12/19   Huh?  The Governor says the "hidden tax" of paying for health treatment
        of illegals should be replaced by....an open tax.  How will this
        improve things?
        http://www.dailynews.com/theiropinion/ci_4863698
        \_ Full cost accounting. You can see where the money is going and
           decide to increase/decrease it and how. When it's hidden, you
           have no control over it. I think that if people knew the true
           costs of illegal immigrants then they can make informed
           decisions. As it is now, all we have are vague estimates and
           debate over whether illegals help or hurt the economy.
           \_ What's stupid about this though is that it's not like there's
              going to be an "illegal immigrants who consume health treatment
              tax dollars revenue fund".
           \_ Given the number of emergency rooms which have closed, I don't
              thing there's a debate.
              \_ Sure there is. Are they contributing elsewhere (e.g.
                 lower prices on goods and services)? Do the pluses
                 outweigh the minuses? One way is to start openly tracking
                 this stuff.
                 \_ Of course, the Gov. said this was a drag on the economy, so
                    you're making a different argument than he is.
                    \_ Someone said there's no debate. I disagree with
                       this. I didn't 'make an argument' other than that
                       the benefits of illegal immigrants are debatable.

12/19   Welcome to CA, now part of Mexico
        http://www.ocregister.com/ocregister/homepage/abox/article_1386317.php
        \_ The purpose of a school is to educate its local population.  If this
           lets them do that more effectively, what's the problem?
           \_ The point is that CA is becoming part of Mexico.
              \_ The school district's plan sounds like a good idea, actually.
                 The only people it is bad for are people like me who would
                 have to pay for childcare during the day when the kids
                 are out of school. No instructional time is lost and no
                 (school) dollars are lost. It's a more creative plan than
                 I would give most school districts credit for.
                 \_ School administrators have always been infinitely creative
                    when it comes to getting state funds for their child/day
                    rate.  This is all about money, not doing something for
                    the benefit of parents.  For kicks I'm going to look for
                    the Santa Ana school district's test scores to see how
                    creative the administrators are with that whole silly
                    teaching thing.
                 \_ Mexico's annexed OC without annexing San Diego? Taxes are
                    being funneled to MC? Vicente Fox has bought a retirement
                    home here? They're electing (and then crucifying) PRI
                    candidates? What part, other than genetics, makes this
                    different from Korean Town or China Town?

12/19   Zucker's take on the ISG: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-w77sLtz754
        \_ Ah, yes, that Neville Chamberlain of our time, James Baker. I'm
           sorry, wtf are you talking about?
        \_ Sorry, no one is buying your BS anymore.
           \_ What BS?  I pointed to a video on youtube.
              \_ The BS that America is strong and can make other people
                 listen to us. Sorry neocons, the real world doesn't work
                 that way. People hate America and you're not going to make
                 them do what you want them to do just because you think you
                 have the world's greatest military power. Military power
                 comes and goes but resentments live on forever.
                 \_ Who hates America? Do you? The Arabs do because it serves
                    their political leaders for them to do so. I bet China
                    prefers a bit of healthy dislike in its people too given
                    the totalitarianism. The fact is their countries are in
                    a state of shittitude because of their own fucked
                    governments (cf. Iran).
                    \_ The Iranians might hate us because we overthrew
                       their democratically elected government and replaced
                       it with a totalitarian one. Just a thought. Why
                       do the Iraqis hate us? Do you really have to ask
                       that?
                       that? Oh, and just a little geography lesson:
                       Iranians are not Arabs. Thought you might like
                       to know.
                       \_ I didn't say they were. If you asked the average
                          Iranian I bet you will not hear "because they
                          replaced our democratic government".
                    \_ this may shock you, but Chinese government is more
                       popular across the globe than American one.
                       \_ Really?  When did we vote on that?  I haven't
                          missed a vote on anything since I was old enough
                          to vote.
                          \_ anti-American senitment is very stron across the
                             globe during the time when China is forgiving
                             debt and cut checks to Africian oil rich nations
                             with *NO STRING ATTACHED*.
                             You should also dig out old newspaper on how
                             popular Hu Jing-Tao was during his Latin-America
                             tour.
                             As for Middle East, do you have any idea what
                             kind of government would we have today across the
                             Arab nation if we allow them to *VOTE* for their
                             leader?  (hint, Hamas).
                          \_ http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8324290
                             But it wasn't mentioned in MM's blog, so
                             you might have missed it...
                             \_ A Pew poll?  With no numbers?  Ok, whatever.
                                I'm sure you also believe Iraq was a land of
                                chocolate rivers with candied banks under
                                Hussein.  And what exactly would be the
                                surprise if a bunch of socialists prefered
                                a communist country to a democratic capitalist
                                one anyway?
                                \_ I am sure you can google for the source
                                   if you really want to see the numbers.
                                   I am also sure you won't bother to, since
                                   it upsets your fantasy about how the
                                   world is.
                                   world is. You do know that the vast majority
                                   of Iraqis think the country is worse off
                                   now than it was under SH, right?
                                   \_ No I won't do your work for you.  If
                                      you have something to say, go find a
                                      real source for it and post it.  No one
                                      here has the time to google every half-
                                      assed zero-information link posted to
                                      the motd by some crank who believes
                                      in chocolate rivers.  Then you make
                                      another unsubstantiated claim that
                                      I'm supposed to google, too?  How about
                                      you tell me what my fantasy about the
                                      world is since the only thing I've said
                                      so far is your link is garbage.  I see
                                      you also ignored the underlying issue
                                      with a poll "of the world" in that "the
                                      world" is all about predisposed bias and
                                      the odds of getting a "fair" poll about
                                      what "the world" thinks are about zero.
                                      Just curious, do you see yourself as a
                                      "Citizen of the World"?
                                      \_ Tactic 1: ad hominem
                                         Tactic 2: attack the source
                                         Tactic 3 (will occur as soon as I
                                         post a link): claim polls are
                                         meaningless.  -tom
                                      \_ Facts are such bitter stubborn things.
                      http://pewglobal.org/reports/display.php?ReportID=247
                       \_ They don't like Bush. It doesn't translate to
                          a general hatred of America as you imply. At least
                          half our population doesn't like Bush (approval
                          ratings etc).
                          \_ I predict it will take a long time, at least a
                             decade or two, to undo the damage the Bush and his
                             crowd has done to US opinion worldwide.
              \_ I believe it's customary to include either "nutjob" or "He's
                 right, you know" with links like this. Omission thereof tends
                 to imply support. --!pp
              \_ http://www.pollingreport.com/iraq.htm
                 Support for the warmonger faction is down to 28%.

