Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2005:August:23 Tuesday <Monday, Wednesday>
Berkeley CSUA MOTD
2005/8/23-24 [Politics/Domestic/911, Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Others] UID:39222 Activity:moderate
8/23    It's Pat:
        Pat Roberson calls to have Hugo Chavez assassinated. Gee, prominent
        public relig figure calling for "death to <head of state>" ... what
        does that remind you of? I like the line "This is in our sphere of
        influence, so we cant let this happen" ... gee, I wonder if people
        in Venezuala talk about "American Black Helecopters". And I wonder
        if Hugo Chavez is a bigger theat to America than activist judges".
        Any bets on who the next ambassador to Venezuala might be?
        \_ Jesus for Oil..
           \_ I'm willing to make that trade.
        \_ Huge Chavez is a clown. -- ilyas
        \_ Hugo Chavez is a clown. -- ilyas
           \- So? Who would you rather have as your ruler, Hugo or Pat?
              \_ Well, I was gonna say you, Partha, but then I remembered you
                 would feed me ankles first into a woodchipper. -- ilyas
                 \- in spite of your psb-persecution complex, you'ld
                    probably be pretty low on my reeducation or beyond
                    reeducation, convert to fertilizer list. --psbpot
                    \_ I don't know, Partha, you haven't seen me with a lot
                       of money. -- ilyas
                       \- ok i'll keep my options option to have your
                          bones scraped with a rusty file.
              \_ When Pat ran for President in the 80s I distinctly remember
                 him saying that one of his first acts as President would be
                 to nuke the USSR.  So I'd rather have Chavez.
        \_ We need to keep our mullahs in line ... Maybe Venezuela should
           ship off Robertson somewhere, say Egypt.  I love the automatic
           assumption that Venezuela's oil belongs to us because it is in
           our "hemisphere" ... Isn't it property of the people of Venezuela?
           \_ But they are Brown and Catholic, therefore subservient to
              Anglo-Saxon Jesus.
           \_ Heh, yeah, it Belongs to the People. -- ilyas
              \_ No, actually, it's properly owned by PDV, which is at least
                 majority- if not entirely owned by the government of
                 Venezuela, which is, at least pro forma, a democracy, so yes,
                 it Belongs to the People.  If you want to argue that
                 knocking off that fucker Chavez is a good thing due to
                 geostrategic interests (and, well, because he's a fucker)
                 then that's entirely different (this is what I think we
                 should have done with Saddam and couple of other places if
                 we were honest about it).  However, there is _no_ argument
                 that Venezuelan (or any other) oil supplies "belong" to
                 anyone other than whoever's got the drilling rights to
                 them.  -John
                 \_ I am fairly sure the oil in Venezuela belongs to Chavez.
                    Personally, I am in favor of knocking off Chavez _last_
                    among the world's head-of-state fuckers because, hey,
                    at least he's funny. -- ilyas
        \_ Let's see... Chavez is aligned with Iran, Ven. is becoming
           a client state of China, and Chavez provides extensive
           military support to the FARC narco-terrorists.
           Without oil Venezuela = Zimbabwe.  I'd say pat is exactly right,
           but shows poor judgement to say such things in public.
                    \_ Fair enough.  Nonetheless, the point isn't who it
                       belongs to, rather who it doesn't, i.e. us.  And
                       careful, Partha "the Mulcher" is watching.  -John
        \_ Let's see... Chavez is aligned with Iran, Ven. is becoming
           client state of China, and Chavez provides extensive
           military support to the FARC narco-terrorists.  I'd say
           Pat is exactly right.  Without oil Venezuela = Zimbabwe.
                       \- still crazy after all these years ...
                 *Boredcast Message from 'john': Thu Oct 13 15:47:45 1994
                 ||ok...straw poll:
                 ||If anyone on soda was to become the evil dictator of a small
                 ||country, who would it be?
                 ||(assuming I get to be chief of the secret police)
                 *Boredcast Message from 'alanc': Thu Oct 13 15:48:30 1994
                 ||Probably psb
        \_ I am pretty sure that this is an act of terrorism as defined
           by the Patriot Act. I won't hold my breath waiting for him
           to be arrested.
