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| 2007/9/4-6 [Politics/Domestic/RepublicanMedia, Politics/Domestic/President/Bush] UID:47881 Activity:kinda low |
9/3 "We invaded a sovereign nation based on a lie."
http://www.csua.org/u/jfo
\_ BS. Go back to your cage Michael Moore.
\_ You're kind of reaching the bottom of the barrel when
you don't really need to, to get that kind of quote from
the web, I don't think that was the main point of the
article. I think you can find plenty of Republicans
now who would agree that we invaded Iraq for unknown
or disengenous reasons.
\_ Lie != Intelligence Failure
\_ At what point does a willful ignorance and denial of
fact cease to be the fault of the intel provider and
become the fault of the intel receiver? And then at what
point does the refusal to accept fact then become a lie?
\_ If you don't find out the intel is wrong until after
you've invaded then it isn't a lie that caused you
to go in. It was ignorance. So to answer your
question in this context: never.
\_ Okay, now what if you tell your intel people that
you only want intel that backs up your premise? At
what point does willful, active ignorance like that
become lying?
\_ There was a recent Tom Tomorrow comic where he had a dream
that everyone, from the bush admin to the press to the pundits
to the entire staff of the Weekly Standard realized they had
made a terrible mistake and dedicated their lives to living
the rest of their life in exile, obscurity, and penance. That's
exactly what I want.
\_ "My party is Good, the other party is Evil", as seen on Dailykos,
freerepublic, democratic underground, etc, etc.
\_ Oh, no, it wouldn't break my heart if everyone who voted to
authorize went into exile, etc.
\_ Like it or not, the War On Terror has been branded as
Republican thing. Good job branding there guys!
You can make a pretty strong case that all of the think
tanks and pundits and elected officials pushing the Iraq
invasion were Republican. I think pointing out that
plenty of Democrats voted to authorize invading is
a moot point. Bush would have figured out a way to invade
democrats or no democrats.
\_ BS. Go back to your cage Michael Moo yet?"
\_ did you shower between couplings aspo
\_ Not as a rule no.
\_ Does his wife have camel toe? I just found out yesterday that my
sister-in-law does.
\_ Maybe something about having two humps?
\_ So you still think invading Iraq was a good choice? |
| 2007/9/4-6 [Computer/Rants] UID:47882 Activity:moderate |
9/4 Happy Labor Day! Thank you, Labor, for weekends, mandatory breaks,
and a generally un-serf-like workplace.
\_ There are a few books coming out about how horrible the
New Deal was for America. I love it.
New Deal was for America.
\_ There are also books out about how much the Jews control
the world.
\_ The revisionist New Deal books are by the The Wall Street
Journal editorial page crowd. Did you read today's
Pat Buchanan column? He managed to blame the Jews
for everything at the end.
\_ ZOG!
\_ I am embarassed to admit, this comment got me to track
down Pat Buchanan's latest column and read it. There
is no mention of Jews or Isreal anywhere. I am not
about to read every one of his missives. URL?
\_ i exagerate a bit but not much. grep for
"israeli lobby". |
| 2007/9/4-5 [Recreation/Dating] UID:47883 Activity:very high |
9/4 An acquaintance of mine said: "My wife is a sex camel." I'm sure
this is anomalous, because the MOTD told me women love to have
sex all the time.
\_ you're an idiot.
\_ Are camels known for having a lot of sex? I'm confused.
\_ Does your wife have camel toe?
\_ Does your wife have camel toe? I just found out yesterday that my
\_ Camel:water::Wife:sex
\_ I get it now. Thanks.
\_ So... his wife goes long periods of time without sex but then
shags him to the point of exhaustion?
\_ I've dated women like that. 2 weeks of no sex followed
by two weeks where "my god woman are you satisfied yet?"
by two weeks where "my god woman are you satisfied
yet?"
\_ did you shower between couplings aspo
\_ Not as a rule no.
\_ Does his wife have camel toe? I just found out yesterday that my
sister-in-law does.
\_ Maybe something about having two humps?
\_ No, I don't think anyone on the MOTD ever said that. You are
trolling with a strawman argument.
\_ I mentioned that woman, as a general rule, don't like sex.
The counterargument is obviously that they do, despite so
much evidence to the contrary.
