Berkeley CSUA MOTD:Entry 22432
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2025/04/03 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
4/3     

2001/9/13 [Politics/Domestic/911, Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Israel] UID:22432 Activity:moderate
9/14    Some of us are anti-NSA people.  But now that this has happened,
        have we changed our views about the role of NSA?
        http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/news/archive/2001/09/13/national0614EDT0518.DTL
        \_ I'm not one of the heavily anti-NSA folks, but I might be after
           this. Why should we expand the powers of an agency that was
           apparently taken completely by surprise by this? I would
           suggest that perhaps the current set of agencies with their
           WWII-era agendas should be replaced with a new agency with
           a contemporary understanding of what to pay attention to.
           \_ Same to CIA.
           \_ silly sodans, who do you think would staff this "new" agency?
             \_ I volunteer you, to start with. Only some pinko
                commie would fail to rise to the challenge in our hour
                of need.
                \_ I volunteer to arrest anyone who uses the words
                   "pinko commie" in a non-ironic sort of way.
                   \_ Relax, I was just trying to make a point about how
                      federal agencies end up the way they do. I do
                      a lot of public sector related work. Good people
                      like, perhaps, yourself, stay away because they
                      mistrust the agencies. Granted my work is mainly
                      with more mundane outfits like the Bureau of Indian
                      Affairs or the Dept of Justice --ulysses
                      \_ article says that the gov't lost top talent to
                         the dot com's and other place.  The gov't doesn't
                         pay that much.
                         \_ The pay issue is real, but the larger problem
                            that I see that is my friends on the left and
                            and the right disagree on everything except
                            their disdain for the gov't and anybody who
                            works for the gov't. Travesties like this will
                            re-occur until something is done to
                            re-establish some sense of respect for working
                            for the gov't. I don't know if this is possible
                            though. Things have gotten so bad. --ulysses
                            \_  I don't have any disdain for the government.
                               I just think they put way too much emphasis
                               on high-tech/electronic surveillance which
                               is great for collecting information from
                               the Russian millitary and innocent US
                               citizens but doesn't really do anything to
                               stop terrorism. We need spies, not satellites
                               and the government should pour more money
                               into the CIA than it does into the NSA
                               (not the other way around).
                                \_ I could hardly argue, and I hope current
                                   events may bring others to that POV, as
                                   well. --ulysses
                            \_ Point made.
                         \_ I'd be willing to work for free if it means
                            that this sort of bs can be prevented. I have
                            to admit, based on my work experience at nasa
                            I always though of gov't workers as lazy bums
                            sitting on thier arses playing solitare and
                            living off the labors of others (taxes). These
                            types of individuals need to go. We can never
                            again be complacent. Eternal vigilence is the
                            price of freedom.
                      a lot of public sector related work. --ulysses
                            that this sort of bs can be prevented.
        \_ Israel has much better human intelligence capability.  Don't know
           about the post-KGB Russia.
        \_ Israel has much better human intelligence capability.
           \_ So why don't they go after bin Laden for us? It's about time they
              did something for us for a change.
2025/04/03 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
4/3     

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Cache (2140 bytes)
www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/news/archive/2001/09/13/national0614EDT0518.DTL
His comments echoed those of former Secretary of State James A. The tools were also useful in monitoring the moves of organizations such as the PLO and the IRA -- which had traditional, low-tech structures that were relatively easy to follow. But the extraordinary costs meant cutbacks in personnel at the CIA and the National Security Agency, the nation's international eavesdropping arm. As the Cold War came to a close, the number of threatening groups increased tenfold just as the digital revolution hit, making global communications suddenly very cheap and secure. These days, terrorists can download sophisticated encryption software on the Internet for free, making it increasingly difficult to tap into their communications. One recent report said Osama bin Laden, a suspect in Tuesday's attacks, has used complex digital masking technology called steganography to send photos over the Internet bearing hidden messages. Mike Hayden, acknowledged in an interview with CBS' "60 Minutes II" earlier this year that his agency is "behind the curve in keeping up with the global telecommunications revolution," adding that bin Laden "has better technology" than the agency. Wayne Madsen, a former NSA intelligence officer, said he believes the terrorists shunned e-mail and mobile phones, using couriers and safe houses instead. He said it was likely the terrorists in each of Tuesday's four hijacked planes didn't know the others existed. Terrorist "cells are kept small and very independent so intelligence agencies can't establish any sort of network," Madsen said. Others say the big problem is not the technological shortcomings but the inability to get inside tightly-knit organizations such as bin Laden's. Experts say intelligence-gathering, to be effective, must involve close coordination between eavesdropping and spying. In practical terms, this means cooperation between the NSA and CIA. Madsen said there is reason to believe the NSA received some good intelligence showing bin Laden's involvement in Tuesday's attacks but that it wasn't recognized as such. AP writers Steve Gutkin and Jim Krane contributed to this report.