        \_ Let's see... Beaner is aligned with Turbin, Venezuela is becoming
           client state of Chink, and Beaner provides extensive
           military support to the Turbin wearin terrorists.  I'd say
           Pat is exactly right.  Without oil Venezuela = Bin Laden.
           Fuck immigrants, blacks, and Jews.                   !jblack
           \_ "Can anybody understand what this duck is saying?"
        \_ Pat in 2003:
           "How dare the president of the United States say to the duly
            elected president of another country, 'You've got to step down.'"
2005/8/23-24 [Computer/Companies/Yahoo] UID:39223 Activity:nil
8/22    Google search 36.5%, Yahoo 30.5%. Who the hell still uses Yahoo?
        No one I know uses Yahoo anymore.
        \_ Yahoo search has actually gotten pretty good, and is sometimes
           better than Google.  Try searching both for "http".
        \_ A lot of people, especially people who are Joe Average consumers
           and have an SBC/Yahoo DSL account. I still utilize Yahoo maps
           vs. Google maps just out of habit.
                \_ I do too, because Yahoo maps is better than google's,
                   at least when it comes to giving directions.
                \_ driving directions to dense urban areas with google
                   maps totally suck.  i hate them.
        \_ The CSUAers who work for Yahoo! Search.
        \_ I use Yahoo! I only use Google for Google Groups.
        \_ I use Yahoo for email and sports and news.  I just use Google for sea
        \_ I use Yahoo for email and sports and news.  I just use Google for search.
        \_ Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetuer adipiscing elit. Nulla quis
           massa eu mauris placerat tincidunt. Mauris interdum pellentesque
           urna. Nullam non mauris sit amet leo hendrerit mollis.
        \_ I have Yahoo DSL.  I use Yahoo for news (including Japanese and
           Chinese), maps (including Japan), stock quotes, and looking up
           things in its Web Directory section.  I use for
           searching,  and for porn.
2005/8/23-24 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq, Recreation/Travel] UID:39224 Activity:nil
8/22    Just wondering, how much vacation do military servicemen in Iraq get?
        \_ free paid vacation in Mosul.
        \_ All service personnel are guaranteed 1 month vacation a year.
2005/8/23 [Health, Health/Women] UID:39225 Activity:moderate
8/23    Utah police go nutzoid:
        \_ So, were all of the bits in the Sherriff's Dept. official
           statement complete fabrication?
           \_ Yeah, the police never fabricate anything.
                \_ This is nothing.  The Czech police used a tank!
              \_ No, but when you have 2 versions of events on the internet,
                 and one requires the police to just be EVIL AND HATE FREEDOM
                 and the other that the people reporting this were on drugs
                 (while at a rave, no less), Occam's Razor says...
                 \_ Well the police's version (paraphrased) is that a large
                    party somebody is probably doing something illegal, so they
                    decided to bust it up and include the SWAT team because
                    regular cops are no match for raver kids.
                    \_ No, the police version is that something was probably
                       illegal, then that they didn't have the right permits,
                       then that they surveilled and there WAS illegal stuff
                       going on, then they went in.
                       \_ So do you suggest Gestapo tactics for other
                          gatherings that include illegal activity, such as
                          rock concerts and frat parties?
                          \_ And you just know at a left-wing political rally
                             somebody's going to be carrying drugs.
                             \_ Right, and at a right wing political rally
                                you know somebody is going to be carrying
                                loaded automatic weaponry without the proper
                                permit.  So either way, yay!
                                concealed loaded automatic weaponry, so
                                either way, yay!
                 \_ Um, read some of the local press articles linked to from
                    the various web forums.  Guns, Drugs, and note how they
                    bring up the possibility of rape, and how there may be
                    many minors (won't someone think of the children!) there.
                    They make it sound like a Hell's Angels 666th anniversary
                    grill party and baby sacrifice.  Occam's razor also says
                    that mindless police brutality and excessive force are not
                    unknown.  But then it's just a bunch of drug-addled
                    children, so...  -John
        \_ Heh, I like this:
           "I saw a dog signal out a guy who obviously had some drugs on
            him....They had liscenced security guards at the gates
            confiscating any alcohol or drugs found upon entry (yes, they
            searched every car on the way in). Oh, I suppose I should
            mention that they arrested all the security guards for
2005/8/23 [Transportation/Car, Transportation/Motorcycle] UID:39226 Activity:moderate
8/23    I saw a commercial for Geico Motorcycle insurance yesterday. I guess
        this is new since I've never known geico to do motorcycle insurance.
