                    is to rake in as much money as possible. Ideally,
                    in a capitalist society, that desire should promote
                    people to create better products or services. But
                    if there's a legal venue to make money by screwing
                    other people over, a corporation would not hesitate
                    to think twice. You're right, corporations don't
                    have the ability to force people, if by force you
                    mean brute force, police power, and jail time. But
                    they have the ability to gouge you of the basic
                    necessities of life (yes electricity is a basic
                    requirement for most people) which is just another
                    euphemism for "force".
                    \_ Corporations are not altruistic, they are selfish,
                       and selfishness is a good thing.  One illusion I do
                       not have is that the government is altruistic.
                       Corporations merely want money, and they are willing
                       to earn them honestly (by providing you with
                       something).  The government wants money and power,
                       and they use force to get both.
                 \_ Oh yes, people could just stop using electricity!  We
                    should have thought of that!  -tom
                 \_ Ha! And public services don't count?  How about your
                    roads, police, fire departments, libraries, schools,
                    (blah blah blah).  And don't forget corporate bailouts!

6/14    Are high-tech companies required by law to hire minorities (African
        American or Native Americans)? If the law requires Southwest and
        United Airline to hire fat ugly women, why doesn't the law require
        IBM or Intel to hire non-Asians? Or such law is already underway?
        \_ the law requires that you can't reject an applicant  because
           s/he is ugly and fat, unless someone who is not ugly or not fat
           also applies for the same job.  In that case, the law requires
           that there is a reason why the ugly is not preferred or that
           the fat is not preferred for reasons other than for the sake
           that the fat is fat, and the ugly is ugly.
        \_ the law requires that you should read this:
           http://www.e-sheep.com/apocamon
           \_ and i thought i'd never see the word "downloadeth"...
           \_ holy shit that is hilarious.
              \_ yeah. i thought you guys would get a kick out of the 7 eyed
                 sheep.

5/30    Third try: Great read on government (from a democrat even)
        http://washington-weekly.com/may27-01/story5.html
          --reiffin, anonymous censoring coward
        \_ very interesting read; I drew different conclusions, to wit:
           reform the IRS, don't abolish it, and use the proposed Director of the
           Fair Justice Agency position to investigate price-fixing, oil-
           and Big Biz ties as well as foreign national ties to the Pres. and
           members of Congress --erikred
           reform the IRS, don't abolish it, and use the proposed Director
           of the Fair Justice Agency position to investigate price-fixing,
           oil- and Big Biz ties as well as foreign national ties to the Pres.
           and members of Congress --erikred
           \_ Not. I agree with the implied sentiment, which is:
               The only way to reduce corruption in american beauraucrasy
               is to reduce the bearaucrasy. and also to rename it to
               something that people can spel, too.
           \_ I encourage you to read it again.  I would argue that
              current energy problems are due to supply contraints,
              not price-fixing.  The return on new refineries, for
              example, is not high enough - so none have been built.
              \_ Clarification, please: by "current energy problems," are
                 you talking about the current price of gas at the stands
                 or are you talking about the energy crisis as a whole?
        \_  i wonder how this Tauzin-Traficant bill he talks about differs
            from the Fair Tax or National Retail Sales Tax bills that
            already exist? or is it the same thing? http://www.fairtax.org
            i don't think they'll be able to pass that. there's too
            much ignorance and misinformation, and momentum of the
            status quo. plus, it's not clear how they will prevent
            black market, off-the-record, or foreign sales that will
            surely grow to circumvent such a large sales tax, especially
            on expensive items. all talk I've seen on this avoids this
            issue. it's very good in principle though.

4/422   Hey, I know!  How about blowing away the motd and replacing it with
        nothing?  That would be fun, huh?  Restored.
        \_ NUKE THE MOTD! NOT NUKING THINGS WOULD BE EVIL, COMMIE, AND
           LIBERAL.
                \_ Uhm, is there a point to all this?  Are you trying to be
                   funny?  Sarcastic?  Witty?  Something else?  Obviously your
                   intelligence far surpasses mine and I'm unable to figure out
                   what you're getting at without it being spelled out for me.
        \_ Yeah! Thanks for the suggestion!
        \_ get the date right.
           \_ Done. APRIL NEVER ENDED.
              \_ what's this recurring "April never ended" thing?  Yes, yes,
                 if I have to ask, I don't know...
                 \_ That's the clueless version of the line.  The Real Thing
                    goes, "Those who know don't tell, those who tell don't
                    know".
                    \_ That's really stupid.

4/28    http://www.mcicenter.com/index.html
Powered by
Honker Union of China
c001====== H.U.C =====1i0n
The manifesto of Chinese Hackers:
Beat down Imperialism of American!
China will kill all the American!
No American!No U.S.A!
Hoho~~~~~:)
        \_ Shouldn't that be "hooker,"  not "honker"?
        \_ So some weenies hacked an IIS box and posted some drivel.  Why
           should anyone care?  Let me know when they've managed to take over
           the electrical grid or shutdown a nuclear power plant or made muni
           run on time.  "Chinese hax0rz take over American infrastructure!!"
           is *not* a headline you'll ever see.
        \_ beware of the Communist Hackers In North America!

