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2018/08/18 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
8/18    

2001/7/12 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl, Computer/SW/Languages/Web] UID:21779 Activity:nil
7/11    who offers classes on PHP in the east bay area?  work is paying.
        \_ take the money and go get some cheap whores... why would you
           want to take a PHP class?
           \_ d00d! "cheap"?! do you realize how much a "PHP class" is likely
              to cost? this'd cover an all-night orgy with half a dozen
              top-notch professionals...
        \_ Don't bother.  If you know perl, you can learn PHP.  It's
           simpler, albeit with uglier syntax, and, IMHO, inferior.  If
           you don't know perl, learn it.  If you can't learn perl, you
           obviously have issues with functional programming languages,
           and won't be able to learn PHP.
           \_ Dude.  If Perl is a functional programming language then the
              Moon is made of green cheese.  Lambdas do not a functional
              language make.  Perl is about as procedural as they come.
              It's proud of it in fact.  Perl is evil.  Look at Ocaml if
              you want to know what Perl could have been if it was a good
              little language.
              \_ Hah!  Shows what *you* know!  You can do ANYTHING with perl!
                 even get yourself fired!!1!  err....hold on a second....
                 that came out wrong....
2001/7/3 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:21702 Activity:high
7/2     How do I change the path perl checks when I do a "require"?
        \_ Ocaml >> perl.
        \_ use lib "/my/module/directory";
           See "perldoc perlfaq8" for details.
        \_ This probably still works:
           BEGIN { push (@INC,"/my/dir/with/modules") ; }
           \_ It does; see "perldoc lib" for the differences.
              \_ lib is a perl module (.pm) right? I generally
                 avoid those since they are not compatible with
                 perl4 (yes people still use this).
           \_ If it's a script, I find it easier to just change the #! line to:
              #!/path/to/perl -I/my/module/directory
2001/6/23 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:21608 Activity:high
6/22    Is there a utility that helps you decode a hex dump?  I want a tool
        that lets you enter each field and the size of each field.  Then it
        takes in an ASCII hex dump and then decodes it according to the
        field information.  I'm getting a headache reading all these hex
        dumps.   Thanks.
        \_ perl is your friend.
           \_ Perl is the jism of satan.
              \_ is that a bad thing?
                 \_ I didn't know Saddam Hussein had a csua account.
                    \_ Get off my dick.
                       \_ I'm the hot gay dragon.
                          \_ What kind of a Marine are you???
           \_ indeed.  try "perldoc -f pack"
        \_ scanf("%x", ...)?
        \_ listen guys, I do not want to write any code to do this.  I'm
           looking for an application already written.  Free or shareware
           would be nice.   thanks.
           \_ An application to do this would require you to specify the
              format of your particular dump in some kind of detailed
              manner.  Jeez, just write the 5 or 10 lines of code it will
              take.
              \- possibly emacs hexl-mode --psb
        \_ what platform?  if Windows, frhed will let you do something like
           this, although it's a bit limited (byte/short/int/long/float/double
           fields only; can't specify bit-fields, can't specify arrays, etc.)
              \_ exactly.  you could specify a text file with type/size
                 information with each field, etc.  ok, making a custom program
                 to do it wouldn't be hard, but an already-existing, general
                 program would be still be easier.
2001/5/29 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:21378 Activity:high
5/30    tom, why are you adding "anonymous coward" and attributing every new
        post this morning to me?  You're even adding "anon coward" to things I
        signed.  And you're also attributing things to me posted by others.
        You're one weird dude and you also need to get your facts straight.
        As far as censoring goes, that's a funny accusation coming from you,
        someone who obliterates without comment numerous things you don't
        agree with.  Just so you know, I've got to get on with my day now, so
        you're free to libel and misquote me for the next few hours. Have a
        pleasnt morning. -reiffin
        \_  I would also like to take this oppuortunity to tell you
           to go to hell, Tom, for the posts of mine you've cowardly deleted
           past.  -lafe
        \_ that's just tom's way.  Him and his "RIDE BIKE TO THE THIRD REICH"
        - he's like Hitler on cheap weed. (perl and a cronjob, tom.)
        \_ go, reiffin! --anonymous coward
        \_ go, reiffin! --anonymous coward (!reiffin and
           !anonymous cowards below)
        \_ go tom! - not tom
        \_ I'm a part-time student and full-time staff member at U.C.
           Berkeley. I'm studying Computer Science, and working doing
           computer support for Letters and Sciences Computer Resources. I am
           active in the Computer Science Undergraduate Association and am
           on CSUA machine staff on a volunteer basis. --anonymous coward
           \_ I am an anonymous coward.  -- anonymous coward (!reiffin, in this
                                                                case)
        \_ Just believe everything reiffin says and you will be okay. -!!psb
           \_ !!!!!!!
2001/5/12 [Computer/SW/Compilers, Computer/SW/Languages/Perl, Computer/SW/Editors/Vi] UID:21252 Activity:nil
5/11    http://www.grrl.com/hackerboy.html
2001/4/26-27 [Computer/SW/Database, Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:21112 Activity:nil
4/26    I'm looking for software that can do the following.  Anybody know
        of such a package for a small business?
        1.  Track customers' data and their order history.  Plus I need to
            enter customized data fields that can be searched.  E.g, "list
            all customers who ordered XYZ".
        2.  A way to combine information from a arbitrary number of customers.
            E.g., "list all order from all customers from such date to such
            date".
        3.  Some minimum accounting functionality.  Accounts payable, accounts
            receivable.  Simple stuff.
        I'm doing all this stuff in Excel. And it's getting hard to manage.
        I need like a small database with a customizable front-end.  But with
        a lot of small-business functions preconfigured.  Thanks.
        \_ /usr/bin/perl or /usr/local/bin/perl on some systems.
        \_ Used to do this in Access.  It is Easy(tm) but not worth the effort
           compared to either PeachTree or QuickBooks Pro.  Both do full
           accounting, rudimentary customer management, and full order mgmt.
        \_ I was also going to reccommend peachtree, just as long as you don't
           ever intend to become a big (or even medium) sized company, 'cause
           peachtree is definitely a small business only system (or was 6 yrs
           ago when i last used it.  Things might have changed.
        \_ How about UNIX based systems?  Anyone? Ones that will work with
           a postgress backend database maybe?  or should i not hold my breath?
        \_ I'm looking at PeachTree and QuickBook web sites.  They are also
           offering online version of the products.  Like QuickBase.  It keeps
           customer information in their database and you use a web browser
           to access it.  Anybody used it?  Comments?
        \_ QuickBooks easily does this for you.  It isn't the most
           sophisticated piece of software, but it works.  From what you
           describe, you do not need QuickBooks Pro.  And you could perhaps
           use QuickBooks for the Web, although it only works on Windoze and
           only works with Internet Explorer (yes, they are lame... don't even
           get me started).  And if you want QuickBooks for cheap ($50), I can
           get it to you. -phale
2001/4/24-25 [Computer/SW/Languages/C_Cplusplus, Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:21079 Activity:moderate
4/23    Anyone know of a pretty print util for Windows 2000?  (I had a2ps for
        so, where can I get it?  (Please, no suggestions to change OS.)
        \_ print utility to do what?
           \_ Sorry, meant "pretty print" for source code (c++ perl, etc.)
              \_ You meant something like enscript?  If your printer driver
                 supports two pages per sheet, you can simply open your source
                 file as plain text and print with that feature.  Otherwise,
                 You can create a template in M$ Word to use landscape
                 orientation, two columns, and a small mono font.  Then open
                 a new document with that template and paste in your source
                 code.  Then print it.  (The latter was how I printed enscript-
                 like output on my 9-pin printer years ago.)  Either way, don't
                 forget to also utilize any two-sided printing feature to save
                 even more paper.  -- yuen
                 \_ But dumbya told me that cutting down trees is good for the
                    economy.
                    \_ Young troll, remember: to find enlightenment you
                       must hit where it hurts.  Ad hominem doesn't hurt
                       anything except your chances of walking the true
                       path to great trolldom.
                 \_ http://gnuwin32.sourceforge.net/enscript.htm
                 \_ Enscript is similar to a2ps--I was under the impression that
                    enscript had been absorbed into a2ps.
        \_ emacs
           \_ Wow, emacs sends to the printer?  And formats the code like a2ps?
              Are you sure about this?
              \_ M-x print-buffer/ps-print-buffer/ps-print-buffer-with-faces do
                 send output to the local or network printer.  Don't know about
                 formatting.
                 \_ yes, emacs does format like a2ps
2001/4/23 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:21058 Activity:very high
4/22    I have some data in an HTML database. I want to display some of it
        in a mysql table. what's the fastest, easiest way to do this? I
        don't need to be able to enter data, or do anything fancy.
        \_ HTML database -> display in MySQL table.  Whew.  Good thing you're
                \_ why do you keep deleting references to perl?  -tom
           not using something like HTML for presentation.
        \_ go find some sample php code.
                    \_ PHP bigots can't stand a real language like perl or
                       c.
                       \_ Oh my God!  You mean there's a "language" even
                          more pathetic than Perl?!
                          \_ There are many languages more pathetic than
                             Perl: Active-X, VBScript, J[ava]Script, PHP,
                             ASP, JSP, C#, Pascal, Lisp (and derivatives).
                             \_ Young troll, you will become more effective
                                if your arguments are plausible.  Now what
                                plausible argument were you going to use for
                                lisp?
                                \_ lisp? lisp is useful? Please demonstrate
                                   a use to me. And no emacs customizations
                                   isn't a valid use.
                                   I've written a expert system in lisp
                                   before and let me tell you that it is
              severely deluded.
                                   a slow useless POS.
                             The list is practically endless. About the
                             only decent languages in existence are C/C++,
                             Perl and Java (and even that is debateable).
                             \_ Without starting a Perl flamewar--why did you
                                list Active-X as a language?
                                \_ LOL, I think he meant COM.
                                   \_ I meant (D)COM, which I believe is
                                      called ActiveX Contorls or some bs
                                      like that. Strictly speaking its
                                      probably not a language.
        \_ http://wdvl.internet.com/Authoring/Languages/Perl/PerlfortheWeb/index6.html
           Is a pretty good bare bones tutorial on the Perl DBI module.
           Leaves out lots of details, but it should do for your needs.  If
           you need something more detailed, go to Cody's or B&N and page
           through the Programming the Perl DBI (O'Reilly) book. -dans
        \_ PHP made me quite a bit of cash 1 day. - paolo
        \_ My chevy rules over your Ford.
           \_ Dude, unless you're talking about your 'vette, you are
              severely deluded.  Chevy > Ford?  That's funny.
              \_ chevy suburban vs. ford expedition. suburban wins
                 hands down. Same can be said for camaro vs. probe
                 and metro vs. aspire.
2001/4/21-22 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:21046 Activity:kinda low
4/20    Anyone knows of a company where they are hiring Perl developers?
        \_ sun
        \_ ActiveState
        \_ People to develop in perl, or people to develop the perl language
           tools themselves?
           \_ People who develop in Perl.
              \_ There are some openings in Hell.
2001/4/18 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl, Computer/SW/Unix] UID:21022 Activity:high
4/18    I want to filter a file with sed and store the output back into
        the same file.  Is there a way to do this without a temp file?
        \_ no, if you want to do this use either awk or perl (perferably
           perl)
           \_ Please use a language (preferably English).
           \_ perl -pi -e 's/.../.../g ; s/other/foo/g' file1 file2 ...
        \_ yes.
2001/4/18 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:21017 Activity:nil 66%like:21064
4/17    perl-5.6.1 installed, bugs to mconst.
2001/4/16-17 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl, Computer/SW/OS/OsX] UID:21003 Activity:high
4/16    I have a bunch of ^M s from mac files i transfered over. I'm
        sure there is a quick and easy way to remove them all, but i
        don't know how to specify cntrl characters in my script.
        Someone please point the way.
        \_ Does vi's :1,$s/<ctr-v><ctr-m>// work?  I think emacs also
           has a remove trailing  function.
                \_ Are you really helping by giving it away?  He was 99% of
                   the way there.
        \_ man tr.  Or do a search/replace in your favorite editor.
               \_ For the hopelessly lazy: tr -d '\015' < file > newfile
           \_ yes fine, i could come up with "do a search/replace" myself
                the problem is that i don't know how to write ^M so that
                my editor can read and match. it.  How about i make this
                specific:  perl -pi -e 's/^M/ /g' FILES doesn't work. What
                do i need to type instead of "^M" or actually pressing the
                CNTRL and the M key together, so that i can match this char.
                Does anyone know what the ascii (alt+3) number is for this
                character or where i can find that?
                \_ Heh... guess what?  "man ascii".  "But if you teach a man
                   to fish...."
              \_ perl -pi -e 's/\r\n?/\n/' FILES
                 this will work for both Mac & DOS formatted files --dbushong
                 \_ Didn't you answer this question like 47 times before?
        \_ How many times has this been asked on the motd before?
        \_ just ftp your files over in ASCII mode
2018/08/18 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
8/18    

2001/4/9-10 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl, Computer/SW/Languages/Python] UID:20925 Activity:very high
4/9     Does anyone here use the Python language on a regular basis?  What do
        you use it for?  What is your opinion of it as a language?
        \_ ML >> Perl >> Python.
           \_ Tcl >> ML >> ... >> PHP
                \_ I've seen Python, PHP, Perl, and TCL.  3 of 4 are crap.
                   Got a link for ML?  I can decide for myself.
                   \_ http://cm.bell-labs.com/cm/cs/what/smlnj
           \_ Who is it that keeps putting ML into these Python comparisons?
              I seriously doubt anyone would consider ML where they were
              thinking of using either Perl or Python. Might as well put
              Prolog into these comparisons.
              \_ Ok!  ML >> Prolog >> Perl >> Python.
                 \_ Scheme >> ML >> Prolog >> Perl >> Python >> JavaScript
                    \_ ML >> Scheme.  Scheme doesn't have a type system.
                       \_ so what? you making fun of it? it gets by just fine
                          without one asshole.
                          \_ Silly troll.  I programmed lisp in the industry.
                             I _know_ how bad runtime type errors are in
                             lisp-like languages.  Train harder.
              To answer the original poster's question, Python is a nice
              language. It's a poor-man's Smalltalk. There are some weird
              quirks to the language, but i would prefer it to Perl for
              all but the simplest tasks.
2001/3/22 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:20877 Activity:low
3/21    Why does perl's open function not error when you try to open
        a file for reading that is not readable by you?
        \_ Of course it does.
2001/3/18 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:20833 Activity:high
3/17    Are there any perl modules to handle command line flags simply?
        I want something like "if (Flag1.value == foo) then {...}"
        \_ man Getopt::Std
        \_ Search for 'getopt' on cpan, there are lots.
        \_ It's perl.  Of course.
2001/3/14-16 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:20774 Activity:moderate
3/13    does anyone happen to know when/where the python infosession
        will be on thursday?  thank you.
        \_ Perl >> python
           \_ ML >> Perl >> python
              \_ ML >> prolog >> Perl >> python
              \_ yermom >> ML >> Perl >> python >> ilyasmom
              \_ Yes, Ilya.
        \_ a little after 6pm, 306 soda. see the motd.official and/or all the
           flyers around soda. - chialea
2001/3/9-14 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:20732 Activity:nil
3/13    How do you change the logging behaviour of sudo after it has
        been installed?  (i want to log all actions taken as sudo).

#!/usr/bin/perl -w
# 531-byte qrpff-fast, Keith Winstein and Marc Horowitz
<sipb-iap-dvd@mit.edu>
# MPEG 2 PS VOB file on stdin -> descrambled output on stdout
# arguments: title key bytes in least to most-significant order
$_='while(read+STDIN,$_,2048){$a=29;$b=73;$c=142;$t=255;@t=map{$_%16or$t^=$c^=(
$m=(11,10,116,100,11,122,20,100)[$_/16%8])&110;$t^=(72,@z=(64,72,$a^=12*($_%16
-2?0:$m&17)),$b^=$_%64?12:0,@z)[$_%8]}(16..271);if((@a=unx"C*",$_)[20]&48){$h
=5;$_=unxb24,join"",@b=map{xB8,unxb8,chr($_^$a[--$h+84])}@ARGV;s/...$/1$&/;$
d=unxV,xb25,$_;$e=256|(ord$b[4])<<9|ord$b[3];$d=$d>>8^($f=$t&($d>>12^$d>>4^
$d^$d/8))<<17,$e=$e>>8^($t&($g=($q=$e>>14&7^$e)^$q*8^$q<<6))<<9,$_=$t[$_]^
(($h>>=8)+=$f+(~$g&$t))for@a[128..$#a]}print+x"C*",@a}';s/x/pack+/g;eval
        \_ So, what's the purpose of using "eval" here? -perl newbie
           \_ RTFM. most single-arg perl commands take $_ as the default arg
              if they're not given one. so eval at the end evals everything else,
              which is stored in $_.
                \_ I know what eval and $_ stand for. I did not ask this
                   correctly I guess. I am wondering what's the purpose of
                   doing this fancy '$_=".."; eval' stuff? Looks like
                   redundant to me.
                   \_ (1) obfuscation; (2) compression by being able to use "x"
                      instead of "pack+", which occurs frequently in the actual
                      executed code (i.e. note the s/x/pack+/g). -alexf
                   \_ just being clever about it.  It isn't strictly required
                      but it sure looks cool.
2001/1/29-31 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:20461 Activity:moderate
1/28    http://perltidy.sourceforge.net
        This is a "beautifier" for Perl (like indent(1) for C). It hasn't been
        really announced yet; the author would like it if people tried it out
        to see if they can find real problems before it is announced to the
        world. (Perl is hard to parse, so it will always be possible to write
        code that perltidy treats differently than perl does; but it should
        work on all code that people actually write, including obfuscated perl
        contest entries.) --Galen
        \_ but perl is all about writing cryptic one-liners.
           \_ The perl beautifier will remove all the carriage returns for you.
           \_ no, it just converts it to java
        \_ Seems to work pretty well; I'd like an option to make/leave
           lists/hashes as:
           %foo = (
             a => 1,
             b => 2
           );
           instead of:
           %foo = (
             a => 1,
             b => 2);
           --dbushong
           \_ That's the default; did you mean you want the two-line version?
              \_ Sorry, without the trailing comma too; corrected above.
                 --dbushong
                   \_ the perl whore
                      \_ You know, Dave, Java would be faster for that. -Ilya
                         \_ DA STARS. WE WANT TO KNOW ABOUT DA STARS.
                         \_ You show me that Java is faster for declaring that
                            hash, in terms of "faster to write" or "faster
                            to run", and maybe I'll believe you.
2001/1/24 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:20411 Activity:kinda low
1/22    In perl, how do I read a set of vars from a .*rc file?  In bash,
        I'd just say ". $HOME/.foorc" and all the varname=value pairs come
        into scope.  What's the perl equivalent?
        \_ perldoc -f require
           perldoc -f use
           \_ Both of these require the use of perl's package syntax in
              the .rc file.  I'm looking for something simpler.
              \_ They don't -- just write your rc file with lines like
                 $variable = "value";
        \_ require 'filename.pl';
           ... use the variables you set in that file...
           The only trick is that filename.pl has to end with a positive
           value... just make the last line of the file:
           1;           ##dbushong
                1;
                \_ Ladies and gentlemen, we have a winner!
2001/1/18-19 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:20367 Activity:low
1/19    How do I read from an input  pipe in sh or perl?  I need a little
        script that can read in "echo foo | myScript"
        \_ you use 'read' in sh, and <> in perl. i.e
           while (<>) print $_; is perl equivalent to /bin/cat
        \_ In perl: explicit is <STDIN>; magical is <>
        \_ In csh: accessing $< gives you a line from stdin
2001/1/17 [Computer/HW/Languages, Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:20342 Activity:kinda low
1/16    Has anybody written perl scripts that translate CAD related data
        files (all in text) from one format to another?  Or know of one?
        I'm just looking for an example of this type of program.  Thanks.
        \_ Which CAD software?
           \_ from some PC program whose name I don't remember to berkeley's
              MAGIC.  The translation is straightforward.  There's a set of
              keywords and numbers following keywords.  I'm looking for an
              sample program that does something similar.
              \_ Magic was a piece of shit. Even with its so-called "user
                 friendly" Tcl/Tk GUI Max it still stunk. Fortunately, in
                 the real world, you use real CAD tools (which unfortunately
                 Synopsis will charge you 7 digits for).
2001/1/7-16 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:20259 Activity:nil
1/5     I hate motd censors. - cronjob + scp + perlscript.
        \_ I squish motd bots.  - root
        \_ You need Tom's permission to post anything not directly interesting
           to Tom.  I think he's writing a CGI to auto-grant permission based
           on twink points but you'd have to ask him for details.
2000/12/6-8 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl, Computer/SW/Languages/Misc] UID:20028 Activity:low
12/6    anyone know how of a script to extract from an xml file
        and save as some type of formatted text?  or can you point
        to where one should look online for that kind of info?
        \_ uh, xml is a formatted text file. what do you really
           want to do?
                \_ for instance, extracting tag information.
                input /whatever to look for it and return
                lists of values following the named tags...
                \_ You can really write this yourself in C or Perl, but
                   there is free XML parsing code in Java
        \_ Look on CPAN, I'm sure there's plenty.
        \_ XSL style sheets
2000/11/16-17 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl, Computer/SW/Languages/Functional] UID:19806 Activity:high
11/16   I have two arrays a1 and a2 and I need to create an array a3
        that contains all the elements in a2 that are not in a1. I'm
        doing this by removing elements in a2 that are in a1, but this
        is an operation of nm complexity (where n is number of elems in
        a1 and m is number of elems in a2), is there a better way to
        do this? - not a cs geek
        \_ are the arrays sorted?  can they be? (becomes (m+n) lg m problem)
           \_ I could sort the arrays, but the contents are
              strings, so I'm not sure what difference it
              would make.
        \_ This is a O(size(a1) + size(a2)) operation.
           Create a hashtable.  Go through a1, and hash the elements.  Now go
           through a2, and insert an element into a3 if it is not in the
           hashtable.  This is an entry level coder interview question. -- ilyas
           \_ I see. Thanks.
           \_ can you give me an example of a suitable hash function?  Thx.
              \_ google.  Here is the first result of my search:
                 http://burtleburtle.net/bob/hash/doobs.html
                 \_ this is confusing.  can you give me a clear example,
                    pls?  Thanks.
                    \_ Train harder, grasshopper.
                       \_ Someone said this was an interview question.
                          Is there a simple enough solution that you
                          can write out for the interview?
                          \_ There is, but I will not write it out for you.
                             Firstly, because most interviewers are interested
                             in an algorithm, not an implementation, and
                             secondly because you are lazy, and I have no
                             desire to do your work for you
                             \_ I'm still confused as to why hashing
                                is the solution.  What if your
                                array values were int's?  Is hashing
                                still better?  By the way, you need to
                                be less presumptuous, among other things.
                                \_ I don't think I am presumptuous.  I think
                                   I am being very polite, patient and helpful.
                                   You, on the other hand, are acting like an
                                   immature, impatient, ungrateful, lazy prick.
                                   For your information, one can come up with
                                   'reasonable' hashing functions for arbitrary
                                   data structures (java does something like
                                   that).
                                \_ You're getting free advice, you should
                                   be thankful you've gotten this much
                                   information. -someone else
                                   \_ There is something wrong with you.
                                      Do not think because you give
                                      free advice that you can be
                                      an asshole at the same time.
                                     \_ yer the asshole who said I was
                                        presumptuous.  -someone else #2
                        \_ I hate ungrateful dumbasses who think that
                           people owe him an answer.
        \_ The answer is on the WWW. Look it up.
           \_ found it on google. Its in the perlfaq.
        \_
(defun find-common (a1 a2)
  (mapcar (lambda (elm1) (setf (symbol-plist elm1)
                               (cons 'marked (symbol-plist elm1))))
          a1)
  (prog1
      (mapcan (lambda (elm2)
                (if (eq (car (symbol-plist elm2)) 'marked)
                    (list elm2)))
              a2)
      (mapcar (lambda (elm1) (setf (symbol-plist elm1)
                                  (cdr (symbol-plist elm1))))
              a1)
      ))
2000/10/17-18 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:19505 Activity:high
10/17   What do i have to change in my apache configs to allow users thier
        own cgi-bin under ~/public_html like it is here on Soda?
        \_ put 'Options ExecCGI' in the section marked with
           '<Directory /home/*/public_html>'
              \_  Thanks, i'll try that though it doesn't seem to be the
                  way it is done here.
                  \_ Unix: more than one way to do it.
                     \_ Perl: many wrong ways to do it.
                        \_ What does Perl have to do with apache, cgis, or
                           anything else on this thread?  Might as well talk
                           about taking your gf to a lap dance sex club or
                           something equally relevent.
                        \_ right and wrong is subjective unless the sys
                           admin says so, cuz they're always right.
                                                        -sys admin
                        \_ whatever is easiest for the sys admin at the time,
                           is the right way to do it and Perl lets you do
                           things the easy way for now. Code extensibility,
                           scalability, portability, that's for academia.
                           \_ Really? I guess I work at the wrong company
                              since we care about that stuff. Getting other
                              people to extend our scalable framework is
                              how we generate a significant portion of our
                              revenue.
                                \_ You have revenue?  Time to switch jobs.
                                   \_ Uh, no. I like having a steady source
                                      of income and a regular work schedule.
                                        \_ Where'd you get the idea that
                                           revenue = steady job?  Your 9-5
                                           ass can be fired just as fast as
                                           <DEAD>myass.com<DEAD>.  The guaranteed job
                                           days were over decades ago and they
                                           weren't so guaranteed then, either.
                                           Go check out the market.  Go read
                                           up on the bogus accounting practices
                                           at places like MS and Cisco which
                                           require ever higher stock prices to
                                           keep their companies afloat on a
                                           giant river of hope and accounting
                                           mismanagement.  Think pyramid
                                           scheme.
2000/8/3-4 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:18856 Activity:nil
8/2     What are the flags to get PERL to tell me what modules are installed?
        Do i have to recompile PERL in order to user a PM like GD.pm or can i
        just put that .pm file where it is looking for it?
        \_ perl -e 'foreach (@INC) { print "$_\n"; }'
           With perl5, you can use "perl -V" to get this info and more.
           No, you don't need to recompile perl. Thus the term "module."
           No, you don't need to recompile perl. Thus the term "module." -alexf
2000/7/26-28 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:18768 Activity:nil
7/25    SF startup needs clued perl hacker. Mail jobs@viralon.com. -- Marco
2000/7/18-19 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:18709 Activity:very high
7/18    Anyone have a perl one liner to list all the files less than an
        hour old in a directory?
        \_  man perl.
        \_ perl -MFile::Find -e'find(sub{print if (-M _)*24<1},".")' --pld
        \_ perl -e 'system("man find");'
        subday granularity short of using the "newer" switches. in pl you
        can do something like:
        \_ ls -altr | tail -50 | more | eyeballs
           \_ eyeballs: Command not found.
                \_ Eyeballs was part of my standard install.
                   \_ mine too, but then I got owned through an exploit of
                      a hole in libchernobyl 0.1, and the bastards deleted
                      it. can you send me a copy?
                        \_ Sorry.  License violation.  You'll have to
                           reinstall.  They're not open source.
                           \_ AW FUCK!
           \_ i dont think there is a simple way to use find to get
              subday granularity short of using the "newer" switches. in pl
              you can do something like:
              $ageday = (-M $FILE_TO_STAT);
              $agehrs = $ageday * 24;
              $agemin = $agehrs * 60;
              $agesec = $agemin * 60;
                                        --psb
              \_ psbesque formatting fixed. -motd formatting demigod
                \_ i used to have a lot of respect for psb. it's all gone now
                \_ Watch it buddy!  Don't dis the psb formatting --psb #1 Fan
        \_ I like 'newer' switches.
        \_ so a one-liner would look like, eg:
           perl -e 'while(<{.,}*>) { print "$_\n" if (-M)<1/24; }'
           [psb, answer the question]
        \_ or perl -e 'system ( "find . -mmin 60" );'
                                        \-boy i somehow missed the -mmin
                                        flag. i stand corrected. however it
                                        should be -mmin -60 with gnu find.--psb
2000/7/7-9 [Recreation/Dating, Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:18611 Activity:kinda low
7/7     Anyone know how to get scan to display the year in the date
        field?
        \_ After you're married, are you allowed to scan for dates at your
           buddy's bachelor party?
                \_ Only in Perl.
        \_ Yes.  This is mh?  There's a bunch of config files for this stuff.
           Read the man pages and check out the system files.

