Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2004:August:01 Sunday <Saturday, Monday>
Berkeley CSUA MOTD
2004/8/1-2 [Computer/SW/Languages/Misc] UID:32614 Activity:high
8/1     A silly question: how do I output something to stderr from a shell
        script, except by echo foo-bar > /dev/fd/3?
        \_ You mean /dev/fd/2, right?  That works fine, and it's actually
           the only way to do it in csh.  If you're using sh, you can also
           do "echo foo-bar >&2" -- the &2 means "file descriptor 2", just
           like /dev/fd/2.
           \_ Stricly speaking you want echo foo 1>&2 in sh.
2004/8/1-2 [Reference/History/WW2/Germany] UID:32615 Activity:insanely high
8/1     Proof that America is as obsessed with Germany (look at all the
        WW2 games) as Germany is obsessed with America:
        Germans making American Indian/American Colonization games. Heh.
        \_ and who exactly was asking for such proof and why is it relevant?
        \_ Proof?  Uh whatever.  Anyway, why is it surprising?  Each side
           spent a generation of lives and fortune fighting the other within
           living memory.  That does something to a people.
        \_ I just spent some time playing Codename Panzer. TOTALLY AWSOME.
           Kick butt as a Panzer commander. Again made in Germany. HEIL!!!
           \_ Germany makes a ton of games, and many of them are not
              war related.
                \_ yeah but how many American games show nice looking German
                   commanders killing the evil Amerikans? Codename Panzer--
                   definately made in Germany.
                   \_ Combat Mission games do. -- ilyas
                        \_ Seconded.  BF1942 does, as well as most of the
                           WWII multiplayer ones.  The sole concession is
                           usually removing the swastikas from the tail fins
                           of kraut planes.  -John
        \_ Evidence != Proof
2004/8/1-2 [Politics/Domestic/Election] UID:32616 Activity:insanely high
7/31    I've been busy so I'm sorry if this is old for the motd.  I saw Kerry's
        speech.  I thought it was bland and very 'safe'.  He didn't present any
        details at all of how he'd fix anything or do anything better or
        differently than GWB.  In an hour long speech he spent about 6 seconds
        talking about his 19 year Senate record and 55 minutes talking about
        his 4 months in Vietnam 30 years ago.  Although he didn't fuck it up,
        I don't think it was very good either.  It was safe.  What do the rest
        of you think?
        \_ I thought it was trite. It just shows that nobody can deliver
           a speech (or write one) as good as Clinton. Can't wait to see
                                   \_ Some how I dont take your review too
           Bush fuck up his speech. But yeah, I wasn't all too impressed
           with Kerry's.
        \- i thought it was pretty good. the bland speech was edwards.
           Kerry said he wouldnt privatize SS, would repeals the bush tax
           cuts for +$200k ... i dont remember if he said something about
           dividend taxation [that would have been a bad idea in the speech]
           so i think you and all the other people saying he didnt say anything
           gutsy, are not being fair ... and even more ridiculous is
           the "no diff between kerry/bushco". i thought the obama speech
           was overrated ... "edwards and obama have now eclipsed hillary
           clinton for 2008/2012" etc. i dont agree with everything he said
           but at a rhetorical level in style and delivery, the Rev Al was
           the best speech, I think. I think the "reporting for duty" was a
           pretty good beginning to the kerry speech. i bet mccain and possibly
           the Gubernator will give decent speeches at the RNC. --psb
           \_ I've read both good/bad about the reporting for duty thing.  I
              think it was just fluff but I don't hold it against him much.
              I place that in the same category as the rest of his focussing
              on his 4 months in Vietnam 30 years ago and ignoring his own
              19 years in the Senate.  I only heard a few minutes of Edwards
              so I don't know.  Nice accent :).  TheRevAl always speaks well
              in public.  If he didn't we wouldn't have ever heard of him.
              I think the RNC will put McCain up as the local RNC war hero
              to counter Kerry's 4 months and the Governator always does well
              in public, too.  I think most poor speaking is just stage
              fright since the speeches are all written by professionals who
              theoretically know what they're doing.  The Governator isn't
              going to get stage fright both due to core personality and his
              years of performing in front of the camera and on stage for
              live audiences.  GWB, well, the person above thinks he'll fuck
              it up for sure.  He might.  He has a hit'n'miss record.  You
              can always tell when he hasn't had enough time to practice.  If
              he doesn't make the time to practice the shit out of this one
              then he should forget the whole thing.  He only has to not fuck
              it up.  It isn't necessary for him to give some fantastic speech
              we all remember and get taught in college rhetoric courses years
              later like the I Have A Dream speech.  BTW, if you haven't seen
              the entire IHAD speech on film you should go find it at a
              library or something.  I saw it in rhetoric class as a sophomore.
