Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2006:February:09 Thursday <Wednesday, Friday>
Berkeley CSUA MOTD
2006/2/9-11 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/Korea] UID:41777 Activity:nil
        Tallest building in Korea
        \_ I'll bet it's an easy target for North Korean artillery
           \_ South Korea's small and close by. Everywhere is an easy target.
2006/2/9-10 [Uncategorized] UID:41778 Activity:nil
2/8     Anyone know how to turn off the sounds an iMac makes? I want
        to hear some sounds (e.g. music) but not anything else. I
        unchecked "Play user interface sound effects" and notice some
        sounds have stopped, but not others. For instance, pressing tab
        when in Terminal still makes a beep.
        \_ choose visual feedback in Universal Access
           \_ I don't see that option, but played with some others
              under Universal Access and nothing helps. Maybe you mean
              "Flash screen on beep"? Doesn't help either.
        \_ Terminal has its own preferences; turn on "Visual Bell".  -tom
2006/2/9-10 [Politics/Domestic/Election, Reference/Tax] UID:41779 Activity:high
2/9     With housing costs outstriping salaries, 40% of young people are
        moving back in with their parents after college. "And with deep
        cuts to education and tax breaks aimed mainly older, wealthier
        Americans, government no longer has young adults back." Gosh,
        I don't know whether to feel bad for these kids or laugh at
        them. They should have been born in another era.
        \_ And why is housing so expensive?
           \_ there's a shock, the Cato Institute thinks that government
              regulation is the cause of all our problems!  -tom
              \_ Actually a couple of guys from Harvard and UPenn.
        \_ "A college degree is mandatory for most entry-level
            professional jobs, but most of today's job growth is in
            low-paying, low-skill industries like retail and food
           Isn't globalization supposed to force Americans to move
           up the job food chain, instead of down?
           \_ It does happen, just not immediately. The Reaganists and the
              Free Market theorists say that there is a short period that
              people down the chain will have to make adjustments. In
              practice, that short period lasts about 1/2 a person's lifetime,
              and adjustments are rarely made because displaced workers
              usually have no foundations and stepping stones to
              which they could better themselves in order to take jobs
              that require higher skill sets.
           \_ "advertised to" != "supposed to"
        \_ What exactly is wrong w/ this? For most of human history
           people lived in extended families and it mostly worked.
           \_ Nothing wrong.  It's just that people want to moan louder these
              days and they don't want their parents to hear it.
              \_ No, I also think there is more of an expectation of
                 personal privacy and space.  Some people moan about this
                 as an indication of the decline of "family values", while
                 others just don't feel comfortable with the idea of the
                 perceived intrusiveness of shared living space.  Unfortunately
                 that costs.  I feel bad for people who don't have the
                 possibility of their own space, although regarding the
                 article, I don't understand why people in a dodgy financial
                 situation opt to have children.  -John
                 \_ what?!  even Big Cow Wang making $1 a day in rural
                    china can have children.  the dude in the article
                    is making $27000 per year. of course he can and
                    should have children.  that's his right, and any
                    place where a person making $27000 can't afford
                    children must be seriously screwed up.  what I
                    find really wrong is all the tax breaks rich
                    people get when they have children.  I don't mind
                    subsidizing poor people for child care expenses
                    but why do rich people get them too?  It's good
                    that you still don't have children.  I would hate
                    paying tax to support your kids and your
                    expensive tastes.  ok, just kidding.
                    \_ I think child care tax credits phases out as income
                       goes up.
                 \_ The world has more people now than ever before.  I don't
                    think it is really a case of "living with family" vs not.
                    I think it is that when you and 500 people live in a small
                    village and the next village is 2 days away, you are going
                    to get a lot more 'personal space' than living with your
                    parents in a 4/3 house in the burbs.
                    \_ I think think the village of Long Wang, China (2 sq.
                       miles, 500,000 inhabitants, 3 billion chickens) is not
                       something by which I want any society I live in to
                       measure itself.  And yes, by all means have children,
                       but don't whine if you're too poor to support them
                       in the manner you'd like, and don't rely on my state
                       to do so.  -John
                       \_ 500k in 2 sq. miles is exactly what I'm talking
                          about as a "Bad Thing" that you'd only see in an
                          over crowded world.  And no, I don't want to shell
                          out so someone else can have 8 kids and still live
                          like a prince, either.
                       \_ Thanks for your concern, but we manage our affairs
                          just fine, and we alway say "butt out" when
                          American hypocrites start whining about our
                          population control policy, etc.  We also plan on
                          turning Tibet into a big theme park tourist
                          attraction.  All the Tibetans are very excited
                          with the prospects of new tourist money.  But
                          we still love our American friends, so when they
                          are in big economy trouble because their people
                          are lazy and love to enjoy life, and their
                          government is corrupt and like to spend money,
                          we help them by appreciating our currency and
                          lending lots of money to them.  This, in spite
                          of the fact that they stole lots of our treasures
                          last century and acted like drug dealers.
