Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2005:July:28 Thursday <Wednesday, Friday>
Berkeley CSUA MOTD
2005/7/28-29 [Uncategorized] UID:38855 Activity:nil
7/27    I used to drink Momokawa Silver sake (dry) but noew all I can find is
        the Diamond (semi-dry).  Anyone know where I can find Momokawa Silver?
        Alternate question: Anyone care to suggest a decent very dry sake
        around $10 per 720/750ml?
2005/7/28-29 [Computer/SW/OS/OsX] UID:38856 Activity:nil
7/27    Cool yo-yo moves: <- amazingly fast <- 2nd guy tripped  <-- good style <-- double yoyo COOL <--- UNIQUE, COOL!!!
        |_ is this what people do when they can't get laid?
        \_ REALLY awsome. They all have 2 things in common-- they're really
           good at yoyo, and they all look like losers. You get a skinny
           wimp, a nerd, a fat kid... don't they have better looking
        \_ Was anyone able to play with with mplayer on Linux?
           \_ Couldn't get them to play under mplay on either OS X
              or Debian. WMP on OS X worked.
           \_ Worked fine w/ mplayer on FreeBSD:
             Selected video codec: [wmv9dmo] vfm:dmo (Windows Media Video 9 DMO)
2005/7/28-29 [Recreation/Computer/Games] UID:38857 Activity:kinda low
7/28    Re violence/sex in games - Does anyone think that you need
        lots of graphic violence/sex in order to make a good game
        (esp. for younger kids)?
        \_ Obviously not.  Some of the best games ever have no sex and only
           the most abstract type of violence.  I guess you could say that
           loadrunner is violent since the bad guys get buried alive.
           \_ Is that the Load Runner back in the Apple ][ days?
              \_ That's the only one I ever played.  Is there an updated
                 \_ It's "lode runner" not "load runner" -- google "lode
                    runner" + I'm feeling lucky
        \_ I agree with the above poster.  Videogames do not neext be
           explicitly violent.  To be frank, GTA is one of the most vile
           games I've ever played.  It's also a lot of fun.
        \_ There was the whole Myst trilogy.  Also one of the best selling
           games of all time is the Civ. group.  The latter has abstract
           violence only.
           \_ We just finished the 5th Myst installment. Due on shelves
              in late September I believe. -bz
              \_ 5th Myst game?  I didn't even know that Myst 4 was released.
                 Is Cyan actually behind the 5th game?  I thought Myst 3 was
                 made by some other company (Ubisoft?) under license. -dans
                 \_ Ubisoft is a publisher, I thought. -geordan
                    \_ Yes, Ubi is our publisher. We took a break from
                       the official series to do Uru, so Myst 3 and 4
                       (4 came out last year) were done by other companies.
                       Myst 5 is all us. It's the last one. Our next
                       project has nothing to do with Myst. -bz
        \- Sims. Sims 2. Sim City. They should also have games that
           promote better driving, less middle fingering, and less
           crashes. It seems like games today do the opposite.
        \_ It's true that the vast majority of games involve violence. If you
           have a game where you directly control a character, usually you
           make the character do something violent. There are exceptions, like
           sports and driving games (but driving games usually become more fun
           when weapons are added). There are also adventure games like
           Monkey Island, Myst, The Longest Journey etc, but those don't really
           involve direct action; more just clicking on screen hotpoints.
           I guess Tomb Raider isn't primarily that violent. But the sexy
           character helps.
           Other examples: Katamari Damacy, Dance Dance Revolution
        \_ Games like railroad tycoon, civilization, transport tycoon, SimCity,
           don't have any violence except in the most abstract of terms ...
           Games don't need to have violence or sex but if they are highly
           interactive they often need it to be more compelling, since there
           usually isn't that much thinking involved in playing them ...
           \_ Civilization isn't violent? C'mon, you can NUKE cities in that
              game, what could possibly be more violent?
2005/7/28-29 [Politics/Domestic/President/Clinton] UID:38858 Activity:nil
7/28    Worship the mighty Clinton
        \_ I thought this was a joke, until I started to do some googling.
           People sure are gullible.
2005/7/28-31 [Computer/SW/Languages/Java] UID:38859 Activity:nil
7/28    I am looking for a java launcher on Windows that does the following:
        1) Display a splash screen before my app launches
        2) Packages a java jar into an EXE and launches that
        3) Can include a JRE so it will run on systems without Java installed
        4) Be able to set java parameters like -Xmx
        exe4j meets all of these requirements except #3, is there anything
        (free or commercial) that does all these, I haven't found it yet ...
