6/15    Let's face it. Karl Rove is evil, but is also extremely brilliant.
        What new tricks do you anticipate in the upcoming elections?
        \_ Dubya simultaneously stays the course in Iraq and brings some
           troops back to a heroic homecoming.
           \_ Precisely. He announces that victory is complete and says he'll
              bring home troops. He brings back a minimum number and says the
              rest are merely support and on their way home Real Soon Now.
              At the same time, he paints Dems as cowards. Fox publishes
              retrospective on the war describing the entire venture in rosy
              terms ("sacrifices were made for the greater good," etc.).
              The best Dems can hope for after that is the assassination of
              the Iraqi PM.
              \_ Are you fucking nuts?  Why would you *hope for* the Iraqi
                 PM to be assassinated?  Why would anyone hope for that?
                 \_ Because it's ok if the middle east goes to hell and
                    millions die, as long as the Dems win the next
                    election!
                    \_ And yet, not surprisingly, it would be okay with
                       everyone involved if you were found drowned and
                       bloated, no matter who wins the next election.
                       \_ Oo, touched a nerve, huh? And, not surprisingly,
                          you cannot express yourself in an intelligent
                          manner.  Ook! Trog kill!
                          \_ It's always disappointing to me when this is
                             the best a college educated person can do.
                             -someone else
                 \_ You DON'T. That's the point. The GOP is so good at the
                    PR game that they're going to paint the Dems into a
                    corner where the only way out is if something absolutely
                    terrible happens.
                    \_ Paint into a corner?  What?  So Iraq taking a turn for
                       the worse is good for the party?  The logic behind that
                       is so painfully twisted I'm left speechless.  Nevermind,
                       it's only the motd.  I'm going to lunch.
                       \_ Here's my vain attempt to make this clear to you:
                          Bushco is going to announce victory and bring back
                          a minimum number of troops while promising to bring
                          the rest back at some vague date in the future.
                          He'll ridicule the Dems as cowards who would have
                          pulled out our troops before we were able to complete
                          the mission. Fox will kick into overdrive with
                          retrospectives of how the war _was_ terrible but
                          how it was utterly justified and how the troops
                          who died did so in the line of duty. The networks
                          will miss the point and will argue over the war,
                          but in the past tense, thereby solidifying the
                          idea that it's over. The public, faced with a
                          seemingly successful conclusion to the matter, will
                          go along with the GOP as the party of winners. The
                          Dems will then have no real means of regaining
                          Congress or the White House. The one thing that could
                          derail this plan is if something catastrophic
                          and sensationally public occurred in Iraq, such as
                          the assassination of the Iraqi PM; a public
                          reversal like that would be sufficient to prove
                          that the war is not won in Iraq, thereby short-
                          circuiting the PR war. Read carefully: I'm not saying
                          that anyone should be hoping for the assassination
                          of the Iraqi PM; I'm saying that the GOP is setting
                          up an airtight plan to continue their dominance.
                          \_ ok it does make me feel better that you're not
                             rooting for an assassination.  However, I'm not
                             buying that if there's still say, 30,000 US troops
                             there and bombs are still going off in Baghdad
                             that anyone is going to buy that it's over.  As
                             far as planning for political dominance, that is
                             a political parties reason for being.  I expect
                             both major political groups to spend all their
                             time plotting and planning to achieve and retain
                             power.  WTF else are they good for?  Once you
                             accept that political parties exist you can't
                             fault them for doing what they were designed
                             to do.
                             \_ I would buy this if there were oversight
                                worth a damn keeping them from acting
                                illegally and unethically. The sad truth is
                                (as DeLay mostly worked out) that if you
                                control the means of oversight, you can then
                                overlook your own excesses.
                                \_ I'm a glass half-full kinda guy.  I see
                                   DeLay and Jefferson's fridge stuffing and
                                   the many other times someone in either party
                                   got busted and booted and often jailed as
                                   the system working.  I see the Keating Five
                                   (sleaze bag McCain) getting off as a
                                   failure but that's the exception.  So, I'm
                                   not going for this "the people are stupid"
                                   line and I'm also not buying the "they
                                   always get away with it" thing either.  The
                                   overall record stands against that line of
                                   reasoning.
                          \_ airtight except for the fact that Iraq is still
                             a clusterfuck and it will get worse if we pull
                             our troops out.  That government wouldn't last
                             a week.  -tom
                             \_ And that's why they pull back a token number,
                                declare a public victory, and leave the rest
                                of the troops in place to be withdrawn at some
                                vague future date.
                                \_ People are stupid, but I don't think this
                                   administration has enough credibility left
                                   to turn things around with token gestures.
                                     -tom
                                   \_ I hope you're right.
        \_ Don't confuse "conniving" with "billiant."  -tom
           \_ Brilliantly conniving.  Not all connivers are on the same
              plane as Rove.
           \_ yosafbridge
              \_ Two words: "special hell" :D --michener
                 \_ quiet, this is a movie.