| WIKI | FAQ | Tech FAQ | |
 http://csua.com/feed/ | |
| ||||||
| 12/25 |
| 2005/2/3-7 [Industry/Jobs] UID:36058 Activity:low |
2/3 IGN / Gamespy is hiring. J2EE, .NET, DBA, C++, a ton of marketing
and sales, some creative folks such a graphic artists and video
producers. Even a lawyer. Some jobs in Brisbane and a couple are down
in Irvine. All listed online. email for info. -shac
http://corp.igngamespy.com/jobs.html
\_ I love the qualifications:
- Minimum of 5 years experience creating features for a hi-profile
Windows application in widespread use.
\_ and then?
\_ J2EE is an acronym that stands for "Horrible Fucking Job That You
Don't Want." |
| 2005/2/3-7 [Industry/Jobs] UID:36052 Activity:kinda low |
2/2 We just IPO'd and are hiring like mad. -ausman
http://www.planetoutinc.com/careers
also at /csua/pub/jobs/PlanetOut
All jobs are in San Francisco.
\_ gay!
\_ You don't have to be gay to work here, but you have to be
gay friendly.
\_ isn't that discriminatory?
\_ No. It's pretty reasonable to require prospective
employees to be able to get along with the existing
employees. You don't have to love homosexuality, but if
you have a serious problem with it, it will have major
impacts on your interaction with other employees and
customers.
\_ Wow, I didn't even write that! -ausman
\_ I think a great http://theonion.com story would be one about
a straight guy hired to work at Saks or Neiman Marcus
in SF and gets sexually harassed and made fun of by the
other male employees.
\_ Initial Public Out-of-the-closet? Congrats!
\_ dear religious conservatives like emarkp and jrleek, what do you
think about this company? Do you think it is immoral and that they
will fail and go to hell? Would you consider joining their company
for the purpose of converting these pagans into good Christians?
\_ Mmm, anonymous flamebait directed at specific sodans! Yay!
\_ The important distinction is the compnay is in the private sector.
Consequently, if they want to give "partnership" benefits to
random individuals, make the bathrooms gender
neutral, and make workers accept cross-dressers, and
promote unprotected sex with strangers
congrats to them. However, when you try to
force everyone to accept this, or even compensate you for
your lack of resposibility, at the point of a gun, using the
government as your agent, it becomes a problem. Is this really
that hard to understand?
\_ I nominate this as "most likely to get flamed"
\_ The first entry in the list says it's in New York.
\_ They just added that one.
\_ have you guys considered expanding to say, Oklahoma, Tennessee,
and Texas? Just as missionaries go to foreign countries to
spread their good will, maybe you guys can go abroad to spread
your belief as well.
\_ Not really, though the region a plurality of our members live
is The South. -ausman |
| 12/25 |
| 2005/2/1-3 [Industry/Jobs] UID:36020 Activity:nil 50%like:32725 57%like:36755 |
2/1 Job openings at Marimba Mountain View, /csua/pub/jobs/Marimba
\_ Marimba is still around?
\_ Bought out by BMC, but still exists as an organization within
them. |
| 2005/1/26 [Industry/Jobs, Academia/Berkeley/CSUA] UID:35903 Activity:kinda low |
1/26 ResComp is Hiring! Up to $19/hour for student staff.
/csua/pub/jobs/rescomp - erikk
\_ Drink the koolaid!!! |
| 2005/1/17-18 [Industry/Jobs] UID:35754 Activity:moderate |
1/17 Anyone interviewed recently, how is the job market?
\_ Job? Why are you asking me about the book of Job? That's not
even my field...or is there something I'm missing here? -gradstudent
\_ Guess that tells you...
\_ Guess that means the job market is good, everyone has jobs.
\_ Or that no one is hiring..
\_ Interviewed extensively in November; end result: no one hired
anyone. Am hoping January will turn out much better.
\_ Just interviewed at Google, am interviewing with Joe Random Startup
next week. The former was a cold call request for an interview,
the latter was through a friend. I'm not even looking for a job and
have told both of them so. I've had an offer of an interview at
Yahoo! from a friend. I'd say places are hiring again. (Or at
least interviewing).
\_ You're not looking for a job, but you are interviewing?!?!
\_ I'm not the previous poster, but I like to interview every
year or two. It helps me keep track of how much I should be
making, and reminds me that I could leave my job if I wanted
to (or that I couldn't, depending). Like the previous poster,
I always say up front that I'm not looking for a job. No one
seems to mind.
\_ So far 3 interviews and 0 offers :-(
\_ I hear you. Is this a pretty common situation?
\_ You tell me. |
| 2005/1/10-12 [Industry/Jobs] UID:35643 Activity:moderate |
1/10 How soon after you start working at a new place is it reasonable
to ask for a raise? (assuming you had already been a contractor
for them and so it's not a case of "well you didn't know how
damn awsome I was before I started." 'Cause they did.)
\_ 3 months. At most big companies they will have a 3 month
peformance review. It is reasonable to discuss a raise w/
your supervisor during that review.
your supervisor during that review (provided that you are
doing much more work than was initially expected of you).
\_ At a smaller place 1 year is typical.
\_ Raise? My company is just laying off people.
\_ Peoplesoft, huh?
\_ Nope. Different company.
\_ Right after you blow the CEO.
\_ This is something Carly might actually be good at, but I
\_ This is something Carly might actually be good for, but I
doubt it.
\_ Carly is hot enough to give you a "raise"? |
| 2005/1/5 [Industry/Jobs, Recreation/Humor] UID:35553 Activity:kinda low |
1/5 Need someone to show the parents for the holidays but put off by the
stigma attached to hiring a lady of the night? Now there's a service
for you:
http://csua.org/u/al5
\_ ob hawt bengali potemkin dates for partha
\_ HAHAHAHA funny funny, thanks for sharing it. Keep up the funny
links! |
| 2005/1/4-5 [Industry/Jobs] UID:35544 Activity:moderate |
1/4 I'm developing a website and would like it to look as professional
as possible, but I don't have enough money to hire a web designer
to design the entire site. I do, however, want to hire someone to
design and create the logo and title image/logo of the home page.
I can't afford to pay too much though (<$100). Does anyone have any
ideas (or even specific recommendations) how to go about finding
someone for this job? Thanks.
\_ craigslist
\_ Good plan "NSA bj in exch for web design work" should do the
trick.
\_ What does "NSA" mean in this context?
\_ No strings attached
\_ That's not the NSA I know and love. -jrleek
\_ There No Such Agency, citizen.
\_ http://www.megrisoft.com/services/webdesign/logo_design_india.html |
| 2005/1/3-4 [Industry/Jobs, Politics/Domestic/SocialSecurity] UID:35532 Activity:moderate |
1/3 I have a better question. What % of tay payer money actually reaches
it target for expenditure. For example, for Medicare / Medicaid,
welfare, education, this is pennies on the dollar.
\_ I think you need to define your terms more. And not to be pedantic,
but 'pennies on the dollar' includes everything short of 100%. As
far as 'reaches its target', what counts? If medicare spends $100
on a prescription, should you count $100, or the retail price of the
drug, or the wholesale price, or the manufacturer's cost? Education
is even stickier. Do you count teacher's salaries? Do you count
money spent on building maintainance? What about a principal or
superintendant's salary? Or perhaps you're just trying to start
some flamewar on "the government's wasting MY money!"
\_ you're an idiot. -tom
\_ How about asking the question in terms of staff per customer
served? For schools, that would be (# students)/(# persons
drawing a salary at the state and local level).
\_ For CA, the ratio seems to be (10 students)/(1 salary
drawer). Just teachers alone the ratio is (21.2 students)/
(1 teacher), so the other staff:teacher ratio is almost 1:1. |
| 2004/12/10-12 [Industry/Jobs] UID:35243 Activity:high |
12/10 Has anyone worked for Deloitte as a system analyst? What's the
best and and worst thing about working there?
\_ How much does that job pay?
\_ I'm not an analyst, so I don't know exactly how much they
are making, they don't publish the salaries internally.
Though I can estimate based on a Manager's salary. For a first
year Systems Analyst (Consultant) it would probably be
$55-$60k.
\_ What about for a person with 10 years experience?
\_ With 10yrs and assuming Managerial experience you
may be able to come in as a Manager which means
$95-$105k.
\_ why do you guys always care about pay? yes it's
important, but an enjoyable job far outweighs a good
salary. !op
\_ Because you can ask for and get a reasonably helpful
answer on the motd-- quality of life, enjoyability,
etc ratings are harder to come by.
\_ It's called "living in the bay area"
\_ IT'S NOT A HOUSING BUBBLE!!!! PRICES ARE TOTALLY
REASONABLE!!!! IF YOU WONT PAY 700,000 DOLLARS
FOR A SHITHOLE SINGLE FAMILY HOME IN THE SOUTH
BAY 45 MINUTES FROM ANYTHING YOU ARE JUST LAZY!!!
\_ Bitter that you didn't get in while you
still could?
\_ OF COURSE I'M BITTER!!!! OBVIOUSLY ANYONE WHO
DOESN'T LIVE IN THE BAY AREA IS BITTER AND
STUPID!!!!
\_ true but I'm assuming the op has viable alternatives.
\_ I am interested in what other companies pay. This is
very important in terms of career growth and options.
Obviously, the job has to be enjoyable, but it has
to pay well, too. Otherwise, forget it. Yes, I want
it all. Don't you?
\_ Though job satisfaction is important, you can't eat it or
buy a house with it. If I wanted a cool job with no pay,
I could do that at home.
\_ "Hell, you don't nee a million dollars to do that, man;
take a look at my cousin. He's broke, don't do shit."
\_ Not an answer to your question, but my one experience with them
was bad bordering on hilarious. Of course that was D&T UK. -John
\_ I've been with Deloitte for 7 years, 5 in the Systems group
(ERS). I think it's a great company, though certainly not my
dream job.
+ Stable job
+ Meet a lot of different people
+ Work with different Managers
+ Reasonable pay, fluctuates with market
+ Learn about different computer environments
+ Travel 10-30% (Hawaii)
- Long hours parts of the year
- Auditing clients generally not well received
\_ DT guys breathed down our IT department's neck
so much, they got the CIO fired.
\_ Whoops, was that your CIO? ;)
\_ Here they did their share of destroying a ~$500 million
e-banking project, were raided by immigration services
several times for using contractors without valid permits
(thereby losing ca. half their effective workforce each
time), designed a platform around AS400 (this in 1999) only
to realize 75% through the deployment that their key
component didn't run on AS400, and ended up being sued for
gross incompetence and negligence by the client. It was
classic big IT consulting firm. -John
- Slow to adjust pay to Market
- Travel 10-30% (Idaho) |
| 2004/11/15-16 [Industry/Jobs, Computer/SW] UID:34906 Activity:kinda low |
11/15 What's a typical salary for an entry-level web app developer in the
SFBA?
\_ Two dollahs and fifteen cents
\_ $50 if you can suppress the gag reflex
\_ what kind of "web app developer"? if you're just some code monkey,
probably 12.50-20, but if it's "software engineering", then it
should probably be more like 25-30.
\_ are we talking about hourly?
\_ of course, no one talks about yearly as 12.50. |
| 2004/11/13-14 [Industry/Jobs] UID:34878 Activity:low |
11/13 Top 10 Degrees: http://money.cnn.com/2004/11/12/pf/college/degrees_jobs/index.htm?cnn=yes \_ chemical engineers make the most: http://money.cnn.com/2004/09/21/pf/college/starting_salaries/index.htm \_ I wonder how "dropout from tech major in top university" measures up as a major. I'm guessing it would be in the top 20, above most humanities majors. Can anyone find numbers on this? |
| 2004/11/8-9 [Industry/Jobs, Computer/SW/OS/Windows] UID:34757 Activity:nil |
11/8 MS Search job available in Redmond: http://csua.org/u/9vd mfw@microsoft.com if you're interested --dbushong |
| 2004/11/4 [Industry/Jobs] UID:34650 Activity:nil |
11/3 Seriously, how is the job market in Canada? What's their
status on high tech companies? I researched thoroughly and
the only viable solution for me is through work permit.
Thanks for any feedback.
\_ Haven't heard anything good. The Canadians don't exactly want
a flood of Americans coming in. |
| 2004/11/3-7 [Industry/Jobs] UID:34620 Activity:nil |
11/3 My company's looking to hire. See
http://www.reactivity.com/about_us/careers.html#positions
-- dpassage@flophouse.com
\_ is it in Canada? |
| 2004/10/25-26 [Industry/Jobs] UID:34326 Activity:low |
10/25 I finally got an citizenship interview recently but it resulted in "a
decision cannot yet be made about you application". The interviewer
said everything was fine except they are still waiting for FBI's
check, which can take a long time (4-5 months). Is this normal?
Is he telling me the truth?
\_ My wife couldn't get to the interview stage until she was cleared
from the FBI finger print check.
from the FBI finger print check. The FBI check did take a long
time to perform.
\_ This was my wife's experience as well. Once she got through
the interview, everything else was smooth and relatively quick.
Are you working with a lawyer? Do you have any eyebrow-raisers
in your arrest records? -- ulysses
\_ My most serious brush with the law were parking tickets (all
paid). What intrigues me is that he did not check the
"Congratulations! Your application has been recommended for
approval," the only other choice on the result form.
I would expect this means I have to come back for a 2nd
interview though that is not what he told me. -op
\_ Sounds about right to me. My wife worked with a lawyer and
I think it was the lawyer who suggested working out
communication with the FBI beforehand and negotiated that
communication. It took most of a year but YMMV. She walked
out of the interview with the "congratulations" box
checked.
\_ How much does the lawyer charge? I thought I would
be fine without one. -op
\_ It's come to about $2.5K and the lawyer himself said
she probably could have gotten by without his help.
He is also at the high end. Still, everything started
going pretty smoothly with the lawyer on the case.
She had also had a bad experience with a cheap
lawyer. Note the $2.5K was for the entire process
from Res. Alien to Citizen.
\_ I just had my interview a few weeks ago and I got approved. I'm
getting sworn in in 3 weeks.
\_ How long did you wait to get the interview and how long did the
interview last? Mine only lasted 20 minutes. Is this good/bad?
-op
\_ For me the interview itself lasted 20 minutes too. For the
first part of your question I'm not sure if you're asking
how long I had to wait in the INS waiting area on the day of
the interview (5 minutes) or how long the whole application
process took (8 months, no lawyer).
\_ For me, it took a little over a year after the initial
application to get the interview. So I had to resubmit my
finger prints, since they were only valid for a year. My
interview basically consisted of him noticing that I was
a Cal student, and asking me to write down "It is raining
outside." (no kidding) I was sworn in shortly after that.
\_ This is because your fingerprints change every year?
\_ Hell if I knew why. -pp
\_ My wife had an interview in June but still is waiting to clear
Homeland Security background check.
\_ Which box (Congratulations or "cannot yet") got checked? |
| 2004/10/19-20 [Academia/GradSchool, Industry/Jobs] UID:34235 Activity:low |
10/19 This is a doozy, I'm asking about the Federal GS pay scale and
qualifications. It says a B.S. is equivalent to a GS-5. A B.S. plus
X years of specialized experience is equivalent to what GS level?
\_ Every year of college is counted as a year of experience. So
a BS + 2 years is the same as an MS and so on. Without knowing
X you can't expect any more of an answer.
\_ I've worked 8 years. I HAVE A PHD!!! I'm elite!!! |
| 2004/10/17-19 [Industry/Jobs, Politics/Foreign/Europe] UID:34179 Activity:nil |
10/17 Suppose I want to read technical/scientific writing in a foreign
language (e.g. French) but I don't have the time or the need to
learn how to speak or listen in that language nor do I plan to read
anything non-technical. Is there any short-cut learning method or
resource for this?
\_ It's really pretty easy. Get a French-English dictionary (or
http://wordreference.com/fr find something technical to read,
and start reading. When you find conjugated words that aren't in
the dictionary, run them through Babelfish to find the dictionary
forms; after a few you'll start being able to guess them. You'll
pick up the technical terms quickly since you already know what
they mean, and soon you'll be able to read pretty fast using the
dictionary. It works for math papers, at least.
\_ You know, it's not such a bad thing to learn a foreign language.
But if you need to read something in a hurry, you can always
google translate it.
\_ Do scientists still use latin as the universal language?
or maybe try: http://www.worldlingo.com/wl/translate
\_ Just have Trinity download the language directly into your
brain. |
| 2004/9/28-29 [Politics/Domestic, Industry/Jobs] UID:33820 Activity:high |
9/29 So last year I asked the motd for advice about writing a "self-
evaluation" at the end of the year during review time. I was told
to talk myself up as much as possible w/out going overboard. I took
this advice and I believe it helped. But then after my review and
compensation adjustments I was asked a question I wasn't prepared
for so this year I'll ask the motd again...
After receiving end-of-the-year compensation adjustments, what
should one answer when manager asks "Is this what you expected? If
not, more or less?" I can think of reasons for both yes/no and
more/less answers. Any thoughts?
\_ I would not answer such questions unless I were absolutely sure
they were doing this seriously, for their employees, which is
not possible, so never mind. I would never answer that.
\_ What you expected would seem to be less relevant than what you
wanted. I would proceed assuming the "want" meaning. To answer
that you need to figure out what you're worth independent of the
manager's mind games. Not that I know anything really though.
Oh and if it really does seem high, I don't really see a point
in admitting that, what would your reason be? Brownie points?
\_ i'd be happy to just have a job. what's a raise?
\_ my thinking is to use this to your advantage. if you're unhappy
with the raise, say "it's too low." it's a great opportunity to
do so, and your manager might expect you to say it so you won't
be making people uncomfortable. If you're happy with it, provide
no information. Say something uninformative like "it will do" with
a poker face. That way, the manager only gets information if it
benefits you.
\_ I'm the one who told you to talk yourself up without being a nut
about it. In response to all stupid manage head game questions
like this you should reply like a politician, not an engineer.
When asked a direct question, most engineers will try to answer
it truthfully and directly. BZZZT! This is the worst thing you
can do with head game questions. I was asked the same thing when
I got my bonus & raise this spring. The raise was pathetic. The
bonus was better but nothing special as bonuses go. My response
was along the lines of "Well, everyone would agree that more is
always better than less, and this was certainly better than nothing.
how much is left in the budget for further adjustments at this
point?". So I answered without answering and then turned it around
back on them with a question which made it clear I wanted more and
I know they have more money in the budget for it (they can always
get more money if they really want/need it), yet I wasn't an
aggressive greedy overly demanding asshat about it. Of course they
didn't actually come up with anything extra but I didn't expect
them to. The point was to answer the question in such a way as to
not come off as a total asshole but making it clear they didn't
just buy my undying loyalty forever either. Remember, talks with
your manager are not engineering problems to be solved. This is
them testing you to see how far they can abuse you without making
you quit or stop working as hard. Good luck next year and let us
know how it goes.
\_ well its the end of our year right now... my review is tomorrow
so you all will find out soon enough. I'm taking all above advice
into consideration. thanks. -op |
| 2004/9/27 [Industry/Jobs] UID:33782 Activity:high |
9/26 White collar unions, hi-tech still sucks:
http://www.cnn.com/2004/TECH/biztech/09/15/techjobslump.ap/index.html
\_ Too late, we should have formed one when we had the bargaining
power back in the late 90s. But then all the moron sysadmins
were convinced that they were doing well because they were
brilliant, not because of the economy. Now they are all
taking pay cuts (if they are good) or out of work (if they
are not) and employers will fire anyone who even dares
to say the word "union."
\_ On the other hand, the good engineers should be thankful that
no union was formed. Otherwise after the bubble bursted, the
only ones that would still have jobs are those with high
seniority, not high ability.
\_ There is that. We wouldn't be losing so many jobs to
outsourcing if there were tech unions though. |
| 2004/9/25-27 [Industry/Jobs] UID:33755 Activity:low |
9/25 Salary question: I'm applying for a job as Tech Support Tier 1 and
2 for a small company (three tech support staff). What's a reasonable
salary?
\_ In the Bay Area? How many years of experience do you have?
I would say about $70k/yr from what you have said so far.
\_ my answer: it totally depends. I work for a non-profit, and make
around $30k/yr. I also tend to like my job, the work environment,
etc. If the company actually has money, though, I'd guess between
50-70k with at least a few years experience.
\_ Not sure where you work, but I'm seeing more $40k-$60k. The $60k
range is more for crossing over to Sys Admin range. Entry level
Sys Admin (Windows world) is $60k and then up to $85k-$95k. |
| 2004/9/23 [Industry/Jobs, Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Troll] UID:33719 Activity:nil |
9/23 Why is it that if I post a political troll, I get 3 pages of
discussion, but I'm lucky if I can get one trollish replay to a
technical question?
\_ Nobody cares about computers at the CSUA.
\_ Because your technical question is stupid.
\_ That and you don't know the answer.
\_ Possibly. But no one on motd answered... |
| 2004/9/22 [Industry/Jobs] UID:33684 Activity:very high |
9/22 First of all, I am not bitter or anything. But Google sucks ass.
Their recruiter of the Site Reliability group called me and I
went on pass the phone screening and did an on site interview,
but only to find out the group is mostly an IT/Operation type
of group and they are looking for someone strong in UNIX sys admin
with programming skills. So they politely told me that there
wasn't a good fit. That's all fine since my background is in
application development. Then a second recruiter contacted me
and wanted to talk to me. I emailed her back and attempted to
set up a phone interview but only to have her email me back and
told me to get out of her face since Google's database said
\_ If she blew you off rudely or unprofessionally, just send a
calm letter to the director of HR. Write something like
"I have been impressed with google's technical expertise ...
interested in working there ... but was somewhat surprised
at the lack of professionalism among the HR/recruiting
personnel ...". It would be interesting to see the
"get out of my face" letter.
I have been rejected before. WTF? It's like interviewing
a sales guy for a marketing position and tells him there isn't
a good fit and denies him of any future opportunities. That's
\_ Similar thing happened to me in 1997 when Netscape people contacted
me. They were totally unorganized and were very unprofessional.
I'm glad they fucked up though because AOL sucks and the good/smart
people who used to work there all left and the only people who
remain are now the dumb dot-com rejects who have no where else
to go to.
\_ That wasn't my experience. -- ilyas
fine if the 'one-strike-and-you-are-out-forever' is the company
mandate, then the second recruiter should have checked their
f*cking database before contacted me so she doesn't waste my
time.
\_ in other words, google is teh suck.
\_ I interviewed with the Site Reliability group. Answered all the
standard stuff perfectly, answered their random stuff 99.9%.
Taught one of their guys more about his topic than he knew. The
response? I'm not technically qualified to work at Google.
Whatever. Fuck it. 6 months after the IPO, all the smart money
will quit and go find a nice beach and they'll be desperately
combing their database for both of us. I'll be happily fitting
in somewhere else. I suggest you do the same. Nice cafeteria
though. Don't take it personally. Our interaction with Google
is *very* common. They think their shit doesn't stink and treat
everyone like crap. It's an equal opportunity crappiness there.
\_ Yes. You are not bitter. No. Definitely not bitter. Not a chance.
\_ I am not, I am just pissed that she wasted my time.
\_ Maybe the first interviewer said those nice things to you, but
wrote "He is teh gay. Do not hire under any circumstances," in
his report.
\_ OMGWTFLOL! GOOG doesn't hire gay people? LAWSUIT!
\_ Google is run by a bunch of kids with money. If they have a
one-strike policy and lack professionalism, then it's time to
move on to another better-run company.
\_ hey, how's that short of GOOG going? -tom
\_ GOOG at 118.65 up .81. It just barely hit their original
opening price before they dropped it like a pile of stinking
shit. At IPO+6 months+1 day, we'll see how many of their
employees dump how many zillions of shares and retire
causing a huge brain drain. At that point expect to see
a lot of Google jobs posted online and a less shitty
attitude when it comes to hiring there.
\_ Since you're a brilliant analyst and I'm just an
employee, maybe you can tell me the relative size of
these two numbers: total employee holdings vs. average
daily volume of google since open. No? Then how about
a nice hot cup of shut the fuck up?
\_ The volume is likely going to increase when more shares
are released. Right now the volume is a high
percentage of the float. Insiders still own most of
the stock. Do you have a point?
\_ I love how you totally and intentionally missed the
point. At 6mo+1day, all the smart people will quit.
*You* don't have enough stock or brains to matter but
the smart ones are outta there.
\_ You don't know anything about my brains or my
stock. I however know a lot of things that make
me laugh at your dancing monkey rants. --googler
\_ The GOOG employee lockup doesn't expire at 6mo.
\_ The vast majority of shares can go on the market
in February.
\_ These grapes, dey are so SOUR!
\_ Go ahead and buy GOOG the day before those people can
sell.
\_ Hmm, it opened at 100, which means it's up almost 20%.
Still pissed about that short squeeze, I see. -tom
\_ Ignoring what I said, again. It is just barely above
the price they originally announced before they dropped
it, roughly.... (drumroll) 20% before going public.
\_ Now you're just making stuff up. The initial
"range" was announced as $100-$120. The initial
price was set by a public auction. -tom
\_ It was me who is going to short it and I still am.
Investors are still unable to short it. The higher
it gets the better short prospect it will be.