        \_ J++ used to do this. I think there's a new version called J#
           included in dotnet that does this. Since you only care about
           MS it doesn't matter if you lose cross platform capabilities, right?
           I don't know about the java params though. Alternatively you could
           just port the whole thing to C#...
           \_ Umm, it's a java app, porting it to C# is not an option.  And I
              have to be able to package my own JRE.  Looks like launch4j
              might do the trick.
              \_ Well, you didn't specify what exactly your development
                 situation is. Porting java to J# is pretty trivial as long
                 as your code base isn't using anything too fancy. Since
                 it's an app one assumes that cross compatibility is no
                 longer an issue. Re-building the app from source on top of
                 .NET will most likely give you a tighter binary and will
                 open up native win32 API calls to you, making things like
                 the splash screen trivial. You also don't need the source
                 if you have bytecode only. There are tools to do a bytecode
                 \_ Sigh, I use java not J# for a reason, I just need a
                    launcher on Windows.  This is a multi-platform piece
                    of software, but the assumption is that users on
                    non-Windows are capable enough to download/install a JRE.
                    And I will quit any job that makes me develop in .NET. or
                    any other massive convoluted API-of-the-year M$ comes out
                    with.  The Win32 API programming I've had to do is bad
        \_ ZeroG?
2005/7/28-31 [Finance/Investment] UID:38860 Activity:nil
7/28    I am new to windoze and have a silly problem that's driving me crazy.
        When I click on a window or its corresponding tab,  the gui seems to
        decide on a whim whether to make it the front window or just change
        focus to it.  What setting should I change?
        \_ Some apps choose to raise on focus.  Examples I've seen include:
           Lotus Notes and Microsoft Visio.  This _really_ sucks when you're
           using XMouse where mousing-over-the-window = focus.  Then you happen
           to stray across one little corner and wham.. it takes over your
          \_ I have the same problem with only IE or any program running. This
             must be some thing trivial but I can't figure it out! - op
2005/7/28-29 [Recreation/Dating, Reference/Religion] UID:38861 Activity:kinda low
7/28    Apropos of the current video games scare, can anyone else think of
        past overblown hysterias about media forms or substances that were
        "corrupting the youth" and "ending civilization as we know it?"
        I can think of:
        Dancing (especially to jazz)
        Comic books
        Violence in the movies
        Sex in the movies
        Rock music
        Long hair
        Elvis and his hips (kinda goes with Rock, but special mention of this
        seems appropriate)
        Pre-marital sex (personally I'm still against it, but it's commonly
                accepted now.)
        \_ Why are you against it, if it hasn't led to the downfall of the
        \_ Maybe we could have "temporary marriages" like in Muslim societies
           so everyone's happy: No pre-marital sex, but you can still go
           screw anyone you want (just not more than 4 at the same time)
           \_ I think it only works one way in Islam - a woman can't go
              and marry four men.
        \_ Abortion, Teaching Evolution
           \_ I guess I was trying to pick more cut and dried cases that
              aren't subject to current controversy, but I guess motd drones
              can't help trying to start flamewars.
              \_ How is contraception or pre-marital sex any more cut&dry than
                 abortion? -pp
                 \_ So you're equating contraception with killing babies?
                    \_ You know how birth control pills work, right?
                       \_ Do you?
                    \_ Zygote, embryo, or fetus != baby. Besides, the Catholics
                       still are against contraception so it's still
                       "controversial". By the way, if you use a condom, aren't
                       you preventing a new life from possibly being born? If
                       you hadn't used that condom the next Einstein might
                       have been born!
                       \_ Just because the Pope is a moron doesn't mean a
                          shitload of Catholics don't use contraception
                          \_ IMO they are not actually Catholics.
                             \_ Have you ever told one that to their face?
                                \_ No, but I'd like to. Especially if they
                                   call their pope a moron. Why call yourself
                                   a Catholic if you selectively ignore the
                                   teachings of the Catholic Church?
                                   \_ The one thing this discussion is making
                                      increasingly clear is that you are most
                                      likely not Catholic.
                                   \_ You are absolutely the cutest thing
                                      EVER.  Come over here, purty thang.
                                   \_ Because those teachings are out of
                                      touch with the reality of the vast
                                      majority of your followers?
                                      \_ What?
                                      \_ I'll just call myself a Jew then.
                                         That actual stuff they do is out
                                         of touch with my reality.