        Anyone given them a try?
        \_ I have them and am quite happy. Don't even get one point though,
           or your rates will go up. -ausman
        \_ Geico and Progressive provide motorcycle insurance and are not
           always the cheapest. If you have an auto insurance, they often
           offer "recreational vehicle" insurance, which includes your yacht,
           motorcycle, and in some cases your LearJet or Citation X. They
           usually don't advertise this but they do that. I have my motorcyle
           insurance through AAA but I'm switching to something else because
           they keep raising the price. Here is my biggest gripe with
           insurance. For the first year or two it's pretty cheap, then
           they figure you're sticking with them (even without a single
           accident) and they keep raising the price. Fuckers.
           \_ capitalism at its best.  same for my sbc dsl service.  they
              offer new users at $14.95 per month, while old users have to
              renew their 1 year contract at $26.95 per month, or they
              will raise the price to $49 per month.  fairness and
              customer loyalty means nothing to them.  they just want
              to milk as much as possible out of you, and have a very
              short term view on running a business.  so you either pay
              more or call them and complain, switch, etc., wasiting
              your invaluable time.
              \_ Left wing socialist rant alert!!! Under capitalism the
                 nature of competition drives down the price. If you don't
                 like your provider, you switch to something cheaper or
                 better. Stupid liberal rant.           !jblack
                 \_ You know, if you ignore the first sentence of pp's post,
                    it is completely apolitical.  Don't have to be a socialist
                    to hate SBC.
                 \_ hehe, call it whatever you like.  I just don't
                    like to play games with these companies.  they keep
                    setting various traps for their customers.  for
                    instance, if I missed the letter saying that if
                    I don't renew the contract at $26.95 for one year,
                    I will suddenly see my bill increase to $49.  I
                    am the type who will gladly pay a little more
                    as long as I don't have to deal with these types
                    of crap.  And a lot of the things these phone
                    companies do like some of those fees they tag on
                    to your phone bills turned out to be illegal.
                    and of course the switching of your carrier
                    without notifying you.  another example was MCI
                    whose long distance service I had been happily
                    using for some time, until one day, after WorldCom
                    bought MCI, they suddenly decided to increase
                    the rates through the roof.  We all know where
                    Ebbers is headed.
2005/8/23-24 [Uncategorized] UID:39227 Activity:nil
8/23    Maradona admits scoring goal by hand: (Yahoo! Sports)
        So much for Argentine soccer.
        \_ Barry Bonds doesn't even admit to using steriods..
        \_ The only way most CSUAers know how to score is by using their hand.
           \_ That's Rosy Palm and her five sisters.
2005/8/23-24 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:39228 Activity:moderate
8/23    Photos from the Iraq war.  Warning: Very graphic.
        \_ This puts some things in perspective.  "Oh no, the British police
           accidentally and incorrectly killed one innocent person!"  Now
           \_ Your moral equivalance/equivocation is disgusting.  That's not
              perspective.  You can call both "wrong".
              \_ They _are_ both wrong!  But which has gotten more press?
                 \_ It's not a zero sum game.  They both should get plenty
                    of press.  That the war hasn't is a decision of the gov't
                    and complicity by our media outlets
           let's look at the bit in the slideshow where the US Helicopter fired
           a missle into a group of 13 civilians.  "Oops, our bad."  I mean,
           it's really they're fault for _forcing_ us to invade.  Stupid
           it's really their fault for _forcing_ us to invade.  Stupid
           camel jockeys.
           \_ They did have the audacity to have lots of oil.
           \_ Actually it was a group of > 50-100 people.  Many were partying
              by the disabled Bradley.  Is it within the rules of engagement
              to lob a missile into the middle of the crowd?  I don't know.
              \_ Not really, but unfortunately the US doesn't have a weapon
                 that swoops down to beat people with sticks.  -John
                 \_ just admit it, we are not accountable for anything we
                    do.  It is OK to kill Iraqi at randomn.  Something
                    that we don't talk about, but it's a fact.  Do you know
                    how many people got ran over by US convoy due to
                    aggressive driving?  do you have any idea how many
                    people died as he/she bring his blanket to the roof
                    to sleep because electricity is not restored?  Is
                    there any consequences for killing civilian?