------------ [that's it, nothing else to see, scuddle along now] ------------

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

Yep.  There was nothing else to see.
2000/6/23-25 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:18530 Activity:low
6/22    Has anybody tried to write a new mode for emacs?  I have a new
        language and I just need some basic indentation and color.  Non
        of the current modes can be tweaked to suit my needs.  Is there a
        template somewhere I can follow?  I would hate to wade through
        cc-mode.el or perl-mode.el to figure it out.  There is just too much
        stuff in those modes that I don't need.  Thanks.
        \_ I made a mode for Lua starting with tcl-mode.el as a base.
           tcl-mode.el is pretty intelligible.  And next time, sign your name
           so I can just mail you about it. -mogul
           \_ Thank you, this will be most useful. -!original poster (as a
              reminder that motd replies>>mail replies)
        \_ ML is the standard language.
           \_ Dude, this is so tired.  It *might* have been amusing the first
              time, now it's just stupid.
              \_ Marketing is stupid, I agree.
                \_ ED!
           \_ WTF is Lua?
              \_ Lua, WTF?
              \_ Some people are really really stupid.  A) It's obvious from
                 context.  B) The first thing that shows up on a google search
                 tells you the answer.  <sigh>
2000/6/1 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:18378 Activity:high
5/31    #!/usr/local/bin/perl
        @a=(Lbzjoftt,Inqbujfodf,
        Hvcsjt); $b="Lbssz Wbmm"
        ;$b =~ y/b-z/a-z/ ; $c =
        " Tif ". @a ." hsfbu wj"
        ."suvft pg b qsphsbnnfs"
        . ":\n";$c =~y/b-y/a-z/;
        print"\n\n$c ";for($i=0;
        $i<@a; $i++) { $a[$i] =~
        y/b-y/a-z/;if($a[$i]eq$a
        [-1]){print"and $a[$i]."
        ;}else{ print"$a[$i], ";
        }}print"\n\t\t--$b\n\n";
        \_ this is fuckingstupid. -ali
        \_ ali is fuckingstupid. -this
        \_ i'm with ali
                    |
           <--------+
        \_ in this case I AM ali
2000/5/23-24 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:18326 Activity:low
5/23    Death to Perl!
        http://www.segfault.org/story.phtml?mode=2&id=3905b40e-05c0a760
        \_ PROLOG! PROLOG! PROLOG IS THE STANDARD!  Highly useful language
           no one ever uses.
2000/5/18-20 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:18291 Activity:nil
5/18    perl-5.6.0 installed, bugs to mconst.
2000/5/16-17 [Computer/SW/Languages/C_Cplusplus, Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:18276 Activity:very high
5/15    I need to write some c++ client/server code using sockets.  Is there
        a nice library to use or do I need to roll my own.  I want something
        which makes it easy to set up a connection and then have the
        client and server communicate via << or >>.  Thanks.
        \_ Idiot.  C++.  READ!
        \_ actually, I have some really sleek Pacsal libraries that
           I've managed to fine tune for above average performance.
           If you're interested, post a followup....
        \_ If you want to use Java, there is an easy way to do it... look at
           the Socket class.
           \_ Thanks, but I was planning on using c++.
        \_ It's pretty easy to do in Tcl.
                \_ Idiot.  C++.  What's wrong with you people?  READ!
        \_ you can buy libraries like Roguewave.  Or, you can create your
           own classes and perhaps buy the Steven's book.
        \_ Using C code, it wouldn't be hard to write your own << and >>
           operators.  Get some sample C code and go from there.  Is this for
           Unix or another operating system?
        \_ Might be useful:
                http://www.gnu.org/software/commonc++/CommonC++.html
           \_ Thanks.  This is exactly the kind of thing I was looking
              for.  Unfortunatl, the documentation is a bit sparse.
        \_ I know this asian chick that does killer COBOL.  I'm
           sure I could get her to send along a pointer or two if
           put up your email addy.
        \_ Perl is perfect for socket programming. Perl is perfect for
           replacing Java and C.
                \_ Idiot.  C++.  READ!
                \_ Yer welcome.  -mogul
        \_ All non-CC+ replies purged.  --not original poster
2000/5/9 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl, Computer/SW/Unix] UID:18206 Activity:very high
5/8     Is there a Visual Basic equivalent to the UNIX system() function?
        I need to write a VB program to run a bunch of dos commands
        and report the results to the user.  If I had a choice, I would
        use perl, python, tcl, bash, or something like that, but I need
        to create a program that will run a standard windows system.  Thanks.
        \_ Yes.
        \_ Yes.
        \_ Perl runs on windows just fine, so does the bourne shell.
          \_ Sorry.  What I should have said was that I need a solution
             which does not involve installing perl, python, tcl, bash or
             some other tool which is not installed on a standard system.
             \_ Install gcc and write a C program to do it.
                \_ Duh.  Without installing anything.
        \_ ShellExecute or CreateProcess - chiapet
        \_ Shell (command, windowmode)
          \_ Thanks.  Shell seems decent.  Is there any way for Shell
             to return the output to VB?
2000/5/2-3 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:18151 Activity:moderate
4/32    Trying to use POSIX.pm in perl.  I have:
>>      #!/usr/bin/perl
>>      use POSIX;
        But perl complains
>>      syntax error in file .//wparse at line 2, next 2 tokens "use POSIX"
        What am I doing wrong?
        \_ '/usr/bin/perl -v' will tell you. use /usr/local/bin/perl{5}
        \_ Not sure, but as a side note: POSIX.pm has tons of stuff; just
           import what you need, e.g.:
           use POSIX qw(strftime setsid);       ##dbushong
        \_ I switched to /usr/local/bin/perl and it works fine.  Any ideas as
           to why we have two perl binaries?  I thought the parsers were very
           backwards-compatible.  Perhaps one should be deleted? -- Thanks
                \_ Perl 5 is not completely backwards compatibile with 4.
                   Many common scripts have to be updated to use Perl 5.
2000/4/19-20 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:18061 Activity:nil
4/18    Is there a Perl-DBI for dos/Windows9x machines?
        \_ yes
            \_Great.  Where can i get it?
                \_ Install/use activestate perl.  http://www.activestate.com
        \_ perl dbi is the database package right?  I know there are really
           easy to use perl to odbc libs that are standard.  Maybe that is
           perl DBI?  I dunno.  Been too long.  Thank god I don't know this
           crap anymore.
2000/4/12 [Computer/SW/Languages/C_Cplusplus, Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:17975 Activity:nil
4/11    question: if i declare (pseudo code):
        Interface1 *pInterface1;
        what do these return: &pInterface1 and *pInterface1?
        \_ &pInterface1 - the address of the memory location that holds
                 pInterface1
           *pInterface1 - the value stored in the memory location whose
                address is stored in pInterface1
           (since you didn't say assuming C - the answers would be very
            different in another language such as perl)
            \_ thanks, i really appreciate it. - comdude
           \_ wow, you people are fast.  I see unedited motd and when I edit,
              someone already wrote this.
2000/4/11-12 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:17973 Activity:moderate
4/11    If I add in mod_perl, is there anything extra I have to do on the
        hundreds of *.cgi's files that I created?
        \_ Yes.  There is a guide with the mod_perl documentation that
           tells you what to do.  Mod_perl is MUCH pickier than most Perl
           programmers. That is to say, your scripts may require a lot of
           reworking. --sowings
           \_ I think the most common catch'em (for me) is that my CGIs
              operated on the assumption that variables == 0 or empty string.
              Alas, when run under mod_perl, variables tend to have the value
              from the last time they ran (can't depend on this though),
              so you need to make sure you always reinitialize things.
              \_ 1) Good thing you don't write in C (or perhaps you don't
                    write your C this way).
                 2) This is because mod_perl caches scripts.  If the script
                    hasn't changed on disk, the server doesn't have to
                    recompile it.  This is what buys you performance.
                                                        --sowings
                \_ If you put #!/usr/bin/perl -w at the top and
                   "use strict;" in the code, you'll get a good idea of
                   the changes you need to make.  -tom
2000/4/6-9 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:17944 Activity:high
4/6     I wonder how many bugs will come out once time hits 0xDEADBEEF?
                \_ 0xFEEDFACE of 0xCAFEBEEF with 0xDEADBABE
        \_ the fun one will be sep 9 2001. the ascii representation of
        a time_t will roll from 999999999 to 1000000000, and thousands
        of lazy perl hacker code will sort lexicographically and launch
        the nukes. --aaron
        \_ Damn, why the hell do people (like the guy below) like to tab
           so far out.  What I'm curious about is what will happen to
           computers once 2^32 seconds have passed by since 1970 (which
           should happen around the year 2106).  What will happen then?
           Will the world predict a Y2.106K bug that will end the world
           again?
                        \_ I thought that time_t wraps around in 2037.
                           Anyway, if we are still alive we should all
                           be using 128 bit or larger processors if not
                           quantum computers, meaning that time_t won't
                           wrap for several billion years (?).
                           \_ you must have this much clue to post to the
                              motd...
                              Hey wait, how did you get there.  Go back to
                              your basement or something and stop talking outta
                              your ass.
                \_ It doesn't seem likely that lazy perl code would do this;
                   if you are using "<" and ">" perl will treat the scalars as
                   numbers.  You'd have to be explicitly using "gt".  -tom
                   \_ He said sort.  Perl sort defaults to cmp, not <=>.
                      --dbushong
        \_ (why does this keep getting deleted?) 0xdeadbeef is a negative number
           for signed 32-bit ints.  0xdeadbeaf refers to sometime in 1952.
           for signed 32-bit ints.  0xdeadbeef refers to sometime in 1952.
           \_ What's so special about 1952? Was that the year dead beef
              was invented?
              \_ No, that's what you get when you take 0xdeadbeaf and convert it
                 to a signed decimal (-559038737), and add that many seconds to
                 Jan 1, 1970.  That's about 17 years and change.  Hence 1952.
                 \_ well duh. I got that part.  I'm saying what's so special
                    about 1952?  That's like saying that 0xF00DF00D will take
                    us back 1879961613 seconds putting us 59 years back from
                    1970.  Who cares?
                    \_ So what was the question?  Do you really believe that
                       there was some cosmic conspiracy to choose Jan 1 1970 so
                       that 0xdeadbeef would be sometime in 1952?  What are you
                       asking then?
                    \_ What's so special about 1921? Was that the year food
                       food was invented?
2000/4/6 [Computer/SW/Languages/Java, Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:17940 Activity:nil
4/6     C vs. Java vs. Perl comparisons:
------------------
#include <stdio.h>
#include <stdlib.h>
int fib(int num) {
    if (num==0 || num==1) {return 1;}
    return fib(num-1) + fib(num-2);
}
main(int argc, char *argv[]) {
    printf("%d\n", fib(atoi(argv[1])));
    exit(0);
}
------------------
import java.lang.*;
class fib {
    private static int fib(int num) {
        if (num==0 || num==1) {return 1;}
        return fib(num-1)+fib(num-2);
    }
    public static void main(String args[]) {
        System.out.println(fib( (new Integer(args[0])).intValue() ));
    }
}
------------------
#!/usr/local/bin/perl5
sub fib {
    my($num)=@_;
    if ($num==0 || $num==1) {return 1;}
    return fib($num-1)+fib($num-2);
}
print fib($ARGV[0])."\n";

