3/6     Recently it seems that a lot of wackos (e.g. Pat Robertson)
        have been bashing Muslims as violent extremists while other
        people defend Islam as a peace-loving religion.  Obviously
        I don't agree with Pat Robertson, but if Islam is a peace
        loving religion where does the idea of "holy war" come from?
        Do only some sects believe in "holy war" or is it part of the
        mainstream Islamic beliefs and if so how can Islam be
        peace loving?  Thanks
        \_ You've answered your own question.  I suggest you take your
           personl dislike of PR out of the equation and ask yourself the
           personal dislike of PR out of the equation and ask yourself the
           same questions you ask the motd.  The answer is self evident.
        \_ There are many interpretations of the Koran.  There are
           extremists for any religion; it all depends on how one
           was the Crusade.
                   \_ Crusades. There were a few.
           interprets it.  "Holy War" is hardly unique to Islam.  There
           was [sic. were] the Crusade.
                   \_ Crusades. There were six (plus some other forays).
                   \_ weren't the Crusades a response to the "JIHADS" and
                    bloody conquering all the followers of Mohammed did?
                      \_ Not really. The Crusaders were conquering the people
                         of the Near East and Middle East to "reclaim" the
                         Holy Land for the RCC. Muslims happen to be living
                         on that land. Gold, treasure, goods, and glory.
                         \_ duh, they had to reclaim it because the muslims
                          attacked and conquered the jewish settlements due to
                          mohammeds teaching and their their koran. It's okay
                         to claim with violence but not okay to take it back with
                         war? i don't understand.
                        \_ they conquered all the up to Spain with violent wars.
                        and killed those who wouldn't convert, this was before
                          the crusades by muslims.
        \_ jihad ("holy war") means a war against the ones primal nature.
           To wage a successful jihad one must turn ones aggressive
           nature inward and destroy the ego. The militants have grossly
           misinterpreted it. If you want a more indepth understanding
           Joseph Campbell has written and spoken about this.
           \_ Whether they misinterpreted it or not, they're now living it
              and have been killing innocent people in it's name for a few
              decades in modern times and earlier if you want to mix n match
              historical periods.  Murder by any other name is still murder.
              Do you think Joseph Campbell would like to go to Afghanistan,
              Saudi Arabia, Iraq, Iran, Syria, Libya, Egypt, etc, and explain
              to them they've got it all wrong?  I'm sure they'd just slap
              their heads like in a V8 commercial and change over night.
           \_ Thanks, I'll look around for that on the web.  Would you
              happen to have a URL?
              \_ You can get started at the Joseph Campbell foundation:
                 http://www.jcf.org/about_jcf.php
           \_ So is killing others via holy war discussed in the Koran?
              The New Testament doesn't explictly advocate killing one's
              enemies (although the Old Testament does).  Basically I'm
              wondering if Islam is like Christianity where the
              "official" dogma is non-violent but practioners are violent
              or like Judaism where the "official" dogma is explictly
              violent.
              \_ The main problem of "dogma" is that it is often based
                 on a literal interpretatation of religious texts. Since
                 most of these texts were written metaphorically, such
                 an interpretation gets you lots of problems.
                 For example, think about the phrase "kill your enemies."
                 Who are your "enemies"? How do you know they are outside
                 of yourself and not inside? Think about that. Read
                 Campbell, he explains it like no other westerner I've
                 ever met.
              \_ This is incredibly blatant anti-semitism, and the
                 precise opposite of the truth.  Everything in the old
                 testament is included in the Christian Bible (barring
                 slight mistranslations) but the unmediated (<-key word;
                 Judaism explicitly forbids Jews to engage in the
                 literal, unmediated interpretation mentioned in the
                 previous response) Old Testament does not represent
                 "Jewish Dogma" in any way.  Jewish law is composed of
                 3000 years' interpretation and reinterpretation: the
                 Mishna, Talmud, Shulkhan Arukh, etc.  Jewish "official
                 dogma" is extremely complex (the Talmud alone fills an
                 entire bookcase, but great rabbis memorize it) and
                 pragmatic, and applies in a rational way to everyday
                 life; the closest it comes to being "explicitly
                 violent" is to say that a person in the act of murder
                 may be killed to prevent the murder.  Since I don't
                 watch the motd constantly, I probably won't have an
                 opportunity to reply to further nonsense on this
                 subject, but ... there's a reason there has never been
                 a Jewish "Holy War," barring Bible stories.
                 \_ What the hell are you thinking?  The motd is the perfect
                    place for lies, misinterpretation and blatant
                    anti-semitism.  How dare you bring coherent fact to the
                    motd and crush all debate?
        \_ What a stupid question!  Go read freerepublic since you're really
           only interested in one answer.  You might as well ask, "How can
           Christians really believe in the 10 commandments when they bomb
           abortion clinics?"
        \_ "Kill them all. God will recognize his own."
                           \_ I believe that its "God will sort the dead".
                              \_ Translation varies.
           \_ wasn't that a Metallica Album?