7/15    Which format, .MP3 or .WAV, usually produces smaller files for the
        same song and same reproduction quality?  And by how much?  Thanks.
        --- yuen
        \_ MP3 is a lossy compression algorithm.  Quality varies widely
           based on encoder used and bit rate you encode at.  Many folks
           feel that encoding with LAME at 256 bits CBR is virtually
           indistinguishable from originals.  If you want to save more
           space, you can use VBR, though, from my understanding, LAME is
           the only encoder that does decent VBR.  See
           http://www.r3mix.net for details.
           WAV is not lossy, but file size ranges from 2-10 times that of
           MP3s.  Understand that when making MP3s, you record WAVs first
           then compress to MP3. -dans
           \_ I see.  I thought MP3 is lossless too.  Thx.  --- yuen
           \_ Anyone try OBB Vorbis? Quality comparable? Winamp now
              supports it.
        \_ you tried variable bit rate encoding?  shrinks my mp3s it does.
                \_ from those crazy open source communists?  there could be
                   viruses in it!  and wtf does "ogg vorbis" mean anyway?  BTW,
                   I saw some numbers today on total # of cd's sold in this
                   country over the last few years.  In 98/99 when the net was
                   the new cool thing everyone was doing, cd sales dropped like
                   a rock and stayed there.  Must be Nsync or Britney.
                                     \_ Maybe if they made music that didn't
                                        suck, people would buy it.
                   \_ Maybe if they made music that didn't suck, people would
                      buy it. [formatd]
                      \_ If it sucks so much why are they downloading it?  Why
                         did they buy it before the net was a big deal in 98?
                         Standard nonsense from a music thief.
                   \_ Ogg comes from netrek, obviously, and Vorbis is a
                      Terry Pratchett character.
                 quality, encode to MP3 using lame at CBR 256 bits or VBR with
                 the r3mix settings. -dans
                   \_ DOOSH DOOSH!
                   \_ Learn to format your posts.
                      \_ it was formatted.  whats yer problem?
              \_ Ogg Vorbis is better at lower sampling rates (128 bits or
                 less), but mp3 is still much better quality at high sampling
                 rates.  So if you want the best tradeoff between size and
                 quality, encode to MP3 using lame at CBR 256 bits or VBR
                 with the r3mix settings. -dans
                 with --alt-preset?
           \_ .WAV files usually are uncompressed, but they don't have to be.
              .WAV is a container format and can use any of a number of audio
              codecs, such as PCM (uncompressed), ADPCM, and--yes--even MP3.
              Comparing .WAV to MP3 is an apples-to-oranges comparison.  Also,
              a lot of people think that the r3mix guy is full of himself,
                 \_ re-ripping with recent lame versions (compared to
                    the one from a couple years ago) makes a big difference
                    even if you stick with the basic presets or custom
                    settings.  but i got a usb/toslink adapter recently
                    and was amazed how crappy my notebook sound card was
                    in comparison... much worse than mp3 artifacts.
              and as of LAME 3.90, --alt-preset standard generally is
              recommended over --r3mix. --jameslin
              \_ d'oh! now I have to re-rip all of my cd's again and encode
                 With --alt-preset?
                 \_ no one's forcing you to.  if you can hear the difference
                    and if it matters that much to you, then go ahead.