12/16   Today's PVP reminds me of the motd:
        http://www.pvponline.com
        http://www.pvponline.com/archive/2005/pvp20051216.gif
        \_ Today's PVP reminds me that PVP just isn't funny

12/16   Bush uses NSA to spy on US Citizens:
        http://csua.org/u/ebv
        \_ Engage spin cycle:
           "Those aren't citizens, they're enemy combatants"
           "These are dangerous people.  Do you want another 9/11?"
           "We wouldn't be spying on them if they weren't bad guys"
           "It's not spying, it's routine surveillance"  -tom
           \_ "Tom Holub is an unpatriotic hippy, let's spy on him" -Echelon
        \_ I'm unable to find the word "citizen" in the article or headline.
           Can you point it out?
           \_ Gee, would we be as worked up if the headline said "Bush uses
              NSA to monitor foreign nationals inside the US"?  Of course
              these must be citizens.
              \_ Of course you would.  You've been worked up over all sorts
                 of things that wouldn't bother you if the previous admin
                 did them.
                 \_ I call bullshit.  Many people were worked up about
                    project Echelon.
                    \_ Dude.  It's reiffin.  Bullshit is self evident.
                    \_ No, I meant the wider issues of admin vs admin and the
                       typical political nonsense of "my guy is always right
                       and yours is always wrong" which is seen from people
                       on both sides of the isle.
                    \_ Well, let's see.  According to kchang's MOTD archive,
                       there has been 4 Echelon threads.  How good is that
                       archive's coverage back to 2001?  Let's see how much
                       MOTD coverage this current story is worth.  OBTW,
                       reading about Echelon coverage on MOTD, there did not
                       seem to be a lot of outrage as you claimed.  Perhaps
                       you can substantiate your claim?
                       seem to be a lot of outrage as you claimed.
                       \_ Please, this is the motd, no facts.
                       \_ You think "Jam Echelon" day is a statement
                          in favor of Echelon?
                          \_ Boy, it must be nice to live in a binary world.
                             Someone said "worked up", someone else said
                             "outrage".  To my mind, a 2 line "jam echelon"
                             thread doesn't count for either.
                       \_ And there have been no discussions about
                          whether watching paint drying is interesting,
                          therefore it *must* be interesting.
                          \_ Now, you really should be better at logic than
                             this.
                \_ Do I have to do everything for you? Do you dispute
                   that citizens were being spied on?
                   http://tinyurl.com/ahlo5
        \_ Tips balance on Patriot Act:
           http://csua.org/u/ec8 (NYT)
           \_ 'Senator Charles E. Schumer, Democrat of New York, called the
              disclosure "shocking" and said it had impelled him to vote "no"
              today.'  Oh blow it out your ass, Chuck.  Like you were going to
              vote "yes" under any circumstances.  -independent
              \_ Hmmm..  I wonder how Schumer voted on the Patriot act in 2001.
                 Actually, I don't have to wonder.  I know.  Do you?  Blow it
                 out your own.
                 \_ I do know, but that doesn't change the fact that if Chuck's
                    brand of reactionary blustering is the best face the
                    Democrats can put forward (and he's one of the ones I see
                    most often), they're in as sad a state as the Republicans.
                    -pp
              \_ And look up "impelled" in the dictionary.
                 \_ Hey, this guy can't even bother to look up "lie" in the
                    dictionary and avoid looking like an ass.

12/16   Ever wonder how much junk mail Americans are getting?
        "Fiscal 2005 was also the first time advertising mail has topped
        first-class mail in volume. The post office handled more than 100
        billion pieces of what it calls standard mail, compared to 98 billion
        first class letters."
        Damn.
        http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051206/ap_on_go_ot/postal_finances

12/16   Pacific islanders move to escape global warming
        http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20051205/sc_nm/environment_climate_island_dc
        \_ GLOBAL WARMING IS NOT HAPPENING!  TREES CAUSE POLLUTION! LALALALAL
           LALALALALAL!!!!!!11!!!1one
           \_ Hi.  Take a geography class and learn how coral reefs and beaches
              have been slowly disappearing for a few thousand years.  LALALA
              indeed.  A little education will help you better understand the
              world around you.
              \_ Is this poster trying to be funny, too, or did he completely
                 miss the point of the previous post?
                 \_ cf.  "LALALALA"
              \_ I suggest you take a class on the geography of Vanuatu.
                 It is not a reef.  -John
                 \_ LALALALALALALAL!
        \_ What is this, slashdot?  Why are we having a slew of posts of
           week-old news?
           \_ Probably someone just randomly surfing crap. Anyway, who cares,
              by 2100 most of us will most likely be dead.
              \_ "There's no such thing as legacies. At least, there is a
                 legacy, but I'll never see it."  --George W. Bush

12/16   The problem w/ Wikipedia:
        http://www.penny-arcade.com/images/2005/20051216h.jpg
        \_ heh this is pretty funny, thanks

