Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2005:February:14 Monday <Sunday, Tuesday>
Berkeley CSUA MOTD
2005/2/14-15 [Computer/SW/Mail] UID:36164 Activity:high
2/13    We just got SBC yahoo DSL and can't send or
        calmail mail with Eudora anymore.  We already changed SMTP server over
        as per help page suggestion. Anybody else had trouble with this?
           \_ Thanks but we already changed the SMTP server over, which is what
              above article is mostly about, and we still can't
              send via socrates or calmail. I'm wondering whether we should just
              cancel before the intro period is over.
           \_ They pulled this shit on my mother last week, and I wasted a good
              4 or 5 hours of my life trying to figure out how she could have
              screwed up her email.  Instead it was SBC fucking things up.
              \_ You should be angry at the spammers for forcing SBC to do
                 this, rather than SBC.
                 \_ wrong.  there were any number of ways SBC could have
                    approached the problem.  they made the most brain-dead
                    decision which would piss off the widest array of
                    \_ The truth is actually a little worse. They approached
                       the problem by making it conspicuously more difficult to
                       send email by means other than their proprietary
                       browser/mailer...which exists primarily to harvest
                       marketing data and re-direct people to sponsored material
                       a la AOL. I suppose that's what to expect from the
                       cheapest DSL provider, though.
                    \_ Are you the kind of person who feels ok stealing online
                       music because "that's how it ought to be anyway"?  Use
                       the service as it's provided, or don't use it at all.
                       \_ It's against the TOS, the TOS are stupid, there are
                          better ways of doing this, this has nothing at all
                          to do with stealing music, switch ISPs and tell them
                          to go fuck themselves sideways, tell all your
                          friends to switch (I would--remember that maxim
                          about each dissatisfied customer equalling 13 p.o'ed
                          customers?  SBC might not..) write them a letter
                          explaining that you're switching and why, and wash
                          your hands of it, don't give money for shitty
                          service, don't argue with braindead "take-it-or-
                          leave-it" morons, enjoy your day.  -John
                       \_ This was a change in service that breaks a commonly
                          used feature.  Do you liken Dynamic DNS and running
                          your own mail server to stealing music?  Or even if
                          running your own server was against TOS, connecting
                          to an authorized SMTP server with your browser was
                          not.  This was stupid.  Plain and simple.
                          \_ Would you say that it's ok to race in a rental
                             car, even though it's against the TOS?  The SBC
                             TOS is clear in that customers are not to run
                             *any* servers.  If you don't like it, find another
                             dsl provider.
                             \_ Meyers, are you being obtuse deliberately?
                                Yes, it stops spammers from sending out mail.
                                But they had infinite options to curb the
                                problem, and they picked the one that pissed
                                off the most people.  And did you just not read
                                the post before answering?  Are you getting
                                kickbacks from SBCi?
                                \_ See, this is where you have your head up
                                   your ass. They do not have infinite options.
                                   I have run an ISP and stopping your users
                                   from sending spam is techinically very
                                   from sending spam is technically very
                                   hard. I am curious what you think would
                                   be easier to implement that would work
                                   just as well and would piss off less
                                \_ I agree that running a private mail server
                                   for the household is hardly a strain on
                                   the bandwidth you pay for, but SBC (and
                                   Comcast, etc) spell out what they allow for
                                   how the connection can be used.  It's
                                   funny listening to how much motd-types are
                                   sticklers for the exact letter of the law
                                   or a contract, until it becomes
                                   inconvenient for them.  But hey, let the
                                   free market decide, right?  -meyers
                                   \_ You're missing the point; SBC is blocking
                                      *outgoing* connections to port 25, not
                                      incoming connections to mail servers.
                                      (They might be blocking connections to
                                      mail servers, too, but that's not the
                                      issue posed.)  I'm sure using Eudora is
                                      not against the TOS.
                                      \_ No, the point is SBC defines what
                                         their service includes, and if you
                                         don't like it you can find another
                                         provider.  Where are the defenders
                                         of the free market?? -meyers
                                         \_ The free market has been
                                            mathematically proven to produce
                                            sub-optimal results.  -tom
                                            \_ Wow, you seem really smart.
                                   \_ Read the op's post below.  Reread the
                                      above post.
                                   \_ Although I'm sure the SBC policy is
                                      very clear on this one wonders what
                                      actually constitutes a "server" vs.
                                      a "client" when everyone is utilizing
                                      P2P to distribute crap. Remember, the
                                      letter of the law is hardly ever
                                      clear, which is why lawyers get paid.
                                      \_ Why don't you just put together a
                                         fund to deport the whiny users to
                                         canada?  Then you don't even have to
                                         really address the issue at all.
                                         \_ Actually, I'd rather you apply for
                                            the fund. It's better to deport
                                            morons like you who attempt
                                            non sequitor comments.
                                            \_ How's this for a non sequitur:
                                               FUCK YOU.
