Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2004:July:14 Wednesday <Tuesday, Thursday>
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2004/7/14 [Recreation/Dating] UID:32266 Activity:insanely high
7/12    Is it normal for somone already in a relationship (married or not)
        to continue masturbation?
        \_ http://www.themarriagebed.com/masturbationinmarriage.shtml
           \_ Wow, I think this crafty site is written by the Satan himself.
          \_ says that spouse have an obligation to satisfy each other
             even when "not in the mood." boy oh boy, I wanna be a Christian
        \_ Yes, it is perfectly normal.
        \_ No, it's sinful and bad.  The hair growing on your palms is
           just a harbinger of the hell-blindness that will soon inflict
           your syphilis-wracked corpse, evil-doer.  -John
           \_ Is it normal to fantasize about your wife's best friend
              while you masturbate? Should I tell her (the best friend)
              about it?
              \_ Yes, it's normal.  You should tell your wife, as it will make
                 her really hot for you.  Then you should tell her friend and
                 you can have a three-way.
           \_ Where did the whole hairry palm and blindness thing come from?
              Just an old wives tale they told their husbands and kids?
              \_ Just an old soda tale told to newbs
        \_ the only happily married men who have a lot of sex are the
           newly married men.                   -married, little sex
           \_ Are you Bitter Married Guy?  Maybe soon to become BDG #2?
           \_ does four years count as "newly married?"
2004/7/14 [Politics/Domestic/Election, Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:32267 Activity:insanely high
7/12    Malpractice maelstrom
        http://www.washtimes.com/op-ed/20040713-080936-3867r.htm
        Vote Kerry-Edwards!
        \_ what is your point...that it should be OK for neurosurgeons to
           remove as many cervical disks as they want?
           \_ my point is if you think channeling children born with CP to
              win malpractice settlements is good for the US medical industry
              vote Kerry-Edwards.  Is that so hard to understand?
              \_ Penalties for malpractice are good for the medical profession
                 (not the same as medical industry) as it provides an incentive
                 to not screw up.  Manipulating the emotions of a jury is
                 standard good lawyering.  If Edwards has been a robo-lawyer
                 you could have complained that he was failing his clients.
                 \_ And if I close my eyes, all the bad things go away!
                    Penalties for malpractice is one thing, manipulating
                    jurys to punish the innocent is completely different.
                    In this link, one guy destroyed a doctor's life, and
                    killed hundrends by forceing all the neurosurgeons out
                    of the state.  Woohoo!  Go Lawyers!
              \_ compare with a guy who lied to go to war to settle old score?
                 sure.
              \_ Wow, this is the only criterion allowed? Bush has driven
                 this country into a fucking ditch, asshole.
                 \_ How so?  Funny since I consider all of the problems the
                    result of leftist policy.
                    \_ yes all bad things come from clinton, all good things
                       from bush.
                        \_ While conservatives have made mistakes, they
                           have also manage to do things right from time
                           to time. The leftists have *never* done anything
                           right. Some of us vote for the lesser to two evils.
                           \_ nah, clinton got everything right. bush got
                              everything wrong.  compared to bush, everything
                              is a lesser evil.
                 \_ Which ditch is that?  The economy is fine, there were
                    a hundred reasons to invade Iraq, he picked a big one
                    to push with, but there were plenty more.  Since prety
                    much everyone thought Saddam had WMD, it's hardly a
                    lie.  Maybe he was wrong, but so was everyone else.
                    I keep hearing how Bush has destroyed the country, and
                    I don't agree with everything he does, but I see
                    little base for your accusations.
                    \_ nah, everyone knows bush says iraq has wmd.
                       everyone gives what he says a some measure of
                       credibility because he is the US president and
                       has the cia, the supposedly most technologically
                       advanced intelligence agency in the world.  now,
                       he and his subordinates have been shown to be
                       liars.  neither the US presidency nor the cia
                       has any credibility in the world anymore.
                       economy is at best sputtering even with the
                       historically low interest rate and huge fiscal
                       stimulus, with record budget deficit and
                       trade deficit, rising oil prices, threat of
                       inflation looming, threat of housing bubble
                       bursting, it's much better not to have the huge
                       drain of money into the Iraq sinkhole, which
                       is likely to continue for a few more years.
                        \_ Who gives a damn about what the world
                           thinks? Most of the world is living on
                           handouts from the US taxypayer, the rest
                           is a festering socialist mess. And when
                           the world gets into trouble, guess who
                           gets to pick up the pieces, US.
                           As far as Iraq is concerned, I guess you
                           are one of those guys who would have
                           prefered that Saddam got a NK nuke and
                           gave it to Bin Laden to drop of @ JFK
                           or something before we took the threat
                           seriously and started negotitating with
                           them.
                           \_ Uh... because they provide us intelligence
                              and help us catch terrorists...
                           \_ "Most of the world is living on handouts from the
                               US taxypayer."  Are they?  Last I chacked, aid
                               to foreign governments was a tiny part of the
                               Federal budget.  I seem to recall most of the
                               world works for a living.  But your theory is
                               good too.
