11/15 Please read the text without ragging on the source. Dr. Laura had
the easiest to read (in terms of fonts, etc) copy of this quote:
http://drlaura.com/letters/index.html?mode=view&tile=1&id=115
Any opinions on this quote? Was Tyler full of shit? Where do you
think we stand on Tyler's timeline if he had it right?
\_ Tyler is full of B.S. True democracy in a country where the people
are 100% educated won't vote for more money. That happens in
the U.S., in Philipines, in Mexico, etc, where the average voter
has no clue of what's happening. We haven't even progressed to
true democracy yet, much less going on to bondage again.
\_ unless by "100% educated" you mean 100% brainwashed into your
or my particular ideology (and even the latter would be a high
price to pay for what wouldn't really be a democracy), you,
like most people, have an entirely irrational faith in
education. -crebbs
\_ You missed the point. "true democracies" dont last, you always
degenerate into the haves and the havenots, which then
accelerates like how the US is going now.
\_ Its a moot point, since the US is not and has never been
a true democracy. The US is a representative republic.
A true democracy is not much different than mob rule. A
simple majority often makes hasty and ill considered
choises. The founding fathers knew this and created a
system of government resistant to drastic changes that
can plague a democracy.
\- that quote does better on style than substance. the fall of athens
has a lot to do with the peloponessian war. See Thucydides and
Kagan IV: The Fall of the Athenian Empire. You know being invaded
genreation, that men intheir prime could not be found or
[by the macedonians] also didnt help. I dontthink we need to worry
about invasion. The point about populism is interesting. See the
rule on land reform legislation in Republic of Rome. --psb
\_ It's not across from France anymore? Where did they move it to?
\- here is an interesting quote from Kagan:
"It is revealing of the state of Athenian politics that
the Athenians believed they must seek such qualities
["prudent cautious, moderate leadership"] in an earlier
genreation, that men in their prime could not be found or
trusted to provide it.". --psb
\_ The U.K. wasnt "invaded" either, but it is no longer where
it once was
\_ It's not across from France anymore? Where did they move
it to?
\_ Thanks to the liberals who turned it into a socialist
welfare state.
\_ The British Empire fell long before that. Unless you
are calling Winston Churchill a liberal.
\_ It was still an empire into the early 50's, well
after Churchill was out of power.
\_ The British EMPIRE is anti-democratic. That's why it fell.
\_ Actually, it fell because it actually tried to be
somewhat nice to the people it conquered, rather than
ruling with an iron fist forever.
The last straw was of course the massive draining of
resources due to WWII.
\_ Yeah sure, massive draining of resources from the
colonies to the European front. When the Japanese
Imperial Army came with 30000 soldiers, the 80000 Brits
ran so fast down the Malayan peninsula, the Japanese
soldiers had to grab bicycles from the locals to
keep up with the retreating British (note
that the terrain in Malaysia is unsuitable for
armored vehicles).
\_ They will face a problem 10x worse than what the
French had when they persisted in their anti-
democratic ways in Algeria and IndoChina.
\_ Nice? Please explain in what ways the British were "nice"
conquerers. Taken a history class anytime in this life?
\_ yeah, thats a pretty fucking dumb thing for someone
to say. it's always hard to tell on the motd who is a troll
and who really is a moron. there are so many true morons
and so many really devoted trolls who have honed there
skills over the years and they both seem to like to post
to the motd. -troller
\_ The democracy/republic which is the United States will persist
as long as most people feel that the U.S. is the best country to
be a citizen of on this planet. It also persists on a common,
nation-wide feeling of what is right and wrong, what is fair and
not fair, and that honest, hard-working people can better
their situation in a reasonable way, in the face of all that
is wrong and not fair. Voting to give yourself money is
generally accepted as corrupt and embarrassing, unless you
have a good reason that other people will buy. For example,
most people will vote to give veterans money, but most people
will not vote to give only rich people tax breaks. People
may want to abolish taxes, but most people understand
this will upset the system and create a situation where
the U.S. is no longer a great place to live. Anyways, the
bottom line is that Tyler makes a lame, inflammatory college
frosh argument that you'd hear in section and from your
\_ Explain then, why every democracy in existence has
a higher tax rate now than it did 50 years ago? And higher
50 years ago than it was 100 years ago, (obviously you can
keep going with this).
\_ Interesting trend. Explanation not available. Opinion
unchanged. |