\_ These grapes, dey are so SOUR!
\_ That's not sour grapes, and shorting GOOG isn't
just player-hating. No company can trade at 150x
earnings forever, so unless they produce massive
earnings growth, it *will* come down.
\_ you appear to be discounting the fact that
GOOG *is* producing massive earnings growth.
-tom
\_ They're doing well now, but they still need
to increase about 1000% to justify the
current price.
\_ No one shorts anything based on sour grapes. You
are a kool aid drinker.
\_ I find being short harder than being long. When I am long
if the stock goes down a little, I am not worried, but
when I am short, and the stock goes up, I get worried and
cover. This happened when I bought pmcs at like $21 and
covered at like $24. Now it's like $10. So, while I was
"right", I still lost money. I think a similar thing
could happen with google. If you want to short it, you
need to have patience and be able to withstand some
volatility.
\_ Your gf said she found it hard when you were short, too.
\_ Unbounded risk will tend to have that effect. |
| 2004/9/7-9 [Industry/Jobs] UID:33399 Activity:kinda low |
9/7 Three job openings at Sun Microsystems for SAs and Network admins.
http://www.sun.com/corp_emp/search.cgi?req=538227
http://www.sun.com/corp_emp/search.cgi?req=538230
http://www.sun.com/corp_emp/search.cgi?req=538242
If you know anyone with kick-ass techie and social skills, who loves
stress and constant learning and regular fire-drills, this is for them
--samli
\_ Fire drills?
\_ Koan: How can one be a great sysadmin and at the same time have
social skills?
\_ You pursuade your co-workers to do all your work and willingly
let you take all the credits.
\_ What exactly is a fire-drill in this context? Does someone pull
a cable at 3am on a Saturday to see how fast the team responds?
\_ Not that bad. Worst would be 8am Monday. Lot of work can be
done remotely of course, so it's not that bad. Usually it's
a big-deal-about-nothing so takes you 15 minutes fix and
make sure it doesn't happen again and then explain to mgmt.
Patience, diplomacy and communication skills are required.
Example: User reports: "system crashed, pointer does not
move". Solution: replace batteries in wireless mouse. |
| 2004/8/20-21 [Industry/Jobs] UID:33047 Activity:moderate |
8/20 New SAGE Salary Survey out.
http://www.sage.org/salsurv
\_ I put it in /var/tmp/seesal -ausman
\_ need to register
\_ Can someone drop the pdf in /tmp?
\_ I put it in /var/tmp/seesal -ausman
\_ Permissions are too tight to read it.
\_ Ooops. Fixed.
\_ bad sysadmin! |
| 2004/8/17-18 [Academia/GradSchool/MBA, Industry/Jobs] UID:32969 Activity:insanely high |
8/17 So apropos of the discussion below, do people here think it is
dishonest to leave a degree *off* of a resume, i.e. a phd?
\_ Dishonest? Yes. Does it matter as long as you don't later come
back and ask for better money/title/position/work/etc based on
it? No. I've dropped all the one-off contract jobs from my
resume. Am I dishonest? For the next rewrite I'm going to
drop anything more than 10 years old. Is that dishonest? I
don't remember the titles I had at 2 places so I made one up
that fit what I did. Dishonest? It's just a resume. If you
can't do the job, they'll fire you later. If you can, then so
what? The only place I'd give a full and complete disclosure
is for a security government or financial job where they'll do
a very deep background check and find out everything anyway. As
some random staff techie at a non-security job? Fuck it. Do
whatever you can to improve your chances without adding things
that aren't true.
\_ The day corporations do full disclosure of all their warts
in their offer letter, you might have a case.
\_ No.
\_ Yes, because I will not be happy if I find out the person is
a liar. Lying to your new boss before you even meet him/her is
lame. Find a job that fits you and don't waste my time.
\_ How is replacing phd with MS + 3 years research experience
a lie? Obviously if someone asks what education I have,
I'll say, I'm just talking about what goes on the resume.
Is it dishonest to leave information about one's military
career off of a resume for a programming job? where do
you draw the line?
\_ Why would you even want to leave out a PhD?
\_ Ph.D.'s cost more, and the company might have a bunch
of non-productive degree holders who might bias the hirer
-!op
\_ Why don't you just say you won't demand higher
pay? It's not a good idea to start off lying
to a potential future employer. Even if it is
a lie by omission.
\_ My buddy who has a U. of Chicago law degree
omitted this on his Best Buy application. He's
been working there for almost three years (not
as a corporate guy, but the lowly guys who
help customers with advice). -!op
\_ 1. He's clearly an idiot. 2. He's not
seriously cultivating a career at Best
Buy, is he? If not, then it does not
matter.
\_ In case you didn't get it, this is one
example where it makes sense not to list
a degree -- when it has no relevance to
the position you are applying for
(assuming the lack of any instruction
to list all educational history).
\_ In case *you* didn't get it, Best
Buy is not exactly pertinent to his
career, so what does it matter if
he pisses his boss off or gets
fired? It's not that it makes sense
to omit it. It's that it won't
matter either way.
\_ Maybe it is his career. Maybe he
enjoys what he does and intendeds
to continue.
\_ Listing "+ 3 years research" is questionable if it's what's
led to your Ph.D.
\_ A lot of people would argue that it is not even a lie of
omission, unless HR specifically asks you to list all educational
background. Same goes for previous jobs.
Obviously we disagree: you think you're right, I think I'm
right.
\_ As someone in a position to hire, I will tell you that
I wouldn't like it. You can think you are right all you
want.
\_ Actually, I disagree with you on whether it's a lie of
omission (I say it isn't, and I still think you're wrong
about this), but I agree with you on not
liking it: As someone in a position to hire, I wouldn't
like applicants omitting a Ph.D. if they got one.
To summarize: It's not dishonest, as I originally
said, but your employer probably won't like it.
Part Deux: Be careful how easily you throw around the
label "liar". I wouldn't want to work with someone who
thought like that, but that's just an IMO.
\_ based on all the other stuff that gets posted to the
motd, what are the chances you want to work with
anyone on the motd anyway?
\_ why not? this is all bullshit and venting. do you
think any of these people are *really* like this?
\_ That the motd is a more insulated way to
communicate (i.e. you aren't risking a punch in
the face) does not excuse being a complete
asshole. People who are assholes on the motd
are either
(a) assholes in real life or
(b) too cowardly to be assholes in real life like
they are on the motd.
Either way, would you want to work with them, or
indeed spend any time with them? -- ilyas
\_ yea, whatever, all the ceos are liars anyway.
\_ but they have the hiring money and you don't.
\_ how do you think they become ceos in the first
place?
\_ they all lie on their resumes! of course!
none of them went to a pricey mba school after
clawing their way up the corporate ladder and
destroying the careers of dozens of others on
their way to the top! nononono, they simply
wrote some random shit up on their resume that
no one would check like "senior vp, ibm sales,
world wide, 1987-1996" and bingo! Profit!
\_ Have you read a quarterly report before?
Or go to a Q&A session following an
earnings announcement? It's all about
emphasizing strengths and hiding
weaknesses. Get real.
\_ So if I ask you some questions about your company
during the interview, will you tell the complete
truth and include all the things you hate about your
company?
\_ What the hell does this have to do anything? You
may as well lie and say you have 10 years designing
ASICs when you have 0, right? Why put your real
name on the application? Maybe you should omit your
prison record, too. This last one gets lots of
people fired.
\_ What does it have to do with anything? It tells
me that all the talk about honesty is full of
shit.
\_ Go ahead and omit your time in prison. Hey,
the corporation lies, too. Your ass will
still be fired for it.
\_ well, it hasn't. in fact, I am doing
really well. thanks for your concern
though, corporate dick sucker hypocrite.
\_ What were you imprisoned for?
\_ You lost me. What does the candidate lying about
his background have to do with the company employees
coming clean when asked about the company?
\_ Ask the person I was responding to. |
| 2004/8/17 [Industry/Jobs] UID:32965 Activity:nil |
8/17 Hasselblad is going digital:
http://www.hasselbladusa.com/news/newsMain.asp?secId=224
\_ I thought digital backs for medium formats have been available for
quite a while. |
| 2004/8/17 [Industry/Jobs] UID:32960 Activity:very high |
8/17 Education is good in hiring, but not too much education:
http://tinyurl.com/6nqkl
\_ That was a good article. Thanks. I'm also glad to see that
giving the text book answer to that "What is your biggest
weakness" question isn't always a good idea. "I work too
hard." "Suuuure ya do."
\_ Walking out of the interview as soon as someone
asks you that inane question is a good idea.
\_ no, the insight is that MOST jobs out there do not require a PhD.
Why hire a PhD when a BS/MS would suffice? Hire a PhD iff the
job requires it.
\_ I work in an environment where PhDs are highly valued, but
not really required. We have a lot of overeducated people
running around these days. People doing the same jobs 25
years ago had MS mostly. Now people are commanding higher
salaries and it's harder to find 'qualified people' because
of the insistence that PhD is desirable. There are very few
jobs where a PhD is required in reality.
\_ In my experience, PhDs can often be some of the worst
engineers.
\_ You should not hire PhDs do to engineering work, period.
You hire PhDs to do publications, papers, evaluations,
architect, grant proposals, networking between CTOs and
architects, etc. If your company hired PhDs to do low
level engineering grunt work, then your company sucks.
Sorry.
\_ Hmmm. So someone gets a PhD in engineering and then
should avoid engineering work? I disagree. PhDs
should be doing research, though. I agree with
that. Unless you work at a university (or at a
place like Xerox PARC) you probably don't need a
PhD, even though you might be doing things like
grant proposals, evaluations, and such. I work with
a lot of people with PhDs in engineering and they
qucikly get bored with work of any kind - even
"networking between CTOs and architects". They want
to do research and there are not enough jobs in
research.
\_ I am fairly sure google hires PhDs for coding.
What about MechEng PhDs? Systems PhDs? EE PhDs?
You are an idiot.
\_ Agreed, most PhDs can't code, but they still make more
money than you. Such is life... |
| 2004/8/13-15 [Recreation/Dating, Industry/Jobs] UID:32895 Activity:very high |
8/13 In reference to something from below, how many male sodans actually
enjoy blowjobs? I've only ever had one my entire life I really found
satisfying, out of hundreds of attempts. Its a pale shadow compared to
intercourse. Is it just that no girl knows how to give them, or am I
just some kind of freak?
\_ First, tell your grandmother to take her teeth out.
\_ What's the difference between the wife, the dog, the kids and
a blowjob? A: You can't beat a blowjob.
\_ Two women I've dated gave good blowjobs. Others didn't. It is
indeed a skill, but some guys don't get off on it at all.
\_ Practice makes perfect.
\_ Maybe I just don't get off on it at all. --op
\_ Could be. Such is life.
\_ I enjoy them. Only one women I ever dated gave exceptional
blow jobs, but I enjoyed all of them.
\_ I enjoy blowjobs. My SO says I give excellent ones. -- male sodan
\_ that's sick, get off the motd you fuck!
\_ Dear God! There are sodomites at the university?!!
\_ This would work better if you were at Bob Jones ...
\_ Why do you hate America?
\_ "Our enemies are innovative and resourceful, and so are
we. They never stop thinking about new ways to harm
our country and our people, and neither do we"
\_ I think you have a defective gene.
\_ Have your girl practice on me and I'll tell you whether it's her
technique or just you.
\_ To give a fair and balanced assesment, shouldn't you perform
felatio on the op first?
\_ that's sick, get off the motd you fuck!
\_ Black girls on San Pablo give excellent BBBJs
\_ Black girls on San Pablo give excellent BBBJs -jblack
\_ Black girls on San Pablo give excellent BBBJs -donkeyboy
\_ Hey! Stop posting as me! -The _Real_ Donkeyboy
\_ Actually...that's true.
\_ It's a skill thing like many things in life. I thought sex was
always a good thing until the first time I was with a girl who
rated about -3 on a 1 to 10 skill scale. Willing, able, no
talent, bad sex. Life has its disappointments. Same deal with BJs.
\_ Where can one find good technical advice?
\_ This is kind of an aside, but I dated a young woman with very
little experience once and she kept biting down on me. So we
went to Good Vibes and bought a dildo and I showed her what
I like. |
| 2004/8/5-8 [Academia/Berkeley/CSUA, Industry/Jobs, Computer/SW/Languages/C_Cplusplus] UID:32725 Activity:nil 50%like:36020 |
8/5 Another Mountain View job. Senior C++ developer.
/csua/pub/jobs/coral8
_________________________________________________________________ |
| 2004/8/4-5 [Industry/Jobs] UID:32672 Activity:high |
8/3 Blogger/Google is hiring a UI engineer. Must already have a blog.
Expert HTML/CSS/JavaScript. User-centered design. A lot of web
application development experience. Mt View. -- misha.
\_ Why would anyone want to join google at this point? You'll get
low pay, no options or options with a value set so high they'll
be below water 2 days after the IPO, and you'll work like a dog.
I learned a long time ago having some 'cool' job on your resume
isn't worth the bullshit. No one cares 6 months later.
\_ yes I can't think of anything worse than working
at google.
\_ I know. I'd rather be unemployed and homeless.
\_ Working with smart people is overrated anyway.
\_ It has its moments. -- misha.
\_ How many people does google interview for each position before
hiring someone, on average?
\_ 1E100
\_ If I don't find that answer amusing, does that mean I shouldn't
apply?
\_ Are you smrt? Will you move to Mountain View?
\_ yes. no. |
| 2004/8/2-3 [Industry/Jobs, Industry/Startup] UID:32638 Activity:high |
8/2 What are the best job sites? Have you found a job using those
sites?
\_ I'm in civil and monster worked fine, though it took some patience.
I had to wait about four months for something good, ducking
crap from headhunters most of that time. That time waited has
more to do with the realities of the civil job market than with
monster. -- ulysses
\_ sites work well for entry level jobs. Nowadays you really need
connections and referals.
\_ *you* might. others do fine going in cold.
\_ I found my current job three years ago by posting a resume on
http://dice.com. The HR at my company saw it and gave me a call for an
interview. But at the same time I got calls from ten job firms or
so. That's the downside.
\_ I hated dice for precisely that reason: lots of responses from
annoying headhunters, none from real companies.
\_ So what? Ask them for the name of the hiring company and
no you're not coming in or sending in an updated resume
without that information, click.
\_ You don't understand. They're not representing a
specific company. They have a zillion no-name,
uninteresting companies they're trying to fit you for.
\_ craigslist
\_ ditto. Got my current job thru CL. |
| 2004/7/30 [Industry/Jobs] UID:32592 Activity:high |
7/30 What's a good site to search and price-compare used and perhaps out-of-
print technical/professional but Non-CS books.
\_ They're out-of-print and you still want to compare prices? Just buy
it as soon as you see one.
\_ Not everybody's dad is a banker.
\_ http://www.bookfinder.com |
| 2004/7/23-24 [Industry/Jobs] UID:32456 Activity:high |
7/23 I really like Rammstein, but I'd like to find some similar bands. The
problem is when a website says "You may also like..." it always
reccomends bands that are all screaming without the songwriting skills
of Rammstein. Can someone reccomend an industrial band with a good
songwriter or some compositional skills?
\_ Skyforger
\_ http://www.sabbatum.com
\_ It says 403 Forbidden
Apparently I'm not worthy...
\_ Laibach, Old Lady Drivers, dISEMBOWELMENT |
| 2004/7/20-21 [Industry/Jobs] UID:32368 Activity:nil |
7/20 Technical Consultant position available at Berkeley start-up. See
/csua/pub/jobs/Recommind/TechnicalConsultant.txt |
| 2004/7/20-21 [Industry/Jobs] UID:32367 Activity:insanely high 66%like:12088 50%like:30016 66%like:30258 |
17/20 motd poll: how much did you get for your last raise?
\_ http://csua.com/Industry/Jobs
\_ got a 6% raise just last week. Before that, my last raise was in
early 2001 and that was 8%.
\_ 10% cost of living increase in grad student stipend. These happen
in random years in response to competition from other universities.
\_ buahahahah...: .
\_ about 7% (including "bonus")
\_ inflation adjustment of 3% on average. I got a 8% raise only
because couple guys in my project left and I was implying I was
going to leave if I was not well compensated.
\_ None (consultant) but manaegd to keep my rates constant, and
noticed that nitpicking about $$$ by clients has decreased
markedly over the past few months. -John
\_ 10% -- market rate adjustment and because I aksed.
\_ Last "raise" (pay increase w/o a promotion) was 3 yrs ago.
I think it was about 7%. I was promoted one grade level 2
yrs ago and my pay went up about 15%. I haven't had a raise
since then (I've survived 3 rounds of lay-offs, so I'm just
glad to have a job). I'm in line for a promotion this year.
If it happens my pay should go up 10% or so (not sure what
"engineers" get paid at this firm, currently I'm just a
"member of technical staff").
\_ 3.4% in December 2003, 3.5% in Feb 2003.
\_ 1.9 in 2/03, 2.7 in 2/04. Didn't ask, no promotion.
\_ 2% in 2/04, 0.5% in 2/03
\_ Got a 3.5% COLA raise, but it got sucked up by higher benefit costs.
\_ Got a 4% raise at my last yearly evaluation, which was in October.
\_ So with the above responses the economy seems to be getting better?
\_ The economy is getting better, but it's still very weak. It
will most likeley not go back to the way it was in the
forseeable future. This has been the worst recession in
about 20 years.
\_ WSJ had an article yesterday. It says that the
recovery has happened for well-off americans but
low income and middle class americans are still
very much struggling. for me, it seems that
those with money is going to do well in this
age of outsourcing and globalization, whereas
those with skills that can be oursourced are
going to continue to struggle.
\_ Rich get richer - same old story. Only difference now
is that no one speaks for anyone but the rich.
\_ That is not new either. People who had money
during The Depression became very wealthy. I am
not sure if anyone has ever spoken for the poor
unless you mean activists like MLK.
\_ The progressives of the late 19th/early 20th
century are a good example...and both Roosevelts,
to some extent - Teddy more than Franklin, perhaps.
Current whiny left types are definitely not
included. MLK would be, for sure. There was
also more voices for the worker in the media in
the days before consolidation...
\_ even the Communist Party in China no longer
speaks for the poor. funny, huh?
\_ Unions still speak for the working man. Who
isn't poor anymore, thanks to their efforts, but
doesn't really qualify as rich, either.
\_ here's the article if you have access to WSJ online.
http://tinyurl.com/6d6y6
incidentally, for those who haven't considered it,
the wsj has surpassed economist as my favourite rag.
it's worth considering even if you are not a pig
for finance and business news. I agree with the
critism that the opinion pages are totally one
sided, but I find the rest of it rather balanced.
and its viewpoints are often quite refreshing
and insightful compared to more general news rags.
\_ Could you share the WSJ login?
\_ it's not free, so I can't.
\_ The WSJ has never been anything but a very vocal
advocate for unregulated markets and I really
doubt that anything has changed on that regard.
Do they discuss the pros and cons of socialized
medicine yet? Having said that, they are still
the best source for business news in America.
But I am boycotting them until after the election
since they have turned their opinion page into
a partisan hackfest. -long time WSJ reader
\_ http://csua.com/Industry/Jobs
\_ put your shit at the bottom like the rest of us |
| 2004/7/11-15 [Industry/Jobs] UID:32221 Activity:low |
7/11 Zone Labs is looking to hire approx. 20 developers.
See /csua/pub/jobs/ZoneLabs for details
(Note also interested in Seniors looking to work part time,
with possible full time employment after graduating or dropping
out. --sky
\_ Are you guys going to fix the crap that is version 5.x? Are you
going to fix the "kills idle ssh connections" 'option' in 5.x
which has no option to disable this 'feature'? I rebuilt my home
network so that I don't have to use zone alarm anymore. If someone
won't use the free version, how many more won't pay for it? 4.x
was so much better.
\_ I couldn't agree with you more. I fought long and hard to
try and convince management/executives to hold the release
but ultimately lost. The kills idle ssh connections
bug has been fixed along with many other egregious bugs
that should have prevented 5.0 from releasing in the first
place. This update will be released around ~7/15.
Please email me (sking@zonelabs.com) if you'd like an advance
copy of the update, though from the sound of it i guess not.
--sky
\_ version 5 doesn't work with NetScreen VPN, will the new
release fix that?
\_ Hrm I see no mention of NetScreen in our bug database,
but i wouldn't be suprised. Can you send me an email
at sking@zonelabs.com and I'll see if I can figure
out the problem. --sky
\_ Yes!! Finally!! Thank you!! |
| 2004/7/8-9 [Industry/Jobs] UID:32188 Activity:high |
7/8 Does your internship pay for health insurance? Mine doesn't -intel
\_ be glad your internship actaully pays!
\_ None of mine ever did. SHIP.
\_ When I interned at Apple they provided health care. --twohey |
| 2004/6/22 [Industry/Jobs] UID:30954 Activity:nil |
6/22 How's the job market looking these days? software engineers.
\_ The job market has been white hot since January of this year for
anyone who a) already has a job and b) has some skills. My last
unemployed friend finally got a job last week after 2 years of
fucking around not really looking. |
| 2004/6/18 [Academia/GradSchool, Industry/Jobs] UID:30899 Activity:nil |
6/18 Reality show application:
http://www.cbs.com/info/user_services/application2.shtml |
| 2004/6/16 [Industry/Jobs] UID:30835 Activity:kinda low |
6/16 Anyone here worked in a business consulting company like McKinsey,
Accenture, or the like? Please share your experience. Thanks.
\_ My girlfriend works for BCG, which I think is one of the better
ones. They pay a lot of money to young people straight out of
college (so they don't really have any work experience to measure
themselves against), put them in a pool of other young over-
achievers, and tell them they're the best. That's the good part--
the bad thing is that they start thinking it normal to work 12 hour
days, that there are no real jobs outside of the consulting outfit,
and that they are some sort of loser if they get out of the "up
or out" system. Only the really strong ones manage to avoid a
total burnout. To be fair, a lot of the people I know at her
outfit are of above average intelligence, except when it comes to
saying "no" to being shat upon at work by managers and customers.
I also think that you have to be a singular kind of defective to
survive for long enough to get into senior management, so that
breeds some pretty evil culture. All the people I know who "left"
Accenture, PWC & co. were inevitably totally burned out and totally
dissatisfied at having wasted a few years of their lives. -John |
| 2004/5/27-28 [Industry/Jobs] UID:30454 Activity:very high |
5/27 For that $70k coder who was going to ask for a raise. Did you do it?
how did it go?
\_ got outsourced!
\_LOL, you sob!
\_ did it, but review is delayed until end of 4th quarter.
put my resume out and got quite a few responses so far
sticking at job until i find something, they will counter
offer only when I will leave, not giving notice because
they fire tons of people without notice.
\_ yep look around, lots of oppertunities out there now. I also went
and talked to my VP of Eng, it is delayed until mid next month. I
think I'll put my resume out as well because if he's sincere, he
should at least give me a good faith offer.
\_ You should give notice but not until you find a new job. Why
would you let them know you were looking before you actually got
a new job? My God, are Cal people really this unprepared for
life in the real world? Cal needs a class on how to get by in
the real world. Notice means, "I already have a new job, I'm not
interested in your counter offer, I hate your guts but I'm giving
you two worthless weeks of slacking and short hours so you can't
ruin my good name by saying I walked out with no notice".
\_ hahah, I like that. better yet, just give a day notice because
I ain't coming back. when I got laid off, I didn't get two
weeks of pay. it sucks to be the last one to be laid off.
people got laid off during the first round got six month of
paid. Even the guy that was fired also got some severance. in
the real world, you'll just know how to whine and complain to
the the money. :)
\_ No matter how your job sucks, exercise noblesse oblige and
\-you have an odd
notion of noblesse
oblige --psb, exer-
cising dictionary
oblige
don't burn bridges. Word gets around, and the world is
small--and even if 9/10 of your colleagues are shit, you
may find yourself working with the tenth someday, and want
to leave him with a good impression. Just give notice,
smile, say thank you, and leave. -John
\_ Maybe he actually wanted to stay at the current job as long as
his pay is raised. So he threatened to leave by giving the
notice that he's looking for a job elsewhere.
\_ Good managers know that once someone gives notice they're
gone. A raise granted under those conditions won't keep
the employee around for more than 6 months. If he wants a
raise he should ask for a raise and then when he doesn't
get one they have no reason to waste his time with a fake
counter. There's also the risk that they'll give him the
raise he wants and then replace his ass 3 weeks later since
they know he's going to quit in 6 months anyway *and* that
other job is now gone so he's fucked. Get new job, quit
old job, move on like a professional, forget about them.
\_ I didnt tell them I am looking. i told them I'll wait
for the review to come. In the meantime I will look for
a job and when I do find one, leave without 2 weeks
notice.
\_ Give the 2 weeks. I just quit the worst job I ever had but
I gave the 2 weeks. I slacked off, got paid for it, and
they can't tell their manager buddies in other companies
that I walked without notice. It's a very small industry.
Do yourself a favor. No matter how much you hate them,
give the two weeks. Slack off, come in late, leave early,
take long lunches, accomplish nothing, but get those two
weeks officially on the books.
