10/3    Does anyone have a good link to a discussion of the pros & cons
        of giving drivers licenses to illegal immigrants?  I didn't hear
        about it until a couple of days ago, and it seems rather far-
        fetched, but someone must have presented some good reason or
        it wouldn't have happened, right?
        \_ RANT! GROWL! MESSICANS! GRRR!!!!! DAVIS!!!!! ARNOLD!!!!
        \_ pro: they're driving anyway and we need slave labor
           \_ That's it?!?!?  If they're too broke to pay for insurance,
              what's the point of giving the license that will let them
              get insurance?  And if they *do* get driver's licenses,
              what prevents the INS from tracking them and deporting
              them if they are illegal immigrants?
              \_ The INS?  Nothing.  You forgot about the importance of
                 slave labor.
              \_ the INS bit is easy, you don't let the INS use the DL
                 database.  Other pros: if you make laws so that people
                 stopped without a DL get checked in the INS system and
                 deported, while poeple with DLs just get a speeding
                 ticket, suddenly there are going to be a lot less
                 unliscensed, uninsured drivers out there.
                 \_ Like that would happen.  They already don't deport illegals
                    who have "established connections to the community".  They
                    just let em walk.  Almost no one gets deported.  There's
                    never been a serious effort to stop the influx or kick out
                    those who are found when anyone bothers looking.  This is
                    a load of bullshit.
           con: they shouldn't even be here, they're going to use it to vote,
                it can be used to elevate an illegal to the same level of
                concern in the government's eyes as tax paying citizens.
                \_ DL alone is not a valid enough id to register to vote.
                   \_ Motor Voter!  Howdy!  That's all it takes.  Fact.  I'm
                      a citizen voting every election for 15+ years and I've
                      never showed anyone any real proof of anything to vote.
        \_ Anything which adds drivers to the road is bad.  I don't care
           who they are.  More drivers means more idiots on the roads
           and more pollution.  We should raise the driving age to 18 to
           balance things out.
           \_ Under 18 drivers aren't a significant percentage of drivers out
              there. Furthermore, even if we increase age limit to 18, they're
              still going to be inexperienced drivers on the road. Yeah, they
              will be more mature, but still not confident on the road.
              \_ let's change the minimum driving age to 80, video tape it,
                 sell the tapes, and use the revenue to pay for good public
                 transit in california.  this will also save money on health
                 care for the elderly.
                 \_ public transit can never entirely replace private transit.
                    it cant *never* be that flexible due to it's very nature.
                    \_ try visiting tokyo sometime.
                       \_ the rest of the world isn't built like tokyo.  try
                          visiting *any* large American city.  Actually, try
                          visiting just small city, town, village, or farm in
                          the US.  Hint: this is a bigger place than tokyo and
                Not really.  Ever seen Tokyo?  -John _/
                          frankly who the hell wants to live like the japanese
                          do?  I'm a man, not a sardine.
                          \_ what's really amazing is that i got three serious
                             replies from my "let the elderly kill eachother
                             on the roads" troll.
                             \_ not really.  that part was ignored but you
                                can give yourself a few troll points if you
                                like.  its not like anyone keeps track or
                                cares.