                                \_ Maybe we should do like Pat B. say and
                                   complete isolate ourselves from the world
                                   for a few yrs and see how the world gets
                                   along w/o the us market to export things
                                   to. The fact that most of the world has
                                   free access to our market is a huge
                                   subsidy by the taxpayer (we are passing
                                   up all the money from tariffs, &c.)
                                   Don't forget all the "loans" we made
                                   and forgiven over the years. Most of
                                   the world would in shambles if we didn't
                                   keep it solvent by forgiving loans and
                                   such over the years.
                                   \_ go ahead, try it.  If the US isolates
                                      itself economically from the world,
                                      the country that will be in economic
                                      shambles would be the US itself.
                                   \_ Don't forget we depend on other parts
                                      of the world for oil.  That has been
                                      main reason we have all these conflicts
                                      in the Middle East.
                           \_ Actually, we are in a shitload of debt from
                              loaning from the rest of the world, mostly
                              through selling treasuries.  1.4 trillion,
                              IIRC.  Just go to economist and add up the
                              foreign reserves of countries like China,
                              Japan, Taiwan, S. Korea, India, Spore and HK,
                              and you will get a rough idea.  As for
                              Saddam, much better to neutralize him the
                              way we neutralized Gaddafi of Libya.
                              It takes a little patience and a little
                              diplomacy, but hey, that's what adults are
                              good at.
                                \_ We neutralized Gaddafi only after we
                                   invaded Iraq and scared him shitless.
                                   \_ that's a stupid theory the bush
                                      admin put out.
                                        \_ Its what happened. We invade,
                                           he rolls over.
                                           \_ we haven't seen N. Korea roll
                                              over.  What about Iran and Syria?
                                              In fact, some these are more
                                              hostile than before.
                                                \_ Desperation. They know
                                                   better than to try
                                                   *anything* though, because
                                                   the result will not be some
                                                   stupid protest in the UN,
                                                   it will be total destruction.
                                                   \_ Iran is always been
                                                      relatively benign.  But
                                                      in case of NK, they could
                                                      do some SERIOUS damage
                                                      to Asian economy before
                                                      you and your 7 carriers
                                                      arrive.  That is assuming
                                                      they don't have nukes
                                                      yet.
                                           \_ I am amazed how many people
                                              bought the stupid theory.
                                              Gaddafi didn't roll over when
                                              we bombed his home and almost
                                              killed him (got his infant
                                              daughter instead).  why would
                                              he suddenly roll over because of
                                              iraq?
              \_ zzzzzz
                 \_ Sounds like a deviated septrum. Let's operate!
                    \_ yea, even deviated septrum makes a more interesting topic
                        than the above.
                        \_ Septum.
                           \_ septrum. search google.
2004/7/14-15 [Politics/Domestic/President/Bush] UID:32268 Activity:high
7/12    If you were Edwards and Bush offered you a night with one of his
        daughters to throw the election, would you do it?
        \_ When you're vice president, you can have all the women you want.
           Would YOU?
           \_ I think Cheney would die of a heart attack if he got all the
              women he wanted.
        \_ Man, I wouldn't sleep with one of the Bush girls if you paid me.
           Do sodans have a thing about chubby blonde vapid Texas girls?
                                        \_ not everyone prefers anorexic, vapid
                                           la girls, and might prefer the allure
                                           of the well-proportioned, vapid,
                                           southern belle.
                                           \_ Well you're in luck.  Get thee
                                              to Texas lad!  Stop fantasizing
                                              about the so-so Bush twins and
                                              experience the amazing land of
                                              Tex-Mex pussy!
           If you really want one, go to Texas - there are tons of them there
           and they are horny as hell.  They'd even sleep with a sodan for
           free, if he could manage to tie his shoes and shower once a day.
           [restored]
           \_ Man, I wouldn't touch this thread with a 10 foot pole.  I bet
              the Feds are still watching soda.
              \_ By "Feds," do you mean csua alumni who are supposed to be
                 doing useful work at some national lab but are wasting time
                 on the motd?
                        \_ tomasu bin holub
                           \_ Osama bin Laggin?
                           \_ This is abysmally stupid.  Grow up already.
                              \_ Tom Holub, the undergrad who never grew up.
              \_ As you know, the sexual desirability of the Bush daughters is
                 of paramount importance to national security.
              \_ let alone your massive huge 10inch one?  --Jon
                \_ bigger than the standard Jap 1cm size.
                   \_ Cubits!  Our context is bushel/cubit!  no metric!
        \_ For *both* twins, I'd do it in a second. The world can wait four
           more years for HRC.
           \_ But why?  You can get a pair of women to do anything you want
              that look 100x better and will be 100x better in bed for
              just a little bit of cash!
        \_ Well, if you're gonna lose anyway, might as well take what you
           can get.
           \_ I can hardly wait to mock you the day after the election.
                   \_ I can hardly wait to mock you the day after the
                      election.
2004/7/14-15 [Computer/SW/WWW/Browsers, Computer/SW/OS] UID:32269 Activity:high
7/12    Can anyone give me a good reason why I should update to FF 0.9.X from
        0.8? -- ulysses
        \_ dont
        \_ I think that 0.9.{1,2} has a fix for the frame insertion attack.