\_ Horse hockey. The counterargument is that women, as a general
rule, don't like sex with you.
\_ My acquaintance's wife doesn't like sex with him either.
\_ Birds of a feather fuck together?
I've had one girlfriend whose cravings didn't meet
mine. She'd had an abusive ex-husband which made sex
a touchy thing. All my other girlfriends have had
very healthy sex drives, and very much enjoyed sex
with me. I pity you and your acquaintance.
\_ How long did you have these 'girlfriends' for?
\_ No, you or someone else on the same theme, said that no
women enjoy sex. The counterargument was that some women
do in fact enjoy sex.
\_ Yes. Strippers, druggies, and sexually abused women.
\_ No, healthy, self-confident women.
\_ Uh huh. At the beginning of a relationship. |
| 2007/9/4 [Uncategorized] UID:47884 Activity:low 66%like:47880 |
8/31 Hulk smash!
http://xrl.us/5k6p |
| 2007/9/4-5 [Computer/Companies/Yahoo] UID:47885 Activity:nil |
9/4 Is it my imagination or it seems like Picasaweb and Gmail and
other shit products are getting slower and slower? It takes like
10 seconds to refresh the images on Picasaweb and 5 seconds to
go through the emails. It used to be almost instantaneous. What
is going on? If this is not fixed I'm going back to Yahoo Mail.
\_ I do not notice this in Gmail, and I bet I have moessages
than you do. Who the hell uses Picasa? Feel free to go back
to Yahoo Mail, the interface is terrible.
\_ Both gmail and yahoo have been slow lately. |
| 2007/9/4 [Uncategorized] UID:47886 Activity:nil |
9/4 It's weird being back from burning man. I had a really profound and
meaningful time there, and I would write about it but it was like
being transported to another dimension of space and time and you
wouldn't be able to understand it without having been there. It was
like a religious experience. I am gay now.
\_ Did you get your period? |
| 2007/9/4-5 [Uncategorized] UID:47887 Activity:low |
9/4 "You must be my lucky star! Starlight, starbright, first star I
see tonight."
Does that mean she's looking for promiscuous sex?
\_ It's a Madonna song. She's never really had to 'look' for it,
just pick from among her own dance troupe. |
| 2007/9/4-5 [Health/Men] UID:47888 Activity:nil |
9/4 the spammers say my penis is too small or that my shaft
is too big for my girlfriend's mouth. i wish they'd make
up their mind.
\_ I don't see any reason it can't be both.
\_ You got a spam trying to sell you a product to increase the
size of her mouth or shrink your penis? |
| 2007/9/4-5 [Uncategorized] UID:47889 Activity:nil |
9/4 Why did you delete my personal, profound summary of my time
at Burning Man?
http://jameth.livejournal.com/3347563.html |
| 2007/9/4-7 [Science/GlobalWarming] UID:47890 Activity:nil |
9/4 "NOAA blames hot MILFs on greenhouse gases"
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070829/ap_on_sc/greenhouse_warming_6
\_ Good
\_ Good for NOAA
\_ Why do they continue to ignore solar activity?
http://www.canada.com/components/print.aspx?id=597d0677-2a05-47b4-b34f-b84068db11f4
http://csua.org/u/jfv
\_ they don't. |
| 2007/9/4-7 [Computer/SW/Languages/C_Cplusplus, Health/Disease/AIDS] UID:47891 Activity:nil |
9/4 http://csua.org/u/jfs (townhall.com, why hide your url?) This was all before politicians gave us the idea that the things we could not afford individually we could somehow afford collectively through the magic of government. \_ it was also before it was empirically proven that the unregulated \_ umm. no. health care system in the U.S. is twice as expensive as everyone else's. \_ Everyone else's healthcare is great until you get sick. |
| 2007/9/4-5 [Reference/Religion] UID:47892 Activity:nil |
9/4 haven't had a good Mormon troll-off in a while. Lemme fix
that:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/6972862.stm
\_ Wow, that's some pretty bad fact-checking. Let me highlight an
easily-checked fact they got wrong:
"The heretics, in their view, are the five million members of the
mainstream church."
