Berkeley CSUA MOTD:Entry 46949
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2024/11/27 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
11/27   

2007/6/14-19 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Israel] UID:46949 Activity:kinda low
6/14    http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/14/washington/14diplo.html
        Hamas routing larger Fatah security forces, may take over Gaza
        territory from Palestian unity government.  Fear is that Gaza
        will become a "full terrorist state".
        Abbas to dissolve unity government, call for new elections, buying
        undetermined amount of time where Hamas is not officially in power.
        \_ Hamas is won the election fair and square.  It is Abbas, USA,
           Israel and other nations who really need to get over the fact that
           Hamas won.
           \_ Does "getting over the fact that Hamas won" imply that we should
              resume paying them 100s of millions of dollars?  'Cause, you
              know, I think it would be pretty dumb to fund their war against
              Israel.
              \_ If "democracy in Middle East" is something we are preaching,
                 then, we should stick with it.  We've toppled democratatically
                 elected government in the past (Iran, Guatamola, Chili), none
                 of them turned out to be too well.  Further, we should of
                 given Hamas a chance.  Many political groups use their radical
                 rhetric to win power.  Many of them, once the responsibility
                 of running a country cast upon them, they become a lot more
                 reponsible.
                 If you have any clue, you would know that Isareli's biggest
                 problem is not some strong state which seek for its
                 destruction, rather, anarchy and weak governments which have
                 little controls over their radical elements.  Unfortuantely,
                 neither Israeli government nor USA seems to understand that;
                 each military incursion only weakens PLO/Lebonese governments
                 even further.
           \_ And executions of their political opposition in the street is
              really democratic.  But you're right, let's just move on and
              get over it and send more money to their Swiss bank accounts
              and to fund their terrorism against Israel and now their own
              people.  You're on message, troll.
              \_ After decades of undermining the PLA, blowing up its buildings,
                 and assassinating its leaders, Isreal is shocked, just shocked
                 to watch the government collapse. You reap what you sow.
              \_ attack on Israel per se is not "terrorism."  Some of Israeli
                 tactics are not exactly abeit by IRC/UN standard neither.
                 The truth is, we don't know how Hamas is going to react
                 if Hamas actually had a chance to run a government.  My
                 feeling is that they would of be so consumed by the daily
                 grind that little action would of taken against the Israeli.

                 What we are doing (boycotting Hamas' legitiment government)
                 is undermining our message to the greater Middle East.  We
                 again and again supports absolute monarchies (Saudi Arabia,
                 Kuwait, Jordan), waging/waged war agaist countried where
                 oil money is actually belong to the state instead of royal
                 families (Iraq and Iran).  Now, we are underming legitiment
                 Palestinian government just because we don't like them.  If
                 you are a young, unemployed Arab teenager male, what would
                 you believe?  All these things USA is doing is for the sake
                 of democracy?  or USA just a big attack dog for Israel and
                 in the mean time extract petro from Musleum land?
              \_ After decades of undermining the PLA, blowing up its
                 buildings, and assassinating its leaders, Isreal is
                 shocked, just shocked to watch the government collapse.
                 You reap what you sow.
                 \_ Some Palestinians are grimly joking that this is the
                    Two Party solution mentioned elsewhere.
        \_ http://www.coxandforkum.com/archives/001131.html
           http://www.coxandforkum.com/archives/001130.html
           Some good political cartoons over the last few days.
           \_ This word "good", I don't think it means what you think it means.
              \_ So few on the motd have any sense of humor, that I can't take
                 your opinion seriously.  I liked them. -!pp
        \_ But they were elected, so we should let them take power by force to
           show our support of Democracy.
           \_ Yeah, see, this is where that whole binary thought-process gets
              you.
              \_ it's matter of pricinple.  You can't undermining a
                 democratically elected government on one hand and claiming
                 you are building one in Iraq at the same time.
              \_ Mushroom cloud over major American city >>> free elections
                 F4T4l1TY!!!11
           \_ Democratize or I'll shoot you.
        \_ This is what Israel has been aiming for all along:
           http://files.tikkun.org/current/article.php?story=20070616224228533
2024/11/27 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
11/27   

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With Bush administration backing, a 15-month-old economic embargo of the Hamas-led Palestinian Authority is being eased with funds from Arab and European donors, Israeli and Western officials said on Monday. Some Israeli officials have decried what they see as a shift in US policy aimed at bolstering Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas, whose Fatah faction joined a unity government led by Hamas three months ago, and currying Arab states' support. "The Palestinian Authority's financial position is much better today than six months ago. We are losing," said a senior Israeli official involved in overseeing the economic embargo imposed after Islamist Hamas came to power in 2006. In the one month since Washington said donors could send funds to Finance Minister Salam Fayyad through a Palestine Liberation Organization (PLO) account, the account has received at least $160 million. Hamas continues to defy Western demands to recognize Israel, renounce violence and abide by previous interim peace deals.