        \_ I was the guy complaining about it earlier, and I have no real
           problems with it.  The one thing is that if you turn off the
           "allow web sites to install software" option, you won't get any
           indication about a failed extension install.
        \_ if you are on windoze, then, i can tell you that for some site,
           the html form element "submit" no longer works with 0.9x.  That is
           the only "down" side I found upgrading to 0.9.  Other than that,
           there isn't much differences really, including the fact that
           since 0.7, the "download" screen will crash my firefox, and I
           haven't figure out why yet.
        \_ Note also that you probably should nuke your old install directory
           for the .9 upgrade.  I believe they changed things around to
           something semi-stable so the 1.0 upgrade goes well.
2004/7/14 [Politics/Domestic/Election] UID:32270 Activity:nil
7/14    BUSH GOOD!!!! !!!! !!!!1!!! KERRY BAD!!!!!!!!!!!11!!  DELETE ME AND I
        WILL ONLY POST AGAIN!!!!!!!
        \_ !TOOW
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2004/7/14-15 [Politics/Domestic/President/Bush] UID:32271 Activity:very high
7/14    I just saw F911. I didn't know John Ashcroft was such a good singer.
        He is cool.
        \_ The movie had the opposite effect as intended on me.  The cheap
           potshots Moore took at Bush, Wolfowitz, etc., getting made up
           for the camera actually made me briefly feel sorry for the
           bastards.
           \_ I've heard that reaction from a lot of people; I think it's
              a pretty common reaction, actually.  I agree with most of
              Moore's politics, but that movie really sucked and was a cheap
              shot--with lousy editing to boot.
                \_ I agree. --liberal dem
        \_ The family of the Major who got blown up by a grenade in his
           tent is *really* pissed off that footage of his funeral was
           used without permission or even letting them know.  Moore is
           scum.  Bush's poll numbers are actually *up* since F9/11.  The
           American people know trash when they see it.
           \_ So when Fox News uses random footages of people's funerals
              for their touchy-feely stories without permission, it's
              perfectly okay?
              \_ How do you know they do it without permission?  And is Fox
                 the only news caster doing this?  Why do you single out Fox
                 news when they all do it?  Fox bad, everyone else good?
           \_ there is a WSJ poll recently, and the percentage of
              people who support bush among those who have
              seen the movie is about 1/2 of the percentage of people
              who support bush among those who intend to see the movie.
              \_ Stat 2.  It is a self selecting group that has seen/not seen
                 the movie.  The most hardcore leftists flocked to it on
                 opening.  The rest took a wait and see attitude.  Your stats
                 only prove that Moore is preaching to the choir.  The movie
                 has not changed the minds of some large percent of viewers.
                 Why do I have to explain such a simple concept on the motd to
                 what are supposed to be college students and alumni?
                 \_ er ... I just gave the stat as it is without any attempt
                    to interpret it.  it's you who just tried to interpret it,
                    rather unconvincingly.  you need to learn to get off your
                    soap box, and not spew misdirected saliva all over the motd.
           \_ Let me guess, they haven't even seen the movie.
           \_ Bush's poll numbers are not up. What poll have you been smoking?
              \_ It must be the FoxNews push poll.
                 "Do you support (a) a patriotic American who will fight
                 terrorists or (b) a communist liberal who will run this
                 country into the ground?"
                 \_ I hate bush. I *really* hate bush, but I don't hate bush
                    enough to ignore the truth:
                    http://www.zogby.com
                 \_ It isn't hard to get the full set of questions for most
                    polls.  Only politicians do push polls, not news orgs.
              \_ Up.  Polls are up.  Compare the last few days to what they
                 were just prior to F911 coming out.  New number minus old
                 number is positive.  Up.
                 \_ I don't know about the polls, but my erection is up.
2004/7/14 [Reference/Religion] UID:32272 Activity:nil
7/14    God rocks: a book approved by the National Park Service on the
        creation of Grand Canyon:
                http://www.harpers.org/GodRocks.html
2004/7/14 [Reference/Military] UID:32273 Activity:nil
7/14    http://news.com.au/common/story_page/0,4057,10134001%5E13762,00.html
        I cast magic missle at the overweight security guard!
2004/7/14-15 [Politics/Domestic/California, Politics/Domestic/Gay] UID:32274 Activity:high Edit_by:auto
7/14    How do i find out how each senator voted on a given bill?
        In particular, I'm trying to find out how each senator voted on
        the gay marriage ban today, and I can't find the actual vote in
        the senate records.
        \_ http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=108&session=2&vote=00155
          \_ you rock. thanks.
        \_ DUDE U R TEH GAY
        \_ Post it if you find it.
        \_ do you want to OUT them?
        \_ http://www.senate.gov/pagelayout/legislative/a_three_sections_with_teasers/votes.htm
           (just google for: how senators voted)
        \_ You can figure it out from this article. They list the
           party members who crossed lines:
           http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A49537-2004Jul14.html
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2004/7/14 [Uncategorized] UID:32275 Activity:nil 100%like:32341
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\_ Yes!! Finally!! Thank you!!
2004/7/14-15 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:32276 Activity:low
7/14    Saddam Iraqi court finds him not quilty (due to improper
        evidence by US and British intelligence)
        \_ Is this your prediction? Or maybe DrudgeReality?
          \_ it's my prediction based on the fact that Johnny Cockrun will
             be defending. If the WMD don't fit, you must acquit!
             be defending.
2004/7/14-15 [Politics/Domestic/California, Politics/Domestic/President/Clinton] UID:32277 Activity:high
7/14    So I am curious how Conservatives feel about The House repeatedly
        "bending the rules" to get things passed at the last minute:
        http://blog.lewrockwell.com/lewrw/archives/005080.html
        \_ Sounds shady to me (the actions of the house leaders, not the
           reportage).  Got any better references than Joe Q. Blogger?  How do
           Liberals feel about the mutation in the Senate of everything
           requiring cloture?
           \_ This was widely reported.  You can do a search anywhere for it.
              On the Medicare bill last year, they held the vote open for
              almost 3 hours while they tried to convince people to change
              their votes.  This time it was only 20 minutes.  As far as I've
              read, this was unheard of before last year.
           \_ Weren't the new cloture rules proposed by Frist and Z.Miller?
              Why do you suggest this is a Liberal mutation?
              \_ I'm not referring to rules, but rather the practice of the
                 dems to filibuster anything they don't like, which basically
                 means that to get anything done you need cloture rather than
                 simple majority.
                 \_ That's the senate, son.
                 \_ As opposed to the filibuster free repubs in the senate
                    under Clinton?  Come on...  That's what the senate is for.
                 \_ As opposed to the filibuster free repub senate under
                    Clinton?  Come on...  That's what the senate is for.
                    It's a necessary check on the majority.  Democracy at
                    work.
                    \_ We could compare the numbers between the previous and
                       current admins for filibusters.  The answer won't
                       come out in your favor.  You're also twisting the
                       issue.  It isn't a case of "filibuster free". It is
                       a case of now requiring 60 votes instead of the
                       Constitutionally mandated 50 because the Dems won't
                       let *anything* pass at 50 now.  It's an abuse.
                       \_ okay, i'm curious. care to cite sources for numbers
                          and post the math and results somwhere?
                  \_ I think it is a shitty way to run a democracy. -op
           \_ So I guess when the Republicans logjammed the congress in the
              '90s, that was really bad too?  Oh wait, Democrats BAD,
              Republicans GOOD.
              \_ Compare the numbers like I said above.  There's a difference
                 between stalling a few bills here and there and doing it
                 for nearly everything.
                 \_ And the dems don't do it for nearly everything.  Man have
                    you drunk the koolaid.  They have done it for a few high
                    profile cases, jsut like the repubs did.
2004/7/14-15 [Politics/Domestic/President/Clinton, Politics/Domestic/RepublicanMedia] UID:32278 Activity:high
7/14    Don't ever try to pass off Fox News as "Fair And Balanced"
        http://csua.org/u/86m (wonkette, a political blogger)
        \_ You're using a blogger site to prove something on the motd?  This
           is beyond ridiculous.  Just quote something off the
           http://democraticunderground.com message boards and get it over with.
        \_ That John Moody has a good vocabulary: "obstreperous" was new to me.
        \_ Doesn't matter, the wingnut crowd will just stick their fingers
           in their ears, shut their eyes and go "waaah waaah waaah liberal
           media waaah waaah waaah."  The scary part is that given Fox's
           success, all of the other 24 hour news networks are now
           emulating them.  The worst part isn't their bias so much as
           how they package it as good wholesome entertainment.  At least
           in soviet russia, people knew Pravda for what it was.
           \_ Ummm... The rest of the media IS biased.  That's no excuse
              for Fox, but I really wish people would stop pretending Fox
              News invented the biased news program.  It just pisses off
              all the liberals who are used to the news being slanted
              their way, which is the same reason so many middle american
              conservitives like it.  "Sure it's biased, but at least
              it's biased toward ME now." -jrleek
              \_ The liberal media canard has been thoroughly debunked.  Its
                 mostly just a stick with which to beat the mainstream media
                 to keep them in line.  There is absolutely no equivalent to
                 Fox on the left.
                 \_ Debunked in your little leftist echo chamber.  The rest
                    of us know the score.  Try being intellectually honest
                    for once.  You can't even see it because you're so
                    partisan.  The Fox equiv. is NBC/CNN/CBS/NYT/LAT at the
                    core and many others with smaller audiences.
                 \_ Well... maybe KPFA, but they don't reach *nearly* as many
                    people.
                    \_ I don't really see the equivalence with KPFA.  KPFA
                       presents itself more as "the Voice of the Activists"
                       and an organizational rallying point than as a news
                       source.  Fox is more like Inside Edition meets the
                       World.
                       \_ They both present themselves as a news source and
                          provide biased news.  Fox is the only one that keeps
                          claiming to be "Fair and Balanced"
                          \_ Are you confusing their opinion shows with their
                             news shows?  Yes.  I think you are.