                                                 - Big Cow Wang
                          \_ You personally help do this stuff eh? That's
                             quite the active motd poster. How's your standing
                             in the Party?
                             \_ I am member of the legislature for the
                                Great and Glorious Republic of China.  I
                                led the successful "Just say no to buying
                                overpriced and outdated American weapons"
                                campaign.  - Big Dog Lee
                          \_ Here, we'll give you back the glorious imperial
                             hankie that we stole in the Opium War, you have
                             a bit of froth right there, to the left.  -John
                             \_ Don't tell me.  Tell your museum directors.
                                But it's okay, you can have them for now.
                                May help a few of those laid off delphi
                                workers work as museum security guards.
                                                  - Big Cow Wang
                                Think of the children they have to feed.
                                and security guards most likely make less
                                than $27000 a year.        - Big Cow Wang
                                                  - Big Cow Wang
                                \_ Hey, I don't care.  As long as great
                                   glorious Chinese mob is living in shit
                                   and getting beaten with sticks to make room
                                   for new factories, it's all good.  -John
                                   \_ Paddi field bad.  Factory good.
                                      More pay at factory so I take my
                                      children to see exotic natives in
                                      Tibet, and Americans dancing around
                                      in funny suits in Hong Kong
                                      Disneyland.  - Big Cow Wang
                                      \_  -John
2006/2/9-10 [Reference/Religion] UID:41780 Activity:nil 92%like:41764
2/8     The three fake images used to inflame Muslims against Denmark: (
        \_ Is this site similar to
           \_ No, it's just a blog.  Somehow, though, they manage to blame
              evil liberals by the first comment.
           \_ I didn't see the comments, it was just the easiest link I found
              to the three fake images. -op
        \_ Does anyone have links to the real images that the Danish
2006/2/9-11 [Politics/Foreign/Europe] UID:41781 Activity:high
2/9     "The press will give the Muslim world the message: We are aware of
         the consequences of exercising the right of free expression,"
        \_ The guy in the photo looks like Inspector Closeau pondering the
        \_ Man, that's really disappointing and frustrating.    -mice
        \_ This sounds a lot like the Comics Code of the 50s. Sigh.
        \_ What can I say, I'm disgusted.  -John
        \_ Well, it's looking like that whole Iraq War has spread stability
           and democracy throughout the Muslim World!  Yes, it sure is going
           well, yessiree Bob!
           \_ Yes, it's all because of this.  Give me a fucking break.  The
              Iraq war was wrong, and it hasn't helped, but what you're seeing
              is as much of a symptom of a generally pathetically broken
              "culture" as a reaction to just one factor.  -John
        \_ The Arab press published the cartoons Oct 17:
           \_ "Arab press"... For a better researched examination of press
              accounts, see the juancole link from yesterday. worldnetdaily
              is shit.  Wow. They quote the astute observations from "an
              anonymous poster on FFE's blog".  There's a news source to
              \_ juancole's url is weak.  all he shows is that egypt used
                 the issue, when one could also show that iran and syria
                 used the issue also.  he also shows that people got pissed off
                 when they first heard about the cartoons, which has been an
                 obvious fact and not in dispute.  the two unanswered questions
                 are, did saudi arabia use it too, and which entity(ies)'s
                 using this caused this to become as serious as it did?
           \_ How come the major western media or the Danish govt didn't pick
              up on this?
              \_ Because major western media is not concerned with such petty
                 issues as demagoguery, mudflinging and..uh..nevermind.  -John
        \_ This is just being realistic.  Demographically, the number of
           people who believe that images of the prophet should result in
           being stoned, or punished, or whatever, is going to overwhelm
           the number of people in Europe who believe the right of free
           speech trumps any religious concerns.  In the coming decades
           Europe is going to become a lot more like the Middle East
           than he Middle East is going to become like Europe (freedom
           wise that is).  The massively exploding populations of the Middle
           East and shrinking populations of native Europeans pretty much
           seal that.  And plenty of them, coming to Europe, think Sharia
           law is a good idea.  This is not to say Sharia law will become the
           law of the land anytime soon, but eventually the concerns of the
           Muslims are going to filter into European governments, especially
           since it's unlikely they would go for any kind of Apartheid system
           that doesn't give Muslims an equal say in government.  Actual
           discrimination is another issue (see France).
           \_ Not if European countries start shutting their borders to
              immigrants.  Then the massively exploding populations will
              discover the downside to massively exploding populations.