                             \_ Wow.  So I guess confession and forgiveness and
                                God's love DO have limits...
                                \_ Duh..  how else do you explain fags?
        \_ Islam                                -Chris
        \_ Christianity                         -Mohammed
           \_ Islam and Christinaity were not considered predominately youth
        \_ motd
2005/7/28-31 [Politics/Domestic/California, Finance/Shopping] UID:38862 Activity:high
7/28    How is the existing global domination of IKEA, who's founder
        surpasses Bill Gates as the richest man due to weakening
        US currency, differ from the American domination of Walmart?
        People boycott, protest, and say bad things about Walmart, but
        what about IKEA?
        \_ He's a lonely old miser who barely leaves the house (the IKEA guy.)
           That, and IKEA doesn't have the size 30 mumus next to the family
           tubs of cheap candy.  I kid you not, I saw this in the first and
           only Wal-Mart I ever went into.  It was as close to inferno as I
           ever hope to get.  -John
        \_ It is not Walmart's size that is the problem. It is Walmart's
           behavior. -- ulysses
           \_ How is Walmart's aggressive behaviour any different from
              other super-mega American corporations' behaviours?
              \_ Stay on topic.  IKEA != American corp.
              \_ Costco pays their employees a decent wage, Wal-Mart does not.
                 Costco gives health benefits, Wal-Mart does not, dumping the
                 cost onto the taxpayer. Costco allows unions to form, Wal-Mart
                 does not.... should I go on???
                 \_ You guys just don't get it.  This is like thinking a minimum
                    wage actually helps the poor. -- ilyas
                    \_ So, if there was no wage, and people could be paid
                       $.20/hour, that would be better?
                       \_ I think it would.  The economy is a complex machine,
                          but everybody wants to tinker with it, without an
                          understanding of what tinkering will actually do,
                          given the way the machine works.  So if your original
                          tinkering doesn't work, you tinker some more!  The
                          real art is to make a just society where people do
                          the natural self-interested things.  I could turn your
                          own question on you: 'if the minimum wage was 20
                          dollars an hour, would that be better?'  The real
                          question is, why are there poor people in our economy?
                          The poor aren't going to go away, regardless of what
                          you do.  -- ilyas
                          \_ Your troll is barely amusing.  The minimum wage
                             should be set to whatever gives people in a given
                             area a reasonable standard of living for a 40
                             hour work-week.  Most poor people living on
                             minimum wage are barely scraping by, and there
                             are a lot of them.  They are the ones using the
                             emergency room, food stamps, etc.  Why do you
                             prefer big government programs to just plain
                             companies compensating employees properly?
                             \_ I don't prefer big government programs either.
                                Legislating minimum wage increases unemployment,
                                and fucks over the poor.  Similarly for most
                                measures forcing companies to spend more money
                                on employees.  -- ilyas
                                \_ Do you think poor people should be allowed
                                   to be worked to death? Should the government
                                   let poor people starve?
                                   \_ As I mentioned in the conversation on this
                                      topic on irc, it's very difficult to
                                      starve in the United States.  Mconst said
                                      that in Togo they say the US is a country
                                      where even the poor people are fat.
                                        -- ilyas
                                      \_ After 100 years of big government
                                         intervention in the economy, it is
                                         hard. It was not hard at the
                                         turn of the century. You want to
                                         bring us back to those days.
                                         \_ Yes, of course, you want to claim
                                            the cause of American prosperity
                                            was 100 years of attempts at
                                            socialism, whereas in reality
                                            America prospered in spite of, not
                                            because of it.  I ve seen what
                                            actual socialism does, you haven't.
                                              -- ilyas
                                            \_ No, the cause of American
                                               prosperity is the combination
                                               of government, business,
                                               eductation and other efforts
                                               over the last 100 years. The
                                               ameliortion of the worst forms
                                               of poverty and abuses of
                                               capitalism were done because
                                               of the popular will, exercised
                                               through the political process.
                                               You are like the man that was
                                               bitten badly by a dog as a
                                               child and persists in believing
                                               that all dogs are evil.
                                               \_ No, I just saw the 'wall of
                                                  cheese.' -- ilyas
                             \_ But if the min wage is increased, then the
                                wage required to get a "reasonable standard
                                of living" (define pls) must increase. It
                                creates unemployment and harms the ability
                                to get a job of the very people who would
                                most have trouble getting a better job.
                                Instead of min wage you might as well do the
                                zero unemployment economy thing and create
                                taxpayer-subsidized "jobs". They do some of
                                that in Europe.
                 \_ Wal-Mart also gives health benefits.
                    \_ Less than most companies:
                       \_ That's not what the claim above is.
        \_ Much of the Walmart hate stems not from the family founders
           being filthy rich (worth billions), but the fact they are so
           chincy in providing benefits to their employees.  When you
           have over $22,000,000,000 why would 1) you force your workers
           to pay relatively high health care premiums, 2) hire illegal
           aliens, and 3) discriminate against female workers in pay and
           promotions.  Those 3 thorny issues haven't plauged IKEA.
           In fact IKEA has been rated one of the 100 best places to work
           for in general and for working mothers.
           \_ And the worst part in all of this is that their huge size and
              power forces their competitors to do the same in order to stay
              in business, so now an entire sector of the economy is always
              low paying with shitty benefits.
           \_ Wal-Mart pays 50% of health insurance premiums. The industry
              standard is 75%. I read that it would reduce Wal-Mart's profits
              20% in order to jump to a more standard 75%. Can they afford to
              do it? Of course. However, most companies aren't in business to
              give all profits back to the employees. In fact, I really detest
              Wal-Mart, but I can't think of anything unique about your points
              #1, #2, or #3. Wal-Mart is evil for other reasons, including
              the aggressive way it does business with suppliers and
              competitors. I don't know enough about IKEA to say if it is
              similar, but since it is an UltraMega corporation buying a lot of
              cheap product from Asia it probably has skeletons in its closet, too.
              \_ costco is holding its own against walmart, and it treats its
                 employees well:
                 \_ I like Costco in that it doesn't provide plastic bags and
                    that items only come in big sizes, both of which cut down
                    wasted material which is good for the environment.  Of
                    course Costco does it for profit reasons, but I like its
                    \_ I find the big sizes wasteful. It's good if you have
                       a large family, though.
                       \_ purchase what you need and use up.  eg. I don't touch
                          their huge boxes of snacks i rarely eat.  But, water,
                          or fruit juice, I purchase plenty of.
                    \_ As a friend pointed out to me, Costco's return policy is
                       the best.  You can basically return anything anytime.
                       If you don't like wal-mart, don't shop there.  Tell people
                       not to shop there.  This is how a healthy economy works.
                       Avoid government regulation as much as possible.
                       \_ Yeah, my friends said they could buy a computer at
                          Costco, and return it 1yr later saying that they
                          didn't like it.  I think that's insane to allow that.
                          didn't like it.  I think it's insane to allow that.
                          \_ It's now 6 months on computer and computer eq.
           \_ Welcome to America, where the safety net blows so hard that you
              need to work to survive -- which is why America is so productive.
              Create a wealth gap (they earned it), it will keep 90% of America
              working like dogs to either make ends meet or keep up with the
              I heard in Canada you can be productive and also get a lot of
              social services, and the wealth distribution is not as insane.
              \_ Yup, social services that includes cheap prescription drugs
                 that Americans pick up the tab for.  If they had to pay the
                 real cost of medicine, their system would completely collapse
                 instead of merely teeter on the edge as it does now.
              \_ Their economy is also mostly based on exporting raw
                 \_ Like beer?
              \_ Canadian cost of living is very high - higher than US.
                 \_ You sure about that?
                    \_ Factoring in taxation, yes.
                       \_ Are you factoring in health care costs?
                          \_ For quality health care or Canadian health care?
                             \_ Depends.  Do you want to survive an illness?
                     Canadian cities are lower than American.
                     Canadian cities are cheaper than American.
                     \_ PWNT!
                        \_ except for american goods!
                     \_ 'Comparative cost of 200 items' is not cost of living.
                        Canadians have less money to begin with because of the
                        \_ You mean sales taxes? Because income taxes shouldn't
                           really be part of the "cost of living"; they affect
                           ability to gain income but not costs, seems like.
                           \_ Income taxes are absolutely a part of the cost
                              of living.  How can you think it matters if the
                              money came out of my check before I saw it or I
                              had to pay extra for each item I purchase with
                              that same money?  You're trolling, right?  IHBT.
2005/7/28-29 [Computer/SW/Languages/Misc, Computer/SW/Languages/JavaScript] UID:38863 Activity:nil
7/28    How easy/hard is it to use Google Map's interface? Do you have
        to be a JavaScript expert? How many lines of code to write
        something simple?