                    Without punishment, people bound to do bad things, pure
                    and simple...  And at the mean time, Americans don't
                    understand why Iraqi hates Americans.
                    \_ Are you stupid?  Yeah, that's exactly what I was
                       implying.  Kill all those non-American civilians!  Woo!
                       It's OK!  Moron.  -John
                       \_ Am I saying that all US
                          GIs are shooing at Iraqis for fun?  of course
                          not.  All I am saying is that there are bad apples;
                          there are those who are trigger happy, justified
                          or not.  The problem is that there are no
                          consequences for any wrongful actions unless it's
                          caught by US media.  Even so, US militaries are not
                          subject to any external scruny other than its
                          own military justice system.
                          Then, there is the issue of mercenaries or
                          "private contractors."  Their actions are not even
                          subject to US law and US military.
                          \_ Bad apples, huh?  There are reports that in
                             faloojeh, we got intel that the "bad guys" were
                             using taxicabs.  The order came down that cabs
                             were greenlighted as targets.  I won't be
                             surprised when we hear about free-fire zones.
                             These things happen because of orders.  There
                             may be some bad apples, but the real bad shit
                             comes from orders that the troops are told are
                          \_ All intentional abuse of military power should be
                             avoided and punished when it occurs.  It's wrong.
                             Nobody's saying that it isn't.  I also find it
                             odd that a lot of people say "hey, all these
                             abuses go unreported, just look at this link!"
                             My point was that people who dance around a
                             burning apc or who generally celebrate that kind
                             of violence (even if they're in the US military)
                             deserve a fucking beating.  -John
                             \_ Put yourself in their shoes for a sec.  That
                                same APC has been blowing up _their houses_
                                looking for terrorists.  You'd bemoan its
                                \_ Has it?  And no I wouldn't, I'd probably
                                   stay inside wishing it would end.  -John
                                   \_ But if your house blows up while you
                                      are in it ... maybe safer to dance
                                      on blown up Bradleys!
                    \_ Wow, the clever, seductive transition from 'we' in
                       the beginning to 'Americans' in the end almost had me
                       going for a second there.  Well, aside from the
                       atrocious engrish, anyhow.  Whatever personal guilt,
                       political/social obligations & responsibilities I may
                       feel, I'm certainly not going to debate them with a
                       clown like you.  What's the point when your whole
                       statement makes it clear that you're not going to
                       listen to intelligent discourse?
                 \_ Why the hell not?  For all the billions we've flushed down
                    the toilet for space weapons that literally contributed
                    *nothing* to national defense we could have not only
                    beat stick drones, but imperial walkers by now.
                 \_ No, but we do have a ray gun that microwaves people.
                    \_ sweet idea, had they used that instead, it would be
                       helicopter flies up, blasts crowd with burning-pain
                       beam until they disperse, then drop bomb on disabled
                       bradley to destroy it.
2005/8/23 [Recreation/Computer/Games] UID:39229 Activity:low
8/23    ilya, what do you think of Arimaa?
        \_ Well, if you want an example of a game where computers do poorly,
           there is no need to invent a new one -- Wei Chi will do.  But
           thanks for the link -- looks interesting.  My intuition about this
           game, without looking into it carefully, is that one of the
           superstrategies is dominant (it is very difficult to balance the
           rules in such a way that you can have completely different looking
           games, and have them all be reasonable strategies). -- ilyas
2005/8/23-24 [Politics/Domestic/President/Bush] UID:39230 Activity:nil
8/23    Bush talking to veterans: "We owe them something. We will finish the
        task that they gave their lives for..." Finishing the task? Look out
        North Korea and Vietnam!  We'll get it right this time!
        \_ Time to invade Vietnam and finish the task we started there
           40 years ago!
        \_ Veteran with his Bullshit Protector on
2005/8/23-24 [Computer/SW/WWW/Browsers] UID:39231 Activity:nil
8/23    I need to setup a kiosk with a mouse and a browser. How do I make
        Firefox/Mozilla/whatever display the entire screen, and disable
        Windows format, reboot, installation, going off to improper
        porn sites, etc for the kiosk? Thanks.