                \_ As long as economies are based on fractional banking and
                   require endless growth, they will need an influx of labor.
                   For example, in Spain the fertility rate is like 1 baby
                   per woman, which means every generation the new population
                   is cut in half ... Witness what happens in America.  It's
                   the huge desire for cheap labor that draws in the
                   \_ What's "fractional banking"?  --ignorant
                        \_ It allows banks to create money out of thin air
                           and lend it out.  These loans have to be paid back
                           with interest.  This requires more economic
                           activity, hence growth.  See wikipedia.
              \_ The ones already in Europe are exploding quite well on their
                 own, immigrants or no immigrants they will be a large
                 political force.
                 \_ Interestingly, in the countries that have historically
                    been very open to immigration (UK, France), there seem to
                    be far more second/third generation "foreigners" that
                    acclimatize poorly than in traditionally more homogenous
                    countries (Germany, Scandinavia)--but then again that
                    could be because there are just more immigrants.  -John
                    \_ Cf. ghettoization of immigrants vs. bringing them into
                       the economy. In the US, depsite the existence of
                       extensive "foreign" cultural centers (e.g., Chinatown),
                       immigrants have become a part of mainstream economy
                       and thus have less to lose by acclimating or
                       \_ I wouldn't credit this too much as a reason; any
                          large German or Austrian city, for example, is
                          very likely to have a big Turkish "ghetto".  -John
                \_ I wonder why European countries (specially Spain and
                   Portugal) don't import more workers from Latin American
                   countries instead.  The cultural 'incompatibility' wouldn't
                   be as much of an issue in that case.  Most Latin American
                   countries have terrible unemployment and underemployment
                   rates even among their college graduates.  This would be a
                   win-win situation for Europe and Latin American countries.
                   \_ Guessing: price.  Employers don't care who they hire as
                      long as they're cheap.  Transport from LA is too pricey
                      for cheap labor when you can hire the people who are
                      already right there in country.
2006/2/9-11 [Politics/Domestic/911, Politics/Domestic/President/Bush] UID:41782 Activity:moderate
2/9     Pres. Bush reveals details of terrorist plot to run planes into
        US Bank Tower in LA, foiled in... 2002:
        "[T]the White House would not say whether the 2002 plot was thwarted
         as a result of the spying program."
        '"The plot was foiled in early 2002 when a Southeast Asian nation
         arrested a key al Qaeda operative," Mr. Bush said'
        ...the hell is he bothering to talk about this now?
        \_ Oh my god! West Coast is saved thanks to George Bush! He
           protects us from terrorists and 911 and all the evil guys
           who hate freedom. I'm definitely voting Republican again.
        ...the hell is he bothering to talk about this now?
           \_ Cause they only just got around to making up all the evidence.
        \_ His whole argument for the wiretapping is "trust me."  He's
           manufacturing "trust". "I", meaning a SE Asian nation, "am keeping
           you safe from the big bad bombers."
           P.R., Pure and simple.
        \_ The peasants were starting to revolt
        \_ "In his remarks, Mr. Bush inadvertently referred to the
            [US Bank Tower] as 'Liberty Tower.'" hahahah
            \_ That means his wife was once a Liberty-ian. I thought they
               were against huge governments.
           \_ The US Bank Tower used to be called the Library Tower.
              \_ Does this make his wife an ex-Liberty-arian?
           \_ A news reader on KCBS radio made the same mistake last night.
        \_ why now?  well for political reasons, obviously, for one.  he's
           a politician.  they're all the same.  on the security side, you
           generally wouldn't talk about something like that right away because
           you'd want to have a chance to turn those people to get their
           buddies.  if you announce to the world you caught someone, their
           buddies immediately know, too, so your intel asset value just
           dropped to zero.  k?
           \_ The timing is still bizarre: too untimely to be useful,
              \_ very important GOPers have been saying the wiretapping
                 program has problems -- the subcommittee head overseeing
                 the NSA even recommended a full review.  oh look, al qaeda
                 is coming after L.A., and Dubya stopped it!  John Q. Citizen:
                 "It must be because of the Tewwowist Surveillance Program!"
                 \_ Even though he was very careful not to say so....
        \_ Dubya is a fucking moron.  He has a very low bar when it comes
           to scoring political points.
        \_ And where did they find the details?  Next to WMD in Iraq?
2006/2/9-11 [Computer/SW/RevisionControl] UID:41783 Activity:kinda low
2/9     I'm starting a personal programming project and I need some revision
        control system.  What would you suggest given that the client and
        server must run on Windows?
        \_ Subversion
           \_ Seconded. Subversion is probably the best revision control
              system I've used. It is as easy to use and maintain as cvs
              but has almost all the features of clearcase (including
              versioned directories and symlinks).