\_ will do, going fishing during lunch
\_ As long as you were officially there on the books and
didn't walk out in a no-notice huff, fishing, fucking,
or anything else during your 3 hour lunch is the way
to go.
\_ If the alternative is doing violence to your boss,
walk out in a huff. Better to be known as someone
who quits without giving notice that someone who
assaults his supervisors.
\_ How about, returning to your desk calmly, writing
a two-weeks-notice letter, and giving that to him
the next day?
\_ That would be too mature a response for some motd
people. ;-) I agree with you in concept but I
still think there's no reason to walk in a huff.
If things are *that* bad you have a lawsuit.
\_ Yeah, but you *really* don't want to get
a reputation as a guy who sues his employer.
\_ Nope, take the two weeks and walk. |
| 2004/5/25-26 [Industry/Jobs] UID:30414 Activity:very high |
5/25 Let's say I have a day job which brings in $Y/hour. I have
been asked to do consulting for another company on the side.
What should I charge? $(1.5*Y)? $(2*Y)? Any suggestions on
places to look for finding how to set this rate? Thanks.
\_ ((ln e) * Y) / i)
\_ supply & demand. You can't charge more than what the
other company willing to pay.
\_ Do you work at Microsoft Technical Support? That was a
perfect completely true but totally worthless answer!
\_ just to answer a stupid question. You can charge 2x or 10x
if you want to. It all matters to what the company willing
to pay for your work. If the company don't think it can find
someone reliable or capable, heck, they're willing to pay
2x, 3x or 5x. The key is to do your market research and
find out what you're worth. To say that you're worth 1.5x
is so bogus.
\_ The full-benefits cost of an employee, including overhead, is about
2x salary. If you're not using their facilities, you could probably
argue 2x, but if you're at the office and using their equipment
(which means you're not a contractor in the strictest sense of the
word), then 1.5x is more appropriate, since you're only saving them
benefits, not overhead.
\_ On-the-side jobs are a lot of work. How much is your spare time
worth to you? If it's not enough money, you won't be motivated to
finish it.
\_ I did an on the sire job for a few weeks at 1x. It was a huge pain
\_ I did an on the site job for a few weeks at 1x. It was a huge pain
in the ass and totally not worth it so I dropped it. At 2x it might
have almost been worth it. At 4x I would've been happy. Remember
that people think you're worth what they're paying you. That's not
as trite as it seems. I mean it literally. Whatever you do, you
should not charge under $100/hr for real IT work. If you're just
installing windows patches in some office, then less is ok. Nothing
with skills for less than $100. Remember, it costs them a shitload
more to hire fulltime to do it and they don't have to pay your
benefits, etc. Your current salary is only an amusing tidbit and
shouldn't have much effect on what you charge since it's likely
you're underpaid right now. When did you get a raise? How much
would someone with your skills make today in the open market?
Probably a lot more than you think. The CSUA salaries I've seen
posted over the years are always pathetically low. |
| 2004/5/17-18 [Industry/Jobs] UID:30264 Activity:high |
5/17 what pays more: sys admin or software developer?
\_ Depends on your oral skills.
\_ How well you blow your boss?
\_ SA is less likely to get shipped over seas, however you get even
less respect than devs, there are fewer jobs, the jobs require
serious skills, the work is often repetitive and dull and the
tech side in most companies is run by former software guys who
don't know shit about SA, don't want to know, and treat that
stuff like the plague. SA tends to pay more. |
| 2004/5/17-18 [Industry/Jobs] UID:30253 Activity:high |
5/17 70k per year guys (who took lower pay and dont get raises)
i am in similar situation, but am going to boss and telling
him that I at least need a raise to beat inflation or else
I am being paid less that I was last year
\_ I'd also suggest adding other facets to your argument, so that
you have a stronger position. What contributions have you made,
or skills do you have that would also merit the extra money? Even
if your boss does agree that you should be given a raise based
on "inflation" how is he going to argue on your behalf to
-his- boss (or worse) Human Resources? --chris
\_ I think this is on purpose. Salaries are being held in line so
that you are taking a pay cut (over time), and ppl being hired
are paid less (starting sal) than the .com era.
are paid less (starting sal) than the .com era. It's better than
having your position eliminated and/or sent overseas. Might also
want to think about changing careers, if you are not on the mgmt
track.
\_ You're better off sending out your resume and taking the jump to
$95 to $110k. The economy is up, people are hiring, salaries are
going up. If you have any tech skills and can negotiate worth a
damn and are willing to walk away from lesser offers you're good
for the $100k range easy. The rest of you 70k bastards should go
get real jobs and stop fucking up the pay scales for the rest of
us.
\_ a $70K job which doesn't suck is way better than a $100K
job which does.
\_ They're mostly bitching about 70k jobs that *do* suck and
won't do anything about it but whine on the motd. |
| 2004/5/14-15 [Industry/Jobs] UID:30228 Activity:very high |
5/13 Are employers in the Bay Area paying so incredibly low these days? I
still have an inflated dot-com era salary from 2000 and I'm realistic
about taking a 20%-25% cut if I were to switch jobs. But even then, it
seems that when I give a potential employer my adjusted minimum, I
never hear back. Are places really hiring people with >5 years exp
for $70k?
\_ I recently took more than a 1/3rd salary hit to leave my old place.
I expect/hope that my new lower income is temporary and in time I
shall return to near what my old salary was. The plus side is that
I now work with really great people, the company is making money
and the company long term focus is to make the company attractive
to big buyers so maybe our options will have value some day. It's
a risk but I'm happy in the meantime and making enough money. I
miss the mega salary but I had to learn the hard way that money
really isn't everything. A certain income level is required to pay
the bills and have savings. After that? Be happy. OTOH those of
you who have 5+ years in anything technical and hate your jobs and
make less than $100k need to go job hunting. There's no point in
waiting for some magical date to start looking. You can find the
great job at any time. Start now. I started at the very beginning
of the recent upturn. Do not expect things to return to 1998
levels ever again in your lifetime. Place offering $70k for > 5yrs
who aren't giving you some other reason to signup are fucked. Just
move on. You should ask them their range before giving up yours.
\_ economy is picking up, be patient. Many places is starting to hire.
yeah, I took a pay cut, at exactly $70k now.
\_ Ditto.
\_ wow, i am 70k too, 7 yrs out of school.
\_ What do you guys do?
\_ Where should I be after 18 months out of college, EECS? I like my
job, just curious.
\_ Ditto.
\_ Start at $58K, you should now be at $63K?
\_ Where should I be after 72 months out of college, EECS?
-geordan
\_ I got a 20% raise in 2001 when I switched job after the previous
company went Chapter 7. After that, 2% raise last year and 3% raise
this year at the same job.
\_ yeah.. seems that changing jobs is the fastest way to boost
your salary, especially if you're being underpaid
\_ Are the figures on http://salary.com still accurate? Or were they based
on salaries from 2000?
\_ I don't why someone keeps censoring this (I am using motdedit)
but $70K is very underpaid for the Bay Area. In the LA area
*civil* engineers who work for the *government* are getting
$100K+ after 10 years. You guys at 7 years out should be near
or over $100K. If you love your job that's fine, but if not LEAVE!
\_ I have a MS, and I'm 7 years out of school. I make >$110k, but
was just offered a job for $80k. I hate my current dot-com job,
but I don't think I hate it by >$30k. -op
\_ Have you considered saying to them something along the
lines of "I'd really like to take the job, but I'm afraid
I couldn't handle the pay cut." They might up their
offer. If they don't, no loss.
\_ Civil engineers are paid more than programmers these days.
\_ Which branch of government? Certainly not federal or state.
\_ County, but federal pays pretty well too.
\_ I find this suspect. Do you have a URL? Government
salaries are supposed to be public knowledge.
\_ Well, why should I care if you find it suspect? I
know two civil engineers. However, here's one job:
http://www.lacsd.org/personnel/ElectricalEngineerNew.htm
You might start at $6-7K but by 10 years+ you will
exceed the stated $8K mark.
\_ Thanks.
\_ SAGE has the best report for syadmin salaries out there.
For SF Bay Area, they report $86k median for 5-9 yrs
experience. $98k for 10-12 yrs. Are you a programmer or a
sysadmin?
experience. $98k for 10-14 yrs. Are you a programmer or a
sysadmin? BTW, I get paid $90k in salary and a stock grant
worth $23k at current valuation for 10 yrs experience.
\_ Does it have figures for programmers as well?
\_ nope. I don't know of a similar study for programmers.
From http://salary.com and anecdotally, I would guess that programmers
used to get paid 10-20% more, now probably about the same. I
have no idea if this is correct though.
\_ and are you a programmer or a sysadmin?
\_ shouldn't matter. the pay ranges are almost exactly the same.
\_ This is not going to remain true over time.
\_ I think it will, but what's your theory?
\- i think it'll fluctuate in both directions. currently
the hip thing to do is outsource programmers. the
effects of outsourcing might actually be to incraease
average salaries, bc the low end jobs won't be here.
\_ sysadmin
\_ That's a bit low. Economy has picked up -- companies _are_
hiring. Certainly, it depends on your skills and attitude...but
$70K is on the low side now. fyi. --chris |
| 2004/5/14-15 [Industry/Jobs] UID:30223 Activity:high |
5/13 Has anyone ever had 1/3 of their dev group leave within the
span of a week? How did you deal with the short term effects?
Three guys in my group gave notice within the span of a couple
of days and now I'm stuck trying to figure out who will cover
for them and its driving me nuts since we are already under
staffed as it is.
\_ the easiest way to deal with the short-term effects is to
make it 4 guys giving notice.
\_ I'm going back to school in the fall (my manager has
known about this for a year, so its not going to be a
surprise to anyone). I want to work till august or so
to save up more cash. I also want to retain a good
relationship with my mgr in case I need a reference
(or a job) in the future.
\_ what school? if you're going to academia, references from
the industry will mean very very very little. my advisor
says he never reads recommendations from industry unless
they're from famous research labs. professors tend to
look down on industry experience because they're most
likely not "interesting" -grad student
\_ That professors tend to look down on industry experience
or even academic experience outside of their narrow little
field is a simple empirical fact. However, I think
this speaks more to the personality defects of
academics than to the value or interest of anthing.
-cynical grad student
\_ I was on a project that had 3/4rs of the team leave one year into
a two year release cycle. Unless you managers are making it clear
they understand they are going to need to push deadlines way back
in order to not destroy everyone who stuck around my advice is
don't deal with the short term effects, just coast. They won't
fire you or even think less of you, they are too busy running around
panicing to even notice. And it just isn't worth it to try to
do the work of four people, which is the other option.
\_ You're not the manager? Don't worry about it. Do what you're
assigned to do by your manager. If you were a manager then it
would be your problem. Why are you even thinking about this much
less worried by it since you're leaving soon anyway?
\_ Tell them you can recruit your brother and/or sisters who will
work for low wages, and you can vouch for them 'cause they're
family. You can also put in four extra hours on weekdays and
Saturday, and on Sunday, can put in a half-day. You had
no idea the other guys were leaving, the traitors.
\_ this is really good. -phuqm |
| 2004/5/12-13 [Industry/Jobs] UID:30190 Activity:nil 57%like:30184 |
5/12 Telespree is hiring a mobile application developer. The posting is
in /csua/pub/jobs/Telespree_junior_mobile_appdev. --njh |
| 2004/5/12-13 [Academia/Berkeley/CSUA, Industry/Jobs] UID:30184 Activity:nil 57%like:30190 |
5/12 Snapfish is hiring a mobile architect. See the posting in
/csua/pub/jobs/Snapfish.mobile.architect for more details.
-- ajani |
| 2004/4/30 [Industry/Jobs] UID:13490 Activity:nil |
4/29 My recruiter is looking for some entry to intermediate level
Java developers. Please see the description at:
/csua/pub/jobs/intermediate-java-developer
\_ if nothing else should, at least this should get restored.
\_ Someone is being nice enough to post a job listing. If you don't
like recruiters, fine don't apply for the job. Just don't try to
deprive other people of the job opportunity.
\_ Is there a particular reason you're hiding the name of your
company? It may explain why this posting keeps being removed.
\_ I assume there's the poster, his recruiter, and the company
the recruiter is recruiting for. The op may likely not even
know the name of the company.
\_ I'm guessing the company might be http://geac.com -!op
\_ Not a clue. I'm the one doing the restores and not the
OP. I just think there might be people looking for
jobs. Call it public service on my part, and I assume
the OP's.
\_ There is no company. It's a recruiter. The guy posting gets
a referral cut. Evil.
\_ how do you know?
\_ Why would he post a recruiter add on the motd?
\_ Who cares? Even if he does get a cut, that's one more
job going to a csua'er. Better that than no cut, but
the job goes to somebody else. NEPOTISM!
\_ He's doing other motd readers a favor? I've often
pointed friends at recruiters with just a "he's looking
for X" and no additional information.
\_ Because the motd censor is much wiser than the rest of us.
\_ Yeah, right, like resumes and job applicants are such hot
commodities right now.
\_ I have recruiters contacting me a couple of times a
week for unsolicited job offers these days. |
| 2004/4/17 [Industry/Jobs] UID:13243 Activity:nil |
4/16 Do programmers at startups normally get raises every year (assuming
they are doing a good job etc)? Or is there some kind of
understanding that people don't get raises until the company hits
certain technical or financial milestones?
\_ maybe it depends on how well you're being paid in the first place.
if they're underpaying you and not giving you a raise, they'll
find it hard to retain even semi-competent people. |
| 2004/4/15-16 [Industry/Jobs, Industry/Startup] UID:13211 Activity:nil |
4/15 I finally understand what a CRM is and what it is used for.
it's the database of contacts, customers, customers' employees,
business leads, interests, themes, "opportunities" and a calendar
to remind you the flow of following it all up. The front end is part
of a CRM. -brain
\_ throw in deliverables, impressions to cover marketing
\_ http://csua.com/?entry=12519
\_ right, that was the post I was referring to.
check out the mouseover on kchang's page! crazy! -brain
\_ It should be noted that most CRM project fail. (you don't earn
your money back on the investment for it)
\_ Yeah. Most of the CRM software that people bandy about
(RazorsEdge, etc), work out to be upwards of $150k. When
we looked into it at the BAM/PFA, it was around $150k for the
package and customization. Hardware to run it and ongoing
support was a lot of money on top of that.
There are other systems out there, though, with not quite all
the functionality but much more reasonable price. -sax
\_ the installation I was working with cost $30k, with $50k
of labor and $200k of contracting that went into building
custom modules into it. The data mining that resulted
from it landed a $4.8 M deal. Sounds like a good
investment to me!
\_ I've struggled through goldmine for the last 2 years, and
hate the pile of shit. 90% of user problems are goldmine
crashing, "losing" mail, and just otherwise being a pile
of shit. They still use a fucking broken bde library.
The DB schema has grown without a redesign for years, and
feels like it. I've been wanting to make my own suite out
of open source stuff to replace the crap. --scotsman
\_ We actually went with a Filemaker solution. It was
developed by people who left Bluebaud. It is FM, but
it has a pretty decent feature set... kind of focused
on membership and donation campaign tracking. For
under $15k, it does everything we need and more -sax
\_ i agree, but it depends on which company you get it from.
ROI from enterprise crm companies generates more cash flow.
The mid-market crm products out there aren't that good and
is why most fail. If you can come up with a cheap mid-market
crm product, then definitly make one.
\_ LT. TOEJAM: I just got another blast on the CRM-114, and the
damned thing decodes: Wing Attack, Plan-R.
MAJOR KONG: Wing attack, Plan-R?
\_ Major Kong: Well, I've been to one world fair, a picnic, and a
rodeo, and that's the stupidest thing I ever heard come over a
set of earphones. You sure you got today's codes?
\_ http://crm114.sourceforge.net -John |
| 2004/4/14 [Industry/Jobs] UID:29928 Activity:nil |
4/14 Let's set some rules on what gets to stay and what gets deleted.
I say each thread gets to stay for 8 hours after it stops
becoming active (no new information added). Hours at night
12 midnight - 8 a.m doesn't count as time passed. Informational
threads like job openings get to stay longer.
\_ That relies on people playing nice. There's a hierarchy of
lamers who don't: first, the motd censors. Lame.
Lamer: people who retaliate against everyone else for the
actions of the ceensors. Very lame, and akin to terrorism.
\_ Perhaps 8hrs is a little long. The motd can get pretty big
pretty quickly. Aside from that, I would think guidelines
would be a good idea. |
| 2004/4/13 [Industry/Jobs] UID:13172 Activity:high |
4/13 Who on this csua board are still in the software industry? Doing
programming more specifically.
$40k - $60k:
$60k - $80k:...
\_ great. usually, when surveys come up, there is usually
bragging: I make > $120k with only one year experience!
\_ Now who's bragging, braggart?
\_ I make over $120k with over 10 years experience. Is that
bragging or useful information for others?
\_ I'm not bragging. I'm just showing an example of someone
who brags and the type of statements they make.
\_ I'm not bragging. I'm just citing an example of a person
who brags.
$80k - $100k:..
$100k+: .
$666k: .
\_ wow. i did not realize salaries have come down that much.
\_ the people making real money are too busy to fuck around on the
motd. also Cal grads tend to underprice themselves in the
market. $60k-$80k is ridiculous for anyone has more than 1 year.
\_ Berkeley grads make $20k more than the prevailing wage. I read
it on the motd.
\_ Is there an industry wide salary survey for programmers, similar
to the SAGE salary survey for sysadmins?
\_ http://Dice.com has something similar. http://www.salary.com as well. Don't
know how accurate the latter is. |
| 2004/4/7-9 [Industry/Jobs] UID:13075 Activity:moderate |
4/7 Anyone hiring interns this summer? A former student of mine goes to CMU
and is looking for a summer internship. willing to do either coding
(C/C++, can do java) or sysadmin (solaris/linux). He's smart but only
a freshman.
I'm George Bush, and I approved this message.
\_ you realize that employers prefer a dumb/experienced guy over a
smart/inexperienced guy right?
\_ actually, that's the lie we feed you to soften the blow
when we really think you're dumb and inexperienced. |
| 2004/4/5-7 [Industry/Jobs] UID:13022 Activity:nil |
4/5 Graphic Design Engineer needed, degree or 1-2 years experience,
for application software company. Contact wck@@genp.com (recruiter).
\_ where is the position located?
\_ What is a Graphic Design Engineer? You mean someone to design
the user interface? |
| 2004/3/31-4/3 [Industry/Jobs] UID:12950 Activity:nil |
3/31 Interested in working at a start-up company in SF as a Field
Application Engineer or a Windows Application Software Engineer?
Check /csua/pub/jobs/Mediabolic -toshi
\_ Out of curiosity, who makes more money?
\_ The FAE will make much more than the $15k the Indian
subcontractor will want for the software engineering job. |
| 2004/3/17-22 [Industry/Jobs] UID:12728 Activity:nil |
3/17 Over 30 open jobs at Transmeta, mostly in the Senior Circuit Designer
and Layout type of jobs, but also some test engineering and a couple of
senior software positions. Sorry I can't be more specific, but there's
32 slots and you probably don't want them all here in bushy detail.
Email me if interested. --lye
\_ What's the salary for the Senior IC Designer? Thanks.
\_ Don't know this information, sorry. --lye
\_ Please post this on the India's job site. -- GWB
\_ What is *your* plan to stop outsourcing to India?
\_ nothing. Outsourcing is good for you if you still have a job.
It allows companies to stay competitive. Do you want your
company to shutdown and lay you off? -- GWB
\_ ok so the troll doesn't have a plan, just negativity.
\_ ok so the troll doesn't have a plan, just relativity.
\_ Hey sir! I am trying my very best to protect your
sorry ass company. -- GWB
\_ but true.
\_ ok so the troll doesn't have a plan, just relativity.
sorry ass company. -- GWB
\_ yawn.
\_ 32? So you're starting over?
\_ No, it's an expansion for a future product, I think. These are
new positions, not old positions being refilled. Why do I
get the feeling I've just answered a non-serious inquiry? --lye
\_ it was semi-serious. the first products out didn't exactly
take over the world after all the hype about killing Intel,
etc, secret messages in home page, etc.
\_ Yeah, true that. I didn't work there then, oh well.
Surprise, they're still around! Anyway, they're only
jobs...Some people need them.
\_ That's cool. Never drink the koolaid at any company
\_ oh. Your company is still alive?
\_ what do you mean still alive?! My favorite simian stock
\_ Is Ditzel still running the show there? Oh you poor pups.
picker says the stock of lye's employer is a buy!:
http://www.trudythemonkey.com
\_ TMTA has $110 mill in cash and short-term investments. -tom
\_ Is Ditzel still running the show there? Oh you poor pups. |
| 2004/3/5-6 [Health, Industry/Jobs] UID:12546 Activity:nil |
3/5 http://store.nimanranch.com/store/nimanranch/help3.jsp This FAQ is particularly enlightening. \_ That's also disgusting. Who feeds plastic to animals for "roughage"? |
| 2004/3/5-8 [Industry/Jobs] UID:12531 Activity:nil |
3/4 Yahoo! hiring sysadmins: /csua/pub/jobs/yahoo -ekim
\_ what's the pay range? It looks junior-mid level. Any point in
an expensive senior guy applying?
\_ "pay depends on experience" etc. Several positions open.
Well within current industry-wide ranges. You're welcome
to submit your resume and we can talk.
\_ for the lazy:
Be a member of a dynamic team that is vital to Yahoo!, including our leading
Web Search engine. You will develop, run, and monitor tools for
large-scale search clusters located around the world, using primarily
Linux. This position is full-time, located in Sunnyvale, CA.
Responsibilities:
* Administer Linux clusters, monitor their health and performance
* Develop and maintain in-house automation for world-wide cluster operations
* Coordinate and execute changes to live cluster software and configurations
* Diagnose and repair production clusters
* Participate in the on-call pager rotation
* Collaborate in the design of cluster configurations with developers
* Work closely with other system administrator and network teams
Requirements:
* 2+ years experience with Linux
* Strong Perl scripting skills
* 2+ years experience administering large Linux installations in a tier 1
environment
* BS Computer Science and/or strong System Administration background.
Send questions and text (or url to) resumes to ekim |
| 2004/3/4-5 [Industry/Jobs, Industry/Startup] UID:12519 Activity:nil |
4/3 Can someone give me a description in layman's English what CRM and
ERP are (in the business software world)? Thanks!
\_ CRM: Software which tracks customers, including what they bought,
when they last bought, how much they bought, how likely they
are to buy again, who they are, how to contact them, how they
they are distributed geographically, who is responsible for
interfacing with them, when was the last time you called them,
how many times have you contacted them, when will you meet them,
when was the last time you sent them out something, etc.
ERP: I have to build 100 boats to meet an order. Each boat contains
100,000 parts and requires three different fabs and twenty different
distributors for base parts. I need to coordinate how these boats
get built on time, within spec, and under budget. I also have
5000 employees to coordinate, enter SAP/IBM/Oracle.
\_ CRM is usually some piece of software that coordinates
correspondence with clients and prospects in some meaningful
(usually sales-driven) way. Never heard of ERP. Though a quick
google comes up with this:
http://www.cio.com/research/erp/edit/erpbasics.html --scotsman
\_ I realize these are not definitions, but expanding the
acronyms should help you anyway:
CRM = Customer relationship management
ERP = Enterprise resource planning
\_ ERP = everything a company does except what it does
\_ ERP is sort of a tracking system for "resources" your internal
processes use. Both of these things are more of a layer of
software than a single application, and usually involve software
components knit together with a variety of databases. Surf on
almost anything SAP does and you may get a better feel for what
those components actually do. -brain
\_ Thanks for all the answers, everyone. I STFW but I never found
anything that really explained in plain simple English. --op |
| 2004/2/20 [Industry/Jobs, Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Motd] UID:29826 Activity:very high |
2/20 Restored after some idiot child deleted all the comments.
This isn't a one-way message board for job postings and one
word answer technical questions. It is a discussion forum for
topics of interest. If a topic is of no interest to you, then
ignore it. Deleting them does not improve the quality of the
motd, it reduces it by making it more likely that others with
overlapping interests will cease using the motd because their
topics keep getting killed and the rest just isn't interesting
enough for them. You may miss out on a job posting or
technical answer because you've ruined the motd months or
years earlier for a hiring manager or highly skilled person.
Do yourself a favor and leave the motd alone. It doesn't need
you to police it or 'clean it up. Think of yourself even if
you have no consideration for others. Thank you.
(extended whine nuked, but silly discussions preserved in
deference to silly whiners' sensitivities.) [and restored
twice now because you still don't "get it".]
\_ Guess what? The fuckwit censors never will "get it." The only
solution is when they get like that, start deleting all the
technical posts. After a few days of saturation bombing, the
fuckers give up.
\_ tell us about the tragedy of the commons
\_ this is not tragedy of the commons, go back to read your
basics of capitalism
\_ it was a joke.
\_ There is a technical reason to this. Those who knows how to
monitor the motd text file, please either post the script and/or
post the name of the person who is constantly deleting motd. |
| 2004/2/19-24 [Industry/Jobs] UID:12307 Activity:nil |
2/18 We're looking to hire a couple software engineers.