Actual membership in the LDS church as of April 2007:
12,868,606
http://lds.org/conference/talk/display/0,5232,23-1-690-3,00.html
\_ "He's harmless! Back in the sixties he was part of the Free
Speech movement at Berkeley. I think he did a little too much
LDS" |
| 2007/9/4-7 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:47893 Activity:low |
9/4 Do you think one of the 7 out of 11 Iraq war surge benchmarks
they met is 'end all violence' or 'restore 100 percent power' ?
\_ it make sense. afterall, we demand PLO to "end all violence"
and insist that since there are still attacks in Israel,
PLO most of sanctioned it. According to that logic, we sanctioned
all these violence in Iraq too. :)
\_ "The Iraqi government is "dysfunctional" and has met only three
of the 18 benchmarks laid out by Congress for gauging its efforts
on political reconciliation, according to a new independent report
on Iraq by the Government Accountability Office." How do you get
7 out of 11 from that?
\_ Bush-math: count the 4 that have been partially met, even if
only 1% of criteria have been met. Kind of like how calling cards
count minutes used.
\_ even then it's 7 out of 18. -tom
\_ "I cannot let this go by, the old-style Washington
politics, trying to scare you with phony numbers." -GWB
\_ Does anyone even know what those benchmarks are and if they are
meaningful anymore given the current situation? |
| 2007/9/4-6 [Science] UID:47894 Activity:nil |
9/4 kchang are you using advanced internal Google api technology
to crawl the motd?
\_ Dear anon coward, I have no idea what you're talking about -kchang
\_ I assume you must be leveraging the vast tech you have
at your disposal, to better your motd classifying.
at your disposal, to improve your motd classifying.
\_ It is my belief that any reference to proprietary
technology requires all parties to sign NDAs -kchang |
| 2007/9/4-5 [Recreation/Dating] UID:47895 Activity:very high |
9/4 8am. All clean. Teeth brushed. Clean underwear. No more porn
HOW LONG WILL I LAST? Bets?
\_ Do you mean no more porn physically or no more porn in your mind?
For me, if it's the latter, it'd be 2-3 minutes.
\_ HAVE RESISTED ALL DAY! ok fine i thought of jsl's
gigantic firm milk filled heaving straining triple G
taught breasts for 2 minutes.
\_ What exactly were her breasts taught?
\_ Sorry, jsl's full name please?
\_ jsl's pics please?
\_ 7AM and I AM STILL RESISTING. thanks jsl!
\_ jsl can you eat a few more cheeseburgers like
this girl? http://xrl.us/5nhe ok thx.
\_ I wouldn't give the clean underwear till noon. |
| 2007/9/4-7 [Politics/Domestic/California, Politics/Foreign/Europe] UID:47896 Activity:very high |
9/4 "Annual job growth has definitely not reached pre-recession levels in
1990s. In California, 200,000 jobs were added last year compared to
400,000 (annually) between 1997 and 2000. In the United States, we're
still nowhere where we were in annual job additions as a whole." The
200,000 increase was unable to keep up with the state's increasing
population, with unemployment jumping to 5.2 percent in the last 12
months from 4.9 percent the previous year. The same holds true for
wages. While earnings rose by 0.4 percent between 2006 and 2007
nationwide, the biggest increase in five years, in California real
wages fell by 0.8 percent. Statewide, wages are 1 percent lower in 2007
than in 2003.
-Arindrajit Dube, UC Berkeley Center for Labor Research and Education
\_ You mean the economy of the 90s that was based on nothing, like
http://pets.com? And "jumped" to 5.2%? I thought that was theoretically
full employment. Or are we supposed to ignore the unemployment rate
only when it's going down?
\_ From poking around http://www.bls.gov/lau (regional
resources there on the right) it looks like unemplyment
is due for a serious upswing soon. One thing to note
about those graphs, if you look at the cycles they have
they are pretty cyclical, but the unemployment percentages
have been trending down over the years. That's because
politicians have had a strong intrest in redefining unemployment
so that the numbers come out lower. In the 70s it was a hell
of a lot easier to be classified as unemployed than it is now.
\_ Screw your predictions. Let us know when it actually happens.
\_ http://tinyurl.com/3asgnu
Tell me that doesn't look like the start of a big jump.
\_ Oh good grief. You can't extrapolate 100 data points from
3 (numbers pulled out of my ass).