                 \_ Link?  That is, a link that doesn't come from farther
                    left than CNN?  -jrleek
                 \_ I don't buy this "thoroughly debunked" argument. An
                    older survey (American Society of Newspaper Editors, 1997):
                      http://tinyurl.com/4c295
                      Total:
                      36% democrat/liberal
                      25% lean democrat/liberal
                      7% lean republican/conservative
                      8% republican/conservative
                      24% independent
                    A more recent survey (Pew Research Center for the
                    People and the Press):
                    http://people-press.org/reports/display.php3?ReportID=214
                      "More striking is the relatively small minority of
                      journalists who think of themselves as politically
                      conservative (7% national, 12% local). As was the
                      case a decade ago, the journalists as a group are
                      much less conservative than the general public
                      (33% conservative)."
                      \_ Talk to people who actually work in journalism.
                         Individual journalists have almost no say about what
                         ultimately appears.  This is almost always up to a
                         publisher or producer or whomever the authority
                         depending on the medium.
                         \_ So far I have 2 links showing media bias.  I'm
                            still waiting for the one that "throughly
                            debunks" media bias. -jrleek
                            \_ those surveys are about how journalists
                               self-identify, not about how they report.  And
                               the Pew report you give is very specifically
                               about how bottom-line pressure is "seriously
                               hurting" the quality of news coverage. And of
                               course you've seen the FAIR report, which you're
                               going to claim "comes from too far left".  -tom
                               \_ You're saying that the political leaning
                                  of the people who report the news
                                  doesn't effect how they report it?  I
                                  admire your faith tom.  And yes, when a
                                  communist tells me Clinton was a
                                  right-winger, I tend to think his
                                  opinion is too far left.  (BTW, that's
                                  hyperbole) -jrleek
                                  \_ First of all, I don't think people are
                                     very good at reporting their political
                                     leaning; the FAIR report asks their
                                     position on specific issues and then
                                     compares that to the national average.
                                     Second, it should be obvious that
                                     the ownership of the news outlet has
                                     more control than the people who report
                                     it.  -tom
                                     \_ It's all relative.  How else to
                                        determine one's place on the political
                                        spectrum without comparing to other
                                        people?  It isn't something that can
                                        be measured like the frequency of
                                        sound.
                                  \_ I respectfully submit that you don't
                                     know much about how publishing or
                                     the news media functions, jrleek.  I know
                                     a couple of people that work in print
                                     journalism, which admittedly may differ
                                     from television media in many ways but
                                     not, I doubt, in this respect.  Editors
                                     vet everything that goes into print, and
                                     editors in turn are under enormous pressure
                                     to follow general directives about content
                                     and editorial direction from publishers.
                                     People lose their jobs in the industry
                                     all the time over this.
                                     \_ I admit, I don't have much
                                        personal contact with
                                        journalists.  My opinions are
                                        pretty much all circumstantial in
                                        reguard to the media.  That is,
                                        all the news sources I see, SF
                                        Cron, NYT, CNN, etc. are left
                                        leaning.  I've seen right leaning
                                        local newspapers before, but no
                                        national ones.  -jrleek
                                        \_ The fact that you consider the NYT
                                           left-leaning speaks volumes about
                                           your bias, and little about theirs.
                                           \_ I like the NYT, mostly, but if
                                              you think it isn't left
                                              leaning you're either waaaaaay
                                              out in left field or just
                                              trolling.
                                           \_ Not to mention the William
                                              Randolph Hearst SF Chron.  -tom
                                              \_ Ummm... ok.  I guess I
                             should point out that I'm refering to
                             left-leaning against the national average,
                             not the Berkeley average.  -jrleek
                             \_ Do you know anything about William Randolph
                                Hearst?  -tom
                                \_ I know he's dead.
                                   \_ Tell us how dead guys control the
                                      media Tom!
                                      \_ That's Dead Rich White Males to you!
                             \_ So I guessed you missed that whole thing where
                                the Howell Raines-led NYT was basically out
                                to get Bill Clinton in the '90s with their
                                Whitewater coverage?
                                \_ Sorry, yes.  I wasn't reading the NYT
                                   regularly in High School. -jrleek
                                \_ "Out to get" or simply reporting the
                                   biggest news story of the day?  Should they
                                   have ignored the Clinton's criminal
                                   activity?
                                   \_ Whitewater criminal?  What criminal
                                      behavior was Clinton convicted of
                                      in connection to Whitewater?
                         \_ Are you suggesting that publishers personally
                            edit each and every article that goes into, say,
                            the New York Times every morning, injecting spin
                            of their own particular flavor? Interesting. I'd
                            always thought that the articles that go into, say,
                            a daily newspaper were largely the work of their
                            authors, with a little editing. The headline is
                            written by someone else, but not the article.
                            \_ The owners and editors lean conservative.
                               And you bet that biases their newspapers.
                               Are you trying to claim that GE, Westinghouse
                               and MSNBC are "liberal"? I personally think
                               that the Big Business owner bias and liberal
                               reporter bias more or less cancel out.
                               \_ Cancel out?  The person writing the story
                                  is the most important part of it.  There are
                                  tens of thousands of words printed in each
                                  paper everyday and you think some editors
                                  are rewriting everything to have a right
                                  slant?  That's just nutty.
                         \_ http://www.fair.org/extra/0405/npr-study.html
                            Republicans outnumber Democrats 2:1 on NPR.
