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| 5/25 |
| 2004/9/29-30 [Politics/Foreign/Europe] UID:33837 Activity:very high |
9/29 What do you guys think about Turkey joining the EU?
\_ Not yet. It's only recently that their main islamist groups have
come around to the idea that beating women and imposing shariya
may not be the best road to prosperity. They're getting there,
making friends with Greece and starting to be reasonable about
Cyprus and the Kurds. Give them some time, start building ties.
Turks are pretty nice & civilized people in general, and I'd like
to see them join "Europe", but I would like to see some more
movement towards what is (not in religious terms) Europe's
judeo-christian cultural and economic identity. -John
\_ I think it's an EU problem and has little to do with us. At best
it is another back door for the US into controlling the EU. At
worst, it'll drag Europe down that much faster and there'll be a
huge mess in Europe as it goes down in flames. It already won't
be Eurpean by the end of the century at current birth and
immigration rates/trends. I wonder if this is the first time
in history that an entire people, or in this multiple people with
a similar/tied culture, have allowed themselves to become extinct.
\_ Ah. So "European" is short-hand for "white", then?
\_ Ah. I someone would scream "RACIST!" instead of appyling
their brain. Europe has a unique culture which a flood of
people from other countries who are not being integrated
into society will overwhelm and destroy. I didn't say
"white" or even hint at it. Don't strawman me.
\_ Again, how is Turkey more of a problem than the former
Soviet Bloc countries?
\_ Some of the former Soviet slave states are European
cultured and only differ in that their economies are
still recovering from communism as their legal systems
come up to speed. Turkey is a completely different
culture. What sort of answer other than the obvious
were you expecting?
\_ Actually, the ones that just joined EU like the
Baltic states, blend pretty well with the rest
of Europe culturally.
\_ That's what he said isn't it?
\_ Why not, they joined NATO.
\_ It's a hard question. On the one hand, Turkey is one of the few
Muslim countries actually making progress into the modern world,
and it's not a bad place. I'd like to give them all the
opportunities possible. On the other hand, Turkish immirants
into Europe have become a serious pain in the butt.
\_ More so than Eastern European immigrants? Turkey is in better
shape than, say, Albania or Macedonia, and slightly less corrupt
than Russia.
\_ Thank Allah. What Europe needs is more red-headed hookers.
\_ I couldn't tell you about eastern europeans. I'm pretty
sure gangs of them aren't taking over Swedish cities
though.
\_ Nobody's taking anything over. Arabs, Eastern
Europeans (lots of Russian, Polish and ex-Yugoslav),
Turks and some Central Asians and Africans control a lot
of the crime in European cities (from small time shit
to organized prostitution and drug smuggling.) Sweden,
France, Germany and the UK, among many, are just
starting to realize that the great social experiment,
and treating everyone with kid gloves, is not conducive
to having a civil society when you're dealing with
thugs. Not all non-Europeans are thugs, just a lot of
the illegal immigrants. So: should "Western" countries
stop immigration from places where people look funny?
No. Should they consistently hold everyone to certain
minimal standards of behavior? Definitely. Also note
that the article talks about "Arabs".
Searching for 'turk' yields 0 results. -John
http://jihadwatch.org/dhimmiwatch/archives/2004/09/003131print.html
\_ http://jihadwatch.org/spencer ???
Can you give me a good reason why I would want to listen
to a source as provocative as this?
\_ Well, if you're good at Swedish you could read the
articles he links to yourself. Bork! Bork! Bork!
\_ From the BBC's description of Aftonbladet:
"The biggest-selling paper not only in Sweden but
across the Nordic region, the Stockholm-based
tabloid Aftonbladet is one of only two truly
national titles. Described as an evening paper,
Aftonbladet appears on news stands in Stockholm at
around 0830 and follows the classic tabloid format,
with plenty of celebrity news, sport, sex and
crime. Part-owned by the Swedish trade unions,
Aftonbladet is described as "independent social
democrat".