        Conclusion: C is still the fastest. Java is not as slow as people
        think it is. Perl is nowhere close to Java performance.
        \_ I could an implementation on my TI-85 pseudo-BASIC that will kick
           the crap out of any of those. Take an algorithms course. That's
           the conclusion.
2000/4/6 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:17937 Activity:nil
4/6     C vs. Java vs. Perl comparisons:
2000/4/5-6 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:17936 Activity:insanely high
4/5     In C/C++, how do you implement "ls" type of functionality without
        using a "system" call?  Where can I get the source code for "ls"?
                                \_ http://ftp.gnu.org, <DEAD>ftp.freebsd.org<DEAD>,
                                   http://ftp.redhat.com, and fifty million others
        \_ Your implementation of a directory/folder is system-dependent.  Hence
           you need to use system calls.
        \_ Okay, found something for WinNT: findfirst, findnext using io.h
        \_ POSIX/UNIX: opendir/readdir/closedir.  Other OS'es: see your OS'es
           API docs.
           \_ thanks.  but what a pain.  why can't someone put a layer on
              top of that and make it more portable across various OS's.
                \_ Sun did.  It's called "Java".
                   \_ this is a stupid answer. POSIX api *is* supposed to be
                      the multiplatform solution. opendir/readdir/closedir
                      are very much multiplatform and are definitely not UNIX
                      only. if your OS doesn't support it, looking for YET
                      another "standard" library is asking for lack of
                      portability. -ali.
                                \_ Java is better than POSIX. POSIX
                                   compliance is limited mostly to UNIX
                                   systems (and WinNT) while Java is
                                   usable on Mac,Win*,*nix and others.
                                   And once you compile your java files
                                   into classfiles you can give them
                                   to someone on a different platform
                                   and they can run it without needing
                                   to recompile.
                        \_ Use ACE! It works everywhere and does everything.
                           ACE will rule the world! ACE ED will be the standard
                           editor/library/os/everthing.
                   \_ Fuck Java, use Perl!
                        \_ Java has real OO, not some stupid hack like
                           in Perl! We should ditch Perl5 and go back to
                           Perl4. If you need OO, then use Java. Also
                           if your are doing web stuff that accesses
                              It's also
                              a royal pain to set up with any real webserver.
                           ldap servers or db servers Java (servlets)
                           are much better than Perl cgi. And don't give
                           me that crap about fast cgi or mod_perl. There
                           are several problems with reusing server
                           connections.
                           \_ OO is a style of programming that need not be
                              supported by language constructs.
                           \_ Uh.. crack.  Have you actually looked at the
                              performance numbers for mod_perl vs. java
                              servlets?  Java loses.  Heavily.
                              \_ URL?
                             \_ http://www.chamas.com/bench/hello_bysystem.html
                                --dbushong
                                It's also a royal pain to set up with any
                                real webserver.
                                \_ This page is bs and it even states that:
                                   "These benchmarks do not represent real
                                    world scenarios."
                                    Perl is faster for simple form processing
                                    and basic text output. But how many cgi's
                                    do that anymore. Most are wrappers for
                                    accessing services like a db or ldap or
                                    corba or a tib. Perl loses here.
                                    Benchmark a java servlet that does jdbc
                                    odbc access using a connection pool
                                    against a perl cgi that needs to open
                                    a db connection every time it is invoked.
                                    Java beats the pants off of perl for
                                    most transactions. Same for LDAP. I
                                    know that Java is better since I worked
                                    to convert a large perl cgi based product
                                    (worked on the perl cgi's in the original
                                    version) to java servlets for Cisco and
                                    we got ~ 1.5 to 2x improvement on the
                                    server side performance. Setting up JRun
                                    or Appache JServe isn't that hard. If you
                                    think JRun's setup is hard your admin fu
                                    is really weak. The most recent versions
                                    required only 5 lines in httpd.conf.
                                    \_ JRun is an utter piece of shit.  I
                                       had to restart it once a day when
                                       it barfed all over itself.
                                        \_ I haven't had this problem for the
                                           last few versions. But I'm using
                                           JServe now since I don't like
                                           Alaire's upgrade policy regarding
                                           old Live cust. They asked me to
                                           pay full price for the latest vers.
                                       mod_perl does not need to open new
                                       database connections every time;
                                       that's what Apache::DBI is all about.
                                       And saying you got a performance
                                       improvment over "perl cgi" is idiotic.
                                       Of course you did, the compile/exec
                                       penalty on non-mod_perl is lethal.
                                       \_ We were using mod_perl, but Apache::DBI
                                          wasn't stable enough for our needs.
             \_ POSIX API exists for most OS's.
             \_ Tcl/Tk also has platform independant APIs for this kind
                of thing.  I've used Tcl/Tk and I highly recommend it. -emin
                \_ Tcl/Tk is pretty junky compared to Perl. If you need
                   to use a scripting language use Perl or Bourne Shell.
                \_ there really is no point in doing Tcl in my opinion.
                   Instead you should use python. It's easier to learn,
                   it's easier to write wrappers for your C code in it,
                   it runs faster (actually, i don't know about tcl8.0),
                   and it's got builtin support for OO. -ali
                   \_ I checked out the python web page and it does seem
                      pretty nifty.  I'll try using it next time instead
                      of Tcl. Thanks. -emin
                        \_ Any language that uses white space for scope
                           is pretty junky. Next they will dictate the
                           columns that I can use. Fortran anyone?
                \_ tcl + python are academia languages and are USELESS
                   PERL R3WL$!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
2000/4/1-3 [Computer/SW/Languages/Java, Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:17907 Activity:high
3/31    how can i tell whether a Java object is an array?
        ie applet.getClass().toString() -> java.applet.Applet
        (new int[] { 1, 2, 3 }).getClass() -> ?
        \_ Arrays aren't objects, they are primitive types.  Your question
           betrays a serious lack of understanding of what an object is, and
           an array is.  I hope you haven't graduated.
           \_ Your reply betrays a serious lack of experience programming
              in Java,  Java isn't my first choice, but that's like one
              of the first principles you learn coding in it.
           \_ "Java arrays are objects" -- the opening words of Chapter 10,
              Arrays, in the Java Language Spec.
           \_ nevertheless, you can do:
                1) (new int[] { 1, 2, 3 }).getClass()
                2) Object o = (new int[] { 1, 2, 3 })
                3) BUT NOT Object o = 1
              so its not an object... ??? :p
              go read: http://www7.software.ibm.com/vad.nsf/Data/Document2712
              and you'll see the reason for the question.
              its a big kludge by Sun
           \_ array.getClass().isArray() -> true
              hope you haven't graduated either ;p
                \_ the String class supports '+' and '+='
                   \_ that's just syntatic sugar,
                      but object vs primitive in Java is a Real Big Mess(TM)
                        \_ "Java=C++--" - Bill Joy
                        \_ GO Smalltalk!!! -purist
                        \_ PERL 5.6!!!
                           \_ ED! ED is the Standard Language!
                                \_ so how can you tell if an ED! object is
                                   an array?
                                   \_ Its all just memory anyway, just toggle
                                      the right bits in RAM. How hard is that?
                                      (Not hard at all, if you have ED fu!)
                                        \_ It's easy in PERL.
                                           \_ This thread looks similar to
                                              Bresenham's algorithm.
                                                \_ I wrote that in PERL with
                                                   ED once, just for kicks.
                                                   \_ NO, WINDOWS. WINDOWS IS
                                                      THE STANDARD EVERYTHING.
                                                      \_ Microsoft invented
                                                         the Internet.
                                                         \_ I heard that BG
                                                            wrote PERL with an
                                                            early version of
                                                            ED.
                                                            \_ cool.
                                                   \_ NO, MAC OS X WILL SQUASH
                                                      WINDOZE SOON.  LONG
                                                      LIVE APPLE-NeXT
                                                      \_ NO, WINDOWS. WINDOWS
                                                         EATS EVERYTHING FOR
                                                         BREAKFAST. IT IS THE
                                                         SOLUTION TO ALL YOUR
                                                         PROBLEMS. NEED AN
                                                         ABORTION? WINDOWS
                                                         WILL TAKE CARE OF IT.
                                                         NEED TO HAVE YOUR CAR
                                                         FIXED. WINDOWS WILL
                                                         TAKE CARE OF IT. BILL
                                                         GATES IS MY GOD.
                                                      \_ NEGATIVE...THE
                                                         NEW HYBRID OF UNIX
                                                         AND THE MAC OS WILL
                                                         TURN THE TIDE IN
                                                         IN THE MAC/PC WARS
                                                         FOR YEARS TO COME.
                                                         MACS WILL NO LONGER
                                                         JUST LOOK GOOD...
                                                         THEY WILL ESTABLISH
                                                         A NEW PARADIGM IN
                                                         PERSONAL COMPUTING.
                                                         STEVE JOBS, THE
                                                         SMELLY-ASSHOLE,
                                                         DAUGHTER-DUMPING,
                                                         "REALITY DISTORTION
                                                         FIELD MAN" IS THE
                                                         TRUE MESSIAH WHO
                                                         WILL RESTORE
                                                         BALANCE TO THE
                                                         FORCE.  REMEMBER:
                                                         THERE CAN ONLY
                                                         BE ONE.
2000/3/30-31 [Computer/SW/Mail, Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:17887 Activity:low
3/29    Sr. UNIX SA needed at Sendmail, Inc. in Emeryville.  email
        christine@sendmail.com if you're interested.  Oh, and engineers
        with clue in C and/or Perl, too.
        \_ Make sure you know at least three Perl bugs.
            \_ Doesn't handle garbage collection correctly. -- ilyas
            \_ It's ugly.
               It's slow.
               Compiling is broken.
                \_ You just described sendmail.
                   \_ what's your point? But anyway, I'm talking about
                      byte-code compilation. You can't "compile" a .cf file
                      to binary, last I checked.
                \_ Jealous python developer!
                   \_ Nice replython necktied beaver -(fucker)
        \_ Make sure you can read minds during the interview.  They don't
           know how to ask a question.  And woe be unto those who provide
           _a_ correct answer, but not _the_ correct answer as per the
           required ESP.
           \_ when I interviewed they just asked me really picky perl
              quesitons that said nothing about my ability as an engineer.
              \_ it probably said a lot about your ability as an engineer.
                 happy hunting!
        \_ I suppose one of the requirements is to be able to write
           /etc/sendmail.cf from scratch, using /bin/ed at 60wpm ?
           \_ close. But use cat.
                \_ cat is for wimps. Use a magnet and toggle the bits
                   on the correctly hd platter.
                        \_ They let you use a magnet in your interview?  They
                           must be dropping the standards.  I wasn't allowed
                           to use a magnet.
                           \_ I made my own electro-magnet using the iron
                              in my interviewers blood and the electricity
                              from the wall socket. I solved the problem
                              but I wasn't hired.
                              \_ DISCRIMINATION! you need to sue them
                                because they are practicing religious
                                discrimination against voodoo
2000/3/24-25 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:17845 Activity:moderate
3/24    Can you have nested parenthesis in perl regular expressions?
        If so, what is the rule for assigning the corresponding $d variables?
        \_ Yes: you count open parens.  So in /(foo(bar))/, $1 is "foobar"
           and $2 = "bar".
        \_ no.
           \_ yes.
              \_ xor.
        \_ Why don't you post the code and what you _think_ it should do and
           maybe you'll get a real answer.  Perl being perl, your question can
           be interpreted in more than one way.
2000/3/18-19 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:17797 Activity:high
3/17    Been RTFM, but I can't figure this out in Perl: How do I search
        a string for a specific pattern, eg. [0-9][0-9]/[0-9][0-9],
        and return just that pattern to another variable?
        \_ No need to make it personal:
           $str =~ /([0-9][0-9]\/[0-9][0-9])/ ; $v = $1 ;
           \_ $str =~ m|\d{2}/\d{2}|; $v = $&;
           \_ You are telling me it took less effort to write this motd question
              than to look this up?
                \_ It's not a trivial thing to look up.  -tom
                \_ I was reading the camel book. I still haven't come across
                   where it says matches go to $1. But thanx to the person
                   who answered!
                   \_ You must not have read very far. Its on page 28 of
                      the pink camel book.
                      \_ Oh fuckin' spare me.  Like anyone except nweaver
                         can memorize the whole book or is willing reread the
                         goddamn thing for something that may or may not be
                         near the beginning.
                                \_ I'm not nweaver, but I've been using perl
                                   since v3.0 and I did perl programming for
                                   a living for several years before moving
                                   to java/c++ and now back to c.
                         \_ s,nweaver,mconst,g
                                \_ yes, he's more nerdy than smart.
                         \_ Get real.  This is totally trivial.  This is one of
                            the first perl-ish things I learned.  -not nw/mc
                        \_ So exactly how advanced does a question have to
                           be so it can be asked on the motd without flames?
                           Heck, if a question is hard, it shouldn't even be
                           asked cuz we're all so smart here. This question
                           may be trivial or basic to some, but not to
                           everyone. Telling the guy he's stupid for not being
                           able to find it in the book is pointless & childish
                     \_  It can't be helped...no matter how intelligent they
                         may be, you have to remember that at heart, too many
                         csua-ers are immature egomaniacs...*sigh*
                        \_ It's easy to look up if you know what it is.  If
                           you don't, what do you look up?  "pattern matching"
                           is a huge topic.  -tom
                           \_ It's only one chapter.  Read it.
        \_ or, another way: ($v) = $str =~ m/($pattern)/;
           if you couldn't find this in the manual, you didn't look --
           it's one of the basic features of regular expresions.  it's
           also easy to find in the camel book.  or : 'perldoc perlre'
           -kurtz, working with perl now, though i'd rather use java or c
                \_ It apparently wasn't spoon fed enough from the book.
        \_ Oh, yes, "perldoc perlre" should be so obvious to a new perl user.
2000/3/17-19 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:17788 Activity:nil
3/17    Which of the available public www libraries for perl are better,
        for general purpose?  (Not to complicated yet have a good enough
        selection of features.)
        \_ Just get the standard www from cpan.  Everything else web related
           requires it anyway.  Should almost be a default install item.
2000/3/16-17 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:17782 Activity:moderate
3/16    When I do some pattern Matching in a Perl script on the string
        in the arguement $_[0] to a subroutine, it seems that $_[0]
        itself gets modified.  Is this normal?  I thought backrefrencing
        affects $digit but not the argument array @_.
        \_ "argument"
        \_ just have a temp value to preserve it before you call the
           subroutine. some of the mysteries of perl seem to be not
           clear no matter how many times you scour the O'Reily series
           \_ I did try that and it worked and I concur with the observation
                about perl in general.  It perhaps shows how match (not
                substitution) really works.
        \_ @_ is passed in by reference.
2000/3/16-17 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:17775 Activity:nil
3/14    Is there a UNIX utility that, when given pw and salt pair, will
        give me a /etc/passwd|shadow equivalent of crypt(pw,salt)?
        \_ its called perl.
          \_ something like:  perl -e 'print crypt ( "$salt", "$pw") . "\n" ;'
             \_ ("$pw", "$salt")
        \_ Can't ed do this?
2000/3/13-14 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:17752 Activity:nil
3/12    What are good intro./ref. on the net for perl with emphasis on
        www related programing among the zillion found by search engines?
        \_ http://www.cpan.org
        \_ http://perl.apache.org
2000/3/6 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl, Computer/SW/Unix] UID:17694 Activity:nil
3/5     I'm trying to configure majordomo but I keep getting this error:

   ----- Transcript of session follows -----
wrapper: Trying to exec /usr/lib/majordomo/-c failed: No such file or
directory
    Did you define PERL correctly in the Makefile?
    HOME is HOME=/usr/lib/majordomo,
    PATH is PATH=/bin:/usr/bin,
    SHELL is SHELL=/bin/sh,
    MAJORDOMO_CF is MAJORDOMO_CF=/etc/majordomo.cf
451 "|/usr/lib/majordomo/wrapper majordomo"... Operating system error

        I've looked in /etc/majordomo.cf and found nothing that would
        cause a non-existent program like -c to execute. Any ideas?
        \_ well, duh, Did you define PERL correctly?
2000/2/28-29 [Computer/SW/Languages/Java, Computer/SW/Languages/Perl, Computer/Theory] UID:17642 Activity:insanely high
2/28    If the push-down automton can accept the language consisting of all
        words in the form (a^n b^n, n=1,2,3,...), how come no pushdown
        automaton, deterministic or non-deterministic can accept
        (a^n b^n c^n, n=1,2,3,...)? How would a linear bounded automaton
        accept this language?
        \_ Just write a perl script for some computer.  Make k large enough
        \_ Do you own homework.
           to make 3*n*k be equal to the RAM size of the computer.
           \_ 'your'
                \_ 'typo'
                   \_ 'idiot'
                        \_ Think of this the next time you typo, idiot.
           "That's how."
                \_ and people wonder why the csua is a sysadmin farm
        \_ pumping lemma pumping lemma pumping lemma, hehe.
        \_ Do your own homework.
        \_ Are you saying no one has shown that it can, or are you saying
           someone has formally proved that it can't?
           \_ "Someone" has formally proved that it can't, and YOU CAN, TOO!
              With just a small 4-unit investment into an intro complexity
              class, YOU TOO can go around saying cool words like "pumping
              lemma", "LBTM", "Savitch", and "EXPfuckingSPACE." Take 172,
              and CHANGE YOUR LIFE FOR THE BETTER! -alexf (real answer: pump)
              \_ I did take 172 in Spring '91.  I just had a lousy professor
                 (Anvari).
        \_ How relevant is complexity, architecture, automata&languates,
           logic&systems design, theory of computation? NONE. I took a
           c++/Java class and now I'm making 80K/year.          -not CS major
           \_ relevant to what?  just because most people in computers
              dont need to understand fundamentals doesn't make it important.
              this is like all those idiots who think that because they make
              tons of money in software hardeware is useless.  without
              people to concieve of new kinds of computing devices who understa
              nd theory and people to build those devices, you would not
              have anything to work on for your 80k/yr.  no one is going
              to pay you 80k/yr to write addition algorithms on Babbage's
              difference engine.  not relevant to *your*life != not relevant.
                \_ I happily make tons of money in a non-hardware field and
                   fully appreciate all the hardware toys that come my way.
                   Not a CS major and making more than the clown above who
                   doesn't get it.  Every advance in either software or hardware
                   is good for everyone's bottomline.
           \_ Is your code maintainable and extensible?  Probably not...
                \_ Are you in school and making +80K? Probably not.
                   Are you in industry and making +80K? Probably.
                   \_ Industry is for brainless people and academia is for
                        brainy people. Industry sucks and academia rules.
                        B1FF G0 BAC|< 2 SK00L!!!!!!!
                        \_ "I work for academia and get paid less to do less,
                           therefore I am morally superior and more intelligent
                           than my industry counterpart."  This is such a total
                           crock.  It was hard to get a good first industry job
                           coming from academia because in industry they know
                           the book worms don't know how to produce, can't work
                           and can't get along well with others.  Academia isnt
                           even academia anymore.  How many rooms and buildings
                           are named after companies or CEO-ish sponsors?  How
                           many projects on compas are paid for in whole or in
                           part by industry?  You think that's free money from
                           the goodness of USA INC's heart?  Academia is the
                           cheap research arm of industry, today.  Traditional
                           academics are dead.  Long dead.
                           \_ Idiot.  It's the long term research in the
                              industry that is dead.  Go away, you superficial
                              software drone.
2000/2/22-23 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:17585 Activity:high
2/21    Quick question: For married couples, does filing jointly or filing
        separately yield lower tax?  Roughly how much difference?  Thx.
        \_ Yes, lots.
        \_ in general, if both people work and makes comperable amounts of
           money, filing separately is better.
        \_ It isn't called the Marriage Penalty Tax for nothing.  -married
           \_ Yeah, but the way it is now it encourages one person to stay
              home and take care of the kids.  It's only a penalty if both
              are working.

Tragic headlines from ABC news today:

        PERL GUNMAN SLAYS 2, HURTS 8 IN MALL RAMPAGE
        \_ Just think of how many innocent lives would have gone unscarred if
           he'd used awk, cat, and sed: he'd have wasted so much time trying
           to pipe the output of this into the output of that and worrying
           about whether or not he was using sh or csh that the authorities
           would have apprehended him before he'd done any damage.  Languages
           should only be in the hands of those who undergo regular
           psychiatric evaluation and who are properly licensed by the
           government to use them.  BAN PERL NOW!!!
           \_ I agree.  Most people I've met who are hardcore use Perl/use
              Linux/ride bike types are definitely in need of regular
              psychiatric evaluation.
                \_ Love my car, hate bikers, really hate linux fanatics, and
                   use perl everyday and loving it.  Am I suffering from
                   some sort of MPD?  Is there a 12 step program to turn me
                   into a full-on raving bike riding linux fanatic?  Thanks,
                   motd wisdom!    --seeking help
                   \_ i'm guessing the first step involves reading a man page,
                      and probably several other steps involve RTFMing.  just
                      a guess.
        \_ It is inevitable that something like this would happen
           sooner or later.  This is what happens when you give away
           software to anybody on the Internet. This open-source
           stuff has gotten out of hand.  There should be a
           3-day cooling-off period with in-depth background checks
           before letting anyone download Perl source code. I've
           known of young 12-year old kids downloading Perl and
           then going out and killing children and parent processes,
           breaking loops using 4 different types of commands, mixing
           scalars and other data types...
           Dont get me wrong -- when I was growing up, we consumed
           our fair share of stuff like sed/awk/grep/csh/sh. But
           things were more innocent back then -- sure, a few guys
           I know did C, but we never had this stronger, addictive
           scripting stuff like Perl -- and it was not as widespread.
           Now with the Internet, video games and Linux, anybody
           can get this stuff, and they dont know how to handle it.
           Sure, the naysayers will try to argue that they have a
           *right* to have Perl in their home and on their computers.
           Well, recent studies have shown that a (perl)loaded computer
           in the home gives you a 68% increased risk of shooting
           yourself in the foot.
           \_ You PC liberals are always trying to take away rights
              guaranteed by the US Constitution!!!!
              It is our right to bear Perl. (1st amendment)
              It is our 1st amendment right to bear Perl.
              \_ I dont just mean for PC's but even Macs and Sparcs.
                 And i think you mean the second amendment. The first
                 is for freedom of religion and expression.
                 is for freedom of religion and expression.
                 \_ Not 2nd! It is the 1st amendment: Freedom of
                 \_ Not 2nd! I said 1st amendment -- Freedom of
                    regular expressions.
        \_ You don't have the choice to file separately.
                \_ You don't have enough clue to hold 2 brain cells together.
                   Go read form 1040 and try again.
                   \_ hey!  that's mean!
                   \_ I read it every year.  And your point was...?
                        \_ Note the part where you choose "Married filing
                           jointly" or "Married filing separately"
                                \_ Yup.  And...?
                                   \_ Then you do have the choice to file
                                      separately.
2000/2/21-22 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:17582 Activity:very high
2/21    Tragic headlines from ABC news today:

        PERL GUNMAN SLAYS 2, HURTS 8 IN MALL RAMPAGE
        \_ Just think of how many innocent lives would have gone unscarred if
           he'd used awk, cat, and sed: he'd have wasted so much time trying
           to pipe the output of this into the output of that and worrying
           about whether or not he was using sh or csh that the authorities
           would have been able to apprehend him before he'd have done any
           damage.  Languages should only be in the hands of those properly
           licensed to use them.  BAN PERL NOW!
           would have apprehended him before he'd done any damage.  Languages
           should only be in the hands of those who undergo regular
           psychiatric evaluation and who are properly licensed by the
           government to use them.  BAN PERL NOW!!!
           \_ I agree.  Most people I've met who are hardcore use Perl/use
              Linux/ride bike types are definitely in need of regular
              psychiatric evaluation.
                \_ Love my car, hate bikers, really hate linux fanatics, and
                   use perl everyday and loving it.  Am I suffering from
                   some sort of MPD?  Is there a 12 step program to turn me
                   into a full-on raving bike riding linux fanatic?  Thanks,
                   motd wisdom!    --seeking help
                   \_ i'm guessing the first step involves reading a man page,
                      and probably several other steps involve RTFMing.  just
                      a guess.
        \_ It is inevitable that something like this would happen
           sooner or later.  This is what happens when you give away
           software to anybody on the Internet. This open-source
           stuff has gotten out of hand.  There should be a
           3-day cooling-off period with in-depth background checks
           before letting anyone download Perl source code. I've
           known of young 12-year old kids downloading Perl and
           then going out and killing children and parent processes,
           breaking loops using 4 different types of commands, mixing
           scalars and other data types...
           Dont get me wrong -- when I was growing up, we consumed
           our fair share of stuff like sed/awk/grep/csh/sh. But
           things were more innocent back then -- sure, a few guys
           I know did C, but we never had this stronger, addictive
           scripting stuff like Perl -- and it was not as widespread.
           Now with the Internet, video games and Linux, anybody
           can get this stuff, and they dont know how to handle it.
           Sure, the naysayers will try to argue that they have a
           *right* to have Perl in their home and on their computers.
           Well, recent studies have shown that a (perl)loaded computer
           in the home gives you a 68% increased risk of shooting
           yourself in the foot.
           \_ You PC liberals are always trying to take away rights
              guaranteed by the US Constitution!!!!
              It is our 1st amendment right to bear Perl.
              \_ I dont just mean for PC's but even Macs and Sparcs.
                 And i think you mean the second amendment. The first
                 is for freedom of religion and expression.
                 \_ Not 2nd! I said 1st amendment -- Freedom of
                    regular expressions.
2000/2/17 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:17531 Activity:high
2/16    Perl Question: Under perl5 does local() do anything or do you have
        to use my()?
        \_ "When in doubt, use my. When not in doubt, think twice, and
            then use my." local() has very limited applications and can
            almost always be replaced by my.
                \_ Certain variables cannot be my'd. Basically, think of
                   local as "assigning a temporary value", and my as
                   "creating a private variable." See perlsub, like the
                   poster below suggests. -brg
        \_ Use local for dynamic scope, my for lexical.
           \_ And use perlsub(1) for a detailed explanation of exactly
              what this means.
                   \_ Thanks this had the explanation I needed. Basically,
                      in perl5 I need my() whereever I used to use local().
                \_ Go back to CS 60a/61a if you don't know what this means.
                   Do not pass 164, do not collect diploma.
        \_ Go read http://www.cpan.org you idiot.
           \_ This is a language issue, moron.  CPAN distributes packages.
              \_ Yes, RTFM before wasting people's time.  CPAN has, among
                 other things, the entire perl manpage in convenient
                 html form.  Idiot.
                 \_ THE MOTD IS FOR PEOPLE WHO WANT TO WASTE TIME.  DUH.
                 \_ It's only a waste of a person's time if that person
                    chooses to respond. And even then, that person may not
                    find it a waste. How much time did you waste to respond
                    anyway?
                    \_ You must be a fellow tweaker.  --tweaker
                       \_ I admit it. I tweak a lot.
2000/2/4-5 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:17428 Activity:moderate
2/3     For people who know Perl intimately:
        Does anyone know why system("echo hello world |& tee hello.log 2>&1");
        does not work?
        \_ Not perl, sh: you meant "echo hello world 2>&1 | tee hello.log".
        \_ Use perl's internal pipe mechanism, it'll work faster.
        \_ the problem is you dont understand that the 'system' function
            invokes its argument with /bin/sh, not csh. -ERic
                \_ That's not even csh, it's some strange hybrid
                        \_ It's /bin/msh.  Don't recognize it?
2000/2/3-5 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl, Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Troll] UID:17420 Activity:high
2/3     Does emacs automagically understand lines like the following or
        do I have to do something special in .emacs? How can I get emacs
        to automagically insert these lines at the start of all my
        c and tcl files?
     /*-*-Mode:C++; c-basic-offset:8; tab-width:8; indent-tabs-mode:t-*-*/
>
2/3
What is the difference between flamebait and a troll?
        \_ Use perl.