                         \_ Conservative think tanks quoted more than liberal:
                            http://www.fair.org/extra/0405/think-tank.html
                            \_ I dunno, A lot of the think tank references
                               I see are written poorly.  That's a whole
                               article on how we're all going to die from
                               Global Warming, then a little blub at the
                               end that says "Hertiage Foundation dude
                               says that he doesn't think this is the
                               case."
                         \_ The Myth of The Liberal Media:
                            http://csua.org/u/86s (Amazon)
                            How corporations have taken over what used to
                            once be a free and independent press corp.
                            \_ The press has always been a business. This is
                               just plain silly.  When exactly was the media
                               ever  "independent"?
                         \_ On the http://fair.org links: My concern about media
                            bias is not so much the biases that I DO know -
                            if they quote the Heritage Foundation or bring on
                            a liberal commentator, I know what to expect. My
                            concern is biases I can't see. What is the bias
                            of the person who writes the news, and what is
                            the bias of the person who edits it and decides
                            what gets on the air? Consequently I find the
                            third link (and also the Eric Alterman book) more
                            compelling than the first two.
                            \_ http://fair.org is a raving left-wing group.  Just
                               tiptoe through their archives and count the
                               number of stories of media being too liberal.
                               Good luck!
        \_ Barry Diller is one of Hillary's closest allies and biggest
           contributor.  President of ABC advising Kerry on VP selection.
           The notion that coorporate leadership can't lean democrat is
           nonsense, look at campaign contributions.  The media is based
           in New York and Hollywood, very left wing areas.  Based on
           this it would be natural to expect to some bias.  Couple that
           with the rich Jews it becomes even more obvious.
           As for Alterman, I've repeatedly heard him admit on CSPAN
           yes the media is biased, but, he then contrives some
           bizarre explanation why it doesn't matter.  As for Fox, their
           prime time viewership is 2 million, compared to 30 million for
           the broadcast networks.
           \_ Corporate contributions can influence politicians of any party.
              The current administration seems to exhibit quite a lot of
              quid-pro-quo.
           \_ No one said it can't.  It just that it doesn't.
           \_ Use motdedit, you quished 2 reponses.
           \_ Corporations contribute to *both* parties so that they can
              receive favors no matter who wins. Even Enron gave money
              to the Dems. Your analysis is spot on. The media is
              controlled mostly by rich, left-wing Jews who are fiscally
              conservative and socially liberal. Liberals go to journalism
              school. Conservatives go to business or law school. In
              addition to Diller there are Eisner and Geffen among others.
              \_ So you're saying David Geffen controls the news media?
                 You are a funny man.
                 \_ I didn't write this comment but I think its pretty
                    obvious Jews control the media, and they are
                    overwhelmingly leftists.
                    \_ Media is not the only thing we control, peon. -- ilyas
                 \_ Music and movies are definitely media that influence
                    lots of people. Further, I named Geffen because he
                    is an example of a big, rich, media owner who is also
                    decidedly liberal. I have no idea why the left equates
                    "corporations" with "conservative".
                    \_ I don't equate the two; I think the media is corporate
                       rather than conservative.  -tom
                       \_ What is the corporate position on social issues?
                          \_ there is not a single corporate position, but
                             generally, corporations will not take risky
                             positions.  -tom
                             \_ In other words they won't lean too far
                                left or too far right. That sounds right.
                                So what's the beef?
           \_ Racist! Hate Israel, Love Jews!
           \_ Oh I get it!  Jew bashing is cool as long as you're only bashing
              left wing Jews!
              \_ Most Jews are left wing, but I didn't see any bashing.
           \_ It is just a list of memos from the director of Fox News.
              Are you trying to claim that she made them up?
2004/7/14-15 [Recreation/Computer, Reference/Military] UID:32279 Activity:kinda low
7/14    A farewell to the Marine Corps, Colonel Wayne Shaw, USMC, Quantico,
        Virginia
        http://www.usna63.org/tradition/history/Farewell_Shaw.html
        \_ Great find.  I love his 10 questions.
2004/7/14-15 [Computer/SW/OS/OsX] UID:32280 Activity:high
7/14    Any ideas on why Mozilla/Firefox/etc is so slow on OSX? Even Camino,
        "designed from the ground up for OSX," is really bad.
        \_ Slow? FF seems as fast as Safari to me. Load time is slower than
           Safari, but once it is loaded I can't really tell any difference.
           \_ Did you try resizing the browser window?  That was where I
              noticed the big difference.  I'm on a recent G4 Powerbook
              running 10.3.x.
                \_ I loaded the same http://amazon.com page in FF and Safari
                   just now and tried resizing the page. Both FF and
                   Safari seem to resize at about the same speed on
                   my iBook G4 (800 MHz model).
                   \_ Odd. Which OS version are you running?
                      \_ 10.3.4. I have 640 mb of ram, maybe that
                         is the difference? BTW, resizing isn't
                         that fast, its just that they are both
                         about the same speed.
        \_ Why is everything so slow in OSX?
           \_ Heh.  Ever done a side by side comparison of OSX with any
              other GUI?  Lynx doesn't count, nerdling.