           \_ what is wrong with CVS?    --clueless
        \_ Does it have to be free?
           \_ Free or <$50 for 1 user.
        \_ Perforce is free for two users. If you make your project open
           source, you can get a free multi-user license from them; I don't
           know how willingly they give those out. I've heard svn is close to
           p4 in functionality, even if it does pollute your file system. -gm
           \_ p4 does a lot more than svn, but if you are a one or two person
              team you probably won't ever use all that lot more.
           \_ I didn't know that.  Since that's what we use at work and I'm
              reasonably happy with it that sounds like a good solution. Is
              there anything better about Subversion I should know? -op
           \_ I used Perforce in my previous job and now I use ClearCase.
              Perforce has a nice feature called "change list" which ClearCase
              doesn't.  It's for grouping together related changes in multiple
              files.  Submitting changes in multiple files using change list
              is atomic.  You can include and exclude changes using the change
              list number.  You can also look up which changes in which other
              files are tied to this change in this file, via the change list
              number.  I wish there is something similar in ClearCase.  Now
              in ClearCase we have to create labels for every change, and rely
              on the individual engineer to manually list all the changed files
              in the label description.  Using labels doesn't make checking-in
              atomic either.
2006/2/9 [Academia/Berkeley/Classes] UID:41784 Activity:nil
2/9     Hello, I'm a disillusioned almost-40 year old engineer. I used
        to play netrek all the time. The closest I was with a woman
        was when my lab TA crouched down to type over my shoulder. I got
        95/100 on my 60a proj3 thanks to her. She smelled nice and at the
        time I almost kissed her. I miss being a student. I miss CAR CDR
        and the meta circular evaluator. I miss my TA. She smelled nice.
        15 years later, I'm still a virgin. I spend most of my life in
        my cubicle typing on the fucking motd. I am depressed. Meeting
        99 virgins girls in heaven must be less painful than real life.
        \_ Hi troll!
2006/2/9-11 [Politics/Domestic/President/Bush] UID:41785 Activity:nil
        In letter from lawyer of ex-FEMA chief Michael Brown to Harriet Miers,
        Brown asks Dubya to scratch his back and he'll scratch his ...
        "Unless there is specific direction otherwise from the president,
        including an assurance the president will provide a legal defense to
        Mr. Brown if he refuses to testify as to these matters, Mr. Brown will
        testify if asked about particular communications"
        \_ Huh? How the hell did you read quid pro quo from that article?
           All the article is reporting is that Brown's lawyer notified the
           White House that he will advise his clien to testify before
           Congress unless he hears otherwise from his ex-boss. He isn't
           exactly being hauled into Congress to be indicted. If he is
           ordered by the POTUS to refuse to testify he'd of course be
           in violation of the Congressional subpoena, and of course his
           counsel would demand legal immunity from the subpoena. Heck,
           this isn't really even that newsworthy.
           \_ "if you don't give me a legal defense to not testify, all heck
              may break loose when I testify on friday and it's not my fault
              because you didn't say anything.  if you give me a legal defense
              to not disclose, then I won't, and good on you and me both."
              "how the hell" indeed.
              \_ Uhm, duh?  It sure as hell couldn't be, "Now that I'm no
                 longer an employee and I'm being called to tell people stuff
                 that you, my former employer, may not want the public to
                 know, you have the choice of letting me go say all that
                 stuff or you can pay for my defense because I'm sure as hell
                 not paying out of my pocket to cover your ass", could it?
                 But a conspiracy is much more interesting than self interest
                 and common sense.  Motd, carry on.
                 \_ yes, the self-interest is "don't blame me, I'm giving
                    you fair warning right now", which is also a common
                    sense interpretation.
2006/2/9-11 [Transportation/Car] UID:41786 Activity:nil
2/9     Rejected taglines for the recently released Harrison Ford vehicle,
        \_ Zzzzzzzz
        \_ Do the young generation of engineers in their 20s still know what
           "Abort, Retry, Fail" refers to?
           \_ Of course. It's from Alpha Centauri, right? "If you see this
              message, always choose 'Retry'." -20something
           \_ FC:<enter>
              \_ Fred Cohen?
           \_ DOS was still common 11 years ago.
2006/2/9-11 [Uncategorized] UID:41787 Activity:nil
2/9     Best Star Wars action figure of all time:
2006/2/9-11 [Transportation/Car, Transportation/Car/RoadHogs] UID:41789 Activity:nil
        Urban sprawl is universal and not an American phenomenon.
        \_ The auto has turned it into a major menace though.
           First world cities built post-automobile are all
           spread out much more than the older cities, sometimes
           by a whole order of magnitude more.
2019/09/15 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2006:February:09 Thursday <Wednesday, Friday>