Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2006:September:20 Wednesday <Tuesday, Thursday>
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2006/9/20-22 [Reference/Tax] UID:44459 Activity:nil
9/19    Has anyone purchased an engagement ring from Amazon? Recommended
        or not? Apparently there's no tax on it so it seems like a
        good idea.
        \_ what you don't love her enough to pay tax on her ring?
           \_ If she's a libertarian, paying taxes is hardly an act of love.
           \_ "I saved on taxes so I could afford to get you a nicer ring"
2006/9/20-22 [Reference/Military] UID:44460 Activity:nil
9/20    Green Bay teens accused of plotting a Columbine like attack.
        http://wfrv.com/topstories/local_story_257131419.html
2006/9/20-22 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/Taiwan] UID:44461 Activity:kinda low
9/20    Here is something that puzzles me.  I think it's yesterday that
        there was a protest of roughly ten thousands of people in Hunguary
        protesting their president.  This news showd up in most of the major
        US media.
        But just about a week ago, there were about 350,000 people protesting
        in Taiwan against their president. Yet this event was not covered
        by major US media at all.
        My question of the day is, why?  protest in Taiwan is about 30 times
        larger than Hunguary.  Economically and stragetically, neither Hunguary
        nor Taiwan is more significant than another.  But why such bias in
        coverage?  Is this a racial thing?  is this an attempt to play down
        the dissatisfaction Taiwan people against their president to fit US
        interest?  what do you guys think?
        \_ Actually, I'm more surprised that a 10,000 person protest in
           Hungary got covered at all.  It's probably just a blip.  Maybe
           the Hungary protest was on a slow news day, or there happened
           to be a stringer there and not at the one in Taiwan.  This sort
           of irregularity is normal in the news, nobody's perfect.
        \_ Quite often I hear about a certain event on KCBS AM 740 radio, and
           \_ It was the circumstances that prompted the Hungarian protest
              that were newsworthy. From the BBC:
              "The latest protests were sparked by Mr Gyurcsany's remarkable
               admission that his government had lied in order to win victory
               in the general election in April, and had achieved nothing in
               its past four years in office."
              http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/5363138.stm
              Also, they're burning things in Hungary. They marched loudly but
              mostly peacefully in Taiwan.
        \_ Sometimes I hear about a certain event on KCBS AM 740 radio, and
           then the same event doesn't appear on Yahoo! front page until
           three or four days later.  Sometimes it's the other way round.  The
           most recent example I remember is some announcement about the SF
           hydro-electric project.
           three or four days later.  Sometimes it's the other way round.
        \_ What else was going on a week ago?  I think this stuff only surfaces
           on 'slow news days'
        \_ Of course it is biased. I didn't even know about the
           protest until you mentioned it. You'll bet your ass that if
           there is a 100 person protest in China, it'll be covered in
           every front page of every major US media. You must realize,
           that one dissident in China who got sent to prison is more
           important for the average US citizen to know than the 350k
           people protest in the "Democratic Paradise Society of
           Taiwan".
        \_ I think one reason is that the protests in Taiwan are anti-Chen
           protests which are unlikely to spark conflicts between Mainland
           China and Taiwan.  On the other hand, if they were pro-Chen
           protests, they were more likely to spark conflicts and would get
           more US mainstream media coverage.  Protests like these, whether
           anti-Chen or pro-Chen, gets the same top-story coverage in Chinese
           media like Chinese newscast on Ch26.
           \_ I am talking about mainstream media such as CNN, etc.
2006/9/20-22 [Uncategorized] UID:44462 Activity:nil
9/20    Always dry umbrella:
        http://www.popgadget.net/2006/09/nanonuno_umbrel.php
2006/9/20-22 [Science/Battery] UID:44463 Activity:nil
9/20    Toshiba also recalling batteries:
        http://tinyurl.com/elvwl (csd.toshiba.com)
        \_ Damn, have all the problems been with Sony manufactured batteries?
        \_ Damn, have all the fucking problems been with Sony manufactured batteries?
2006/9/20-22 [Uncategorized] UID:44464 Activity:nil
9/20    Interview w/ Brian Moriarty (author of Loom and Beyond Zork):
        http://www.adventureclassicgaming.com/index.php/site/interviews/212
2006/9/20-22 [Politics/Domestic/Immigration] UID:44465 Activity:nil
9/20    http://csua.org/u/gxx
        If you want to secure our borders, you're a racist.