3/21    http://www2.uclick.com/client/nyt/gm  Both true and amusing cartoon.
        \_ That cartoon is neither true nor amusing.  You bastard, you wasted
           three seconds of my life.
           \_ and I want them back!
        \_ that should have been an elephant presented a sign that reads
           "fiscal responsibility" or "healthy economy"
           \_ Responsibility?  You think taking away ONE-HALF(!!!) of what I
              *earn* and handing it over to the largest beauracracy on the
              planet is a *responsible* way to spend my money?  Are you totally
              insane?  _What_ exactly is responsible about that?  What exactly
              is wrong with the government spending based on what they need to
              within a budget on a program by program basis rather than just
              automatically inflted every single budget every year in every
              lame program without any serious oversight or questioning of how
              *my* money is getting spent or *ever* cutting back on anything?
              And no, reducing the rate of growth is not a cut.  That's the
              stupidiest shit I've seen on the motd in... in... god... days.
              And *that* is saying a lot, given the sort of ignorant crap some
              of you people post.
        \_ [restored.  sorry if the truth hurts, you censoring bastard]

1/25    "Today, the challenge is different, but there's still a challenge."
        -sound bite
        \_ Only in this day and age can a quote that dumb make the news.
           \_ It's called, "slow news day".  Then one has to wonder if that's
              actually the quote and what the context was, if any.
        \_ What's wrong with that?
           \_ Boy, you must be the type of person, that when asked to write
              a simple 5 page English paper, use the 14.5 point Courier
              font with 1.33" margins on all sides and inundate your
              paper with irrelevant quotes from the book you were supposed
              to have read not thinking that the teacher will notice.
              \_ No, I'm a politically savvy conservative who knows
                 how to connect with the common people, while pleasantly
                 surprising dismissive intellectuals who learn that
                 there is intelligence behind empathy.
                 \_ I don't think anyone reading the motd counts as "the
                    common people".
                 \_ Isn't "savvy" a bit of an overstatement there?
                    You're certainly not connecting with me or
                    impressing anyone with your self-praising concept
                    if "intelligence". I don't know who the hell said
                    that challenges still exist and are different but
                    (s)he must have been a real dumbshit and the
                    journalist who quoted it must have been a moron
                    himself.
                    \_ Well, you do what you gotta do.
                        \_ None of this has anything to do with anything.
                           \_ But today, this none is different, but there
                              is still none of it to do with anything.
                              I have a surprisingly savvy intelligence.

1/18    Wow, lots of notice for this already-unconstitutional elections
        meeting that doesn't even mention that elections are involved.

1/17    Rolling blackout in effect in Northern Claifornia.  Please help
        conserve power by turning off unused monitors, computers and lights
        at your offices/classrooms/labs.  Thanks.
        \_ Just go flip the switch at Yahoo. Aren't they the number one power
           consumer in the Bay Area?
           \_ Really?  I'd think bigger companies like IBM use more power.  Or
              even BART and MUNI.
              \_ I think MUNI generates its own power for the electric trains
                 and busses.
           \_ Doubtful.  Exodus is #1 in Santa Clara due to all their co-lo
              facilities, but only when Great America is closed for the winter.
        \_ pull the plug on a place like Fresno!
         \_  are some people really cranking it up, just to cause the blackout
             in hopes of getting days off?
        \_ pull the plug on SF.  No one important would care.

12/9    My favorite part of the FL SCO ruling was they included the partial
        recounts from Miami-Dade which were in the most heavily democratic
        areas but the other 80% of MD won't ever get checked.  It's so cool
        we've still got 4 of our judges on there working from the living
        constitution instead of that old raggy paper one in the vault in DC.

12/6    I know people are passionate about their presidential
        candidates but why do I see pictures of people protesting
        against CNN and local network affiliates?
        \_ The media likes showing off how much influence they have on
           people
        \_ How could they be passionate about such sorry sacks of shit?

4/249   What's your gift budget this December?  What's the average
        price of your gifts?  (reasonable people (no show offs) only)
        \_ ~$20 for a CD for my wife.
        \_ $35 for a family gift trading game
           Same for girlfriend.
           Everyone else gets plants that I have raised from seed.
           (little basil plants).
        \_ $0. BAH HUMBUG! - scrooge
        \_ I don't know if this is bragging, but it is about $100/person
           for family members, with a $1000 computer for my brother and
           a plane ticket worth about $800 for my g/f.
                \_ shit, are you made of money??     doh!n
                \_ yes, you are bragging
        \_ $50-100 for family members. $30-50 for non-serious girlfriend.
           $10-20 for friends that I won't get something for them unless
           it fits them. -- student making <$10k/yr.
        \_ a watch for everyone in my family.
           \_ a freebee company watch?

11/22   Thank God the Florida Supreme court finally made a solid decision and
        has put the final nail in the Republican coffin.  I don't care that
        their ruling was clearly a sham and the US no better than any third
        rate banana republic.  The ends justifies the means.  We must destroy
        the republicans at any cost.  They are evil.
        \_ I take it you are a member of the COMMITTEE TO ELECT ALGOR BY
           ANY MEANS NECESSARY.
                \_ What's wrong with that?

11/14   Florida news but not about the election.  Boys sues city because
        cops failed to stop him from driving drunk and injuring himself:
        http://ap.tbo.com/ap/breaking/MGA34QG0JFC.html
        \_ Is it still legal to carry concealed guns in Florida?

11/14   Some light humor from the BCR mailing list (with regard to
        the upcomming BCR elections):

        Unlike the election in Florida, results of our election
        should be known within the hour because our trained election
        specialists know how to count and we won't have to deal with
        sore losers and BS lawsuits.
        \_ Racists!  Call in Wexler!  Where's Jesse!  I've been disen-- oh,
           wait.  I already graduated and can't participate in a BCR election.
           Racists!  Call in Wexler!  Where's JEsse!  I've been disenfranchised!
           Racists!  Call in Wexler!  Where's Jesse!  I've been disenfranchised!
           \_ reiffin, you really have to stop responding to your own trolls,
              it's completely pathetic.  -tom
              \_ reiffin didn't post the original.
                 \_ Motd Conspiracy Theory!
                    \_ Oliver Stone's MOTD!
                       \_ I think tom and reiffin are secretly the same
                          person.
                          \_ Drat.  Caught.  --Tommy Reiffin
                       \_ I think tom and reiffin secretly love each other.
                          \_ I don't dislike tom.  I just think he takes
                             himself and everything else too seriously which
                             makes me laugh.  It isn't personal.  I'd laugh
                             at anyone like that.  In fact tom and I only
                             'know' each other through these twice a year
                             public tiffs.  Something gets posted he doesn't
                             like, he says I'm a troll, if he's right, I tell
                             him to stuff it, if he's wrong I tell him so and
                             get a laugh out of it.  Then the motd is wiped,
                             tom adds a few reiffin 'twink points' and life
                             goes on as before.  Too bad someone wiped my
                             first reply.  I guess the truth bugs some people.
                             I LOVE YOU, TOMMY BOY!   -reiffin
                             \_ Welcome to the CSUA co-op.  Don't hoard
                                the bagels.
                                \_ It's the co-ops that taught me not to take
                                   it seriously.  It was fun while it lasted,
                                   though, except for the mice.  -reiffin

11/11   Some comments on statistical analysis and data collection and how it
        relates to the elections:
        http://www.opinionjournal.com/editorial/feature.html?id=65000587
        \_ Mr. Glaeser is an idiot.  Can someone in Boston tell him that, plz?
                \_ And you base that opinion on what other than political bias?
                   Perhaps could you provide a URL that demonstrates the man
                   is an idiot for reasons other than who you voted for?  I
                   suggest you try something clever like posting the same URL.
                   If you can't be right, be a smart ass.  That always works.
                        \- yes but the is putting this on a web site for
                \- i dont think that article is particularly interested or
                illuminating, but what is idiotic about it? --psb
                \_ He's a Brookings/Harvard prof/very smart man.  This is
                   a politically charged issue.  His conclusions are obvious.
                   Do I really have to say anything more?
                        \- yes but he is putting this on a web site for
                        the masses, not Econometrica. --psb
                        \_ Fine.  The masses need this education.
        \_ Fine, Mr. Glaeser is not an idiot.  I realize that most
           of my rantings were because I was a liberal.

11/9    It's amazing how many political figures use the word "liberal"
        interchangably with "communist freak". All you have to do is
        look it up.
        5 : BROAD-MINDED; especially : not bound by authoritarianism,
        orthodoxy, or traditional forms
        \_ Liberals in America are communist freaks.

10/28   http://www.votexchange2000.com
        \_ Also see <DEAD>www.voteswap2000.com<DEAD>

10/6    What's the term that describes being penalized due to a new law
        change, that was once legal before?
        \_ Fucked by COMMIE loving democrats.
                \_ Fucked by RACIST hate loving republicans.
           \_ Hi ranga
        \_ ex post facto.  after the fact
        \_ This is only if the law is retroactive.  Retroactive laws
           are unconstitutional.
        \_ "nerfed"

10/4    motd content critical of Republicans censored by ranga.
        \_ I didn't say all of the things that were attributed
           to me.
        \_ I like Republicans.
           \_ Sadly, that's far more intelligent of a comment than
              most of the motd postings deploring Democrats.
           \_ I only eat vegan meat. - (fucker)
              \_ You eat only certain Gardenburgers?
                 \_ No, (s)he only eats the meat of vegans.
                    \_ I'm safe. - vegitarian

10/04   Anybody else think that height is an issue in presidential elections?
        The last president < 6 feet tall was jimmy carter, and we how the
        circumstances surrounding his election.  Gore is like 6' 1" and Bush
        is just under 6 feet right?
        \_ It's not absolute height, its relative height.
           The taller presidential candidate always wins.
           Unless he can somehow avoid ever standing next to his
           competition for the whole election run. Not.

10/01   What is with snotty politically ignorant trolls on motd?
        \_ Conservatives are not the ones censoring topics on the
           motd. Its the liberal luzer though police. At least
           conservatives let people who disagree with them speak
           freely, unlike liberal COMMIE SCUM!
                \_ Whatever: McCarthy Party Lamb. Shout your
                   repressive conservative politics all you want, your
                   crusty old-fashioned reps. are getting left in the
                   political dust. I ain't deleting anything, better
                   to let you show off your ignorance to the world.
                   \_ It's you liberals ruining them oral and economoic
                      fabric of society.
                   \_ It's you liberals ruining the oral and economoic
                      fabric of society. -ranga
                      \_ If you want to sound half intelligent (or more
                         intelligent that George Bush) then you might
                         want to refrain from using random permutations
                         of the words damn, liberal, luzer, commie, and
                         scum as they show absolutely no intellectual
                         thought. Rather than shooting off the hips why
                         don't you pick a particular topic and discuss it
                         in full detail (why you agree/disagree, what
                         evidence you have to support it, what arguments
                         you have to counter the other side, etc...).
                         That would surely sound far more intelligent than
                         saying things like "you're stupid", "you're a
                         damn commmie liberal", painting the motd with
                         "LINUX, RIDE BIKE", etc... Being a democrat
                         doesn't make you dumb. Not following your
                         arguments with any form of rational thought is.