12/16   Making money from stupid people by selling $15 for $21
        http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5644161666
        \_ More accurately, stupid people make you money by buying $15 for $21.
        \_ was bought by someone in the uk.  suppose he isn't clear on the
           exchange rate.
           \_ more like you can probably use it to get around iTunes having
              different stores for different countries.
              \_ good point.  apple sells songs for 79p for the UK ($1.40)
                 so $21 probably is a great deal for a Brit
                 \_ Bonus question: USD15 of songs at USD.99/song ::
                                    GBP?? or songs at GBP.79/song ?
                    (answer--not much of a deal)
        \_ Much more lucrative would be selling JP gift cards in the US.
           You can buy JPop albums from the music store for ~Y2000 but in the
           US, you might pay $50-80 for an import through Amazon. Search
           for "Love Jam" (Ai Otsuka) for comparison.
           \_ redeeming a JP gift card would probably tricky from here in the
                US.
        \_ wow, you can make 33% profit with each sale to the UK

12/16   What are your favorite Casino games?
        \_ Blackjack. Poker.
           \_ what kind of blackjack?  (single deck?)  What type of poker?
              \_ Poker? I hardly know her!
        \_ I troll emarkp
        \_ Craps
           \_ what are your most common bets?
              \_ Pass, max odds up to my betting limit.  - !pp
                 \_ yes, these are the best bets.  it's all a crapshoot
                    though.
                    \_ I believe don't betters have a slight edge.
                       \_ I think so, if you play perfectly.  But its like
                          if you make one mistake in 1,000 games you loose the
                          edge.
                          \_ how can you make a mistake if you just do the
                             same bet every single time?
                             \_ Its complicated.
                       \_ No, because the odds bet is exactly 50/50 and the
                          come out bet is like 50.9% in the houses favor.
                          They change the 12 to a "push" for DON'T PASS
                          betters. How else would they stay in business?
                          It is very slightly better odds wise than betting
                          PASS, but less than .01%.
                          \_ So you agree that don't betters have a slight
                             edge.  Thanks.
                             \_ here's the final answer:
                                http://wizardofodds.com/gambling/houseadv.html
                                \_ Well, I've been meaning to get into some
                                   video poker action.
                             \_ A slight edge over PASS bettors, but still
                                a disadvantage to the house. Sorry if I was
                                not clear enough.
                    \_ This is the best bet, but it gets boring fast so
                       I also place bets (usually 6 & 8) and sometimes play
                       COME. If the point is, say, 6 then I'll place 8.
                       \_ Well, logically the come bet is the same as the
                          pass bet.
        \_ Climb the wall.
           \_ Combining the best of D&D character dice rolling and Candyland
              for money.
        \_ I always liked guess the number.  Pretty much any of the games in
           the "ghetto" casino that Chevy Chase went to in his Las Vegas movie.

12/16   Anyone figure out how to fix tabbing inside emacs?
        \_ Maybe if you mentioned what you perceive to be wrong with tabbing
           inside emacs, someone could offer a helpful response.
        \_ Try it now.  I changed the default file motdedit uses to edit.  It
           previously had a .c in there and that caused emacs to snort cocaine.
           \_ Thanks. It runs in Fundamental mode now. Works well.
              \- among the emacs standard modes, i'd use text-mode over
                 fundamental-mode for the motd.
                  \_ What's the best way to set that?
                  \_ Wow, you're right, text-mode is great for the motd!
                     What's the best way to automatically set that mode
                     for files named motd.public.r
                     \_ (setq auto-mode-alist
                          (append
                            '(("\\.xsl\\'" . sgml-mode)
                             ("\\motd.public.r\\'" . text-mode))
                          auto-mode-alist))

12/16   Anyone know what the performance is like for the KDE kdesktop versus
        ultraVNC or tight? I find kdesktop kind of slow to connect to from
        home and was wondering if it was worth the effort to use another VNC
        server. Thanks
        \_ In my experience, running stuff X-remotely is about the same speed
           as VNC w.r.t. UI response.  However, TightVNC is considerably faster
           at sending large bitmaps (complex webpages, etc).  That said, I
           have no clue what kdesktop is.  --dbushong

12/16   Holy crap.  After seeing the B5/LotR comparison below, I found this:
        http://www.katspace.org/fandom/b5
        \_ People really never caught this about B5?  Seriously, by the second
           season it was clear just what he was doing..

12/16   http://www.boxofficemojo.com/daily/chart/?sortdate=2005-12-14&p=.htm
        Nothing in particular.

12/16   Who are your favorite motd trollees?
        \_ Jblack. Fucker.
           \_ what kind of jblack?  (single minded republican?)
              \_ Fucker? I hardly know her!
        \_ I troll jblack
        \_ This is totally uncalled for.  Grow up.  Replies purged.

12/16   Stupid and stale political discussions deleted.
        \_ You are the one who is stupid and stale.  Nyeaahhhh!
        \_ Congratulations sir, you have killed all discussion whatsover
           on the motd! I salute you!