Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2005:April:19 Tuesday <Monday, Wednesday>
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2005/4/19 [Politics/Domestic/SIG] UID:37252 Activity:nil
4/18    ACLU smoking dope at border? Minutemen say photos show
        'legal observers' getting high
        http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=43867
        \_ ACLU members smoking pot? This surprises you?
           Given the type of cases/clients the ACLU takes,
           it is apparent they have been smoking something
           for years.
2005/4/19-20 [Reference/Religion] UID:37253 Activity:kinda low
4/19    New Pope has been selected (don't know who it is yet though):
        http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/europe/04/19/pope.tuesday/index.html
        \_ We have a new member of the deadpool - Pope Benedictine XVI
           (formerly Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger [age: 77]). Gentlemen,
        \_ We have a new member of the deadpool - Pope Benedict XVI
           (formerly Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger [age: 78]). Gentlemen,
           adjust your bets.
           \_ How do you know?  He hasn't been announced yet.
              \_ He's 78. Of course, they'll add him to the deadpool, unless
                 he dies before then... (Insert conspiracy here)
                 \_ Conservative enough to keep the hard-liners happy and to
                    let them save face, old enough to die soon and let them
                    pick a good long-term solution.  -John
                 \_ Oh, Yahoo! News wasn't up-to-the-minute, even though I did
                    a force-reload.
        \_ BTW, can the cardinals talk to the public about the voting after a
           new pope is elected?
           \_ They can, but if they do and are found out, they would be
              excommunicated.
              \_ During the vote, but after?
              \_ You're not serious are you?  Giving details about
                 the election of a pope is punishable by eternal
                 damnation?
                 \_ You can usually be un-excommunicated if you recant what
                    ever it was you did.  For higher-ups it would probably
                    mean a major demotion though.
                 \_ How many "tell-all" books are there about the Holy See?
                    Damn near none.
                    \_ Some news cast says it has become a tradition that the
                       first round of voting has become a round of courtesy
                       voting, where cardinals just vote for their close
                       colleagues respectively or whomever that have been
                       working hard to give them recognition, rather than
                         \- Yes, this is known as the "Big Up Yourself" round.
                       voting for whom they think should become the next pope.
                       Then the real voting starts at the secound round.  Now
                       how do we outside people know about this if no cardinals
                       ever talk about the voting even after it's over?
                       \_ The same way we know about CIA agents. Anonymous
                          sources to connected newspeople who keep their
                          mouths shut. They are excommunicated if FOUND OUT.
                          \_ Well, as holy as cardinals, they are just ordinary
                             people after all.
                             \_ Well I guess I was wrong. Some of the
                                Cardinals are talking about the conclave
                                despite their oaths of secrecy. Some vague
                                generalities, but still....
        \_ Okay, no same-sex marriage, no female priests, no pills, no condoms.
           I hope he at least continues to reach out to Islam. -- !religious
                        \_ No way.  Remember, "dictatorship of relativism",
                           The islams are heretics and heathens in the
                           eyes of God
                           \_ Concur. He's hard core Western Orthodox.
                              \_ he's orthodox, but not necessarily
                                 Western Orthodox.
           \_ No married priests. Continued centralization of Catholic
              power towards the Vatican. Less reaching out to younger
              generation. Future of the Church is unclear.
              \_ One bright spot is he apparently knows how to tell people
                 they're going to hell in 10 different languages.
                 \_ I wonder if Galileo is packing to go back to Hell.
              \_ without Ratzinger, the church would become a democracy
                 and would follow every latest fad without any anchor
                 in God, Jesus Christ and the truth.
                 \_ With Ratzinger, the world will end with overpopulation.
        \_ Somehow his face looks like he's an evil Enron or MCI executive.
           \_ Good German stock.
        \_ Last odds were 7-2.
2005/4/19 [Computer/SW/WWW/Browsers] UID:37254 Activity:nil
4/19    Firefox 1.0.3 released. Fixes security vulnerabilities.
        http://www.mozilla.org/projects/security/known-vulnerabilities.html
2005/4/19-20 [Reference/Religion] UID:37255 Activity:high
4/19    Germany's Ratzinger is the new pope. Too bad. I was hoping we'd get
        a black or oriental pope. Damn (*@#$ Catholic racists.
                   \_ Uhm, we prefer "Asian".
        \_ you're the racist. look in the mirror
           \_ Racism against whites is not racism!  It's affirmative action!
