Berkeley CSUA MOTD:Entry 46138
Berkeley CSUA MOTD
2019/04/22 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular

2007/3/29-31 [Politics/Domestic/911, Politics/Domestic/Crime] UID:46138 Activity:moderate
3/28    Good thing the GOP has leaders like Tom DeLay:
        \_ I assume this is a "Tom DeLay is evul!" article.  Seriously, get
           over the whole "our guys are angels, your guys are the devil" thing.
           You've got land scammers, bribe takers, nation security document
           destroyers and various other assorted and sundry felons walking
           around free and in power in the majority party.  Few things are
           uglier than hypocrites.
           \_ Pot, kettle, black. Your "defence" for Tom DeLay's hatred and
           \_ Pot, Bongwater, Hash. Your "defence" for Tom DeLay's hatred and
              corruption is that Democrats do it too? I am actually an
              independent and despise (and actually do something about,
              which is probably more than you can say) corruption in
              both parties. You "assume"? You can't even be bothered to
              read the article, but you feel qualified to offer up your
              opinion on it? On second thought, this is actually pretty
              funny and emblematic of why the GOP is in such bad shape.
              \_ can we please stop the use of "Pot, kettle, black"?  It's
              \_ I don't defend Delay at all.  I point out hypocrisy.  If
                 DeLay is evuul, so be it, but to turn a blind eye to (D)
                 corruption or write it all off as 'not as bad' or to say
                 'charges haven't been filed so no problemo!' is painfully
                 and ridiculously intellectually dishonest.  And no, I can't
                 be bothered to read the article.  Tell me, was I wrong about
                 what was in it?
                 \_ You "pointed out hypocrisy" because I didn't condemn
                    both Democrats and Republicans in the same motd entry?
                    You are the hypocrite, padawan.
              \_ can we please stop the use of "Pot, Bongwater, Hash"?  It's
                 hackneyed, awkward, and stupid.  -tom
                 \_ Pot, kettle, black.
                 \_ Pot, Bongwater, Hash.
                    \_ Pot, Bongwater, Hash.
                       \_ Pot, Bongwater, Hash.
              \_ See, you're misunderstanding the post.  The pp didn't say he
                 was defending DeLay.  He said "stop attacking everyone on the
                 right while ignoring the corruption on the left".  Expose the
                 problems on the left as well. -emarkp
                 \_ Name a corruption problem on the left.  "Voter fraud"
                    will lose you -2 troll points.
                    \_ First of all, I have to ask, do you really thing there's
                       no corruption on the left.  Secondly, look up "William
                       Jefferson"--the guy caught with $90K in his fridge.
                       \_ 1. That guy was not a major leader of his party.
                             \_ so what?
                          2. There is always corruption, but there are levels.
                             \_ *cough* No!  There are no levels!  Your
                                office holders are corrupt or they're not.  If
                                they are corrupt they are undeserving of your
                                support and should get kicked out and
                                prosecuted.  No level of corruption is ok.
                                \_ You obviously have not thought about this
                                   too hard. Is Halliburton getting no bid
                                   contracts an example of corruption or not?
                                   How about companies giving big contributions
                                   to office holders and then lobbying them
                                   after they win office. Both of these are
                                   legal, but borderline cases of corruption.
                                   And not everyone is going to agree with
                                   your black and white definition of what
                                   corruption is, so you should stop trying
                                   to force your vision of it on the world,
                                   to force your vision of it on the motd,
                                   and accept that there are going to be
                                   grey areas in the real world.
                             The modern republican leadership has raised
                             the level of corruption to where something
                             like $90K is pocket change.  William Jefferson
                             is more like Cunningham, not like Delay.
                             \_ Stuffing raw hard cash in your fridge is the
                                most base form of corruption possible.  Even
                                if your 'relativist corruption' view point was
                                valid, it doesn't seem to bother you at all.
                          \_ So you're limiting corruption t leadership?  Okay,
                             then refer beck to the pp about Harry Reid and his
                             shady land deals.  Oh, and I agree that William
                             Jefferson is more like Cunningham.  So why is
                             Cunningham in jail and Jefferson isn't? -emarkp
                             \_ Um, time?  AFAIK, Jefferson has not been
                                charged with anything yet.  He maintains his
                                innocence and was recently reelected.  Now, I
                                personally would love to see him resign both
                                for the horrible appearance of impropriety, and
                                for the fact that his still being in the House
                                serves as a football for people like you who
                                want to say "Democrats do it too!" as cover for
                                the corrupt party you support.  But for now,
                                he is a duly elected representative of the
                                people of his district.  --scotsman
                                \_ The fact that months have gone by with no
                                   prosecution or charges while some shmuck
                                   like Libby is facing prison time for nothing
                                   is insane and the root of the problem.  His
                                   own party has not only not disowned him but
                                   put him on the DHS committee.  Sure makes me
                                   feel so much safer knowing he's only a few
                                   bucks away from screwing over the entire
                                   nations security to the best of his ability.