\_ I'm not saying it is a sure thing, but I'd bet even
money on it. In a heartbeat.
\_ This bet is looking better and better:
http://www.csua.org/u/jgl
\_ I read this morning that for the first time since 2001, Japan
and a few EU countries might have exceeded US GDP growth. So
clearly the non-US countries have the right economic plans in
place. It just took 6+ years to see the positive results.
\_ Japan's GDP growth has a lot to do with trade surplus against
China. And China can only afford such trade plus because
*ITS* trade surplus against USA. So, in that regard,
you should give yourself a bit more credit. Now, please
go ahead take out another equity loans for the sake of global
economy growth.
\_ Umm.. I don't think that follows, exactly.
\_ This. Is. MOTD!! Where non sequitur rules!
\_ What has GDP/capita growth been like in those countries?
Who really cares if the nations overall GDP has gone up
if all that has just been due to population growth? Most of
Europe has beaten US GDP/capita growth for about three
years. And even Japan is starting to beat us now.
\_ 5.2% is a cooked figure that does not include all the out
of work illegals. According to The Economist, if we used
the pre-Clinton way of counting unemployment, it would
be about 1.5% higher. Most economists these days discount
the idea of "full employment" after the decade long period
of 4% unemployment and low inflation in the 90s. How man
people do you think actually worked at http://pets.com and other
<DEAD>dot.com<DEAD>s? It was a pretty small part of the economy.
\_ Pre-Clinton? You mean Bush/Reagan? 6.7% is still lower
\_ Pre-Clinton? You mean Bush/R \_ Pre-Clinton? You mean B\
ush/Reagan? 6.7% is still lower
than anywhere in Europe yet their economies and health plans
are stronger than here so we should be emulating their
success.
\_ No, there are many countries in Europe with an
unemployment rate less than 6.7 or even 5.2. Try
Ireland, The Netherlands and Switzerland, to start.
And it was Clinton who really started fudging the
numbers, not Reagan.
\_ Those are not big economies. My village of 12 people
has a 0% jobless rate. And I don't know about the
other two but Ireland is hardly known for their high
productivity, hard work, and strong work ethic. Take
a look at real countries like Germany and France.
\_ What benefit do hard work and a strong work ethic
bring to the citizens of a country? Other than
more work. -tom
\_ Prosperity. Or we could all just live off the
government dole with magically created food,
housing, and other products. Where do you come
up with this stuff? Is there some web site
where I can just pre-read all this bizareness?
\_ The countries in western Europe are plenty
prosperous. And they're more productive
than the U.S. on a per-hour-worked basis. -tom
\_ http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/04/business/worldbusiness/04output.html?ref=business
-- ilyas
\_ hi ilyas my elisp killed your url.
sorry.
\_ So you have the 5 seconds to apologize
but not 5 seconds to put the url back?
It's this btw:
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/04/business/worldbusiness/04output.html
ERROR: Moved Temporarily
If your scripts are broken don't use
them. -- ilyas
\_ my url shorterner really hates
that url. very very odd.
\_ Not only are you wrong about current
productivity but western europe's socialist
system is headed towards complete collapse
as the number of workers per slacker has
dropped dramatically in the last few
decades. But nevermind all those pesky
facts. The government will just raise
someone else's taxes and magically provide
the rest of us with all we need from cradle
to grave.
\_ Usenet libertarians have been predicting
the imminent collapse of "socialist
Europe" since at least 1989. Since
then, if anything, they have been
catching up to the US.
\_ Catching up in what way? Europe
will collapse before the US
does. They have already started
cutting services.
\_ Median GDP per person as a
percentage of the US median GDP.
How would you measure "catching
up"?
\_ I didn't see what you were
getting at. I don't think
median GDP per person is
useful in this sense. What
is important is to look at
outlays versus expenditures,
especially commitments
that have been made. If
GDP doubles, but outlays
will triple then Europe
will still go broke.
\_ If their economy is growing
faster than ours, it is
pretty hard to make the
case that it is collapsing.
No one (no one who is
intellectually serious at
least) believes that govt
outlays will exceed the
size of the economy.
\_ Of course not, because
they will be cut before
then as is already
happening. When
those outlays shrink
then, surprise!,
socialism becomes
strikingly similar
to what we have in
the US currently. It
is impossible to
continue with the
current European model.