              It was truly deeply amazing in a way I can't describe.  --op
              \-I'm actually most interested to the Evil Cyborg vs. The Trial
                Lawyer. that's a weird matching. --psb
                \_ how do you figure cheney is a cyborg?  of course he's a
                   hard crusty old bastard, but cyborg?  where's that come
                   from?  i suspect edward's trial experience won't translate
                   that well to the debate format and he'll get stomped in a
                   blizzard of policy details but the vp debate is just a
                   sideline entertainment anyway.  --op
                   \- I read it in the Economist. --psb
                   \_ hard and crusty? i vote for "dour and scheming".
                      \_ what politician isn't scheming?  dour is part of
                         being a crusty old bastard.
2004/8/1-2 [Recreation/Food] UID:32617 Activity:low
8/1     Electronic Frontier Foundation's FREEDOM FEST 2004
        Music, Food, Drink, Geeks -
        Wed Aug 4th 5-8 PM, Yerba Buena Gardens, SF
        \_ Was it called FRENCH FEST before? -- french food #1 fan
2004/8/1-2 [Computer/HW/IO] UID:32618 Activity:high
8/1     I need to buy a decent but inexpensive keyboard (the kind you make
        music with, not the kind you type with).  Does anybody have any
        recommendations or horror stories of models/makers that I should avoid?
        \_ Yamaha Clavinovas are usually known for their piano-like feel.
           \_ The Yamaha YDP223 is the same as the entry-level Clavinova, but
              you can get it for ~$300-400 cheaper at consumer electronics
              places (, guitar center, etc).  Only difference
              is warranty.  My wife got one last December, and loves it -
              same feel as a piano, lots of great features.
        \_ You can't go wrong with a Roland.
        \_ Yamaha-- realistic feel. Roland, feels fake, but sounds really
           really good.                         -classical pianist for 15 yrs
        \_ When I last compared 7yrs ago, I personally felt that Technics
           digital pianos have better key touch than Yamaha ones for the same
           price, although the Yamaha ones have many more functions.  I ended
           up buying a Technics SX-PX222. --- yuen
        \_ I'd actually recommend that you buy a seperate MIDI controller
           keyboard, which only sends and receives MIDI data rather than
           producing sound.  Then you can find just the right feel that you're
           looking for and swap whatever module you like until you find a
           sound that you like.  Most of the best "feeling" keyboards don't
           have particularly good sounds, and vice versa.  My personal
           recommendation for a weighted, full-range controller would be a
           StudioLogic SL-880, which will run you about $600.  A good piano
           sound module would only be another couple of hundred, but you have
           the option of connecting to a computer and running any manner of
           software samplers to get the right sound.  Email me if you have
           any other questions...Oh, and by the way, if you think the numbers
           I'm quoting are "expensive," you probably want to stay out of
           the musician game altogether.  -- lye
           \_ Don't a lot of regular keyboards have a MIDI out? -n00b
              \_ Yeah, but usually the built-in sounds are a waste of time
                 unless you're looking at full-featured workstations or
                 analog synthesizers, which start in the $2000 - $4000 range.
                 You're better off spending the $600 on a keyboard that
                 actually feels like a piano, is aftertouch and velocity
                 sensitive, and has a pedal input, rather than some Kmart
                 Casio action with a "computer keyboard" feel.  Also, most
                 controllers allow you to split the keyboard into seperate
                 "zones," allowing you to play more than one sound at once -
                 for instance, playing a "bass" sound in the bass clef and a
                 lead in the other. -- lye
2004/8/1-2 [Health/Disease/General, Recreation/Food] UID:32619 Activity:insanely high
8/1     I found a bug on the organic Raomain I bought from Trader Joe.  Is is
        still edible as raw salad?  I know organic farming means not relying on
        pesticide to kill of bugs but would there be a danger from parasites?
        \_ Eat the bug and like it!  If necessary, you CAN be wormed.
        \_ If this sort of stuff bothers you, you can buy kosher food.
