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| 11/26 |
| 2003/11/18 [Science/GlobalWarming] UID:11125 Activity:very high |
11/18 Wasn't ethanol proven to have almost no effect on the quality of
gasoline?
\_ Pretty much, yeah. You can split hairs over it but not really.
\_ So why was so much money added to the energy bill for this?
Also, do you have any links about what it's supposed to do
vs what it does? I heard it all just evaporated.
\_ it lowers the energy density of the gasoline. It sends a
bit of money to the farm states where the ethanol is produced.
bit of money to the farm states where the ethanlo is produced.
\_ It also sends a LOT of money to ADM, which is a big
policitian-buyer.
\_ True. And makes deluded "environmentalists" happy.
Even though more energy is used in the final analysis;
\_ Don't kid yourself. The Energy Bill is just one
big barrel of pork. No one in this Congress cares
what environmentalists think, not real ones and not
the imagined demons you're talking about. BTW, check
out King George's latest decision on textile tariffs?
Whatta free trader!
California has more oilfields than cornfields....
\_ What do you mean "the quality of gasoline"?
You been listening to Rush Limbaugh again?
\_ boy, how does it feel being a dupe of the most evil corp.s that
i'm sure you claim to hate? See ADM and Sierra club posts below
\_ Christ no. I'd heard that it was supposed to replace MTBE as an
octane additive but that it evaporates and you're basically left
with plain old gasoline sans MTBE. Thanks for the link, what
about counterarguments?
\_ Do you have any? I don't know of any. I guess that site
would suggest that you want to increase the VoC requirements
so that it doesn't evaporate off.
\_ Doesn't it do what MTBE does?
\_ poison the water table? no, it doesn't.
\_ Ethanol is a ludicrous fuel made out of corn, at a cost far higher
than the petroleum it replaces, produced with a huge government tax
subsidy, which started during the energy crisis a quarter-century ago
and has long since become a classic case study of stupid policy
entrenched by special interests (in this case farmers and Archer Daniels
Midland, the company responsible for the fabulous discovery that if you
tell the government what to do in commercials on every Sunday talk show,
the government apparently is powerless to resist). - Michael Kinsley
\_ the Sierra Club is suing some Ethanol plants.
http://indiana.sierraclub.org/Sierran/03-1/EthanolPlants.asp
policitian-buyer.
\_ What do you mean "the quality of gasoline"?
http://www.sentex.net/~crfa/ethaair.html
You been listing to Rush Limbaugh again? |
| 11/26 |
|
| indiana.sierraclub.org/Sierran/03-1/EthanolPlants.asp By the EPAs own admission, these two plants are only the tip of the iceberg, said David Bookbinder, senior attorney with the Sierra Club. Theres a clear pattern in this industry of systematic disregard for the law. These lawsuits should serve as a warning to the entire industry to clean up their act, and to the EPA to enforce the law. Indeed, Ethanol 2000 was exceeding its permitted level by nearly 10 times and was emitting acetaldehyde and formaldehyde. Both of these chemicals are classified by the EPA as probable human carcinogens, while VOCs contribute to the production of ozone, which causes serious respiratory problems, including asthma and lung diseases. Other ethanol facilities were found by the EPA to be emitting unlawful amounts of carbon monoxide, a poisonous gas that causes visual impairment, reduced work capacity, reduced manual dexterity, and a host of other human health problems. Despite this clear indication that many ethanol producers are breaking the law and putting human health and the environment at risk, Congress is shaping an energy bill that would provide $5 billion in subsidies for the industry. Lawmakers would also exempt ethanol producers from any liability when people become sick from drinking polluted water. When ethanol producers violate the Clean Air Act and endanger human health, Congress should treat them like the corporate polluters they are, not give them yet more tax breaks, continued Bookbinder. Until these plants clean up their acts, they deserve fines, not hand-outs. |
| www.sentex.net/~crfa/ethaair.html -> www.sentex.net/%7Ecrfa/ethaair.html Fuel Ethanol and Air Quality HOW DOES ETHANOL LETS CLEAR THE AIR? Carbon Dioxide Most liquid fuels gasoline, diesel, natural gas, propane come from fossil hydrocarbons. Unlike them, ethanol is produced from renewable biological feedstocks, such as agricultural crops and forestry by-products. Carbon dioxide is released into the atmosphere when ethanol like other fuels is burned in an automobile engine. However, this carbon dioxide is recycled into organic tissue during plant growth. Only about 40 percent or less of the organic matter is actually removed from farm fields for ethanol production. The rest is returned to the soil as organic matter, increasing fertility and reducing soil erosion. With modern conservation farming practices, this soil organic-matter will build up, representing a net removal of carbon dioxide from the atmosphere. An increase of only 1 in the soil organic matter level means an atmospheric reduction of over 40 tonnes of carbon dioxide per hectare of farm land. Canada has vast areas of agricultural cropland. Most of these soils could benefit from increasing soil organic matter by several percentage points. Ethanol use in gasoline has tremendous potential for a net reduction in atmospheric carbon dioxide levels. Carbon Monoxide Carbon monoxide, formed by the incomplete combustion of fuels, is produced most readily from petroleum fuels which contain no oxygen in their molecular structure. Because ethanol and other oxygenated compounds contain oxygen, their combustion in automobile engines is more complete. The result is a substantial reduction in carbon monoxide emissions. Research shows that reductions range up to 30, depending on type and age of automobile, the automobile emission system used, and the atmospheric conditions in which the automobile operates. Because of health concerns over carbon monoxide, the 1990 amendments to the United States Clean Air Act mandate the use of oxygenated gasolines in many major urban centres during the winter when atmospheric carbon monoxide levels are highest to reduce this pollution. Other Octane Additives Because of its high octane rating, adding ethanol to gasoline can permit the reduction or removal of aromatic hydrocarbons such as benzene, and other hazardous high-octane additives commonly used to replace tetra-ethyl lead in Canadian gasoline. Ozone Because of its effect in reducing hydrocarbons and carbon monoxide in exhaust, adding ethanol to gasoline results in an overall reduction in exhaust ozone-forming potential. Ethanol has no significant effect on emissions of nitrous oxide, another common contributor to atmospheric ozone. Adding ethanol to gasoline can potentially increase the volatility of gasoline. This potential is controlled if all ethanol-blended gasoline sold in Canada meets the volatility standards required for other types of gasoline. In contrast, the United States Clean Air Act allows gasohol gasoline plus 10 ethanol to have a higher volatility than that of gasoline. This results in greater volatile organic compounds emissions. Therefore, the Canadian ethanol blend has less potential to form ozone than the American counterpart. Adding of ethanol to gasoline does create slightly greater amounts of aldehydes during fuel combustion. Yet the resulting concentrations are extremely small and are effectively reduced by the three-way catalytic convertors in the exhaust systems of all recent-model cars. The Royal Society of Canada termed the possibility of negative health effects caused by aldehyde emissions with the use of ethanol-blended gasoline as being remote. |