                                   \_ He asked to be on the DHS committee.  He
                                      has not been seated yet.  He may never
                                      be.  So just chill yourself.
                             \_ Someone had evidence on Cunningham, presented
                                such in court, and had him arrested; Jefferson
                                has been accused, and evidence has been alleged
                                but neither evidence nor charges have been
                                forthcoming. This is why C is in jail and J is
                                not. I agree that "cold hard cash" in his
                                fridge is fishy, but if he committed a crime,
                                charge him. --erikred
                                \_ Fishy?  It's only fishy?  If it was a (R)
                                   you'd be calling for his political death
                                   along with the rest of the left.  *shakes
                                   head* at thought of $90 in the fridge being
                                   merely 'fishy'.
                                \_ Forgot to mention, why the silence about
                                   Harry Reid's shady land deals? -emarkp
                                   \_ Is there an indictment?  Is there
                                      anything beyond allegations?  Are you
                                      going to bring up the boxing thing
                                      again?  How 'bout Vince Foster again?
                                      \- i shot vince foster, just to watch
                                         him die.
                                      \_ Caught with hand in cookie jar.  If
                                         he was a (R) you'd be calling him
                                         the worst sort of criminal.  Getting
                                         lawerly is the last sign of a lost
                                         \_ Cookie Jar?  Where?  Would you
                                            like to cite evidence, an
                                            investigation, anything?
                                \_ So why is congress in uproar about AG when
                                   they haven't said word one or done anything
                                   to investigate WJ?  They can police their
                                   own members. -emarkp
                                   \_ Politics and priorities, duh.
                                   \_ As noted by above response, for the same
                                      reason that RDC wasn't censured and
                                      ejected when the GOP ran Congress. I will
                                      certainly grant you that. But remember
                                      that uproar over the AG need not preclude
                                      investigation of WJ; these things are not
                                      mutually exclusive as though there were
                                      limited resources to investigate ethical
                                      violations. A lack of political will to
                                      pursue WJ until the charges are leveled
                                      has nothing to do with the investigation
                                      of whether the AG fired US Atys in order
                                      to punish them for not embarassing the
                                      opposition party. --erikred
                                      \_ The USAGs can be fired for any reason
                                         at all.  They are politically
                                         appointed positions.  How you can say
                                         their firing is worse than stuffing
                                         your fridge with hot cash is beyond
                                         my ability to understand.  $90k in
                                         your fridge is just fishy, though.
                                         WJ is not defensible yet you defend
                                         it.  The USAG firing were handled
                                         poorly but are in no way illegal, yet
                                         you find this outrageous.
                                         \_ Actually, what I find outrageous is
                                            the idea that the Admin was so
                                            blatant about firing these people
                                            for not launching fruitless and
                                            embarassing investigations of its
                                            political rivals. I find partisan
                                            use of the US Atys as your own
                                            Gestapo utterly outrageous, but
                                            I find the lack of circumspection
                                            and careful planning insulting.
                                            What they're saying is, we'll do
                                            what we like, and you'll shut up
                                            and take it. At least the Reagan
                                            White House went through the
                                            motions; these guys are strictly
                                            amateurs. As for WJ, unlike you,
                                            my capacity for outrage is not
                                            limited to the opp. party; if he's
                                            done wrong here, he's a scumbag,
                                            and he should be censured. I've
                                            got no problem with that. But at
                                            least show me some proof. Also,
                                            am I still talking to emarkp or
                                            just to some AC? --erikred
                                            \_ That swath of entries reeks of
                                               reiffin. --scotsman
                 \_ Since the Democrats have been out of power in Washington
                    for so long, there is probably not a lot at the national
                    level to expose. I have (literally) campaigned for more
                    oversight at the local level, where the politicians are
                    all Democrats. Believe me, there is plenty of Democratic
                    machine corruption in San Francisco, but at least
                    Newsome is doing someting about it finally.
                    Newsom is doing someting about it finally.
                    \_ Newsom is the benefactor of the SF political machine.
                       He was Willie Brown's boy.  I don't live in SF though so
                       I'm curious what he is doing to cut his own support?
                       \_ No, he is not really Willie's boy. Willie endorsed
                          him, but Gavin's "base" is in the Marina/Pac Heights
                          crowd, where Willie's was in Hunter's Point and
                          the Projects and the City's municipal unions. Newsom
                          fired the old corrupt Police Chief and Fire Chief
                          fired the old corrupt Police of Chief and Fire Chief
                          and replaced them with reasonably competent
                          technocrats, has upended the planning dept and
                          indicted a number of corrupt building inspectors,
                          and cleaned out the whole rat's nest of corruption
                          that surrounded placement in public housing.
