Berkeley CSUA MOTD:Entry 45211
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2025/05/24 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
5/24    

2006/11/7-8 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:45211 Activity:kinda low
11/7    This question is mostly for the supporter of the war and those
        who oppose quick withdraw from Iraq.
        One option which no one talked about is mobilizing entire freaking
        nation for Iraq.  Draft until we got 2.5 million pairs of boots,
        ration supplies if absoultely nessarily, and blanket Iraq with an army
        of 2.5-3million strong, pacify the country, and leave.
        What is wrong with THAT idea?  Do you guys really think we can
        "win" this war with the current troop level in Iraq?  at 8 billion
        a month, such idea is even economically sound!
        \_ The problem with such a tactic against a guerilla force is they will
           melt away into the civilian populace, only to resurface when the
           massive force goes away.
        \_ "pacify"ing the country
           == Saddam kills you if you piss him off
           || Shiites kill you if you piss them off
           != Americans there temporarily (same thing above guy said),
              unless it serves bullet point 2
        \_ 2.5 - 3 million non-radical Sunni/Shiite loyalists?  Aaaaanyway.
           We'll just arm both sides..  I'm sure they'll only use their training
           and weapons to Keep the Peace.
           We'll just arm both sides..  I'm sure they'll only use their
           training and weapons to Keep the Peace.
        \_ I say we take off and nuke the site from orbit; it's the only way
           to be sure.  -John
           \_ done that in Japan, it worked well.  I wonder why don't we do
              that again.
        \_ There are many things wrong with that idea: politics, economics,
           logistics, military structure.  And oh yeah, it wouldn't work
           anyway.  I don't have to be a war supporter or oppose retreat to
           see that a draft won't work and wouldn't help.  How about you
           explain how and why this could possibly work?
        \_ Naw, the right way to do this is to deport Iraqis to reservations
           in New Mexico and replace them with illegal immigrants waiting for
           deportation. That, and raise all of the kids in orphanages. Oh,
           yeah, and give everyone smallpox blankets. Let's see, have I missed
           any really terrible imperialist ideas here?
           \_ Er, orphanages are imperialist?
              \_ Google: australia lost generation
                 \_ Edit: Grr, afternoon brainhit: The Stolen Generation:
                    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stolen_Generation
                 \_ my question of the day is, how come Australia never
                    charged with Genocide??  Or it is ok if White do this to
                    non-white and take their land?
                    \_ Australia has been working pretty hard to deal
                       with decimating the native population of Australia.
                       Hey either get grammar training, quit pretending to
                 \_ Since neither Canda, USA, nor Austrilia was punished for
                    this, I have been long advocating Chinese to do this to
                    Tibetian, Mogolians and rest of the minority tribe. :D
                       be ignorant, or I'll bust out the Im 30HHH and
                       no bra will hold me postings.
                       \_ Why USA say china bad when advocate australia
                          congress iraq no tibet?!  you racist white dog
                          not understand USA no good bad native genocide!!
                          Do we get more bra postings now?
2025/05/24 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
5/24    

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2010/7/20-8/11 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:53889 Activity:low
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Cache (8192 bytes)
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stolen_Generation
Estimates have been made that between 10-30% of all Aboriginal children were removed, during the 70 year period. Despite this, the nature, extent, and effects of the removals are disputed and debated within Australia to the point that the term "Stolen Generation" is sometimes referred to as the 'so-called Stolen Generation'. This is due to the dispute over the scale of the damage and legal use of the term 'generation'. Conservatives often quote the ten percent estimate, which does not constitute a 'generation'. Stolen Generation Nationally we can conclude with confidence that between one in three and one in ten Indigenous children were forcibly removed from their families and communities in the period from approximately 1910 until 1970. In certain regions and in certain periods the figure was undoubtedly much greater than one in ten. In that time not one family has escaped the effects of forcible removal (confirmed by representatives of the Queensland and WA Governments in evidence to the Inquiry). the destiny of the natives of Aboriginal origin, but not of the full blood, lies in their ultimate absorption by the people of the Commonwealth, and it therefore recommends that all efforts be directed to that end." The stated aims were: - to culturally assimilate mixed-descent Aborigines into contemporary Australian society so as to aid in the biological assimilation of the native race. "Generally by the fifth and invariably by the sixth generation, all native characteristics of the Australian Aborigine are eradicated. The problem of our half-castes will quickly be eliminated by the complete disappearance of the black race, and the swift submergence of their progeny in the white." Dr Cecil Cook - Aboriginal Protector, Northern Territory. Social Darwinist ideology prevalent at the time held that the full-blood Aboriginal race would be unable to sustain itself, and would eventually die out by itself. Stolen Generation Mr Neville holds the view that within one hundred years the pure black will be extinct. In Western Australia there were half-caste families of twenty and upwards. After that they were taken from their mothers and reared in accordance with white ideas. This extract gives us the idea that some white Australians were clearly very worried by the apparently prolific nature of a half-caste Aboriginal population. In reality the population of Aboriginals in 1901 was around 93,000 as compared to 6,000,000 non-natives. edit The policy in practice In general the practice was to remove children between the ages of two and four to be raised either by adoptive Colonial parents or in an Aboriginal Institution (which was anything from a Colonial run religious mission to a boarding house). We jumped on our mothers' backs, crying, trying not to be left behind. But the policemen pulled us off and threw us back in the car. They pushed the mothers away and drove off, while our mothers were chasing the car, running and crying after us." Stolen Generation The report closely examined the distinctions between "forcible removal", "removal under threat or duress", "official deception", "uninformed voluntary release", and "voluntary release". There was evidence that some Aboriginal parents voluntarily sent their children to religious missions, in the hope that at least in this way they would be able to retain contact with their children and some knowledge of their whereabouts. With regard to official deception, the report identified several cases where parents were told by government officials that their children had died, even though this was not the case. This report discovered that in many cases gross violations of human rights did occur. The report also acknowledged that in several cases the state took responsibility for children that were genuinely orphaned or in a state of neglect. Defenders of the removals claim that mixed-race children were often severely neglected within Aboriginal communities. Removed children were, in most cases, placed into institutional facilities operated by religious or charitable organisations, although a significant number, particularly females, were "fostered" out. A common aspect of the removals was the failure by these institutions to keep records of the actual parentage of the child, or such details as the date or place of birth. Stolen Generation the physical infrastructure of missions, government institutions and children's homes was often very poor and resources were insufficient to improve them or to keep the children adequately clothed, fed and sheltered." We had two very wonderful old ladies that looked after us. I can say that about that home - United Aborigines Mission home that was at Quorn. Y'know they gave us good teaching, they encouraged us to be no different to anybody else. Stolen Generation The report condemned the policy of disconnecting children from their "cultural heritage". "I've got everything that could be reasonably expected: a good home environment, education, stuff like that, but that's all material stuff. It's all the non-material stuff that I didn't have -- the lineage... Melbourne and cited in the official report found that there was no tangible improvement in the social position of "removed" Aborigines as compared to "non-removed", particularly in the areas of employment and post-secondary education. Most notably, the study indicated that removed Aboriginals were actually less likely to have completed a secondary education, three times as likely to have acquired a police record and were twice as likely to use illicit drugs. The only notable advantage "removed" Aboriginals possessed was a higher average income, which the report noted was most likely due to the increased urbanisation of removed individuals, and hence greater access to welfare payments than for Aboriginals living in tribal communities. The legal circumstances regarding the Stolen Generation remain unclear. Likewise, even though the actions may have contravened International Law, ruling on such a basis is outside the jurisdiction of Australian courts. At least two compensation claims have passed through the Australian courts and failed. The presiding judge noted in his summary judgement that he was not ruling that there would never be valid cases for compensation with regard to the Stolen Generation, only that in these specific two cases he could not find evidence of illegal conduct by the officials involved. Michael Lavarch MP, commissioned a formal inquiry entitled "The National Inquiry into the Separation of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Children from Their Families". During the ensuing 17 months, the Inquiry visited every state and Territory in Australia, heard testimony from 535 Aboriginal Australians, and received submissions of evidence from over 600 more. The report proved to be a considerable embarrassment for the Howard administration, as it recommended that the Australian Government formally apologise to the affected families, a proposal actively rejected by Howard, on the grounds that a formal admission of wrongdoing would lead to massive compensation litigation. Howard was quoted as saying "Australians of this generation should not be required to accept guilt and blame for past actions and policies." As a result Commissioner Dodson resigned from the Council for Aboriginal Reconciliation, saying in a newspaper column that "I despair for my country and regret the ignorance of political leaders who do not appreciate what is required to achieve reconciliation for us as a nation." John Herron, tabled a report in Parliament that questioned whether or not there ever actually had been a "Stolen Generation", on the semantic distinction that as "only 10% of Aboriginal children" has been removed, they did not constitute an entire "generation". After a week of scathing media commentary and the attempted invasion of parliament by scores of angry Indigenous Australians, Mr Herron apologised for the "understandable offence taken by some people" as a result of his comments, although he refused to alter the report as it had been tabled, and in particular the (disputed) figure of 10%. United Nations Commission on Human Ri...