2/3
        What is the difference between flamebait and a troll?
        \_ Semantics? Or a troll is a post to gain attention, and flamebait
           is a post intended to provoke vehement reaction. I dunno really.
           \_ flamebait is something stupid. "MS-DOS is the best OS".
              A troll is something inflammatory posted deliberately,
              about a 'big issue'. But usually posted in the guise
              of an "innocent" poster. eg:
                "Why does the army let fags in anyway?"
                \_ No.  A troll is a descriptive term for a person who posts
                   flamebait.  Flamebait is a post intended to provoke a
                   vehement reaction.  Trolls post flamebait.  I know because
                   I'm one and loving it.  --flamebait posting troll
                \_ troll describes both the idiot and the idiotic post.  -tom
                \_ WTF does that mean? Signyerposts Tom. I signedyermom.
                        \_ That means "Use perl."
                                \_ Is perl a new text editor? I typed perl,
                                   but nothing happened.
                                   \_ Inline insertion/replacement with perl.
        \_ ED!  ED!  ED is the STANDARD!  Text Editor.
2000/1/26-27 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:17337 Activity:very high
1/26    Some friends of mine are having problems with memory
        management in Java.  Is there a way you can force
        garbage collection in Java?  Alternatively, is their
        a way you can do memory allocation similiar to C/C++
        where you can explictly allocate and deallocate stuff
        so that you aren't at the mercy of the garbage collector?
         \_ java 1.1: System.gc(); System.runFinalization;
                in that order, to force garbage collection and
                call all object finalize() methods.
         \_ Does that actually FORCE garbage collection, or does
            the system just treat it as a suggestion?  Thanks.
            \_ depends on the java VM.  The ones I've worked with
               actaully do a GC when you ask for one, but this
               is not required by the language spec. - seidl
         \_ Are you sure the problems are caused because the VM isn't
            doing a gc? You could have objects which you think are dead,
            but are still referenced and therefore not up for GC. You'll
            need to use some tools to figure out.
            Also, the VM you are using is important. Some Java VMs out there
            use conservative gc, in fact I think all the Sun VMs before
            HotSpot (which has an exact garbage collector) used conservative
            gc. With conservative gc's, it's possible to have objects which
            are collectable, but the garbage collector isn't *sure* they are
            collectable, so to be safe it doesn't collect them (this can not
            happen with an exact collector).
            \_ Dude, if garbage collection is so complicated and delicate,
               what the heck is the point?  If I'm going to worry about
               memory management with GC, why not just use new and delete?
               New and delete are nice and simple and you don't have to
               worry about all this weirdness;  you just clean up after
               after yourself.
               \_ Implementation of GC is complicated and delicate, but
                  the use of a GC'd runtime system isn't. Or at least,
                  it shouldn't be -- the problem here is that the people
                  who originally designed an implemented Java are morons
                  (if you need any more proof, look at java.util.Date).
                  When using any reasonable garbage collector (like one
                  in any Smalltalk or the Java HotSpot), you just make new
                  objects and the garbage collector will reclaim when they
                  can no longer be used.
                  Now, you could make a programming error where something
                  you think should no longer be useable still is, but
                  if you have good programming habits, that shouldn't happen
                  very often. Far less often than memory leaks with malloc,
                  free.
         \_ Also, if you set the variables' value to null I believe it will
            be marked for garbage collection.  Of course, this won't _force_
            gc.
            \_  This is a myth -- nulling vars does not help gc. Either
                you need
                the objects in those vars, in which case they should not be
                up for gc and they should not be null (of course); or you
                don't need them and you don't need the class holding on to
                those variables, so the root class should be up for gc and
                its ivars should be up for gc also.
                I guess the above is not true if you have a class that is
                long lived but puts objects that it only needs for a short
                time into an variables, but that *probably* is a bad design.
        \_ Perl has great GC mechanism, is easier to program (little error
                                \_ No.  The way you wrote it, either meaning
                                   was valid in English.  See you at the end
                                   of English 1A.  Do not pass Go.
           catching code required), is portable, and has BETTER GUI designer
           (Perl/Tk). It is also OO (Perl5). GO PERL!
                                  \_ Perl OO is about as intuitive as IRS tax
                                     forms.  It is incredibly awkward as well.
                                        \_ Perl is easy for people with a unix
                                           background.  We're the target
                                           audience.  Sorry if that's not you.
              What an insightful comment.  Where did I say that I don't _/
              have a unix background?  I didn't?  Then why did you make such an
              inane statement?  Look again:  Perl is a great language for many
              things, but it's impl of OO sucks.
                \_ Thought you were talking about Perl as a whole, not Perl OO
                   in the second line.
                   \_ Please pay attention.  Thank you for playing.
                      \_ No.  The way you wrote it, either meaning was valid in
                         English.  See you at the end of English 1A.  Do not
                         pass Go.
                         \_ Bzzz! Try again.  'It' refers to 'Perl OO' not to
                            Perl.
                            \_ Duh.  That was obviously your intended meaning
                               looking back with your able assistance to parse
                               your questionable grammar, but it is not the
                               only valid interpretation of what you said.  You
                               are a dunce and a nincompoop.  You're not quite
                               at the self-centered low-grade moron level but
                               keep trying and you'll make it soon enough.
                               \_ What part of "It...as well" doesn't
                                  obviously refer to Perl OO.
                                  \_ "It" can refer to either Perl or Perl OO
                                     as used.  Consult HS English teacher.
                                     \_ "My car door is poorly implemented.  It
                                        is awkward to use as well."  Do you
                                        honestly mean that I could be talking
                                        about the car or the car door?  Moron.
                                        \_ Geeks arguing about grammar arcana
                                           are always so *cute* . . . I just
                                           want to reach out and give the both
                                           of you one great big *hug*!
                                        \_ thread snipped. here you go:
                                           alt.usage.english
           \_ Perl GC doesn't catch circular structures because it uses
              reference count GC.
           \_ LISP! LISP! LISP IS THE STANDARD!  Garbage collection language.
        \_ PERL IS THE BEST, JAVA SUCKS!!!!!                    -sys adm
           \_ JAVA IS THE BEST, PERL SUCKS!!!!!                   -god
              \_ I don't think god reads the motd.
                 \_ *pshaw* Since when did you have to read the motd to
                    post to it?
2000/1/20-22 [Computer/SW/Languages/Java, Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:17278 Activity:moderate
1/20    Where is a good place to find Regular Expression and Regular
        Substitution package for Java?
        \_ http://www.javaregex.com -vann
        \_ Just use perl.
        \_ java.text
        \_ GNU has one and oroinc is the best (oroinc.com ?). It's Perl5
                regex in Java.
2000/1/18-19 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:17262 Activity:moderate
1/17    Where can I find perl in Japanese? I'd also like to know where
        I can get hold of character recognition software for Japanese/
        Chinese characters? -fab@csua
        \_ You misunderstand the nature of perl.  There's nothing inherintly
           american or japanese or anything else about it.  Perl relies on the
           underlying OS for almost everything.  What are you trying to do that
           requires "perl in Japanese"?
           \_ Maybe he wants error messages in Japanese?
              \_ If you want to display messages in Japanese, use jcode.pl
                 (ftp://ftp.iij.ad.jp/pub/IIJ/dist/utashiro/perl/) and
                 http://ina.kappe.co.jp/~sabre/kcode/jcode.html has manual
                 for jcode.pl (in Japanese).
        \_ perl in XXX: http://www.perl.com if it ain't there, it either doesn't
           exist or is so pre-pre-pre-alpha that you don't want to go near
           it. The only usable implementations of optical character
           recognition for Asian languages are commercial.
        \_ Character recognition is an interesting AI problem.  If you are not
           in a rush and want to learn something (along with me), drop me
           a note, and I ll see what I can do. -- ilyas
                \_ aren't you just going to mumble something about stars
                   and evolution?
        \_ There is some free java program that allows users to mouse in
           kanji characters. "jdict"? Go find that, and steal the algorithm.
           But personally, I think doing it in perl is stupid.
          \_ handwriting recognition is not the same as character recognition
             since you can take advantage of stroke generation information.
2000/1/6-10 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:17176 Activity:high
1/6     What would be a reasonable expected salary range for an
        entry-level sys-admin type?  Contracted and/or perma?
        \_ 40$ if you're not very good, but still call your self a sys admin
           \_ That translates to ~$85K/yr.  Pretty high for an entry-level job!
           \_ Entry level sysadmins do not get  $80k a year.  You must be
              talking $40k a year, not $40 an hour.
        \_ Entry level contracting coudl easily be 40/hr if you're not a twit
           and you go to a pass through agency (ie, not taos).  But it doesn't
           have benefits, so might translate close to $65k on annual basis.
           \_ I thought the rule of thumb was $10/hr ~= $10k/yr for contractors.
              \_ No.  Normal rule is yearly salary = 2000 * hourly rate.
                \_ That's just the raw pre-tax, pre-everything amount, though.
                   Just keep in mind that you don't pocket that much each year.
                \_ Also, full timers tend to get much better non-cash benefits
                   than contractors.  You'll have to weigh the value of these
                   benefits vs. more cash as it pertains to your life.  Also,
                   some benefits are never worth it when you can buy them with
                   the higher salary you might make elsewhere.
        \_ Great info.  What contracting agencies do folks reccommend?
                Hall Kinion, EDP, TAC-Temps, etc.  (clearly not Taos)
           \_ Why not Taos?  They never screwed me... -ex Taos Employee
                \_ You signed a contract with Taos?  You got screwed.
                   \_ You sound like a disgruntled ex taos employee.
                        Smart people who have used taos don't seem to have a
                        problem.. Like me.
                        \_ Dummyhead.  You got even more taken than the rest of
                           them.  No, I never worked for Taos.  I got as far as
                           an offer and then snapped out of it and got a real
                           job.  Your error lies in the fact that you think you
                           out smarted Taos or were treated well in some way.
                           I pity you.  -better resume than you, no Taos on it
        \_ I recently accepted an entry-level sysadmin TAOS job for
        \_ I recently accepted an entry-level sysadmin Taos job for
           $70K to start.  From reading the motd, I now feel I got really
           ripped off. True, I am only an Art major, but I had a
           campus job using UNIX and I will learn Pearl soon.
           campus job using UNIX and I will learn Perl soon.  [perl, not pearl]
           I did really well on their online tests.
           When they asked me how much I wanted, I said $70K, thinking
           that I'd work down from there, but they offered me that and
           I already said yes and signed the offer sheet and start in 9
           days. Should I try to renegotiate for more money? Can I
           legally do that? Advice?
           \_ This must be a troll. --dim
                \_ Why?  I got offered the same 70k from Toas with similar
                   experience.
                   \_ [perl, not pearl] is the tip-off to me. --dim
           \_ How many new BMW's have Ric and Alexis bought in the past year?
           \_ You should post your resume with a throw away email address and
              see what offers you get.  In this state, you're an "at will"
              employee.  In non-legalise, this means you can quit at any time
              without penalty and they can fire you at any time without cause.
              "At will" is perfect for employees in the current job shortage
              and will suck if things ever turn around... hmmm... you ever
              think of leaving the tech field and putting that art degree to
              work?
1999/12/21-23 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:17078 Activity:low
12/20   Expecting a serious answer: did lwall@soda ever actually refer to
        the Larry Wall responsible for perl? That is, is he really the
        originator of `wall`?
                        \_ : Command not found.
        \_ No.
        \_ Yes.
        \_ Maybe.
1999/12/21-24 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:17076 Activity:very high
12/20   This random guy called me on the hallway to help him out. He said
        that I looked like a sys adm. What the hell does that mean?
        Is there a typical sys adm look?                        -sys adm
        -- Stereotype , yes
        \_ And you told this clown to fuck off after that comment, right?
        \_ Suspenders, possibly a slight gut, and a big, bushy beard.
          \_ dont forget a free t-shirt that's 2 sizes too small
           \_ Long unkept hair that fails to make you look cooler...
            \_ pastey skin
        \_ You were walking around with your head stuck up your ass?
                      only hired to do work the developers consider to
        \_ Do you pretend you're a programmer because you know Perl?
                \_ do you pretend dealing with pointers is more interesting
                   or difficult than solving problems?  -tom
                   \_ do you whine about not understanding pointers?
                   \_ Do you pretend you're indispensible when really you're
                      only hired to do work the developers consider too
                      menial to do themselves?
                        \_ Most developers couldn't sysadmin their way out of
                           a wet paper bag.  They're lucky to get their own
                           machine running.
                           \_ figuring out how to get things running is
                              part of the "too menial" bit.  It isn't hard
                              it just takes time to learn.  Compare that
                              with what would happen if you stuck a sysadmin
                              in an engineering position.
                              \_ Well gee, as if programming is so fucking hard.
                                 It "just takes time to learn".  Idiot.
                              \_ Engineering is ALL ABOUT "getting things to
                                 work".
                                 \_ right. As someone with a CS degree, I'm
                                    a better sysadmin than any programmer here
                                    AND I'm a better programer than anyone
                                    \_ So you're lazy and you don't want to
                                       make a difference in the world.  Well,
                                       a man's got to know his limitations.
                                    here. So I choose to do sysadmin.
                                    Less work, more money.
                                        \_ Me: cs dgree, no; programmer: no;
                                           under 40 hrs/wk: yes; more money
                                           than 99% of cs degree
                                           programmers: yes; says good night
                                           on the way out every day to the
                                           programming team: yes; smarter than
                                           your average bear: you betcha!
                                                -sysadmin and loving it
                                           \_ Asshole: yes; pull statistics
                                              out of ass: yes; consider money
                                              primary motivation for job: yes
                                                \_ I'd work for anything but
                                                   money?  You're not one of
                                                   those Open Source freaks
                                                   are you?  "Asshole" is just
                                                   you being jealous and
                                                   bitter.  Since I'm making
                                                   well over 100k and I can
                                                   read job postings, it isn't
                                                   too hard to figure out if
                                                   I'm making more or less than
                                                   99% of programmers of any
                                                   sort.  Happy coding!
                                              \_ whats so wrong with that?
                        \_ Do you collect same money for only 40hr/wk?
                                \_ Or more money for less than 40hr/wk?
                        \_ I don't work for developers.  -tom
        \_ Do you complain about Java being inefficient because its'
           interpreted, but praise Perl?
                \_ They have different uses.
        \_ You don't eat anything that can't be found in a vending machine?
        \_ You look smug because you earn more than all the bitter
           programmers?  Oh wait, that's over here, not in the US.
                \_ Here too in the US, John.
1999/12/9-2000/1/5 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:17048 Activity:nil
12.09   Got Perl?  2 unit perl decal class for Spring 2K.  See your fellow
        csuaers teach a useful course!
        http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~darin/perl
1999/12/9-10 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:17045 Activity:moderate
12/8    If I want to run perl should I do it in NT4SP5 or 98?  Is there a
        signifigant performance differance?  I am mostly interested in
        learning to program without having to buy a compiler.
                \_ perl will run the same either way.  NT4 works less badly.
        \_ perl will run the same either way.  NT4 works less badly.
        \_ Performance?  If you want performance you don't use perl.
           \_ Nor Windoze.
              \_ Nor anything else from M$.
        \_ Who said you had to buy a compiler?
           <DEAD>sourceware.cygnus.com/cygwin<DEAD>
           -brg
        \_ The most noticible difference between NT/98 for Perl is how awful the
           command shell is under Win9x.  If you can choose, go with NT.  The
           scrollback is much better (i.e. existant) and you can actually
           redirect stderr.
1999/11/20-24 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:16933 Activity:kinda low
11/20   How can I redirect stderr in a dos shell in Windows9x? (I
        *have* to find the answer for Windows--installing Linux isn't a
        solution).
        \_ Install a real shell. Better yet, perl.
           \_ That was useful.  Sheesh.  At least provide the answer.  Go to
              http://jpsoft.com and check out the various 4dos 4nt 4blah products.
              I love perl but my toolbox has more than just one hammer in it.
              I don't ride bike! either.
                \_ I love my hammer but I don't use it to drill holes.
                   perl is a better tool.
                   \_ He wants a dos shell that can properly redirect.  4dos
                      is *exactly* that and more and he can just do a drop in
                      replacement for the msdos http://command.com and continue doing
                      what he was doing without changing anything at all but
                      hit command line shell.  Perl is not the right tool for
                      his command line shell.  Perl is not the right tool for
                      this job.  4dos is the right tool.  http://jpsoft.com.  You're
                      trying to get him to RIDE BIKE! and USE LINUX! when all
                      he needs is a better dos shell. --doesn't BIKE!/LINUX!
        \_ Get bash for dos/win32 along with perl, emacs, gcc and all GNU tools
                at http://www.delorie.com/djgpp
        \_ You can try this which works in NT:
                foo.exe 2> myerr.txt
           But I don't know if it works in Win9x.  --- yuen
1999/10/24-26 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl, Computer/SW/OS/OsX] UID:16754 Activity:high
10/23   From a C programmar who knows just enuff to be dangerous,
                                                       \_ wut r u gonna do,
                                                          nibble my bun?
        how to I convert a binary text file to plain text file?  Do
        I have to get each character one at a time, check for 0x1a, etc.
        before writing it in text?    Thanx - mtbb.
        \_ man strings.   WTF is a "binary text file" anyway?  Everything is
           in binary if you want to be anal about it and otherwise, it's
           either binary -or- text.  What are you talking about?
           \_ He's referring to text files terminated with CR/LF vs. CR,
              otherwise known as dos-tyle text and Unix-style text. To
              the original poster: try "todos"  -mogul
              the original poster: try "todos".  If that doesn't suit you,
              and you'd rather do this with C than with tr or perl, then you
              need to open the file in binary mode and do exactly what you
              propose, though you can be much more efficient by working on
              larger chunks of data before writing it out. --mogul
              \_ Just in case you're actually trying to get this done
                 rather than theorize about how to do it in C:
                 DOS -> UNIX: perl -pi -e 's/\r//g' filename
                 DOS -> UNIX: perl -pi -e 's/\r//g' filenames
                 \_ I think you mean
                    perl -pi -e 's/\r\n/\n/g' filenames
                 UNIX -> DOS: perl -pi -e 's/\n/\r\n/g' filename
                 UNIX -> MAC: perl -pi -e 's/\n/\r/g' filename
                 MAC -> UNIX: perl -pi -e 's/\r/\n/g' filename
                 I'll leave the DOS to MAC conversions as an exciting
                 exercise to the reader.  --dbushong
                 \_ Will the dos to mac conversions be on the midterm?  Do I
                    have to know that stuff?
                        \-emacs dos-mode --psb
                          \_ Will *that* also be on the midterm?  Is it open
                             book?
                             \_ Midterm question: Do the above conversion
                                using only nroff
                                \_ Oh come on... I thought this was supposed
                                   to be an advanced course!  What's with the
                                   baby questions?
1999/10/20-21 [Computer/SW/Languages/Java, Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:16737 Activity:nil
10/20   Your CS 150 book made /.
        http://slashdot.org/books/99/10/18/1053237.shtml
1999/10/1-4 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl, Computer/SW/Languages/Misc] UID:16646 Activity:moderate
10/2    Taiwan earthquake: 7.6 ram prices double
        Mexico earthquake: 7.4 no effect on ram, but avocado prices double
        WHAT THE FSCK?
        \_ You expected ram prices to increase when mexico had a quake and
           avocado to increase when taiwan had a quake?  this is the oddest
           troll ive seen in a while.
        \_ http://www.freebsd.org/handbook/install.html#INSTALL-HW
        \_ Well, Taiwan has shanties, and mexico has tijuana.
        \_ God has it out for Taiwanese bourgeiousie heathens.
           Anything in particular? Sound Cards? scsi, motherboards? video? ..
           \_ what is /csua/bin/rootshell?  It seems to be a perl script
              SIUD root.
        \_ Should add: turkey earthquake: 7.6 NO EFFECT ON RAM OR AVOCADO.
           --jon
        \_ which is a long way of saying 'you are forever identified as a
           pinhead'
                \_ Thats Viviana, dumbass. Go see Admiral Krag.
                   \_ no, it's Vyvvian you bastard, Go see Neil Edmondson
                      in "The Young Ones"
                        \_ "Why do I always have to cook the lentils?"
        \_ My penis ejaculating rates a 7.8
        \_ Well, Taiwan has shanties, and mexico has tijuana.
        \_ hey dumbass, ram prices were double before the earthquake
           \_ uh Aha! but how was the average price of produce, so called
              "Vyvvian"?
        \_ in case no one spelled out it for you, read the fucking source.
           \_ Not to mention the area of Mexico that was hit was more flat
              and less densely populated.
           \_ Source?  It's a stupid 2 line script.  I wouldn't call that
        \_ Should add: Turkey earthquake: 7.6, killed 15,000 people.
              the wall.  It's a stupid hyuck hyuck moron script.
        \_ hey dumbass, ram prices were double before the earthquake
           \_ uh Aha! but how was the average price of produce, so called
              "Vyvvian"?
        \_ The scale is exponential, plus shoddy construction in Taiwan.
        \_ God has it out for those Taiwanese people.
1999/9/23 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:16574 Activity:high
9/23    The installed perl is 3.0, which is kinda old. Anyone mind updating
                                \_ Try 4.036, the last perl4 release
        it?
        \_  /usr/local/bin/perl --version
            This is perl, version 5.005_02 built for i386-freebsd
            \_ Hey, thanks!  I needed Perl 5 for my motd-rearranging script.
                \_ Wimp.  I wrote mine in bourne shell.
1999/9/23 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:16571 Activity:nil
9/23      The installed perl is 4.0, which is kinda old. Anyone mind updating
          it?