                          I am sure there is more that I am unware of.
2019/04/22 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular

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No Retreat, No Surrender, former House majority leader Tom DeLay, R-Texas, writes of former President Bill Clinton, "I openly admit that I just don't like the man, and my disgust is both personal and political." Enough to recite as fact a story about the Clinton White House that's acquired wide currency within the military but has been shown again and again to be false. As DeLay tells it, the story is a smear against Bill Clinton, but as the Hammer no doubt knows, it is really a smear against Hillary Clinton, who is running for president. went back on his word to enter the Reserve Officer Training Corps upon completing his Rhodes scholarship. In unloading on Clinton, DeLay steers clear of the ROTC saga, perhaps because it might raise the question of why DeLay, in reciting his own life story, never explains how he avoided the Vietnam draft when he graduated from the University of Houston in 1970. The only time I'm aware of that DeLay has ever answered this question publicly was at the 1988 Republican convention, amid the ruckus surrounding the vice-presidential selection of Dan Quayle, who'd sat out the war in the National Guard. highly original complaint that he'd been a victim of reverse discrimination. So many African-American kids joined up that there was no room for patriotic white kids! high draft-lottery number (312 in a year when the highest number called was 195) and, though already a Goldwater Republican, apparently saw no reason to enlist. Here is DeLay's accusation, on Pages 108 and 109: What sent me over the top about Clinton is that his brand of liberalism had an almost anti-American feel to it. Because it received scant treatment in the press many Americans don't know that when the Clintons first moved into the White House, they seriously considered banning all military uniforms from White House grounds. From the generals briefing the president to the Marines guarding the front door, no one would have been allowed to wear a military uniform. Fortunately, someone talked the Clintons out of this treachery, but take a moment to think about what even considering such a thing says about them. This was the president of the United States and his wife saying that something about military uniforms offended them. Apparently the noble symbols of martial honor and sacrifice so disturbed their unpatriotic, liberal sensibilities that they wanted to forbid them in the home of the nation's commander in chief. We should have kicked them out of office right then and there! The only part of the preceding passage that's true is that the purported consideration of a ban on military uniforms received "scant treatment in the press." It received scant treatment because no such ban was ever considered. The few news accounts to mention this rumor did so only to point out that it was entirely false. first knocked down by Kenneth Walsh, Bruce Auster, and Tim Zimmerman in US News & World Report, March 7, 1993: Poisoned rumors. At the Pentagon, the stories about White House insensitivity are numerous, and, some Clinton defenders say, approach paranoia. Perhaps the most virulent is the story that Chelsea Clinton refused to enter a government car destined to drive her to school because she didn't want to ride with a uniformed officer. Knowledgeable sources say Chelsea has always ridden with Secret Service agents and the occasion has never arisen where a military escort was asked to fill in for her regular agents. Among other poisonous rumors is the tale that the Clintonites are preparing to order military personnel to wear civilian clothes, not their uniforms, whenever they enter the White House. Another rumor is that Clinton advisers have forbidden the military aide who carries "the football"--a suitcase containing nuclear launch codes--to dress in uniform. The following month, the Washington Post's Barton Gellman tracked down these same rumors and once again reported that they were not true. Still, the rumors have persisted, and increasingly they've identified the culprit as then-First Lady Hillary Clinton. The trouble with Klein's (and Patterson's) version is that it has Hillary proposing the ban in 1996--three years after US News and the Post had knocked down the exact same rumor. from 1996 to 1998, so it isn't possible that he merely got his dates confused. To believe Klein and Patterson, then, we must believe that Hillary consciously made happen something that, three years earlier, had been identified by at least two prominent news sources as something that hadn't happened but, if it had, would have been a political disaster. David Horowitz Freedom Center, a right-wing agitprop mill in Los Angeles (my description, not Patterson's, but not all that different from the Center's self-description in its year-end report; calls itself "a battle-tank, not just a think-tank," and boasts that it has, among other things, persuaded DeLay, Bill O'Reilly, and Sean Hannity to make frequent use of the terms "fifth column" and "hate-America left"); and 4) The column you have on your screen is "rife with lies." On this last point, Patterson elaborates: It happened in the spring of 1996. I was the Air Force Aide to the President so I had firsthand knowledge of the First Lady's edict. Others who served in the White House Military Unit at the time can corroborate. In the grand scheme of things, it was a drop in the bucket in the Clinton's overall disdain for the military. I rectified that upon my retirement from the USAF in 2001. I've e-mailed Patterson, asking him to clarify from whom he acquired "firsthand knowledge of the First Lady's edict," and to put me in touch with the others who "can corroborate." I've also solicited his thoughts about the US News and Washington Post stories describing and knocking down his story three years before he says it unfolded. Correction, March 27, 2007: An earlier version of this column misstated the publication year of Dereliction of Duty as 2006.