Berkeley CSUA MOTD:Entry 44778
Berkeley CSUA MOTD
 
WIKI | FAQ | Tech FAQ
http://csua.com/feed/
2024/11/23 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
11/23   

2006/10/11-13 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:44778 Activity:low
10/11   Iraqi are better off?  Tell 1 in 40 Iraqis who died since the US
        invasion:  http://tinyurl.com/geore
        \_ Your knee jerked before you checked--this has already been posted
           today.
        \_ The Iraqi Deputy PM was on NPR yesterday, and I found his
           perspective enlightening. He said that no matter how bad the
           situation is now, nothing compares to the horror of living under
           Saddam. That said, he also pointed out that he was in no way saying
           that things are rosy or even good now. All in all, a fascinating
           interview clip. --erikred
           \- well, i obviously have no experience with iraq, but i think
              there is something to the following "a priori" argument:
              in the saddam era, rights and freedom were curtailed but
              the violence wasnt random. there was a good chance you could
              "choose" to keep your head down, go along to get along, and it
              was highly likely you would be left alone. however, today it
              seems it is quite likely anytime you leave the house to go
              buy some cheese, go to work, apply for a job you will get
              blown up. there is something to the hobbesian position that
              anarchy is worse than tyranny. consider how freaked out london
              was when the ira was planting bombs or those crazy sniper doods
              were shooting people in Washington DC ... the numbers in iraq
              are 100x or 1000x worse ... i think that affects life in ways
              which just canot be appreciated at a distance [just like you
              cant imagine what life is like under say hyperinflation].
              \_ The difference being that tyranny has no end.  Anarchy is a
                 temporary state.  Power will always gather around some person
                 or group who will then seize control for better or worse.
                 \_ Armed anarchy is merely detente thuggery.
           \_ This guy is just a Bush troll and needs to be replaced by
              someone who better understands the Iraqi people and their
              situation like some motd posters.
              \_ Point of clarification: I'm a Bush troll or the Iraqi Deputy
                 PM is a Bush troll? --erikred
                 \_ The Iraqi DPM is a Bush troll.  Why else would he say that
                    over 650k dead Iraqis, 550k of them in the last 2 years
                    is ok?
                    \_ He didn't. In fact, what he said was that he disputed
                       the numbers but was opposed to saying "only" 30-100k
                       as if any number would be a good thing. It was on All
                       Things Considered. I'll see if I can dig up a URL for
                       you. Here you go: http://csua.org/u/h6j (NPR)
2024/11/23 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
11/23   

You may also be interested in these entries...
2012/7/21-9/24 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:54440 Activity:nil
7/21    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Cold_War_pilot_defections
        This week's food for thought, brought to you by People's
        Republic of Berkeley: Did you know that many US pilots defected to
        communist Cuba?  South Korea pilots defected to communist
        North Korea? Iran<->Iraq pilots defected to each other?
        W Germany pilots defected to E Germany? Taiwan/ROC pilots
	...
2012/3/26-6/1 [Politics/Domestic/President/Bush, Politics/Domestic/President] UID:54347 Activity:nil
3/26    Things I learned from History: Lincoln was photographed with
        killer. Lincoln had 3 male lovers (he was bisexual!).
        Kennedy had an affair with a Nazi spy. Elenore Roosevelt
        was a lesbian!!!  Nerdy looking Ben Franklin was a suspected
        killer and quite a ladies man. WTF???
        \_ Did it mention anything about Washington and the cherry tree?
	...
2011/11/6-30 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:54212 Activity:nil
11/6    By a 2:1 ratio Americans think that the Iraq war was not worth it:
        http://www.pollingreport.com/iraq.htm
        \_ Bad conservatives. You should never change your mind, and you
           should never admit mistakes.
           \_ Most "tea party" conservatives still support the war. It is the
              weak-kneed moderates that have turned against America.
	...
2011/2/16-4/20 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:54041 Activity:nil
2/16    "Iraqi: I'm proud my WMD lies led to war in Iraq"
        http://www.csua.org/u/sl0 (news.yahoo.com)
        \_ Duh.  the best thing that could ever happen to a country is
           the US declaring war on it.  cf: japan, germany, and now iraq.
           the US winning a war with it.  cf: japan, germany, and now iraq.
	...
2010/11/2-2011/1/13 [Politics/Domestic/California, Politics/Domestic/President/Reagan] UID:54001 Activity:nil
11/2    California Uber Alles is such a great song
        \_ Yes, and it was written about Jerry Brown. I was thinking this
           as I cast my vote for Meg Whitman. I am independent, but I
           typically vote Democrat (e.g., I voted for Boxer). However, I
           can't believe we elected this retread.
           \_ You voted for the billionaire that ran HP into the ground
	...
2010/9/26-30 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:53966 Activity:nil
9/24    Toture is what gave us the false info on WMD and Iraq.
        http://video.nytimes.com/video/2010/09/25/opinion/1248069087414/my-tortured-decision.html
        Where is the apology jblack?
	...
2010/7/20-8/11 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:53889 Activity:low
7/20    Is jblack still on? What about the rest of the pro-war cheerleaders?
        http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100720/ap_on_re_eu/eu_britain_iraq_inquiry
        \_ War is fought for the glory of generals and the economics of the
           war machine.  Looking for "justifications" for it is like looking
           for sense in the necronomicon.  Just accept it and move on.
        \_ When we fight with Red China, what nation will we use as a proxy?
	...
2010/2/22-3/30 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:53722 Activity:nil
2/20    Ok serious question, NOT political.  This is straight up procedural.
        Has it been declared that we didn't find WMD in iraq? (think so).
        So why did we go into iraq (what was the gain), and if nobody really
        knows, why is nobody looking for the reason?
        \_ Political stability, military strategy (Iran), and to prevent
           Saddam from financing terrorism.
	...
2009/10/1-12 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:53421 Activity:kinda low
10/1    Signs that Communist China is really opening up!
        http://www.csua.org/u/p6f (news.search.yahoo.com)
        \_ WOW that is TOTALLY AWESOME. I'd love to see a porn
           of this genre. Asian. Lesbians. Military. That
           is just awesome.
           \_ This unit has unusually good drill and ceremony discipline.
	...
Cache (3806 bytes)
tinyurl.com/geore -> www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,20867,20567647-2702,00.html
The Australian -- The Nation This story is from The Times Up to 600,000 have died in Iraq fighting: report Sam Knight and James Hider October 12, 2006 A new study by public health researchers estimates that up to 600,000 Iraqipeople nearly 1 in 40 have died violently since the American-led invasion of the country in March 2003. The estimate, which far exceeds figures compiled by the United Nations and the Iraqi Government, is the second made by a group of American and Italian researchers and used a sampling of nearly 2,000 households across Iraq to extrapolate a total number of violent deaths, be they caused by crime, the US-led coalition or sectarian strife. The first report, issued in October 2004 by a team led by Les Roberts of the Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health, estimated that 100,000 people had been killed in the first year of the war. The study was criticised for its narrow sample and wide margin of error. The new study, published in the online edition of The Lancet, the British medical journal, also accepts a broad range of error, with its lead author, Gilbert Burnham, also of Johns Hopkins, saying the true figure could lie anywhere between 426,369 to 793,663. It estimated that a total of 654,965 more Iraqis had died as a consequence of the war than "would have been expected in a non-conflict situation". Of those, 601,000 it was said had died directly of violent causes, including gunfire, car bombs, air strikes and other explosions. The rest had suffered from a general decline in healthcare and sanitary standards due to failing water supplies, sewerage and electricity supply. When asked about the study at a White House news conference, President George Bush said: "The methodology is pretty well discredited." He added: "I do know that a lot of innocent people have died and that troubles me, and it grieves me. And I applaud the Iraqis for their courage in the face of violence." The researchers defended their methods, which replicate those used to estimate the death toll in humanitarian emergencies such as Darfur, claiming that studying the mortality rate of a sample of families across Iraq is at least as accurate as relying on casualty figures issued by morgues, hospitals and the Iraqi Government. According to a report in today's New York Times, the researchers maintain that their study reflects the larger breakdown of order across Iraq and reflects the turbulence outside Baghdad, which dominates press and official reports about the progress of the war. "We found deaths all over the country," Dr Burnham told the newspaper, adding that Baghdad was an area of medium violence compared to the provinces of Diyala and Salahuddin, north of the capital, and Anbar to the west, which all had higher death rates. The study found that up to 15,000 people are dying violently every month in Iraq, a level that surpasses by far the most recent UN estimates. Last month the UN Assistance Mission in Iraq said that 3,009 civilians had died violently in August, down from 3,590 in July, two of the worst months of the war so far. The US military does not keep an official count of the civilian casualties in Iraq, but according to its latest report to Congress, around 120 Iraqis, including police officers and soldiers, died every day in August, a total of 3,600, up from 26 a day, or 800 per month, in 2004. The John Hopkins figures also tower over the running totals maintained by the Iraq Body Count, an independent group that monitors media reports to estimate the numbers of Iraqi dead. The Iraqi Government, meanwhile, has sought to take control of the compilation of mortality statistics. Baghdad's central morgue, until now the main source of information for violence in the capital, was prohibited from issuing its own information last month.
Cache (408 bytes)
csua.org/u/h6j -> www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=6248512
All Things Considered, October 11, 2006 A Johns Hopkins report states that the number of Iraqi deaths since 2003 may have exceeded 600,000. The study averages violent deaths to 15,000 per month, four times higher than the number of deaths counted in July by the Iraqi government. Iraq's leaders say they are trying to stem the death toll. Michele Norris talks with Deputy Prime Minister of Iraq Barham Salih.