12/19   What do you wish to have for Christmas? Put anything you want, like
        Nintendo Wii, World Peace, Death of all SUV drivers, whatever.
        \_ I want two hours worth of lap dance from Crazy Horse with this
           particular dancer I like.
        \_ I want to be special and own a 4200 sq ft McMansion only 60 miles
           away from the city just like everyone else. I also want an H2 so
           that I don't have to make frequent trips to/from Walmart, and
           actually, a pollutionless H2 so those damn hippies don't curse
           at me on the road. Lastly I want my freeway to be void of other
           drivers and ESPECIALLY hippies so that I don't have to run over
           them when I'm in a hurry.
           \_ Hybrid Humvee:
              http://evworld.com/archives/conferences/evs14/humvee.html
              350hp.  0-50mph in 7sec.  18mpg.  Climbs 60% grade at 17mph and
              fords 5ft of water (think New Orleans).  It even has a stealth
              mode.
              \_ "In addition, the vehicle gets twice the fuel economy at 18 mpg
                 enabling it to carry a smaller fuel tank, while retaining the
                 same 300 miles range."
                 OK, just think about that for a second, and why it's obviously
                 bullshit unless these things are solely used for stop and go
                 traffic...by the armed forces... and if they are... who cares
                 about range?  Ugh.  Stupidity.
                 \_ Range is important in reconnaissance missions.
                    \_ Very much so, but hybridizing a vehicle doesn't increase
                       its absolute ("highway") mileage.  You might gain a
                       little by using the smaller motor, but that's gonna be
                       cancelled by the weight of the batteries and electrical
                       subsystem.  This is why the hybrids that actually show
                       really good numbers also have low resistance tires,
                       low drag coeff., etc.
           \_ What is stopping you?
              \_ Maybe he has a wife who has put a tracking beacon on him. Or
                 maybe he means getting it for free.
        \_ G600
           \_ That means Google -> 600. Hilarious.
        \_ I want soda to work like it did a couple years ago.
           \_ make it deux
        \_ Nokia 770
        \_ Nokia 77
        \_ Nokia E70
        \_ Bush in front of the ICC for his crimes.
           \_ ICC has no spine w/o the U.S.
              \_ No one said it had to be a realistic fantasy...
        \_ Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Libby, Bremmer, and rest hawkish, pro-war
           neocons being throw to Iraq outside the Greenzone.  Let them
           experience the democracy and better life they've created for
           the Iraqi people first hand.
           \_ I'm sure they loved it under Saddam
        \_ You liberal nutjobs serving a day in the military
              \_ at least people don't die at the rate of 100 a day under
                 Saddam.  Physical protection is always more important
                 than political freedom.  If you live in LA slum and worry
                 about being shot everyday, be able to vote or not is probably
                 the last thing on your mind.
                 \_ Give me freedom or give me death! I'll take freedom
                    over food, shelter, and sex! FREEDOM!!!     -American
              \_ 9 out of 10 Iraqis say that things were better before the
                 invasion:
                 http://www.csua.org/u/hs7
                 Original source:
                 link:www.csua.org/u/hs6
                 The Iraq Centre for Research and Strategic Studies used to
                 be hired by the American CPA until that body left Iraq, so
                 they should probably have at least some credibility.
                 FYI, in over half the Western Countries surveyed by Ipsos,
                 a plurality thought that Iraq was better off under SH, as well:
                 http://www.ipsos-mori.com/polls/2006/ap.shtml
        \_ You liberal nutjobs serving a day in the military, like Cheney,
           and Bolton, and Wolfowitz, and Pearle and Scooter and Rove and
           Brooks and Krauthhammer and Delay and Hastert and Lieberman and
           Feith.
           \_ I walked along Telegraph Ave almost every night for a year and
              a half.  That's gotta be at least equivalent! - jvarga
           \_ Well... I spent three years in the 82nd Airborne. -ausman
           \_ hmm... serve under those who dodged the draft... inspiring!
              \_ Obviously you were never in the military during the
                 Clinton years.
                 \_ obviously Clinton never needed over 130,000 troops in
                    a hostile territory. what the fuck are you smoking jlee?
                    \_ I'm glad you can ID me but not ID yourself.
        \_ A wife with ample bosom and hot body.
           \_ As your genie I grant you your wish.
              *POOF*
              "Not tonight dear, I have a headache."
        \_ http://www.divinebreasts.com/i/pod/pod75.jpg
           \_ That is not hot body.  Pre-reduction Christina Ricci body was
              hot body.  (Her face is another matter.)
        \_ How about http://85.17.40.9:88/22a/full/116/1168550884.jpg ?
           \_ Yucks!  I want Sakurako-Kaoru-type.

12/19   "Bus ride upsets black students"
        http://www.csua.org/u/hqz (http://www.mercurynews.com
        Troll: When they had to sit in the back, they complained (Rosa Parks).
        When they have to sit in the front, they complain (now).

12/19   Surgeon's knife may offer hope in African AIDS fight - Yahoo! News:
        http://www.csua.org/u/hpi
        \_ The side effect is that it'll be easier to convert to Judaism!
        \_ Castration will almost completely eliminate risk of all STDs

12/19   Libya Sentences Bulgaria Nurses to Death: http://csua.org/u/hqy
        That is fucking horrible.
        \_ Can't really say I'm surprised.  (Wish I could.)
           \_ you know, invading another country is morally so much superior
              \_ It's raining out, maybe you better get back under your
                 bridge.

12/19   Is csua mail down again?  Outgoing mail does not seem get sent
        \_ thank you~~!
        \_ Hey jvarga, if I throw in one more manpower, would you be able to
           1/2 the time to repair soda?                         -management
           \_ Not likely. - jvarga

12/19   http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20061219/ts_nm/iraq_usa_army_suicides_dc_1
        Will Fox News report that the number of homicides is up?