now, dig dis:   If ya' kin't play supa' fine, ya' kin't play at all.  Stop
                rearrangin' replies on de motd.  It be 3 lines uh puh'l.
                Grow up.
1999/9/14-15 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:16511 Activity:insanely high
9/13    A smart social scientist friend of mine, not yet a computer geek,
        intends to learn programming. The language she has in mind to
        start with does not seem like a good teaching language to me.
        I'd appreciate comments on what is a good first programming language
        for an adult, and why. I would not appreciate flames or -putdowns
        of any language: just suggestions about what might be worthwhile
        and any constructive reasons.
                \__ED!  Ed is the standard!
        \_ I suggest watching Harvey's cs61a lectures on the web. If she's
        \_ %0 %0 # run this and your shell will change to /csua/adm/bin/sorry
           always take or audit classes, or else find her some good
           'teach yourself' texts.  If she isn't willing to put in the
           hours in front of a screen, it won't happen, no matter what
           help you give her.  Programming isn't for tourists, no matter
           how smart they are.  That said, the language to pick is the
           one for what she wants to do.  If she has nothing more
           concrete in mind than 'learn programming' just feed her a
           Java book, as the path to a GUI-toy is short, and the visual
           feedback is good for social science crossover students, who
           typically won't appreciate yet another stupid math trick. -mel
           \_ You  jump to the most amazing and unfounded conclusions.
           might help her learn to program.
           \_ http://bmrc.berkeley.edu/bibs (re-added after motd cleansing).
           nothing to do with computer science. Knowing about them (parsing,
        \_ Python's a good beginner's language.
        \_ Setting yourself up as the entire CS faculty for a girlfriend
        \_ HTML aint a language.  Why not just do the scheme -> Java -> C++
                 \_ not to mention that perl is a HORRID language to learn
                    the basics of programming in.
           is a really bad idea.  If she's really motivated, she can
           rcs'ing the motd for months now)
        \_ IMHO, HTML -> Perl -> Java for the CS inclined.
                      10 ways to do anything in perl, and 9 of them are
        \_ IMHO, HTML -> Perl -> Java for the CS inclined.
                \_ HTML is not a programming language.  -tom
                \_ shut up, nweaver.  perl is a great language to learn,
                      pretty quick.  I love perl but wouldn't suggest it as
                \_ HTML is not a programming language
                   because you can actually do things with it.  -tom
                      There are easier first languages that do stuff.
                   because you can actually do things with it.  -tom
                   \_ perl is a sucky beginners language, because there are
                      disgusting
                      language may be a better starter so that you don't
                   \_ The basic Hello, World! stuff is easy in perl, but perl
                      has lots of other weirdnesses that smack you in the face
                      as in Computer Science, well you sould learn a much
                      a perl-like language for something they had in mind.
        \_ HTML aint a language.  Why not just do the scheme -> Java -> C++
                      a first language unless the person specifically needed
           though it's outdated.  Some non-CS friends of mine took the
                      yourself some horrid habits.
                      a perl-like language for something they had in mind.
                   \_ perl is great for doing perl stuff.  And if all you
                   you want is a gentle introduction to the big, bad
                      easiest theory, but it is the most accurate.
                /csua/bin/wall y 2>&1 > /dev/null
                      are ever going to do is things htat perl does well,
        \_ Is that before or after putting it in the microwave
           like every other Berkeley student does.  Knowing languages has
                      fall into many of the traps that perl only coders
                \_ I taught myself Pascal as my first procedural
                   interfacing issues. Probably the facilities available
           grammars, symantics, etc...) does for classes like 164.
                   \_ perl is great for doing perl stuff.  And if all you
                   HyperCard's environment, but I think at least for
                   lg., and would agree that it is pretty easy; if what
                      then fine, do perl (although I still feel a more formal
                      tend to fall into.)  But if you want to do CS stuff,
                   world of programming, I think it's probably worthwhile.
        \_ What's her goal in learning how to program?  Does she have work-
           hobbyist?
              \_ He's an idiot.
           Esperanto.  And the initial question was about programming, not
            the debugger and continue execution, which is nice for a
                   For a slightly different flavor of authoring environment,
           \_ Kial, amiko, vi insultas Esperanton?  Kial oni _ne_ devas lerni?
        \_ What's her goal in learning how to program?  Does she have work-
           related reasons?  Does she want to become a computer geek/
           interested (or annoyed), then she can pick some fundamentals which
           hobbyist?
                   in JavaScript to manipulate web pages will someday
              \_ He's an idiot.
           really going on.  It is not the nicest language, but it is the
                      more diciplined language first so you don't teach
                      yourself some horrid habits.
              because it exposes what is really going on.  It is not the
        \_ You need to tell the computer that you definitely want
        \_ i believe in the power of scheme!
        \_ They should first learn Visual Basic, and then move onto ASP,
           and Visual C++.
                   world of programming, I think it's probably worthwhile.
           these messages off.  "chsh -s /usr/bin/yes".
                   to create interesting applications. -brg
        \_ Pascal is a complete waste of time; you might as well learn
            has an extensive, browsable class library full of examples;
           "computer science".  -tom
            different compared to other languages); it's very powerful,
                \_ Fuck you.
           \_ doesn't chsh check /etc/shells?
                   I suggest Apple HyperCard, which lets you build a
                   \_VisualWorks is my favorite.  The commercial version
                     runs on HP-UX, Solaris, and Linux (on Intel).
                     There's also a non-commercial for Linux:
                        http://www.objectshare.com/VWNC
                     I also like Squeak.  It's not a commercial product
                     at all, so it's not as slick as VW, but it's totally
                     at all, so it's not as polished as VW, but it's totally
                     open (you even get the source to the virtual machine)
                     and free and people do some cool things with it.
                        http://www.squeak.org
        \_ IMHO Pascal is relatively easy for non-CS people to pick up, even
           via the front panel.
           CS 9-something class and learned the basics w/o my help.  -- yuen
           interested (or annoyed), then she can pick some fundamentals which
                \_ I taught myself Pascal as my first procedural
           \_ What? You can watch lectures on the web?
              \_ Yes, go to http://bmrc.berkeley.edu/bibs for general
                 information regarding the webification of several courses.
                 You can even watch the feeds live (unicast and multicast
                 are supported).
                   now it's still worth considering. YMMV. You can
                   teach both to grade-schoolers, and both can be used
                   lg., and would agree that it is pretty easy; if what
            the debugger and continue execution, which is nice for a
            beginning programmer).
                \_ What's your favorite Smalltalk system for Unix? I'm
                   curious to try one out (if it's a good one.) -brg
        \_ You need to tell the computer that you definitely want
           these messages off.  "chsh -s /usr/bin/yes".
                   But everyone outgrows Pascal; it's merely a matter of time.
                   For a slightly different flavor of authoring environment,
           \_ Ah yes.  All hail the foundtain of truth which is tom.  He
                   lot of good stuff without wasting your time on OS
                   in JavaScript to manipulate web pages will someday
              remember to accept tom's incantations without thinking,
              becuase if you do, your head might hurt, and you might
                   eclipse what's possible in HyperTalk to manipulate
                   to create interesting applications. -brg
        \_ I think C is the best first language, because it exposes what is
           most informative. -- ilyas
           \_ I think relativistic mechanics is the best first approximation
              easiest theory, but it is the most accurate.
        \_ Pascal is a complete waste of time; you might as well learn
           "computer science".  -tom
           \_ Ah yes.  All hail the fountain of truth which is tom.  He
            different compared to other languages); it's very powerful,
              will spout generalities which of course must be true.
              Consideration for the individual is unimportant.  Always
              actually reject tom's axioms.  Fear this as you would any
              rational thought.  -- not #1 tom fan
        \_ Visual Basic, C, Java, or BASIC.  If I were to do it all over
           again, I'd major in math and start with C.  perl?  no.  nonono.
        \_ I suggest watching Harvey's cs61a lectures on the web. If she's
           might help her learn to program.
           \_ http://bmrc.berkeley.edu/bibs (re-added after motd cleansing).
        \_ I suggest Smalltalk.  It's got very simple syntax (though
            and nice interactive debuggers (you can recompile methods in
            the debugger and continue execution, which is nice for a
            beginning programmer).
                \_ What's your favorite Smalltalk system for Unix? I'm
                   curious to try one out (if it's a good one.) -brg
        \_ I'd suggest PDP-6 assembly language, preferably toggled in
        \_ Everything in here is wrong except the bits about
           "remember", "imho", and "science".
1999/9/2-3 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:16455 Activity:high
9/2     I know this is probably about a 4 line perl script, but could
        someone direct me to a program which changes a html doc. into a
        text doc.
        \_ This is close but not there.  html2ps converts html to postscript.
           try to apropos html (or alias apropos man -k if you haven't done
           so).
           \_ what's so hard about typing man -k?  it's a full keystroke less
              than apropos and easier to remember...
              \_ apropos is an english word so it's easier to remember for
                 some people.
                 \_ apropos?  Say that ten times, fast.
                    \_ Yeah, I did. So what?
                        \_ No you didn't.  If you said it fast enough you'd be
                           dead now.  Coded into every lifeform is a trigger
                           which will cause spontaneous combustion.  The
                           trigger happens to be saying apropos ten times, fast.
                           The fact that you're still here to claim you did so
                           only proves you didn't.  Please note that me, the
                           CSUA, the politubro, UCB, and no other person or
                           organisation is responsible for your death should
                           you choose to say apropos ten times at a fast enough
                           rate to cause your burning death.
        \_ lynx -dump
           \_ This is the closest answer to correct.
                \_
#!perl
@x = <>;
`|lynx -dump`;
                   Something like that?  :-)  (my perl is rusty, sorry)
                   \_ that's only 2 lines.  You must make it about 4 lines
                      or else you can never show your face here again without
                      it being bitten off by my dog.
                      \_ Ok add this:
print "Conversion done in";
print "4 lines of bad perl.\n";
                         Will that keep the dogs at bay?
1999/8/24-26 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:16386 Activity:low
8/24    Is there a command in NT that works like "sleep" in UNIX?  Thx.
        \_ You want it for scripting?  There's a few ways.  4NT from jpsoft
           is a dos shell replacement that has a sleep function.  perl can
           do a sleep function.  you can write your own in C/whatever and
           compile it.  NT has an "AT" like function if you need a long term
           sleep.  There isn't a command line sleep that I know of.  If you
           detail what you're trying to do, it'd be easier to help you.
           \_ I just want to sleep in a loop in a batch file, like
                :again
                foo.exe
                sleep 60
                goto again
              I guess I'll write one in C.  Thanks.
                \_ A little C program is probably easiest.  You can download
                   one from many public archives.  If you're willing to switch
                   shells, try jpsoft's.  In many ways it's more powerful and
                   easier to use than tcsh but of course doesn't support true
                   backgrounding of jobs.  perl is ok if you don't mind pissing
                   away some cpu.
                   away some cpu and memory.
        \_ cygwin (<DEAD>sourceware.cygnus.com<DEAD> is a good thing.
        \_ perl -e 'sleep 60'  --  use NT perl!
1999/8/21-24 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl, Computer/SW/Unix] UID:16365 Activity:low
8/19    If you have to ask questions about how to accomplish things in
        sed/awk/shell, you should be doing it in perl.
        \_ perl.
                \_ perl.
        \_ BIKE!
                \_ RIDE PERL!  USE BIKE!
1999/8/20-21 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:16353 Activity:high
8/20    Why do people like to delete other people's posts?  I'm trying to
        find this famous collection of Perl poetry that was published by
        Larry Wall that he found on a newsgroup.  Does anyone have an
        online copy of this?
        \_ use dejanews and go away.
        \_ Searchj on http://www.perl.com
        \_ deja news.
1999/8/20 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:16351 Activity:nil
8/19    Larry Wall once had a collection of Perl poetry which looked pretty
        amussing.  Does anyone know whre I could find this?
1999/8/13-15 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:16311 Activity:kinda low
8/13    How can I use two different programming libraries that share many of
        the same function names.  I don't want to go through and change the
        function names everywhere and recompile--it's not really possible
        in this situation.  Basically is there anyway to say that everything
        from a library should be prefaced with LIB1__ to be used (but NOT
        have to recompile the lib)?  -drex
        \_ you could write a program using libbfd
        \_ you ahve to write your own wrapper for every single
           function in one of the libraries, and use dlopen()
        \_ sed
        \_ write a perl script to prefix the function names and recompile
        the lib sources
        \_ cpp.
        \_ Why is this still up here? I answered it definitively.
            You have to make wrappers for each conflicting function,
            and use dlopen(), etc to make the wrappers actually
            work.
1999/7/13-15 [Computer/SW/WWW/Browsers, Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:16120 Activity:high
7/13    How do you write a PERL CGI that both starts a file downloading and
        displays a "Thank you" page? (The download links on
        http://home.netscape.com/download are a good example.) Thanks! -icrew
        \_ Can't you just output the "Thank you" page and then use
           <meta> to redirect to the download file?  The download
           shouldn't actually display a different file, but rather just
           begin downloading.  More specifically:
           <META HTTP-EQUIV="Refresh" CONTENT="#;URL">
           Where "#" is a number (number of seconds), and URL is the URL
           \_good idea, but it doesn't work--it just sits there and
             continually refershes the "Thank you" screen.  Thanks for your
             help, tho...  -icrew
             \_ Worked just fine for me.  Note that URL should be the
                URL of the *download*, not of the current doc.  See
                <DEAD>www.csua/~emarkp/test_refresh.html<DEAD>  -emarkp
                \_ah.  I forgot the "URL=" part.  It does work, but
                  not the same way the same way the netscape one does b/c
                  it leaves the URL to the downloaded file in the "Netsite"
                  field and in the source of the "Thank you" page.  My reason
                  for putting it behind a CGI was so that people couldn't get
                  this info so easily. -icrew
                  \_ When I try the Netscape site, the HTML header tells
                     me that the location is: ftp://ftp.netscape.com/pub/communicator/english/4.61/windows/windows95_or_nt/complete_install/cc32e461.exe
                     so I don't see much difference.
                \_ Netscape almost certainly uses some sort of javascript
                  \_nope.  It works even with Java script turned off.
                     Ideas for a place where I might find the answer (instead
                     af asking it here) would also be appreciated.  -icrew
                     \_ Simple, bonehead:
                        telnet http://www.netscape.com 80
                          GET <DEAD>WHATEVER/blah/blah<DEAD>
                        \_ Or "view source" from a browser.  ahem.
        \_ (Incorrect answers deleted.) Use Content-type: mixed/multipart
1999/6/25 [Computer/SW/Unix, Computer/SW/Languages/Misc, Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:16018 Activity:high
6/25    Using perls LWP it's trivial to 'download' html file
        and parse it, but what if I want to download something like a
        *.gif file where I dont want to capture standardout like
        with HTML. In other words I just want the file. Any pointers?
        \_ getright.  http://www.getright.com
        \_ hint: the gif files on a web page have unique urls.  good luck.
           \_ more specifically I was looking for the right functions
              of LPW to download as an object.
        \_ Jeez. why use a crane to pick up a bowling ball?
           you can use "wget" or other executables compiled for
           "Get this http file". Or if you insist doing it in perl,
           then just use the http get routines. Or open up the socket,
           send "GET /file HTTP 1.0", and ignore everything until
           the first empty line.
1999/6/24 [Computer/SW/Languages/C_Cplusplus, Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:16011 Activity:nil
6/23    Here's a question.  I'm trying to send and receive a large file from one
        machine to another.  To do this I've used a SOCK_STREAM with TCP
        protocol.  It works fine normally as I read away from the socket.
        However when I get transfer-encoding:chunked, for large files.  I get
        a portion of the file, but soon the sysread returns 0 bytes read.
        However its not done with the file yet, it never finishes, the socket
        stays open but it never sends the rest of the data.  I'm doing
        this all in Perl but C solutions will work too.
        \_ for large amounts of data you can end up reading only a portion
           of the data you want in one read call, and need to wait for more
           data to arrive (the sysread of 0 means no data currently in the
           buffer, but you might get some more in a few hundred milliseconds)
           \_ I thought of that.  So I looped the read until I got the chunked
                exit value.  No luuck I get an infinite loop.  Nothing ever
                comes in on the socket again.
                \_ Could be a problem on the send-side (not sending
                   subsequent chunks). Could be you're not properly
                   recognizing the 'chunked exit value' on the
                   receiving side (the bunches of bytes you read
                   won't necessarily be grouped as they were sent).
                   Could be a lot of things -- are you writing
                   both sides of the transfer? Is this HTTP/1.1?
                   Feel free to drop me an email w/ more details. -gojomo
1999/6/18-21 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:15983 Activity:low
6/17    I can't find "Web Client Programming with Perl" by O'Reilly on any
        of the book sites including the O'Reilly site, I think it's out of
        print.  Any help/info/pointers?
        \_ I bought it from Computer Literacy two months ago. Last time I was
           there (two weeks ago) they still had a few copies left.
        \_ http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/156592214X
1999/6/18-21 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:15982 Activity:nil
6/17    why does my perl break with the following message?
        "use" may clash with future reserved word at ./foo line 3
        syntax error in file ./foo at line 3, next 2 tokens "use strict"
        \_ Because you're not using perl 5.  You will probably have to change
           the first line of the script to show it where perl 5 is installed
           on your system; if you don't have perl 5, you can download it from
           http://www.perl.com/CPAN/authors/id/GBARR/perl5.005_03.tar.gz
1999/6/10-12 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:15942 Activity:moderate
6/10    Pretend I'm four years old.  I just want to setup a script to send
        an SNMP message (or PDU or whatever it's called) to a machine every
        X minutes.  It could be a fake message that's dropped.  I just want
        the sockets opened and closed to simulate a real-world setup.  I have
        root access.  What's the simplest way to do this without having to
        re-invent the wheel?  My machine is running Solaris 2.6 .
        \_ Go to your room.
        \_ There's snmp perl code.  Try cpan.  I've read snmp values but never
           tried traps or setting values or anything like that.
           \_ even easier is the ucd-snmp package, grab it compile it, and
       you can do snmp gets sets and whatever with simple command lines. -ERic
        \_ FYI, here's how I did it:
                #! /usr/local/bin/scotty2.1.5

                set s [snmp session -address mymachinename]
                set result [$s get "sysDescr.0 sysName.0 sysContact.0"]
                puts $result
                after 15000
                $s destroy
1999/5/16-18 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:15816 Activity:moderate
5/16    Hey, can someone install the Chatbot from CPAN?  Also, how do you do
        CGI from your home dir?  The Chatbot is at:
        http://ftp.iguide.com/pub/mirrors/packages/perl/CPAN/modules/by-module/Chatbot
        I'd really appreciate it, thanks.