In other words, it's the NY Post or Sun Daily of
Scandinavia. Nope, no sensationalism here.
\_ I can't tell if you are joking or not. Is there
something wrong with this guy that I am not seeing?
-- ilyas
\_ This gentleman has a particular, and might I add,
extreme, point of view which he purports to support
by quoting other extremist points of view. He then
defends his position by suggesting that the point of
his exercise is merely to inform people about the
extreme points of view. The implication, however, is
that the extremist POVs he reveals are in fact the
driving forces of an entire culture (which he lamely
tries to deny he's implying by saying "I am not doing
this" while he continues to do it with the other
hand). My point is that while it is good to know
that there are extremists out there, this fellow, in
trying to address the so-called soft press that has,
according to him, ignored the extremists, goes over-
board in his characterizations. This does not help
the debate.
\_ I don't understand what you are trying to say.
What is his extreme point of view? That militant
jihadists are bad? That's not extreme at all.
I think this guy's only fault is not being
'diplomatic' with his language. Can you show me
in particular in what way he is going overboard?
-- ilyas
\_ Did you read the sidebar on "Why Dhimmi Watch"
on the main page of this site?
"Spearheaded by dhimmi academics and self-
serving advocacy groups, that same attitude
of chastened subservience has entered into
Western academic study of Islam, and from
there into journalism, school textbooks, and
the popular discourse."
Apparently, anyone who doesn't view Islam with
deep fear and suspicion is a dhimmi tool of the
Islamic overlords.
\_ Given some things stated in the Qu'ran, I
think the burden of proof is on Islam, not
on the West. -- ilyas
\_ Maybe they are? Ever think of that?
\_ Sure. About the same time I thought that
Adam Weishaupt and the Bavarian
Illuminati wanted to corrupt my precious
bodily fluids.
\_ Oops! You got schooled by John!
\_ I think Europe is far more seriously
affected by muslim immigration than
the US, and there _are_ a lot of very
warped apologists for islamist b.s.
here who play either the racism or
the "you're a paranoid kook" card if
anyone disagrees with them. Why are
you doing the same? It's a serious
problem. Look up 'Finsbury park
mosque' for starters. -John
\_ What I would call extreme is a French girl
raped by 80 muslim men.... Don't hear
much about that do you?
\_ Lots of that in the European adult
comic books. Seems like that's what
the Europeans fantasize about.
\_ Hi! Why are you still taking up
our oxygen, twit?
\_ You stupid fuck. There is an
ongoing case in France where this
happened.
\_ Who is want to come TURKEY I can invitate
http://www.ikissyou.org/indeks2.html
\_ I don't think it makes any sense for Europe. It helps Turkey of
course, and certain business interests, and would help long term
political stability and so forth. But Turkey IMO is still has too
many problems and culturally doesn't seem ready for it. Even if some
eastern European countries like Romania may have a lot of problems,
they are already "there" from a cultural standpoint. It looks like
it will happen sooner or later anyway though. |
| 5/25 |
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| jihadwatch.org/spencer -> www.jihadwatch.org/spencer/ ROBERT SPENCER, the director of Jihad Watch, is a writer and researcher who has studied Islam for more than twenty years. He is the author of Onward Muslim Soldiers: How Jihad Still Threatens America and the West (Regnery) and Islam Unveiled: Disturbing Questions About the World's Fastest Growing Faith (Encounter). He is coauthor, with Daniel Ali, of Inside Islam: A Guide for Catholics (Ascension), and editor of the essay collection The Myth of Islamic Tolerance (forthcoming from Prometheus Books). Spencer (MA, Religious Studies, University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill) is an Adjunct Fellow with the Free Congress Foundation. He has written seven monographs on Islam that are available from the Foundation: An Introduction to the Qur'an; com, WorldNet Daily, Insight in the News, Human Events, National Review Online, and many other journals. He has discussed jihad, Islam, and terrorism on CNN, FoxNews, MSNBC, PBS, and C-Span, as well as on numerous radio programs including Michael Savage's Savage Nation, The G Gordon Liddy Show, the Michael Medved Show, The Michael Reagan