You should look at
"profit" as defined
by GDP growth minus
growth of outlays at
the current level of
benefits. I am betting
this is a negative number.
\_ Not a chance that this
is a negative number
since 1989.
\_ What makes you
say this? France's
2% GDP growth?
This chart doesn't
show what I'd like,
but it still shows
that France is
borrowing heavily:
http://tinyurl.com/23d4ny
ERROR: Don't shorten\
urls from other shortening services
BTW, the unfunded
SS liability in
France is 2x that
of the USA.
Yes, that chart doesn't show what you'd like_/
In fact, it shows the exact opposite of what
you'd like. It shows that public deficit
peaked at 5.9% in 1993 and since then has
more or less steadily been going down to
the current level of 2.5%. Unless taxes
have been going up (hint: they have not)
the "growth of outlays" as you put it
has been negative. So GDP (per capita,
because that is what really matters)
minus growth of outlays (which has been
negative) is quite strongly positive.
How do I know this? Because I pay
attention to stuff like this, that's
why. The government's expenditures as
a percentage of the total economy has
been trending down for a while in Europe,
which is the exact opposite of your
thesis.
http://qsi.cc/blog/pictures/GovConsShareofGDP.gif
link:xrl.us/5puc
\_ France reformed its SS system, so that could be why
expenditures have been less. It could be because they
cut other programs like defense. We don't know from
this data. However, cuts will continue to happen. If you
look at your own chart you will see that expenditure
is flat from 1991 to 2002 (slightly higher for France,
actually). As for the chart I showed, that is the
deficit each year. The country is in the red every
year. How many years can that continue? Sure, they are
better off now than in 1993, but essentially flat since
1990. In fact, the deficit exceeded that of 1990 in
15 of 18 years. When a country runs a deficit every
year that means the current model is not sustainable.
I have an aunt and many cousins in France and two aunts
and a cousin in Holland and they all say that the level
of government services that they had in the 1970s and
1980s does not exist anymore. They blame the influx of
immigrants from Africa and the Middle East. Regardless
of who is to blame, the socialist utopia is breaking
down and I think it will ultimately erode almost to the
point of the US system. It is ironic that so many in
the US wish to emulate them when their governments are
trying to emulate us (though it is a hard sell to
people used to being on the dole). My Dutch cousin, a
teacher by trade but an artist and author in an ideal
world, was made to go back to work for the first time
in her life (she's 45). She had worked when she wanted
and took time off (paid for the government, of course)
to do art and write when she wanted. Needless to say,
she eventually didn't bother teaching at all. Why would
you when you get checks and an apartment for nothing?
Well, the government finally (after the last reform)
told her they needed teachers, she wasn't injured and
to get her butt back to work. The horror! Oh she was so
mad! It's just another sign that things are not how
they used to be and I think that is good for the
Europeans, many of whom had gotten lazy.
\_ The plural of anecdote is not data. What other
major economic power has run a budget deficit every
single year (except one) for the last 20 years? Hint:
you don't have to look too far to find it. The EU has
huge efficiencies that that US does not, which I will
not bother trying to explain to you, since your mind
is already made up, in the abscence of any factual
information whatsover. In any case, my prediction is
that the US and EU economies will converge, and that
neither one will "collapse", which is your prediction.
Let's watch and see who is correct, shall we?
\_ The EU will collapse *unless they change what
they are doing*. If they converge with the US
then of course they won't collapse. However,
that's not status quo now is it? The US is
running debts because of defense spending and not
because of social programs. I have anecdotal
evidence *and* data. You don't have either. have
you ever been to Europe? Do you know anything
about it?
\_ Yes, I have been to Europe, many times. You
predicted the complete and inevitable collapse
of the EU economy. Nice to see that you are
backpeddling now in the face of evidence. The
only data you presented not only didn't support
your case, it argued against it. And why is
deficit spending due to defense spending any
more likely to improve an economy than any other?
The best kind of deficit spending is probably
on infrastructure improvement and education, not
on blowing up people in Iraq.
\_ Uh, no. My chart does not argue against my
point. France is running a deficit every
year and 15 of the last 18 years it
has run deficits larger than it did in 1990
so clearly it is digging itself a hole with
current policy. I never said that defense
spending is "better" only that we are
talking about social programs. The US will
not spend itself to death because of social
programs unless Hilary does something stupid.