              -- PC joe
        \_ yea, but they say the secret cardinal could be a chinese.
        \_ If we get an oriental pope, what if he picked a name like
           Pope Chingchung XVII?!
        \_ The only Asian western media will accept is idiots like
           William Hung, look, that's an Asian and that's what they
           are good for!
                \_ Wouldn't that be Pope Chingchung I?
        \_ I smell a "Rat"
        \_ Don't worrry.  In a couple years, we'll go through this circus
           again and we'll have another chance for a black or asian pope.
        \_ I don't think there are any more racist countries in the world
           than those in asia.
           \_ speaking like a true racist.
                \_ how do you figure?  I doubt he is suggesting that racism
                   is genetic (whether or not he believes it and whether or
                   not it is true).  And the countries in asia ARE more
                   racist.  (yes, *all* of them.)

        \_ There was a black Pope before the U.S. was discovered by Columbus.
           \_ http://www.ipoaa.com/black_popes_in_italy_pope_victor.htm
           \_ there were three black Popes before the year 1000
              \_ Who cares about a St. Victor, St Militades or a St. Gelsius?
                 Wait till we have a St. Mugambi.
                 \_ That's St. Mugabe to you!  -John
                 \_ the three popes mentioned above are black popes.  Way
                    before many countries had a black leader.
                    \_ But they adopted European names, so they betrayed their
                       African heritage.
        \_ Ah, the young German:
           http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2089-1572667,00.html
2005/4/19-21 [Uncategorized] UID:37256 Activity:nil
4/19    What is a good and inexpensive RF bug detector?  I don't find any
        comparison shop or review site for this kind of things.
2005/4/19-20 [Reference/Religion] UID:37257 Activity:nil
4/19    Thank GOd! I was feeling popeless for a few days..
        \_ Get yer hands out of your pants - you'll go BLIND.
        \_ with all the Catholic molestations, i was hoping they
           would come out with Pope on a Rope this time..
2005/4/19-21 [Uncategorized] UID:37258 Activity:nil
4/19    Anyone know why ilyas has stopped posting for over 1 month? Has
        he successfully aaron'ed himself?
        \_ He is gathering hHis resources for His grand comeback. -ilyas #1 fan
        \_ He is gathering His resources for His grand comeback. -ilyas #1fan
2005/4/19 [Uncategorized] UID:37259 Activity:nil
4/19    Attention
2005/4/19-21 [Health/Dental] UID:37260 Activity:high
4/19    Is coke bad for me? I feel I need the 'kick' after lunch. I don't
        drink Coke as I mainly drink Sprite. Is one a day bad in the
        long run?  What do you health conscious sodans do?
        \- it's bad for your teeth more than anythign else.
           \_ because of the sugar?
              \_ The sugar and the acids.
        \_ Yes. coke is bad.  In addition to sugar and acid mentioned below,
           you are ingesting 1) empty calories(no nutritional content),
           2) a miniscule amount of aluminum which may be linked to Alzheimers
                \_ This was pretty much debunked.  The Alzheimer's
                   brain plaque mass spec which showed aluminum in
                   Alzheimer's brains was contaminated.
           3) a ton of calories which causes weight gain, or sugar substitutes
           which have been potentially linked to any number of weird,
           fucked up conditions(IOW don't touch saccharin and other
           substitutes with a 10 foot pole), and 4) caffeine, which some
           ppl say negatively affects the body: it speeds heart rate,
           increases blood pressure, etc.
           If you need a caffeine kick, drink tea, preferably green tea,
           which has antioxidants and has beneficial health effects.
           On the other hand, you could try getting some mild exercise
           during lunch(15 min. jog, or 30 min. yoga).  This likely will
           keep your metabolism up, and you won't feel tired in the afternoon.
           \_ thanks, will do!
        \_ High acid + sugar is bad for teeth.  Corn syrup instead of
           sugar is bad for your dabetic tendencies and waistline (then
           again that's true of all major soft drinks these days.)  And
           frankly coke tastes like ass, drink tea or coffee instead.
           \_ Coke from other countries tastes different and better than
              they do here (primarily because they use real sugar).
           \_ What about diet coke/pepsi?
              \_ You're substituting chemicals that at least occur somewhat
                 naturally in nature with funky ones that do not.  And if
                 regular coke tastes like malted battery acid, diet coke tastes
                 like malted battery acid with a funky aftertaste.