Show, The Larry Elder Show, Vatican Radio, and many others. FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS Q: Why should I believe what you say about Islam? Pick up my books Onward Muslim Soldiers and Islam Unveiled, and you will see that both are made up largely of quotations from radical Muslims and the traditional Islamic sources to which they appeal to justify violence and terrorism. Since childhood I have had an interest in the Muslim world, from which my family comes, and when I met Muslim students in college I began studying the Qur'an in earnest. That led to in-depth forays into tafsir (interpretations of the Qur'an), hadith (traditions of the Prophet Muhammad), and much more about Islamic history, theology, and law. I think that its adamantine certainties appeal to many people who are disgusted with the current relativism and amorality of the Western world. Also there are many rich and grand aspects of Islamic history and culture which also make the religion attractive today. The global jihad against the West today also helps Islam gather converts in the West from among groups that feel themselves to be oppressed or marginalized. Conversions have been stimulated by successful, if often fanciful, Muslim efforts to present Islam as a religion free of the sins of the West -- particularly racial discrimination. Islam is not a monolith, and never have I said or written anything that characterizes all Muslims as terrorist or given to violence. I am only calling attention to the roots and goals of radical Islam. Any Muslim who renounces violent jihad and dhimmitude is welcome to join in our anti-jihadist efforts. Any hate in my books comes from radical Muslims whom I quote, not from me. Cries of "hatred" and "bigotry" are effectively used by American Muslim advocacy groups to try to stifle the debate about the terrorist threat. I am trying to point out the depth and extent of the hatred that is directed against the United States, because I believe that the efforts to downplay its depth and extent leave us less equipped to defend ourselves. any Muslim who renounces the ideologies of jihad and dhimmitude is most welcome to join forces with us. Anyone who targets innocent Muslims in the USA is not only evil, but is playing into the hands of the radical Muslims who are trying to fan the flames of anti-American hatred. Also, one of the reasons why the war on terror is so important is that those who would destroy Western civilization do not believe in the principles of due process and justice that are central elements of the American system. Q: Are you deliberately ignoring more liberal schools of thought in Islam? I encourage any Muslim individual or group who is willing to work publicly for the reform of the Islamic doctrines, theological tenets and laws that Islamic radicals use to justify violence. But not all self-proclaimed moderates are truly moderate: many deny that these elements of Islam exist at all hardly a promising platform for reform. It is important to make proper distinctions and speak honestly about the roots of the terrorist threat. A: Many things, but what we must do above all is remain true to our principles of freedom and equality of rights and dignity for all. These ideas and related ones are what set us apart from global jihadists. If we discard them in order to fight the jihadists, we risk erasing the distinction between the two camps. A: Jihad ideology is a threat to the peace and human rights of non-Muslims as well as Muslims worldwide. |
| www.ikissyou.org/indeks2.html jpg (21777 bytes) I like music , I have many many music enstrumans my home I can play I like sport , swiming , basketball , tenis , volayball , walk ......... jpg (43163 bytes) I like sex I like travel I go 3-4 country every year I went , Germany , Nederland , Belgium , Austria , Denmark , Sweden , Hungary Moldovia , Ukraina , Bulgaria , Romania , Macedonia , Azerbaijan , Georrgia , Iran ..... jpg (33602 bytes) My profession jurnalist , music and sport teacher , I make psycolojy doctora I like to take foto-camera (amimals , towns , nice nude models and peoples)..... jpg (25580 bytes) My tall 184 cm (62 feet) My weight 78 kg. jpg (38269 bytes) I like to be friendship from different country .. I speake turkish , english , rusian , I want to learn other language ! |