France, on the other hand, will do so
unless they change their system. It's a lot
easier to cut defense spending than to tell
several generations of people to expect less
because their expectations of housing and
health care were unrealistic. BTW, I
predict that EU will collapse *if they
continue doing what they are doing*. They
can always alter the course. I would never
argue against that. It's not backpeddling.
I would lump in Japan, too.
\_ As stated, the EU continues to make
more non-working people than working
people. If you can explain how that
trend can continue without leading
to inevitable collapse I'd love to
hear it. If you can explain what
will stop that trend, instead, that
would be nice too. Until you can do
so, smearing people with some silly
'usenet libertarian' label and
changing what was said into a straw
man.
\_ "European socialist" is not a
straw man, but "usenet libertarian"
straw man, but "usenet
libertarian"
is? How about this one then? You
are a crackpot.
libertarian" is? How about
this one then? You are a crackpot.
\_ They proudly call themselves
that. It is not an insult to
call them socialists. Now then
anytime you'd like to answer my
trendline questions, feel free.
\_ Did you say "anywhere in Europe" or not? And those
are just the ones I knew of off the top of my head,
I am sure there are others. But yes, the big
countries in Europe all have high unemployment,
with the exception of the UK, if that is Europe.
And you obviously don't know about the "Irish
miracle." It is one of the fastest growing
economies in Europe.
\_ Based on freakishly low, nearly illegal levels of
business taxes designed to drain their neighbor's
economies. Miracle indeed.
\_ Can you explain for us not economically
enabled how you can drain your neighbor's
economies by doing something in your own
country?
\_ "illegal levels"? lol
\_ If you have free trade and work agreements
with other countries those may very well
have rules to stop just this kind of
abuse. Treaties with other nations
work like laws, the penalties for breaking
them are just different than if you get
caught going 150 mph with 5 kilos of
blow and trunkload of dead hookers.
\_ Low business taxes are not an abuse. Why
must there be any business taxes? A
business is not a person. It's redundant
with other forms of taxes. It's the
argument of idiots that we should "tax
the rich greedy corporations" as if they
are magical beings independent of their
employees, customers, and shareholders.
\_ Because then everyone who can afford
to incorperates, and has a magic
bussiness that buys them what they
need and it is a huge loophole. But
mostly because taxes are not a one
time thing. The same money gets
taxed over and over again, goes
into the government who spends it
and guess what, gets taxed AGAIN.
It's not a simple system and any
attempt to claim that taxes should
only happen at one place because
anything else is double taxation or
whatever bullshit is the ravings
of a moronic libritarian utopian.
\_ No, it is the ravings of a perfectly
intellegent and self-serving wealthy
person who is trying to shift their
tax burden to someone else.
\_ "intellegent"? stupid fuck.
\_ spelling flames: the last
refuge of he who has lost
his argument
\_ I saw no argument, merely
an idiotic assertion.
\_ Incorporating isn't that expensive.
You file some paperwork, it costs a
few bucks well within reach of anyone
with income to be taxed.
\_ A magic business buying everything
someone needs is illegal. You can't
write off everything unless you
are committing fraud. I didn't
say tax should happen at one place
because of double taxation. I just
say that business taxes result are
say that business taxes are
ultimately paid by people. And
your argument is fucking stupid:
"mostly because taxes are not a
one time thing". Uh, stupid?
one time thing". That's not even
an argument. "You need business
taxes because taxes are not a
one time thing." ???
Libertarianism is a worthy goal
where it works. We should avoid
something because it is "libertarian"?
Yes control is good for its own
sake. Totalitarian fuckwad.
\_ Libertarianism is a great
thing in your magic utopian
world where it works worth a
damn. Then again so is
communism. And benevolent
fascism. Sadly, we don't live
in any of those worlds.
\_ Only in your pessimistic
communist world is Liberty itself
and impossible ideal.
\_ And you want to flame others
for their spelling? Oy vey.
\_ Yeah, those lazy Irish can't do crap. Eatin'
potatoes and drinking beer all the time.
\_ Not so much on the potatoes anymore but
otherwise just about right, yeah. |
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