Downtown San Jose. Please see /csua/pub/jobs/GlobalVR |
| 2004/2/16-17 [Industry/Jobs] UID:12275 Activity:very high |
2/16 Poll, I post on motd regularly and I am a:
dropout: ...........
sysadm: .
developer: .
programmer: ...
manager/director: .
real estate:
grad student: ...
ugrad student:
\_ difference between developer and programmer?
\_ "Developer" just sounds vague and lame.
\_ Also, there are several careers that use this term,
including real estate, construction, and fundraising as
well as probably a few others.
\_ in the context of this poll, developer should be the same as
programmer. I don't know why the poll writer is distinguishing
them, probably in ACADEMIA for too long, when INDUSTRY is where
you make the big bux.
\_ op had developer, I added "programmer" because "developer"
is such a stupid title. It's like being an "sales associate"
at a store instead of being a goddamn "clerk".
\_ do you think there's a difference between programmer and
software engineer?
\_ In a word, yes.
software developer > computer programmer > developer, coder
> programmer
\_ IMO, best terms to use:
software engineer > software developer > computer programmer
> developer, coder > programmer
(thanks for the sw engineer suggestion) |
| 2004/2/10-12 [Industry/Jobs] UID:12186 Activity:nil |
2/9 A rare opportunity! WebFeat, a start-up provider of patent-pending
Knowledge Prism technology for academic, public, corporate and
government libraries currently has a position for a Software
Development Engineer. see /csua/pub/jobs/webfeat
\_ So, what, you sell shitty European automobiles over the web?
\_ More buzzwords than you can shake a stick at!
\_ Is the stick fully buzzword compliant?
\_ "Knowledge Prism technology"?
\_ Maybe marketroidian for 'data mining'?
\_ Just like on Startrek where everything is stored in data cubes.
Beam me up! |
| 2004/2/1 [Industry/Jobs, Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Motd] UID:12062 Activity:moderate |
1/31 Boring motd. Stupid technical questions, and stupid job postings.
Where's the glory? Where's the zinc?
\_ Weekend motds are slow. Most of us aren't bored enough to go through
the motions.
\_ It's the weekend. There are more censors than posters on the
weekend so there's no reason to post much. The censors got what
they wanted, at least on the weekends, a dead motd.
\_ When was there ever any zinc?
\_ There was some zinc a few days ago.
\_ Come back, Zinc! Come back!
\_ Come back, Zinc; come back! |
| 2004/2/1 [Recreation/Dating, Industry/Jobs] UID:12059 Activity:nil 66%like:12030 |
1/29 "Hey all, my girlfriend is hiring a part-time eunuchs sis admin
contractor...", see http://tinyurl.com/2f6wd |
| 2004/1/29-2/1 [Industry/Jobs] UID:12030 Activity:nil 66%like:12059 |
1/29 "Hey all, my girlfriend is hiring a part-time unix sys admin
contractor...", see /csua/pub/jobs/sysadmin
\_ I still want to know how so many women ended up in technical
management roles. I've yet to meet a single woman in such a
position with enough technical *or* management experience to
fill a piss bucket.
\_ Donna Shirley
\_ Yes, any and all men are fully qualified for these positions
no matter what. Women need not apply because sysadmins on
the motd are latent homosexuals and only want to hang around
with other men in the server room....serving each other.
\_ At Cisco three of my managers were women. All of them were
knowledgeable about the development of routing software
and network design and deployment. Two of them had 15+
years of coding experience (real coding in assembler and
c) before becoming managers. They were also the best
organized and friendliest managers I've worked for. They
always made sure that things like monthly one-on-ones
occured, that reviews were taken care of in a timely
fashion, that people weren't overworked, necessary equip.
\_ I'm glad your experience was different from mine. However,
you don't have enough evidence to claim "most women" are
highly competent or anything else. You got lucky, IMO.
\_ I interned at Cisco and noticed lots of female managers. This
is consistent w/ other places I've worked as well. From exper,
I see that women can be just as technical as men, but that
more often than not they also possess other skills that male
engineers lack. These skills include organizational and ppl
skills. --likes working with women and men
\_ Is she HAWT?
was available &c.
No doubt some women (and many men) who are incompetent
become mgrs but most women who become mgrs. are given
that position because they are highly competent. |
| 2004/1/27-2/1 [Industry/Jobs] UID:11952 Activity:nil |
1/26 Undergrad SysAdmin & Web Development Position Available in EECS/ERL
/csua/pub/jobs/EECSERL
\_ doesn't seem to be readable.
\_ Thus the need for the sysadmin.... |
| 2004/1/26-2/1 [Computer/SW/Languages/Java, Industry/Jobs] UID:11948 Activity:nil |
1/26 Some cool jobs at DemandTec in Redwood City / San Carlos.
http://www.demandtec.com/contact/engineering.html
Applied math, CS theory, distributed systems, UI, etc...
We also do lots of Operations Research and Stat. Send me your
resume if you are interested. -- joshk
\_ (We also have some unposted openings for general CS types) |
| 2004/1/14-15 [Industry/Jobs] UID:11781 Activity:nil |
1/13 Windows network driver/NDIS senior developer, 5 years experience
needed. Mail wck@genp.com (recruiter).
\_ Uh... What the FUCK is recruiter scum doing on the motd? |
| 2004/1/7-14 [Industry/Jobs] UID:11703 Activity:nil |
1/6 Java Development Engineer position available at PlanetOut.
/csua/pub/jobs/PlanetOut
Ask me out if you have any question. -ausman |
| 2003/12/31-2004/1/6 [Industry/Jobs] UID:11634 Activity:nil |
12/31 I'd like to see more Berkeley grads work at AMZN so I'm announcing this
one more time. Anyone here looking for a job? AMZN is aggressively
hiring SDE IIs and IIIs right now. Pretty much all positions are up in
Seattle though. Send me your resume and I'll refer you -larryl
\_ I thought they are expanding down in the Bay Area?
\_ I believe they have announced moving a small search division
there. Don't count on too many positions though.
\_ what are SDE's?
\_ Software Development Engineer (as opposed to hardware, tech
support)
\_ What is a "SDE"?
\_ Software Development Engineer?
\_ http://www.hyperdictionary.com/computing/sde
Software Development Environment
\_ http://www.lsc.co.uk/otherinformation/glossary.html#s
Shared Data Environment
\_ Maybe no one wants to work with someone who is such a moron he
uses stock symbols for company names. Doesn't it hurt when
someone asks you where you work and you choke on saying AMZN and
cover them in spit and they beat the shit out of you?
wierd. They seemed more like recent initiates into a religious
\_ What world do you live in where anyone cares about this crap?!
\_ I don't know about that. I have never met larryl. I did live for
in Seattle for two and half years. The Amazon kids were a little
weird. They seemed more like recent initiates into a religious
cult than employees. Anybody else have this impression?
\_ I thought using AMZN was okay.
\_ Well AMZN we at least get. What about SDE ?
\_ I emailed larryl a tongue-in-cheek letter asking him
what amazon was doing with second order stochastic
differential equations, it was the only thing I could
think of when I saw SDE-II. First time I saw his post
I thought it was some sort of brokerage firm looking
for a math person to do voodoo forcasting on stocks.
If said person is really serious about looking for
candidates, he should post a complete description
written in standard english to the motd and to
the /csua/pub/jobs directory. I mean seriously, stop
wasting other people's time if you're just fucking around.
--williamc
\_ Isn't "wasting other people's time if you're just
fucking around" exactly what you were doing with
your "tongue-in-cheek letter"?
\_ You fruits are all lame. He's offering a referral to work at a
stable, reputable company, even if you have to move to Seattle.
I also had no problem with reading the terms "AMZN" and "SDE II".
\_ So what is an SDE II? Why not say s/w engineer or s/w
developer? "SDE II" is too fucking formal for the motd. What's
the difference between an "SDE II" and an "SDE III" (or an
"SDE I" for that matter)?
\_ If you don't know what it stands for, just ask. No need
to resort to profanity (too formal of a word for you?).
I thought it's nice gesture. And to people who have
\_ Well AMZN we at least get. What about SDE ?
--williamc
worked for a while, SDE, SQA are quite common terms.
Have you thought of the possibility that he was
trying to filter out people who have no prior experience?
\_ 9 years experience and never heard of SDE. You ever
hear of MTS?
\_ You know, it's okay to be ignorant. No one's going
to hold it against you if you have to ask what a given
acronym means. You can even do it politely without
profanity!
\_ Here's a good acronym: FOAD
\_ Member of Technical Staff |
| 2003/12/30-31 [Industry/Jobs] UID:11610 Activity:nil |
12/29 Anyone here looking for a job? My employer, AMZN is looking for
SDE II hires. Lemme know if you're interested -larryl
\_ what's an SDE II? software developer E?
\_ software development engineer?
\_ more like Sucker of Dicks, Extraordinaire.
\_ what's that pay these days?
\_ 70k
\_ Whatever happend to Sean Welch? Is he still there? -ausman |
| 2003/12/12-16 [Industry/Jobs] UID:11436 Activity:nil |
12/12 Any one know of any job openings for a unix kernel developer
strengths in networking and storage? Thanks. --jwm
\_ every once in a while I see something on craigslist for
this type of job.
\_ checked procket, juniper, cisco ?
\_ also check ironport.
\_ EMC? |
| 2003/11/15-16 [Industry/Jobs, Transportation/Car/Hybrid] UID:11097 Activity:nil |
11/15 When IT jobs disappear
http://news.com.com/2010-1022-5106494.html
\_ All this lumping of IT together is inane. Just because few car
manufacturing jobs are left in the US doesn't mean all car jobs are
gone. If you're not the brains behind your company, or you're not
doing a job that requires you to be on-site, you might as well be
manufacturing buggy-whips. Otherwise, your job is likely safe...for
now.
\_ la la la! I'm a sysadmin, not a java monkey, la la la, gotta
be on site, got job security, la la la! One day I'll also be
fat *and* a libertarian! --skinny employed onsite sysadmin
\_ But how much money do you make?
\_ $120k/year with a raise coming by Xmas. You? -seos |
| 2003/11/1 [Industry/Jobs] UID:10893 Activity:nil |
10/31 I want to start a professional society that finds the most painfully
hideous implementations of various electrical engineering practices
and tracks down the engineer responsible and shouts at them on speaker
phone after getting rip roaring drunk. any takers?
\_ what's it called?
\_ I'll figure that out when I sober up. |
| 2003/10/25-26 [Industry/Jobs, Industry/Startup] UID:10786 Activity:nil |
10/25 Had an interview yesterday with a startup. It was just like 1998!
Go go gadget economy go!
\_ where?
\_ hah! not a chance! *I* found it, its my 1998 startup and I
aint telling! --op
\_ Top Dog!
\_ Top Dog isn't a startup. Squirrel-on-a-stick, on the other
hand....
\_ 1. Kill Squirrels
2. ?????
3. Profit!
\_ Arf! Arf!
\_ 2. Put squirrel on stick?
\_ Hey! That was under NDA! You're so sued!
\_ Dude, seriously, you *CAN'T* put a patent on
*squirrels*.
\_ we didn't patent squirrels but we have a
patent pending business method that involves
them. I can't give you details yet but think
of: squirrels, the net, and one-click and
you're halfway there.
\_ See US patent number D369,202,
"The ornamental design for a squirrel skinner,
as shown and described."
http://www.uspto.gov
Why am i not suprised this guy is from West
Virginia?
\_ I'm speechless. Just...speechless.
\_ You're not surprised because you're a hater?
\_ http://web.wt.net/~psherr/squirrel_hazing.htm |
| 2003/10/22-27 [Industry/Jobs] UID:10733 Activity:nil |
10/21 Positions available at Zone Labs updated.
Positions include Unix device driver developer,
NDIS device driver developer, security researcher, QA engineer (2),
java developer (2), content analyst, and Sr. engineering manager.
See ~sky/jobs or email sking@zonelabs.com for details.
--sky
\_ jobs@freebsd.org
\_ We love you sky!
\_ Right on...he's OUR sky!
\_ WOOT!!!! --sky #1 Fan
\_ Uhhh..uh..uh...uhhh...fuggit -Sparky |
| 2003/10/8-9 [Industry/Jobs, Academia/GradSchool, Computer/SW/OS/Linux] UID:10530 Activity:low |
10/7 Anybody know of a free solids-modeling application for Linux?
\_ you can try poop. either your own, or someone else's if they're
willing to donate it. best when not too wet, but not too dry.
and the best part is it's totally free and cross-platform.
\_ of course if poop were really a Linux application, there
would now follow a two page flame war about dog poop vs.
horse poop. |
| 2003/10/1-3 [Industry/Jobs] UID:29551 Activity:nil |
10/01 http://www.taprootfoundation.org/about/index.shtml Has anyone here tried working with these guys? It sounds like a great idea in principle that is very difficult to pull off well in practice; I'm curious -- is it actually working? |
| 2003/10/1-3 [Industry/Jobs] UID:10405 Activity:low |
10/1 http://www.taprootfoundation.org/about/index.shtml Has anyone here tried working with these guys? It sounds like a great idea in principle that is very difficult to pull off well in practice; I'm curious -- is it actually working? *@,,,,,,.,,,,,*,##@@##*@@@@@@@#@@*+,,,,,#@@@:::::::::::::::::..... *W,,,,,,.,,,,,+*######@@W@@@WW@@W@W,,,,,#@@@:::::::::::+::::::::+. *@,,,,,..,,,,,**@@#@#@@@@WWWWWWWW@@:,,,,#@@#+:+:+::::::::::::.:::. *W,,,,,,.,,,,+WW@@@@@@W@@WWWWWWWWWW@W:,,#@@#+++++++:::+:+:::::+++: *@,,,,,..,,,##@#*@@#@@W@@WWWWWWWWWWWW.#.@@@#+::+++++:+:+::::::...: *@,,,,,..,,@####@##W@@W@W@WWWWWWWWWW@W*:#@@#::+::+::+::+::::::+:.. #W,,,,,..,**#**@@@W@W@WWW@WWWWWWWWWWWW@:#@@#+::+++++:++:+::::::::: *W*+:.,+:,*#**@@@##@@@WW@#@@@WWW@WWWWWW,#@@*+++:+++++++++::::::::: *W,,,,,::**#*#@****@#@##@##@@W@#W@W@@@@@#@@*++:++++++++++::::::::: *W,,,,,::+W+@##*#@@#####@#@##@WW@WWW@@#@#@@+:++++++++++++:::::+:+: *W,,,,,.*::#@@+#*@#**+++*:++:+**##@W##@@@#W+:+++:+++++++++:::::+:: *W,,,,,.+*+@#++*@@*++:::::::::::++*@W@@@W*@+:++++++++++++++:::+++: #W,,,,,+:++#*:*@#@*+:::....:::::::+*@*W@W#@+++++++++++++++:::::++: #@,,,,,+::*@#*#@@#+::..........:::+**WW@@##+++++++++++++++::::+++: #@,,,,.::+WW**+@@#+::.......,...:::+*WW@@#*++:++++++++++++::::::+: #@,,,,.:+@@@#+:*##+::...........:::+#WW@@**+:+++++++++++++:::::::: #W,,,,:.+@@@*+:##@*:::..........:::+#WW@#*@+++++++++++++++::::+:+: #@,,,,:+*W@#+:.#@+++::........:.::+*@WW#**@:++++++++++++++:::::::: #@,,,.::@#@*+,:@@#*+::*#@#+:..:::#@@@W##@#@:++++++++++++++::::+++: #@,,,::+#@#*+.:@@***++....+#:.::++**#@@W@@@::+++++++++++++:::::+:: #@:,,::+*@W*++:@****:::#@W*:..::WW+W@@W*+@@::++++++++++++++:::+:+: #@..:::+@@#+++:##**+:*W##,*::.:*@@+@W@W@###::::++++++++++++::::::: #W,,.:::#@:**::+***+:::@@@+::.:+:::+@@#+@@@::::::+++++++++::::+++: ##,..:.:#W*#*:++##**:.....:::.:+:::+WW@###W:::::++++++++++++:::::: *W.::*:+*@*##:++@@@+:.......:.:+::::WW@@#@@::+:::+++++++++++::+::: *@.+*+:+*####**#@@#+:....:::..:++::+WW@##@@::::+:+:+++++++++:::+:: *+:+#++*+##@*:*#@@#*::...:....:+:::+W@W#**#++:::+:+++++++++::::++: +*.+++*#:##@*@@#@@#*+:....+:::::+:::W@WW*@@::::++++++++++++:::+::: *:+*+*##.@#@##@#@@@*+:...::.....++:WW@@@*@#::::::++++++++++:::++:: **:#+*#*.@*@@@@#W@#*+:..:::::..:++:*@@@@##@:::::+:++++++++:::::++: ++:*:+#*+@#@@#@#@@#*::::..:::++:+:+W@@@@@*@#+::::++++++++++::::++: #+**:*#@*@@W@@@@@@#*::.:@#::+#**#:WWW@#W@@#@*:::::++++++++:+:::+:: +*#*+*@@@@WW@#@*#@#*::...*#*,,@#+*:*@W*@#@*@W::+::::+++++++:::++:: +:#**#W@@@#@@+@#@@*#+::...++**+#:@*@@.W@#@#@@*:+++++++++++++:::::: **+**@###@*@#@@+*@*+*::.::..***:+@@@@*##@#*+#+:+++++++++++++:::::: ++*+*#**#W#+##+:@#*+:+:......:::W@W@@@+*W#++@+++++++++++++++:::::: +++*W++#*@+:#@#*##*+:::::....::.@+W@#*+*#****+++++++++++++++:::::: ++*#*+#++@:*@@#.***+::::::..::.W@@:@#*@@@#*:*++++++++++++++++::::: *+*@@+@**W@@+@#@+:#+::::+*:::*@W,*,@@#*@@@++:++:++++++++++++:::::: ++:W:W:#*W@.*@*:#***:::++++.++*##*,*@#:@@@+++++++++++++++++++::::: ++::,@:@*@@W##+#**+*::++++*+::*##*.,,+*@+W:*+++++++++++++++++::::: :*@:,#+@*+W@:*++*+*@++:+++*#+:#**#,,,.*@@.#*+:++++++++++++++++:::: ,+#+:+*#+:W@@*:*@+#*#+:+++++*+***#@,,,.@@####@W++++++++++++++::::: +++@+##@##WW@*:+@##@:+****++******#@,,:@#W@WWW#+*+++++++++++++:::: *:+++.#@W@WW#@+##+#*@*+***+++******#@:.@@WWWWWW@#:*++*++++++++:++: #*+:+#*@W@W*@#***#**##@+++++++******#@@@@@@@@@WWW#,@++*+++++++++:: ***:+@@@WW###+@###+*+*:+:::+++******##@@@@@@@@##@W#*##++++++++:+++ *#+#+@:@@@##+*#*@**:++*++::++++******##@@@#######@#W+,@++++++:+::: +**++WW###*++++*+#**+#+:+++++++*******########*#####@@,*++++++++++ +:+::@@#**++::::++*#@+++*.++++++********#####******###W,#+++++:++: *:*::@##*++::::::+#+*#::.::++++++++*****##***********#*W::++++++++ +:*.+##*++::.:::::*#++**:,.++++:+++***+****************#@+,+++++++ ::*:#*#+:.......::#*:++:.:*.+++:++****+********+**********:@++++++ ++*+##+:........+*+*:+.:#:,.+++++++*********+**++*+******@+*#+++++ +##*#+...........:+*:::::,+:,+++***##@###***++++++++*****##+#+++++ *###+......,,,,..::*+:+::@.+#:+**#####@@@#**++++++++++****@*+@++++ **#:....,,,,,,,,..++.::.:+,..,#*#########@#*++++++++++****#@#:@+++ *+::...,,,,,,,,,..:+:*.:::@.,+.###******####**++++++++*****@+*#+++ *::....,,,,,,,,..:+::..::+@::,+@##*********###*++++++++****#+##*++ :....,.,,,,,,,...:::::.::+#@@..:,##****+****###++::++++++**#W@*#** .....,,,,,,,....:.::...::*##:*+::+,+#*********##*+:+++++++**#+**** ....,,,,,,,,...:::::.:.::*#+:::+:.*,,,.++++****##*::::+++++**+@##* ...,,,,,,,,,...::...:.:.:*#*.+*:,*.:,,:.*+++*****#*::::++++**#,**# ..,,,,,,,,,...:::...::.:+**:.+:+:+.,,..,.,+++++*****::::++++*#+++# ,,,,,,,,,,....:::::..:::***.#:*+:..:..,,,,:,#+++****+:::++++*@,+*# ,,,,,,,,,,...:++++:::::+*:,:+:+.:,*.,.::,::*:,@#****#::::+++*@,:+# ,,,,,,,,,...:++++*+::::++.+::,,@+:,:+,:,.,.,,:...#***#:::++++@..:# ,,,,,,,,,..:++++:::::::++...*:+++.,*,...,,,,...:+,*****:+:+++@.::# ,,,,,,,....++:::::.:::++.,,**.:::++..+,.,.:,,+.:,,+@@*#:+:++**.*+# ,,,,,,,...:*+++::..::+**+#,++*+**...:,:.,.,.,.+,@,#+#**#+:++*.,:+# ,,,,,,...:***++:::::+++,,,,..,.:,*++.,:,,,,..,,,#*+@.:*#:+++@,:+:. ,,..,,..:,****+:::::++*:+,.,,*..*.:+.+,,,,*,..+,+:*.@@.:++++#.+,.. ,..,,...,,****++::++**.,,,,,,,:+.,*+:.,*,+,,,,,,*++#*,@#:++@..*,,, .,,,,..***:+**++++++*+.+..,,,.+:,.::+..,.:,,*,+*+#+*#@+*+:*#,+,,,, ,.,...*,,,,++++++++*+::,,.,,,,,+,....+.,+,+,+,.*+.*+::,#,*W@:,..,, ,.,,..*,,,,+++++++***:,,:,,,,*,.,:,.::+.,+,#*,#+*:*@,@*,#+#,+,,,,, ,,...,#,,,,.++++++***+,,,,.,,,,,,.,.+,..,+:*:+.:#.@.:,,**,@@,,,.,, ,,..,,#,,,,,++++++**+,,,,,,,:,:,,,,.,:+,:,:*.+:#:+#:@.+,,**,,,,,,, ,,,,,,@,,,,,.++++***#*,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,.:::#.:.:@@:+.#,.*@.,,,,,,, ,..,,,@,,,,,:.+++*****,+,,,.,:,,,,,,,,:::+,*,+.,#,,+,**#+:,,,,,,,, ,.,,,,@,,,,,+,:++***#,#,.,,,,,,,,,,,,,.,.:++,+,**:*,*,*,*#,,,,,,,, .,,,,,@,,,,,:+.:++**,*,*,.,,,,,.:,:,,,.,,,:*,..*+*++.*..*,,,,,,,,, .,,,,,#,,,,,+*#,*+**#++,#,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,.,,#,@.+:@+#.*,+*,,,,,,,,, *,,,,,#,,,,.+**@,:,*#*,+,,,:,,,,,,.,,,,,,,,:,@,*:,*,*.:@,,,,,,,,,, +,,,,,#,,,,:+++**@,,#*,#,:#,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,.,,+*:#,*,**+,,,,,,,,,, W*:,,,*,,,,+:++++*#@,+#,#,#,*,,,,,,,,,:,,,..,,,,*.*.++,::,,,,,,,,, +.,..+W**+.::++:++*###W++#*@:+*#,,,,,,,,,,,:,,,,..,.@+..,,,,,,,,,, +,,,,,+,,,+::::::+++*#+.+@:@.**,+,:,,,,..,,:,.:*.,:+.,.:.,,,,,,,,, +,,,,,+,,,::::::::::+*#*#:+*#+*,#,,,.,,:,.,.,,+:..+,*,,.,,,,,,,,,, :,,,,,:,,.::::::::::+:+*+.+@*:##+*++*,,,,,,.,,:.,++,,.,..,,,,,,,,, :,,,,,:,#::::::::::::::++::,**.@.W##..,,,.,:,,:.*..,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, :,,,,..,,,+:::::::.:::::::++::++#:@.:+:.+,+,*.#::..,:,,,,,,,,,,,,, :.,,,,.,*:,:::........:::::::++**+++**+**+,.+,,,*,,..,,,,,,,,,,,,, :.,,,,:,,,..,+::......:.:::::++++++++++*,,,,,,,,.,+,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, \_ Truly a great end to a great Day In the Life of the motd. \_ Oh yeah? How about: 8888 8888888 888888888888888888888888 8888:::8888888888888888888888888 8888::::::8888888888888888888888888888 88::::::::888:::8888888888888888888888888 88888888::::8:::::::::::88888888888888888888 888 8::888888::::::::::::::::::88888888888 888 88::::88888888::::m::::::::::88888888888 8 888888888888888888:M:::::::::::8888888888888 88888888888888888888::::::::::::M88888888888888 8888888888888888888888:::::::::M8888888888888888 8888888888888888888888:::::::M888888888888888888 8888888888888888::88888::::::M88888888888888888888 88888888888888888:::88888:::::M888888888888888 8888 88888888888888888:::88888::::M::;o*M*o;888888888 88 88888888888888888:::8888:::::M:::::::::::88888888 8 88888888888888888::::88::::::M:;:::::::::::888888888 8888888888888888888:::8::::::M::aAa::::::::M8888888888 8 88 8888888888::88::::8::::M:::::::::::::888888888888888 8888 88 88888888888:::8:::::::::M::::::::::;::88:88888888888888888 8 8888888888888:::::::::::M::"@@@@@@@"::::8w8888888888888888 88888888888:888::::::::::M:::::"@a@":::::M8i888888888888888 8888888888::::88:::::::::M88:::::::::::::M88z88888888888888888 8888888888:::::8:::::::::M88888:::::::::MM888!888888888888888888 888888888:::::8:::::::::M8888888MAmmmAMVMM888*88888888 88888888 888888 M:::::::::::::::M888888888:::::::MM88888888888888 8888888 8888 M::::::::::::::M88888888888::::::MM888888888888888 88888 888 M:::::::::::::M8888888888888M:::::mM888888888888888 8888 888 M::::::::::::M8888:888888888888::::m::Mm88888 888888 8888 88 M::::::::::::8888:88888888888888888::::::Mm8 88888 888 88 M::::::::::8888M::88888::888888888888:::::::Mm88888 88 8 MM::::::::8888M:::8888:::::888888888888::::::::Mm8 4 8M:::::::8888M:::::888:::::::88:::8888888::::::::Mm 2 88MM:::::8888M:::::::88::::::::8:::::888888:::M:::::M 8888M:::::888MM::::::::8:::::::::::M::::8888::::M::::M 88888M:::::88:M::::::::::8:::::::::::M:::8888::::::M::M 88 888MM:::888:M:::::::::::::::::::::::M:8888:::::::::M: 8 88888M:::88::M:::::::::::::::::::::::MM:88::::::::::::M XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX Go Do Your Homework. XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX 888 MM:::::::MMM::::::::::::::::MM:::MM:::::::::::::::M 88 M::::::::MMMM:::::::::::MMMM:::::MM::::::::::::MM 88 MM:::::::::MMMMMMMMMMMMMMM::::::::MMM::::::::MMM 88 MM::::::::::::MMMMMMM::::::::::::::MMMMMMMMMM 88 8MM::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::MMMMMM 8 88MM::::::::::::::::::::::M:::M::::::::MM 888MM::::::::::::::::::MM::::::MM::::::MM 88888MM:::::::::::::::MMM:::::::mM:::::MM 888888MM:::::::::::::MMM:::::::::MMM:::M 88888888MM:::::::::::MMM:::::::::::MM:::M 88 8888888M:::::::::MMM::::::::::::::M:::M 8 888888 M:::::::MM:::::::::::::::::M:::M: 888888 M::::::M:::::::::::::::::::M:::MM 888888 M:::::M::::::::::::::::::::::::M:M 888888 M:::::M:::::::::@::::::::::::::M::M 88888 M::::::::::::::@@:::::::::::::::M::M 88888 M::::::::::::::@@@::::::::::::::::M::M 88888 M:::::::::::::::@@::::::::::::::::::M::M 88888 M:::::m::::::::::@::::::::::Mm:::::::M:::M 8888 M:::::M:::::::::::::::::::::::MM:::::::M:::M 8888 M:::::M:::::::::::::::::::::::MMM::::::::M:::M 888 M:::::Mm::::::::::::::::::::::MMM:::::::::M::::M 8888 MM::::Mm:::::::::::::::::::::MMMM:::::::::m::m:::M 888 M:::::M::::::::::::::::::::MMM::::::::::::M::mm:::M 8888 MM:::::::::::::::::::::::::MM:::::::::::::mM::MM:::M: M:::::::::::::::::::::::::M:::::::::::::::mM::MM:::Mm MM::::::m:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::M::MM:::MM M::::::::M:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::M::M:::MM MM:::::::::M:::::::::::::M:::::::::::::::::::::M:M:::MM XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX Weren't you supposed to do XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX your homework? XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX M:::::::::::::::::::M::::::::::::::::::::::::::MMM MM:::::::::::::::::M::::::::::::::::::::::::::MMM M:::::::::::::::::M::::::::::::::::::::::::::MMM MM:::::::::::::::M::::::::::::::::::::::::::MMM M:::::::::::::::M:::::::::::::::::::::::::MMM MM:::::::::::::M:::::::::::::::::::::::::MMM M:::::::::::::M::::::::::::::::::::::::MMM MM:::::::::::M::::::::::::::::::::::::MMM M:::::::::::M:::::::::::::::::::::::MMM MM:::::::::M:::::::::::::::::::::::MMM M:::::::::M::::::::::::::::::::::MMM MM:::::::M::::::::::::::::::::::MMM MM::::::M:::::::::::::::::::::MMM MM:::::M:::::::::::::::::::::MMM MM::::M::::::::::::::::::::MMM MM:::M::::::::::::::::::::MMM MM::M:::::::::::::::::::MMM MM:M:::::::::::::::::::MMM MMM::::::::::::::::::MMM MM::::::::::::::::::MMM M:::::::::::::::::MMM MM::::::::::::::::MMM MM:::::::::::::::MMM MM::::M:::::::::MMM: mMM::::MM:::::::MMMM MMM:::::::::::MMM:M mMM:::M:::::::M:M:M MM::MMMM:::::::M:M MM::MMM::::::::M:M mMM::MM::::::::M:M MM::MM:::::::::M:M MM::MM::::::::::M:m |
| 2003/9/26-30 [Industry/Jobs, Computer/SW/Languages/C_Cplusplus] UID:10344 Activity:kinda low |
9/26 I am looking to hire several experienced C developers to work on
a network security product and a financial (stock trading) application.