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Palestinian fighting 'will burn all of us,' official says. Fighting between Palestinian factions is worse than ever and can produce no winner, a senior Palestinian official said Tuesday. Saeb Erakat spoke as Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas held emergency meetings and weighed options, including pulling out of the unity government of Fatah and Hamas leaders. Abbas on Tuesday urged both sides to adhere to an immediate truce, according to a statement from his office. "In my capacity as head of the Palestinian Authority and supreme leader of all our security and military forces, I call for an immediate cease-fire and for ... talks to end all violence and infighting," the official WAFA news agency quoted Abbas as saying. But around the same time, an announcement on Fatah radio called on fighters to confront Hamas militants. Broadcasts from Hamas fighters urged their Fatah foes to abandon their posts or face death. A short time later, hundreds of Hamas gunmen surrounded a Fatah base in northern Gaza near the Jabalya refugee camp and launched an attack, Palestinian security sources said. The commander of the Hamas' Izzedine al-Qassam Brigades was killed in the fighting, the sources said. Hamas militants killed at least 11 members of the rival Fatah faction Wednesday after setting off explosives in a tunnel beneath a security compound in southern Gaza, Palestinian security sources said. Fatah's Preventive Security headquarters in Khan Yunis is now under Hamas control, the sources said. The blast came after Hamas' military wing, Izzedine al-Qassam Brigades, announced it had taken over northern Gaza and turned the region into a "closed military area." Izzedine al-Qassam, which made its announcement late Tuesday over mosque loudspeakers across the region, called on residents to hand over their weapons to the militant group by 7 pm (noon ET) Friday. The "closed military area" over which Hamas has asserted control includes all villages and towns north of Gaza City, including Beit Hanoun, Beit Lahya and the Jabalya refugee camp.
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Join the Network of Spiritual Progressives Understanding What Just Happened in Gaza Posted Saturday, June 16 2007 @ 10:42 PM PDT The triumph of Hamas was a goal of Israeli policy--though now they have no clue about what to do. Discussion by Uri Avnery, and a discussion on Amy Goodman's show. EDITORI'S NOTE: For many years, Tikkun has argued that a goal of Israeli policy has been to strengthen Hamas sufficiently so that it's power in Palestine could be used as an irrefutable 'proof" to the West that Palestinians couldn't be trusted to run a state of their own, and that therefore all it could be allowed would be the bantistun version of a state--little Palestinian enclaves cut off from each other by a sourrounding Israeli Army and the Israeli settlers. It was for this reason that Ariel Sharon came up with the "unilateral withdrawal from Gaza" strategy as his alternative to what might have been growing pressure for Israel to accept the terms of the Geneva Accord negotiated by MK and former Israeli official negotiator with Palestinians Yossi Beilin. Sharon's alternative was "unilateral withdrawal," rejecting the notion of talking to the Palestinian Authority then under control of Fatah and the pro-non-violence President Abbas. As we pointed out at the time, if Israel had negotiated an end to its presence in Gaza with Abbas, they would have strengthened the credibility of this pro-peace faction of the Palestinian world. Instead, by leaving unilaterally without negotiating with Abbas, they gave great credence to Hamas, which could say that it was Hamas' armed resistance that had chased Israeli troops out of Gaza, and that ll of the non-violence posturing of Abbas had won him nothing but being ignored and labeled "not a partner for peace" by Sharon and then by Ehud Olmert who became prime minister after Sharon had a stroke. Ariel Sharon was no fool: his strategy was to strengthen Hamas so that the pressure from the rest of the world to give Palesitnians a state would dramatically abate, as it did. Now the strategy has paid off better than Sharon and Olmert had dreamt: with visions of Palestinians fighting each other in the streets, many people in the world are saying "see how these people never could run a state." On the other hand, much as I agree with Avnery that the situation is a set-up that was created by the Occupation and the brutality of Israeli treatment of Palesitnians, including the slow starvation of the people of Gaza, I find it morally troubling that none of the champions of Palestinians in this country like Abunimah (see below in the interview with Amy Goodman) can face up to the following point: even when Jews were forced to live under real starvation conditions and wild-overcrowding in the ghettoes of Nazi Germany and then the concentration camps, they did not take up systematic violence aganst each other. There is something in the culture of the Palestinians, or of the Arab world, or of the Muslim world (you tell me which, I'm not sure) that