                                               \_ Oooh! I like that one!
                                            \_ Speaking of morons, maybe you
                                               should learn to spell.
                                               \_ Woohoo!  The old
                                                  spelling insult!  There
                                                  should be some law
                                                  similar to Godwin's that
                                                  refers to spelling.
                                                  \_ And pronouncing Nuclear.
                                                     \_ Oh, did you
                                                        pronounce that again?
                                                        I'd ding you on it,
                                                        but since motd is
                                                        FUCKING TEXT, I guess
                                                        I'll just have to
                                                        assume that you
                                                        pronounced it wrong.
                                                        \_ I was replying to
                                                           the "Godwin's law"
                                                           comment.  I guess
                                                           some dumbass used
                                                           motdedit.  Dumbass
                                                \_ MOTD inded has become the
                                                   lowest form of what Cal has
                                                   to offer when one is atacked
                                                   on a typo. Here's a quartur,
                                                   go buy yourself a brin,
                                                   atach it to your moth,
                                                   learn how to use the former
                                                   with the later, and stop
                                                   spewing out BS. -williamc
                                                   \_ *yawn*  Train harder,
                                                   \_ Of course, this rather
                                                      assumes that I think
                                                      you're worth the effort.
                                      \_ Exactly.  I think the cable modem
                                         TOS forbids running code from a
                                         remote machine.  Woudln't this mean
                                         the customer can't run Java applets?
                             \_ Oh good grief. We're not running a server. My
                                wife is just trying to send and receive email
                                on her university accounts. But, as you say,
                                we may cancel SBC since the port 25 blocking
                                may make it more trouble to use than it is
                                worth. -op
                                \_ All you have to do is make a very slight
                                   change to Eudora to send your wife's email
                                   through the Yahoo mail proxy. I am pretty
                                   surprised that it took you 4 hours to
                                   figure this out.
                                \_ Good man.  I think ISPs taking this sort of
                                   action are lazy and technically ignorant.
                                   They're not interested in a solution; there
                                   are other, better ways of doing things if
                                   they were, but rather, want to sell
                                   "business" connections.  Please write them
                                   a very clear letter _why_ you are switching
                                   providers, and that you are telling all
                                   your friends to do the same.  -John
                       \_ I'm not sure that expecting email to work is
                          that unreasonable. -!pp
        \_ SBC is now blocking port 25 traffic to SMTP servers other than its
           own.  You can request to have your connection unblocked.  -tom
           \_ Got it. That must be the "Abuse of Service" form. Thanks, tom.
           \_ Alternatively, some servers also offer port 587 for sending mail,
              the idsg pages mention that (and it worked for me when SBC
              started blocking, I didn't know about that form...)
              \_ Would some of those servers include, say, calmail?
                 \_ Why don't you check for yourself?
                 \_ Or just try it - I'm using gateway.eecs, but another
                    server at UC Davis was configured the same way, it might
                    be a default server config now.  Just change from port
                    25 to 587, and see if it works...
2005/2/14-15 [Politics/Domestic/President/Clinton, Science/Space] UID:36165 Activity:high
2/14    Eileen M. Collins, commander of the upcoming space shuttle flight, a
        former colonel in the Air Force and a veteran of three spaceflights,
        said "I'm a person who won't even get on a roller coaster at an
        amusement park because they scare me. I've been on one once, and I
        won't do it again."
        I find this very hard to believe. (Yahoo! News)
        \_ Typical error about military astronauts - they are not former
        \_ You should read Chuck Yeager's autobiography where he claims that
           he now drives like an old lady.  Just because someone can tolerate
           risk when they're in control and NASA engineers are in charge of
           safty doesn't mean they like to put their lives in the hands of
           random idiots for fun.
        \_ HH would test pilot first run planes but was afraid of doorknobs
           \_ Do recomend the Aviator?
              \_ It's got some cool visuals and is neat for the whole 1930s
                 glam environment, but drags a bit and is pretty Hollywood-y,
                 and has too many random loose ends.  See a matinee.  -John
           \_ HH?
              \_ Just a guess: Howard Hughes.
                 \_ Heh, right.  Gotitnow.  -PP
        \_ "Could I pass the challenge of a background check? My answer is
           absolutely. Not only could I pass the background check and the
           standards applied to today's White House, but I could have
           passed the background check and the standards applied on the most
           stringent conditions when my dad was President -- a 15-year period."
           -President GW Bush (August 1999)
           \_ And this is relevant because? Get over it - you lost
              \_ Our President is a former cokehead / drunk!
                 An astronaut is afraid of rollercoasters!
                 Also:  Get over it - our President is still an object of
                 \_ All presidents are objects of ridicule.
                    \_ Not Clinoccio!