If you or anyone you know is looking for a job please email a resume to
rjchu@hightowersoftware.com
\_ Wow. Is it an embedded product? Or a legacy one? Are you sure it's
in C?
on C?
\_ It's gotta be .NET/C#/F# or Java
\_ !C != .NET/C#/F# or Java
\_ You're just jealous because you don't have 10+ years of
\_ I have 15+ years of Java, C#, and .NET!
\_ Do you have over 10 years of HTML?
on C?
\_ It's gotta be .NET/C#/F# or Java
\_ !C != .NET/C#/F# or Java
C# or .NET technologies and innovations on your resume.
\_ yeah, it didn't even exists until 3 yrs ago
\_ [ Someone discovering America by opening their window ] |
| 2003/9/17 [Computer/SW/Unix, Industry/Jobs] UID:10220 Activity:nil |
9/16 Related to the evaluation question below, how do you answer the
interview question "what are your weaknesses"? I've gotten that
from two different guys at the same company before and it was kinda
painful because they really, really pushed deep on that question.
\_ Do like they did on The Simpsons. "I'm a workaholic."
\_ "My weakness is I refuse to work with doofuses who ask
lame-ass questions like 'what are your weaknesses'?"
\_ "I survived UC Berkeley where we kill the weak and eat their still
beating hearts! I have no weaknesses, little man! What pathetic
'school' did *you* go to?" It doesn't really matter what you say.
You're dealing with some doofus and every answer can be turned
into the wrong answer. You can say something like, "well my
girlfriend sometimes gets upset that I'm such a take-charge
gung-ho kinda guy when we make plans but she always has fun!"
All answers are stupid, just try to avoid giving an axe-murderer
answer.
\_ These were the two highest-ranking tech godfathers at this co.
If you had said that "take charge" answer they'd scoff and
make you give a *real* weakness. Oh well, fuck 'em I guess.
One of them spent about half the interview on that question,
and the rest questioning my "passion for engineering" and why
I'm an engineer etc... unfortunately rather close to home tho.
\_ I'm 28 and a software engineer, and I want to work with
"good" people more than get a salary. The fact that they're
asking these meta-questions might suggest that they're
concerned with what your life goals and attitudes are,
have you figured it out. It's just a job, but you
spend half your life at work, so I can see why.
\_ No, it means the interviewers are lazy and/or
inexperienced. However, your answer is correct. -John
\_ I've had the exact same thing happen to me when I gave some
clever variation on the 'work too hard' line. So I told him
I'm smart and have low tolerance for people who are
intentionally stupid. Not stupid people, but people who
play dumb for political or other reasons. I got an offer,
but I don't think that had anything to do with it. I think
he was just filling time and feeling self important.
\_ yeah. btw i needed *3* weaknesses. well, it actually
taught me how to be better prepared for interviews.
it's all about attitude.
\_ 3? That's fucking crazy. "Gee, I'm not that flawed".
\_ a more specific question would have been
"tell me 3 things your co-workers hate about you"
\_ the standard answer is: "I work too hard...". not inspiring or
original, but it works. if yer just outta skewl, mention that
you spent all yer time in the computer lab. don't mention the
B.O. problem.
\_ a good manager (read, the kind of manageryou want to work with)
knows that different people are happier doing different things.
Questions like this aren't ment to be ducked. What they are trying
to get at is "What sort of stuff do you do poorly? What sort of
stuff do you just not enjoy doing?" Yeah saying something like
"I goof off half the day and get everything done late" is stupid
but a real answer like "when I'm working on a project with a bad
debugging environment my productivity drops really bad" would,
say let them know you might do better at being a server coding
person that working with some proprierty scripting system that
doesn't have real tools. They want people, not pretend workaholics
who will leave in disgust six months later because they treated
management as roadblocks to be worked around, and somehow, gee,
that made work a nightmare.
\_ This is probably true but I've never had the pleasure of working
with a "good" manager. Then again, I'm in civil engineering, not
coding. The consensus among those I've talked to is that the
weakness question is the interviewer getting in an early stab at
establishing pecking order. They, after all, will never have to
answer such a ridiculous question of themselves from you. If you
want the job, have your canned answer ready and don't be worried
that it's not exactly honest. They're not looking for honesty.
They're looking for you to subvert your ego for the "team". You
may, however, want to consider whether this is the sort of
situation where you'd like to work, if you have a choice in the
matter. In the current times, nobody in my business really has
much choice.
\_ I had a good manager once. I can barely remember what it was
like.... Maybe we had the same one since I think there's only
about 3 out there. |
| 2003/9/17 [Industry/Jobs, Academia/GradSchool, Academia/Berkeley/Classes] UID:10219 Activity:nil |
9/16 New Graduate Salary Survey Quiz. What was your starting salary if
you've graduated in the last two years with a CS or EECS degree?
< 35K:
35-40K:
40-45K:
45-50K:
50-55K:
55-60K:
60-65K: .
\_ 2 years ago, didn't graduate.
65-70K: .
\_ and my company is hiring if anyone is interested
\_ which company?
\_ hm, it seems we have a ucla ee/cs guy problem
> 70K: .
still looking for a job: . |
| 2003/9/12-13 [Industry/Jobs] UID:10171 Activity:nil |
9/12 Has the job market in CS begun to recover, esp. in the bay area?
I am not in CS myself but a friend asked me this question.
\- yes, if you have mad gis skillz.
\_ Talented people can get jobs. NCG's can get jobs. People who
are midlevel are still doomed.
\_ What's "NCG"?
\_ New College Grad?
\_ If you don't know someone on the inside, fahget about it. |
| 2003/9/10-14 [Industry/Jobs] UID:10139 Activity:nil |
9/10 Senior software engineer opening at Yahoo!:
"We are looking for a experienced, self-motivated engineer to join the
team to work on local search. You'll be a member of a team design and
implement all aspect of a distributed system for location based
content. Applicant should have BSCS/MSCS, 5+ years industrial
experience, excellent communication skills. Extensive experience in
C/C++, Perl, MySQL, Apache, XML on UNIX platform is required. Knowledge
of PHP and geographical information system(GIS) is a plus."
- Please send resume or questions to eyip
\_ Don't they mean 'industry experience'? Or do they want someone who
has been a factory worker?
\_ Sounds like they want a geography major who is also a programming
guru. But wait, they say they want a BS/MS in CS. But *none* of
them will have GIS skills which are very specific to geographers
and only a subset of those. They don't know what they want and
won't find it, especially now that the market is tightening up.
A big "fuck you!" to all employers with insane job requirements for
the last 3+ years.
\_ dude, chill. they just said it is a "plus", not a requirement
and i'm sure there are muliple coders out there who have worked
with GIS because they aren't the first to write related code.
\_ Plus always means required. And required means must have
all bizarre and unrelated skills at 100%. And oh yeah, we
didn't really have funding for that job anyway, we're just
trying to fool our competitors into thinking we're doing
better than we really are.
\- helo, i dont think that is ness true. i'm not a cs major
or geography major but i have some "gis experience"
\- i dont think that is really true. i'm not a cs major or
a geography major but i have some "gis experience"
[ooh, bad flashback]. the commercial software isnt
that well written [the unix platform stuff was really
leem. it was eventually moved to windows and i got off
of the project] so maybe the expectations are low in
this area. a lot of statisticians use this stuff and
they do a lot of programming, so while maybe it will
coalescing on low latency paths but i dont think
be rare to find someone who knows a *lot* about GIS
and know a lot about say the effects of interrupt
\_ there has been at least one reasonable berkeley hack who
graduated with a geography degree, so the combination exists.
coalescing on low latency networks but i dont think
general programming experience and moderate GIS exp
is particularly rare. ok tnx. |
| 2003/8/29-30 [Industry/Jobs] UID:10015 Activity:moderate |
8/29 How do I deal with a co-worker who is delegating his responsibliities
to me and then taking credit for the work afterwards? He's the
Director of Architecture and had me write an architecture document.
When I showed him the nearly completed doc, he essentially said to me
"thanks, you know it wouldn't be right for you to present this to
Engineering. I'll go ahead and present it."
\_ If he's not your boss, how did he "have you" do it?
\_ set him up... put "this document was written in full by XXX XXXXX"
in the footers of every page after page 10.
\_ It's too late for this one, but you need to network with Engineering
and discuss what you're working on. If you get highjacked, piss and
moan to them.
\_ Is this your boss? If so, there is nothing you can do. That is
what bosses do, they get people to do work for them and then
take credit for it. The most you can hope for is a pat on the
back from him and a raise when the time is due. If this is not
your boss, complain to your boss.
\_ He's not my boss. I did just complain to my boss in my weekly
TPS report. And thus far, my solution to this was to name the
new architecture after myself. -op
\_ I'm a 'boss' and I always try to give my employees more credit
than they are do... I routinely say "we did X" when it was really
me doing X and then showing someone how to support X. Maybe
\_ it's an easy enough task to show that you wrote the document
by showing greater understanding of it than he does. Having
a good opportunity to do it is the problem. btdt ... --Jon
\_ You got burned on this one but you can do damage recovery by doing
things like mailing the engineers and asking if they had any
questions about your documentation. In the future, keep in touch
with them as you write it, show them drafts, etc along the way and
when this asshole says it wouldn't be appropriate, grill him on it
and ask why not? If it's a written doc that they'll get and he
only has a paper copy you can stick your name all over it. Don't
give up the original doc. "It wouldn't be appropriate for me to
give you my original source material".
\_ is it really your architecture? ie: the content was based
on his ideas or yours? also, these things should be checked
into a Source Safe of some sort, if you did , it'll be
under your name.
\_ that's not enough. this is a political situation, not a
technical one. no one important is ever going to see the
name on the source control files. the op must get out there
and get involved and communicate with other people who matter
why I'm never promoted. -happy at the bottom of the totem pole.
\_ it's an easy enough task to show that you wrote the document
by showing greater understanding of it than he does. Having
a good opportunity to do it is the problem. btdt ... --Jon
only has a paper copy you can stick your name all over it. Don't
give up the original doc. "It wouldn't be appropriate for me to
give you my original source material".
and tell them about his plans and documents. if he continues
to be passive he'll just get crunched. if all you did was leave
your name on a source safe file, i'd steal your work, too. |
| 2003/7/22-24 [Academia/Berkeley/CSUA, Industry/Jobs] UID:29104 Activity:kinda low |
7/22 Looking for junior java developers. Limited job experience is a plus.
/csua/pub/jobs/Snapfish.junior.java
I asked and got more info: money isn't the issue. The reason for
wanting a junior level person is they need someone junior enough who
is willing to do junior level work and not quit as soon as a senior
level job comes along. They don't want to underemploy someone. This
is intended to be a good learning first/second job thing for the
employee and a reliable, smart person to do stuff that needs to be
done but no one else has time for right now. They expect/hope the
candidate will stick around long term and become senior in time.
\_ What if you've been unemployed so long you've fallen
from senior to junior. Like you've had a concussion. Is that OK?
\_ You can't succeed if you don't try. Send me a resume. I'll
pass on anything from any Berkeley alum but I'm not the hiring
manager or even in that group so I can't promise a job or an
interview. I do promise that your resume will be read by
someone else here (probably several someones) and won't get
instantly trash canned unread like many companies are doing
today. |
| 2003/7/22-27 [Computer/SW/Languages/Java, Industry/Jobs] UID:29093 Activity:kinda low 71%like:29140 85%like:29142 55%like:29155 |
7/22 Looking for junior java developers. Limited job experience is a plus.
/csua/pub/jobs/Snapfish.junior.java
\_ This is a very interesting requirement. Why prefer junior over
experienced java developers? Is it the salary factor? Or
veteran coders have bad habits? Or are veteran coders very slow?
Or Junior coders tend to work longer hours, and has no complaints?
most places are looking for over 10 years experience which I think
it's kinda dumb. So exactly why are your company so different that
seems to see the benefits of junior coders?
\_ I'm sure it's all about $$$. It always is.
\_ Money, of course, is always a factor. As far as the rest,
anyone is going to be expected to work the hours required to get
their project(s) done. I'm not on the dev team but I didn't
hear anything about bad habits or experienced people being slow,
etc. I think they already have piles of veteran coder resumes.
We don't have a problem taking junior people and training them
up on the job unlike most companies today. I guess that's the
difference. The dev team guys are all really decent. No one
is job hunting that I know of. For anything more either write
me and I'll find out or send a resume and you can ask in your
interview. I posted what I was told plus whatever else I know.
\_ Oh I see. I was only curious as your company seems to be the
only exception. From my working experience, if it were I to make
the decision, I would give UCB undergrads interviews. My working
experiences with UCB graduates are very good. And the people that
supposedly have over 10 years of coding experiences all seem
pretty lame (bad code, dumb algorith, slow and inacurrate...)--
I'm talking about only the ppl that I have worked with.
\_ Pretty much it comes down to having had good experiences
in the past hiring new college grads from quality schools.
Why pay more for 10+ years when you're happy with a NCG?
\_ you know, computer science has matured in the past 30 years that
really complex tasks can be partioned into many simple tasks.
Look at EJB, J2EE, DB, etc. Everything is just an integration
of many components that can be broken down further and further
into more specialized and simple parts, and now we can just hire
a lot of simple-minded code monkeys to do a product instead of
a few expensive PhDs. My friend, CS is becoming more and more
like the automobile industry where you only need a few designers
(software architects) and a lot of dumb assembly line workers
(code monkeys).
\_ damn, that is depressing
\_ Uhm, ok, maybe so. Please send junior java resumes. It's not
my group so I can't confirm or deny that with regards to my
company. Please send junior java resumes.
\_ In my experience intelligent programmers are hard to find
and always in demand. Sure most "progammers" slap together
a bunch of components or use some visual tool instead of
taking the time and effort required to do things intellegently.
These kinds of programmers end up causing the endless
bugs in windows, slow, bloated software, and missed deadlines.
Good programmers will always be in demand because software
development is a complex balance between speed, space,
flexibility, and cost.
\_ demand for excellence will always be there, but there
will be a much much greater demand for mediocrity.
Engineers get paid because business men say so, and
business men don't know jack about excellence. They
only understand time-to-market and marketting. |
| 2003/7/11 [Industry/Jobs] UID:29003 Activity:very high |
7.10 http://biz.yahoo.com/rb/030710/economy_6.html They say new jobless claims hit a 20-year high but i am wondering if any of this is due to the fact more people were employed during the dot-com boom so there are more potential workers out of jobs and also, is it because they are simply more people in the workplace due to population growth and the fact that the past good economy got some people to get off their lazy ass and get a job? Or are all these factors already deducted from the statistics? \_ percentages of poeple filing are really high too. The fact is that things are bad out there. \_ It's sort of like how recent movie hit all-time box office highs in ticket sales, but do they consider that tickets now average nearly $10 while in 1977 i saw Star Wars for $3.00? \_ Well, at least one site, http://boxofficemojo.com, does (Gone With The Wind is #1 all-time) \_ Yeah I hate that. \_ actual unemployment is usually a lot higher than the published the figure most of the time. Further, If a person who is too lazy to look for a job, he won't be counted as an unemployed. Population is always growing, so that is not an excuse. The real issue is that we are in a post over-produced economy, and there isn't a clear way to get out of it. History is not very encouraging, as last time we got out of the mess by declar war on Germany and Japan. \_ See? Bush is trying to get us out of the oncoming Depression! Why can't we all just help him start WW III ? \_ Anyone too lazy to look for a job (your crack mama) shouldn't count as unemployed. She goes on permanent welfare and ends up counted under a different statistic and rightly so. Part of the problem in tech is the H1b program. With zillions of qualified Americans unemployed they're still letting in foreigners under a program intended to let in foreigners only to fill jobs where no qualified American is available. And worse is abuse of the L program which has even fewer restrictions on who can come in, do what, for how long and how much. \_ what a shitty little troll you are. \_ I'm glad you took the time to respond to something that professional economists and others have pointed out for years with an empty personal attack. My points stand and you're wasting bits until you say something worth posting. \_ Businesses have cried that there aren't enough H1b visas issued! It's all about the free market; local labor prices themselves right out of it. Why pay more when you can get an H1b guy who won't complain or join unions? Are you saying that companies that are using H1b's are intentionally driving this economy down? \_ The H1b program was not created to push labor prices down. It was very specifically created to allow companies to hire foreigners when there wasn't a qualified American available. It had nothing to do with the free market or labor rates. Any other use is an abuse of the program. \_ that's how they described it but it's pretty clear that in practice it's just a cheap labor device. "qualified" and "available" in that criteria are just too hard to enforce. \_ No, there are very clear regulations that state how much effort a company must go through to try to not only hire an American but *replace* H1b workers with an American. The only problem here is abuse of the program which the feds allow by ignoring it. The difference here is that I'm talking about the law and you're just writing whatever you 'feel'. \_ His feelings are as valid as a law that is ignored. \_ No because the law could and should be enforced. His feelings should not. \_ Abuse is not the "only problem". The law itself is the problem when it is too hard to enforce/easy to abuse. God you're dumb. \_ It isn't too hard to enforce. They choose not to. Thanks for the babyish personal attack. You look so smart now. \_ Business would prefer to pay $1/hr to workers for 80 hour work weeks, are you in favor of that, too? \_ Yes, and it would work like this: There aren't that many people willing to work in those conditions, and there would be a labor shortage. To attract more workers, businesses would raise wages and/or give other benefits, until a balance was reached. Free market all the way. \_ Let's see, there are 800 M Chinese willing to work for $1/hr and 100M Americans who are not. How low do you think wages would go under your plan? \_ who the hell are you to cry about your artificially high wages?? If businesses *want* to lose money they can overpay for american workers. Get some more marketable skills; not all workers add the same value to a company. \_ There are so skill so marketable that your job can't be outsourced for less to a third world country. What set of skills should we all go get that can't be sent overseas? |
| 2003/6/12-13 [Industry/Jobs] UID:28714 Activity:low |
6/11 A friend's company is hiring recent CS grads. If you're
interested, contact him directly:
----- Forwarded message-----
> We are a privately funded technology startup looking for a
> summer intern - a CS graduate who is capable of designing,
> developing and testing web-based applications.
> Strong perl/python and sql programming skills, good
> understanding of databases, good knowledge of Unix/Linux,
> willingness to code with an awareness of scaling
> requirements.
> Please send resumes to marietta@everesttech.net
\_ So they want someone with 5+ years experience?
\_ As far as I know, they would hire a fresh grad. I'm
sure that the requirements above are more of a wish
list.
\_ where is it? Locations matter!
\_ Mountain View. |
| 2003/6/9-10 [Industry/Jobs] UID:28683 Activity:very high |
6/9 Ok got a technical onsite interview at a big company in Sunnyvale.
Should I or should I not wear suits and why/why not?
\_ You will look overdressed but that isn't such a big deal IF you
look comfortable in a suit and it fits you well. If you look like
you have a suit that you only wear to job interviews you will look
silly. Just wear a nice pair of pants and a buttondown.
\_ Agreed. You must be comfy but don't go in looking like a slob
either. No jeans, sneakers, etc.
\_ curious: what position are you interviewing for?
\_ internship as a grad student for MTS.
\_ Shirt 'n slacks. Decent shoes please.
\_ for experienced folks, dress professionally, but don't need to
use coats and ties.
\_ The suit will never hurt you and might help. Wear it. I've seen
what CS/IS guys consider to be business casual. Yikes. Oh wait.
I've seen the suits, too. Double yikes.
\_ actually it can hurt you. Although it is unlikely anyone will
mark you down for wearing one, if you are one of those poeple
who look awkward in a suit because you never wear one and dress
pretty casual normally or your suit is cheap or doesn't fit
well or whatever it will increase the awkwardness of the
interview and that does hurt. -aspo
\_ holy shit! the sky is opening and raining flaming frogs! i
agree with aspo on something! must've been a bad batch....