10/01   What is with snotty politically ignorant trolls on motd?
        Find another place to worship Limbaaaa and jack off, luzer.
        \_ Conservatives are not the ones censoring topics on the
           motd. Its the liberal luzer though police. At least
           conservatives let people who disagree with them speak
           freely, unlike liberal COMMIE SCUM!

8/14    Are "Bank of America" and "Banc of America" the same thing?  I see
        a lot of "banc"s in financial news articles.
        \_ something to do with a law that dates back to the post-depression
           days when they out-lawed any single bank from doing both
           commericial banking and regular banking (or something like that).
           The Ban{c|k} of America, I think, is their little loophole
           to get around this.
        \_ el blanco banco!
        \_ http://www.hoovers.com/co/capsule/1/0,2163,47381,00.html

7/21    What's the story behind the whole prince of norway thing?  Is he
        still a student here, or was he ever?
        \_ He was (poli sci/international politics); graduated last year. Or
           so saith the Daily Cow:
           http://archive.dailycal.org/archive/1999/5/25/graduation.html
        \_ Why?  Looking for a royal lover?

05/02 CSUA Fall 2000 Election Results:

                     President:  Paolo Soto (paolo)
                Vice-President:  Mike Howard (mikeh)
                     Secretary:  Eli Bingham (lye)
                     Treasurer:  Bem Ajani Jones-Bey (ajani)
                     Librarian:  Paul Twohey (twohey)

4/19    http://www.techlawjournal.com/educ/20000415.htm
        Somebody fire this dumbass. More realistically, go write your
        congressman.
        \_ Even better, please fire this interviewer.  He doesn't know how to
           ask good questions.  Even better than that!  Just write /. instead of
           the full URL you moron.

3/27    I hear so much about HMO's in the news today. But what the hell does
        the acronymn stand for?
        \_ Health Maintainence Organization
        \_ The only one here (at present) is IMHO.  It stands for "In My
           Humble Opinion"
           \_ Thanks for the answer ulike the crap below.  All I ask for
              was a stupid acronymn and I get a 1 page troll from a bunch
              of political nut bags.  geez.
        \_ Basically, health insurance providers.  You are hearing about
           in the news b/c they are evil...cutting corners whenever
           possible to the detriment ot patients under the health care
           plan.  From what I can ascertain, these HMO's are run by
           businesspeople, not doctors, so they are not really looking
           in the patient's best interest most of the time.
           \_ HMO's are an evil socialist monstrosity devised by liberals in
              the name of "affordable healthcare."  A real businessman
              ALWAYS has the patient's best interests at heart, because
              otherwise he ll lose a customer.  The only thing that will
              fix the evil of HMOs is fully privatized healthcare.
                \_ Nice theory.  Completely wrong though.  Most HMO customers
                   have no choice - they go with whichever HMO gave their
                   employer the best deal on the group plan.
                   \_ You just don't get it, do you.  People don't have the
                      choice PRECISELY because HMOs are forced down our throats
                      by lefties, and because there are laws REQUIRING the
                      employers to provide HMO coverage for their employees.
                      In these sorts of nasty socialist conditions, what do you
                      expect will happen?  Exactly what is happening now.
                      A fully privatized healthcare will give people choice,
                      and stay affordable the way any service stays affordable:
                      competition.
                        \_ hey, do you know what a mixed economy is? govt
                        regulated capitalism. welcome to america.
                        \_ I'm with flacid

3/16    Greetings friend.  Do you wish to look as happy as me?  Well you've
        got the power inside you right now, so use it!  And send one dollar
        to happy dude, 742 Evergreen Terrace Springfield.  Don't delay,
        eternal happiness is just a dollar away.
        \_ What state again?
           \_ North Takota

2/18    Are laser discs essentially dead in America and Canada?
        \_ Yes.  And you should be too - please go off and die now.
        \_ Yes.  Unlike you, who is alive, vibrant, and bring new hope
        \_ Yes.  Unlike you, who is alive, vibrant, and brings new hope
           to the world with your every thoughtful notion.

1/9    I want to buy the following item on the net but I have no idea
        what the hell the damn thing is called: it's a long, tube like
        object (often decorated to look like a cat or some such animal)
        that you put at the bottom of the door to stop a draft. Any hints
        on a site or even a name for the damn thing? -trying to buy cute shit
        \_ ED! ED! ED is the STANDARD!  Draft eliminator thingie.
        \_ I call it a "towel".
        \_ I think you want cute weather stripping
        \_ They call it a draft eliminator.  For a Garfield one, see:
           http://catalog.garfield.com:80/default.asp
                \_ I thought going to Europe and not inhaling was the draft
                   eliminator.
                   \_ That's the draft avoider.
       \_ Thank you, public motd. Once again, you have proved to be
      an invaluable source of wisdom mixed with subtle humor. -bought cute shit

