3/28 "This nonsense of 'jobs Americans won't do' is an age-old lie that's
been around as long as the republic. Prior to the illegal alien
problem, the same excuse was applied to the perpetuation of slavery.
Georgia Representative James Jackson rose in opposition to a Quaker
petition to end slavery in 1790 by fuming 'that rice cannot be brought
to market without these people [slaves].' William Loughton Smith added
that slavery was an economic precondition for prosperity of his
constituents, as author Joseph Ellis noted in his book, Founding
Brothers . 'Such is the state of agriculture,' Smith said, 'that no
white man would perform the tasks.' "
http://www.philvalentine.com/IllegalAlienMyth.htm
\_ this is stupid. everyone knows 'jobs Americans won't do' means
'jobs Americans won't do at the current wages'. There will be
people willing to do almost anything if the price is high enough.
\_ And yet that keeps getting dropped in conversation. And people
keep acting as if "Americans" won't do the jobs under any
circumstance.
\_ yea, but the question is "why pay a higher wage when
someone is willing to do it at a lower wage?". It's
laws vs economics. The biggest loser? Probably black
males whose plight has been deteriorating even during
the prosperous 90s. Unemployment isn't high for other
ethnic and gender groups. If you didn't graduate from
high school, yes, your livelihood would likely be
affected by the many illegal aliens, but otherwise,
you likley won't be affected and may even benefit from a
cost standpoint.
\_ This post seems like a non sequitur to me. The point
is that the employment at the lower wages is illegal,
and talking about "jobs Americans won't do" implies
all sorts of things which is why people say that. I've
seen it raised on the motd, as in "how are you gonna
get fresh produce???!11/??"
\_ yea, and slavery was legal, so please explain
how the comparison with slavery makes sense.
\_ slavery was an abomination and is now outlawed
everywhere in the world but places you'd never set
foot in. what does the legal status of slavery in
this country 150+ years ago in _some_ states have to
do with whether or not slavery is ok or the price of
berry picking or anything else today?
\_ exactly, thus the quote op posted is stupid.
\_ So the point is 'Jobs American's won't do (for how little we want
to pay )'. However, if the employery were to offer to pay what
it would take to get Americans to work them, would those jobs
still exist?
\_ If they need to exist. Some would and some would not. The
net effect is more jobs for "Americans", although perhaps
fewer jobs overall.
\_ nah, it will further increase cost of doing business in
the US, and trigger more outsourcing, and moving of
factories and jobs overseas.
\_ You can't outsource most of these kinds of jobs or
that would've already been done. These people are
maids, day laborers, farm hands, and the like. Some
businesses will fold because of the increased cost of
doing business and some won't. Mostly, I think it
will be the same amount of $$$ spread out across
fewer employees in aggregate.
\_ I don't know. The janitorial and cafeteria
people at my company are all hispanics. So are
the people keeping the company's lawn looking good,
as are the movers, drivers, etc. Cost of
doing business will increase as living costs
increase. Nobody is talking about outsourcing
these jobs, but the rise in cost of doing
business. As it is, we aren't having an
easy time competing with China and India.
\_ Well, someone above *did* write "trigger more
outsourcing" and "mov[e]... factories and jobs
overseas." I imagine the cafeteria staff at your
company is not comprised of illegal aliens.
Gardeners may be. I know that it costs a lot more to
have a gardener in places w/o a lot of illegals,
even in places where the cost of living is much
lower. So fewer people will have gardeners and the
gardeners that are hired will make more money, but
will probably be better gardeners. I know an
old-time tree trimmer and his company has been
driven to the brink of bankruptcy by competition
with illegal aliens who aren't arborists, but who
charge 1/3 the price for the work such as they
do it. The cost of doing business will increase,
but so will the average wage. More money will
stay in the USA, instead of being sent to family
abroad. Somehow Europe manages to stay competitive
despite higher wages and a higher standard of
living. Competing with China and India on price
alone is a recipe for disaster, anyway. Maybe
people wouldn't need to shop at Wal-Mart for
Chinese-made crap if they had more money in
their pockets.
\_ Yes, the costs will rise. Or they won't. And we'll
go on with life.
\_ life's pretty good as it is today.
\_ life was pretty good with slavery.
\_ slaves did not come voluntarily. |