\_ is "try not to look better than your potential boss" a good tip?
\_ no. |
| 2003/5/31-6/1 [Academia/GradSchool, Industry/Jobs] UID:28595 Activity:high |
5/31 "Tom Devlin, director of UC Berkeley's career center, said that 2 out
of 3 of the university's 6,000 graduating seniors are expected to be
working full time six months after graduating."
http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2003/05/31/MN254655.DTL
\_ Retail, burger flipping, and car washing count. The other third
are in prison on drug and prostitution charges.
\_ Oh, come on, it's not that bad. I had to get a job as a lookout
four a few months, but now I've got a good position in a major
cartel as a runner, and things are looking good.
\_ Hey that's great! I was in the back in the chemlab naked for
the first 6 months before they let me be a courier! What's
the secret to your success in our field?
\_ I put caltech on my resume instead of cal, and told them
i'd lived in the dorm that got busted for making smack.
it also helps to blow the pilots, since they have the
strongest connections to the higher-ups in colombia.
\_ Thanks for the resume tip. I'll switch to Caltech too!
\_ Nasty little men like you always get their comeuppance.
\_ you're an idiot. im going places. by xmas ill be
one of the top 10 guys in columbia. |
| 2003/5/29 [Industry/Jobs] UID:28570 Activity:very high |
5/28 To those who don't understand Lila's request, have you any idea
what's going on out there on the job market? I'm happy you were
at a nice stable place during this fun, but clearly you have no
clue about the situation for many.
\_ Yes, I do. I've turned down offers and killed second round
interviews at places that sucked from the first round. Berkeley
*should* have prepared you for this. Either it has and you don't
see it or your degree was wasted on you. --has job, clue, offers
\_ I knew many people with your arrogance, up till the point
where they got hit by the downturn. They're humble now.
And less willing to tell others how they should be.
\_ pshaw, been laid off twice during the down turn. I spent the
good times learning stuff and saving money. --job,clue,offers
\_ sounds like have have many talents, but one of them isn't
humility. some day it might be good to add that to your skill
set. on a related note, one hiring mgr got so sick of the
arrogance of berkeley and stanfurd grads that he won't even
take a look at resumes from these schools anymore.
\_ humility is for the inept. the rest of us are doing great,
thanks. as far as your idiotic HM who won't even look at
resumes from top schools: if you only look at mediocre
\_ The Book is the only Book I need to keep my life on track. If
you let Jesus into your heart, you'll find true happiness as
well. Only The Lord can set you free and make you happy both
in this life and the next.
resumes you'll only get mediocre employees. you work at
pacific bell, maybe? a bank? city government? the HM is
from where? cal state hayward?
\_ there are also those who are sick of the tech industry and just
something different, even mindless, just to pay the bills.
\_ this is a good time to sit down and read "your money or your
life" by dominguez and robins. It changed my life. I view the
purpose of work completely different now. And have a goal when
working. It's all about the money, but it's not about what
money can buy. Read the book. I hope it changes your life
as well.
\_ the real lesson from this post is that what you need to do
is sit down and write some dipshit selfhelp book so that
other unemployed suckers all give you money and you never
have to work again.
\_ as usual, hot headed youngsters jump to conclusions.
You're a gamer aren't you? Loser.
\_ I didn't write the thing you're replying to, but I'm
probably several years older than you and I agree with
the "gamer's" statement. What does gaming have to do
with having a real job or a real life anyway? You've
got some issues to work out, son.
\_ work was *always* about the money. what else could it be for?
\_ I need money to pay rent, but I'd be willing to make
a lot less money to do stuff I love, or to do stuff I like
but work less hours and with less stress. Money is nice
but there is a lot more to life than buying nice toys -aspo
\_ yeah but there's no reason to work other than money.
\_you have a very uplifting view of social change.
\_ it has nothing to do with social change. are you
trying to get us all a 15 hour work week?
\_ oops forgot something else. In addition to "your money or
your life" I also recommend "getting a life..." by Blix
and heitmiller. It's written by a couple who went through
the steps described in the dominguez book. Also very good.
\_ http://www.fastcompany.com/magazine/66/mylife.html
\_ Thanks for posting this.
\_ I highly recommend this book. "You money or your life"
is more about not getting screwed, and maximizing your
earnings, which is still compatible with finding a job you
are happy with, alla this book. -tcmoore |
| 2003/5/21 [Industry/Jobs] UID:28501 Activity:high |
5/20 This happen to you. You get laid off, but your loyalty entitles
you to 'salary continuation.' You ask you former company if it's
ok to get unemployment insurance. They say yes. You collect.
A year later the EDD send you letter saying the 'salary continuation'
is considered wages, they want the UI $ back plus penalties and
suspension from ever getting UI for 3 years. The company won't
help you now in writing a letter saying it was severance. Everyone
else who was laid off and did the same thing, doesnt have that
the EDD breathing down their necks. I STFW of EDD's site. The
info says the case is hopeless.
\_ Even severance is considered salary in terms of EDD's view.
Your unemployment benefit starts only when your severance
runs out. I think you are f*cked.
\_ What is salary continuation exactly? -- new to workforce
\_ hack their system already, jeez, what kinda cs geek are you? |
| 2003/5/8-12 [Industry/Jobs] UID:28368 Activity:nil |
5/7 My company is looking for experienced QA people.
<DEAD>www.reactivity.com;<DEAD> email me as david@reactivity.com
for details --dpassage
\_ My company is also hiring also but it *really* sucks here and I
don't want to inflict that on any of you.
\_ it once sucked here as well, but hiring a couple of sodans
fixed a lot. Try it. --scotsman
\_ I wouldn't do that to a fellow sodan.
\_ see if you can get them to hire the asshole who keeps deleting
everything interesting. seriously. monitor the motd, get a login
name, find the fucker on google, and submit a bogus resume.
\_ no way. they might hire him and then I'd be stuck with yet
another jerk off at work. |
| 2003/3/14-15 [Industry/Jobs, Industry/Startup, Computer/SW] UID:27691 Activity:moderate |
3/13 My company is looking for an intern. We're a financial software
company, and we could use some extra hands to help us gather
content for part of our website. It's probably going to be
unpaid, but you could learn a lot about finance, and it might lead
to more interesting paid work after a while.
/csua/pub/jobs/wsa.txt, or email me for details. -dlwhite
\_ Do I have to bring my own cigars? This one time at band camp....
\_ Cigars will be provided. -dlwhite
\_ Sweet! I'm going for it!
\_ isn't there something illegal about this
\_ why should there be? unpaid internships are the _norm_ in
many industries, including the one most sodans are in, if you
go back 15-20 years.
\_ you mean they didn't always pay $80k for summer interns?! |
| 2003/3/4 [Reference/Tax, Industry/Jobs] UID:27593 Activity:high |
3/3 I have been searching Google and also contacting some friends regarding
the going rate for a 3 month contracting position that might become
full time at a big internet company in Mountain View. The duties
consist of works for a backend Java and Java-related technologies
developer. I have about 5 years of working experience with about 2
years of Java and Java-related technologies working experience. I have
a BS in EECS from Cal. However, I have never done any contracting work
before, but have a very broad set of skills, very capable, and very
fast learner. The numbers that I found seem a bit high for the current
market; $100-$200/hr DOE. Will anyone here point me to some recent
surveys (2003 or late 2002) and/or provide some comments based on their
own (or people that know) experiences and also how to best negotiate
while keeping the door open for the full time conversion? Thanks!!
\_ holy sh*t that's a lot of money
\_ no it isnt.
\_ DOE is the key. A fresh-out-of-college type should be happy with
$40/hr. A senior with a decade of seasoning and reasonably
being a contractor so they *have* to charge what looks like an
obscene amount of money to make it worth it. The guy I replaced
was making $300/hr but by in the last few months he was only doing
an hour or two a day. Sometimes none. His only duty was doing
interviews to repalce himself. My salary? 20% of his rate plus
some minor benefits. If they like you and need you, they'll convert
your expensive contractor ass as fast as possible, so don't worry
about that part. See if you can get them to blink first by making
an offer or stating a range or something. If not, then say that
you'd like $X (I suggest $200/hr) but that the rate really isn't
the issue since your goal is to convert to FTE after a reasonably
short time period.
agressive skills maintainance can expect substantially more.
Generally we take the FTE equivalent and multiply by 0.75 to get
a reasonable rate for short term contractors.
\_ that assumes full time employee
\_ here's why: contractors get screwed on taxes and benefits and are
the first to go when heads roll and a bunch of other badness about
\_ screwed on benefits: true. screwed on head roll: true
screwed on taxes, not even close. Self employment tax comes
out exactly the same as regular exempt employees making the
same amount of $$$.
\_ They suggested a range of $60-$65/hr. They are really
low-balling me then? -op
\_ I've read $1/hour for every $1K/year you'd make on salary.
\_ Industry standard is 0.6 to 0.75 these days. -hiring mgr
\_ As a contractor, you need to cover your own benefits and
unemployment insurance (i.e., savings).
$1.5-$2/hour for every $1k/year is where I start.
\_ assuming you contract for 2k hours per year, this works
out to 3 to 4x regular salary for a contract. i did 3x
in '98 '99, and i was close to 4x '00 '01. i'm down to
hmmm 2.5x now. where are you getting contracts today
that are in the 3 to 4x range?
\_ $60-$65/hour seems really fair now adays. I've seen rates
as low as $40/hour for some senior level contract gigs.
Email me if you wanna take it offline --chris
\_ That's really low for contracting. I suggest you ask them
flat out when/IF you'd convert to FTE and what the salary
would be. If you like the final salary, get them to put it
in writing that after X months (I suggest 2-3 max) at their
super low-ball rate, they convert you to FTE at the previously
agreed upon salary. If they'll do that and you're happy with
the FTE, then consider the contract rate as a sort of
probationary period and just do it at whatever rate. If they
won't do that, then your odds of converting are near zero and
you should ask for more. --same long winded person from above
\_ This is a silly idea. If they were willing to commit to
a full time hire, they wouldn't be using a contractor
probation period in the first place.
\_ C2H is pretty common. I'd be surprised if less than
a majority lead to conversion, or end if you suck.
\_ Only if you're looking for FTE....
\_ The big hit is self-employment tax. Basically, you pay your
own payroll tax. Plus paying for benes. And you're only
paid after you bill. Overhead costs (not including time to
do your own paperwork) is easily 30%, less if you want to
skimp on benes (ie. covered by spouse insurance, etc.). So
$60/hr contract -> $42/hr FTE -> $80K yearly + minor benes.
\_ Wrong! Most bene packages are only worth about $10k/year
or less (usually a lot less).
\_ Cost to employer is on order of 30% of salary - this
includes benefits, sick/vacation/holiday, 401k match
if present, and their share of the employment tax.
Also, no one is listing 1099 vs W2 contracting.
\_ Is anyone even able to get a contract job in the past few years?
-ax
\_ They are popping up more often now. I've still got a few
friends recruiting and that's what I'm seeing/hearing. --chris
\_ I just updated my job search profile for the first time in 18
months and got my first set of new job emails this morning. It
looks like 1998 out there for full timers! |
| 2003/2/26-3/3 [Industry/Jobs] UID:27540 Activity:nil |
2/26 FactSet... hiring... full-time and interns... San Mateo and NYC
mail for details - rory
\_ Anger... rising... rage... taking over...
\_ I don't get it
\_ Some weirdos get upset when people post job ops on the motd.
\_ Watch the movie 'Mystery Men'
\_ Pull my finger. |
| 2003/2/26 [Transportation/Bicycle, Industry/Jobs] UID:27528 Activity:high |
2/25 I'm a lazy 5'8" sysadm, is a kawa ninja 500 big enough for me?
\_ almost related - I'll be selling my bmw 850R soon, and cheap.
Showing age (72k), but motor is solid. Reasonable first bike,
good commuter. was 130 this year for 100/300 liability. -jor
\_ yes
\_ on a related note, how much do you bikers pay for insurance?
- biker-wannabe
\_ depends entirely on cost/year of the bike, displacement, and
your driving record/experience/training. anywhere from $150
per year to $3000 per year. -- caliban
\_ I have a 2001 Ninja 500 (aka EX500) for sale. Mail me if you're
interested. Was my first bike too, glad I didn't go get anything
more. -nevman
\_ are you a sysadm? how much you weigh?
i am very comfortable on it.
-- caliban
\_ sysadm, hmm, let me fire up the old abacus. First question is
how many tubs of butter do you eat per day?
\_ that depends on what you are looking for in a bike. the ninja/ex
500 is a perfect starter bike for a new rider who is interested
in sport bikes. you'll want to replace it, most likely, in a
year or two max. i'm 5'8" and can fit just fine on any sport
bike, though something shorter like the ex 500 (or250) makes
for more confident learning. i currently ride a BMW R1150GS,
a huge bike, and though 5'8" is about the limit for that bike,
i am very comfortable on it. -- caliban
\_ are you a sysadm? how much you weigh?
\_ sysadm, eh? Hmm, let me fire up the old abacus. First question
is how many tubs of butter do you eat per day?
\_ my roomate's 5'7" and he when he rides a 500EX he could barely
touch the ground with his toes (30.5" height on the 500). Does
that mean he can't ride taller bikes like the ZX-6R (32.5" height)? |
| 2003/2/13-14 [Industry/Jobs] UID:27403 Activity:very high |
2/13 I had a managment job without a manager title. My VP refused to
make me a manager on the ground that "I didn't have enough years
of experience". I did all the management work, including hiring.
Now I am looking for a new job with a manager title, how do I
explain to my prospect employer about the situation when they
challenge me that I didn't have a manager title before?
\_ Put on your resume what you did. But you will still have
tough time getting a job with "manager" in the title,
especially in this job market.
\_ My company's the opposite. Since all salaries are frozen,
they've been throwing around titles like crazy. People haven't
moved up the org chart, but we randomly create new positions w/
fancy titles... pretty weak. we rule.
\_ How many people did you really hire, and how many projects
did you manage?
\_ Put in your valid title and then in parens put "Acting Manager."
Be sure to note all managerial tasks you performed in description.
Of course, you're assuming that someone will check references...
Have someone who worked "under" you as a reference.
\_ I have done all this. I just don't know how to answer
questions like, "why didn't they just make you a manager?"
What's the best way to answer that? Be honest and said
because the VP was an idiot and discriminated me against
my young age? I don't think that would go too well? -op
\_ you can be honest without sounding like you hated the VP
personally or whining about being "discriminated against".
just say that the policy at your company required a manager
to have a certain number of years of experience to have
the title but that your responsibilities were the same
as a manager.
\_ "Headcount problem." They felt they didn't have the resources
to make my title official. It's a dodge, but a useful one.
Also note you can provide references to support it. |
| 2003/2/12-7/5 [Industry/Jobs] UID:27385 Activity:low |
2/13 http://www.craigslist.org/sfo/sfc/sad/8608525.html Contract/part time/backup sysadmin for http://snapfish.com. I'm the full time guy. Send in your resume now if interested. You can email me with questions but I'm not the primary resume contact. Use the jobs@ address. -reiffin UPDATE: the resumes I've seen so far all suck. If you've got some experience with Solaris, Linux, 3ware, raid on linux, raid on anything else, Veritas volume manager, Netapp (any model), and want this contract, then send me your resume and I'll get your name in the post-HR hat. If you've already sent in a resume to jobs@, it didn't get to me. Please send resume via me this time. \_ Is that job still kickback - hide in the office and surf for porn all day? \_ still? It's never been like that. -reiffin \_ I was offered (briefly) your job in Aug, 2001. It was that kickback. Probably why they ended up getting acquired. \_ How were you "briefly" offered the job? I was hired Aug 2001, btw. It wasn't kickback then, it isn't now. The contracting thing may turn out to be easy money, though. -reiffin \_ obridicule \_ obstfu |
| 2003/2/11-7/5 [Academia/Berkeley/CSUA, Industry/Jobs] UID:27365 Activity:moderate |
2/10 Lyris is hiring (downtown berkeley)
http://csua.org/u/929
\_ Any non-senior code positions? Also, I know someone in the CSUA
works for Lyris, and I recall him making allusions to the Lyris
code base being pretty gnarly. Care to confirm or refute that?
\_ Not for now. Currently only senior candidates are being
considered. The code base has in the recent past been in
much gnarlier states, but this has been from understaffing -
a problem which is finally being addressed. --scotsman
\_ no one trains interns anymore - at least not for loooow wage |
| 2003/2/6-7 [Industry/Jobs] UID:27327 Activity:high |
2/6 I know none of you grumpy, jaded dot-com free market
Jew-bating hentai obsessed bitches care, but just in case,
\_ You mean "baiting".
\_ Acutally I meant "batting". They make such a nice crunchy
sound when you smack them with a bat.
KALX is having its Spring recruitment meeting today,
even people on campus give me the cold shoulder, you know
how it's almost common courtesy to at least take a flyer
from someone if they offer it, as long as they're not obviously
people the Moonies shipped over in bondage? Some people
won't even take my flyers. Maybe I have a huge oozing
sore on my lip that I am unaware of. As a joke I gave
a few flyers to that crazy (or maybe he's not so crazy,
he dropped the whole act and thanked me) guy with the
laminated signs who shouts all day in a really annoying
voice "LLAMA PACK MULE!!!", I'm hoping he shows up.
Thursday, 7:30pm, 145 Dwinelle - danh
\_In this day and age what the hell are you doing with paper flyers?
Learn how to SPAM!!!
\_ No it isn't common courtesy. It kills trees and fills the land
fills with colored crap that will stay there forever. I think
most people learn "the don't fuck me with, I'm not taking your
stupid flier, you don't exist in my universe" stare by the end
of their second year at the latest.
\_ yep. sometime sophomore year sounds right. |
| 2003/2/3-4 [Industry/Jobs] UID:27293 Activity:very high |
2/3 A friend of mine is looking to hire a SW Eng to do some network mgmt
work. It's a small consulting firm and he's thinking $70-75k for
someone w/ a few years experience. Does this sound about right or low?
\_ OP HERE: I meant network management SOFTWARE work. sorry.
\_ So many trolls...so few trollops.
\_ given today's economy, i'd say that's about right. else, it'd
be a little on the low side for a few years experience.
\_ Depends on what you want. If its write custom MIBs its probably
okay. If its write your own agent then he should offer more.
\_ what's a good way to learn about MIBs / SNMP etc?
\_ don't go into that field. Writing MIBs and doing SNMP is
new grad stuff. I used to hire interns or cheap contractors
to do the work. It's brain dead grunt work.
\_ Since when do software enginners to network management?
\_ network management as in network management software.
\_ Full time or contract? That's ok for someone with 0-2 or maybe
0-3 if they didn't do much but he's scraping.
\_ Fulltime (to do contract work). Oh, he's also got a Master's
from Cal. Yes, he's kinda scraping.
\_ That should get someone with a few years experience. Not really
a senior person though. Look on some of the hiring websites to
get a range for what people are offering.
\- this is not a direct answer, but in my experience a lot of
what you need for network stuff depends a bunch on scale
issues. what might work for an office for a couple of classCs
and 500 machines with 100mbit and not a lot of diversity
[read broken tcp stacks on weird embedded devices] would not
fly for mutiple class Bs, with unpredictable traffic or
really high badwidth links where you need detailed knowledge
of say ethernet drivers or network subsystem implementation.
pehaps this is less the case in "network management" which
may have narrower scope. --psb |
| 2003/1/30 [Industry/Jobs] UID:27240 Activity:high |
1/29 More about jobs: just had a very nice phone screen with HR at (don't
need the competition, thanks) who said her perception of the job
market is that things aren't as 'soft' as they have been and it isn't
as easy to hire good people as it was only a few months ago. Cross
your fingers and keep sending those resumes. Avoid recruiters. Good
luck to all of us!
\_ What specialty?
\_ Unix Guru
\_ are you the guy who needed to do a man nice?
\_ No, I'm one of the guys who told him to stop asking to be
spoon fed, stop logging in as root and go learn something.
\_ oh you were a meannie. - man nice guy fan #1
\_ Who are you?
\_ Tres cool. Let us know $$ after you score. |
| 2003/1/29-2/2 [Industry/Jobs, Academia/Berkeley/CSUA] UID:27235 Activity:nil 50%like:25736 57%like:28180 |
1/29 Undergrad research position available, /csua/pub/jobs/roc |
| 2003/1/29 [Computer/Companies/Google, Industry/Jobs] UID:27232 Activity:very high |
1/28 Anybody get an unsolicited "I just found your resume"-type job
opening email from Google lately? I just got something that
seems plausible but can't tell if its just some spammer's
attempt to get my email address.
\_ don't trust it. google doesn't hire. everyone there is a volunteer.
\_ May well be, but then again, I finally got a job when a
recruiter mailed me up out of the blue. Still don't know how
she found my resume, don't care either.
\_ everyone who ever had your resume has resold it dozens of times.
\_ Hope no one paid much for it. It's free on my web site.
In any event, I'm not complaining about a 6 fig job.
\_ probably not an email spammer, but maybe a headhunteror or a wierdo.
\_ There is a message envelope, right? Doesn't that sufficiently show
that it came from Google? Google is hiring. -mgoodman
\_ Maybe... maybe not:
http://csua.org/u/893 (fucked company)
\_ This is an incoherent rant, even by fc standards.
\_ fc has no standards.
\_ Will you submit my resume for me?
\_ You can reply to these things if you want but it won't matter.
These are 99.999% likely to be some sort of bottom feeder recruiter
types but replying will *not* get you a job and may in fact ruin
your chances if they fax blast you to 5000+ potential employers.
I no longer reply to these people as I've never gotten so much as
an email reply back.
\_ i don't think you have enough statistics to state that number to
five digits.
\_ You are mistaken. We adhere strictly to 5 Nines quality
standards.
\_ having dealt with millions of these cretins, I believe I do
have five9s quality data to backup that statement's
statistical validity. Even if I'm only four9s correct, it
still won't get you a job and might ruin your chances of
doing so. Just delete. Do not reply to these things. |
| 2003/1/27-28 [Industry/Jobs] UID:27210 Activity:high |
1/27 How accurate is http://salary.com in this market? \_ Seems about right to me. Read the job descriptions though, not just the titles. |
| 2003/1/27 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl, Industry/Jobs] UID:27209 Activity:high |
1/26 I asked my two managers (why do I have two? for double the work!)
\_ Go one manager up and get one of your managers fired.
Sounds management-top-heavy: "too many chiefs, not enough
(American) Indians." Managers are essentially overhead.
to hire another sysadmin to help with the workload they
are forcing on me. I asked for an SA with experience and
who knows some Perl. Am I being unfair to expect an SA to know Perl?
They are trying to get me to accept 3 internal candidates of
which only one even knows bourne shell programming. I feel
they are trying to dump someone on me which will only make
my workload worse. They refuse to hire someone external.
How do I convince my boss(es) of the validity of my concerns?
I have one meeting with them tomorrow (Monday) before they decide.
\_ I can't really help you with convincing pointy-hairs about anything,
but I'd be surprised if any mid to high-level sysadmin didn't
profess at least familiarity with perl. On the other hand, if
they're a decent shell programmer it won't take long to pick it
up. -tom
\_ They will be paid $80K/year. Is that considered
low or mid level nowadays?
\_ In this climate, probably mid level. Can you make the
economic case for it? Perversely enough, even pointy hairs
with poor analytical skills tend to buy well reasoned
arguments when it comes to money, provided you walk them
through slowly. Something like this:
a) You are overburdened.
b) This is costing your company money.
i. There are a fair number of studies that show employees
are more productive when they are not scrambling to
smash too many tasks into their day-- find one. In the
worst case, you quit, and they incur the cost of hiring
a replacement, which some HR wonks claim this runs as
high as 25% of hiring salary (presumably your salary
is greater than that of the new sysadmin they will
hire/transfer)
ii.There are other arguments you can make to support the
idea that overworking you will cost your company money
in the long run. Just make sure you don't end up
threatening to quit unless you're willing to make good
on it. And don't shoot yourself in the foot by somehow
making it look like it's your fault that you are
overburdened.
c) Thus, you need a junior or co-sysadmin
d) If the new sysadmin has any holes in his skill set, then
it will obviously fall to you to train him. Training
the new recruit adds to your overburdened status, and
though it benefits the new guy, it takes away from time
that both of you could be doing productive work that
benefits the company at large.
And on that note, I may be looking for a job, I know perl,
and have references that can vouch for this. If you do end
up looking outside your company, and you'd like to chat
further, drop me an email. -dans
\_ In this climate i'd say someone already there for the last
year who is making 80K would be "mid-level". You can
definiteley hire "senior level" sys admins in this market
for 80K. You CERTAINLY should be able to get someone
who knows at least some PERL. Also, if this was 1 year
ago, i'd tell you that you should quit any place that
doesn't let YOU as the only Unix admin, have a pretty
damn big say in hiring another one.
\_ For 80K they should write perl while juggling hot spares
on the main file server and hand-crafting packets to get
them through the shitty router... Call me. I'd love to
do just a little perl on top of mid-level SA stuff for
80K. --scotsman
\_ Starving people are always willing to do whatever while
they're starving. You'll quit the moment the economy
improves. Desperate people stink of it.