12.09   Spring 2K officers:
        Dan Silverstein         (President)
        Mike Howard             (Vice President)
        Paolo Soto              (Secretary)
        Paul Twohey             (Treasurer)
        Elle Yoko Suzuki        (Librarian)

11/15   Why does the US Constitution states the separation between
        church and state, while in court people are required to take the
        oath "...... So help me God." ?  -- yuen
        \_ Sue Yuen!
        \_ Boy you are asking for trouble aren't you?  Let me tell you
           right off that that kind of logical thinking is HIGHLY frowned
           upon by society. But, at the risk of being denounced, i'll lead
           you further into temptation... 1st) "the separation of church
           and state" comes from a letter from Jefferson (1802) in regards
           to the first amendment and is nowhere found in the constitution.
                Clearly the first amendment was a guarantee of Freedom of
           Religion, specifically to be free from undue gov't restriction.
           It was not designed nor intended to allow gov't to impose
           secularism on the masses.  This contemporary concept (more
           aptly: "freedom FROM religion.") is a creation of the soft-
           minded liberal, with no respect for reason, history or law.
                -crebbs (who believes that religion is a crutch and is
           astounded to see how many individuals are hell bent on kicking
           a crutch out from under intellectual cripples).
           \_ http://www.capitalism.org  Softminded liberals indeed.
           \_ Oh, I thought the requirement is in the constitution, according
              to
              http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/19991116/ts/court_prayer_5.html
              -- yuen
              "The justices agreed to review ...... violated the constitutional
              requirement on church-state separation ......" -- yuen
              \_ Please note that yahoo news != supreme court justice.
                 -emarkp
                 Try reading the actual constitution sometime.  You
                 might even come to a similar conclusion as crebbs.  -emarkp
        \_ You aren't required to say "so help me God".  Only to swear to
           tell the truth, whole truth, nothing but the truth.  God won't
           help you if you lie and get slapped with a perjury charge or
           something equally unpleasant depending on the case.

11/11   Anybody know of a web site (gov't or otherwise) that have economic
        data like M1 and M2 numbers?  Thanks.
        \_ ask a better question.
        \_ Probably one of the links from
                http://www.census.gov/econ/www
           will have money supply stuff.  They definitely have "economic
           data" in general.

11/05   CNN says that Amazon and Starbucks are killing mom&pop stores.
        We must boycott Amazon and Starbucks!!!
        \_ No, we must boycott mom&pop stores which over charge you in
           exchange for nothing more than some outmoded feel goodism.  When
           you can only buy cooks from one company, software from one company,
           food from one company, etc. the world will be a better place just
           like Switzerland.
        \_ I say boycott Le Petit Market (that little store down the street
           from Soda Hall). That guys a jerk. His store is just an over-
           sized vending machine. I went in there almost everyday for a while
           and when I finally won a free Mtn Dew under a cap, he charged me
           tax to redeem it. Bastard.
           \_ The guy at Petit Market is cool.  You sound like one of the
              whiney underage drinkers he chases out and refuses to sell to
              who leave his store calling him an asshole after shop lifting
              just to "punish him" for not selling you cheap beer.  Waah, waah,
              waah, you big baby.  I'm not impressed with your silly baby Mtn.
              Dew whine.  Waaaaaaah!  Tell it to someone who gives a shit.

8/9     (New to US history.)  Was Pres. JFK a Democrat or a Republican?  Thx.
        \_ Democrat. Republicans bad.
           \_ Democrats bad. Republicans bad.
              \_ Jesse Ventura rewls, DUDE!
                \_ No.  It's just that our one party system sucks.  Just bc
                   JV isn't a member of the one party, doesn't mean by default
                   that he's good, but yes I do like the very few things I've
                   heard from him so far.
                   \_ One party to rule them all and in the darkness bind them.
                        \_ BONDAGE PARTY!  RULE!
              \_ Yes, Dick is somehow connected to Richard Nixon...
        \_ Democrat - ran against Dick Nixon.  (All Kennedys have always been
           Democrats - it's a family tradition.)
           \_ Does that mean that Jimmy Hoffa was Republican?  The two hated
                   ran for Govermnor and lost to Jery Brown's dad.  After
              each other.
                \_ "hated" != "ran against in a partisan general election"
                        \_ I thought Nixon was a Congressman when he did
                           the McCarthy witchhunts.  I'm glad you saw
                           Oliver Stone's _Nixon_ movie, though -- your
                           synopsis runs just like in the movie, complete
                           with quotes.
                   Later, Richard ran for President and won, but then
                \_ Hoffa was a mobster criminal.  His politics don't have
                   anything to do with it and good thing they buried his
                   wretched corpse (or all the bits of it) where it could
                   never be found.
                        \_ New Jersey Meadowlands.  Under the end zone.
           \_ The Trickster rules!
           \_ Is Dick Nixon related to Richard Nixon then?  Thx.
                \_ Go see the movie "Dick" and find out.  It's all completely
                        true of course.
                \_ Dick Nixon was a Senator who ran the Communist witchhunts
                   with Joe McCarthy, was VP under Eisenhower and then ran
                   against JFK for Pres and lost.  He then came back to CA,
                   ran for Governor and lost to Jerry Brown's dad.  After
                   losing he declared "They're not going to have Dick Nixon
                   to kick around any more" and retired from politics.
                   Later, his son Richard ran for President and won, but then
                   Later, Richard ran for President and won, but then
                        \_ It was such a beautiful story, a man with so much
                           power giving it up to marry the woman he loved but
                           his country despised.  It's hard to imagine in
                           these days where having your wife suffer a "fatal
                           accident" and then marrying a divorcee is no longer
                           an unforgivable sin, but is even being done by the
                           Prince of Whales.
                           \_ What's wrong with marrying a divorcee?
                                \_ Divorce is very anti-Catholic.
                                   \_ This isn't a Catholic country.
                                        \_ And we've never had a king who was
                                           forced to abdicate so he could
                                           marry an american divorcee either.
                                           Your point?  (Not that England is a
                                           Catholic country.)
                   ended up resigning 25 years ago today.

