11/1 http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2007/10/31/BAUIT3FBN.DTL&tsp=1
"Each car costs about $15,000 to convert. The program is being funded
by the California Energy Commission and the state Air Resources Board."
God damn idiots.
\_ Dude it's a test. Those things cost more. Moving to all
electrical power means you have centralized power production.
Which means less waste, less emissions and less spillage. (If you
fill up a tank of gas and spill a few drops that's as much
pollution as burning the whole thing given our good smog
regulations.) In the scheme of things 10 cars at 15k each is
nothing. Start caring about stuff that matters.
\_ laugh.. batteries are the dirtiest things on the planet
it also takes a lot of energy to make batteries, to make
eletricity, tons of nasty chemicals to make computer chips
to control these things.
\_ Can you point me to research on the effects of batteries
and chips in aggregate vs. the effects of fossil fuels in
aggregate? It's a nice bit of devil's advocacy there, but
where's the beef? -dans
\_ Chips? Or Crisps? Or French Fries?
\_ Freedom Fries
\_ That's a huge cost. There are much more cost-effective ways to
reduce emissions. There's no reason to test this, it's nothing
new: it's just using really expensive batteries. Total waste.
It's 100 cars, not 10.
How about just simply buying modern, cost-effective, efficient
small cars with conventional diesel technology? Offer people
high trade-in deals for their old polluting cars.
\_ No, it's not a huge cost. Seriously. The tests are
expensive. The batteries are expensive. Tech goes down
in price. And read the article. 10 cars. 100 families.
8 weeks each.
\_ Ok fine, I didn't see that. Still an utter waste of
effort if you ask me. What will we learn from this
program? Why should CA funds be used for this rather
than say Toyota's?
\_ Because it is in California's long range interest.
As I said, the money involved is pretty damn minor.
Start actually looking at what is spent where and
start caring about things that actually matter.
Let me give you a hint. In general state funded
grants are a benefit to society.
\_ Really? Where do I sign up for my grant? I would
like to benefit society.
\_ You welcome to write all the grant applications
you want. However you'd better have a good
explanation of what the money will be spent on,
as grant fraud is frowned upon. Oh wait, you
are just talking out of your ass aren't you?
\_ Gee being frowned upon would be horrible.
Anyway, I'd like to hereby frown upon this
hybrid grant.
\_ I frown upon your frowning upon their
frowning upon the general frowning upon.
\_ Grant proposal to give me lots of cash to
provide benefits to society: You (the gvt)
give me (the recipient) lots of other people's
money you don't care about (tax payers) to
live a life of luxury and slack. Goal: one
less grumpy tax payer. Improvement to society
is lessening of grumpiness among citizens. Why
do you think my grant proposal requires me to
commite fraud? You're so cynical.
commit fraud? You're so cynical.
\_ for that same extra $15k you could buy a small electric NEV like
say Xebra to use instead of the prius for 'short trips'. And
then still have the prius.
\_ Yes, if the tech never gets cheaper than $15k it will never
be a real solution. However the tech WILL get cheaper than
$15k.
\_ or 100 cheap bikes! And none of them would use any gas or
electricity at all. RIDE BIKE!!!
\_ You're an anti-environmental terrorist! If you truly cared
about the environment you wouldn't ride a bike. You'd walk.
Do you have any idea how much energy went into designing,
marketing, producing, and shipping your bike? Then there will
be repairs and the entire industry behind the spare parts
mill. And then you'll eventually get a new one and the cycle
of death continues! If you loved this planet you would walk.
\_ Are you walking bare-foot, or are you walking with shoes
and socks that also required energy for designing,
marketing, producing, and shipping?
\_ Duh, no of course not. That's why your feet will get
tougher over a short period of time. Before the modern
era you think cavemen wore Nike's? Sheesh, get over
your big bad modern environmentally destructive self.
Ride Bike! if you want to rape the Earth. USE FEET!
if you're at one with the planet's life energies.
\_ everyone already has shoes and clothing so it's
an overlap
\_ The more you walk, the faster the shoes wear out.
-- PP
\_ ditto with bikes but less parts to repair
\_ But which one costs less per mile?
\_ probably the bike, if you're trying to
optimize for cost/resource saving. A
cheesy racing bike is expensive to maintain,
but a good touring bike is quite cheap. -tom
\_ earth hater.
\_ The more you live, the faster you will die.
\_ the more you drive, the less intelligent you are.
- Miller, the Repo Man.
\_ http://www.edrivesystems.com has been building the same thing.
\_ yes, but in Los Angeles.
\_ yes, but ONLY in Los Angeles. |
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