        Whoever the f**k wrote that below is a f**king idiot.
        \_ Install it in your own directory lamer.
                \_ That's not where yur mom told me to install it!
        \_ make sure the script's group name is csua and not wwwdir
        (there's female Yoda named Yaddle)
1999/4/28 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:15716 Activity:high
4/27    Is there a thesaurus on csua?  Something like dict.
        \_there is an old [1911?] copy of roget's that is part of
          gutenberg. there is a perl interface to this called th, and an
          emacs library thesauraus.el ontop of that. the emacs interface
          is reasonable. using the perl one directly from the shell was
          kinda lame. i am not sure this made it in the soda3-> soda4 or
          soda4->sodaV upgrade. it should be easy to get it going again.
          --psb
        \_ Or you can go to http://www.m-w.com for more recent dictionary and
           thesaurus (unless of course you absolutely need it on the
           local machine).
1999/3/31-4/1 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:15673 Activity:insanely high
3/30    Can root install the lastest version of perl?
        \_ Yes.
        \_ % mail root
        \_ It's already installed.  Use /usr/local/bin/perl, not /usr/bin/perl
           --dbushong
           \_ Why are two different versions installed?
                \_ because freebsd is stupid
                   \_ Because soda is running a 2 year old version of FreeBSD,
                      when perl4 shipped as part of the OS and was "perl" and
                      perl5 was an option to be installed in /usr/local/bin?
                      Of course, if it were Linux, it would have been the
                      latest broken beta sitting in /bin/perl  --dbushong
              \_ former = perl5, latter = perl4
                 \_ which doesn't answer the question.  Why are two
                    different versions installed both as a binary named
                    'perl'?  Why not put 'perl4' in /usr/local/bin
                    instead of the confusing mess of having one version
                    down one path and another version down another path?
                    \_ Stop whining.  You can always create sym links
                       in your bin directory and put your bin in front of
                       your path setting.
                       \_ Who's whining?  Note that the question asked
                          was "why," which regrettably assumed there was
                          a valid reason (which apparantly there is).
                          Why is it whining to ask for people to answer
                          the question posed?  I'm fully aware of how to
                          avoid the problem--however that wasn't the
                          question I asked.  Thank you dbushong for
                          actually answering.
                        \_ Some people have confused a valid question with
                           whining to such a degree that they can either no
                           longer tell the difference or simply knee-jerk
                           their own whine about others' alleged whining.
                           Welcome to the motd.
1999/3/19-22 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:15615 Activity:high
3/19    Is there a portable way (in Perl) to check for available disk space?
        looking at df output is not portable enough.
           \_ The check is needed as part of an installation program.
        \_ Huh?  You never run out of disk space on Modern Computers(TM)
           \_ Obviously you haven't downloaded porn.
              \_ You obviously have an ancient hard drive.  Even I can
                  download porn on my tiny computer.
                  \_ Obviously you're not downloading enuf porn.
                \_ I bought the Dell Porno Special with the 180 gig 11 disk
                   RAID5 array.  I don't think I'll need a new array for
                   atleast 4 or 5 weeks.
           \_ The check is needed as part of an installation program.
        \_ man statfs
           \_ that doesn't seem to work on perl for win32 systems.
1999/3/18 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl, Computer/SW/Languages/Misc] UID:15606 Activity:high
3/17    Hi, I'm looking for a mail filter that strips everything except the
        flat ASCII text.  All that mime type thing, HTML tags, jpg attachments,
        etc, are all not worth having.  I want to pipe a piece of mail through
        it, so it should know the mail header as opposed to just get rid of
        everything in between '<' and '>'.  Thanks!
                \-if you are tall enough, mailagent. --psb
        \_ awk is your friend
           \_ Would sed be actually easier for this case, or no?
              Something like 's/<.*>//g'? (not exactly correct, but close)
              \_ no. tags can span multiple lines.
        \_ I pipe everything through a perl script, but not for the same
           reason you do.  You could easily write something that did
           everything you want and more but you'd probably end up with your
           own version of something that already exists anyway.  I've never
           looked at mailagent as suggested by psb.  procmail and perl do it
           for me for now.  I read and reply with mh if it matters to you.
                \_ That's exactly my point.  I can spend the time writing a
                   customized filter or searching for one already written
                   by someone else.  Ugh...  It's looking more like I'll need
                   to write one myself.  HTML mail is just annoying and evil.
                   But I have a feeling that the days of 100% pure flat ASCII
                   email are gone.  -too old to change
                \-mailagent has a perl escape and does some of the harder
                parsing fo ryou. --psb
                \_ I figured it was something like that.  I just pipe all the
                   html-ized crap through lynx and if lynx can't deal with it,
                   then I just skip it and go on.  Got a URL for mailagent?
                   \_ Ok, found it.  The docs say it stops at the first match
                      which will break some of my filtering.  Does mailagent
                      do anything that procmail doesn't?
1999/3/4-5 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:15536 Activity:nil
3/3     Where can I get color scheme for emacs(.emacs) for perl?  My
        scheme is ugly, and I dont have a clue how to change the color
        after loading hilit19.  Thanks.  - clueless
        \_ Font-lock >>> hilit19.  It has defaults for perl mode as well.
        \_ Sacrifice your mom and we'll tell you.  -clued
           \_ Done.
1999/3/2-10 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl, Computer/SW/OS/FreeBSD, Computer/SW/Languages/Functional] UID:15517 Activity:nil
3/2     motd restored.  I find it odd that people bother nuking it
        given how obvious it is that so many others save it.
        \_ Please restore the fetish stuff.
           \_ By popular request:

      Hillary Clinton & Monica
      Lewinsky con dildos de
      "strap-on"              535
      TOM!                    999999999
      latinas lesbianas con
      dildos de "strap-on"    534
      asian                   10
      \_ subset: korean       2
      \_ subset: fobs         1
      \_ subset: japanese
                 schoolgirls  3
                 \_ Wearing
                    Sailor
                    Uniforms  3
                 \_ wearing a cut-off "spank me daddy"
                    t-shirt   1
      tall                    3
      talg                    1
      B&D                     5
      spanking                4
      little boys             0       -- cogan?
      little girls            4
                              \_ This almost makes me proud to be a sodan.
                                 *sniff*  -mlee
      - catholic schoolgirls  3
      - toothless             1
      barely legal            2
      illegal                 2
      petite women            2
      muchandr                2
      big tits                6
      anal                    5
       -on nweaver            1
      tentacle                1
      fetishes                4
      small rodents           2
      necrophillia            2
      crazed psychos          4
      the elderly             1
      file cabinets           1
      PDP-10s & LISP          6
      BSD driverhacks         1
      rootcows                37337
      raverporn               1
      \_ Where do you get this? I want some.
      sexual torture          3
      fat chicks             -2
      soda                    1
      perl                    2
      lila                    1
      ahm                     2
      tickling                2
      shaved pubes            3
      spinach                 3
      pics of fatties         1
      Hank AKA JSL            -20
      amputees                1
      oral                    0
      kane                    2
      danh & stump fantasies  3
      redheads                3
      mail order russian brides 0
      the Simpsons!           1
      wattle                  0
      ASTEROIDS               1,599,990 @ 2020 !!!!!!
      nuking the motd         666
1999/2/25-3/30 [Recreation/Dating, Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:15479 Activity:insanely high
2/25    Let's vote for the most popular soda fetish. If you fetish is on the
        list, increment the counter. If not, add it. You may vote for
        several fetishes.               \_ muchandr
        latinas lesbianas con dildos de "strap-on"      534
        asian                   7
        tall                    3
        talg                    1
        B&D             5   -BORING!
                                    \_ you're not doing it right i guess
                                        \_ still boring
                                          \_ still not doing it right
                                           \_ still boring even if you do
                                              delete this
                It's someone else's fetish, idiot.  Who cares if *you* find
                it boring?  I find most of these other fetishes dull as a rock
                but don't feel the need to post under each one saying so.
        spanking                4
        little boys             0       -- cogan?
        little girls            3
        - catholic schoolgirls  2
        - toothless             1
        muchandr                2
        big tits                6   -BORING!
        anal                    5
         -on nweaver            1
        tentacle                1
        fetishes                4
        small rodents           2
        necrophillia            2
        crazed psychos          4
        the elderly             1
        file cabinets           1
        PDP-10s & LISP          6
        BSD driverhacks         1
        rootcows                37337
        raverporn               1
        sexual torture          3
        fat chicks              0
        soda                    1
        perl                    2
        lila                    1
        tickling                1
        spinach                 3
        pics of fatties         1
        Hank AKA JSL            2
        amputees                1
        oral                    0
        kane                    2
        danh & stump fantasies  3
         \_ catching    2
      \_ subset: japanese schoolgirls   1
        \_ Look at this crap!!  You're a bunch of sinning freaks!
        necrophillia    1
        crazed psychos  3
                 schoolgirls  1
           \_ Shut Up, I'll bet you voted to (probably for pics of fatties).
           sex or substite intercouse entirely. That means that
        BSD driverhacks 0
        PDP-10s & LISP  3