                    \_ Correct, but we now have one whose oral abilities
                       are comparable to or worse than Dan Quayle's
                       (ob Clinton-Monica joke)
        \_ [political troll deleted]
        \_ I'm terrified of rollercoasters.  I don't like being up high on a
           structure that shakes.  But I enjoy flying.
2005/2/14-15 [Recreation/Dating] UID:36166 Activity:nil
2/14    In honor of Valentine's Day:
2005/2/14-15 [Uncategorized] UID:36167 Activity:low
2/14    Why isn't there a day for single, unattached people?
        \_ "Every day is single people's day!"
           \_ Don't you really mean that every day is couple's day?
              \_ It is at my house anyway.   RAARROOW.
        \_ There is a day for single unattached people. Its July 4th.
2005/2/14 [Science/Electric] UID:36168 Activity:high
2/14    I'm trying to make sure I don't trip my 20Amp Circuit.  How much of
        an amp draw does an average single disk single p4 cpu box take.
        Alternatively, how may "regular" desktops could i put on a 20 amp
        fuse with a very good chance that it won't trip.  (Assuming I don't
        try to turn them all on at the same time).
        \_ 0.5-2.0 amps.  In contrast, a hair dryer uses about 10-14 amps.
           Portable space heaters typically have one setting for 7 amps,
           one for 14 amps.  Have phun.
           \_ Gotta also calculate in the monitor. That's usually around
              2 amps. Don't know what it is for LCDs, probably less.
              \_ 17/19" LCDs use ~ 35 watts (1/3 amp).
                 The Dell 20" 16ms LCD eats 90 watts (~ 1 amp).
                 19" CRTs use ~ 140 watts (~ 1.25 amps).
        \_ "Kill-A-Watt", nice gadget if you are interested in this sort of
           thing. Also useful to calculate what size UPS you need for your
           \_ How much is it and where can I get it?
              \_ $30, you can find it at J&R or Amazon. Google!!
        \_ Every hardware vendor publishes these figures. Go to the
           Dell/Sun/IBM/HP website and find it.
2005/2/14-15 [Health/Disease/General] UID:36169 Activity:nil
2005/2/14-15 [Recreation/Dating] UID:36170 Activity:very high
2/14    I'm trying to get a plain brown clay water pitcher as a present for my
        wife.  I've searched online and can't really find anything remotely
        like what I'm looking for.  Anyone know of an online/mail order seller
        of something like this?
        \_ Places such as Home Depot and OSH sell these by the cartload.
           Obviously they may not have the exact style you want.
           \_ I'm trying to get something that's older-styled, like say 1800s
              or earlier, not a modern smooth finished item.
              \_ Don't know the difference between 1800 brown clay water
                 pitchers vs. 2005 brown clay water pitchers. I thought a
                 water pitcher was a frickin water pitcher. Try an antique
        \_ EBay
           \_ You know I've been checking over the past week, and hadn't
              found anything, but someone posted something just right this
              weekend.  Funny.
              \_ It would be awesome if the pitcher you found on ebay was
                 posted by pp just to prove his motd fu.
        \_ I am sure your wife will be thrilled with a plain brown clay
           water pitcher. You're gonna get some that night!
           \_ You're not married, are you?
           \_ If it were just a pitcher and nothing more, I could get anything.
              The basic look has an important meaning.  You'll understand when
              you grow up.
              \_ Sometimes a pitcher is just a pitcher.
              \_ When I grow up I will understand the meaning of a pitcher?
                \_ or when you start dating girls, whichever comes first.
                   \_ Yes, most women are wowed by plain clay pitchers.
                      \_ There's this thing called 'context'.  Clearly, you
                         don't have it. Stop being petulant and accept it. -!pp
                         \_ I am just in awe.
                            \_ See below, petulant, ignorant fool.
                      \_ what you don't understand is that a water pitcher
                         could be a symbol of the male sexual organ and of
                         male virility, and hence evoke an erotic response.
                         \_ Uh... You've got it backwards.
                      \_ The pitcher is a semi-obscure reference to a favorite
                         movie, and she'll love it.  Women place a lot of value
                         on that kind of thing.  You'll understand when you
                         meet and actually get to know women in real life. -op
                         \_ Uh...right.  As long as whatever woman he gets to
                            know happens to attatch the same sentimental value
                            to some random obscure movie as your wife.  You're
                            a moron.
                         \_ I find it funny that a guy buying a pitcher
                            for his wife thinks he knows anything about
                            \_ I find it funny that someone sad and alone at
                               his keyboard could judge. -op
                               \_ Someone like you?
2005/2/14-15 [Computer/HW/Laptop] UID:36171 Activity:nil
2/14    To follow up about my laptop's traffic to  I had
        visited = = I don't know why opera kept a TCP connection
        open for 17 hours.  Perhaps it was related to putting my laptop into
        suspend mode 7 minutes after visiting the website.  Would y'all
        consider this to be a browser bug?
Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2005:February:14 Monday <Sunday, Tuesday>