\_ Um. 80K for midlevel SA is far from starving.
hell, it's about average for a senior, non-manager
admin.
admin. --scotsman
\_ Missing point: he's desperate to work for 80k now
\_ ...and he's a sysadmin. enough said.
\_ So he gets to manage liquidating capital
equipment?
but will quit the moment the economy turns around
in the slightest.
\_ when the mean goes up to, what, 81k? if i
like the position, i stay. the job i have now
was out of sheer desparation, and for a while
it was hell, and i would've taken the first
opportunity that came up. Over the last 3
months because of changes in management and
raises, it's gotten much better and I'm happy
to stay. Avg. salaries don't rise as quickly
as you seem to think. Certainly not enough
to risk my livelihood at "the moment the
economy turns around in the slightest."
--scotsman
\_ You still reek of desperation. Sorry, but
if it shows on the motd, you're not making
it through an interview until you mellow.
\_ i agree. he should call em up and say
"let me hear you beg, bitch."
\_ Dude, you work for a company that pays inflated
salaries in a down market. Don't act so smug.
\_ Missing point: he's desperate to work for 80k now
but will quit the moment the economy turns around
in the slightest.
\_ I bet you were one of those bitches who bragged
about the six digits they were making in the
boom time. |
| 2002/12/20-21 [Industry/Jobs] UID:26877 Activity:moderate |
12/20 Christine the hiring beaach, do you look at GPA?
\_ Way to impress your recruiter!
\_ That's "biiiiyotch!" to you, kid! |
| 2002/12/20 [Industry/Jobs] UID:26869 Activity:kinda low |
12/19 Sigh... more resume help for motd readers: you may have graduated
with a 3.918/4.0 but your resume sucks. No one wants to read prose.
Keep it to simple bullet points. Each job posting online will get
roughly 400 resumes. No one reads full sentences. Make it easy for
the reader. You get about 0.75 seconds to convince someone to skim
the rest of your resume. Harsh? Yes, but true. Cut out all that
crap and try again.
\_ ...and you want help people with 4.0 gpa's who somehow make it
all the way through college with no communication skills or common
sense why? fuck them. if they can't communicate well enough
to tell you why you should hire them they probably aren't useful
to you.
\_ most EECS majors probably meet this description
\_ http://xmlresume.sourceforge.net
Won't help much with the brevity problem, but possibly useful.
\_ GPA is irrelevant after X number of years in the industry. RIGHT?
\_ That X is probably 10 years. If you're a newgrad or with 5-7
years experience, I do look at GPA if I have 10 people who are
equally good at coding. If two people both are good at solving
problems and one has a high GPA and the other has a low GPA,
which one would you hire? GPA tells me that the person is more
responsible and disciplined. Skills are the most important
quality of course. But all else being equal, high GPA wins.
\_ X=10? I stopped putting that crap on my resume after four
years and emphasized references, work experience, and
projects. Much better indicators of how you'll do at the job.
\_ I agree with the above. X=10 is silly. After 10 years if you
ask me my gpa after seeing TEN YEARS of work experience and
think what I did as a child somehow matters TEN YEARS later
then I'll happily keep looking because working for such an
inflexible and thoughtless PHB would suck big time. |
| 2002/11/27-28 [Industry/Jobs] UID:26652 Activity:kinda low |
11/27 job openings in SF:
http://www.ca9.uscourts.gov/ca9/joblistings.nsf/employment?openview&expandview
\_ no slav jews need apply
\_ eh? |
| 2002/11/5-6 [Industry/Jobs] UID:26424 Activity:low |
11/5 How is the job market now for senior developers?
\_ My company has one opening for director and three for senior level,
but no opening for junior level.
\_ yermom's always got openings for them.
\_ Which company?
\_ http://www.efi.com
\_ Is Efi still running the show there? He's pretty
annoying. |
| 2002/10/25-26 [Computer/Companies/Ebay, Industry/Jobs] UID:26313 Activity:moderate |
10/24 Anyone works at eBay? I have a technical interview with them
and would like to know in advance on what type of questions might
be asked.
\_ All your base are belong to us!
\_ Just be arrogant, like say "If you're asking questions like that,
you must really be desperate!" Or, "are you serious?" Even better,
before you agree to go in, tell them you've been offered every job
you've interviewed for, and are therefore requesting a technical test
via email before conceding to a in-person interview, to make it worth
your while. Worked for me. Wtf could ebay possible need anyway? None
your while. Worked for me. Wtf could ebay possibly need anyway? None
of this is rocket science. |
| 2002/10/18-19 [Industry/Jobs] UID:26247 Activity:moderate |
10/18 Friday afternoon. work sucks.
\_ could be worse. it's been lay-off central around here for the
last two days.
\_ last night I dreamt that my boss told me I'd be out of a job
after january. But I was supposed to finish my stuff before
then.
\_ Funny--that actually happened to a co-worker of mine.
\_ could be worse, you could have quit your job and gone to
grad skool and then discovered that you had forgotten how
much you hated school and that work is infinitely better
than putting up with shitty profs, boring course work and
and tiresome homework.
\_ And by the time you get back into the real world all the hot
asian chicks turned into 35+ year old prunes.
\_ Funny--that actually happened to a friend of mine. |
| 2002/10/15-16 [Industry/Jobs] UID:26192 Activity:moderate |
10/15 If psb were laid off from LBL and replaced by two of his hindu
buddies from india, would he still be so gunho about H1bs?
Yes:
No:
\_ "gung ho"
\_ It wouldn't go like that. It'd be psb replaced by 1 H1b who can
barely speak english, has a resume which is nothing but lies, and
works for 50% less but can't actually do anything useful. I loved
working at Indian run dotcoms. They'd pass over super qualified
americans, go out of their way to bring in an H1b buddy, and then
spend the rest of their time covering for him because he didn't
know *any* of the things he claimed to know on his resume.
\_ You too? I thought that was just at my startup.
\_ I was at more than 1 like this. It was the way it worked.
My favorite was a small software place that had a job listing
that read like my resume. Despite having 10 years experience
with much larger places the VP Eng told the HR girl I wasn't
experienced enough. I was shocked until I looked over the
company bio page for management. All Indian. Then it made
sense. When I last checked they were out of business so good
riddance to racists in the industry.
\_ for great justice! |
| 2002/10/2 [Reference/BayArea, Industry/Jobs] UID:26075 Activity:insanely high |
10/2 http://csua.org/u/36b "... full-time longshoremen earn an average salary of $80,000 a year, while the most experienced foremen average $167,000." And they still shut down all the west coast docks and tumble the already bad economy in order to demand more. \_ hmm, if they so importent that the can hurt the economy that \_ hmm, if they so important that the can hurt the economy that simply maybe the DESERVE high salaries. \_ The work is important, the workers are not. It's grunt work. Any high schooler with 4 hours training could do it. People who stock grocery shelves are important, too. You think they should get $80k starting and $167k for 'experienced' stock shelvers? \_ The docks locked out the workers, not the other way around. Train harder. \_ You really buy that "we didn't slow down; we were just trying to follow the safety procedures" crap? \_ And you really buy the "there was an undeclared slowdown"? \_ With average pays at $80K and $167K, why do they deserver immunity to competition from non-union workers? \_ Duh. Go read *anything* on the net about union tactics. This is classic strategy. The counter punch lock out is a new response, though. Jeeze, I know it's the motd but if you know *nothing* about a topic, take 5 seconds to look on google before posting and wasting all those bits. \_ They cite the death of five workers over the previous months. You know what? If my boss started hedging on my contract, I'd start following all of his stupid rules too. \_ They're OSHA rules. If all OSHA rules were followed, the economy would collapse *and* people would die on their job trying to follow them. \_ You're missing the point. They don't necessarily want more money, they want to keep their jobs. The companies want to hire nonunion folks to handle some of the new tech going in. The new tech will eliminate union jobs. The union want the company to put union folks in those new jobs instead of having them laid off. \_ With average pays at $80K and $167K in this economy (and I bet \_ sure I'd prefer that they trained me. Hell, I'd prefer that they paid me for doing nothing at all. But why should they *have* to? they get OT pay as well), why do they deserver immunity to competition from non-union workers and layoff? \_ Ignore the union bit for the moment. Would you prefer that your employer trained you for new technology or just outright hired someone else instead? okay, bring the union back into this, they work to make sure this doesnt happen, to make sure you are not just discarded because your employer doesnt want to provide relevant training. \_ sure I'd prefer that they trained me. Hell, I'd prefer that they paid me for doing nothing at all. But why should they *have* to? \_ so you dont mind being disposable. \_ He didn't say that at all. He said he'd prefer not being disposable, in fact but doesn't see why they should be *forced* to not dispose of him. Please learn to read basic English. Thanks. \_ my parents are/were both union workers, so I'm biased, I wonder if the rest of you feel this way? \_ That you're biased? Sure! Why not? Ok, I feel you're biased. Happy now? \_ I'm a union (tech) worker, but I hate the goddamned union. It's retarded that these fat fucks can get by on their skills that havent been updated since the DOS days and havent bothered picking up skills that theyve been taught in training. and since we have the same job title, we get paid the same, so i get paid the same as lazy fat fucks. \_ You know nothing and more nothing about this issue but it's the motd so who cares? |
| 2002/9/25-26 [Industry/Jobs] UID:26002 Activity:high |
9/25 Now what? Maybe they'll go pay per view....
link:www.miami.com/mld/miami/4145004.htm
\_ "Illegally paying a person to fight." I don't get it. How is this
different from professional boxing?
\_ professional boxing is licensed. -tom
\_ You are intentionally being funny right? I had assumed you
were - and thought that a clever comment - until i
remembered that you are a big gov. liberal and may well
actually consider that an important difference. -crebbs
\_ uh, it's fairly important to the question I was
responding to, which was how bumfight is different than
professional boxing (that is, why the bumfighters are
getting arrested). -tom
\_ I know people are stupid, but i'd be willing to
wager that tOP is aware that pro boxing is licensed.
\_ I wouldn't...
\_ what else is there for him to "get"? -tom |
| 2002/9/19 [Industry/Jobs] UID:25938 Activity:high |
9/18 So how should I write a "thank you" letter? any good examples on
the web? Is it really that important in an interview?
\- "hello, special announcement: ok tnx. ok bye --<initials>" --psb
\_ Yes, it is highly recommended that you do so, and right away
before they can forget you. Thank them for their time,
and briefly remind them how excited you are about their co.
and that you think you'd make a great fit with their co, or
something like that.
\_ is this appropriate after a phone interview, or only
after a full proper interview? e-mail or snail mail?
\_ usually a phone interview leads directly to an in person.
if yours didn't then it's not a good sign. never let a phone
interview end without asking "so, what's the next step?" or
something like that.
\_ if it's a screening interview, then prob not. a face-to-
face interview is a must. most interviewee's don't send
thank you's. so set yourself apart from the crowd.
\_ make sure you talk about your lofty goals and make
absolutely sure you tell them how you got your
nickname.
\_ Yeah totally. I forgot that part. Esp. the nickname.
\_ If your phone screen didn't end with someone setting up an
in-person interview then it's hopeless anyway. Always end a
phone interview with a "So, what's the next step?" type of
question. And no, you don't generally do thank you's for
phone interviews without exceptional reasons like maybe the
entire interview process is by phone. |
| 2002/9/16-17 [Industry/Jobs] UID:25905 Activity:insanely high |
9/17 Informal survey.
I have a full-time job and I work
under 30 hours per week: ..
30 to 35 hours per week:
35 to 40 hours per week: ....
39 < work < 41 per week: .
40 to 45 hours per week: ......
45 to 50 hours per week: ..
50 to 60 hours per week:
60 to 70 hours per week: .. (damn it...)
\_ why are you guys working so hard and are
you getting compensated appropriately?
over 70 hours:
\_ And my commute takes
no time at all (I work from home):
less than 10 minutes: ..
10 to 30 minutes: .
10 to 30 minutes: ...... (yay!)
45 to 60 minutes: ..
30 to 45 minutes:
45 to 60 minutes: .... (assuming this is one-way)
60 to 90 minutes: ...
more than 90 minutes:
no time at all (I live at work):
\_ Do you subtract lunch or does that count as "work"?
What about email/motd breaks?
\_ If you're on their clock, you're at work no matter what you're
actually doing. We're doing an office move soon which will add
10 minutes each way to my BART trip (extra walking). That 20
minutes is coming straight off my chair warming time.
\_ What about a quickie with the hot HR manager? |
| 2002/9/3-4 [Industry/Jobs] UID:25762 Activity:very high 63%like:25761 |
9/3 Salary survey, please be honest. No need to mention company if you
don't want to. How much are you getting? doing what? How many years
how experience? Thanks.
\_ Salary survey person, you need to take salary+bonus+other benes
into account as a total package. When you break it down you're
seeing the trees, missing the forest.
\_ Two or three times a week, more if I have time to hit the bars on
weekdays. Years experience? Going on 15 (started in 7th grade). As
for doing what... that's for yermom to know, and for you to find
out.
\_ you can't claim experience back to 7th grade and expect to be
taken seriously. experience does not mean "the first time i
touched my dad's computer". it means "years i was paid by some
stranger to do tech work and paid taxes on it"
\_ Does it include co-op or intern time before graduation?
\_ $74k software test engineer, 4 yr (I am satisfied cause I am
a dumb, lazy slacker waiting for the next job change opportunity)
\_ $75k, software test engineer, 4 yrs, midwest (I am satisfied
\_ $74k, software test engineer, 4 yrs, midwest (I am satisfied
cause I am a dumb, lazy slacker, totally uninterested in what
I am doing and waiting for the next job change opportunity)
\_ $65k IT 8 years... but just because i was desparate and took their
first offer.
\_ $27k + tuition, grad stud, 5 years
\_ 18k/yr + tuition grad student
\_ Embarassed to say... $77K, 7 yr exp. I know I'm getting jipped.
\_ if you're doing more than perl and vb scripting, you should
likely have crossed 6 figures. -mice
\_ how much do you think you should be getting paid? How much
do you think others with your experience are getting paid?
\_ $85k software test engineer, 4+ years.
\_ $100k, IT management, 5 years
\_ $108k, 9 years device driver and other low-level software stuff.
Is it too low, compared to the 5-yr IT guy making $100k above?
\_ $75k, software test engineer, wireless systems, 4 yrs, midwest.
I am satisfied cause I am a dumb, lazy, slacker, totally
uninterested in what I am doing, and waiting for the next job
change opportunity. Group used to develop a load testing tool
which was fun, but next generation of tool moved to India.
\_ $75k, software engineer, 2 years. but i haven't had a raise in
a year and a half (salary freeze)... bitches.
\_ $15k, programmer, shanghai, china
\_ Fucked in the ass daily, Perl coding, 5 years.
\_ is this considered a company perk?
\_ $120k. $5k bonus. 10+ years. Unix Guru.
\_ $93k, software engineer (mainly kernel networking), 5 years.
$3k raise and $5.5k bonus last year.
\_ $48k IT/router guy. 40hr/wk. work for san diego county. slack job,
get 38 days off / year.
\_ $75K, Back-end server software, 6 years |
| 2002/9/3-4 [Industry/Jobs] UID:25761 Activity:high 63%like:25762 |
9/3 Bonus survey, please be honest. No need to mention company if you
don't want to. How much is your yearly bonus as a percentage of
your salary? Please specify the # of years of experience.
For me, 15% and 7 years of experience. Thanks.
\_ up to 10% based on "merit"
\_ what yearly bonus
\_ 0% and 7 yrs exp.
\_ 0% company-wide regardless of experience.
\_ 0% and > 5 yrs exp.
\_ scale eight used to do 7% for 3+ (with 4% salary raises)
\_ scale eight did salary raises? not while I was there
\_ they did in the first year and a half.
\_ were you there more than 3 months?
\_ Well it depends. Some year I received a 45% bonus (as a 5th year)
and some year I received none. These days it's too darn hard to
project what's 'normal' in bonuses. I work for a small company so
the amount varies widely. If you want my last year's number, it's
0% and 6 yrs exp.
\_ From 3 years ago: ~ax/pub/salarysurvey
\_ Three years ago? During the Y2K rush? What good is that?
\_ it's still a gold rush for some folks. remember it was
the people who sold shovels and jeans that made gazillions,
not the prospectors....
\_ 3% raise mainly because I went up a job grade and probably didn't
meet the minimum salary for the new level
\_ 14%, 6 years, Back-end server software |
| 2002/8/15 [Industry/Jobs] UID:25568 Activity:nil |
8/14 All these bickering over degrees and jobs fails to take into account
into one critical fact: most jobs people get is through personal
\_ ^H^Hare
jobs is a plural noun
-motd grammar nazi
connections. Only newgrads have to go into an interview "cold".
For people with experience, this is hardly ever a problem.
\_ correction: most *good* jobs.
\_ I think you will find that, as the economy fails, even people
with experience will be forced to interview cold more often. We've
had almost ten years where that was not the case so you may not
have seen this for yourself, yet. -- wrinkled old crone
\_ No. Most tech people don't meet enough people in a position to
hire them later for something else. For the most part, knowing
someone will get you past HR and that's it. You're still cold in
the interview.
\_ Shucks. I guess I imagined my 2nd job out of school. Please, make
sweeping assertions like this and you don't have a chance of being
credible. Maybe that's why you're still in school.
\_ maybe you're an antisocial loser that doesn't have any
personal skills?
\_ Or maybe I left the Bay Area before the economy imploded.
\_ I jumped ship with my VP to my second job, so no HR nor interview,
100% personal connection. I posted to http://dice.com and got my third job
thru HR and interview, so no personal connection nor head hunter. |
| 2002/8/9 [Industry/Jobs] UID:25530 Activity:nil |
8/8 Is there a technical reason why there exists a tradeoff between
resolution in frequency and resolution in time? When I took
EE120 with Kahn, he attributed it to Heisenberg Uncertainty,
and although that involves a tradeoff too (velocity/location)
I don't see how that explains the frequency/time tradeoff.
Thanks.
\_ Isn't it the idea that by "zooming in" on a unit of time,
you're missing the "big picture" frequency? Eg, mistaking the
high frequency carrier wave in AM radio for the actual lower
frequency signal?
\_ Here is the crux of the problem, how can you resolve a 10 Hz
signal if you observe for a mere 1 us?
\_ The posters above give a good intuitive explanation of the
time-frequency trade-off. For a more technical explanation
imagine that you want to measure some properties of a
signal, s(t), through a finite time-slice. You can get a
finite time-slice via multiplying by a "boxcar", b(at), which
is 1 for -.5 < t < .5 and 0 elsewhere. In frequency, multiplying
by b(at) is convolving with (1/a)B(f/a) where B(f) is a sinc.
Choosing a to be large gets you very fine time-resolution, but
makes the sinc sidelobes wide smearing out X(f) and giving poor
frequency resolution. Choosing a to be small makes the sinc narrow
and reduces the smearing in frequency, but gives you poor
time-resolution since you are including a long time-interval
of s(t). There are many ways to do time-frequency analysis where
instead of using a boxcar you use other functions, but you can't
escape the tradeoff. See wavelets for more info. -emin
\_ Thanks, but that's more of a way of just
demonstrating the tradoff. Is there a natural or
technical reason why it exists?
\_ I'm not sure what you mean by "a natural or technical
reason why it exists". If you could be more
specific about what you find unsatisfying in the
previous three explanations, I could do better. -emin
\_ I'm just wondering why the tradeoff exists. Is
it simply because time and frequency are
are inverses? (i.e. t = 1/f)
\_ I tried to understand this in particular and EPR in
general at one time. I went to a friend of mine
who now is a physics instructor at CAL (part time)
and he stepped me through a bunch of math (including
Lornez transformation) and I realized I was over my
head and gave up.
\_ I found this confusing too. The equations that describe
a particle position/momentum and the equations that describe
the time/frequency resolution are the same equations. So,
the phenomena of the time/frequency trade-off is called
Heisenberg Uncertainty, not because there is some physical
connection between particles and Fourier analysis, but because
the math works out exactly the same. |
| 2002/7/5 [Industry/Jobs, Finance/Shopping] UID:25283 Activity:very high |
7/4 Just graduated, and the money situation is ok. So I'm thinking of
just taking a little time off and relaxing at the folks house
for a little while or until the economy picks up (not that I have a
choice). (related to below post) What are some good (possibly open-
source) projects I can dedicate some time to? And what are the best
ways to get started on these kinds of things?
\_ Art is good. Pick a medium and take a class. If you really
like it you'll get better. Pick a form which takes a lot
of time and organizational skill to thin your competition.
Or enslave yourself to my film crew for extra cool points.
We always have openings, and it's not pr0n. -brain
\_ Mistake. Any "holes" in your resume will raise questions when you
finally do decide to join the economy. And btw, it might be years
before it picks up again. Say hi to yermom for me. (sorry, I had
to take the cheap shot, it was so there).
\_ is saying, "I spent the last year working on open source
projects" that bad?
\_ Depends on how you say it. You make it seem that you took
the time off for a "good" reason. If it's shareware, make
it something that has a public release. If it's 3-6 months
off, it's acceptable to say you took time off to celebrate
graduation.
\_ I'm doing this (sort-of) right now; working on a part-time
contract, setting up our apartment. The hardest thing is to
get used to relaxing and not feeling guilty about not working
full-time. I suggest taking some certification exams, since it's
\_ i did have to explain where i was for a year. I said, "Peace corps."
even "Missionary work in Sierra Leon" works.
probably nice weather outside to go prepare with a book in the
park. Get a ton of exercise, tank up on sun (unless you're in SF),
and buy an old laptop to go work away from home on stuff you feel
like--otherwise you just end up sitting around at home and pr0n-
hosing. -John
\_ i did have to explain where i was for a year. I said,
"Peace corps." even "Missionary work in Sierra Leon" works. |
| 2002/6/25-26 [Politics/Domestic/Immigration, Industry/Jobs] UID:25190 Activity:very high |
6/24 How many of you feel victimized the same way for being a citizen?
http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/020625/sun_visa_investigation_2.html
\_ It's happened to me. I know for a fact I lost out on a job I was
qualified for to an H1b only because he cost dirt to hire. I know
because a friend in HR told me flat out. It happens and it's
illegal. They've done 4 rounds of layoffs since then anyway so
fuck em.
\_ Don't worry. Those low-cost H1Bs won't be able to get a green
card with their salary history and will have to leave the
country soon.
\_ yeah but in the curent shortage of job openings, it's not
going to help us unemployed/undeemployed folks NOW.
\_ If you want to get rid of them now, I guess you can sue
the company or report them to INS. But then you'll have to
explain how you know the H1Bs' salaries since supposedly
it's confidential.
\_ If I had bothered to file a complaint I sure as hell
would have spilled it all if I had to. Anyway, I don't
have to know what the H1b got, I just have to know they
hired the Aussie and not me and have them investigate.
I predict death by xmas anyway so I'm happy fate and
karma has taken care of it.
\_ Yes, but their job will follow them out of the country.
Soon all the "high-tech" work will be done in India and
China by barely tech literate people (by Berkeley EECS
standards) for peanuts. Software is about to become a
commodity and the days of six figures (at least in dollars)
for coders will be over shortly.
\_ Nonsense. And no I'm not a programmer so I'm not worried
or threatened by the possibility.
\_ Then you can exploit the holes in the software and make
millions.
\_ No, you can't, since the feds will come to your house
take your computers and lock you up for violating the
DMCA.
\_ DMCA? That has nothing to do with anything. Sheesh.
If you're going to whine about the gub'ment, please
at least educate yourself about it.
\_ Follow Rep. Tom Tancredo who is authoring H.R. 3222 to kill
the H1-B program. He is also an active opponent to illegal
immigration (eg. Bush's 245i amnesty). FWIW you can read
about him, where else, but http://freerepublic.com
\_ You're not victimized for being a citizen. You're victimized for
asking for a higher salary than those H1Bs. This is not a case of
discrimination. Sun is "discriminating" against those getting
higher salaries in favor of those getting lower salaries and doing
the same jobs. This is simply a business decision, not
discrimination under law. The real issue here should be whether
or not those remaining H1Bs are getting below-market salaries,
thus breaking the law. That law relates to protecting US labor,
not preventing discrimination. -- former H1B
\_ Last time I checked, these H1B workers are making way more
than CA's minimal wage. When is compensation below market
average is breaking the law now?
\_ I don't know when it started. When my employer sponsered my
green card application six years ago, the lawyer had to do
some paperwork to quote several major salary surveys in this
area to prove that I was getting above-market salary.
\_ No the real issue is whether companies should be allowed to
import labor from the third world to replace citizens here.
They're getting all the benefits of being an American company in
the US but not paying their dues back to the country that makes
their company's existence possible. The answer is that they
should not and are not legally allowed to hire an H1b to fill a
job when there's an American available for the position. |
| 2002/6/23 [Industry/Jobs] UID:25173 Activity:high |
6/22 To the liberals - have you ever had a positive experience
dealing with any government agency (eg. DMV)? Or, as in
my experience, are all bureaucrats rude, lazy and painful
to deal with. Then take a look at the Federal Register
(accumulation of SOME federal regulations since 1940):
http://www.mercatus.org/regulatoryaccounting.pdf
\_ I got pistol whipped once right by Reel Video and
the nice cop gave me a ride home. |
| 2002/6/19-20 [Industry/Jobs] UID:25146 Activity:insanely high |
6/19 How many hours a week do you work?