        \_ STFW. There are people who have done this before. There is even
           a firefox package or something specifically for kiosks.
2005/8/23-24 [Industry/Jobs] UID:39232 Activity:nil
8/23    My brother is an engineering manager at Apple (iTunes Music Store).
        His group is looking to hire a mid/sr level SW engineer. We do our
        development in WebObjects, but a solid understanding and practical
        experience with appservers in general is more important than specific
        knowledge of Java or WebObjects. Email me if you're interested or
        have questions. -abe
2005/8/23-24 [Computer/SW/Security] UID:39233 Activity:low
8/23    Hi motd.  I recently got a Dell Latitude D610 from work.  There is a
        "Hard Drive Password" feature in BIOS.  After setting it, now every
        time I boot it asks me for this before it loads the OS.
        Does anyone know if this password is stored on the drive or on the
        mobo?  E.g., if the latter, I can just put the drive in an external
        enclosure and access all files.  Thanks.  I suspect the latter.
        Okay, I see here it looks like the former:
        \_ Depends on the make & model.  A lot of mfgrs deal with the password
           with a combination of bios and either an eeprom or a reserved area
           on the drive.  Generally it's some variant of the bios being a
           sort of "handler" for the password info which is stored elsewhere.
           The good news is, there are ways of breaking this with some
           understanding of electronics diagrams and a degree of proficiency
           with a soldering iron.  With some IBMs, for example, you need to
           nuke the password on the particular laptop it was set on before you
           can use it for something else (unless of course you break it, which
           is difficult-but-not-impossible.)  I did some research on this a
           while ago for a project, but my info may be out of date.  -John
           \_ fyi, I downloaded the spec doc for the Hitachi 5K80 Travelstar,
              and there's a whole section on this, which leads with:  "With a
              device lock password, a user can prevent unauthorized access to a
              device even if it is removed from the computer."  It sounds like
           \_ fyi, I downloaded the spec doc for the Hitachi 7K100 Travelstar,
              and there's oodles about password set/clear/change.  Presumably
              this is all stored on the HD.
              Upon further reading, it looks like the drive supports a Master
              Password and User Password.  Presumably the Master Password is
              known only to Dell and is different for different service tags,
              and is used to unlock the drive if the user forgets the User
              Password that he or she used to lock the drive.
              Unfortunately it looks like all you need is a keygen program
              to get the Master Password for Dell Latitudes:
              Doh! -op
              I do agree that if you speak with Dell they'll probably tell
              you a special way of clearing the "Hard Drive Password" if
              you authenticate with them completely.  And DriveSavers probably
              knows exactly how to do it without any trouble.
              After googling for a while, it looks like this is the only way to
              clear the hard drive password:
              Much easier to clear the non-hard-drive passwords. -op
              \_ OK the mechanism I found consisted of soldering together a
                 bit of electronic gymcrackery according to a set of wiring
                 specs I found, which would slurp the password hash off the
                 laptop via serial and let you dump it on a PC in order to
                 crack it.  I'd be very interested in what you find, so if you
                 would like to look at the bit of poking around that I did,
                 drop me a mail (non-bouncing email in my .plan)  -John
                 \_ Oh, it's just the link I posted -- run the keygen
                    against the reported hard drive code, obtain the password
                    which clears the other passwords.  Apparently another
                    mechanism involves a paperclip shorting some pins. -op
              \_ Good news.  That keygen only works for old service tags
                 (ending with extension -D35B).  Then, I e-mailed the owner of
                 the document that describes how to unlock passwords using
                 a paperclip (shorting some pins).  He says his method is
                 only for the BIOS passwords, and there is nothing he knows
                 of that can unlock the "hard drive password".  Yay. -op
                 \_ See above, offer still stands (dunno if it'll be of any use
                    but might give you some pointers of where to look.)  -John
2005/8/23 [Computer/SW/Mail, Computer/Companies/Yahoo] UID:39234 Activity:nil
8/23    I have a lot of problems with Google and Yahoo mail lately. I use
        pine with the "Roles" feature where I can set the From: field to
        whatever address I have. I've been using this for a while without
        any problem, but lately Google and Yahoo just filter all of my
        mails. How do I tell them that my email is legit? I don't send
        spam contents or anything like that. Thanks.