is too tolerant of violence, and too willing to excuse it, whether it be in the disgusting violence of Sunnis vs. Shias that took place in the Iraq/Iran war and in the current civil war in Iraq, in Lebanon, and now the struggle in Palestine. We at Tikkun who have always been critical of those distortions in the Jewish world that have allowed Jews to deny the realities of the horrible oppression visited on the Palestinian people by Israel and have consistently criticized those elements in Jewish culture that contribute to the denial or even active support for Israeli war crimes agains the Palestinian people and last summer against the Lebanese, we who have consistently criticized the war ethics that have allowed Christians to fight Christians for centuries, have a right to ask Muslims, Arabs and Palestinians to be similarly PUBLICLY critical of those elements in their own culture that have led to such distortions in their world. And that new approach is the only way we are ever going to see anything but an endless blame game and endless violence. org/home/he/channels/avnery/1181993439/ WHAT HAPPENS when one and a half million human beings are imprisoned in a tiny, arid territory, cut off from their compatriots and from any contact with the outside world, starved by an economic blockade and unable to feed their families? Some months ago, I described this situation as a sociological experiment set up by Israel, the United States and the European Union. They proved that human beings react exactly like other animals: when too many of them are crowded into a small area in miserable conditions, they become aggressive, and even murderous. The organizers of the experiment in Jerusalem, Washington, Berlin, Oslo, Ottawa and other capitals could rub their hands in satisfaction. The scientists want to know what happens if the blockade is tightened still further. WHAT HAS caused the present explosion in the Gaza Strip? The timing of Hamas' decision to take over the Strip by force was not accidental. It has no interest in provoking the Egyptian regime, which is busy fighting the Muslim Brotherhood, the mother-organization of Hamas. Also, the organization has no interest in providing Israel with a pretext for tightening the blockade. But the Hamas leaders decided that they had no alternative but to destroy the armed organizations that are tied to Fatah and take their orders from President Mahmoud Abbas. The US has ordered Israel to supply these organizations with large quantities of weapons, in order to enable them to fight Hamas. The Israeli army chiefs did not like the idea, fearing that the arms might end up in the hands of Hamas (as is actually happening now). President Bush has chosen a local leader for every Muslim country, who will rule it under American protection and follow American orders. In Iraq, in Lebanon, in Afghanistan, and also in Palestine. Hamas believes that the man marked for this job in Gaza is Mohammed Dahlan. For years it has looked as if he was being groomed for this position. The American and Israeli media have been singing his praises, describing him as a strong, determined leader, "moderate" (ie obedient to American orders) and "pragmatic" (ie obedient to Israeli orders). And the more the Americans and Israelis lauded Dahlan, the more they undermined his standing among the Palestinians. Especially as Dahlan was away in Cairo, as if waiting for his men to receive the promised arms. In the eyes of Hamas, the attack on the Fatah strongholds in the Gaza Strip is a preventive war. The organizations of Abbas and Dahlan melted like snow in the Palestinian sun. How could the American and Israeli generals miscalculate so badly? They are able to think only in strictly military terms: so-and-so many soldiers, so-and-so many machine guns. But in interior struggles in particular, quantitative calculations are secondary. The morale of the fighters and public sentiment are far more important. The members of the Fatah organizations do not know what they are fighting for. The Gaza population supports Hamas, because they believe that it is fighting the Israeli occupier. Their opponents look like collaborators of the occupation. The American statements about their intention of arming them with Israeli weapons have finally condemned them. In this respect all nations are the same: they hate collaborators of a foreign occupier, whether they are Norwegian (Quisling), French (Petain) or Palestinian. IN WASHINGTON and Jerusalem, politicians are bemoaning the "weakness of Mahmoud Abbas". They see now that the only person who could prevent anarchy in the Gaza Strip and the West Bank was Yasser Arafat. He created several security apparatuses that competed with each other, in order to prevent any single apparatus from carrying out a coup-d'etat. Arafat was able to negotiate, sign a peace agreement and get his people to accept it. But Arafat was pilloried by Israel as a monster, imprisoned in the Mukata'ah and, in the end, murdered. The Palestinian public elected Mahmoud Abbas as his successor, hoping that he would get from the Americans and the Israelis what they had refused to give to Arafat. If the l...