        sexual torture  2
                    Uniforms  1
      TOM!                    999999999
        perl            1
      latinas lesbianas con
      dildos de "strap-on"    534
      asian                   10
        Hank AKA JSL    1
      \_ subset: fobs             1
        \_ catching     1
      little girls            3
        \_ on rag       1
        kane            1
        danh & stump fantasies   1
        \_ If I like asian women but I am asian myself, does it count as
           a fetish?
           \_ no, then it is not a fetish.  -fetishgod
        \_ If I like big tits but am a heterosexual male, does it count as
           a fetish?
        \_ oh be quiet, dpassage
                \_ "like" is not a fetish.
        \_ Let's use relaxed freudian definition. Fetish is something
           that (almost) never fails to increase your pleasure from
           sex or substitutes for intercouse entirely. That means that
           you can be asian and have asian fetish BTW.  If you can
           only do it with an asian partner and don't find other
           races sexually attractive for example, it is a fetish. -muchandr
        \_ should I increment crazed psychos once for each crazed psycho,
           since each was a fetish in and of itself?
                \_ No.  Put down each name on it's own line.  Others may share
                   some but not all of those particular fetishes.
      - catholic schoolgirls  2
      \_ subset: japanese
                 schoolgirls  3
                 \_ Wearing
                    Sailor
                 \_ Wearing
      barely legal            1
      petite women            1
                    Sailor
                    Uniforms      4
                 \_ wearing a
                    cut-off
                    "spank me
                    daddy"
      fat chicks              0
      petite women            2
                    Uniforms  3
                 \_ wearing a cut-off "spank me daddy"
                    t-shirt   1
      tall                    3
      talg                    1
      illegal                 2
      petite women            3
      B&D                     5
      spanking                4
      little boys             0       -- cogan?
      tickling                1
      fat chicks             -1
      little girls            4
                              \_ This almost makes me proud to be a sodan.
                                 *sniff*  -mlee
      rootcows                37337
      - catholic schoolgirls  3
      illegal                     2  (Illegal for you or for them?)
                                     \_ Well, seeing that this is a fetish
        list, one MIGHT suppose that we are describing the object of
        affection/outlet for sexual energy in question, so then it would be
       -on nweaver                1
        pretty fucking clear that "illegal" refers to that 16 year old
      redheads                1
      rootcows                35545
        object.  If you actually used your brain, then there wouldn't be
        any confusion, which reminds me, I need to vote for "empty sporous
        craniums" as we all well know by now that grey matter spoils the
      \_ Where do you get this? I want some.
        meat.  -mlee
      fat chicks             -2
      soda                    1
      perl                    2
      mail order russian brides 0
      - toothless             1
      barely legal            2
      illegal                 2
      petite women            2
      petite women            3
      rootcows                    37337
      muchandr                2
      \_ recursion in action
      mail order russian brides 1
      big tits                6
      anal                    5
      fully clothed women     0
      idaho                   -1
       -on nweaver            1
      tentacle                1
      fetishes                4
      small rodents           2
      lila                        1
      \_ PDP-11s                  1
      Scheme                      1
      necrophillia            2
      rootcows                    31337
      crazed psychos          4
      \_ Where do you get this?   1
         I want some.             3
      Ahm                     2
      fat chicks                 -3
      soda                        2
      perl                        3
      lila                        666
      \_ in leather with a crop   1
         and a big fat strap-on
      pics of lila and kchang     4
      the elderly             1
      file cabinets           1
      rootcows                37337
      PDP-10s & LISP          6
      BSD driverhacks         1
      rootcows                35545
      shaving                     1
      teen shaving                1
      raverporn               1
      \_ Where do you get this? I want some.
      sexual torture          3
      fat chicks             -2
      soda                    1
      perl                    2
      leather                     1
      latex                       1
      reeser                      1
        \_ That's sick nevman.
                \_ Incest is best!
      catholic                    1
      mormon                      1
      soft porous craniums        0
      soft porous craniums void of grey matter 1
      sisters                     1
      ahm                         28
      twins                       1
      Hot babes with no brains    1
      lila                    1
      \_ in a leather corset  1
         \_ with leather skirt 1
      tickling                2
      spinach                 3
      pics of fatties         1
      Hank AKA JSL            2
      mail order russian brides 0
      amputees                1
      oral                    0
      ASTEROIDS               1,599,990 @ 2020 !!!!!!
      nuking the motd         666
      kane                    2
      danh & stump fantasies  3
      redheads                3
      mail order russian brides 1
      the Simpsons!           1
      wattle                  0
      fully clothed women     0
      idaho                   -1
1999/2/22-24 [Computer/SW/Mail, Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:15463 Activity:nil
2/22    Trying to decide if we need another T-1.  Can anyoned recommend
        software for monitoring the amount/percentage being used? -crebbs
        \_ http://www.best.com/~doosh/netrek/netrekFTP.html
          \_ MRTG rules, and it is free!  -ERic
             http://ee-staff.ethz.ch/~oetiker/webtools/mrtg/mrtg.html
1999/2/20-21 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:15451 Activity:low
2/19    My supervisor wants to learn Perl but doesn't have any programming
        background...I don't know any book better than Wall's own but
        I question if he's capable of using it to do what he needs
        to do.  I also question whether there are any "kid gloves" books
        would "work" as in general I believe ya gotta pay your dues to get
        the clues..  Anyone have any advice on this?  --jnat
        \_ yes.  learn perl and make him depend on you for all his perl needs.
          \_ Ho ho ho!  But that's the current situation..  I guess the
                only option is to teach him myself?
                \_ No, don't be stupid.  The above was a perfectly good
                   answer.  Why would you want your boss to be able to do the
                   things you're currently doing?  Are you getting paid extra
                   to train people at your company?  Is that part of your job?
                   Does it enhance your career in any way to teach your boss
                   anything more than how to kiss your ass to get done what he
                   needs done?  You're in a great situation, don't fuck it up.
        \_ when the boss suddenly decides he wants to write code, is
           just about the #1 major disaster possible. Like you said, he
           has zero coding experience. So anything he writes is going
           to be crap. Your best course of action may be
           1. teach him some basics
           2. say why don't you try to do something now?
              [give him huge project, and say "I could do this in about
                a day"]
           3. Either he gives up, or makes a total mess ofit.
             Then say "This takes years of training. Maybe you should
             leave the programming to me from now on"
1999/2/4-5 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:15356 Activity:moderate
2/3     Perl Gurus only:
        Let's say that I need a Perl module, but I don't have root to do
        "make install". Exactly what files do I need to copy to my local Perl
        directory, and how do I use the module that resides on my local dir?
        \_ when you make install, I believe you can go
           "make install PREFIX=/home/foo/local" or whatever and it'll do the
           right thing. Then stick "use lib '/home/foo/local/lib/perl5';" at
           the top of your script.
        \_ a separate question:  When I invoke multipule copies of perl(cgi
           scripts actually), the machine moves at snail pace.  When I have 10
           scripts running simultanouesly, the load shoot up to 25!! Anyway
           to get around this problem...and is linux/freebsd better at handling
           this type of job? with what type of hardware configuration?
           \_ It's probably out of RAM and swapping.  Does your machine have
              shared memory pages?
              \_ I am not sure.  The server is a ~175MHz machine(SGI most
                 likely) running IRIX with 256Mb of RAM.
                \_ ps.  top.
1999/1/26-29 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:15301 Activity:moderate
1/26    Is there any command line utility that returns the width and height
        dimensions of an image file, specifically .jpg & .gif?
        \_ file foo.gif         --dbushong
           \_ Seems like it only prints the width and height of .gif files
              but not .jpg files.  Why?  -- yuen
              \_ Well, someone keeps deleting this, but again:
                 perldoc Image::Size.  If that's too tricky,
                 ~dbushong/bin/imgsize   --dbushong
              \_ Because someone like you didn't take the time to rewrite
                 it to do so.  What's up with everyone expecting everything
                 to be pre-written to do exactly what they need?  Do it
                 yourself, sheesh.
                 \_ Because chances are someone has written something to
                    do what you want. Why reinvent the wheel? And why
                    suppose the person has the time or knowledge to
                    accomplish the task?
                    \_ To ask if someone else has done it is differant than
                       asking why they haven't.  One is a query, the latter
                       is a whine.  I don't suppose they have the time or
                       skill.  I object to the whining not the desire to have
                       a feature.
                 \_ Well, since it knows to look into the file content to
                    find out if a file with no ".jpg" extension is a
                    JPEG file, I would think it also knows to look into the
                    JPEG file content to get the width and height. -- yuen
                    \_ Because the author didn't need this function and you
                       didn't add it.
           \_ Well, someone keeps deleting this, but again:  perldoc
              Image::Size.  If that's too tricky, ~dbushong/bin/imgsize
              --dbushong
1999/1/26-28 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:15297 Activity:high
1/26    Would like to know if there is a conversion utility for taking a
        very large bourne shell script and turning into a Perl one.  I don't
        look forward to re-writing 20K+ of scripts somebuddy else wrote.  -mtbb
        \_ While this is theoretically possible, the naive version would
           generate nasty code, and even the best version couldn't generate
           good code; the styles differe too greately between sh and perl..
           why do you need to rewrite them in perl?  --dbushong
           \_ because the effort of porting them is less than the effort
              of trying to get sh to do what you want it to do?  -tom
              \_ I would rather deal with sh than with script-produced perl
                 --dbushong
                 \_ Depends on how much it needs to change in the future.
                    Some stuff is a bitch to do in sh.  You can script-port
                    to perl and then rewrite it in pieces over time as
                    required and enhance more easily in the long term this
                    way.
           \_ Becauer PERL r000lez!
        \_ The reason I need to put this into Perl is because Perl is portable
           \_ See if you can license one of the [c]sh programs for NT.  We
              have one at work, MKS Toolkit.  -meyers
           to the NT machines we have as well.  I was hoping there was a
           utility to help out, but seeing as the script needs re-writing
           anyway.....  Perl will also allow us, as Tom-Bud pointed out, the
           ability to code in CGI stuff for better DB-Web application
           integration in future modules.  -mtbb
           \_ bash for NT exists.
                \_ Oh just stop.  None of the ported shells work as expected
                   under NT.  Stop offering half assed unix-centric solutions
                   for NT problems.  Just because it exists doesn't mean it
                   works correctly.
                   \_ bourne shell scripting is NOT UNIX-CENTRIC, it is
                   POSIX.1. Microsloth CLAIMS TO SUPPORT POSIX.1
                   So you don't have to install anything non-microsloth
                   to run the stupid script. Theoretically, just
                   change the path to SH, and run.
                   Don't complain, if you don't at least TRY to run
                   the scripts, as is, under NT.
1999/1/19-21 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:15252 Activity:nil
1/18    I'm sorry to repost this, but I lost the motd answer two months ago.
        Here is my question. In regular shell scripts, I can do `nohup prog &"`
        or simply `prog &`. However, in Perl, it seems that when I exit the
        parent Perl program, ALL the children exit as well! How do I make it
        behave like any other shell scripts, without using fork? Thanks.
        \_ `prog &` doesn't normally make sense -- backquotes mean to capture
           the output of a program, but the programs you want to run in the
           background don't usually generate any output.  Perhaps you wanted
           system "prog &"?
           \_ AH that works! No wonder when I kill my parent process, the
              children dies (cuz I'm waiting for their output). THANKS MOTD!
1999/1/15-17 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:15236 Activity:nil
1/14    I'm running Apache on a Linux box and it won't seem to allow me
        to post to/from a PERL script.  I keep getting the error mesg:
        "The requested method POST is not allowed for the URL..."  Is
        there some thing i can set somewhere to allow this?. Any help
        is appreciated  -crebbs
        \_ Options ExecCGI
           \_ this goes where? httpd.conf??
1999/1/11 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:15207 Activity:high 75%like:15553
1/11    Troll on Perl deleted                                   -tom II
        \_ It wasn't a troll, asshole.  WTF is wrong with you people?  Don't
           you have jobs or a life or anything?  Stop fucking with other
           people's motd entries, trolls or not, and piss off.
                \_ Grab it from mehlhaff's RCS archives & post to http://ucb.org.csua
                        & ucb.cs.undergrads so the assholes can't nuke it
1999/1/11 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:15206 Activity:very high
1/11    Is there any reason Perl couldn't/shouldn't replace scheme & java
        as the languages of choice for 61x?  Yes, it can be damn ugly, but
        the iteration/recursion difference is a lot clearer, the CPAN
        provides many excellent examples of abstraction & component use,
        and it's a lot easier to get perl to work on home computers (unix, mac,
        or winblows) than scm/Dr. Scheme.  Everything scheme & java can do
        perl can too.  (Well, java does win at threads for now, but that's
        not taught in the 61-series is it?)
        \_ does Perl support closures and upward funargs? -nick
           \_ It has both static & dynamic scoping, and you can close over
              statically-scoped vars.
        \_ Perl is kinda messy.  It also assumes you have a brain and know
           something about systems as well.  There's lots of niggly little
           historical things in PERL that a freshy wouldn't get.  Scheme,
           although useless in the RW is much cleaner (as taught in freshy
           courses) and there's already tons of experience at Cal teaching
           it the right way.  I love PERL, but I don't think it's a good
           choice for a first language.  Java?  Which Java?  heh.
        \_ Perl can be learned the wrong way, and is much easier to cheat
           solutions that do the "task", but in the wrong way.
        \_ basically, if the 61 series is a place people can get excited
           about programming and get tools they can use to actually create
           useful programs themselves, perl is a good choice.  If it's a
           weeder series, where you're trying to knock out people who aren't
           really interested by making them use a crappy language with
           no practical purpose and no redeeming features, scheme is a good
           choice.  In a typically Berkeley manner, the department has
           decided to go for the latter option. -tom
           \_ um, scheme is not being used with those goals in mind at all.
              scheme is used b/c that's what the book that bh likes uses,
              and b/c it's a nice simple elegant language that is easy for
              first-time programmers to work with.  it may not be practical,
              but it certainly has redeeming features.  see response below.
           \_ Y3AH, D00D!!!1!  1 AGR33 W1TH T0M 100,000,000%%!!!!1!!!
              P3RL 1Z __S0__ MUCH M0R3 K-RAD THAN SCH3M3!!!1!  B3S1D3S, 1F
              TH3Y ALS0 TAUGHT P33PUL H0W 2 PLAY N3TTR3K AND DR1NK D13T
              C0K3 1N TH3 61 S3R13Z, P33PUL C0ULD QU1T SCH00L AND MAK3 L0TZ
              UV M0N3Y BY B3CUM1NG 1NSTANT SYSADM1NZ!!!1!!!
                \_ gee what an intelligent comment.  -tom
                   \_ did that look like it was meant to be an intelligent
                      comment to you?
       \_ The 61-series is designed so that someone can come in knowing
           nothing about computers (but hopefully knowing at least
           "induction" which is the math version of recursion) and as they
           work their way through the series the levels of abstraction
           choices of syntax to use.  Probably not the best choice for a
           gradually go away and you end up in assembly. Remember, the goal
           is not to learn an interesting language, it is to learn *about*
           computer languages, about how we use computers. In languages like
           Perl, a lot of other "junk" gets in the way of doing that. Also,
           the Abelson & Sussman text really is a good text. Chances are if
           it used Perl, Berkeley would be using Perl.
        \_ Scheme is pretty much a pure functional language.  It's a
           good environment to learn about how to structure programs,
           break problems into components, etc.  It also has a rigid,
           well-defined syntax.  Perl is powerful, but not only are
           there 100+ ways to get any task done, there are several
           choices of syntax to use.
           \_ and most of them disgusting.
                                     Probably not the best choice for a
           first course in functional programming.
        \_ "In English Composition 61, we force everyone to write in iambic
           pentameter, because the rigid, well-defined syntax makes people
           broaden their vocabulary and appreciate Shakespeare more."  What
           a crock of shit.  No amount of time spent working around the
           klunkiness of a language is more valuable than time spent actually
           solving problems through programming.  The fact that there are
           lots of ways to get stuff done in Perl is a *good* thing, if
           what you want to teach is how to get stuff done.  You're fooling
           yourself if you think the 61 series is supposed to do anything but
           weed out English majors (as English 61, above, would be designed
           to weed out CS majors).  -tom
             \_ when i took cs61a i found it to be a very good introduction
                to the concepts of programming (for a person who had never
                done any before that class except a couple of lines of basic
                in some lame hs computer tools class), and also friendly and
                not intimidating. it didn't seem like a weeder course at all.
                i'm sure the class itself has much more of a weeder feel now,
                since cs is so overloaded, but i still think that scheme is a
                nice language within which to teach the basic concepts.  if
                61a had used perl i probably would have freaked.  -lila
           \_ And since we all know English and CS are the same
              thing....
           \_ this reminds me that I switched from an english major to CS
              because of 60a (SICP w/ Wilensky).. --karlcz
1999/1/7-10 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:15184 Activity:nil
1/7     Love perl? Need a FT job with great benefits? Mail marco.
1998/12/16-17 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:15099 Activity:high
12/15   How would I count the number of occurances of a pattern in Perl?
        \_ the easy but incorrect way to do it is grep pattern file | wc -l
        \_ In a single line?  In a file?  In what?
          \_ Find pattern.  $count++;
             \_ Yeah, this would work if I'm feeding a for loop line by
                line. But what if you have say $foo = "aaabbbaaacccaaa"
                and you want to count the number of times 'aaa' appears?
                \_ Use the same algorithm.  Implement "find pattern" differently.
                   Twink.  Try while ($foo =~ m/pat/g) { $count++ } or
                   $count = length($foo =~ m/pat/g);
                   \_ Thanx, but can anyone ask anything on this motd without
                      being branded a twink? I guarantee you there is not
                      one question here that someone won't think is trivial
                      or self-evident or just plain dumb.
                \_ you then have to decide if "aaaaaa" matches with "aaa"
                   once, twice, or 5 times.
        \_ troll deleted                                        -tom
        \_ tr/// it into its identical string/pattern and catch the returned
                result in a variable.  The result will be the number of times
                the translation (in this case the null translation) was
                performed.  Example from camel book:
                        $cnt = $sky =~ tr/*/*/;  # count the stars in $sky
                                                        -brain
1998/12/4-6 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:15073 Activity:high
12/4    I'd like to write a simple mail client using Perl5. Should I download
        the CPAN module for IMAP4 or POP? Which one is better in performance?
        Which one is easier to program? Thanks.
        \_ What added features does IMAP4 have over POP3?  People brag that
           you can download only message headers under IMAP and selectively
           download only certain message bodies but it seems that you can
           do the same with POP.
        \_ On the side note, is there a command line mail utility, that is the
           same for Solaris and Linux, that allows you to read mail content and
           read mail headers using just command line?
           \_ mh
              \_ eww, yuk. I used mh for a whole summer because the place
                 I worked for had nothing else. vi beats pico any day but
                 mh was just nasty.
                \_ Peasant.  mh is awesome.  You use /bin/mail?
           \_ I use a program that's part of ELM, called "readmsg". -brg
        \_ If you're making this because you're a perl stud and want better
           handling of mail, you might look at 'mailagent' (perl moral
           equivalent to procmail). -lim
1998/12/3-6 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:15063 Activity:nil
12/3    Need perl hacker for a few days to write a preprocessor for an
        assembler. Contact ali.
        \_ ali needs to be sodomized
1998/10/21-25 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:14806 Activity:low
10/21   Anyone know a good perl module (or other reliable method) of
        interfacing with mail spools?  Specs for spools? -jnat
        \_ you just want to read the spools, or do all the file locking
           stuff as well?
        \_ formail and procmail are pretty useful
        \_ ever considered scanning CPAN under the Mail:: namespace?
1998/9/29-30 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:14699 Activity:kinda low
9/29    The other day when I was using "dict" it somehow searched a lot of
        different online dictionaries rather than just Webster, but I could
        not reproduce it.  What is the right command?
        \_ dict/webster queries a secondary source when EB Webster fails
           to return a definition.  there isn't a way for end-users to
           specify which source to use at run time right now.  but you
           can go to <DEAD>work.ucsd.edu:5141/cgi-bin/http_webster<DEAD>
           with any browser in the mean time.  -jwang
           \_ of course, since dict is a simple perl script, if you were
               an elite perl hacker, you could hack it to do that yourself.
                \_ Then someone must be changing the script when I ran
                dict the other day, because it queried about 4 or 5 different
                sources, with very nice quotations of actual usage and
                detailed notes on similar words.  Hope it can remain that way.
                \_ the second source (in the URL) is in fact a gateway to
                   about 4 or 5 other databases.  again, it's only used
                   when the primary Encylopedia Britannica Webster database
                   fails. -jwang
1998/9/15-16 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:14605 Activity:insanely high
9/15    Is there any way in Perl to do the same is #include in C?  That is,
        just insert the text of one file into another?
        \_ if you mean to include or share perl libraries,
           the "require" keyword will work in most cases.
           perl5 has more powerful module support with "use".
           \_ No, I have one big script that parses input, and would like to
              use it in another to parse and do some other stuff.
              Basically, I have file1.pl, and would like to do
              #include "file1.pl"
              sub_defined_in_file1();
              \_ he answered your question, idiot.
                 \_ No he didn't. I've read the docs on require and use,
                    and it isn't working.  I'm not trying to include perl
                    libraries.
                    \_ require is what you want.  your fu is weak.
                       train harder.
                        \_ require "included.pl" returns:
                included.pl did not return a true value at test.pl line 2
                        Since I was specifically looking for something as
                        simple as #include, it appears that require won't
                        do the job.  I don't want to go through the hassle
                        of creating a module if I don't have to.  A simpler
                        answer to the first question would have been, "No,
                        there is no equivalent of #include in perl.  You
                        have to create a module."
                        \_ No you don't have to create a module, just make the
                           last line of the file you require be: "1;" which
                           will evaluate to the true value perl is looking for
                           \_ Thank you!
                                \_ You obviously didn't RTFM.
                    \_ Yes.  He did.  Indeed your fu is not weak.  You lack
                       all traces of fu.
                       \_ My kung fu is the best. -billg
                                \_ Everyone was kung fu fighting -discoman
        \_ Why yes indeed. Perl needs to run with the -P flag. That can go in
                 Also read the man pages on use and require -- there are
                 some subtle differences (among other things, require
                 does "run -time" inclusion, and use does "compile-time"
                 inclusion.
           in the shbang line (e.g. "#!/path/to/perl -w -P"). man perlrun
           for more details. -anirvan
        \_ Summary of require solution:
           require "include.pl";
           the last expression in include.pl must evaluate to true
           (non-zero)
           \_ i.e. make the last line:
              1;
           \_ Read about the AUTOLOAD method in the perlsub manpage.
              Also read the man pages on use and require -- there are some
              subtle differences (among other things, require does "run
              -time" inclusion, and use does "compile-time" inclusion.
1998/9/7-9 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl, Computer/SW/Unix] UID:14555 Activity:high
9/6     Someone should crack root on eecs instructional and administer
        that damn thing since no one seems to be.
        \_ In the last month, jenni, alanc, & monish left.  While they
           did hire brg, it will take some time to get back up to speed.
           \_ so is jon the only competent sysadmin left at berkeley.
                \_ no, there are many much more competent than jon, they
                        just don't work for eecs inst.
                   \_ to name a few, mike sinatra, brian shiratsuki,
                      rob mcnicholas.  --jon
           \_ brg >> jenni+alanc+monish   --brg #1 fan
              \_ but brg can only work << jenni+alanc+monish  --brg #1 realist
           \_ And I curse the life I'm living, and I curse my poverty,
              And I wish that I could be, oh I wish that I could be,
              Oh I wish that I could be root@cory.  -- schoen, who has
                                 actually written the other verses too
                \_ Yuk, i became a cs major because i hated poetry.
                   \_ it's amazing how telling that statement is.
                      read a book that's not published by o'reilly sometime.
                      \_ Really, ORA books have quite a lot of poetry in
                         them (they're pretty literate), but, in general,
                         poetry is a Good Thing.  - humanities h0zer
                                \_ Perl Poetry doesn't count.
                                   \_ I know.  Some of the books have actual
                                      poetry, in examples or in chapter
                                      epigraphs.
                                \_ According to Larry Wall, these programs
                                   actually do compile (yes perl compiles)
                                   and runs.  Incidentally, they do
                                   nothing interesting.
                      \_ It seems to me that CS majors in general have the
                         most depth of knowledge, yet least breadth. Not
                         necessarily a bad thing, but not all that great
                         either.
                         \_ It is perhaps one of the tragic aspects of this
                            high-tech economy.  Depth of knowlege will get you
                            a cool job.  Breadth of knowledge will likely have
                            you flipping burgers.  Hard choice to make there...
                     \_ I bought O'Reilly's Posix Poetry.  Brought tears to
                        my eyes.  -poetry lover
        \_ I cracked it - what you do want done?  - rewt
           \_ The mailspools of all the cuties (null set?)
                \_ Mail is _always_ boring.  If you're going to ever break
                   root, please don't do it for something stupid like reading
                   some chick's boring email.
                   \_ not to mention it is usually easier to hack the "chick's"
                      account than root - if she is a true chick her passwd
                      should be something simple, try dddelta or such, or
                      there is always the social hack (ask her personal
                      questions - the name of her dog?), or just wait for her
                      to walk away from her logged in session and rhost, cp her
                      whole file structure, fwd her mail, or if you don't want
                      to be caught, xhost yourself and look at her screen :)
                      \_ ali, you sound as if you have experience
1998/7/30 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:14413 Activity:moderate 50%like:14387
7/29    perl-5.005_01 (the latest non-beta version) installed, bugs to mconst.
        \_ Is this a version _without_ the threads compiled in, cause
            I heard threaded perl might run slower (but I havent installed
                5.005 myself yet )
                \_ perl5 -V yields:
                        usethreads=undef useperlio=undef d_sfio=undef
                        ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
        \_ could you link perl5 back to the stable perl5.00404 please?
           \_ perl-5.005_01 is an official release (the _01 is a maintenance
              patch, not a development version); as far as I can tell, it's
              more stable than 5.004_04 was.  I saw someone complaining on
              wall that LWP didn't work; I've recompiled LWP (along with most
              of the other modules we had installed) to work with 5.005.
              If you find anything else that doesn't work with the new perl,
              please let me know.  --mconst
                \_ ok fine. but remember p54 didn't stablize till patch 04.
1998/7/29-30 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:14407 Activity:low
7/28    Has anyone used linux in any home automation systems. x10/CP290 boxes
        and such? --smitty
        \_ I have a cron job that makes my coffee, adjusts the AC/heat,
           calls the office to tell them I'm working from home again, and
           then walks the dog.
           \_ cron?  who needs cron -- I only use perl
            \_ Larry Wall gave a neat demo of how he uses x10 boxes at his
               home in conjunction with Linux and Perl just a few months back
               at SVLUG.  He said that the x10 protocol was easy to use if
               you could get a home automation control box with a serial
               interface.  I didn't pursue it any further, personally I'm
               more interested in wireless ethernet at home.
1998/7/27-28 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:14402 Activity:high
7/23    Long bit truncated down to:
        but this is what i wanted to do:
        foreach f (*.gif)
            mv $f `echo $f | sed 's/\(.*\)\.gif/\1th.gif/'`
        end
        it seems like it's better done at the command line. I didn't think
        you can do that in as few bytes (and processes) in perl.
        \_ If you want to do it once, period, for the rest or eternity,
           fine, do that.  But the perl is:
           foreach $f (<*.gif>) {
                $f =~ s/\.gif$//;
                rename("$f.gif", "${f}th.gif");
           }
           Process count:  Shell: 4   Perl: 1
           Process count:  Shell: 4 per file renamed   Perl: 1
           Byte count:     Shell: 90  Perl: 139
           49 more bytes, but runs much, much faster  (really, try it on
           Byte count:     Shell: 70  Perl: 75
           \_ isn't the carat supposed to be a dollar-sign? -- idiot
           \_ 68 bytes but uglier:
           5 more bytes, but runs much, much faster  (really, try it on
           even 50 files)  --dbushong
           \_ 66 bytes but uglier:
                foreach (<*.gif>) {
                        s/\.gif$//;
                        rename("$_.gif", "${_}th.gif");
                }
           \_ 62 bytes:
           \_ 57 bytes:
              $g=".gif";foreach(<*$g>){s/$g$//;rename($_$g,${_}th$g);}
                \_ are you sure you can do $_$g ?
        \_ with the extra added bonus of globbing via <> ick ick but that's
           a stylistic issue
1998/7/24-27 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl, Computer/SW/Unix] UID:14382 Activity:moderate
7/23    How do you do this in sed, not perl?
        s/(.*).gif/$1th.gif/;
        s/(.*).gif/\1th.gif/
        \_ sed: 1: "s/(.*).gif/\1th.gif/": \1 not defined in the RE
           \_ try this instead (ugly, but works): sed 's/.*/&th.gif/;s/.gif//'
           \_ sed 's/\(.*\)\.gif/\1th.gif/'
              (sed uses \( and \) to mean "save this") also,
              don't forget to \ the . so it doesn't mean "any character"
              --dbushong
                \_ woo woo, that's what i was looking for. you da man!
                   \_ This being said, perl regexps are significantly nicer
                      than sed, perl -e 'regexp' is nicer than sed 'regexp'
                      And if you're applying it to an entire file in place,
                      you can say perl -pi -e 'regexp', whereas you need to
                      create tempfiles for sed..  --dbushong
                      \_ but this is what i wanted to do:
                         foreach f (*.gif)
                         mv $f `echo $f | sed 's/\(.*\)\.gif/\1th.gif/'`
                         end
                         it seems like it's better done at the command
                         line. I didn't think you can do that in as few
                         bytes (and processes) in perl.
                          \_ You can do it in 1 process, and approximately
                             the same number of bytes, in perl.  -tom
                      \_ Yeah?  So?  sed is for real men.  You sound like a
                         limp-wristed, lisping girly-man.  You probably use
                         emacs instead of ed, too, I'll bet.
                        \_ ed? You pansy faggot!  I use cat, don't make any
                           mistakes and never need to edit a file because I
                           thought ahead and did it right the first time!
                      \_ why are perl regexps "nicer"?
                         \_ In general, they require fewer backslashes, support
                            all the standard operators, and add some new and
                            useful (if tricky) things like non-greedy qfiers.
1998/7/11 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl, Computer/SW/Languages/Misc] UID:49814 Activity:nil
7/10    A quick and dirty  spam filter i wrote:
         http://www.csua/~jefe/.nospam
        I'm not really sure how well it works and it might even filter out
        real mail.
        \_ You expect us to run a binary without source or do you expect
           that a shell script can be run if an arbitrary user's process
           can't read the shell script to find out what shell to run on
           it?
        -rwx--x--x  1 jefe  csua  2490 Jul 11 00:57 /home/j/jefe/.nospam
            --jon
           \_ There is no binary involved.  It's all perl script as
              stated at the top #!/usr/bin/perl.  Your procmailrc file
              will automatically invoke it if it has:
                :0
                | $HOME/.nospam
1998/6/25-27 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:14249 Activity:moderate
6/25    how do you make emacs auto-indent after pressing "ENTER" in
        perl/cc-mode?  What do I need to add in my .emacs file? TIA
                                                - clueless emacs user
        \_ M-X vi-mode; set ai
        \_ In your .emacs, add:  (add-hook 'c-mode-common-hook
             (function (lambda ()
                (define-key c-mode-map "\C-m" 'newline-and-indent) ) ) )
           ... And a similar thing for your perl mode.  --sowings
           \_ I assume it's: (add-hook 'perl-mode-common-hook
                (function (lambda ()
                (define-key perl-mode-map "\C-m" 'newline-and-indent) ) ))
                for perl?  it didnt work for me.  - still clueless
                \_ It would probably be 'perl-mode-hook, without "common".
        \_ Use vi.
1998/6/8 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:14186 Activity:nil
6/8  Anyone knows how Perl does its checksum in unpack?  I need
     to implement unpack("%32C*", "some string") in Java...any ideas?
1998/5/16-17 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl, Computer/SW/Unix] UID:14101 Activity:high 50%like:14484
5/16    How do I remove repeating lines form a text file so that
        any line of text only appear once, at most?
        \_ uniq.  If the repeated lines aren't necessarily next to each
           other, use sort first.
           \_ But I want to keep the original order (of first appearance).
              \_ you could always write a C program to do it.  Not necessarily
                 the most productive way, but it could be fun.
              \_ thats why theres perl
1998/5/16-17 [Computer/SW/Unix, Computer/SW/Languages/Perl, Academia/Berkeley/CSUA] UID:14099 Activity:nil
5/14    Summer job with a startup in Berkeley: Unix, Java, Perl.
        /csua/pub/jobs/RodaGroup - schoen
1998/5/16-17 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:14097 Activity:nil
5/15    Anyone have a pointer to code or library to take an MD5 fingerprint?
        Preferably something that has been ported to Digital UNIX.
        \_ the md5 rfc has code
           \_ There is lots of (inherently "cross-platform")
              crypto/authentication stuff in Perl; try CPAN.
              \_ I'd like C code.
                \_ why not check out the md5 source in /usr/ports ?
        \_ SSLeay, what else.
        \_ md5sum from GNU textutils package --brg
1998/5/11-12 [Academia/Berkeley/Classes, Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:14077 Activity:nil
5/8     A friend of mine is looking for someone to do some
        only-slightly-challenging Perl CGI work? there's $150 or so in
        it for them, negociable. Mail me if interested: -=aubie
                        \_negotiable
1998/5/5-6 [Computer/SW/OS/Solaris, Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:14050 Activity:nil
5/4     In Perl, when I execute time() on Solaris and on Soda, the time
        is very close. However, when I execute time() on my Linux, there's
        a discrepancy of about 30000 seconds. On all the machines, the
        time and date sync, but time() does not. Why is this happening,
        and how do I fix it? THanks.
        \_ Your machine's time is wrong; it only looks correct because you
           have your timezone set incorrectly.  Type "env TZ=PST8PDT time"
           to see what time your machine actually thinks it is.
           \_ env is a gross hack for those who don't use real shells.
        \_ How do I change it? Instead of PST, mine says WAT?
1998/4/29 [Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Troll/Aspolito, Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:14015 Activity:insanely high 50%like:14025
4/28    To mock People's Magazine, I am now doing a contest on the top
        10 most beautiful people on soda.
        \_ three words: pee ess bee - tpc
                \_ Merriam-Webster's Collegiate® Dictionary contains 2 items
                   relevant for "ess".
        \_ JSL the Angry, Drunken Dwarf
        \_ This is like judging the most intelligent contestants in the
           Miss America pageant. ie. pointless.
        \_ This is Soda-- shouldn't we have the top-ten most beautiful one-line
           perl scripts or something?
                \_ $twink++ if $ENV{"USER"} eq "cmlee"; return $twink;
        \_ aspo
                \_ Don't put aspo on this list.  How will I ever get him back?
                        -dumped gay lover
                   \_ you that bonedaddy-assplaster-gyrosphincter boy?
        \_ psb
        \_ christine
        \_ tom...
           \_ why the ellipsis?
        \_ jsl
        \_ tawei
        \_ yer mom
        \_ This list almost made me think we were electing for the
           10 most unattractive people.
1998/4/15 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:13963 Activity:very high
4/15    Let me clarify on the Perl question.  I have two commands need
        to be spawned from a Perl script, $cmd1, $cmd2.  $cmd2 depends on
        $cmd1.  However, $cmd1 and $cmd2 are called millions (no, not an
        exaggeration) of times in a foreach loop now with different
        arguements each time, so performace suffers.  Now the question is,
        how to run each set of $cmd1 and $cmd2 in parallel while still
        keeping $cmd1 and $cmd2 to run in serial?  I tried system but
        failed.  Each set of $cmd1 and $cmd2 waits for the previous set
        to finish...
        \_ run fork, and have each child system $cmd1 then $cmd2, then
           exit.  The parent process just forks a million times,
           then exits.  Now, make sure to run this on a big box, or
           million perls will bring you to your knees. - seidl
           \_ Is there an alternative?  fork-ing a million times
              is expensive even on a big box.  (I just ran a simple
              script that forks 10,000 times and it increased the system
              load by 10-fold, and it also forbids more processes to be
              spawned). Can we execute each set in parallel w/o fork?
              Thanks.  Or maybe it wasn't pratical to try to run these
              millions of set of commands in parallel in the first place?
              \_ depending on the speed needed, spacing out the forkings
                 might be a good idea (just sleep 0.1 secs between each
                 pair or something like that)
                \_ So thats 100k seconds per million iterations roughly
                   equals 27 hours per run?  3 million = 81 hours.  I think
                   not.  That 27 hours is only the added delay between runs
                   and does not include actual runtime for the binaries.
                   \_ doh. well again, it depends on the binaries'
                      runtime. 27 hours might be acceptable if it means
                      not killing an overloaded server. Adjust the figure as
                      as appropriate for a faster box
              \_ Uh, how do you plan on running different commands without
                 forking separate processes?
                 \_ errrr...good point.  So fork is the only option when
                    you want to run things in parallel?  How does UNIX
                    shell execute two background commands?  By forking
                    twice?
                    \_ Yep.  Thats how you get a new process. fork.
                       Now, you might be able to avoid the extra perl
                       processes with creative use of system("$cmd1 ; $cmd2");
                       but a million jobs in parallel is a lot. - seidl
                       \_ Instead, sh was spawned.  Is that necessarily
                          faster than spawning perl itself?
                    \_ Fork isn't the only way to run tasks in parallel --
                       you can thread things too.  But unix command-line
                       programs can't be run in threads.
        \_ you cna also call system("$cmd1;$cmd2 &");
           \_ buy a clue. system forks implicitly
             \_ if forks but it also waits till completetion you dumbass.
                try the following in perl
                     system("echo foo; sleep 10");
                     system ("echo bar");
                note that it prints foo, then waits for 10 seconds, and then
                prints bar.   -aspolito
        \_ Ok... can you rewrite the unix binaries so that you're only doing
           a single system call from perl and the binary does the looping
           without forking?  Are the command line parameters known before
           or non-deterministic based on user input, the time, or grains of
           sand on the beach?  I agree with the previous person that doing
           millions of calls to a binary from perl is a bad way to go.
           Rewrite the C, if possible, to relieve PERL and the system of this
           forking burden.
1998/4/13 [Computer/SW/Languages/C_Cplusplus, Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:13946 Activity:nil
4/11    For a project, I need to convert a .bmp into a 2D array of numbers
        that represent each color. For example, say I have a 20x20 pixel
        .bmp with 256 colors. I need a 20x20 array holding values from 0
        (white) to 256 (black). Can anyone point me in the right
        direction? Any help would be greatly appreciated. -jkwan
        \_ Assuming you want to automate this (do it tons of times non-
           interactively, I'd suggest:  use ImageMagick (ick) to convert
           them to .xpm, which is acii format roughly how you describe,
           but with it's colormap specified first.  You could then do some
           perl on that to get what you want --dbushong
        \_ I suggest you go and get information on bmp file format.  There are
           already c libraries that reads bmp file header and data for on
           the internet.  I have a game book that came with a CD rom with all
           bmp classes.  So, I assume you get it from the internet.
1998/4/3-4 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:13898 Activity:nil
4/3     The cover of the latest issue of the perl journal
        is pretty hilarious.
        \_ This is the sort of super-geek stuff you should definitely never
           sign.  You poor sad lost little boy.  Most men would be telling
           their friends about the cover of the latest Playboy or SI.  And
           then you wonder why people think computer people are losers and
           anti-social geeks?
        \_ Ha ha, yes.  Quite droll, with a great deal of verve.
        \_ D00D, WHUT WUZ 0N 1T???/??  1 WUZ SUPP0Z3D 2 G3T 1T 1N TH3 MA1L,
           BUT MY M0M TH1NKZ THAT C0MPUT3RZ R A T00L UV SATAN (AND THAT 1"M
           RU1N1NG MY GRAD3Z BY SP3ND1NG 2 MUCH T1M3 0N TH3M), S0 2 SAV3 MY
           S0UL, SH3 T00K 1T 0UT UV TH3 MA1LB0X && SHR3DD3D 1T!!!1!!!!1!!!!
           (AND MY _26OO_ AND _W1R3D_, 2!!1!!!)  WHUT D0 1 D0???//???
           H3LP!!1!!!
1998/3/19-20 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:13840 Activity:moderate
3/19    Is there a way to use PERL or some other scripting language to
        create a windows95/nt shortcut?  I want to have something like a
        .bat file create a bunch of shortcuts then delete itself.  It
        can't be GUI based or interactive beyond an initial double-click.
        Pointers, URL's, etc, all welcome and appreciated.  -stuck
        \_ http://www.perl.org/CPAN/ports
                \_ I got it and version 0.03 of the Shortcut module worked
                   perfectly with a recent version of win32perl.  Thanks!
1998/3/18-20 [Computer/SW/OS/FreeBSD, Computer/SW/Languages, Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:13830 Activity:moderate
3/18    Has anyone (else) encountered a bug where after using lseek with
        a negative offset read stops working on that fd, even though a
        valid off_t was returned?  In particular, I have a file with two
        binary unsigned longs at the end, and when I do an lseek(fd,
        -2*sizeof(unsigned long), SEEK_END); the reads then fail. -mel
        \_ Use PERL.
        \_ Did you try seeking to the beginning to the file, then a forward
           seek to where you want to read as a work-around?
           \_ The file is full of longs and I had wanted to read the two
              longs at the end of it.  The workaround I found was:

              end_offset = lseek(fd, 0, SEEK_END);
              lseek(fd, end_offset-2*sizeof(long), SEEK_SET);

              which is ugly but it works.  Throw in a few error checks
              on the return codes and it should work for you too. -mel
                \_ mel you ugly squint, get off the motd
        \_ And now, the right answer: You are specifying a seek relative to
           SEEK_END... Such a seek is implicitly in the negative direction,
           since it's impossible to seek past the end of the file.  The minus
           sign in front of the 2 is unnecessary.  So you should be doing:
           lseek(fd, 2*sizeof(unsigned long), SEEK_END);
           I tried looking for an example of this in K&R, but in each instance
           where SEEK_END is used, they demonstrate with an offset of 0, which
           is not too instructive.  WHY HAST THOU FORSAKEN ME, K&R? I TOOK
           THY WORD AS GOSPEL ONLY TO FIND A HALF-TRUTH LYING IN WAIT TO SNARE
           THE UNWARY! -mogul (hey, it's 3:15am, fuck off!)
           \_ Not quite.  A seek from SEEK_END is not implcitly negative;
              just like SEEK_CUR and SEEK_SET, positive offsets go forwards
              and negative offsets go backwards (see lseek(2)).  The problem
              with your code (and it's not really your fault) is that sizeof
              returns a size_t, which (on freebsd) is an unsigned int; when
              you multiply that by -2, you get another unsigned int (K&R 2.0,
              p. 198); and the unsigned int (0xfffffff8) then gets promoted
              to a signed long long (0x00000000fffffff8).

              This is not what you want.  The Right Way to fix it would be
              for freebsd to make size_t an unsigned long long, but that
              would break a lot of stuff and probably won't happen soon; in
              the meantime, you can cast the return value of sizeof to a
              signed int and your code will work.    --mconst
1998/3/18-19 [Computer/SW/Languages/C_Cplusplus, Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:13828 Activity:high
3/18    looking at mi professors and tas and manager resumes, these people dont
        know how to c0de shit in perl and c/c++ and shell and java, yet they
        make/will make more $ than me, what the fuck?
        \_ I have actually heard a manager refer to programmers, unflinchinly,
           as "unskilled labor", by which I think he meant disposable/inter-
           changeable or something.   Im not sure
           \_ It depends on what kind of application you develop.  I would
              not call people developing optimized 3d game engine or
              financial application "unskilled".
              \_ No, people who develop financial applications are unskilled.
                 Gamers are pretty cool, though.
        \_ demand for a raise and see how high you can go
        \_ Because coding is for kiddies.  You can teach any idiot how to
           code.  It really isn't that hard.  Look how many idiots are doing
           it right now.  No PhD required.  If you wanted to make big bucks
           you went into the wrong field and now possess the wrong skills.
           Sorry, but you're pretty confused about the world and your career
           is already fucked.  Time to retrain I guess.
        \_ It doesn't matter anyway; when bh and his Communist GNU buddies win,
           you'll all be writing code for free.  (Hope you like doing
           support . . . )
                \_ POT STICKER POWER!  YEE HAA!  Actually I'm glad we have
                   self appointed victims like the FSF/GNU people but I
                   wouldn't want to be one.
                \_ If it weren't for GNU cc, our lives would REALLY be
                   fun. (you, yes you, could write your projects using
                   ULTRIX cc!) I, for one, am rather thankful to have
                   cross-platform tools that *work* for a change... -brg
                   \_ I did.  Thanks.  Wasn't much different except the
                      code ran a tiny bit faster.
1998/3/5-7 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:13760 Activity:high
3/4     Perl gurus: If I can convert from gmtime to scalar time (ie. convert
        a number like 8892341243 -> 2/3/98 11:00PM, how do I do the reverse?
        Thanks.
        \_ use Time::Local;
1998/2/25-3/25 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl, Computer/SW/Unix] UID:13734 Activity:very high
3/25    Any easy ways to calculate median via UNIX utils like bc?
        \_ use awk
        \_ use Statistics::Descriptive;
                \_ descriptive.pm not found.
                        \_ get it from CPAN
        \_ whatever happened to BLSS? That had all sorts of cool statistics
           applications.
           \_ can we scam a license off of the STAT dept? Think they'd want
              porting help, or a BSD platform to build on?
                \_ Mail to blss@stat.  Can't hurt to ask.
        \_ #!/usr/local/bin/perl
           @sorted = sort {$a <=> $b} @ARGV;
           print $sorted[$#sorted/2], "\n";

           or, if you prefer,
           perl -e '@sorted = sort {$a <=> $b} @ARGV;' \
           -e 'print $sorted[$#sorted/2], "\n";' 6 23 9 1 0 23.3 4
              -emarkp
           \_ Just curious: if I've got "1 2 3 4" is "2" the correct response,
              according to any math texts?  -math ignorant
              \_ Yes, "2" is the correct answer, because Soda is really an
                 Apple ][ Plus running Apple Integer Basic.
                 \_ It's true!  Yes, the lottery scheduler is _THAT GOOD_.
          \_ I think, actually, that it should be the average of 2 and 3
             (i.e. 2.5).  Oh well, back to the drawing board.  -emarkp
           \_ can we scam a license off of the STAT dept? Think they'd want
              porting help, or a BSD platform to build on?
                \_ Mail to blss@stat.  Can't hurt to ask.
                \-the BLSS people seemed pretty amenable to work with us
                        \_                     watch your gramar^
                when i dealt with them on behalf of the ocf. --psb
                \_ Mark is pretty cool.  If he can do it legally, he will.
                \_ If there's an even number of items in the array, take the
                   middle two ($#sorted/2 and $#sorted/2 +1), add and div by 2
          \_ okay, here we go:
             perl -e '@sorted = sort {$a <=> $b} @ARGV; \
             $half = $#sorted/2;  \
             print (($#sorted % 2) ? ($sorted[$half]+$sorted[$half+1])/2 : \
                 $sorted[$half]); print "\n";' 1 2 3 4
        \_ My version :-)
           Truly, a work of art.  :)
                #!/usr/local/bin/perl5 -w

                @sorted = sort {$a <=> $b} @ARGV;

                $len = $#sorted +1;

                if ($len /2 == int($len /2)) {
                        $avg = (@sorted[($len /2)] + @sorted[($len -1) /2]) /2;
                        print $avg . "\n";
                        }
                else {
                        print $sorted[$#sorted/2] . "\n";
                }
        \_
        use Statistics::Descriptive;
        $stat = new Statistics::Descriptive::Full;
        $stat->add_data(@ARGV);
        printf("the median of [%s] = %s\n", join(',', @ARGV), $stat->median);
        \_ show off.  mine is easier to read. :-)
        \_Can't locate Statistics/Descriptive.pm in @INC at ./test.pl line 3.
          BEGIN failed--compilation aborted at ./test.pl line 3.
1998/2/10-11 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:13655 Activity:moderate
2/10    Do RoverBot and other Spiders usually traverse through your first level
        of *.cgi? Thanks.

           /- no.
         _ Perl IS THE GREATEST LANGUAGE IN THE WORLD! My mom uses it, my dad
        /  uses it, and SO SHOULD YOU OR ELSE YOU ARE NOT HUMAN!!!
1998/2/10-11 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:13650 Activity:high
2/10    Perl is a great language. However, how do you pass by reference
        a complex data structure? I am able to pass by reference a simple
        list when my subroutine refers to $_[$num], but when I have to
        pass a hash of hash and hash of list, I don't know how to change
        the referenced value anymore! Please help, thanks.
        \_ See "perldoc perldsc" for examples and an explanation.
        \_ list of hash and list of list are easier to demonstrate:
                %h1 = %h2 = %h3 = ();
                $loh = (\%h1, \%h2, \%h3);
                ($h1ref, $h2ref, $h3ref) = @$loh;
           similarly:
                @l1 = @l2 = @l3 = ();
                $lol = (\@l1, \@l2, \@l3);
                ($l1ref, $l2ref, $l3ref) = @$lol;
           get it?
           \_ Yes, that I get, but how about hash of list and hash of hash?
                perldoc perldsc does not explain any of this. Thanks.
                \_ IT"S THE SAME WAY:  %obj = ('alphabets' => ['a', 'b', 'c'],
                                               'numbers' => [1, 2, 3],
                                               'subs' => [ &get, &put, &set ]);
                \_ elements of hashes and lists must be scalars.  This means
                  that you have to have lists of hash refs and hashes whose
                  values are refs of whatever thingies you want.  Boy this
                  is confusing, but I hope I answered your question.
                  \_ oh man, took me a whole week to figure this out. pUrl
                     sucks!!!!!!!!!!!! Now I have to create a totally separate
                     class to handle pass by reference a "slightly" more
                     complicated data structure.
                     \_ Nothing wrong with the lanauge.  You just suck because
                        you didn't RTFM *before* you spent a week writing
                        total crap code.  "WAAAH! I DIDN'T READ THE MANUAL
                        SO IT SUKZ!!!!!"
                        \_If it takes more than 'awk', just write it in
                          C.  -meyers
1998/2/5-6 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl, Computer/SW/OS, Computer/SW/Unix] UID:13626 Activity:high
2/4     Is there a simple UNIX utility that returns the width & height of an
        image, like jpg or gif? Or can the info be easily extracted?
        \_ CPAN:Image/Image-Size-2.6.tar.gz
        \_ its not exactly command-line, but xv can do this pretty  easily too.
        \_ http://www.tardis.ed.ac.uk/~ark/wwwis has perl code to do it,
                and update your html files too while it's at it
           \_ Cool! Thx! This is exactly what I needed!
        \_ The "file" command does it for GIFs... Anyone interested in hacking
           soda's magic file to have it do the same in it's JPG
           matching? -mogul
1998/2/5 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:13624 Activity:high
2/4     Perl manual sucks!Anyway, following the book example 100%,
        I still can't get select(...,...,...,...) working correctly!
        Does anyone have an example that works? Thanks.
        \_ use python; it's got much better socket support.
                \_ Uh... nevermind.
1998/2/3 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:13616 Activity:very high
2/3     Perl gurus who think you're all hot:
        print scalar localtime(2100000000) = year 2036
        print scalar localtime(2200000000) = year 1903
        So Perl and most UNIX shit are not year 203X compliant?
        \_ The unix universe ends at 2037 or 2038, I forget which.  So,
           no, unixes in general are not Y38+ compliant.  Perl is probably
           just passing along whatever the system is telling it.
                \_ make that the 32-bit Unix universe - 64-bit Unixes will
                        last a few billion more years
                   \_ As I said, "unixes in general".
                   \_ some commercial vendors are starting to change their
                      time structs to 64-bit, so this is becoming a reality.
           \_ Of course, in 2038, we will all be using 4096-bit architectures,
             so this problem will go away :)
        \_ This just shows you how stupid designers are, always thinking
           of what's best for today, but never what's best for tomorrow.
           These dumb ass engineers are dumb asses, and Clinton trying to
           get even more incompetent people into high tech is just going to
           make the matter worse.
           \_ Please tell me this is brilliant flame bait.  Because I
             was laughing so hard I hurt myself.  Then I though it might
             be serious.  Now im not sure.
                \_ Well it's obvious that you're either a sys admin or a
                   community college graduate thinking that you're a hot shot.
                   \_ dude: you have to lighten up.  It's not gonna get any
                       easier :)
1998/1/30 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:49808 Activity:nil
 1/29   If I add AutoLoader in Perl, does it still compile every single
        subroutine in one file, or only those that are needed during run-time?
        \_ It's not that simple; you have to prepare your program for use
          with autoloader... There are online man pages which pwill walk
          you thru it, or see some of the advanced perl books....
1998/1/30-31 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:13598 Activity:nil
1/29    Has anyone ran h2ph on /usr/include and /usr/include/sys?  I
        cant get perl5 to run perl code with socket cuz sys/socket.ph
        doesnt exists.  Of course this could be the problem of the script
        but since I am helpless, I am just trying to weed out other
        causes.  I'd love to ran h2ph myself, but I dont have write
        permission.  Thanks for the help.  - perl clueless
        \_ use IO::Socket;
           $sock = new IO::Socket::INET(PeerAddr => $host,
                                        PeerPort => $port,
                                        Proto => 'tcp');
           \_ Thanks.
                \_ You are welcome.  -- cm1ee
1998/1/23 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:13552 Activity:kinda low
1/21    What is a good random seed function using time and $$ in Perl?
        \_ One use might be to create filenames for temporary files. --dim
        \_ a silly first try might be
                my $filename =  $$. time;
        \_ No you stupid! I want to use srand() with a good seed. SHEESH.
           \_ As of perl 5.004, you don't have to call srand at all; see
              "perldoc -f srand" for details.  If you want a better random
              number generator, look at Math::TrulyRandom or /dev/random.
           \_ hahahah.   maybe you should rtfm, state your problem more
              clearly, and see Math::TrulyRandom on CPAN, Einstein.
        \_ srand(time % $$);
           \_ (time % $$) does not generate good random numbers.
1998/1/6 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:49807 Activity:nil
1/6     If anyone with any Perl 5.004 fu can explain the following behavior
        coherently, I'd be enlightened. The file is located in
        ~god/Pub/perl.bugs
        \_ 1.  The first evaluates the backquote expression in list context
               and stores the first element of the result in $result1.  The
               second evaluates the backquote expression in scalar context
               and stores the entire result, as a string, in $result2.  It
               has nothing to do with your use of "my"; you can (and should)
               rewrite the second as
                  my $result2 = `cp --help 2>&1`;
               See "perldoc perlsub" for more information.
           2.  Both of your examples work fine for me.  Could you elaborate
               on what goes wrong when you try them?
           3.  You can't declare $_ with my.  This is a special case in perl
               which may change sometime; it's mentioned in "perldoc perlsub".
               For now, use local instead of my for $_.
1998/1/6 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:49806 Activity:nil
1/6     If anyone with any Perl 5.004 fu can explain the following behavior
        coherently, I'd be enlightened
        1) why are the following two different:
                my($result1) = `cp --help 2>&1`;  #problem! scoping?
                   $result2  = `cp --help 2>&1`;  #right behavior
        2) why are the following two different:
                subs HEY {};
                my($sub1) = 'HEY';   #problem! global scoping problem?
                   $sub2  = 'HEY';   #no problem
                &$sub1;
                &$sub2;
        3) by inserting my($_), I get an error that is far remote from
           what Perl really claims to have. Another scoping problem?
1997/12/3 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:32171 Activity:nil
12/2    Does Perl's dbm package let you synchronize correctly, when
        different threads access the same dbm file at the same time?
1997/1/6 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl, Computer/SW/Unix] UID:32028 Activity:nil
1/5     /dev/dsk/zd2s2        708588  641735      260    100%   /home/perl
 /dev/dsk/zd4s2        624388  561899     3796     99%   /home/grep
 /dev/dsk/zd6s2        682344  613869     4299     99%   /home/uniq
        --> CLEAN UP now already ...
1996/11/4 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:31984 Activity:nil
11/4    Hi -- my perl scripts don't work anymore; what gives?
        :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)
        \_ RTFmotd.official
        \_ Welcome to 1996.
1996/11/4-5 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:31982 Activity:nil 82%like:31956
11/1    /usr/local/bin/perl now points to perl 5.003.
        If you haven't yet, now would be a good time to make your scripts
        perl5-compatible or change the first line to "#!/usr/local/bin/perl4"
1996/10/28-11/1 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:31956 Activity:moderate 82%like:31982
10/20   /usr/local/bin/perl currently points to perl 4.036.  Sometime
        on or shortly after 11/1/1996 it will point to perl 5.003.  You
        have until then to make your scripts perl5-compatible or change
        the first line to "#!/usr/local/bin/perl4"
1996/10/17-19 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:31939 Activity:high
10/17   Tk400.200 installed.  This is a perl5 extension for utilizing TK
        widgets in perl5 scripts.  Sample script is shown below.  -- cmlee
        #!/usr/local/bin/perl5
        use Tk;
        $main = new MainWindow();
        $label = $main->Label(-text => "Hello Sodalites!");
        $label->pack();
        MainLoop();
          \_ What I want to know is when we are going to stop calling
             perl5 perl5, and just call it perl :) :)
         \_ When you can do it without breaking everyone's old perl 4
          scripts.
          \_ /usr/bin/perl -> perl4, /usr/local/bin/perl -> perl5
             is how many sites have it set up.  Look into it.
           \_ Yes sir!  Looked into sir! Found that most
              perl-using soda users have scripts that say
              "#!/usr/local/bin/perl" expecting perl4 to
              be there and think you're an asshole sir!
              Any other orders sir?
         \_ Make perl4 point to perl, put an announcement in the motd
          warning people, give people a couple weeks to change
          their scripts, and then make the switch.  -alanc-
1996/10/6 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:31914 Activity:nil
10/6    I love /usr/local/bin/perl5!  -- cmlee
1996/6/5 [Computer/SW/OS/Linux, Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:31841 Activity:nil
6/5     People who missed out on last year's RMS vs. TCL/Perl Flamewar
        Extravaganza should hurry over to gnu.misc.discuss for this year's
        barnburner - FSF vs. the Linux community over
        GNU Emacs 19.31's renaming of the OS to "LiGNUx" in a shameless
        attempt to take credit for Linux's success.  Nostalgia buffs should
        watch for the little old lady from the early 80's Burger King
        commercials doing a cameo spot asking "Where's the HURD?"
1994/5/24 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:31611 Activity:nil
5/23    Hyper marked-up perl man page is accessible through
        ~cmlee/public/htperlman.  -- cmlee
2018/08/18 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
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