12/2    Would people be in favor/opposed to a Web interface to MOTD in
        the hope that it might allow more new people to use it?  It
        would be authenticated against Soda but anonymized (to prevent
        spam).  Thoughts?  --steven
        \_ I think its a good idea and one I've wanted to look into for a
           long time but what I think makes the motd so ... interesting.. is
           the anonymity aspect to it.  I think that having webforums that
           aren't anonymous and moderated would be of great benefit (job
           postings don't need anonymity), but you need to have that
           no-holds-barred, big-breast-loving, mormon-antagonizing ability
           that anonymity provides somewhere.  It sounds like a fun project.
           Lets build it over winter. ;) -mrauser
        \_ Just build it and see how much traffic you get. dbushong's
           http://csua.org (different than http://csua.com) is a shot at it.
           See how popular it is.
           \_ lol spam. A web interface would have to authenticate with soda
              somehow, and there's no guarantee that that will stay unlogged
              (or indeed, that it could be forced by the powers that be to
              be logged). /paranoia
              \_ We could just as easily track changes to this motd with some
                 kernel hacks or just filesystem notifications or a million
                 other ways.  There's at least some trust involved already, and
                 anything I set up would be as anonymous as possible. --steven
                 other ways.  There's at least some trust involved already,
                 and anything I set up would be as anonymous as possible.
                 --steven
        \_ Personally, this libertarian style motd that's been running
           for 2 decades or so have proved to be... interesting. I'll
           be equally interesting when we move to a socialist monitored
           motd where "the man", errr, steven tells us what we can and
           cannot say. ASSASSINATION! NEGROS! <insert offensive stuff here>
           \_  I have no intentions of changing or moderating in any way the
               MOTD itself. --steven
        \_ Are you going to track editors? What happens if someone
           starts a death threat? What happens if someone dies from
           using motd? Are you going to be liable for monitoring or
           not monitoring the motd?
           \_ Same as it works now.  Use at your own risk / bring thick skin
              --steven
        \_ Clarification - different from http://csua.com in that it is more
           aligned towards active reading / posting rather than archival
                \- why dont you create this "web based forum" and then
                   "let the market decide". i think this is pointless.
                   its like saying "how about replacing wall with
                   something like a "wall client" so people dont need
                   to log into soda ... if only there were such a thing.
                   \_ I only asked because I'm a newcomer and I value your
                      guys' opinions.  Of course I could just go do it, but I
                      wanted to ask advice first. --steven
        \_ edit motd with vi like a real man
           \_ real men use emacs: http://xkcd.com/378
        \_ I am in favor of it. You should be aware that the motd, being
           a mostly anonymous free speech zone, can be controversial. It has
           been complained about in the past. -ausman
           \_ I (think I) understand that :) --steven
        \_ you need to explain what you mean. there is a "web interface to
           motd browsing" at http://csua.com. my inclination is: if you can leave
           everything as is but add something, then do whateever you want.
           but if you are going to change it to web only, that is a giant lose.
           web browsers are not editing environments. on the other hand
           it is reasonable to be able to read the motd via the web [and this
           already exists]. and frankly it's not reasonable to claim this
           will be anonymous. regardless of what you say, when you make it
           trackable to IPs, anonymity is gone [unless you takes the
           obvious cumbersome steps to soem how edit via TOR while not using
           that connection for logins etc]. put be down for "opposed"/
           "it already exists".
           that connection for logins etc]. put me down for "opposed"/
           "it already exists". --psb
           \_ I don't see how anonymity provides a benefit to the CSUA, and if
              "leaving everything as-is" means that the half-dozen long-gone
              alumni can troll stupidly and argue about how to indent the text,
              I don't see how that provides a benefit to the CSUA, either.
                -tom
              \_ Utility has very little to do with the MOTD. Organic processes
                 like this sometimes provide good food for thought, but this is
                 a side-effect, not their purpose. Still, as far as labs for
                 thought go, I think it "works." --erikred
                 \_ It works for undergrads more than grads. Grads donate
                    money and give advice on dating and offer jobs.
                    Undergrads on the other hand don't offer much to grads.
                    Actually they're worth about $2000/head, that's how
                    much bonus I get for referals.
                 \_ It works for who?  10 people who haven't set foot in
                    Soda Hall in 5+ years?  For it to work it has to
                    work for the CSUA's primary constituency, which is
                    current undergraduates.  -tom
                    \_ UG get something from the connection to the alumni.
                       If nothing else, donations for machine upgrades. Also,
                       job offers and company presentations. -ausman
                       \_ That's my point--there's no connection to the alumni
                          in a forum that undergrads don't use.  -tom
                          \_ Except I have foot in Soda Hall. In fact, I think
                             that is the reason we are seeing some UG
                             involvement on the motd. If it weren't for the
                             motd I would have stopped logging into soda a
                             long time ago. So the connection, while indirect,
                             does exist. -ausman
        \_ I don't think a web interface to MOTD makes sense.  I think you
           should probably just kill MOTD and replace it with a web-based
           forum.  Its time has passed.  -tom
           \_ Agreed. I've setup http://groups.yahoo.com/BerkeleyCSUA
              \_ http://community.livejournal.com/ucberkeley/3185418.html
              Let's all join this group. Har har har.
              \_ I don't like killing things people use actively
        \_ I'm against it. http://csua.com is good enough for motd IMO and I don't
           share Steven's weird dislike of web forums. I love 'em. motd isn't
           going away, in any case. motd already works, and there's absolutely
           no need (IMO) to effect any sort of change to it. --toulouse
           \_ I have a feeling if we tried to go to a forum, the crew here
              would stay here.  I'm trying to have some connection between
              alums/neophytes.
              \_ Basically no undergrads lurk here, to my knowledge. It's taken
                 me two years to look into motd; the interest (in motd, not in
                 connecting with alumni) IMO does not have inertia to sustain
                 itself. Perhaps an alternative is to introduce people to motd
                 at GM3, and again during future GM1s? I should put a link to
                 http://csua.com on the site. Pardon me while I do so... --toulouse
              \_ Coexisting doesn't seem like a bad option to me.
                 \_ Except that part of the idea should be to create a shared
                    undergrad/alumni community.  If the alumni really care
                    about wall/MOTD, they certainly have the resources to
                    set them up on their own.  -tom