Berkeley CSUA MOTD:Entry 39294
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2025/07/08 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
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2005/8/26-29 [Reference/Military] UID:39294 Activity:moderate
8/26    Okay, I want to buy a gun.  I don't need it, but just wanna get
        one cause it's fun and cool, and it's one thing I can't do in
        most other countries.  I lean towards not allowing guns, but
        on a personal basis, if it's legal, I feel like exercising my
        right and freedom, and also it feels good to annoy mot.
        what gun should I get?  where can I get a basic gun safety
        training?  and where can I go shoot?
        beretta? glock? s&w revolver?  where do I buy them?
        \_ Get 2 Desert Eagles in silver and don't look back
        \_ If you're in the SF/BA, Target Master's in milpitas is an
           excellent indoor shooting range with a great selection of
           weapons that you can rent.  Their staff is good and willing to
           answer questions from novices.  My suggestion is to go to a
           range where you're comfortable, get your HSC, try out a
           selection of weapons in different calibers, then make a
           decision.  I'd suggest Beretta (92/96), Smith Wesson 490*, HK
           USP, or maybe Sig 22*.  For a beginner, you might want to start
           decision.  I'd suggest Beretta (92/96), Smith Wesson 40[03|06|13],
           HK USP, or maybe Sig 22*.  For a beginner, you might want to start
           with a revolver in .22 to get used to handling a firearm, then
           granduate to a 9mm semi.  Email me if you have questions.  -mice
        \_ If you're in the SF/BA, Target Master's in milpitas is an excellent
           indoor shooting range with a great selection of weapons that you
           can rent.  Their staff is good and willing to answer questions from
           novices.  My suggestion is to go to a range where you're
           comfortable, try out a selection of weapons in different calibers,
           get your HSC, then make a decision.  I'd suggest Beretta (92/96),
           Smith Wesson 490*, HK USP, or maybe Sig 22*.  For a beginner, you
           might want to start with a revolver in .22 to get used to handling
           a firearm, then granduate to a 9mm semi.  Email me if you have
           questions.             -mice
           \_ How about Sig Pro vs. Sig 22*?
           \_ Target Masters seconded. http://www.thegunplace.com/range.htm
              --erikred
           \_ What is a S&W 490*?
              \_ Smith and Wesson 4003 TSW, 4006 TSW, 4013 TSW -- typo on my
                 part.    Corrected -- thanks!     -mice
        \_ Don't get a glock. -- ilyas
           \_ So are you guys against all polymer frames or just Glocks? What
              about a Sig Pro?
           \_ Another thing about glocks I forgot to mention.  They, uh ..
              they tend to explode.  See 'the glock ka-boom faq':
              http://www.thegunzone.com/glock/glock-kb-faq.html -- ilyas
           \_ Seconded.  -John
              \_ Thirded. Damn thing was too small for my hand. --erikred
                 \_ Fourthed, I guess.  I loathed the pull - felt uneven. -mice
                    \_ Fifthed.  Feels like a blocky piece of crap in my
                       hands. -geordan
                    \_ I've heard the "don't buy a glock" advice now from
                       quite a few people who know guns.  So if people in the
                       know all hate them so much, why are they so successful?
                       Brilliant marketing?  What?
                       \_ They are successful because Glocks have one advantage
                          -- they are _extremely_ reliable and resistant to
                          shocks, dirt, sand, water, etc.  However, there are
                          plenty of guns that have comparable durability to
                          Glocks without all the, well, suck. -- ilyas
                       \_ The marketing helps too.  I just hate the balance on
                          them--it doesn't feel like a gun.  -John
                       \_ I thought a lot of the law enforcement use was
                          because of the safety. -geordan
                          \_ Glocks have a safety? -- ilyas
                             \_ They have a "trigger safety" and internal
                                safeties against non-triggered fire.
                             \_ Not a safety safety.  I meant the "dropping
                                it on the ground" safety.  Safeness.  Fine,
                                I'll find a /. article to torture you with.
                                -geordan
                                \_ Glocks have almost no safety features.  This
                                   makes them very mechanically simple, much
                                   less likely to misbehave in the hands of a
                                   panicky or freaked out cop/soldier, and
                                   very, VERY cheap.  It is seen as a true
                                   professional's gun in its stripped down
                                   simplicity.  This makes it somewhat less
                                   safe for anyone other than really hardcore
                                   gun people or professionals.  That's the
                                   theory, anyhow.  *shrug*  I still don't like
                                   them very much.  As a side note, no
                                   modern semi-auto will (should) fire if
                                   dropped, whether it's in the cocked state,
                                   safetied, decocked, etc.  IIRC, James
                                   Bond's Walther PPK was actually notoriously
                                   bad in this respect.        -mice
                                   \_ I am not sure I believe this.  Lots of
                                      cops shoot themselves in the foot
                                      (literally!) with glocks every year.
                                      It _is_ an excellent gun if you plan
                                      to roam the jungles and fieldstrip it
                                      often enough to appreciate how few parts
                                      there are. -- ilyas
                                      \_ Well, yeah.  I know CCCSO considers
                                         the glock an out-of-policy weapon for
                                         exactly that reason.  That's partly
                                         why, I believe, it's viewed as a true
                                         professional's weapon -- that if you
                                         don't know what you're doing, you'll
                                         shoot yourself in the foot, etc -- but
                                         that's counterbalanced by the gun's
                                         simplicity/reliability and its ease
                                         of use right out of the holster, etc.
                                         Personally, I think that reputation
                                         speaks of a mentality which has more
                                         to do with machismo and less to do
                                         with pragmatism.  I mean, as you
                                         pointed out above, there's no reason
                                         why you can't carry your Smith cocked
                                         and hot...but I think that's a great
                                         way to make an ass of yourself by
                                         shooting your toe off with your own
                                         service weapon.        -mice
                 \_ So if I have small hands it's good?
