Berkeley CSUA MOTD:Entry 46561
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2025/05/23 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
5/23    

2007/5/8-12 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:46561 Activity:nil
5/8     new War Nerd:
        http://www.exile.ru/2007-May-04/war_nerd.html
        "So the likely winner of a war like this is an up-n-coming world
        economic power that has been investing in its own economy while we
        blow a trillion - yep, a trillion - dollars on nothing. Not hard
        to figure out who the likely suspects are here.
        China understands that an army is most effective when kept penned
        in and on parade, rather than riding around a hostile, far-away country.
        The answer to "Who won Iraq?" is Iran in the short run, and in the
        long run, China and India."
        \_ Actually China's army/military doesn't sit around doing nothing.
           They spend a lot of time stomping on rioters across the country,
           mostly peasants in rural areas upset at being treated like peasants.
           Old joke: The Soviets and Chinese go to war.  On the first day the
           Russians capture 100 million Chinese.  On the second day they
           capture another 100 million Chinese.  On the third day the Chinese
           rally and the Russians only capture 50 million Chinese.  On the
           fourth day the Russians counter attack with great success and
           capture 250 million Chinese.  On the fifth day the Russians
           surrender.
           \_ Yeah and India does a lot of foot stomping on the Kashmir border.
              I do think we've thrown over a trillion into a giant rathole.
              I don't understand how the Bush administration avoids being
              hounded from power by armed pitchfork bearing mobs.
              \_ rent Idiocracy
           \_ I am not sure which part of it is supposed to be funny..
              \_ It's a joke, son.
           \_ "During the Damansky Island incident the Chinese military
               developed three main strategies: The Great Offensive, The Small
               Retreat, and Infiltration by Small Groups of One to Two Million
               Across the Border."
               \_ What was the futuristic war book (could be by Dean Ng?)
                  that had the Wall of Lenin?  Also, brings to mind the line
                  about "1 billion Chinamen" in Red Dawn... -John
           \_ Note also that the PLA spends a lot of time putting down
              insurgents in the Uighur-populated Northwest.
2025/05/23 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
5/23    

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Cache (8192 bytes)
www.exile.ru/2007-May-04/war_nerd.html
Previous (116) FRESNO, CA -- A funny thing happened on the floor of the Senate last week. Somebody asked a serious question: "If the war in Iraq is lost, then who won?" Lindsay Graham, the guy who asked the question, didn't mean it to be serious. He was just scoring points off Harry Reid, the world's only Democratic Mormon. Reid had made a "gaffe" by saying in public what everybody already knows: "The war in Iraq is lost." When you say something obviously true in politics, it's called a "gaffe." So Graham, McCain's bitch, jumps in to embarrass Reid with his question. But let's take the question seriously for a second here: who won in Iraq? To answer it, you have to start with a close-up of the region, then change magnification to look at the world picture. In fact, Iran wins so big in this war that I've already said that Dick Cheney's DNA should be checked out by a reputable lab, because he has to be a Persian mole. My theory is that they took a fiery young Revolutionary Guard from the slums of Tehran, dipped him in a vat of lye to get that pale, pasty Anglo skin, zapped his scalp for that authentic bald CEO look, squirted a quart of cholesterol into his arteries so he'd develop classic American cardiac disease, and parachuted him into the outskirts of some Wyoming town. And that's how our VP was born again, a half-frozen zombie with sagebrush twigs in his jumpsuit, stumbling into the first all-night coffee shop in Casper talking American with a Persian accent: "Hello my friends! I will have coffee at once, indeed, and is not free enterprise a glorious thing? Say, O brethren of the frosty tundra, what do you say we finish our donuts and march on Baghdad now, this very moment, to remove the Baathist abomination Saddam?" Iraq is destroyed, and Tehran hasn't lost a single soldier in the process. Our invasion put their natural allies, the Shia, in power; gave their natural enemies, the Iraqi Sunni, a blood-draining feud that will never end; and provided them with a risk-free laboratory to spy on American forces in action. If they feel like trying out a new weapon or tactic to deal with US armor, all they have to do is feed the supplies or diagrams to one of their puppet Shia groups, or even one of the Sunni suicide-commando clans. All these claims that Iran is helping the insurgents really make my head spin. If somebody invades the country next door, any state worth mentioning has to act. If Mexico got invaded by China, you better believe the US would react. Gentlemen's bet: which leader's country will benefit more from America's idiotic wars? What really amazes me is how patient Iran has been about it, how quiet and careful. They've covered their tracks