5/28    williamc, while many of us accept that you're ugly, you're also
        pretty dumb [for an Asian]. We suggest that you give a hard look at
        yourself before you decide to flame back. We wish you well.
        \_ Dumb? I think not.  I think the appropriate label for him is "bad
           person", and "bad citizen".  The "love it or leave it" crowd are one
           of the more loathesome components of the American political scene.
           Just by fouling our country with their bullshit attitude, they
           make America a worse place to live.  I suppose he thinks America
           would be a better place if everyone who has fought to improve
           something that was wrong with our country for the last 200 years had
           just picked up and left instead of fighting for change?
        \_ Yes, your ad hominem attacks are indeed very intelligent of you.
           As for your political views, why are you so defensive when
           someone disagrees with you? After all, isn't the point of political
           debate to foster discussion? As for "love it or leave it," instead
           of complaining about it why don't you actually try to come up
           with some real solutions instead of whining about it? As for your
           political views, I would urge you to closely examine all issues
           on both sides of the fence before coming down to conclusions that
           "bush is bad" or "we have to kill all the terrorists". Unfortunately
           the world is much more nuanced than the political propogandists
           would lead you to believe. As for idiotic proposals that we've
           seen recently, they include:
           1. Suggesting that everyone ride a bike (very smart).
           2. We begin protesting just for protests sake (save your energy).
           3. There actually needs to be a discussion on evolution (save
              your breath).
           4. We should support a people who celebrated 9/11 (the Palestinians)
           Now, whether you are a conservative, a liberal, a libertarian, etc.
           if you went to Berkeley and had an iota of common sense you'd realize
           that any of these ideas are pretty dumb. If you don't like people
           responding to your political views, then don't post them.
           Anyway, send me an email if you really want to debate any of these
           topics. We can pick a forum and we can have at it. -williamc
           \_ You've been trolled. Yes, you're very smart.
        \_ While I don't like your personal attack, I do agree that it's
           important to keep an open mind. This country was founded by
           immigrants and visionaries who continually shaped America a
           better place to live. Our fathers have done a lot of good things
           from Emancipation, Women's Sufferage, all the way to Civil Rights.
           I've lived in US most of my life and have been taught that
           America's the best place in the world. I think that may be true,
           but as I get older and have more opportunities to travel abroad
           I also see a lot of good things in other countries like Canada
           and Denmark. Just because our country is the greatest doesn't
           mean we should stop making it even better. Our fathers have done a
           lot of good things, and we should too. I love America, and I
           also have some things I think could be improved. That is why I
           refuse to leave America. I will stay here, and fight for things
           that matter to people, like more tolerance, more compassion,
           better city planning/transportation, and more accountability in
           both the government and corporations. If anyone tells you to "get
           the fuck out of US", that person is narrow minded to a point that
           he/she is unable to take any criticism and should be the one to
           get the fuck out of US. So do us a favor and stay. Continue the
           tradition our fathers have made by continually making America a
           better place to live.

5/29    Any hobby astronomers here?  Can someone point me to a link with hints
        on how to read a star chart?  I have a telescope and have been playing
        with various planetarium-type apps (Starcalc looks neat) and am
        having trouble figuring out how to read the various projections--they
        all look back-assward.  Most "how to read star charts" links seem to
        deal with astrology.  -John
        \_ Redo your google search with "site:.edu".  That weeds out the
           astrology crap.
           \_ Thanks for the tip--I guess I'm just sort of unsure on a very
              basic level of what to look for.  I'm familiar with most of the
              terminology, but am hoping to find some sort of pointer to
              standing in a given spot with a conic or parallel sky chart,
              knowing which way is north, and then figuring out how to locate
              various objects based on the chart.  I'm just having trouble
              visualizing what goes where, if that makes any sense.  -John
        \_ German astronomy:  http://www.astrodatabank.com/NM/HitlerAdolf.htm
                  \- i assume your catelog is listed by right ascensction
                     [24 hrs about the celestial equator] and then declination
                     [like latitude]. or is your question about naming conven-
                     tion/nomenclature?
                     \_ More basic--"I'm standing in a field, here's a round
                        map of the night sky with compass directions, how do
                        I find object xyz from the map in the sky?"
        \_ skip the telescope for now.  buy a star chart from local store
           (to reflect proper latitude), get a compass, a flash light,
           warm clothing, along with the star chart you got, and go
           somewhere *DARK*.  If you are in the cities, where light
           pollution is severe, you won't able to make out anything in
           the sky.  In dark country side, once you got your orientation
           straight and date/time on the star chart properly adjusted, then
           you can actually match stars in the sky and the star chart.
           Telescope is only good for 1. planets such as Jupiter, Mars,
           Saturn. and 2. special event such as comets, eclipses, etc.
           \_ Depends--with the 5mm ocular I can see a lot of pretty
              spectacular stars & clusters that I wouldn't see otherwise.
              I've tried your suggestion anyway, but can't seem to get my
              bearings on how the chart represents what's actually up there,
              that's my problem.  Thanks though.  -John