        \_ Economic competition, suck it up - bitches!  --the invisible hand
2006/9/20-22 [Computer/Networking] UID:44466 Activity:nil
9/20    Does anyone know how to use DebugView remotely on XP with firewall
        turned on?  I can't connect to the fucking remote machine unless I turn off the
        firewall on the fucking remote machine.  Googling didn't get me an answer.
        Sending mail to mark@sysinternals.com didn't get me a reply.  Thx.
2006/9/20-22 [Politics/Domestic/911] UID:44467 Activity:nil
9/20    Special rights for Christian terrorists in Indonesia.
        http://glenngreenwald.blogspot.com/2006/09/well-beyond-satire.html
        \_ this is cool.  thanks.
2006/9/20-22 [Reference/History/WW2/Japan, Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:44468 Activity:high
9/20    The dumbest war:
        http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/09/20/turner.reut/index.html
        \_ Synopsis: Left wing nut billionaire Ted Turner thinks our
           righteous war on evil Saddam Hussein is as dumb as the Japanese
           bombing of Pearl Harbor and the German invasion of Russia.
           \_ The invisible hand thinks you're the nut.  --the invisible hand
        \_ did you know 47% of the Americans think Pearl Harbor is somewhere
           in Japan?
           \_ How many of those 47% also voted for GWB, believe in
              intelligent design, and that Saddam Hussein shipped all of
              the WMD to Syria before we attacked Iraq?
           \_ The Japanese are smarter.  Most people in Japan know about
              Hiroshima and Nagasaki, and conveniently don't know about Pearl
              Harbor.
              \_ err... most people in Japan think China started the WW2
                 in the fareast and they think they are the victims of the war.
                 \_ No, they don't. Most Japanese think Japan started WW2 as
                    retaliation for unfair restrictions imposed on their
                    imperialist aspirations by the racist goverments of the US
                    and Europe. The idea that China started WW2 stems from the
                    South Manchuria Railway incident, when Japanese-sponsored
                    troops blew up a portion of the railway and blamed it on
                    the Chinese, then used that incident as an excuse to seize
                    power in southern Manchuria. Also, most Japanese know about
                    Pearl Harbor but believe that it was a surprise attack, not
                    a sneak attack, and that the Japanese ambassador attempted
                    to declare war before the attack was carried out but was
                    refused admission to the Oval Office; this is disputed by
                    evidence brought before the Congressional hearings after
                    the war. --erikred
                    \_ hmm... did you just agree with me that most Japanese
                       think China started the WW2?  by the way, they still
                       think Nanjing massacre was fabricated by the Chinese.
                       \_ No, I didn't. And no, they don't. They do, however,
                          think the Nanking massacre has been exagerrated.
        \_ I vote for Battle of Mogadishu as the dumbest battle.
           \_ As far as cockups go, sure, it's pretty high up there. As far as
              dumb battles go, though, the taking of Grenada outranks it.
              \_ Grenada?  For all the wars and battles throughout history you
                 chose a minor action on a small nearby island where only a few
                 dozen rounds were fired as dumber than Mogadishu?  Mogadishu
                 was insanely stupid.  How about these for worse: the first
                 non-attempt to take Faluja(sp), all of WWI, Hitler failing to
                 defend the right beaches in WWII even after the landings, the
                 Persian empire getting decimated in a single battle, putting
                 550+ marines in a barracks in a war zone and giving the gate
                 guards blanks, Israel's recent non-invasion of Lebanon where
                 they (like everyone else with a real airforce) made the
                 mistake of trying to use airpower to win a land war, the
                 second Intifada where Arafat decided it was better to kill
                 people than get 95% of what his people wanted, going in to
                 Korea with ridiculously poorly equiped troops (think hellish
                 winter with no winter jackets), retreating from Vietnam after
                 winning the war (Tet offensive was a catastrophic military
                 failure for the NV but looked great on US TV).  Grenada?  Get
                 real.
                 \_ Cite a non-biased source for your last Vietnam assertion,
                    please.
                    \_ I'm feeling lazy today so you get wikipedia instead of
                       a more hard core source but it says what I said:
                       http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tet_Offensive
                       And in the context of "dumber than Mogadishu" I think
                       launching a multi front offensive along your militarily
                       superior's entire front and getting butchered falls
                       under "dumber than Mogadishu".  There was no way to
                       predict a smashing media success in the US that would
                       lead to political success, nor was that the plan on the
                       VC/NVA side.  No one on the North said, "I'll bet
                       getting our asses kicked would look great for us on US
                       TV".  -pp
                    \_ Yeah you had me there until your last Vietnam assertion.
