4/2 http://tinyurl.com/2h3cv
"Russia said in February that it was developing a so-called
hypersonic missile technology capable of piercing the United
States' system. But Mr. Ishiba said he did not believe that a
shield would encourage other countries to develop missiles that
would defeat the system. "If you launch a missile and it gets
shot down," he said, "you give up missile production." "
** Huh? **
\_ saying that if the non-hypersonic missiles get shot down
why bother with missiles
\_ Maybe he's trying to say there's cheaper ways of fucking us up.
\_ The argument for missle defense is not that it will be
perfect. That's stupid. The argument goes more like: (as a
metaphor) Despite the locks on your door, thieves can
metaphor) Despite the locks on your door, theives can
break in and steal. Should you therefore leave the door
open?
\_ I've never felt safer than when i lived just up from a crazy
biker dude who left his front door literally wide open all
the time. if anyone wanted to rob our place, they'd probably
the ceiling. the DETERENCE of the mad biker was much more
just wander in the front door and get blasted straight through
the cieling. the DETERENCE of the mad biker was much more
\_ Ok you're safer from random violence. But psycho biker may
attract violence, or somehow harm you. I'd rather just live
in a normal neighborhood and take steps.
useful than a locked door. deterence has worked with nuclear
weapons for half a century as well.
\_ How much have we spent on Star Wars? $100B? $200B?
\_ About $2b total, mostly in basic research to get where we
are today. Please stop inventing random numbers. With $2b
they wouldn't be *any* safer after the union driven harbors
got their fingers in the pie.
open?
How much safer could our harbors and airports be
for that much money?
\_ But it'd be easier for a terrorist to sneak a nuclear
device in the same way drugs get in here from South
America. So the argument is more like: What good is
locking your door if you've got a gaping hole in your
wall big enough to drive a car through?
\_ Umm, not exactly. Nice red herring though. We have
something of a defense against that. It sucks, but
it's not nothing. We have NO defense against
missiles.
\_ But what's the bigger threat? Terrorists are
the main bad guys these days, and they don't
usually go for (expensive) ICBMs when they have
cheaper and simpler options.
\_ The red herring here is that we should/can only
\_ No, the red herring is that a $30 lock is
analagous to a $200 billion missile defense
system. The missile defense system is simply
not cost-effective; a lock on your door is.
\_ What is the cost of a city getting incinerated?
I suspect more than $200b. What is the cost
of your house getting robbed? I suspect less
than $200b. You're struggling with the concept
of appropriate levels of response. The correct
level for keeping a city from turning to ashes
is much higher than for your bike parked out
on telegraph.
defend against a single threat. The reality is that
we should try to defend against all threats. Natn'l
defense is not an either-or proposition.
\_ That's true that terrorists are the bigger
threat, but that's doesn't make them the ONLY
threat. We're working on how to stop
terrorists, but don't be fooled into thinking
that NK, China, or even Russia are completely
neutralized. With the lazer 747 we can help
defend Japan and SK against the North.
\_ what do you mean "even russia"? russia
is still the only country that can
incinerate the entire USA if it so chooses.
strong man putin is pulling russia back
on its feet, and in this era of cheap
labor and high material costs, the vast
land and riches of mother russia is
going to benefit russia tremendously.
the russian bear shall rise again!
\_ "incinerate the entire USA". So you think a
country that can potentially only incinerate
the west coast such as China or NK isn't a
threat? btw, russia is still going through the
death throes of self destruction. they are
not yet in a recovery phase.
\_ you are out of date. russia is very
much into recovery. It is using the
formula of get rich first with capitalism
under strong authoritarian leadership
\_ russia is fucked. their last election
was a total joke. they're teetering on
the edge of dictatorship (again) and now
they have a broken military *and*
terrorists beating on their doors at
the same time. i'm not out of date. im
right here in 2004. you're living in the
hey day of post-communism but before they
saw how hard the road to freedom really
is. oh yeah and their environment was
and still is *devastated* from what the
communists did to it which makes our
worst problems look like a fairy land of
healthy goodness. russia = fux0red.
open?
cheaper and simpler options.
\_ you are out of date. russia is very
much into recovery.
followed by US allies like Japan, S. Korea,
Taiwan, Singapore, etc. when these nations
were in a similar stage of development. |
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