| jihadwatch.org/dhimmiwatch/archives/2004/09/003131print.html Print this Entry September 09, 2004 Muslims rule major Swedish city An exclusive series of translations from the Swedish press, made for Jihad Watch by Ali Dashti, who writes: Sweden is one of the worst hit countries in Europe of Muslim immigration and Political Correctness. Now, the police themselves have publicly admitted that they no longer control one of Sweden's major cities. I have made some exclusive translations from Swedish media. They show the future of Eurabia unless Europeans wake up. Once-peaceful Sweden, home of ABBA, IKEA and the Nobel Prize, is increasingly looking like the Middle East on a bad day. The police now publicly admit what many Scandinavians have known for a long time: They no longer control the situation in the nations's third largest city. It is effectively ruled by violent gangs of Muslim immigrants. Some of the Muslims have lived in the area of Rosengrd, Malm, for twenty years, and still don't know how to read or write Swedish. Ambulance personnel are attacked by stones or weapons, and refuse to help anybody in the area without police escort. The immigrants also spit at them when they come to help. Recently, an Albanian youth was stabbed by an Arab, and was left bleeding to death on the ground while the ambulance waited for the police to arrive. The police themselves hesitate to enter parts of their own city unless they have several patrols, and need to have guards to watch their cars, otherwise they will be vandalized. "Something drastic has to be done, or much more blood will be spilled" says one of the locals. article=10092861 The number of people emigrating from the city of Malm is reaching record levels. Swedes, who a couple of decades ago decided to open the doors to Muslim "refugees" and asylum seekers, are now turned into refugees in their own country and forced to flee their homes. The people abandoning the city mention crime and fear of the safety of their children as the main reason for leaving. article=10090830 ALL of the 600 windows at one of the schools in Malm have been broken during the summer holiday. Window smashing alone costs the city millions every year. City buses have been forced to avoid the immigrant ghetto, as they are met with youths throwing rocks or bottles at them if they enter. Earlier this year, a boy of Afghan origin had made plans to blow up his own school. article=10093267 People working at the emergency ward at the major hospital in Malm receive threats every day, and are starting to get used to it. They have discussed having metal detectors at the emergency entrance, but some fear this could be seen as a provocation. article=10093495 Lisa Nilsson has lived in Manhatten, New York City, for 25 years. After moving back to Malm, Sweden, she now misses the safety of New York. She never walks anywhere in Malm after dark, but takes a taxi everywhere she goes. a=180423 Rapes in Sweden as a whole have increased by 17% just since the beginning of 2003, and have had a dramatic increase during the past decade. Gang rapes, usually involving Muslim immigrant males and native Swedish girls, have become commonplace. Two weeks ago, 5 Kurds brutally raped a 13-year-old Swedish girl. html 22-year-old Swedish woman going out for fresh air gang raped by three strange men. Ali Dashti comments: "Stories like this are in Swedish newspapers every week. Swedish media usually take great care not to mention the ethnic background of the perpetrators, but you can usually read it between the lines." One more: how have Swedish politicians reacted to the chaos caused in one of their major cities because of Muslims of whom even the police seem to be afraid? html Sweden's politicians view arranged marriages as a positive tradition: a cultural pattern that immigrants should be allowed to preserve even in Sweden. The Swedish government feels that interfering in arranged marriages is an encroachment upon private life. In addition, immigrant couples can apply for family reunification in Sweden even if they've never seen each other before - as long as the marriage is entered in a culture with a tradition of parents arranging marriages on behalf of their children. A 2002 study by Vxj University economics professor Jan Ekberg found that immigration cost Swedish taxpayers DKK 33 billion that year, compared to just DKK 10 billion in Denmark. And while one might assume that the rise in costs would result in knee-jerk opposition to immigration, just the opposite has happened in Sweden. A Swedish government commission has proposed abolishing the so-called seriousness requirement. |