        Below is my header, generated by Pine and the mailer:
From  Tue Aug 23 12:45:24 2005
Return-Path: <>
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 12:45:24 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Blow <>
        \_ Is advertising SPF rules that contradict where you're
           actually sending it from?
           \_ What's a SPF rule and how do I find out?
               \_ 1)
                  2) dig TXT
2005/8/23-24 [Computer/SW] UID:39235 Activity:nil
8/23    CS history question - are there documented instances of early
        PC software firms going bankrupt due to pirated software? More
        generally, good accounts of what prevented the early PC software
        firms from succeeding? What distinguished successful firms from
        failures in that market. Email fab. Thanks.
2005/8/23-24 [Computer/SW/OS/OsX] UID:39236 Activity:nil
8/23    Anyone know of a good way to convert from tex to decent looking HTML?
        \_ Um, latex2html does a fairly good job. Is this a troll?
           \_ Is latex2html-2002-2-1.tar.gz the best version?
              Its over 3 yrs old. I'm just wonder if there isn't something
              newer b/c it didn't work properly on OS X.
              \_ I use 2002-2-1 as part of fink on OS X. Works fine. --pp
2005/8/23-24 [Computer/SW/Apps] UID:39237 Activity:nil
8/23    Google IM is up.
        \_ Great. Just what we need. Yet Another Fucking Messenger. I am so
           sick and tired of having to keep track of different logins and
           clients. I have YM, AIM, MSN, and IRC. Trillian is the solution?
           No. I can't get to certain features in YM like interactive games
           and Audibles. Fuck Google.
           \_ You might not know this, but you are too stupid to live.
           \_ I used to use AIM.  Now I don't even bother logging on.  If it's
              urgent, call me.  If it's not urgent, send me e-mail.
        \_ Holy fucking shit.  A branded Jabber server with no SSL support.
           Where are my smelling salts?  What will they think of next?!
        \_ Great, only socks proxy.  Woo.  That's sad.  -John
2005/8/23-24 [Uncategorized] UID:39239 Activity:nil
8/23    I got some .att files that look like segmented mails with base64/
        MIME data. What program can view/extract attachment from such files?
        \_ munpack?  -John
2005/8/23-24 [Consumer/TV] UID:39240 Activity:nil
        Poll, Blu-ray or HD-DVD? Which one is going to win?
        Blu-ray (50G): ..
        HD-DVD (30G):
        \_ Optical data storage media are fucking retarded: ..
        \_ either way the consumer will lose
2005/8/23-24 [Computer/SW/Unix, Computer/SW/Security] UID:39241 Activity:nil
8/23    Looking for a good backup software for Windows. Preferably free,
        or something cheap with encryption. I'm sick and tired of manually
        using MS's backup software to create a tar-like file and then
        using my pirated Nero to burn it on the DVD. ok thx.
        \_ Check out the backup reviews first.
           I downloaded a copy of Genie Backup Manager, trial version.
           It is very good. I got it from Bittorrent with serial keys
           but I liked it so much that I decided to buy it from them.
        \_ I use Acronis True Image to back up my Windoze disk to an
           external hard drive.  It's fast:  1 gigabyte / minute over
           FireWire or an efficient Hi-Speed USB 2.0 interface.
           Image is password-protected (though not encrypted, but I think
           the password protection is good enough).  Buy the download version
2005/8/23 [Computer/HW/Drives, Consumer/TV] UID:39242 Activity:high
8/23    Do differences in PAL/NTSC formats matter when playing DVD movies
        on PCs? What about VCR?
        \_ PAL/NTSC doesn't matter when playing on a PC, just region
           code (unless you use a workaround).  Tapes won't play right
           on a VCR, but you can get a converter.
        \_ No, doesn't matter on a PC, although you may have region issues.
           As for VCRs, you can't play DVDs on VCRs.  What's your question?
           If you mean if NTSC vs. PAL tapes matter, yes.  They're analog
           standards being played on an analog device.
           formats being played on an analog device.
           \_ What about watching a PAL DVD on a TV with normal US-purchased
              DVD player?
              \_ It's almost certainly not going to work.  NTSC DVD players
                 are rare multi-standard.
2019/05/19 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2005:August:23 Tuesday <Monday, Wednesday>