              \_ OSX is sure slow, compared it to the previous Mac GUI,
                 compared it to Win2K, compared it to WinXP, compared it
                 to X on Solaris and Linux. OSX is just damn slow.
                 \_ If you are running anything other than twm on
                    Linux/Solaris, there is no way that I can buy
                    your story that the GUI is faster. BTW, when
                    they add features like print to pdf and Expose
                    to X11, lets see how fast it is.
2004/7/14-15 [Politics/Domestic/Election, Politics/Domestic/RepublicanMedia] UID:32281 Activity:kinda low
7/14    Happy Bastille Day!
        \_ Tonight on Fox News: Some people say John Kerry, LOOKS FRENCH.
        \_ Lance even let them win this one.  -John
2004/7/14-15 [Recreation/Dating, Recreation/Celebrity/BritneySpears] UID:32282 Activity:nil
7/14    Well, that lifetime commitment didn't last long:
        link:www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/news/nation/9131961.htm
        \_ So by this standard, I guess Britney Spears' marriage and divorce
           invalidates heterosexual marriage.
           \_ I didn't say anything about what it means.  You need to wash out
              your mind.
              \_ I think he's responding to the jackass in the article who said
                 that "unnatural marriages" wouldn't last because they're about
                 self-gratification instead of love.
                 \_ Thank you.
2004/7/14-15 [Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Troll] UID:32283 Activity:nil
7/14    So just out of curiousity, what drives the need to restore all the below
        drivel?  I know, I know, censorship is bad, but really its just drivel.
        Why do you care?
2004/7/14-15 [Uncategorized] UID:32284 Activity:kinda low
7/14    Another Nigerian scam-baiting.  The twist is that the guy
        actually got some money out of the scammer.
        http://www.419eater.com/html/joe_eboh.htm
        \_ Dude, this site is hilarious!  Thanks for posting; it
           made my morning.
        \_ Why are they called 419?
           \_ Section of the Nigerian criminal code that they violate (fraud).
2004/7/14-15 [Consumer/Camera] UID:32285 Activity:moderate
7/14    I miss B&H in NYC. Is there a good place to try out cameras in
        the bay area?
        \_ I'd recommend SF Discount Camera on Kearny, near Union Square
           in San Francisco.  Incredibly helpful salesmen and a great
           selection.  Beware you'll pay about $50 more on average than
           you would through say, Amazon, but then with Amazon you have
           no way to do a hands on comparison.
        \_ What about Looking Glass on Telegraph (a couple blocks south
           of Andronico's)?  I've never bought a camera there but they
           have a great selection of other photography paraphernalia like
           film/paper/bags/tripods/even a darkroom.  Their salespeople are
           super friendly and helpful.  -- alice
                 \-Looking Glass is sort of the Breads of India of camera
                   stores. --psb
                   \_ Dunno Breads of India.  What do you mean?
           \_ They have a great selection of accessories, but last time I went
              there they have only one or two cameras on shelf.  They can
              special-order but there's nothing you can try out.
2004/7/14-15 [Reference/BayArea] UID:32286 Activity:high
7/14    Can i buy fleshlight in berkeley/oakland?
        \_ Try that really scary "comics" store on Telegraph, just south
           of Dwight.  Collectors Realm III.  The area in front looks like
           The Android's Dungeon, but in reality they make almost all of their
           money by selling hardcore porn and associated crap.  Just go through
           the back into the second area.  They'll probably have what you're
           looking for.  Sicko.
           \_ their web site says that the interior lining is silky soft just
              like the real thing, but the real thing has crevices and
              ridges, so how can they make such a claim?
        \_ What's "fleshlight"?  --not cool enough to know
          \_ http://www.fleshlight.com not work safe.
        \_ there is always good vibrations
        \_ Make sure to get the chocolate butt model.
2004/7/14-15 [Uncategorized] UID:32287 Activity:high
7/14    When did this place turn into Chronicles of the Elders of the Motd?
        \_ ?
           \_ cf below with "all the jews control the media"
        \_ since tom holub started to scare all the new blood
        \_ Shut up you warmongering plutocrat jew bastard.  -John
2004/7/14-15 [Politics/Foreign/Asia/China] UID:32288 Activity:high
7/14    ipod owners, http://www.apple.com/ipod/specs.html says it has
        Chinese. Does it just mean the menus are in Chinese? or can it
        display Chinese song names? Thanks.
        \_ I left mine at home but I remember being able to change
           the menus to various languages like French and Spanish. I
           think Chinese might be one of them.
        \_ My dad had a bunch of songs in his iPod in Chinese.  Menus
           were in English.
        \_ everything will be in Chinese (unicode).  The menu and the songs
           (when input in Chinese) will be displayed properly.  Both simplifed
           & traditional supported
           \_ what kind of unicode transformation? utf-8? ucs-2?
        \_ FWIW, Persian/Arabic script didn't show up on my iPod even though
           iTunes displays the song titles correctly.
           \_ they are more complicated than Chinese.  they tend to be the
              last thing be supported.
        \_ Chinese pop sounds like cats in heat anyway.  Get some real
           music, like Britney.