           Many people do, even if their religion does not require it. -- ilyas
        \_ It's food.  Food that is grown is grown outside.  Insects and
           animals live outside.  Food that is grown outside will be touched
           by insects and animals.  That is the way the world is.  Occasionally
           one of those insects will make it into the packaging, especially
           with leafy greens.  Throw the bug away and wash the lettuce, problem
           solved.  Are you people really that removed from where your food
           comes from?  -aspo
           \_ Aspo, no offense, but you are an idiot.  What about greenhouse
              grown food?  Is that 'outside'?  Get a clue.
              \_ Um, yeah, uh, greenhouse grown food is grown in an anti-
                 septic foam nutrient solution.  Food technicians in
                 Intel "bunny suits" meticulously pluck any alien life
                 forms from salad leaves, carefully brushing each leaf to
                 ensure a complete absence of unwanted bugs, weeds,
                 chemicals, or icky "dirt".  -John
        \_ If you knew how many bug bits are in every carton of fruit
           juice, organic or no, you probably wouldn't be bothered by
           this at all.  Still, I think the whole organic thing is BS.
           Genetically modified often means the plants have better natural
           resistance to pests, so they can use fewer pesticides than
           organic crops, not more.  BTW, leafy stuff should be fine if
           you wash it.  Sprouts, broccoli, etc, is the kind of thing you
           should cook.
           \_ If the pests don't even want to eat them, do you?
           \_ I don't think you know what 'organic' means. The federal
              standard provides that the food is produced without
              pesticides, hormones, antibiotics, irraditation, or
           \_ While most organic farming is bs, there is one aspect in
              which genetically modified crops are worse. Many gm grains
              do not produce seeds that can be reused for the next growing
              season which means that farmers must purchase new seeds
              every year rather than simply take seeds from the last
              harvest. The fact that farmers are beholden to ADM or some
              other large conglomerate is worrying, but the main problem
              is that by moving the natural selection process for grain
              from the wild to the lab, we can make the grains less
              able to cope with new forms of pests and infection.
              There is another lesser concern with gm crops for some
              peta/vegans, and that is crops which include animal genes
              might violate their no exploting animals principle.
              \_ There are no crops for consumption that I'm aware of
                 that contain animal genes.  When I've done work with
                 animal genes in plants, it's been as a research tool,
                 it serves no purpose to put an animal gene into a
                 plant for crop use.
                 \_ There's a strawberry which contains a protein from a fish
                    which makes them resistant to freezing (natural antifreeze)
                    I don't think it's been approved for human consumption,
           \_ What about crops which are more resistant to herbicides
              which encourage farmers to apply more weedkiller?
              \_ Oh, and it's especially cute when the crop in question can
                 interbreed with wild varieties and give them herbicidal
                 resistance too.
              \_ I think anyone who's done farming knows that it's always
                 better to try and use the minimal amount of chemicals.
                 The best way to do that, ultimately, will be with GM
                 crops, not organic.  Besides which, organic crops alone
                 cannot produce enough yield to feed our population,
                 so unless 2 billion people volunteer to not eat in the
                 future, or environmentalists agree to start letting
                 us convert forests to farm land, then GM crops are the
                 only option.  Besides, everything is genetically
                 modified, it's just that in the lab we can do it more
                 \_ You're not too bright are you? Just by switching from
                    slash and burn to organized agriculture I am sure we
                    could produce enough food. There isn't a shortage of
                    food in the world and this is not because of
                    pesticides. There's plenty of arable land left unused.
                 \_ You should read the Skeptical Environmentalist. He
                    makes it quite clear that by properly farming the
                    land already converted for agriculture use we could
                    easily feed the entire planet (even if the population
                    continues to increase). GM isn't really needed and
                    in the case of grains with the "terminator" gene,
                    it will actually make things worse since subsistence
                    farming will stop being the strong cheap source of
                    food for the developing world.
2004/8/1-2 [Reference/BayArea, Academia/Berkeley] UID:32620 Activity:high
8/1     Outfoxed >> F911
        \_ One day, everything in Berkeley named Hearst will be renamed
           Murdoch. Murdoch Greek Theater, Murdoch Street, Murdoch Hall,
           Murdoch Mining Circle. Even the Hearst Castle in will be
           renamed Muroch Castle.
        \_ Not hard to do.
           \_ seen it yet?
              \_ Well, I saw F911, but not outfoxed.  That went straight to
                 video, right?
Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2004:August:01 Sunday <Saturday, Monday>