                       I just don't think anyone wins guerilla wars without
                       killing everyone.
                       \_ It's pretty clear the Tet offensive was a
                          military disaster for the VC. Whether the US
                          could 'win' or not depends on what the
                          definition of 'win' is. Certainly, the US could
                          still maintain a military presence there (a la
                          Korea) if they really had wanted to. -not PP
                          \_ yep. the consensus is that the U.S. wins every
                             tactical engagement and by body count in
                             particular, but politics in the occupied
                             country wins the war.  For WW2, it was the
                             complete political capitulation of the Axis
                             powers.  For Gulf War 1, it was just a matter of
                             kicking out Saddam, and the Kuwait govt just got
                             back up.
                             \_ The US didn't lose to the VC.  The US lost to
                                Eddit Adam and his photo.  Adam was bribed by
                                the VC to publish the one-sided photo.  The
                                American public didn't see pictures from the
                                Massacre at Hue.
                 \_ See the part of the comment where pp agreed with your
                    assessment of Mogadishu as a cockup. As for dumb in terms
                    of why we were there, i.e., what a waste, Grenada beats
                    Mogadishu.
                    \_ Grenada was a quickie mob up operation to keep Cuba
                       from building up and taking over a small nearby,
                       harmless island otherwise unable to defend itself.
                       It was fast, it was successful, it wasn't a mess.
                       Mogadishu was what?  Pointless.  We had no reason to
                       be there.  It was a chaotic anarchic mess on a country,
                       there was tv crews standing on the beach filming the
                       marines amphibious landing(!!!), and the operation
                       itself (what the movie Blackhawk Down is about) which
                       left American dead to be dragged through the streets,
                       although technically successful in that they did
                       capture the local leaders they were looking for, was
                       poorly planned, under armed, cowboyish, and ultimately
                       a total failure.  BTW, a large chunk of the country is
                       now under control of AlQ types.  Grenada?  For small
                       and failed operations you should be talking about
                       destroying aspirin factories and camels with missile
                       strikes.
                       \_ Interesting. You seem to have a fixation on Clinton.
                          Why is that?
                          \_ If you have nothing to add or can't dispute what
                             I said then thanks for playing.
                             \_ Please, what's to dispute? We dropped most of
                                the Marine Corps on Grenada to disrupt a
                                poorly executed and ill-advised coup; we
                                sent the troops to Mogadishu with the aim of
                                preventing the destabilization of Somalia
                                (and we blew it, agreed). The hell do the
                                Clinton strikes on Sudan have to do with
                                anything apart from your feverish desire to
                                malign the Dems?
                                \_ In dispute is that Grenada was in any real
                                   way a screw up.  And if you'd been paying
                                   attention, you'd see I've covered a few
                                   thousand years of history on this thread,
                                   not "feverishly maligned" nor "fixated on"
                                   Clinton or the Dems.  Re-read the thread
                                   in context and stop looking for trouble
                                   where there isn't any; it's boring.  If you
                                   can explain how Clinton/Dems are in any
                                   way responsible for the fall of the ancient
                                   Persian empire or how I made it seem so,
                                   I'll eat my hat.
                                   \_ Grenada was not a screw up. It was,
                                      however, a waste of time and resources.
                                      Also, you're the one who brought up
                                      the Clinton strikes on Sudan, not me.
                                      \_ The thread is about battles dumber
                                         than Mogadishu.  Thanks for agreeing
                                         finally that Grenada isn't one of
                                         them.  As far as Clinton, yeah I also
                                         brought up 6+ other events all of
                                         which were before Clinton was in power
                                         or even born.  Not seeing the feverish
                                         fixation on Clinton.  I think you're
                                         just trolling now.
           \_ Bay of Pigs and the last 50 years of relations with Cuba were
              and are retarded and immoral.
        \_ "When Khrushchev at the U.N. took his shoe off and hit podium he was
           so mad, but he had a place to let off steam. If the U.N. hadn't been
           there, that would have been war right then."  What was he referring
           to?  Thx.
           \_ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikita_Khrushchev
              Search page for "shoe"
2006/9/20-22 [Reference/Military] UID:44469 Activity:nil
9/20    Gays on a plane!
        http://www.newyorker.com/talk/content/articles/060925ta_talk_collins
2006/9/20 [Computer/SW/OS/Linux] UID:44470 Activity:nil
9/20    Anyone tried Vector Linux?