carefully and kept their intervention to R&D level: just enough to keep Iraq burning, and patiently test out news IEDs. But that's the Persian way: behind all the yelling, they're sly, clever people. If Iranian intelligence really wanted to flood Iraq with weaponry that would turn our APCs into well-insulated BBQs, they could have done it long ago. They're smart enough to follow Napoleon's advice not to interfere with an enemy in the process of destroying himself - and stockpiling the new IED designs on their side of the border in case we're stupid enough to invade. Iraq is like a nuclear reactor that they can control by inserting and removing control rods. If Shia/Sunni violence looks like cooling off, Tehran's agents, who've penetrated both sides of the fight, play the hothead in their assigned Sunni or Shia gangs and lobby for a spectacular attack on enemy civvies or shrines - whatever gets the locals' blood up. Then, if things get too hot, which would mean the US getting fed up and leaving, they drop a control rod into the reactor core by telling Sadr to call off his militia or letting the Maliki regime stage some ceremony for the TV crews, the kind that keeps the Bushies back in Ohio convinced it's all going to come out fine. They need to keep us there, because - makes me sick to say it but it's true - our troops are now the biggest, strongest control rod the Persians are using to set the temperature of this war. They want us there as long as possible, stoking the feuds and making sure nobody wins. That's what we just did under Petraeus: switched sides, Shia to Sunni, because the Shia were getting too strong. Yeah, God forbid we should be unfair to the Sunnis, God forbid we should do anything to let somebody win. Let's just make Tehran happy by keeping the feud going another few centuries. One thing Iran is pretty clearly not scared of is every American amateur's dream: a punitive US invasion of Iran. In fact, like North Korea, their partner in the Axis of Evil, Iran is all but begging us to invade. Guys in junior high used to hold their chins out, tap them with a finger and say, "Come on, fucker, come on, hit me!" Because with all the anti-armor know-how they've gained by now, they have traps waiting for us that would make Lara Croft's cave expeditions look like a backyard tea party. Even Cheney's team knows that, which is why they're talking about air raids on Iran these days, not invasion. Another way countries can win in a regional war like this is from the money flooding in. The big winners of the Vietnam War were Thailand, Malaysia and Hong Kong. Thailand went from a failed state with a half-dozen insurgencies everywhere outside its central valley to a rich, happy tourist paradise during Nam. Modern Thailand is a country built on the backs and, uh, other body parts of its bar girls. Every time a GI spent his pay at the ping-pong shows in Bangkok, Thailand gained foreign exchange. The neon got brighter, the huts went split-level, and the Commie rebels swatting mosquitoes out there in the elephant grass started to feel a little foolish. Finally they said the Hell with it, bought suits and went Yuppie. Just imagine how much money is flowing into their border provinces right now. Need any US-issue supplies, weapons, toilet paper, or GPS units cheap? Uncle Sam's guarantee of quality - fell off the back of a two-and-a-half ton truck. See, this is why I keep thinking Cheney's got to be an Iranian mole. How could he not see that a war in Iraq benefits noncombatant neighboring states? Some paranoids want to list Israel among the winners, but I don't see it. Perle, Feith and Wolfowitz thought invading Iraq would help Israel, or rather Likud, but like everything else these geniuses predicted, it didn't happen. Last summer's war with Hezbollah was one the Israelis didn't really want to fight, but Cheney insisted. That was the deal, I guess: the US takes out Saddam, then you take out Hezbollah. Instead, the IDF looked scared and weak in South Lebanon, so now Hezbollah and Iran are the poster-boys of every red-blooded Muslim kid on the planet. Turkey, America's one real ally in the Middle East, is a huge loser in this war. We slapped them in the face, gave the Kurds a base to destabilize southeastern Turkey, and helped elect the first Islamist president in what used to be a proudly secular country. Happy now, Cheney, you Khomeini-loving, anti-American mole? When you zoom farther out to look at the global picture, the question "Who won Iraq?" It's much easier to see who lost: Us, and anybody who backed us. If you use armored columns as stationary cops in enemy neighborhoods, you give the locals plenty of time to figure out their weak spots. That's what we did: gave the Arabs a trillion-dollar, multi-year seminar in how to defeat US forces. Another lesson in the Brecher Doctrine: Nuke 'em, bribe 'em or leave 'em alone. To find a winner in this war means looking outside the box, like they say - or rather outside the theater of war. Because the winners are the countries smart enough to stay out of it. France and England, the European powers that stayed out or just dabbled. France played that war a lot like Iran has played this one: tinkered around, tampered, spied and whispered to all the contenders, but never risked a big chunk of money or force. Every country that took part lost, and the Germans, who had what you might call the home field disadvantage, lost most of all, up to a third of their...