5/26 I don't understand why people are opposed to raising taxes for
people who have more children. It is a fundamental question of
fairness. For example, primary and secondary education is funded
mostly by property taxes at the county and city level. Two couples
buy similary priced house and pay roughly the same amt of property tax.
One couple has 1 kid and another couple has 3 kids. The couple with
3 kids is using up more tax payer resources so why shouldn't they
pay more. We can't easily restructure the property tax system. And
everybody should chip in to make public education work regardless of
whether you have kids. But the people whoe use it more should pay
more.
\_ keeping kids in school lowers crime rates. Think about it as
social insurance. If you want to pay less in taxes for schools,
live in a low property value area. You get the idea.
\_ public education is a service to everyone. a better educated
populace (should) translate to a better and more productive
\_ because everyone who isn't a single male sysadmin making 6 figures
is a degenerate freeloader who should pay for their own damn
social services. haven't you been paying attention? are you
a commie?
\_ You can't argue about taxes like this. You need to state your
moral philosophy, including what you believe the inherent human
rights are. After you do this, the tax system will naturally
follow. Without doing this, you are just chewing the fat endlessly.
workforce. The benefit is not only to the family with kids.
So, we have decided (however reluctantly and increasingly
underfunded) to provide a publicly funded education system.
\_ What if you look at it this way: every kid is a future tax
resource. Each kid is likely to pay for his own education
in his life via taxes he pays. So why stick it to his parents,
who're kindly providing this future tax resource at great
expense already?
\_ because everyone who isn't a single male sysadmin making 6
figures is a degenerate freeloader who should pay for their
own damn social services. haven't you been paying attention?
are you a commie?
\_ what is wrong with Commie?
\_ maybe you missed the part where the Berlin Wall fell?
\_ Perhaps you forgotten your "facts" after
leaving Berkeley. The fall of the berlin
wall was a due to the uncontrollable
destructive, oppressive, exploitive,
racist, profiteering, non-collectivist,
anti-abortion, anti-worker, earth
and woman raping, genocide commiting,
firearms bearing, suv driving, slave
owing, gay-murdering, witch-hunting,
arab hating tendencies of theistic
judaea-christian greco-roman anglo-saxon
indo-european materialistic capitalist
millionare fat-cat pig dog vultures.
\_ After I left Berkeley I was free to express the
truth without fear of some club bearing, man
hating, unshowered butch lesbian trying to beat
me to death. Free at last! Free at last! Thank
God Almighty, I'm free at last!
\_ Perhaps you forgotten your "facts" after leaving
Berkeley. The fall of the berlin wall was a due to the
\_ I agree. uncontrolled capitalism of
the late 19th century causes the rise
of commies. the kindler, gentler
version advocated by liberuls
resulted in the fall of the commies.
\_ Oh you poor oppressed upper middle class
white men!
uncontrollable destructive, oppressive, exploitive,
racist, profiteering, non-collectivist, anti-abortion,
anti-worker, earth and woman raping, genocide commiting,
firearms bearing, suv driving, slave owing,
gay-murdering, witch-hunting, arab hating tendencies of
theistic judaea-christian greco-roman anglo-saxon
indo-european materialistic capitalist millionare fat-cat
pig dog vultures.
\_ After I left Berkeley I was free to express the truth
without fear of some club bearing, man hating,
unshowered butch lesbian trying to beat me to death.
Free at last! Free at last! Thank God Almighty, I'm
free at last!
\_ you forgot the part about 'goat sodomizing
baby-murdering, gluttonous'
\_ I agree. uncontrolled capitalism of the late 19th
century causes the rise of commies. the kindler,
gentler version advocated by liberuls resulted in the
fall of the commies.
the children!", "family values" issue.
\_ Oh you poor oppressed upper middle class white men!
\_ Who here is upper middle class?
\_ Indeed. Growing up, my folks' income was marginal poverty
level. I got through Cal on merit- and need-based scholarships,
loans and work. In 2000 I paid of the last of my student
loans and cashed in stock options--and paid more in taxes than
my parents annual income the year I started Cal. (Oh, and I'm
still in CA forking money over in state taxes, so I believe the
investment has paid off.)
\_ Are you voting Republican yet?
\_ If he's smart, he is.
\_ Yes--I have been since I was 18.
\_ I never paid enough tax for myself in CA before I had to
leave in order to get a job. Damned economy. I liked CA.
\_ CA just got a few billion in bailout (2.x billion?) from the
latest budget plan. Everyone in the US subsidized CA this
year.
\_ Only fair since CA pays more in taxes than it gets
back almost every year.
\_ Too late for me. I had to leave CA a year ago. And
$2G is a drop in the bucket of CA's problem. Further,
it won't help anyone get a job, it'll just help keep
the CA gov't going.
\_ they have that. it's called one-child policy in China. while
nothing wrong with tax policies to encourage certain birthrate
pattern, I don't like the way you talked about "fairness"
in tax policies. The tax policies is never fair for anyone.
\_ there's no such thing as a "fair" tax policy. even a flat tax
will hurt lower income people more than higher income people. it
is time for you to understand that life just isn't fair. once you
fully absorb this concept, you'll find the rest of your life is
much more enjoyable. sometimes you gotta break an egg to etc etc.
I've got no kids, I'm married and plan to not have kids and don't
have a problem with the current system.
\_ "fairness" is an important criterion for designing and evaluating
a tax system, however it is not the only criterion. I tend to
agree with you that there is too much tax benefits for breeding
like pigs (dependant, child tax credit, etc., etc.). However,
you are going to be very lonely on this cause it's a "think about
the children!", "family values" issue. both the democrats and
the republicans are suckers for these.
\_ No, actually it's about spending money on them now so they don't
break into my home later. Prisons are expensive.
\_ do it with progressive tax which doesn't encourage breeding
as much as child tax crdit. or give child tax credit to
the first two kids only. if you can't educate your kids
well, stop breeding, or at least, don't expect me to
subsidize your breeding.
\_ Right -- it's much better to subsidize a larger police
force and much more extensive and overcrowded jails after
those kids break into your home and rape your wife when
they become adults.
\_ education hasn't worked. The current system already
subsidizes the poor. How has that worked out? Kids are
still dropping out. Throwing money at the problem
hasn't done anything. Washington DC has the highest
tax burden of any region. It still has one of the
highest murder rates in the country. Taking away these
subsidies and steralizing people on welfare will get
rid of the problem once and for all. No bad kids, no
problem. Also sterlizing illegal immigrants arrested
in the U.S. Just to cover all the bases.
\_ Actually, all tax laws in CA are hard to change. You need the
magic 2/3+1 supermajority to pass tax laws. Perhaps you're thinking
of charging a "fee" for use of public education? Think about how
hard that is for the UC and CSU system and multiply it by 10.
\_ Not hard at all. Didn't they just raise UC rates by $500 or
more? I also read summer students got hit with a bonux $150
charge only a few days before summer classes started. -alum
\_ No you don't. They changed the law, or didn't you hear to only
require 55%.
\_ A judge can change the law whenever he feels like it. It used to
be the case that local property taxes went to local schools.
Judicial fiat changed that. |
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