Berkeley CSUA MOTD:Entry 32711
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2025/05/24 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
5/24    

2004/8/5 [Politics/Domestic/Election] UID:32711 Activity:very high
8/5     For the person who brought up Kerry's meeting with Madame Binh:
        What are we supposed to glean from this one time meeting?  Or
        from his meeting with Ortega (out of which sprung the investigations
        into Iran-Contra)?  That he's a traitor by association?  The same
        argument can be applied to nearly everyone in the current administ-
        ration.  Cheney for his company's dealings in countries with standing
        sanctions, Rumsfeld for his handshakes and arms sales to Saddam after
        him gassing his own people, and yes that picture of Bush holding
        hands with bin aziz.  The difference in my eyes: Kerry was trying
        to open a dialog to end a conflict that we couldn't afford, even if
        he may have been very naive in the manner.  It's 30 years later.  I'd
        like to think his goal is still the same but his execution has been
        seasoned by experience. -scotsman
        \_ You are imagining reasoned dialogue with people who still think they
           are fighting communism and/or that the Vietnam war wasn't a bad
           idea. -- ulysses
           \_ The fight against communism isn't over yet. The great dragon
              and the fine cigar remain.
              \_ you forgot the old ginseng and the yummy pho
              \_ and I see the fight against communism in Yemen and Afghanistan
                 turned out *REALLY* well.  Why don't you continue your policy
                 of supporting Islamic Fundamentalist?
           \_ Don't be an idiot.  I've never met anyone who thought
              Vietnam was a good idea.  The amazing thing about Vietnam
              was that _everything_ was done wrong.  The other thing I
              always find amazing, is that every wrong thing was done by
              "liberals," and yet conservitives are always blamed.  Wierd.
              Just because getting in the war was a bad idea, doesn't
              mean that wasting thousands of lives and allowing South
              Vietnam to fall were GOOD ideas.
              \_ South Vietnam government were puppet government set up by
                 French / American.  North Vietnamese government were
                 underground organization who fought French and Japanese
                 occupation years before S. Vietnam was created.  S. Viet
                 never had a chance.
              \_ You need to write a book:
                 "Vietnam:  The Liberal Failure - The Republican Scapegoat"
                 \_ the beauty of this idea is that if you put Kerry's picture
                    on the cover, you can have it ghost written by a total
                    hack, and still make millions of dollars.  good idea.
           \_ Well S. Vietnam was free for over a year until N. Vietnam
              invaded.  Do you think S. Koreans would say their was a
              good idea?
              \_ actually, they probably would, i don't know why but
                 a lot of south koreans believe the propaganda and somehow
                 think the presence of US troops is keeping them
                 from peacefully reuniting with their n. korean
                 brothers.  they might be right, except for the
                 peaceful part.
                 \_ that is very true.  American want a base in Pacific
                    Rim.  If Koreas are united, there will be no reason
                    for having a US military base there.  For that reason
                    alone, USA will do everything to prevent Koreas to be
                    united.
              \_ "their?"
                    \_ Ha!  Where'd you get this load of BS?  The
                       communist World Weekly?  Not to mention, even if
                       the Koreas did reunite, there would still be reason
                       to have army bases there.  Every here of a friendly
                       little country call China?
                       \_ Where the hell do you think chicom troll is from?
                \_ I don't think n. korea is as benevolent and fun
                   as some s. koreans believe.
                \_ It's basically the same as similar movements we get
                   over here.  The college students with a poor knowledge
                   of history and poor critical thinking skills descide
                   that NK is run by friendly teddy bears. Korea is very
                   nationalist, and they'd like to be re-unitied.  This
                   leads to the usual set of wackiness by certain groups.

                    -jrleek
        \_ I posted it, and if you can't distinguish between what Kerry
           did and those other acts I think your judgement is lacking.
           There is difference between meeting an
           enemy or official in a public capacity and assiduoulsy
           advocating his position.  Kerry is repeatedly guilty of the
           latter.
           As for Kerry's Vietnam activities, his contemporaries vets are
           much more articulate than I:
           http://ice.he.net/~freepnet/kerry/index.php?topic=Letters
           Lastly, have you bothered to learn what actions these groups
           are most upset about?
           Doesn't it bother you Kerry published a book mocking Iwo Jima
           with anti-war figures and upside down flag?
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ice.he.net/~freepnet/kerry/index.php?topic=Letters
Upper Senate Park, Washington, DC Media Appearances Wednesday, August 4 at 12:20 pm Eastern: Professor Henry Mark Holzer will appear on the G Gordon Liddy show (national talk radio). Thursday, August 5 at 4:00 pm Eastern: Scott Swett will appear on the Sean Hannity Show (talk radio, Fox News, national). Friday, August 6 at 8:35 am Eastern: Scott Swett will appear on WCBN (talk radio, Baltimore, Maryland). We'll be publishing "letters to the editor" as they come in, with our responses. com is also searching for primary documents, films, photographs and reports related to the portion of the anti-war movement that centered around the Winter Soldier Investigation. I want you to know that I was Commander US Coast Guard Division 13 out of Cat Lo Vietnam from May 1969 through April 1970. My Division of 82' Patrol vessels worked independently and also alongside Swift Boat Division 13. We had a friendly rivalry in combat and on the volleyball court. I personally led Operation Sea Lords missions which combined both of these vessels. I never once heard of any of the atrocities that this "gentleman" Kerry has referred to. The young men of both the Navy Swift command and the Coast Guard command served bravely and honorably. Some of them had their own misgivings about this particular war but NEVER let that interfere with their duty. Finally, 4 months on a Swift boat with however much time off for those "serious wounds" and whatever maintenance was required gave Kerry just a slight taste of what most of the Swift boat (and Coast Guard crews) went through for many more months. Kerry is not only unfit for command, he should not even be in the Senate. Commander Duane P Gatto USCG (Ret) Thanks very much for writing. Your experience matches that of just about everyone who served in Operation Sea Lords -- with a single exception. Considering all the filming Kerry did in Vietnam, you'd think he would have managed to capture an atrocity or two to support his claims. In your information on this site I found information that said only 2 are supporting him. I don't recall all of their names, and more importantly how many of the Veterans that he was side by side with were not in the line up? I think if you could clarify this this would be important for people researching his record. They made it appear he had the support of all his Swift Boat mates' support. com: 1 If most of Kerry's fellow Swift veterans don't support him, then who were all those guys with him at the Democratic Convention? They made it appear that Kerry has the complete support of his "Band of Brothers" from Vietnam. John Kerry has been able to convince about 13 men who served on Swift boats in the Mekong Delta to support him, 7 or 8 of whom were at various times crew members on his own 6-man boat. Those are the men the Kerry campaign so prominently featured at the Democratic Convention. com shows Kerry with 19 of his fellow Swift boat OICs (Officers In Charge) in Coastal Division 11. Only one of his 23 fellow OICs from Coastal Division 11 supports John Kerry. Overall, more than 250 Swift boat veterans are on the record questioning Kerry's fitness to serve as Commander-in-Chief. That list includes his entire chain of command -- every single officer Kerry served under in Vietnam. The Kerry game plan is to ignore all this and pretend that the 13 veterans his campaign jets around the country and puts up in 5-star hotels really represent the truth about his short, controversial combat tour. The Swift boats fought in groups, so the other OICs who fought alongside Kerry know him well and can accurately describe what he did and did not do. In many cases Kerry's fellow OICs had a better perspective than his own crew members, since the latter had no way to determine whether he was following orders and how well he worked with his peers. I am a Vietnam Vet, not anyone important, just a dig-in-the-mud-grunt from the 82nd Airborne, in-country from 1968 until 1970. Please allow me to make the following observation: A lot of very fine young men fought in that war, many died, and many more suffered damages they will carry with them for the rest of their lives. The one thing we all learned in that hell-hole was loyalty to each other... a kind of faith deep inside that said "I've got your back, and I know you have mine". In 1992 we elected a president who admitted to actively protesting, both here and overseas, against our military while these fine men were fighting and dying. Now, seeing that his fellow soldier-basher was able to get elected, we have a new protester who thinks he should be Commander-in-Chief. All I can say is: Mr Kerry when I thought you had my back, you put a knife in it. I think the Senator from Mass would make an excellent Ambassador to Vietnam, they could talk about old friends. Mike Garrow 1SG (Ret), US Army While "Ambassador Kerry" has a ring to it, we'd prefer someone who would represent our own interests. I then spent a total of almost ten years in Southeast Asia as a Marine pilot and as a pilot with Air America in Laos, Cambodia and at the end in Vietnam. My daughter, one of two little Vietnamese girls I adopted, served as a Captain with the 3rd ID last year during the taking of Baghdad. The reason I am writing is that I checked out a Naval officer I knew way back during my college days. His name was Dale Myerkord and I worked for his dad, who was a friend of my dad's. I knew that Dale was the first Naval officer killed in Vietnam but didn't know that he had received the Navy Cross and had a ship named after him! Louis and talked with the Principal of his high school (who ironically enough was a classmate of mine at another high school in St. My retired group in Sarasota, Marines and Air America, who see through the "medal" game, and of course are strongly opposed to the BSer... I also was instructing Iranian pilots, after the fall of Saigon, in Isfahan, Iran and observed the early problem, there, with the Shia clerics and unfortunately, think we have a long road ahead of us. If we declare war against the French, my Marine buddies -- we are all going back in -- could use some tough sailors with us... Ron Werthman Well, we hope our difficulties with France will remain on this side of open warfare. Dear Sgt Kessler: As a radio commentator in the 1970s at radio station WQRC-FM, I was among the few East Coast journalists who defended our Vietnam Vets, inviting them to appear on my program and broadcasting many editorial comments in support of them on my 10-minute daily commentary, "The Broadhurst Reports". My defense of Vietnam Vets earned me the VFW Massachusetts Department award for outstanding service to veterans. I had the privilege of meeting some of the Vietnam Veterans for a Just Peace when the anti-war left and Vietnam Veterans Against the War staged a propaganda play geared to discredit our men and women who served in 'Nam with distinction and heroism. I never got over the bullshit line that "we lost the war" when in fact we were winning and turned the combat over to the Republic of Vietnam forces who were doing a good job before the anti-war movement forced our precipitous withdrawal. The lead spokesman for your side was a blind Army Captain (I've forgotten his name) and his companion who made mincemeat of the scraggly band of anti-war vets who were too embarrassed to even look at the Captain, who had been blinded by a grenade or booby trap set by the North Vietnam regulars who had taken over combat from the defeated and decimated Viet Cong. These protesters left all the talking to a virulent anti-war minister by the name of Waters who ran the playhouse. The private response was overwhelmingly positive for our side. But the anti-war propagandists were so hateful and vicious that those who supported our troops were reluctant to speak out for fear of reprisals. Some who did had their businesses and homes picketed by the ragtag bobtail nitwits who seemed to be working for Hanoi. I have always questioned John Kerry's motives in becoming so active against his comrades in arms. As one who has covered Massachusetts politics in print and broadcast, I have recognized in Kerry the suprem...