                 \_ But what about my teeth?
           \_ What's with the acid? Is coke really acidy compared to other
              sodas? I have noticed before that Coke feels weird on my teeth
              afterwards unlike any other drink. I am in the habit of always
              rinsing my mouth with water after drinking/eating anything.
              \_ My old roommated did a project in undergrad that involved
                 effects of coke on concrete and metal.  Coke can eat concrete.
                 - 3 cokes-a-day
        \_ "Acidic food and drinks can cause decay. Listed below are the
           pH values of some food and drinks. The lower the pH number; the
           more acidic the product. Anything with a pH value lower than 5 may
           cause tooth decay. Alkalies have a high pH number and neutralise
           the acid effects of sugars."
           - mineral water (still) pH 7.6
           - milk pH 6.9
           - cheddar cheese pH 5.9
           - lager pH 4.4
           - orange juice pH 3.8
           - grapefruit pH 3.3
           - pickles pH 3.2
           - cola pH 2.5
           - red wine pH 2.5
           - vinegar pH 2.0
           - concentrated HCL solution -1.0 <-- don't drink this
                \_ What is the pH of vomit?
                   \_ That should be around 2, the same as your stomach HCL.
        \_ You could try some Cambodian tap water; it's especially interesting
           if accidentally consumed (ice cubes, washed fruit).  OK it won't
           pick you up, but it sure has some amusing side-effects.  -John
           \_ It's really not as bad as you say, I spent 3 months there and
             brushed my teeth using tap water, ate the ice and everything you
             not suppose to do minus drink tap water straight.  I only once got\
             sick and that was from eating iceberg lettuce...which I assume was
             washed in tap water or fertilized with crap or some such fun.
             -scottyg
              brushed my teeth using tap water, ate the ice and everything
              you not suppose to do minus drink tap water straight.  I only
              once got sick and that was from eating iceberg lettuce...which
              I assume was washed in tap water or fertilized with crap or
              some such fun. -scottyg
              \_ Fair enough, but it is pretty bad.  Luck of the draw and
                 your own physiology have a lot to do with it--my girlfriend
                 can drink Mexican tap water, while I get gastroenteritis from
                 just looking at it.  -John
                 \_ that's not a nice thing to say about your girlfriend.
                    \_ Yermom douches with Cambodian tap water.  -John
2005/4/19-20 [Computer/SW/OS, Computer/SW/OS/VM] UID:37261 Activity:low
4/19    How do I enter those funky 'o' with 2 dots, accented e, and other
        characters on my computer? And is motd non-English character compliant?
        \_ You mean the German umlaut? äüö
        \_ You mean the German umlaut? M-CM-$M-CM-<M-CM-6
        \_ Which OS?  And the motd is a text file.  Whether it supports
           UTF8 or Unicode or whatever is up to whatever programs people use
           to edit and to read the file, yes?
        \_ You mean 
        \_ You mean M-`M-aM-bM-cM-dM-eM-fM-gM-hM-iM-jM-kM-lM-mM-nM-oM-pM-qM-rM-s\
M-tM-uM-vM-xM-yM-zM-{M-|M-}
        \_  ObHeavyMetalUmlaut r0x0rs:
            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heavy_metal_umlaut
            -dans
        \_ if you're in screen, screen-escape ^V o :
2005/4/19-21 [Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Motd] UID:37262 Activity:kinda low
4/19    Alright John & tom, you have your opinions and I respect them. I'd
        like to take this time to hear more constructive and useful
        comments from you guys, like what specific actions I can do to
        make Kais Motd less sucky by your high standards. And feel free to
        spare stuff like 'go stick your head in a pig, twink.' Thanks -kchang
        \_ Please, please feel free to quote me where I said that it's
           "sucky".  I believe it's your site that classifies my last (only?)
           comment on it as "UID 37247".  Have a look, get back to me.  I
           merely noted that it had munged some entries before.  It's fine,
           but fix the grammatical error.  Or are you naming me because I find
           some of the knee-jerk mob mentality lets-gang-up-on-tom shit to be
           pretty stupid?  Great.  -John
        \_ Wow, kchang outclasses Tom.
        \_ I'm really not interested in the application, but two obvious
           improvements would be to get rid of blink and get rid of all
           the annoying disclaimers.  -tom
           \_ 1) blink gone. 2) Until I can figure out a way to tell random
              hosers to stop emailing me hate mail because some of the posts
              are politically incorrect, I will leave disclaimers there.
              \_ How many of these emails do you get?  Why don't you post
                 the logins of these assholes here?
                 \_ i'm pretty sure he means random lackwits from the internets
                    \_ I still think he should post the funniest hatemail
                       he gets to the motd, along with the users email
                       address. It would be fun to taunt them and make
                       go nuts, ala tjb.
              \_ Duh, stick a password on it that only soda people would know
                 like "csuamotd/csuamotd" or something.
        \_ I am upset that because of your spying script, I cannot
           write the childish things that I want to write!! ;)
           \_ chiry or amirs or someone else-- you can just do:
              "echo '4/19   Hello world' >> /etc/motd.public"
        \_ How about dropping the dorky "guess who edited the motd" feature?
           \_ You mean like where people vote on who he/she thinks posted?
        \_ Why do you have the disclaimers 10 times?  Once is enough, and not
           in red.  Why are threads with disclaimers greyed out while threads
           without disclaimers in black?  Why can't I just enter UID 37247
           that John provided above and go to that thread?
2005/4/19-20 [Computer/SW/Unix] UID:37263 Activity:nil
4/19    Stupid sed question:  I know you can use UNIX environment variables
        in a sed script by double quoting at the command line, i.e.:
        sed "s/_momma_type_/$MOMMA/g" input.file
        will be expanded by the shell before execution so that _momma_type_
        will be substituted with whatever the value of $MOMMA happens to
        be.  Is there anyway do this in a sed script specified by sed -f?
        or do I have to use a shell script to get shell substitution?
        I'm guessing the latter, but I thought I'd ask just to be sure.
        \_ Environment variable substitution is handled by the shell.
        \_ You can do it in Perl. I don't know sed. Sounds like sed sucks.
           \- i use sed and awk for a lot of stuff but if you are writing
              enough sed to need to put it in a file, yeah use perl. --psb
2005/4/19-21 [Reference/BayArea] UID:37264 Activity:nil
4/19    I'm looking into joining a credit union in the south bay area.
        I know about TechCU.  What others are out there?  I want to do
        some comparison shopping.  If you are in a credit union, which
        one and what do you like about it?  Thanks.
        \_ off the top of my head, there's Valley CU , silicon valley CU.
           I'm a member of addisonavenue (formerly HPCU, formerly HPEFCU).
           Back during the boom the rates were really nice.  I don't
           utilize very many of their services.
        \_ What's the difference between credit union and a bank? No this
           is not a troll.
           \_ A credit union is owned by the members. Any money the credit
              union makes is paid back to the members in the form of
              interest on deposits.
           \_ A credit union is like a co-op, so expect a house manager that
              sells MJ on the side and weekly parties with complimentary
              nitrous oxide.
           \_ What are the top deposit rates at credit unions for savings
              or money market type accounts? Last I checked, they weren't
              better than what you can get with an online money market.
        \_ I have an account with Patelco CU.  They had really good interest
           rates 2-3 years ago, but it's not that great anymore.  It seems
           higher than TechCU, though.
        \_ Credit Unions tend to be less evil, don't fuck you in the
           ass for things like using foriegn ATMs, etc.
           \_ instead, the other banks charge you for using their atms
              wamu does not.  wamu = good.
2005/4/19-20 [Reference/History/WW2/Germany] UID:37265 Activity:nil
4/19    Gentleman, prepare your flamethrowers.  The new pope is a former
        member of the Hitler Youth.
        http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2089-1572667,00.html
        \_ plenty of youth in Germany were required to join the hitler
           youth durin gthe war.  i suppose the alternative is to
           just kill yourself.
           \_ Yes, please go do that.
        \_ And deserted from the German army.
        \_ A brief, compulsory member of the Hitler Youth only until he
           could get out of it by going to seminary.
           \_ until he deserted from the army in 1944.
        \_ He was also in the Nazi anti-aircraft unit.
           \_ Protecting a BMW factory making airplane engines.  Should
              we stop buying BMW's as well?
              \_ There are motd readers stupid enough to pay money for
                 a BMW?
2005/4/19-21 [Computer/SW/Apps, Computer/SW/OS/OsX] UID:37266 Activity:kinda low
4/19    Is there anyway to open up a jpeg in Powerpoint, modify it with
        the built-in drawing tools, and then save it as a jpeg again (with
        modifications)? I'm wondering because I need a program on OS X to
        do simple drawing with (using tools similar to what powerpoint
        offers: lines, boxes, etc.). I have photoshop, but it doesn't
        have drawing tools. If powerpoint doesn't allow this, does anyone
        have recommendations for a free/cheap drawing program for OS X?
        Thanks.
        \_ i think most recent macs come with omnigraffle.  would that be
           sufficient?
                \_ I do have omnigraffle, but I can't even open jpegs.
                   does your omnigraffle open jpegs? -op
                   \_ File->Place Image...
                      Works w/ jpegs and pngs in OmniGraffle 3.2.1
                      (at least w/ the licensed version)
        \_ jpeg is lossy. Don't save a drawing as a jpeg.
           save the drawing as PNG. it will look a while lot better.
                \_ well the images are already in jpeg, so I'd prefer
                   to keep them that way. -op
                   \_ IIRC, each time you save em, they get more lossy.
                      who/what program created them in the first place?
        \_ Photoshop doesn't have drawing tools?  Eh?  Exactly what are
           are you trying to do?
                \_ photoshop is a paint program, so it doesn't have drawing
                  tools like a line tool, circle tool, etc. -op
                \_ I just want to add several lines and circles to an image
                   to point out certain parts. Pretty simple stuff. Photoshop
                   makes simple stuff like that difficult to accomplish.
        \_ Why don't you just import the JPEG into your PP presentation
           and draw on top of it using the PP drawing tools?
2005/4/19-21 [Industry/Jobs] UID:37267 Activity:nil
4/19    Several job openings for SysAdmins/DBAs/Developers at various levels
        Email me for details or just send your resume -ccook
        \_Where?
         \_I'd rather not post the name here due to uptight HR people. Jobs
           are near SFO though if that's what you meant
          \_ Use your SysAdmin-foo to make an educated guess. -!ccook
                               \_ fu
          \_ Use your SysAdmin-fu to make an educated guess. -!ccook
2005/4/19-21 [Uncategorized] UID:37268 Activity:nil
4/19    What is the website for TraqNet?  http://www.leemah.com does not
        seem to be it.
2005/4/19-21 [Politics/Domestic/Abortion] UID:37270 Activity:moderate
4/19    Pope Benedict XVI (aka Cardinal Ratzinger) believes in excommunication
        for all pro-choice Catholics
        http://csua.org/u/brk (priestsforlife.org)
        \_ Sounds good to me.  As a liberal athiest, I think anything that
        \_ Sounds good to me.  I think anything that
           makes members of religious cults question their beliefs is good
           for society.  This guy is going to further accelerate the already
           massive hemoraging of American Catholics from their church.
        \_ Sounds good to me.  I think anything that makes members of
           religious cults question their beliefs is good for society.  This
           guy is going to further accelerate the already massive hemoraging
           of American Catholics from their church.
           \_ so you want a church which wants people to have abortion,
              and supports abortion, which is defined as a very grave evil?
        \_ I like the way they nodded that voting for Kerry is ok:
           "When a Catholic does not share a candidates stand in favour
           of abortion and/or euthanasia, but votes for that candidate for
           other reasons, it is considered remote material cooperation, which
           can be permitted in the presence of proportionate reasons"
           \_ Why should a Catholic vote for Bush instead, since he is
              pro-death penalty, pro-pre-emptive illegal war, and pro-wealth
              gap/pro-unfettered capitalism, things the Catholic church is
              also against?
              \_ The above, translated: "It's bad to vote for pro-choice
                 candidates, but there may be good reasons that outweigh the
                 bad."
              \_ [I posted the quote about Kerry]  Hell if I know, I'm not
                 a Catholic.  I agree with you that Bush seems pretty anti-
                 Catholic values.  However, the link above says pro-choice
                 Catholic politicians cannot receive communion, so I think
                 it's interesting that they explicitly mentioned a way out
                 for people who still want to vote for Kerry.
                 \_ I guess it can be argued that the "sins" of abortion
                    and euthanasia >> war/death penalty/wealth gap, not
                    that a church is likely to have an issue with cognitive
                    dissonance.
           \_ the key is defining "proportionate".
              http://www.catholicculture.org/docs/doc_view.cfm?recnum=6159
              \_ Is their name supposed to be an oxymoron?
                 \_ what name?  why do you think it is an oxymoron?