                    \_ Maybe.  Beretta also makes a 92/96 model with slimmer
                       grips (the Vertec).         -mice
        \_ Shooting on a regular basis can get pricy. Owning a gun just to
           \_ Highly dependant on caliber, dude.  .22 is cheap.
           \_ People who shoot regularly often invest in reloading equipment.
              This makes shooting significantly less expensive as a hobby.
              As a bonus, you can become a powder/ballistics geek. -- ilyas
           have a gun is kinda stupid. There are a few places to go for a
           handgun safety class. Train and learn first before you start
           popping off about gun makers and calibers. Where do you live?
           \_ This post added nothing to the thread at all, aside from you
              taking the opportunity to declare your semi-informed opinions.
           \_ http://dmoz.org/Recreation/Guns/Education
              My brother in law (a collector more into rifles than pistols)
              says that the Chabot Gun Club is pretty decent.  As the
              previous poster reiterates, definitely get your HSC before
              handling a gun -- it's the absolute minimum in terms of
              safety the state of CA requires in order to own.  More
              advanced casses are highly recommended, though.  You could
              probably also call Target Master's for better pointers to
              other gun clubs that offer classes.  This all assumes that
              you're in the BA, of course.  If not, then you could probably
              just call the local gun store (google/yahoo can help find one).
              They usually somewhat connected as a community.   -mice
              says that the Chabot Gun Club is pretty decent.  As was said
              before, definitely get your HSC before handling a gun -- it's
              the absolute minimum in terms of safety the state of CA
              requires in order to own.  More advanced casses are highly
              My brother-in-law (a collector more into rifles than pistols)
              says that the Chabot Gun Club is pretty decent.  Yeah,
              definitely get your HSC before handling a gun -- it's the
              absolute minimum in terms of safety the state of CA requires
              in order to own.  More advanced casses are highly
              in order to own.  More advanced classes are highly
              recommended, though.  You could probably also call Target
              Master's for better pointers to other gun clubs that offer
              classes.  This all assumes that you're in the BA, of course.
              classes.  This all assumes that you're in the SF/BA, of course.
              If not, then you could probably just call the local gun store
              (google/yahoo can help find one).  They usually somewhat
              connected as a community.   -mice
              (google/yahoo/YP can help find one).  They're usually somewhat
              connected as a community, and are likely to be knowledgable
              and willing to help.      -mice
        \_ Depends on your ergonomics, and if you want a safety. Never
           depend on a safety, but many jurisdictions like LA are getting
           draconian about "safety features." Some guns have loaded chamber
           indicators as well. Like with cars, the imports usually cost
           more. But going to any indoor range in CA will never prepare
           you for when you really have to use your gun. Get a shotgun
           for that. Drop me a line for more. -jlee
        \_ I really like my WWII vintage Remington/Colt .45 M1911.  It feels
           more like an heirloom than a soulless tool, and is a pleasure
           to shoot.  There was a _lot_ of discussion of "how-to" gun safety
           and mechanics type of stuff on the motd about a year ago, look at
           KAIS archive; a lot of people mentioned good tips about what to
           look out for, where to go, etc.  -John
        \_ For most things I stick to dual berettas, but I usually
           carry a desert eagle or dual ingrams to deal with tricky
           situations. -mpayne
           \_ I dunno, man.  My glock has always served me well -- even in the
              most extreme situations.       -gfreeman
              \_ Word on the street is that you do your best work with your
                 crowbar.
                 \_ Guns are for pussies -- I like SWORD!  That's a personal
                    weapon.                 -lwang
        \_ Do any motd people have Class III/Title II or whatever weapons?
           Silencers, machineguns?
           \_ I hear John has a tank.
              \_ I didn't get the tank because I had myself declared psycho
                 in lieu of having to spend 15 weeks being told by farm boys
                 to do pushups.  I did, however, acquire an arsenal from a
                 colleague under some weird circumstances recently, and a
                 friend in Germany has a bunch of machine guns and sniper
                 rifles and other scary shit.  -John
           \_ Don't have them, but just two weeks ago I was out visiting
              relatives in Atlanta who are in the gun business, and got
              to try a whole host of stuff that you can't get in the
              good ol' People's Republic of California.
                \_ That's the People's Democratic Republic of Kalifornia, fool
                   \_ Should be Democratic People's Republic of Kalifornia
                      (DPRK).
                      \_ I hate the smell of motd humor in the evening.
                      \_ All hail Kimnold Jongilnegger!
                         \-Hasta La Vista, PSB
                           http://home.lbl.gov:8080/~psb/LBL/Gubernator+Chu.jpg
       \_ Don't forget to visit http://www.nra.org and sign up
        \_ You might want to consider this gun:
           http://www.realtechnews.com/posts/1734
2025/07/08 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
7/8     

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Catastrophic failures may be caused by a variety of problems, but in general a kB! The case failure occurs when pressure inside the cartridge increases to the point that it cannot be contained by the case and the material of the case fails, allowing hot gases to escape from the ruptured case web at damagingly high velocities. The resulting uncontained forces can blow the magazine out of the gun, destroy the locking block, cause the tip of the trigger to be snipped off, ruin the trigger bar, rupture the barrel, peel the forward edge of the slide at the ejection port up, and do other nasty things. In general, Glocks tend to contain case failures fairly well, but under some circumstances they can cause injury as well as damage to one's gun. involving a Glock 21 and a Winchester factory overcharge. Additionally, there is some evidence of there being another cause of a kB!... 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