3/4     US military pilot killed 20 Europeans and got away with it.
        There is no justice.
        \_ Kraut tourists are just anfaellig to bad things, face it.  -John
        \_ Kraut tourists are just anfaellig, face it.  -John
        \_ Sure there is.  They're a bunch of pansy fuck worthless foreigners
           and that was one American.  *ALL* the eurotrash combined isn't
           worth the life of a single American soldier.

3/4     An American military pilot killed 20 Europeans and got away with it.
        Great!  So why do Americans complain so much when Americans
        are killed outside of USA?

3/1     How much is the national deficit these days?
        \_ xdebt

2/23    Can someone recommend a good mobile phone and service provider
        for someone on a budget.  I do not need a lot of peak minutes, but
        free roaming would be good.
        \_ The sprint prices & plan is pretty good, (120 minutes/month,
        with long distance + roaming, $30, +$5 for 500 off peak minutes).
        Unfortunatly, the coverage area does leave something to be desired
        \_ dual band phone eliminates some of the coverage problems.
           \_ dual band is definitely the way to go, but I wouldnt use it
              regularly, since sprint charges something like 60cents/minute
              for analog because they have to borrow analog time
              BTW, you can check out their coverage maps at http://sprintpcs.com
        \_ You may want to check out Cellular One's current promotion for
        instate calls.. basically free roaming and long distance
        http://www.cellone-sf.com/html/current_promotion.html  However, be sure
        to read the fine print...

12/17     The US government is way too immoral. I find it amazing how
a government that goes about preaching "democracy" and how
"democratic" and "free" it is, can go to the length of bombing
innocent people to protect its dirty interests.
  I could *even* understand Desert Storm as means of freeing
Kuwait, even though that wasn't the reason for the attack.
Financial matters came a long way before. But I just can't
believe in laying waste to someone else, far away from yourself,
because they aren't following *your* rules. Who does this
government think it is? How long will the rest of the world
just watch this butchery without acting? And when it does,
things might get messy! England is, of course, excluded from
this "rest of the world", since all it is is a US puppy,
happily yapping along and following whatever it is told.
  This is just plain immoral. I hope the responsible ones go
down.

12/1    Consider enrolling in Philos 146, Philosophy of Mathematics.
        \_ Philos >> NT
        \_ PhilOS >> NT
        The history of how people thought about and practiced Math.
        Really cool and in danger of being cancelled. -tcmoore
        \_ Don't do that.  Philosophy will work you into the ground and
           give you a shitty grade for your efforts.  Unless you've taken
           the core lower div. courses, enjoyed them _and_ did well, dont
           blow your gpa on upper div. philosophy.  Buy the book if you care.
           \_ I found upper div philosophy courses to be relatively easy as
              long as you do the reading. Whatever happened to the, "All
              liberal arts courses are 10x easier than EECS courses" mentality?
                \_ in terms of workload yes.  But grading is rather vague.
                \_ I don't have that mentality and never did.  Philosophy was
                   by far the hardest course I ever took.  Yes, I did all the
                   reading numerous times, went to class, etc, etc.
                \_ In my (very limited) experience, the grading is really
                   inconsistant in liberal arts classes...
                      \_ But you're obviously not a liberal arts major
                   \_ I agree, but Phil o' Math, based on my casual readings,
                      is pretty clear-cut. Everything falls into 2-4 camps.
                      Not all mushy like other liberal arts, philos classes.
                      Just take it P/NP and you'll do fine. -tcmoore
                      \_ Rather than burn yourself out struggling for that
                         "P", go sign up for something truly soft and don't
                         worry about it.  It's foolish to take courses because
                         you think they're interesting.  If you're just mildly
                         interested then buy the book and read it on your own;
                         you don't need the grading hassles.
                         \_ With an attitude like that, why didn't you just go
                            to CalPoly, or better yet, ITT and leave your Cal
                            spot to someone who wanted a University education?
                                \_ Uhm, yeah, in case you haven't noticed, Cal
                                does _not_ provide a classical liberal arts
                                education.  Don't be fooled.