2005/4/19-21 [Uncategorized] UID:37271 Activity:nil
4/19    Sam Fisher needs this:
        http://www.defensetech.org/archives/001499.html
        \_ Finally!  Vanishing cream for men!
2005/4/19-20 [Health/Disease/AIDS] UID:37272 Activity:nil
4/19    "Freebird!"
        http://online.wsj.com/public/article/0,,SB111102511477881964,00.html
2005/4/19-21 [Reference/History/WW2] UID:37273 Activity:high
4/19    Related to the poll below re which era you would like to visit.
        If you could go back in time and witness one battle which one
        would you pick?  Personally I'd choose the Battle of Marathon.
                  \- i assume you have read your herodotus. you might
                     read s. pressfield: gates of fire if you have not
                     already. in a different time, if interested in battle
                     details and a story better than da vinci code, see
                     e.g. "the archers tale" by bernard cornwell. decent quick
                     pulp read ... long description of crecy. and of course
                     A Distant Mirror is a classic. have not read Solider
                     in the Fog. btw, thucydides >>>> herodotus. ok tnx.
              \- Why marathon and not thermopylae?
                     O xein angellein Lakedaimoniois hoti tede
                     keimetha tois keinon rhemasi peithomenoi
                 Might pick Agincourt or Crecy, maybe Zama or Gaugmela,
                 Cannae or Teutoberger Wald/Clades Variana, Pharsala or
                 Actium or Salamis. --psb
                 \_ iirc, Marathon came first and basically ensured
                    that Greek civilization (specifically Athens)
                    would survive. Also Marathon was a real victory
                    in which the good guys mostly walked away unscathed
                    vs. Thermopylae in which the good guys (Leonidas
                    and the 300 Spartan Hoplites) got killed.
                    \- i thought you were going for the drama factor. um,
                       "good guys" here is clearly a "relative term". if you
                       are filled with hate for persians, set your time
                       machine to gaugmela. i think it would be pretty cool
                       to hang out with agricola or marcus aurelius or any of
                       the "good emperors" for a season. i suppose it might
                       be horribly fascinating for some to see what exactly
                       tiberius did after retiring to capri. tagging along
                       for the melian dialog would be pretty amazing.
                       cannae would be more interesting than marathon. --psb
        \_ The one where the Romans attacked Syracuse and got their asses
           kicked by devices designed by Archimedes. That would have to have
           been a good day to be a nerd.
                  \- i assume you have read your herodotus. you might
                     read s. pressfield: gates of fire if you have not
                     already. in a different time, if interested in battle
                     details and a story better than da vinci code, see
                     e.g. "the archers tale" by bernard cornwell. decent quick
                     pulp read ... long description of crecy. and of course
                     A Distant Mirror is a classic. have not read Solider
                     in the Fog. btw, thucydides >>>> herodotus. ok tnx.
              \- Why marathon and not thermopylae?
                     O xein angellein Lakedaimoniois hoti tede
                     keimetha tois keinon rhemasi peithomenoi
                 Might pick Agincourt or Crecy, maybe Zama or Gaugmela,
                 Cannae or Teutoberger Wald/Clades Variana, Pharsala or
                 Actium or Salamis. --psb
                 \_ Why the FUCK is it so hard for you to indent like a normal
                    person?
                    \_ emacs is lame.
                    \- E_FOOLISHCONSISTENCY
                 \_ iirc, Marathon came first and basically ensured
                    that Greek civilization (specifically Athens)
                    would survive. Also Marathon was a real victory
                    in which the good guys mostly walked away unscathed
                    vs. Thermopylae in which the good guys (Leonidas
                    and the 300 Spartan Hoplites) got killed.
                    \- i thought you were going for the drama factor. um,
                       "good guys" here is clearly a "relative term". if you
                       are filled with hate for persians, set your time
                       machine to gaugmela. i think it would be pretty cool
                       to hang out with agricola or marcus aurelius or any of
                       the "good emperors" for a season. i suppose it might
                       be horribly fascinating for some to see what exactly
                       tiberius did after retiring to capri. tagging along
                       for the melian dialog would be pretty amazing.
                       cannae would be more interesting than marathon. --psb
        \_ Anything big in WWII (assuming I get my invisible bullet-proof
           flying bubble to watch it from.)  -John
2017/09/22 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
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Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2005:April:19 Tuesday <Monday, Wednesday>