6/8     GOP loses bid in Senate to eliminate inheritance tax.  Two GOPers
        (Voinovich/Ohio, Chafee/RI) voted against, four Dems voted for.
        BTW, the credit which covers $1 million for gifts and $2 million
        for inheritance is per-person.  So your parents can gift out $2 mill
        to the kids and $4 mill out of the estate, for $6 mill total, or
        $24,000/year to each kid without counting against the gift and an
        unlimited amount for tuition, medical expenses, PACs, and charities
        \_ That's fine and all except it does nothing for the people who got
           there by working hard instead of riding their IPO stock up.  The
           inheritance tax kills family owned businesses.  When the parents
           die the kids can't keep the business running because they have to
           pay taxes on the value of the business which is a non-liquid asset,
           so they have to sell to pay up.  It isn't that hard for a family
           run business that's been around for decades to be worth that or more
           on paper but have near zero cash.
           \_ The "family owned business" is the distraction.  There are
              relatively few legitimate hard-luck cases like this
              compared to the amount of wealth turning over to
              relatives.  And haven't you ever heard of a "loan"?  You
              can use that to pay taxes and pay it back over time.
              I bet the interest is even deductible as a business
              expense.  Second, the parents, if they're not stupid,
              can put the business in a trust and shield it from
              inheritance tax.  The real deal here is that the Bush
              administration and their republican cronies are
              skewing things in favor of the wealthy, setting up
              hereditary aristocracies.  --PeterM
              \_ And what is wrong with that? Are you jealous?
              \_ A distraction?  Small businesses employ what percentage of the
                 American population?  Off the top of my head, it's something
                 like 40%.  Please correct that if you have a better number but
                 it is not a trivial number.  And no, trusts don't work like
                 that.  If they did then everyone would do it and we wouldn't
                 be having a discussion about it.  And I don't even know what
                 to say about the idea of dinging the kids with having to get
                 a loan to pay taxes on the transfer of the family business.
                 Why exactly should some bank make big bucks on the parent's
                 deaths?  I'm left speechless.  The truly wealthy don't pay
                 these taxes because their money is off shore.  You think the
                 Kennedys or the Bushs pay these taxes?  Fat chance.  The
                 truly wealthy don't follow the same laws the rest of us do.
                 \_ If the concern is really for the small business owner,
                    the proper response is to raise the threshhold, not to
                    eliminate the tax.  The fact that proposals to raise the
                    threshhold are shot down by Republicans exposes their
                    true motives.  -tom
                    \_ The threshhold has been raised many times over the
                       years.  What are you talking about?
                       \_ "[I]nstead of seeking a compromise that
                       might win over a handful of crucial Democrats,
                       [Frist] is pushing for a permanent repeal of the
                       estate tax.
                       Though Republican aides say Mr. Frist has not
                       closed off the possibility of a compromise, the
                       senator has pointedly refused to schedule any
                       floor time for debate about alternatives in the
                       event that his own effort fails."
                       Oh, and by the way, the estate tax affects less than
                       2% of estates even at today's levels.  -tom
                       \_ And?  Mr. Frist is not "Republicans" and as I said,
                          the number has increased several fold over the years.
                          Why should he compromise anyway?  Better to kill a
                          bad law entirely than make yet another confusing
                          tax mess full of loop holes for the rich.  As Diane
                          Feinstein said, "Death should not be a taxable
                          event".
                          \_ Yeah, that's brilliant, to get rid of loopholes
                             for the rich, let's just stop taxing them
                             entirely!  My point is that the Republicans
                             are trying to protect the extremely wealthy,
                             not the hard-working small business owner.
                             Thank you for making my point.  -tom
                             \_ My point is that the Republicans are NOT
                                trying to protect the wealthy, but to assist
                                their friends and family members. Thank you
                                for making my point you fucking idiot
                \_ "A study by the CBO shows that in 2000 only 1659 farms
                    and 458 small business were liable for the estate tax,
                    almost all of which had sufficient liquid assets to pay
                    it. The rest can stretch their tax payments over many
                    years." -The Economist 6/10/2006. I am curious, since
                    you think the extremely wealthy should not have to pay
                    tax, who would you tax in their place? -ausman
                    \_ There is no reason for tax if everyone is self
                       reliant. The reason we have tax today is because
                       negros don't work hard and we have to pay for their
                       social security and welfare. Forget tax and forget
                       social progrems, let the beast starve.  -conservative
                       \_ If this is a troll, it's in poor taste.  If it isn't
                          then, uhm, wow.
                          \_ If you made it to Cal you're most likely smart
                             enough to not preach hardcore self-reliance,
                             racist and conservative messages, so this must
                             be a troll.
                             \_ Well, yes, that's probably right...but my time
                                on motd has made me realize that I can't take
                                that as a given.