10/13   Let's say that I make it to a second tier MS CS program. Once I get
        in, how easy/common is it to transfer to a first tier Phd CS program?
        \_ Depends entirely on the quality of your research.  If your research
           is of stellar quality, you will have little problem.  But then if
           you were capable of stellar research, how did you end up in a
           second tier MS CS program? -- ilyas
           \_ You suddenly decided in your fourth year that CS was for you?
           \_ many people gain readiness for various stages in life at
              different times.  maybe this one was ready for a PhD program
              at a later time.
              \_ People don't just spontaneously become brilliant at 24.
                 You can't become "ready" for a first tier PhD program,
           \_ the crappiest president this place has seen since jsl.
                 you either have what it takes, and have a research track
                 record + grades to prove it, or not. -- ilyas
                 \_ Yeah, but you can decide to start working hard and
                    stop slacking.  You don't have to be brilliant to get
                    into a good PhD program.  - mikeym
                    \_ I maintain that if you are not brilliant, first
                       tier PhD programs are not for you: you will not help
                       your advisor, and you will not help yourself.
                       First tier PhD programs are for the future leaders of
                       science, not some mediocrity with a vanity problem,
                       who decides one day to "stop slacking" and "work hard".
                       Such a person may even be able to get into a good
                       program, like a kid sneaking in to an exclusive
                       nightclub.  But a good program will always remain for
                       him just that: an exclusive nightclub of the mind,
                       where he will always feel out of place. -- ilyas
                        \_ Wow... that's stunningly arrogant and elitist.  Who
                           says this late comer to PhD-dom isn't brilliant?
                           Who says that working hard (kissing ass) all through
                           school is a sign of brilliance?  Neither is true.
                           People who work hard are (mostly) doing so *because*
                           they're *not* brilliant and *need* to work hard to
                           stay even with their slacking but smarter peers.
                           You have this all backwards.
                           \_ If he has to "stop slacking" and "work hard" he
                              isn't, which is exactly what I was saying.  You
                              are right, what I am saying IS elitist.  Human
                              beings are not created equal.  First tier schools
                              are for first tier people.  -- ilyas
                                \_ The original poster never said he was a slack.
                                   I believe mikeym added that twist.
        \_ I'm going to gradschool for those 3 letters after my name:
           M.B.A. - paolo (who is sick of all this grad school bullshit)
                \_ But has the right attitude to be a good MBA.
        \_ Why are you getting a CS PhD from *any* school?  The only thing
           you can really do with it is teach at a second rate school.  You
           need to think more about what you plan to do with it than how to
           get it.  You sure as hell won't make more money with it.
                \_ another example where people reply WITHOUT reading the
                   original post. The guy said he wanted to go to
                   FIRST TIER Phd program. FUCKIN MORON.
                   \_ Hypocrite.  I was questioning the value of *any* PhD.
                      *You* need to read the post you're replying to before
                      *you* reply.  You are a complete fucking idiot.  First
                      Tier vs. Second Tier has nothing to do with what *I*
                      was saying.  You are lower than low.  Dumber than dumb.
                      To attack someone for not reading when you haven't read
                      what you're attacking makes you a hypocrite of the lowest
                      order.  I lack the words to describe how completely and
                      utterly S-T-U-P-I-D you are.  Return your diploma to
                      the registrar's office immediately.
                      \_ Feel better now that you got that off your chest?
                        \_ I always feel better after correcting a dumb
                           shit for brains hypocritical asshole.  Yes, thanks.
                           If I had my giant Thesaurus here, I'd have felt
                           that much better, but it was sufficient as it was.
                           \_ If you're interested in money only, a PhD would
                              not be the best. But I'd wager they could
                              do 10X the things you can do. The only things
                              undergrads are really armed with is the 170
                              series. A PhD spends his whole life in 170
                              style concepts, and when they get out to
                              go work, they innovate, not copy, IMO.
                                \_ True if I was a coder.  Since I'm not, and
                                   I have worked closely with several PhD's, I
                                   feel pretty secure saying that a PhD can
                                   *not* do what I do.  No, I can't do what
                                   they can do either but frankly I found 170
                                   really really really dull so I'm ok with
                                   that.
                                \_ When I can actually manage to get enough
                                   sleep, 170 makes sense and is kind of cool.
                                   I wish there were some way to take 170 and
                                   average a reasonable amount of sleep.
                                        -- a current 170 hoser