5/29    I'm sure there are people here using SBC DSL using linux
        I assume it is not too difficult to hack around their lame
        software and make it an "always on" connection.  Correct?
        Is it any easier/harder if I go with their wireless setup vs.
        the standard??  Info appreciated.
        \_ Never done wireless without using a router, but there is a Linux
           PPPoE client. Why not just get a router? They are so cheap these
           days. If you want wireless you can get a wireless router.
           \_ I have wireless(dlink) and wired routers(surestream dsl modem)
              I'm just confirming that I won't have (much) of an issue if I
              don't have a windows box to install their software on.
              The people I've seen with yahoo-sbc dsl have
              "had" to install software on their system and have to
           \_ I have wireless and wired routers.  I'm just confirming that
              I won't have (much) of an issue, if I don't have a windows
              box to install their software on.  I don't know how their
              system is set up, but I know that the people I've seen with
              it they have installed software on their system and have to
              click a stupid little "login" button on their desktop in
              order to log in.  I assume that i will be able to STFW for
              ways around that, but figured someone here could confirm that
              and let me know if it made any difference what hardware I got
              from them (e.g. whatever they ship with their wireless pkg.
              vs. whatever they ship with their standard package).
              \_ router keeps it alive, machines can go down
              \_ That software they install is just a PPOE client. You don't
                 even need it on Windows XP since it has a built in PPOE client.
                 Just get a router though, makes things a lot easier.
              \_ there's a web-url to activate your DSL login name/account
                 so you don't need to load their software which is just
                 there to ensure you have the right hardware specs, the
                 PPPoE software and their yahoo-branded commercial shit.
                 But yeah, get a frigging router, save you headaches.
                 Don't try no "hacks" or linux crapola. Don't get fancy.
                 Make sure you get their traditional dsl modem, not the
                 2wire option, unless u know what u r doing.

5/29    Watch republican fuckwit stooge David Brooks explain how all of
        society's ills are the fault of "educated elites".
        http://www.nytimes.com/2005/05/29/opinion/29brooks.html?hp
        \_ Well hey, what did you think?  Merit is bad!  Working hard towards
           success is bad!  -John
        \_ I agree with you that Brooks is a Republican stooge, but I think
           this article raises some interesting points.  For example, all of
           the credible contenders for the presidential nomination (Bush,
           Kerry, Dean) were from wealthy families.  He also makes a great
           point about education.  Public schools are one of the main
           enablers of social mobility these days, yet the opportunity to
           attend good schools is becoming harder for the poor.  Finally,
           I think the best example of educated elites maintaining the
           status quo is the mainstream media's cowardice and inability to
           do any real reporting on the horrible things going on in this
           administration.  -emin
           \_ Edwards wasn't credible? He ended up doing better than Dean.

5/29    Here is my stupid question of the day.  Why we are on North
        Korea?  So what if they test their nuclear bomb?  They
        have withdrew from the nuclear non-proliferation treaty. and
        There is not much we can do within the bounds of international
        law that we can condamn them for, no?
        \_ because they are likely to sell their nuclear secrets to whoever
           has money (ie, muslim oil exporting countries).
           \_ Pakistan has done just that.  What kind of punishment did
              they get again?
              \_ A handshake for being a great partner in the war on terror,
                 then a few months later a few billion in arms sales.
        \_ This is just one liberal, Bush-haters point of view, so take
           it for what it is worth, but I think we are on North Korea
           because it is run by a dangerous egomaniacal nutjob who is
           busy starving his people and acting irrationally in the
           International community. Kim Jong Il is not someone
           I would trust with a chiansaw, much less nuclear weapons,
           I would trust with a chainsaw, much less nuclear weapons,
           but then again, I get all my information about him from
           the Western media, so maybe I am misinformed.
           \- Greetings, Earthlings! --k.j. il
           \_ I am not saying it is right or wrong. just wondering rather
              we have the legal ground to take any actions or not.  Since
              neither India nor Pakistan nor Israel are being punished for
              \- the united states did "punish" india/pak in the sense that
                 it took certain actions it would have not otherwise taken
                 'against' them, but yeah that isnt punishment in the sense
                 of "justice meted out by a sovereign". "tribal sovereignty
                 means that it is sovereign". -BUSHCO. --psb
              having a nuke, since there are 30k Americans within 30 miles
              of N.Korea's border, If I am Kim Jong Il, I will have all
              the reason to have nukes...
              \_ "legal ground" assumes there exists a central authority
                 who writes the law and enforces the law. UN is an attempt
                 but historically, "legal ground" between countries comes down
                 to who has a bigger muscle. For example, American Indians
                 have no legal ground to live in fertile land, Spaniards have
                 no legal ground to claim California, native Hawaiians have
                 no legal ground to run their tribal government, and Sadam
                 Hussein has no legal ground to run his regime.
                 \- well you can argue if a state does something contravening
                    a treaty they have signed, even in the abscence of a
                    a central authority, they have done something illegal.
                    *if* india had signed the NPT, the us could have claimed
                    what india did was "illegal".
                    \_ Just for the record, NK DID sign the NPT.  They
                       just dropped it when they were caught developing
                       nukes. -jrleek
                       http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB87