Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2009:January:06 Tuesday <Monday, Wednesday>
Berkeley CSUA MOTD
2009/1/6-9 [Finance/Banking] UID:52321 Activity:nil
        wamu, mariachis and drugs.
2009/1/6-9 [Politics/Domestic/President/Clinton, Politics/Domestic/Election] UID:52322 Activity:nil
1/5     What happened to Separation of Church and State?  Where did all these
        churchy Dems come from?
        \_ conservative democrat is the new republican
           \_ Going to church != conservative.  Or do you think Obama's a
                 I think he's something we haven't seen in a long time.
                 \_ Pragmatic?
                    \_ he's a good republican.
2009/1/6-9 [Reference/Religion] UID:52323 Activity:moderate
1/6     Any Art History buffs here? I'm trying to find out if people
        in the Renaissance used the "golden ratio" to compose their
        art work? Do they divide pictures in some magical ratios to
        make them look the way they do?
        \_ The quick answer is yes; the long answer is that they did, though
           not all of them may have done it consciously.
           \_ can you provide URL that talks about this? A friend of mine
              is asserting that people had no idea what golden ratio was
              in those era and they just did what looked good visually.
              \_ Google for Fibonacci and the Golden Mean (a video).
        \_ iirc, "The Golden Ratio" by Mario Livio includes some discussion
           about the use of the golden ratio by Renaissance artists. I think
           he has some references to additional reading as well.
        \_ Did you just read The Da Vinci Code?  You know it's fiction, right?
           And that most of the "facts" in it are crap?
           \_ Sure, sure, understood. However, some of the facts were accurate,
              insofar as they were presented as facts. -!op
              \_ Nope, pretty much everything I read in that book purporting to
                 be facts were actually wrong.
                 \_ /shrug. There was an Order of Knights called the Templars.
                    Opus Dei is a Catholic organization. The Louvre is in
                    Paris. I don't mean to nitpick, but it's a fiction born
                    out of lots of facts. That the facts don't fit together as
                    presented should be obvious from the word "fiction."
                    \- obviously the large scale stuff is made up, but
                       the da vinci code is "sloppy" on a lot of quotidian
                       details. like say somebody set something in berkeley
                       and said somebody was meeting at the corner of college
                       and university or said they walked from the i-house to
                       berkeley marina in 5min or had a 15min coversation
                       driving from evans hall to the GTU library.
                    \_ Pretty much everything presented as what the Templars
                       did or what Opus Dei is is wrong.  Simple facts about
                       the golden ratio are wrong, etc.
                       \_ Point conceded. How about a nice game of chess?
                       \_ Yeah, it's a joke.  Here's what I noted about it a
                          few years ago:
                          \_ Hey, emarkp, can you point me to an historical
                             mention of Jesus that isn't Flavius Josephus?
                             All sources seem to point back to FJ, and he's
                             not exactly unbiased. --erikred
                             \_ Josephus is the only one off the top of my head
                                who wasn't a Christian.  Justin Martyr wrote
                                about him circa 100, but he was a convert to
                                Christianity (I thought by Peter, but now I
                                can't confirm that, so he's probably third
                                hand).  -emarkp
                                \_ Josephus is not contemporary with the
                                   events he writes about, so it's hard to
                                   trust his account. --erikred
                                   \- i am not especially knowledgeable
                                      or interested in jebus, but if you
                                      are interested in the historical
                                      evidence, you can look into "the
                                      jesus project" and BART EHRMAN ...
                                      i would say josephus's "issue" is not
                                      so much his temporal distance or his
                                      being a jew rather than an xtian, but
                                      the fact that he very much had an
                                      agenda, and it was not a dispassionate
                                      academic inquiry into the historical
                                      "facts" [i have only read The Jewish
                                      War]. EUSEBIUS is an obvious person to
                                      read, but i dont remember what he says
                                      about the early first cent. You may
                                      also look into PHILO OF ALEXANDERIA
                                      aka PHILO THE JEW but i am not really
                                      familiar with him ... again, i am more
                                      interested in what was going on in rome
                                      and the west than in the levant. of the
                                      great western historians, the greatest,
                                      western historians, the greatest,
                                      tacitus, was not that interested and
                                      says little about the first century
                                      goings on in palestine although there
                                      is some discussion of the events of the
                                      60s. seutonious is a hack so i wont go
                                      on about him. dio cassius has a limited
                                      amount of commentary, but that is even
                                      more removed in time.
                                      i know more about intellectual
                                      and church history than the personal
                                      details about jebus ... if you want
                                      pointers to that stuff, let me know
                                      what kinds of Qs you are interested in.
                                      \_ Kudos to psb and emarkp for the
                                         usual good info. Will be in touch.
                                         \- factoid of the day: kudos is
                                            singular. do epong and i have
                                            to split a kudos? :-)
                                            \_ Yes. Knife-fight to ensue.
                         \_ that's a pretty good rebuttal. I refused to read
                            the book after a co-worker of mine successfully
                            argued to others that it was the first book that he
                            had ever read that actually made him dumber...
                            getting actual facts and history muddled with
                            fiction. Everyone else at the table who had read
                            the book and knew anything about history agreed.
                            \- if the Vinci Code really made you dumber, you
                               probably started out dumb [yeah, i know it's
                               probably just a line from your associate, but
                               you can see my point too, i hope]. on the other
                               hand a book like ZatAoMM really is pernicious.
                               \_ I don't think it's so much that he's dumb as
                                  that he forgot all the stuff that he learned
                                  in college 10 years prior (or my other friend
                                  who forgot everything he learned in Catholic
                                  school). He remembered the facts, but they
                                  became hazy with time, and then DBrown got
                                  got inserted into the haze. Kind of like a
                                  virus inserting itself into the code. So I
                                  guess he's dumb in a single-cell sort of way.
2009/1/6-9 [Uncategorized] UID:52324 Activity:nil
1/6     Hee hee.  The new apple product:
2009/1/6-9 [Transportation/Car] UID:52325 Activity:low
1/6     Teens tape fake license plates to their cars and purposely zoom
        by speed cameras.  Someone else gets the ticket in the mail:
        \_"It is unfortunate that kids have a lot of time on their hands that th\
ey can think of doing such a thing."
        \_"It is unfortunate that kids have a lot of time on their hands that
           they can think of doing such a thing."
           Yeah, we should keep kids chained in the salt mines all day.
           Hopefully that will keep them stupid as well as occupied.
           \_ Saltpetre mines, you mean.
           \_ we should send them to recover the Holy Land, for all good
2009/1/6-12 [Politics/Domestic/President/Clinton, Politics/Domestic/Election, Politics/Domestic/President/Bush] UID:52326 Activity:low
1/6     URL speaks for itself, really
        \_ Is Art Bell a Republican?
           \_ Your reading comprehension has been classified as: lacking.
              \_ You must not have read all the comments...
2009/1/6-8 [Uncategorized] UID:52327 Activity:nil
1/6     sign me up!
2009/1/6-7 [Industry/Jobs] UID:52328 Activity:high 57%like:52332
1/6     Sanjay Gupta?  Really?
        \_ But inside he is as white as KKK's white satins sheets.
        \- a friend of mine was in a lot of classes with him
           in high school. apparently he was kind of a sociopath,
           but evidently sociopaths make good neurosurgeons.
           it's too bad he didnt pick AGAWNDE.
           \_ Isn't everyone in high school kind of a sociopath?
        \_ Indians have a core competency (+2) in Medicine.
           \_ well they sure can't code or sink pirates
           \_ The Danes have +2 hitpoint in axe and in bezerk mode.
              \_ +5 to hp and Str if we're drinking Akvaavit.
           \_ The Asians have +1 intellect and -4 in shield
           \_ Only if you mean getting degrees. In my experience they aren't
              necessarily good doctors. At least clinicians. Surgeons might
              be something else entirely. Not enough experience to say.
              \_ My Indian GP rules. --white guy
                 \_ i pick white doctors.
Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2009:January:06 Tuesday <Monday, Wednesday>