11/04   Jesse "The Rootcow" Ventura wins Minnesota governor race

11/1    Trying this again: Anarchocapitalist economist David Friedman in
        166 Barrows, speaking on "Private Law", Tuesday 11/3 (Election Day),
        7:00p.  His home page is "http://www.best.com/~ddfr/"   -- schoen

10/6    The Cato Institute, which is sending libertarian activist David Boaz
        to appear with Kennedy at the Spitfire tour on the theme of "personal
        responsibility", desires to give away free tickets for Spitfire (which
        otherwise costs $18?) via campus libertarians.  It looks like I am
        going to receive a number of these tickets to give away, and Cato
        specifically says that they don't care how they are given out, so...
        does anyone want to go to see the event on October 18?  (If you feel
        compelled to flame Cato, David Boaz, libertarians, the LP, etc., I
        suggest private e-mail over the motd.)  -- schoen
        \_ Cool! It's so nice to see people who advocate the defunding
           of the arts offering free access to the cutting edge of
           American culture. What next? Does public support for
           community theater get replaced with free tickets to "Let
           Them Eat Cake: The Myth of Class in American Society"
           (brought to you by the Safeway Bakery)? Support for public
           schools get replaced by the charitable distribution of
           "Bobby Starts a Home Business" coloring books? Do
           government funded rape crisis centers get replaced with
           condom vending machines (and free pamphlets entitled "Date
           Rape: Personal Irresponsibility and Its Consequences"--
           brought to you by Trojan).
           \_ Hmmm, I think this counts as "flaming Cato", etc., but OK:
              for Cato and many other participants, Spitfire is a political
              event, not a cultural one.  It has no pretensions of being a
              cultural event, just an allegedly worthwhile exchange of ideas.
              Cato exists for politics, and other entities for other purposes,
              unless you want the local Symphony Orchestras to start holding
              protests on Sproul.  The Spitfire Tour is just appearing in
              Zellerbach because of the size of the venue (and perhaps the
              ASUC's access to it).  -- schoen
              \_ if you don't want flames stay away form the motd dumbass
                 \_ I didn't notice him complaining about it, he was doing
                    this thing known as "replying" to it.. silly concept,
                    huh, dumbass?
                        \_ dumbasses like you are disgraces to our
                           race.  You know who you are you  lamer.
        \_ give them to the homeless on Telegraph. i bet they'd enjoy
           a free lecture on personal responsibility
               \_ They probably would. Some of those guys get
                 public assistance and they still pan handle.
                 Others seem to be high school age kids who
                 suspiciously wear the latest in torn up jeans
                 and nice sneakers. My hunch is that maybe only
                 maybe one in ten pan handlers on Telegraph is
                 actually desperate and can not find a home
                 even if they tried. A few people are really
                 in need and just can't find jobs. The rest
                 probably need a lesson in responsibility. -fab
                 \_ i think 9 out of 10 people on telegraph
                    with facial tattoos are actually desperate
                        \- damn kids need a beating. --psb

05/09   Dont forget the CSUA general meeting next wednesday at 5:30.
        Elections!
        \_ Make that 6:30 pm jon

5/7     FORBIDDEN CITY COP - UC Theater - 9pm - go see it
        \_ Low budget Asian, low budget American or something else?
                \_ low budget Asian movie in low budget American theatre.
           \_ Ya, they should learn to make big budget movies like
              Waterworld and the Postman.
              \_ Why did you take my comment as editorial?  I was simply
                 asking for a factual non-editorial description.
              \_ Actually, the lesson here is don't allow Kevin Costner
                 to make movies.
                 \_ To think... he was the first choice to be President
                    in Air Force One. *shudder*
              \_ Or Titanic
              \_ totally hilarious HK movie.  don't miss it.

03/12   In unrelated news, the renegade gang known only as the MOTD Nukers
        were rounded up and killed in a mass execution by the Thought Police,
        who were disgusted by their tactics and extreme stupidity.  "I mean,
        I thought WE were bad." said Mike Moodswing, Vice President in
        Charge of Policy, Thought Police Badge #E37R32
        \_ This any relation to the ongoing GoZ/ZOG war?

3/3     Recent MSNBC headline: "American Beats Out Kwan"
        *sigh*
        \_ Ya, so?  You expected better from Gatesnbc news?
        \_ not how I would have worded it, but it's hardly inaccurate
        \_ Not how I would have put it, but is this inaccurate?
           And stop censoring me, arselick.

1/29    http://haas.berkeley.edu/~hoff/auroratimeline.htm
        \_ Down with Imperium Amerikana!
        also just found: http://www.fas.org/irp/mystery/aurora.htm

1/27    whom is by no means a dead form. it's the indirect object form --aaron
        \_ Exactly.  It's dead.
           \_ Sign, so we can mock you when you use an indirect object  --pld
                \_ Indirect objects aren't dead in general.  Just the overly
                   haughty and elitist "whom" which sounds like a wannabe
                   British Royal.  This is America, speak American, God damn
                   it!

11/27   General Meeting Wed, Dec 3, 1997 6:30 306 Soda Hall
        Elections Elections Elections.  Read http://ucb.org.csua for more.

