12/25 What's the name of that famous French restaurant in north Berkeley
that supposedly costs a fortune?
\-lots of comments at ~psb/CP-and-other-restaurant-comments
\_ has anyone tried thirsty bear in sf?
\- yes. reasonable place to meet if some people want to
eat, some nibble and most drink. i wouldnt go there for dinner
specifically. go to hawthorne lane around the corner :-)
specifically. go to hawthorne lane around the corner :-) --psb
\_ Chez Panisse? It's California cuisine and the cafe upstairs
isn't all that expensive. --dim
\_ Been there, done that. They were rude and the food was pretty
mediocre.
\_ Doesn't this describe all of Berkeley restaurants close to
the university? (captive market and all) - paolo
\_ No. They were exceptionally rude. A whole new realm of
rude. Students are not the Chez Panisse market so that
doesn't apply.
\_ I have been both upstairs and downstairs, both as a student
and afterwards, and the service has always been good.
A comparable restaurant in SF would cost much more, so
"a fortune" is correct relative to say McDonalds. Also
much of their business comes from the local community, and
they do take steps to cater to it (eg the reservation
policy for the cafe), so yes: students on dates and at
graduation are part of their "market". --pld
\_ I never had a reservation for the cafe. Is this a
new policy? I wouldn't describe the food as
mediocre, though. You must have some pretty high
standards. --dim
\_ lack of reservations is what makes it local-friendly
However recently (last 2 years) they have started
offering limited same-day reservations. --pld
\_ It was pretty blah especially considering the price
and rude service. Chez Panisse is was over rated.
\_ so what restaurant *do* you approve of? Just
to get an idea what you think is good...
When i was here, i like(d) Rivoli, Hawthorne
Lane. This week, i went to the new HK Flower
Lounge in Palo Alto -- that's good too.
\_ Rivoli is edible and their service is very
pleasant. If they tripled the prices, they
could have the same (undserved) 4 stars that
CP has. Although does CP still have 4? I
thought it lost a star since it's gone so
far down hill in recent years?
Blondie's pizza to rate world-class restaurants
if like having Pat Buchanan run the UN.
You dont know what you are talking about.
\_ Oh.my.G*d! Rivoli SUCKS. Their service
you believe you know what is the best --
typical Berkeley student attitude.
is awful and their food, although good,
\_ Yeah, after i left i heard they went
downhill. Trust me, they were good
when they first started.
\_ I can think of a few counterexamples in the area where
the food and service are always good. At that same
intersection, you'll find Cafe de la Paz (South American)
and Cha Am (Thai). Cafe Venezia over on University is
one of my favorites. Berkeley has lots of good
restaurants (even if only one is four star).
\- where does this notion of "4 stars = best" come
from? the two qualitative measures i pay attentionto are
zagats [1-30 points] and michelin [1-3 stars n.b. michelin
stars are serious business. as of 1998, there were fewer than
500 starred restaurants in the country of france and only 21
3 star restaurants in the whole country (6 in paris, rest
outside). I have never seen a zagats 30. Every place that has
been above a 26-27 in there i have thought was really quite
good.] --psb
\ Cafe de la Paz ovebooks their reservations. Their
food is "mediocre." Comparing Cafe de la Paz to
Chez Panisse is like comparing a Honda Accord to
a Mercedes S600.
\_ As a general rule (from 6-7 visits) I've found the
veggie fare at de la Paz to be much better than
the meatie. The chile relleno they just added to
the menu was amazingly good. --pld
\_ I wouldn't say CP is a Mercedes. More like a high
end Accord, maybe. They're way over rated. Don't
buy the hype. Their food is only good compared to
the rest of the student level fare in the rest of
Berkeley.
\_ Asking low-class Berkeley students raised on
Blondie's pizza and soda to rate world-class
restaurants is like having Pat Buchanan run
the JDL. You dont know what you are talking
about. Your senses have been dulled.
Not only can you not appreciate Panisse,
you believe you know what is better --
typical self-righteous Berkeley student attitude.
But WRONG. I suppose you prefer Windows to UNIX?
;)
\_ Hahahhahahaha, you're funny. You also have it
totally backwards. I don't like CP because I
have had much better food, not because I'm a
poor student raised on Blondies. Even when
I was a student I wouldn't touch crap like
Blondies with a 20 foot pole. You're either
All the negative commentors have not
illiterate or merely very stupid. Bad food,
bad service, high prices != good restaurant.
Don't buy the hype. CP has had it's day. It
was an 80's restaurant. You can get seating
with very little advance notice. CP is dead.
