10/11   On why condos are a bad deal:
        1) you have high HOA rates
        2) value does not rise with rest of housing market thus putting you
           even further behind the curve if you want a house some day
        3) politics.  you have to deal with the condo board which consists of
           your neighbors.  the people most likely to run for board positions
           are typically those least capable of managing anything.
        4) #3 leads to the board not spending money wisely so when you roof
           falls in you have to beg the board who are typically *not* your
           personal friends to repair it.  repairing it will require an extra
           HOA fee because they spent out the budget on things like flowers or
           repairing *their* roof last year while there was still money.  you
           are *required* legally to pay whatever they say into the hoa fund.
           you can't sell and walk away because they'll put a lien on your
           unit which must be cleared before you can sell.
        5) there are probably other but #2, #3, #4 are killers.
        \_ There have been a few articles lately asserting that at this time,
           and particularly in our region, condos have been appreciating better
           than homes, though it could be skewed by being on the lower end
           and all the other issues are still deal stoppers for me.
           \_ if by "our region," you mean the Bay Area, your region
              is totally fucked.
        \_ #3 does it for me.  why not just rent, if you're going to have
           some nosey fucks telling you how to live anyway?
        \_ Tangentially related: in the past two years, a law was passed making
           it really easy to sue the condo builder. You can attend seminars on
           how to sue the contractor. Insurance rates for developers building
           condos have risen a few thousand dollars to 100k+. So if you're a
           bastard, buying a condo might make smart financial sense.
           \_ urlP?
           \_ you *really* don't want to get into a lawsuit over anything. why
              get into a long term situation where your only recourse is a
              lawsuit?  madness.
        \_ #2 is ridiculous. If this were true, condos would get cheaper and
           cheaper in comparison to homes. This has not happened.
           \_ Yeah, according to that theory, a crack house in Gardena or
              Hawthorne would be more expensive than a nice condo in Redondo.
           \_ Hmm, that sounds really familiar. -crebbs
           \_ Shrug.  Do your own math and bet your own money on it.  I don't
              care.  You're a motd poster, you must be right.
              \_ Condos are appreciating faster than homes:
                 http://csua.org/u/3e6
                 But don't let mere facts get in the way of your prejudices.
                 \_ Wow, that means my best investment is a condo because we
                    know it'll eventually surpass the value of a house! Cool!
                    One year's worth of statistics during a recession is a
                    great way to determine your best housing buy!  Thanks!
                    \_ What it probably means it that sometimes condos
                       appreciate faster than homes, sometimes it is the
                       other way around. Are you really that dense?
                       \_ What it probably means is you didn't read the link.
                          If you read the whole article you'd see condos are
                          still a high-risk (ie: shitty) investment.  It's
                          *your* money.  Piss it away any way you'd like.  Life
                          does not have a save/restore feature.  Good luck!
                       \_ Bay Area is an extreme case, and is likely to
                          get more extreme in the future.  Condos doubling
                          or tripling in price within a few years is a
                          phenomenon that has happened in many cities in
                          the world before.
        \_ #2 is only true where there is ample land.  Your condo in
           Manhattan, San Francisco, or lake front Chicago appreciates just
           fine.
           \_ You can't afford a condo in places like that.  If you could you
              could easily but a house in a normal place for cash.  Your point
              is meaningless in this context.
              \_ Just illustrating a point.  There is a continuum of places
                 from the Nevada Desert to San Francisco.
                 \_ Yes and some people buy branded water for their dog, too.
                    I don't.  I doubt you do either.  There's no point in
                    bringing up the extreme cases.  Stat 2.
              \_ Not really, because my choice is either a condo in San
                 Francisco or a house in Union City or Vacaville.
        \_ The choice is not between house and condo, the choice is between
           rent now and buy house in some distant future, or stop renting and
           buy condo now.
           \_ And get stuck in condo... forever.
           \_ Or rent now and still can't afford a house in some distant
              future.
        \_ So what is the deal with houses in planned neighborhoods that have
           HOA dues?  Are those just as bad?
           \_ No.  I pay $65/month to cover basic front yard gardening and
              other trivia.  They have nothing to do with my roof getting
              repaired or not.
        \_ So some people are whining that #2 is invalid.  No one has yet to
           explain why condos are still a good idea given #1,#3 and #4.  Even
           if I grant #2 is invalid (which I don't but go with me here), the
           others should be enough to make any sane person run screaming into
           the night.  When I rent, the apartment is a throw-away.  When it
           gets dirty (about the time the lease ends), I just move to a new
           one.  With a house, I own it, so I'm damned well going to take care
           of it.  With a condo, I get the worst of both worlds.  I don't own
           all of it but have other people forcing me to spend my money in
           stupid ways.  It's insane.  I'd rather rent and not get into a
           deeply financially risky situation I have limited control over.