5/1     i will not work for c.e.o. who makes seven figures
        \_ What do you care?  No matter what the ceo is getting paid, your
           salary won't change, wage slave.
           \_ And where do you think the extra money for the CEO's paycheck
              comes from? "we'll just have the elves in back print out some
          more money" And just maybe he has some ethic issues regarding
              completely irrational distribution of income. -lars
         \_ As if the ceo worked for free the extra money would go
            to employees?  Hardly.  Think shareholders.  Market
            forces will take care of poorly managed companies. Ethics
            has nothing to do with it.  I'll refrain from making an
            ivory tower comment about someone who majored in PACS.
            You should get in on the ucb.class.cs162 socialism debate
            and explain how BH's ultra progressive -300% to 100% tax
            structure will eliminate all of society's ills.
            \_ I feel little need to justify the value of one of my
        majors, faceless hozer. However, I feel that I learned
        a great deal more in that major that affects my life than
        I did in my CS classes. Have you even taken any PACS
        courses,or are you just speaking based on your prejucies?
          \_ Yes I have.  *Everyone* got an "A".  It was
             insulting and ridiculous.
        \_ You should have majored in Business.
           \_ Right, so that one day you can explain to your kids how you spent
              the best years of your life dutifully studying to be a capitalist
              stooge and an intellectual vampire.
         \_ Yeah, business sucks.  Imagine how many CS majors there
            would be if we were all still hunter/gatherers and kept
            strictly to a barter system of trade.  Whoever invented
            money was clearly evil.  Get a grip hypocrite.  You have
            advantages as a member of the US that no one else on the
            planet has.  They were created, in part, by American
            businesses.  Surprise, businesses are run by business
            people who, (surprise!) were mostly business majors.
            The looney left never ceases to amuse me.
          \_ Well said!
                        \_ Judging from the business majors in my classes,
             it must have taken a very exceptional business
             person to move beyond a barter system.
            \_Well I can't help that the average business
              major today is a clone.  The basic point remains
              the same, despite the lower life forms currently
              enrolled in classes.
         \_nanofabrication promises a post-economic era within
           100 years - in the future, the only commodities will
           be ideas and dirt- with this much, all things are
           possible.
            \_ you've been reading too many stupid books.
           \_ If you want my dirt, you're going to have to pay big
              bucks for it.  This is high quality dirt, especially
              formulated for the latest in nanofabrication
              techniques.  My ideas are freely available however.
              Only the dirt has a price tag.    --Dirt-R-Us(tm) Inc.

12/20   One word: Ebonics
        \_ The Oakland school board's attempt to provide better conformity
           to the standardized English by using ESL techniques and funding
           may have some serious political fallout.  In particular if
           Ebonics is recognized as seperate language, it provides an
           objective criterion for racists to exclude blacks at hiring
           time: "we require all our employees to speak English" -mel
        \_ Hey--until you hypocrites remove the jive program from this
           machine, none of you are in any position to comment on what
           K-12 teachers are trying to do with Black English. --elizp
           \_ I think 'none of you' is singular in standard written
              English - choice
              \_ Only in the American dialects.  Most English, Indian,
           and Australian dialects use the plural for collectors
           (e.g. "the audience are") -mel
           \_ The jive program is the closest thing to a serious study
              of Black English on this system.  You should look into its
              code and development before you condemn it. -mel
           \_ get a fucking clue.  The "jive" program is not provided
              as an educational tool.  idiot.
           \_ Aye, I don't think anyone here suggested using Jive to
              proofread their paper for them.
              \_ I think elizp suggested that because we have Jive, we
          are not in a position to comment on teaching ebonics.  That's
          just absurd.
           \_ Censorship man. It's groovy.
        \_ Ebonics math: 1 gat + 2 gats done be 3 gats done be pappappap
           shootin' da man wid.
           \_ Brutha' gots 3 vials o' crack. Brutha sells the crack for 20
              bucks/vial. How many dead presidents do he gots after he sells
              all of his crack?
        \_ Word, muthafukah!

2/07    The CSUA President, Vice-President, Secretary, and Treasurer have
        resigned.  danh is now Acting President and will be holding a General
        Meeting next week to confirm or deny new politburo appointments.
The nominees are:
        president: jwang
         vice-president: lila
          secretary: ryan
           treasurer: lolly
        See http://ucb.org.csua for details.

4/28    All Hail our new CSUA officers!
        President: chiapet    Vice-President: smurf
        Secretary: alissa     Treasurer:      rcham
        Librarian: ekim

4/21    GENERAL MEETING and elections and constitution type things
        next Thursday (4/28).  Draft of new constitution in
        /usr/local/csua/Constitution/constitution.new.

12/9    What's the lastest news on that Atari Jaguar(before any chucks $250
        plus tax)?  Saw it at the Good Guy's.  The rep. said the shipment
        for preorders coming Xmas Eve.  Anyword of third party games...or
        is Atari gonna choke again?
        \_ lastest news on rec.video.games.misc is that the Jag is crap,
            but what else do you expect frtom Atari? I'm waiting for
            the 64bit sgi/nintendo vr machine comming out in xmas 94
        \_ What exactly is 64 bit on that machine?  couldn't be
           64 bit color... that'd be 2x10^19 colors... 64bit processor?
           that sounds like overkill.  I think it's a lie.
           \_ The data bus to the display memory?  High resolution/color
              live action video needs bandwidth.
        \_ No CD = no where to store detailed graphics = really
           fast stick figures. Yawn.

9/8     The National Performance Review - Vice President Al Gore's report on
        reinventing government is now available in http://sunsite.unc.edu via WWW,
        gopher, ftp and wais. (Use "gopher http://sunsite.unc.edu" to get there)

8/30    GENERAL MEETING AND ELECTIONS!!!!!  9/9, 7:00 PM Place TBA.
        This WILL be a constitutional meeting.  We want to discuss moving
        elections to the END of a semester, election reform, and adding
        new officies. - seidl

6/15    Dave has stepped down as President.  By our constitution, that
        makes me the president, and I need to appoint a new VP, so if you
        are interested, mail me. - seidl