-not a student for many years
\_ So, what do you consider a good rest. now?
Enlighten me, you culinary god.
I do not deny that good rests can have
bad days, but nobody can say CP sucks
like you do. Less popularity != sucks.
There are just more and newer ones now
since she pioneered the trend.
All the negative commentators have not
given even ONE example of what they
consider a "better" restaurant.
\_ Solano Ave. has good restaurants, at least one four
star.
\_ Venezia was *really* loud the last time I was there.
Don't take a date there unless you can get a spot in
the back room or you don't want to hear your date. :-)
South American was kinda weird. The food was good but
not a style I liked. YMMV.
\_ Venezia is okay. It was better in its old location.
All the other restaurants mentioned are good, but
not in the league of Chez Panisse. --dim
\_ Venezia doesnt appeal to me -- it is overpriced,
over-rated, undersized. I agree it was better at
old location, but they probably make more $$$ now.
\_ Yeah, the old V. was much better. Oh well.
\_ As as student i've been there twice. Students are their
"market" too. In fact, Berkeley students have worked
there. They are reasonably priced for the kind of food.
They have good service, though not necessarily like some
fancy french restaurant in SF. Of all the Bay Area 4-star
restaurants, they are probably one of the most casual
and least snooty/rude of any.
If it is truly "exceptionally rude" you
should speak up and they'll make it right. Maybe you got
some idiot waiter/ess who needs correcting/firing.
(btw, Alice Waters is an alum, and i'm sure she does not
want bad vibes to spoil good food).
\_ yes -- it is the least snooty/rude of most 4 star
restaurants in the Bay Area. If you haven't dined
around, perhaps you should, before you make a judgment
call.
\_ Food was only so-so. We simply don't go there anymore.
\_ Chef Pauls. But that's near the Elmwood theater...
\_ uh, no, it's on Piedmont Ave.
\_ [Summary: CP is good if you like Cal. Cuisine. Some other places
are better. The Cafe != Restaurant. See psb file for details.]
\_ Anybody tried Masa's in the city? Supposedly their fois gras is
very good, but I hate going to a place just for one good dish.
Comments?
\_ Goose stuffed to death? You like that?
\- the long time chef at masas, julian serrano, left for
picasso in las vega$. i think the jury is still out about
his successor. i'm sure you will have a good meal there,
but unclear if there is a better place in terms of bang/$.
if you want good foie gras, try french laundry. --psb
\_ psb, what is the exact name of the restaurant? I couldn't
find "French Laundry" in http://www.dine.com
\_it IS called "French Laundry". See
http://www.sterba.com/yountville/frenchlaundry for
details. -icrew
\_ You want goose killed by stuffing it to death? Ew.
\- some french scientists found a way to destroy
the gooses brain appetite control center ... so the
goose eats itself to death. --psb
\_ That's exactly what they do. What's not to
understand? It has little to do with science and
everything to do with cruelty.
\- my point was there is a new twist
to genrating foie gras ... previously
they used to force feed the goose via
a tube, now they have a nurosurgical
component to things. this has some
interesting philosophical implications.
--psb
\_ I think it's pretty straight
forward. It was easier to get the
goose to help. Like the talking
pig in hitch hiker's.
\_ "cruelty"? Do you drink milk? Do you
have any idea what other animals are put
through to feed yer fat face? What about
chicken or eggs? Just b/c you feel foie
gras or veal is "cruel" doesn't mean you
feel the same pain the tuna felt in the
net before it suffocated to death. Think
about that next time you shovel any animal
parts in yermouth. - tpc
\_ no, I don't, loud mouth. think about
that the next time you falsely accuse
a life long vegan of anything less.
\_ what is it aobut americans and food?
\_ We're morally superior. Are you
from one of the zillions of little
countries we've saved either from
the Nazi's, the Soviets, the
Chinese, the Japanese, or them-
selves? What is it about
foreigners and their jealousy?
\_ But I'm an American!
\_ We haven't had to rescue
ANYone from the Chinese;
and the Soviets shot
themselves in the head;
we merely made sure they
had bigger guns to do it
with.
\_ Chinese -> South Korea?
Soviets -> Rest of World?
Been with us this century?
\_ [a lot of vegan bullshit deleted.] Just try some Foie Gras, it
\_ hot mustard?
is so delicious that it might just change your mind.
\_ can't forget the squid and a roll of duct tape!
\_ You should try hot gay sex.
\_ with 2 gallons of mustard. at least.
\_ while riding a bike!
\_ mustn't forget the squid and a roll of duct tape! |
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