\_ during the dot com boom, +75 hr/week. After, 30 hr/week. The funny
thing is that now I enjoy my life more than before even though I
was almost a paper millionaire.
\_ do you have a 4 day workweek? or just slack off?
\_ A little bit more than 40.
\_ 0. -grad student
\_ 60+ -grad student -- not all grad students are lazy fucks.
\_ sign your name.
\_ why? what do you care?
\_ Yeah, some get the energy to moan.
\_ Work is relative. Does being _at_ work count as work even if I'm
just surfing? Total time lost is 40-100/wk plus commute. Real
work time is 10-65 + commute.
\_ 30 hr/week physically at work...actual work, 10hr/week.
\_ 40 hr/wk, 45 if you include commute, 35 if you deduct breaks.
\_ seems like people are working less post-boom. Is work getting
boring?
\_ 65 hrs/wk during the boom, 35 or so now.
\_ 50 hrs/wk at a dot-com during the boom, 40 or so now. Now my
salary is 20% higher, but I now get tiny options on stock
which probably won't go up.
\_ 0. -laid off dotcommer
\_ seems like a lot of people are working less than during the dot
com boom. Some are happier now. But are you getting bored
with your work? Are you doing more fun things with your free
time?
\_ I'm getting more, I'm working the same, I'm not any happier. My
problem is I don't want to work *at all* but can't afford to just
quit and not have an income. Starvation is so annoying.
[and stop deleting my stuff. i was here first you motd smushing
pig]
\_ I'd like to work about 20-25 hours per week with 8-10 weeks
vacation per year, but unfortunately, there is the 40
hour work week and only 3 weeks vacation per year.
Actual time spent working is less than 40 hours,
maybe less than 30. Time spent at work probably
45-50.
\_ Since we're project-based, it's roughly 35-40 hrs during non-project
time, and x hrs during project crunch time. (x = whatever it takes) |
| 2002/6/6 [Industry/Jobs, Computer/SW/Unix] UID:25009 Activity:nil |
6/6 Looks like Lawrence Berkeley National Lab has some job openings
for jobs like SysAdmins and Unix Support/Programmers. |
| 2002/5/15 [Industry/Jobs] UID:24841 Activity:high |
5/15 must read! http://ask.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=02/05/14/2044245&mode=thread&tid=156 \_ That's just some boring ass stuff about Indian programmers. http://www.mnftiu.cc/mnftiu.cc/war.html Now, that's a must read. |
| 2002/5/14-15 [Industry/Jobs] UID:24827 Activity:moderate |
5/14 Does "hiring freeze" mean no headcount increase, or no hiring for
replacement even when someone leaves the company?
\_ Both. At least in my company, it was the latter.
\_ I'm guessing it depends on what position leaves. If it's
a chief sysop or something, refill, otherwise, no?
\_ mmm... reduction by attrition... |
| 2002/5/7-8 [Industry/Jobs] UID:24742 Activity:high |
5/7 Is it possible to collect unemployment benefits if your voluntarily
quit? I'm reading http://www.edd.ca.gov and there's too much info. I can't
seem to find a clear answer. Thanks.
\_ Yes. You did keep a backdoor while you still had root, right?
\_ No.
\_ To add to this, even if it was a voluntary lay-off.
\_ There's no such thing as a voluntary lay-off. 1984. |
| 2002/5/3-6 [Industry/Jobs] UID:24698 Activity:kinda low |
5/3 Anyone has any experience with ACE? How was it?
\_ If by ACE you mean Doug Schmidt's Toolkit. I've used it
on and off over the years. Once you get the hang of ACE
it is really easy to write portable scalable programs.
Learning ACE can be a pain, esp. if you don't have someone
to talk to who already knows how to use it. It is also
a bit hard to get a new developer up to speed on ACE.
\_ Thanks! Does Schmidt's books (POSA2, ACE and Patterns,
ACE and Framework) help in learning it? Are they worth
getting?
\_ When I started with ACE, these books didn't exist
so I can't really say if they will help you. Given
what I have seen of Schmidt and co., these books
will heavy into c++ and patterns theory, so unless
you are *exteremely comfortable* with patterns, they
probably won't help you much. One of the reasons I
gave up on ACE was because of patterns.
\_ Telebears was a big improvement over ACE.
\_ ACE forms taught you how to deal with big, govt bureaucracies. |
| 2002/5/1 [Academia/GradSchool, Industry/Jobs] UID:24651 Activity:nil |
4/30 Ok, the job market in the computer industry is in the dumps.
Everybody knows that. How about for CS or EE PhDs? Any colleges
or big companies hiring? thanks.
\_ job_market(Bachelor) >> job_market(PhD), in any job conditions.
\_ why do you say that? What about PhDs who become managers
or Sr. Software Engineers?
\_ PhDs have greater salary requirements. Doors definitely
close for PhDs, though some new ones open. There is a PhD
glut in this country. Getting a PhD to improve your
career is not a wise choice.
\_ I worked with a PhD guy at one company who was very
good at theory but knew jack all about coding. Even
though I was IT Manager and never coded professionally
and *never* wrote anything in Java, I had to read and
explain java threading to him and help him redesign his
code. We all got laid off shortly after that, thank god.
\_ Not all PhD programs emphasize coding. Depends on the
discipline really.
\_ It was 2nd year undergrad level work. Would it be
fair to assume he got his BA before his Phd?
\_ as with anything in life your likelyhood of getting a job decreases
when you have more degrees. For example if you work at a McD
store you could probably work anywhere you want. But if you have
a PhD in AstroBiologyPhysicalAbstruceShit then there are only
a few places that you can work at. The moral of the story is to
simply do what you enjoy, you'll somehow survive anyhow.
\_ Sometimes people will also not consider you because they think
you'll be bored and look elsewhere when you get the chance. |
| 2002/4/23 [Industry/Jobs] UID:24546 Activity:high |
4/23 Any advice on where to find jobs that pay more than retail with
hours flexible enough for classes. ?
\_ Campus?
\_ I said that pay more than retail. Besides;
our good ol governor has a hiring freeze thanks to W.
\_ How is it W's fault that California is run by fuckups?
\_ UC system is exempt from the hiring freeze. - danh
\_ interesting since the CSU system has a freeze
-- SFSU student
\_ I should amend that to "uc system does not have to comply
with the hiring freeze when it would interfere with their
educational mission" - danh
\_ further, the hiring freeze applies only to those positions
paid for by state funds. if there are other sources of
funding available, doosh doosh.
\_ You could read the rest of the motd and see that ResComp
is hiring, for one.
\- I am not an Cal Student.
\_ How did you get a CSUA account, then?
\_ Don't be a moron. Some people actually live to
graduate.
\_ Let's see, you post a message on the
Computer Science *Undergraduate* Machine
asking how you can get a job that will
fit in with your *class**schedule* and
then call someone who points you to campus
jobs a moron. Go stick your head in pig!
\_ share and enjoy
share and enjoy
journey through life with a plastic boy
or girl by your side
that's your pal, be your guide
until it breaks down and starts to annoy
and grinds when it moves and gives you no joy
because it's eaten your hat
had sex with your cat
played ball on your wall
or riped off your dog
sednd it to us we won't giva fig
well tell you
go dstick your head in a pig. |
| 2002/4/23-24 [Industry/Jobs] UID:24542 Activity:moderate |
4/23 Want expand on your technical skills in a fun environment with flexible
hours? Apply to be a Rescomp sysadmin! Applications due April 24th @
12:00pm. For more info: http://www.rescomp.berkeley.edu/hiring
\_ Dude! Do I get a Dell?
\_ "Systems Administrators are paid $17.03 per hour and are
required to work 12-19 hours of work during the school year."
Is that hours of work per year, per month, per week?
When I was student we only got $9.03/hr.
\_ does rescomp still have RCC's and all those positions?
\_ yes. not as well paid as sysadmins, though.
\_ We currently are not hiring right now. Please check back later for
more info on positions which we may need to fill. If you have any
questions, please email us at hiring@rescomp.berkeley.edu. |
| 2002/4/20-21 [Industry/Jobs, Industry/Startup] UID:24507 Activity:high |
4/19 (Soon to Be) New Grads, get any offers yet? How much? Who's hiring?
-- '99 alum
\_ Yes. Mid 70s.
\_ Startup? Big Company? Bay Area? That's more than I'm making...
\_ Startup. Bay Area.
\_ only interest from Bay Area start-ups thus far... no formal offers
yet (two pending). what should I hope for/expect?
\_ Yes. Low 20s. Grad school.
\_ What startups are hiring? Where'd you find their names? Most of
the ones I see publicly posting job ads are total bullshit.
\_ What about defense companies? I've seen positions targetting
0-2 yr experience at defense company web sites. -another99alum
\_ I've talked to people that worked at defense companies for
20+ year careers. Their jobs are very unsafe. Less so than
at some random large corp. Once a project ends the engineers
all get axed and need to find a new project. End = completed,
cancelled, on hold for extended period, etc. And they say
the pay was nothing special. Plus lots of hassles with
security stuff which makes sense given who the employer is. |
| 2002/4/11 [Academia/GradSchool, Industry/Jobs] UID:24409 Activity:nil |
4/10 By far the most important component of an application is
extremely strong recommendation letters from respected
faculty that rank an applicant in the top 1-5%.
Again, we are sorry you were not accepted, but this year was a
particularly difficult one to gain entrance into our program.
We wish you all the success in the future.
CS Graduate Admissions
Stanford University
\_ That's an interesting point. Thanks for that.
I hear this year, getting into grad school (the better ones)
is much more competitive than before.
\_ phd or ms?
\_ I think both, a lot of students graduating this year
choose higher education over the job market (what job
market?). |
| 2002/4/6 [Computer/SW/Languages/Java, Academia/GradSchool, Industry/Jobs] UID:24348 Activity:moderate |
4/5 i2's fucked: http://news.com.com/2100-1017-877222.html \_ The CEO & President of the last dotcom I was at were both from i2. If they're typical i2 employees, then no shit i2 is fucked. |
| 2002/3/27 [Industry/Jobs] UID:24249 Activity:high |
3/27 From the CS162 newsgroup... though I'd be interested to hear an
answer myself:
"If any of you recently got offers for entry level positions in
SW development or know others who did, can you tell me what is
considered a good enty level salary this year... "
\_ You'd be lucky to find a job.
\_ I think it's still $5.15/hr. Good luck, kid. People with real
experience in the real world can't even get call backs or
interviews. This isn't 1998. No one needs or wants interns or
entry level NCGs this year or next.
\_ I've noticed that defense has picked up lately, check
Boeing, NorthropGrumman, LockheedMartin, etc. for jobs
and internships
\_ In CA, it's $6.25.
\_ Oh yeah. Forgot. I think you can still buy a house with that
kind of earning potential... near Chernobyl. |
| 2002/3/22-24 [Industry/Jobs] UID:24191 Activity:moderate |
3/21 I'm looking for a job. See http://flophouse.com/~dpassage/resume --dpassage \_ did you ever get a private pilot's certificate? \_ Nope. Once I didn't work a mile from the airport anymore, it got a lot less convenient. --dpassage \_ that was a test. You're a quitter, and we don't want to hire you. \_ I turned down a job at securant. How was it there? \_ There were some really great people at Securant, and some turkeys. It really helped my career but if I'd asked better questions during the interview process, I might have turned them down too. --dpassage \_ What do you want to do? Based on your resume, I would say sysadmin/networking admin is a direct fit. \_ They took almost 3 weeks to go from "We want to hire you" to "here's your offer letter". A good friend worked in HR there and told me the delay was due to the uh less than professional level of conduct (being nice) of two people who sat on the paperwork for so long HR had to start redoing paperwork because one of the geniuses lost theirs. They eventually did make a decent offer but I wasn't going to wait around for them to get it together. I signed with someone else for more money 2 days before they got me a written offer. And now they're gone. \_ font of the last line is different... looks "unprofessional" |
| 2002/3/14-15 [Industry/Jobs] UID:24118 Activity:high |
3/13 Nobody has experience with voicestream?
\_ Do they even offer coverage in the Bay Area? |
| 2002/3/12-13 [Industry/Jobs] UID:24091 Activity:very high |
3/12 Work has been kind of slow and there just isn't enough work
to keep me here 8 hrs a day. My manager aknowledges that too.
But on the other hand, he keeps on harrassing me for not
being here full 8 hrs a day and they pay my salary base on the
fact of me working 8 hrs a day. As a salary employee and
a software engineer on a project-based schdule, I am sure he
is wrong. But I can't find any information to prove him
incorrect. Any url please?
\_ Here's the deal. Like the others say below, he can keep you there,
you're not entitled to overtime, etc, etc. That's all true. Now
then, the real deal has nothing to do with overtime or paying you
or whatever. It has to do with making your boss look bad. If
you're not there his cubes look empty and *his* bosses start
asking ugly questions about why your boss is there getting paid so
much. As long as your boss is ok with you surfing, or *quietly*
playing some game, you have no problems and nothing to bitch about.
I'm guessing this is your first job or maybe your second? This is
the way the world works. I'm sure you'll make up for the paid-to-
-surf time later with plenty of 12 hour days of hard coding or
whatever. It's karma. It balances. Show your face 8 hours and
don't worry about it. --been there before and now
\_ Actually, I have been working 8 yrs. I just never worked
with quite a boss like him. His boss now "works at home"
4 days a week since it's so slow. I do play games/surf web/
etc, but he gets on my case for these too. He gets on my
case for 1 hr and 15 mins lunches. He wants me to "work"
8 hrs a day while not giving me enough work and akwnoledges
the fact that he hasn't given me any project. I am going
nuts.
\_ Wow, your first idiot manager in 8 years? You're lucky.
You need to learn how to better manage your manager. When
he tells you he wants you to be "working" you have two basic
choices: 1) say you are. keep lots of windows available with
source code on them. you're a) debugging, b) working on a
more efficient algorithm, c) adding comments, d) writing
documentation, e) sticking your thumb up your ass. Or 2)
you can risk throwing it back at him by asking him if there
was some project deadline we're not meeting that requires
more attention or ask him if he'd like to raise the priority
of one of your (non-existent) projects and ask him which one
he'd like you to be working on now. I've used the latter
method successfully and it's a more permanent solution bc
it makes your boss not want to harass you anymore but there's
political risk. He might feel you're being insubordinate and
can your ass. You know your boss better than the motd so
you'll have to decide which route is more effective and safer.
You don't want your boss to ask to see all that documentation
you've been working on if you've really been clock watching
and picking your nose for weeks. Good luck!
\_ go work in India or Russia... this doesn't happen there.
\_ He is not wrong.
\_ Really? If he is not wrong, then based on labor codes,
they also have to pay me 1.5x my salary when I work
overtime, which they never did. Am I not an "exempted"
worker?
\_ There's a "Highly Compensated Computer Professional"
exemption... No overtime if paid at least $41/hr. The
federal equiv is $27.63, so the Calif law (A.B. 88)
overrides that. -nevman
\_ Since when does state law override federal law?
\_ legalized marijuana, for example.
\_ prop 215 was suspended by a federal judge, as was
187 - states can not make federal-level policies
\_ Which is why the feds did a pot bust in SF a week
or two ago? Got a real example?
\_ Being paid $41 satisfies both laws. So it is not so
much an "override" (like pot), but a superset.
\_ I think a lot of managers get away with
not paying their workers over time in tech jobs,
but you know what, we're all overpaid anyway,
who cares.
\_ i'm not! oh, wait. i'm a grad student. nevermind.
\_ If you were paid hourly you'd be eligible for time and a
half. But your status as a full timer exempts you from that.
http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/.html/lab_table_of_contents.html
Section 226: ..."total hours worked by the employee,
except for any employee whose compensation is solely based
on a salary and who is exempt from payment of overtime
under subdivision..."
\_ You are exempt. As your boss, he can keep you there 8
hours or even 12 hours if he wants to. Stop whining
because he wants you to look busy for 8 hours and enjoy
the fact that you're getting paid for just sitting there.
Do your taxes or play Tetris or something. --dim
\_ here is a thought. Why don't you work on your on projects (c,
java, etc) which will look like you're coding hard. Or read
publications from ACM. Or take classes from SITN. You did get
into Comp Sci for the love of science right?
\_ Yeah, I second that. I would love to have free time like that
where I can learn interesting stuff on my own and upgrade my
skills. Mostly bogged down with gnarly stuff lately,
unfortunately.
\_ good idea. why not do something good for the company while
learning new skills? - !original poster
\_ someone tell me with SITN is?
\_ Take courses from Stanford remotely. Could lead to
an MS in CS.
\_ How much does that cost?
\_ it is almost equivalent to the cost of a Stanford
non SITN Master's. Your company may sponsor part
or all of the cost. |
| 2002/2/25 [Industry/Jobs] UID:23964 Activity:very high |
2/24 Getting tired of Bay Area. What is a good place to look for
technical jobs abroad? I speak Chinese and some Japanese.
\_ Are you talking about Web sites or actual locales?
\_ Check out Shanghai.
\_ tell us about the stars^H^H^H^Hhookers aaron
\_ shookers?
\_ aaron? try sky.
\_ Actually, if you are into software, then, I suggest
you look at Beijing instead. Northwest part of Beijing
is where most action is... having said that, I am not
sure how to go about this, as I am not originally from
mainland. Those who are from mainland, please fill
up the detail.
\_ Taipei or Tokyo. Shanghai if you're a pioneer.
\_ related: anyone know about how the pay falls off for software
engineering positions as you go overseas? eg, Europe, asia,
latin america. I'd like to try living/working somewhere else
for a while but don't want to sacrifice alot of pay.
\_ expect: $10k rmb/mon in china, $50k ntd/mon in taiwan
\_ where do you get the $10K RMB figure. Starting
salary for software engineer is about at max
$2K RMB. Unless you're in a real senior
position, $10K RMB / month is a lot at the
local standard.
\_ I also heard 10k to 20k, but this is for
people with a few years of experience in
US.
\_ About 10% (ie. 90% off) of the pay here of you go to India, but
you can live like a lord with that pay over there.
\_ There is a salary survey in http://www.asiaweek.com archives -
2001 (data for 2000).
\_ it would be nice if someone can share his/her experience on
working abroad (specifically, China and Japan). i am
interested on ASIC design opportunity. -original poster |
| 2002/2/16-17 [Industry/Jobs] UID:23887 Activity:high |
2/15 people, the job-market is moving again.
\_ Moving where? And where are the jobs?
\_ India & China for programming/high tech
\_ the offshore thing is a passing fad. It'll take about
3-5 years before US companies figure out this is more
trouble than it's worth.
\_ http://heather.cs.ucdavis.edu/itaa.real.html#tth_sEc9.5
\_ these guys clearly didn't actually try to hire
anyone two years ago. We were getting applicant
pools with 5 applicants, three of whom were
then working as janitors or something. Anyone
who didn't believe there was a shortage had their
head in the sand, or up their ass.
Nowadays, we're getting pools of 100+ applicants.
The methodology used to draw conclusions in the
above report is clearly flawed and designed
merely to grind a partisan axe. -tom
\_ It's a good thing we have your decidedly
unpartisan, bike-riding, linux-using ilk to
set us straight, Tom. |
| 2002/1/25-26 [Industry/Jobs] UID:23670 Activity:very high |
1/25 So my small startup company is asking each one of us to take a
semi-permanent (i.e. for the next 6 months) salary cut. I know I could
probably get a job someplace else for more money. Questions:
1) does http://salary.com still provide a pretty close estimate on 2001/2002
salary ranges or are they still providing stats from the '98-'99
golden era? When I looked at them I thought I'm getting screwed...
2) Would you work for a company that offers $75K/yr for software
systems architecture work?
\_ With the recent wave of layoffs, are you sure you can get a job
someplease else, let alone for more money?
\_ i don't think this is completely irrational. the
biggest cost for any company is by far money
for salaries.
\_ Don't know; but I have been looking. My mgmt simply can't be
trusted and I don't get along with my direct supe. My strategy
(if I can't find anything now) is to put in my required 8-9 hrs
a day and keep an eye out for better things. Any noticeable
flaws in this strategy? -- original poster
\_ I think no management can be trusted when they're talking
about compensation. They just keep on saying you're already
getting top salary at your level of skills. And they'll cite
whatever obsolete salary survey that lists the lowest salary
ranges.
\_ If you want to maintain your current salary level,
work less hrs. i.e., with a 12.5% pay cut, you simply
work 7 hrs a day, that basically puts you on the same
salary when you used to work 8 hrs a day. That's what
I do. Just make sure you still complete your work.
\_ Yeah but you're still taking home less every check.
\_ I've yet to see an online survey that even came close to what I've
made at various places for the last 7+ years. If you're making the
http://salary.com figures then I think you're low. Most of those surveys
allow people to self describe. I've seen surveys where "Senior
Unix Sysadmins" in the U.S. claim to be making $25k. Not even in
Alabama. As for the rest of it, *never* trust management. Even
if they didn't want to cut your salary it sounds like a shitty work
environment anyway. You should *always* be looking for a new job
even if your current job seems great. I think your basic plan is
fine. Do the bare minimum required to keep getting a check and
bug out the moment you get something you'd like. --been there
\_ There is more to work than money. Do you like what you are doing?
Do you enjoy working with your co-workers? Are you learning
new stuff or do you have more responsibility than you would
with your experience level at another place? If the answer to
all these questions is no, then you should definitely be looking
for another job.
\_ very obviously, his main interest is to collect pay checks if
his primary concern is salary. If a company is in this cutback
mode, I'd be more concern about the company outlook more than
bitching over salary cut. |
| 2002/1/25-26 [Industry/Jobs] UID:23666 Activity:very high |
1/24 Someone recommended http://dice.com... are all the postings in there by headhunters? any particular headhunters in there that are good? are there any good job websites that have regular job postings, not headhunters? \_ I keep recommending people NOT to use http://dice.com. Every response I got from there was from some annoying headhunter. \_ http://dice.com is free.. thats why headhunters like using it.. but they use it to find both people and jobs. also, small companies LOVE using http://dice.com for that same reason. we get almost all our resumes from http://dice.com and craigslist \_ long entry (sorry -- skip if you're not interested in the details of job boards): http://dice.com is NOT free for employers. it is actually pretty expensive for employers. however, it does attract the most headhunters into its database of resumes because mostly, that's how http://dice.com markets itself to employers (e.g., that it has a lot of contract employees on there). also, with the economy what it is, most employers are limiting themselves to only one or two resume databases, and from what I hear, they usually use http://Monster.com or http://hotjobs.com (which are even more expensive, but considered to have "better quality" resume databases). most job boards have now opened their clientele to headhunters, due to the economic conditions out there. however, http://hotjobs.com (which held out the longest in not offering access to headhunters), gives limited access to headhunters (ie, I think they allow headhunters to search the resumes, but not to post jobs), so it may be your "best" place to avoid HHs. --chris \_ Nothing wrong with head hunters per se. You just have to know how to deal with them. Your first question should always be, "What's the company's name?" If they start shitting around on you about they have numerous job openings blah blah, insist on a list of the companies they have in mind for you. Sometimes HHs have a real job in hand. It happens. \_ Headhunters are slimy, but very convenient. A good headhunter will find you an interview and negotiate your salary. Get several of them working for you at once and play them off against each other. I recommend starting with about 10 or 15, and narrowing it down to maybe 4 viable job offers. Try to have as many going at the same time as possible and tell them inflated reports of their rivals' yield. That's my advice. And yes I do this. -brain \_ Dice sucks. They kept on reposting the same jobs that's been filled long time ago. Try http://flipdog.com where you can also filter out recruiters posting if you like. \_ this is true -- http://dice.com tends to 'refresh' old job postings from employers (or in this case, headhunters). most employers do not know this happens (it happens at no extra cost, unlike http://monster.com), or they do not care. i believe that hotjobs also does not let jobs expire. --chris |
| 2002/1/22 [Industry/Jobs] UID:23624 Activity:insanely high 50%like:23239 50%like:25337 50%like:25383 |
1/21 What's the difference between a resume and a CV?
\_ the former is for people who work. the latter is for people who
theorize about work.
\_ a resume is supposed to be <= 1 page, with emphesis on skills
and buzzwords. a CV is for academics, mostly, or europeans, and
lists everything you've ever done, and can be up to 2-3 pages.
more or less. -chialea
\_ you should list your impressive boob size
\_ Actually CV's have no limit...since publications
are usually listed, they can get well over 10+ pages.
\_ although these days it's acceptable to have > 1 page resume when
you have had 5+ yrs of professional experience, highlighting the
company/client projects you've worked on, all the skills you have,
\_ Depends on the firm. For you academic types, the
Chronicle of Higher Ed has a good article on how to
convert CVs to resumes:
(http://chronicle.com/jobs/99/12/99120301c.htm
and others on putting together a successful CV.
etc. True especially for consultants. - jthoms
\_ I thought machines were used to read most resumes these
days so length was less relevant? --PeterM
\_ According to the Help-You-Get-Back-on-Your-Feet company
Jeeves hooked us up with after the layoffs, 2 pages
is the maximum, machine-read or not. --erikred |
| 12/25 |