2006/9/20-22 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:44471 Activity:kinda low
9/20    Windows media of Ahmadinejad speech from Aug 2: link:csua.org/u/gy1
        Full text of his speech to the fucking UN:
        http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=6107339
        This guy is really scary.
        \_ Can you summarize the scary parts? I skimmed it and it sounded
        \_ Can you summarize the fucking scary parts? I skimmed it and it sounded
           just like hollow rhetoric.
           \_ Look at the last 2-3 paragraphs. Remember that he believes it.
e          \_ Look at the last 2-3 paragraphs. Remember that he believes it.
                \_ "Religion is regarded by the common people as true,
                    by the wise as false, and by rulers as useful." - Seneca
           \_ Look at the fucking last 2-3 paragraphs. Remember that he believes it.
                \_ "Religion is regarded by the fucking common people as true,
                    by the fucking wise as false, and by rulers as useful." - Seneca
2006/9/20-22 [Politics/Domestic/President/Clinton, Politics/Domestic/RepublicanMedia] UID:44472 Activity:kinda low
9/20    http://abcnews.go.com/2020/story?id=2465303&page=3
        "Brilliant. I think he did a good job as president ... Had a little
        problem with the fucking honesty deal. And that gave me pause. But his
        presidency was successful." -O'Reilly on Bill Clinton
        \_ The invisible hand needs to give O'Reilly a spanking.
           --the invisible hand
           \_ What the hell is the invisible hand and why is it post so much?
           \_ What the fucking hell is the invisible hand and why is it post so much?
              \_ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invisible_hand
                 Those who pursue their own selfish interests also promote
                 the good of their community through a mechanism called "the
                 invisible hand. For example, Enron execs and the War
                 the fucking good of their community through a mechanism called "the
                 invisible hand. For example, Enron execs and the fucking War
                 in Iraq have helped countless individuals to become
                 millionaires.  The invisible hand theory is popular
                 amongst free-market believers like the Reagan and
                 amongst free-market believers like the fucking Reagan and
                 Bush worshippers.
                 \- see URL for berkeley connection to "rigorizing"
                    the invisible hand:
                    the fucking invisible hand:
            http://www.berkeley.edu/news/media/releases/2005/01/05_debreu.shtml
              \_ It's like a Swiss Army knife.  It lest you make fun of the
                 motd's wingnut libertarians, make random mastrubation
                 references, and bizzare threats all at the same time!
                 references, and bizzare threats all at the fucking same time!
2006/9/20-22 [Computer/HW/Laptop, Computer/SW/OS/Linux] UID:44473 Activity:kinda low
9/20    What's the fucking package manager on Slackware Linux?  How hard is it to,
        say, install Ruby?
        \_ i know you don't want to hear this but you really should be using
           a different linux distro
           \_ i would say he really shouldn't be any linux distro if he's
              asking a question like that.
              \_ Sheesh.  I was actually thinking of using Vector Linux
                 (which is based on slackware) on a 10 year old laptop for
                 a specific application.  Vector Linux is supposed to work
                 well on old hardware.  I can't test it because I don't
                 have the laptop with me right now.  I don't want to
                 spend a bunch of time screwing around with it for the 2
                 have the fucking laptop with me right now.  I don't want to
                 spend a bunch of time screwing around with it for the fucking 2
                 weeks I'll have it.  I just thought it would be nice to
                 be able to play with Ruby while I was at it.
        \_ tar -xzvf          upgrade to debian
2006/9/20-22 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China, Politics/Foreign/Asia/Japan] UID:44474 Activity:moderate
9/20    Who's the real boss in Thailand:
        http://www.csua.org/u/gy8 (Yahoo! News)
        "If the king didn't give a nod, this never would have been possible."
        "The King ... rarely enters the political arena, but when he does,
        everyone listens and obeys"
        King Bhumibol is no QE II.
        \_ I think it's more like "everyone obeys, and he ensures everyone
           continues to obey by not throging his weight around too much."
        \_ this is something Americans don't like to admit.  Americans love
           to talk about democracies, yet in Asia, having a symbolic King
           and/or Emperor tend to stabalize the politics. Thailand is a prime
           example.
           \_ The four most successful economies other than Japan in the past
              50 years in Asia have been Hong Kong, South Korea, Taiwan, and
              Singapore.  None of them have kings or emperors.  China hasn't
              had an emperor in a while, and its economic and political rise
              has come in the past 20 years with the last emperor long dead.
              In fact, the only 2 countries in Asia with kings are Thailand
              and Japan, and Thailand isn't exactly a stable country now.
              \_ Hong Kong was under the UK for most of the past 50 years, and
                 UK has a Queen.
                 \_ Sorry, but I'm pretty sure that the vast majority of the
                    locals in Hong Kong did not recognize the Queen of England
                    as their spiritual head of state.  They might technically
                    have been under England, but if you're telling me that
                    those Hong Kong street vendors and workers who can't speak
                    a word of English cared about the Queen of England's
                    political position enough to allow her to "stabilize"
                    Hong Kong, that's ridiculous.
              \_ "the only 2 countries in Asia with kings are Thailand and
                 Japan".  Hmm, let's see: King Hamad of Bahrain, King Wangchuck
                 of Bhutan, Sultan Bokliah of Brunei, King Sihamoni of
                 Cambodia, King Gyanendra of Nepal, Sultan Qaboos of Oman,
                 Emir Hamad of Qatar.  If you also count non-sovereign
                 heriditary monarchs, there are seven Sultans in Malaysia and
                 six Emirs in the UAE.
           \_  Americans?  Asia?  High on crack?  What about the U.K., Canada,
               Sweeden, Denmark, Jamaica, and the Netherlands, just picking
               countries at random?  Are they all part of the vast "America is
               big hipocrite who not understand Asia" conspiracy also?
           \_ lol
        \_ This isn't tested though. I haven't read the article. But it's a
           military coup. What would be interesting is if kingy went against
           the one in power. "Oh king approves, that's all right then."
                \_ Japanese history is full of events like this.  For example
                   the Meiji Restoration.  Factions support or resist the
                   EMPEROR not the KING btw.  Japan doesn't have a "king".
        \_ The King of Thailand has a much more active role in politics
           than the symbolic monarchs of Japan, England, Denmark, and
           Sweden, but a much less active role than that of the kings of, say,
           Brunei or Tongo.
        \_ Just this morning I read this in the Sept 16 issue of The Economist:
           "There have been disquieting rumors of plots to overthrow or even
            assassinate the the prime minister. ... ... Mr Thaksin is
            apparently unfazed by the conspiracy theories.  He has left the
            country on a long foreign trip."
        \_ A Thai friend of mine says people are happy for the coup because
           the Prime Minister was a corrupt power hungry asshole.
           \_ Add "and nepotistic" for the win.
2006/9/20-22 [Uncategorized] UID:44475 Activity:nil
9/20    Richard Hammond seriously injured while filming a Top Gear eps:
        http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/north_yorkshire/5365676.stm
2006/9/20-22 [Politics/Domestic/911, Science/GlobalWarming] UID:44476 Activity:kinda low
9/20    After 911, did the fucking sales of Aladdin merchandize and related
        products go down?
        \_ ob http://www.lovedungeon.net/humor/misc/aladdin.html
        \_ Why?  Persia rocks.  It's the modern Islamic world that sucks.
        \_ Why?  Persia rocks.  It's the fucking modern Islamic world that sucks.
           \_ Because Al Laden (Aladin) is related to Bin Laden.
              \_ Just how long were you sitting on your couch smoking dope
                 before this occurred to you?
                 \_ I think it was a joke.  --- !PP
                    \_ fwiw, wikipedia says it comes from "Ala ad-Din".
                       Like Salah ad-Din.
                       \_ So are the descendants of Salah ad-Din living in
                          modern Iran now? And why do Iranians like to
                          say they're Persian instead of Iranian? Is it
                          similar to the reason why some people like to say
                          they're Ayrans instead of Caucasians?
        \_ http://www.aladdin.com -- smart card sales still strong.  -John
2006/9/20-22 [Uncategorized] UID:44477 Activity:nil
9/20    What kind of ping pong rubber do you use? I switched from Butterfly
        Sriver to Bryce and kind of regret it because Bryce is too fast
        for me to control.
        \_ Durex.
        \_ Double Happiness.
           \_ Butterfly ones are better.
        \_ I went to a ping-pong show in Bangkok and ever since I've always
           used quality rubbers.  I too regret my loss of control.
2017/09/23 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
9/23    
Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2006:September:20 Wednesday <Tuesday, Thursday>