           \_ I wouldn't say it's cats in heat, but I do think there is no
              variaty in Hong Kong pop.  They all sound the same.  After a
              variety in Hong Kong pop.  They all sound the same.  After a
              while you get bored.  Taiwan pop seems to have a little more
              variaty.  --- HK guy.
              variety.  --- HK guy.  [variety, not variaty.  spelld]
2004/7/14-15 [Computer/SW/OS/OsX] UID:32289 Activity:very high
7/14    I bought several Intel GigE nics and one of them has a
        bad mac addr (all ff's). dmesg shows the card as detected,
        and proc/pci lists it, but ifconfig doesn't show an eth*
        entry for it. Does anyone know how I can set the mac addr
        so that I can use the card? (I'm using RH 9, but I can
        just as easily stick the card in a WinXP, FreeBSD or
        OpenBSD box). The card has a 82540 chip if that is of
        any use. tia.
        \_ I'm curious. Why don't you want to return the card?
           \_ maybe s/he's curious about this.  Why do think OP
              doesn't want to return the card?
           \_ If I can get the card working, then I wouldn't
              have to deal with the hassle of getting a RMA
              and shipping it back and waiting for a new one.
              I'm planning on buying several dozen more of
              these cards in the future and in case I run
              into this problem again, I'd like to know if
              it is possible to fix it.
              \_ Return it. You've already had more hassle. You know that
                 the others work, so this one is defective. Send it back
                 and leave us alone.
              \_ Return it. You've already had more hassle.
                 You know that the others work, so this one
                 is defective. Send it back and leave us
                 alone.
        \_ Some cards have the MAC address printed on them somewhere.
           \_ I know what the MAC address is supposed to be,
              I just need a way of manually setting it up
              in the eeprom of the card (linux says that
              the eeprom contains an invalid chksum, and
              the windows based card test utility from
              intel says that it can't read the eeprom)
              \_ Maybe that means the eeprom is bad?  I think you're
                 trying to hard.
        \_ FreeBSD allows you to set the MAC address.  On bootup via
           /etc/start_if.fxp0 or you can do it manually.  Either way:
           ifconfig fxp0 ether <mac address>
           Yours won't be fxp0, it'll be whatever.
           \_ Thanks, I'll give it a shot today.
              \_ It might work on your broken card, but I agree with the
                 others who say you should RMA it.
2004/7/14-15 [Reference/Military] UID:32290 Activity:very high
7/14    F-16 Footage over fallujah
        http://freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1171674/posts
        \_ How do we know it's terrorists rather than innocent people who
           got blown into tiny bits of carbon?
           \_ fallujah is a city of terrorists and people sheltering
                terrorists.  Who's innocent there?
              \_ Sheltering terrorists?   If you knew a bunch of very violent
                 people, can you honestly tell me you'd be brave (or foolhardy)
                 enough to turn them in to the cops, knowing that their friends
                 could come slit your throat in the night?  It must be nice
                 living in your bubble where moral superiority does not pose
                 a danger to your personal safety.
                 \_ I think it's also kind of Darwinian, if you're still
                    in Fallujah after it's full of terrorists, and the
                    Marines are itching to raze it to the ground....
                    \_ Couldn't you say the same thing about the whole Iraq?
                       Are we offering a place to go?
                 \_ As if you'd post a list on your front door of all the
                    people you turned in?  Arabs already learned with Arafat's
                    PLO to do these things quietly or they'll get labelled as
                    traitors and shot in the street.
           \_ Because we only use smart bombs
           \_ You could apply to be sent there as neutral observer of the UN.
              \_ Right, and killing people is normal in war.  But are we
                 supposed to applaud and cheer the vaporization of 20-40
                 people just like those who cheered the killing of just
                 a few westerners?  I know you haven't talked about
                 cheering, but since the op is linking it through the
                 Freepubic rather than the original url, I suppose he wants
                 us to applaud and cheer like those freepers.  Where is
                 our moral superiority?  Are you a moral relativist?
        \_ That's weird. Can they not hear the jets/missiles approaching?
           It looks like these guys are just calmly wandering around.
           \_ When you drop your precision-guided munition from 30,000 feet,
              maybe they didn't hear you.
           \_ No.  They can't.  That's what flying faster than the speed of
              sound is all about.
              \_ So if you fly faster than the speed of sound you make less
                 noise?  Or your bomb got there faster than the sound of
                 your plane reached them?
                 \_ If you fly faster than the speed of sound, nobody will hear
                    your plane until after you've passed.  If a bomb falls
                    faster than the speed of sound, nobody will hear it coming
                    until after it lands.  In WWII, the V2 rockets could not
                    be heard approaching, which made them such a good
                    psychological weapon; in the middle of the night your house
                    could just explode.  Also, with rifle bullets, the bullet
                    you won't hear coming is the one that hits you.
                    \_ If you're orbiting the target, it's more likely for
                       your sound to get there, than if you bomb straight in,
                       right?
                       \_ It's not that hard.  If you're flying supersonic,
                          people can't hear you until after you've passed.
                          If you're flying circles over the target, then they
                          can probably hear you, but that might not provide any
                          good warning if they're always hearing planes flying
                          overhead.
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