           You have to know a little JS, but their examples in the docs will
           give you the general idea.  --dbushong
2005/7/28-29 [Uncategorized] UID:38864 Activity:nil
7/28    where is that program that generate ascii images?
        \_  __        ___     _      _                       ___
            \ \      / / |__ (_) ___| |__     ___  _ __   __|__ \
             \ \ /\ / /| '_ \| |/ __| '_ \   / _ \| '_ \ / _ \/ /
              \ V  V / | | | | | (__| | | | | (_) | | | |  __/_|
               \_/\_/  |_| |_|_|\___|_| |_|  \___/|_| |_|\___(_)
               \_ @@@@@@@@  @@@   @@@@@@@@  @@@       @@@@@@@@  @@@@@@@
                  @@@@@@@@  @@@  @@@@@@@@@  @@@       @@@@@@@@  @@@@@@@
                  @@!       @@!  !@@        @@!       @@!         @@!
                  !@!       !@!  !@!        !@!       !@!         !@!
                  @!!!:!    !!@  !@! @!@!@  @!!       @!!!:!      @!!
                  !!!!!:    !!!  !!! !!@!!  !!!       !!!!!:      !!!
                  !!:       !!:  :!!   !!:  !!:       !!:         !!:
                  :!:       :!:  :!:   !::   :!:      :!:         :!:
                   ::        ::   ::: ::::   :: ::::   :: ::::     ::
                   :        :     :: :: :   : :: : :  : :: ::      :
                   \_ hey nice, thanks.  which font is this?
                      \_ Ah, the yunguns...  "poison"
2005/7/28-29 [Recreation/Computer/Games, Computer/SW/OS/Windows] UID:38865 Activity:nil
7/28    So remember the guy on motd the other day that claimed that
        Microsoft's new anti-piracy measure would kill piracy once and for
        all?  Hacked within 24 hours:
        Now come back so that we can mock you.
        \_ I wonder how long before they patch the website up. Anyway,
           MS has the ability to do some real anti-piracy crap if they
           really wanted to, like they kind of do on XBOX live. However,
           I'm pretty sure someone out there will just start an alternate
           semi-legal "windows update" site that bypasses all this crap
           (like there are alternatives to XBOX live nowadays that doesn't
           do all that hardware and bios CRC checking).
        \_ I agree that this is a hack you need to do everytime you go to the
           Windows Update site (it's not as convenient as having a keygen'd
           product ID that just works), and it's likely it's not too hard for
           MS to fix by updating their HTML scripts.
2005/7/28-29 [Transportation/Car] UID:38866 Activity:nil
7/28    General Lee (the car): will it have the Confederate Flag?
        \_ of course
           \_ no PC?  Wow!
              \_ What else would it have? It's called the General Lee.
                 The horn plays Dixie. Yee-haw!
        \_ Is somebody making a new General Lee car model?
           \_ New Dukes of Hazzard Movie?
2005/7/28-29 [Politics/Domestic, Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:38867 Activity:nil
7/28    Woohoo! Hanoi Jane rides again!  Maybe we'll get a picture of her
        cutting of the head of an American hostage this time.
        \_ Wow, you're like, 35 years behind the times.  Pick up a newspaper,
        \_ you are such a tool
        \_ But what does The Free Republic have to say about this?
        \_ Lots of famous people are anti war. What's so special about
           this case? Fonda's kind of useless anyways, it's not like
           there are many conservative fans of hers in the first place.
2005/7/28-29 [Uncategorized] UID:38868 Activity:nil
7/28    I can remember submitting some CS projects with comments like these...
        \_ heh, an oldie but still a good one.  thanks for posting.  -mice
2005/7/28-29 [Reference/Religion] UID:38869 Activity:nil
2005/7/28-29 [Recreation/Celebrity/ParisHilton] UID:38870 Activity:kinda low
7/28    Jesus Christ
        \_ Huh?
        \_ mildly NSFW
        \_ ...
        \_ jesus christ doesn't have hooters, you ignorant twit
        \_ Is the one with small boobs Paris Hilton?
           \_ No.
        \_ One chick with hot boobs but ample waistline, and another with small
           boobs.  What about it?
           \_ In the real world, chicks with "hot boobs" of the type and
              dimension pictured usually tend to have "ample waistline,"
              unless their "hot boobs" are actually "fake boobs."  Most men
              have actually spent time around women and know this, but this
              is soda.
           \_ Small?  Smaller than the other, maybe....
2018/11/22 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2005:July:28 Thursday <Wednesday, Friday>