Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2004:May:17 Monday <Sunday, Tuesday>
Berkeley CSUA MOTD
2004/5/17 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:30249 Activity:high
5/16    Head of US appointed Iraqi Governing Council dead in car bomb attack:
        \_ it's bad, but it's a rotating position.
           fyi, the car exploded at a checkpoint into the Green Zone
2004/5/17 [Computer/HW] UID:30250 Activity:high
5/17    Some kitchenwares are marked "top rack dishwasher safe".  What's the
        difference between top rack and bottom rack?  The water is equally hot
        - it's the same water afterwall.
        \_ Heat and pressure. The stuff down low usually gets blasted a lot
           more than upstairs.
        \_ <foolish comment>
           \_ it's the drying, not the water.
              \- Makes more sense. I hearby retract my pointless comment.
2004/5/17 [Recreation/Humor, Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Troll] UID:30251 Activity:high
5/17    Anyone know a guy named "Darin" who made a film about life in
        Soda a few years ago?  Mail me if you know how to contact him.
        Thanks. --jeffwong
        \_ try mailing darin@csua.
           \_ Nope, that's not me. --darin
              \_ Darin, who's Megan?  That's a great portfolio.
                 \_ I think the name McGill might be a hint.
                    \_ Sister, wife, or cousin? Believe me, a little detail
                       like this could avoid social awkwardness later on.
                    \_ Can I make a preemptive request to avoid yersister
                       jokes and just double up on yermom jokes? -!darin
                       \_ yermom likes doubling up.
2004/5/17 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:30252 Activity:high
5/17    smoking gun? (sarin found in iraq),2763,1218878,00.html
        \_ Left over from Iran-Iraq war?  Next you'll want to invade Vietnam
           for violating the anti-Mine treaty.
           \_ Wow, if only the CIA read the motd, the government could
              know all this too!
2004/5/17-18 [Industry/Jobs] UID:30253 Activity:high
5/17    70k per year guys (who took lower pay and dont get raises)
        i am in similar situation, but am going to boss and telling
        him that I at least need a raise to beat inflation or else
        I am being paid less that I was last year
        \_ I'd also suggest adding other facets to your argument, so that
           you have a stronger position.  What contributions have you made,
           or skills do you have that would also merit the extra money?  Even
           if your boss does agree that you should be given a raise based
           on "inflation" how is he going to argue on your behalf to
           -his- boss (or worse) Human Resources?  --chris
        \_ I think this is on purpose. Salaries are being held in line so
           that you are taking a pay cut (over time), and ppl being hired
           are paid less (starting sal) than the .com era.
           are paid less (starting sal) than the .com era. It's better than
           having your position eliminated and/or sent overseas. Might also
           want to think about changing careers, if you are not on the mgmt
        \_ You're better off sending out your resume and taking the jump to
           $95 to $110k.  The economy is up, people are hiring, salaries are
           going up.  If you have any tech skills and can negotiate worth a
           damn and are willing to walk away from lesser offers you're good
           for the $100k range easy.  The rest of you 70k bastards should go
           get real jobs and stop fucking up the pay scales for the rest of
           \_ a $70K job which doesn't suck is way better than a $100K
              job which does.
              \_ They're mostly bitching about 70k jobs that *do* suck and
                 won't do anything about it but whine on the motd.
2004/5/17 [Health/Disease/General] UID:30254 Activity:very high
5/17    NOT a troll, please help. When I first started dating this gal I
        convinced her to get on the pill. That was really really cool for
        a while but then then she started to complain so I got her
        to be on the patch. That was ok for a while but then she complained
        so we started using the condom. That was ok for a while but now
        we rarely have sex. What's up with that?         -sex life sucking
        \_ Are either of you upset or resentful of each other?  Do you have
           worries about pregnancy?
        \_ Assuming that she's not mentally trying to keep your semen out of
           her body for whatever reason (maybe she saw you flirting with
           another girl), you can try to tell her that taking the pills helps
           lower the chance of getting breast cancer.  Maybe the patch works
           the same, I don't know.
           \_ I thought there was a correlatiion with cancer later in life, if
              one took the pill in one's youth.
              \_ Over the long term, if slightly reduces the breast cancer risk
                 and slightly increases the cervical cancer risk.  The net
                 effect is overall less cancer, but I don't know which cancer
                 is harder to treat...
                 \_ cervical, I believe. this is probably partially becasue
                    it's harder to detect. -chialea
        \_ The pill and the patch, both containing hormones, can cause mood
           changes, though that may or may not be the problem.
           \_ This is true, and furthermore, each mix of hormones can cause
              different mood changes and side effects.  It is usually expected
              that as the body gets used to the hormone mix, these effects
              subside with time.  Every doctor my girlfriend has ever had told
              her to try a birth control prescription for at least 3 months
              before giving up on it.  Did you try 3 months with the pill or
              the patch?  Also, we at least found that the patch caused much
              more problems than the pill, but this is definitely one of those
              cases where YMMV. [restored, no thanks to whoever stomped this]
        \_ Have you considered the possibility it's just plain old stress,
           fatigue, or depression?
        \_ it takes a few months for all the hormones to wash out from the
           different methods. time frames would be really helpful on this.
           In any case, I'd guess that something other than the pill is at the
           the root of your issue. Perhaps someone is stressed, perhaps you're
           not communicating... The pill can cause mood swings (enough so
           that certain people around here have bet they can track my cycle
           when I was on my last perscription), so a calendar and marking
           down moods can really help determine if they're affected by it.
           \_ i know this is off topic, but does anyone have any idea why
              humans are affected by the position of the moon? this seems
              really bizzare.
              \_ Not that bizarre.  Humans are mostly water, and the moon
                 pulls water.  It's not surprising something in the delicate
                 mechanism gets affected.
              \_ Because they think they are. Sad, isn't it?
        \_ Freakin' ASK her why things have changed. It's part of the freakin'
           RELATIONSHIP. If you've been swapping body fluids on a regular
           basis, you should be comfortable asking about why you're not having
           sex as often. Co-mun-ni-ca-tion. Try it. Then you can worry about
           something real instead of something made up in your mind.
           \_ JS: Alright Huxley, lets just do it the old fashioned way.
              AH: Eer,disgusting, you mean fluid transfer?
              JS: No, I mean, boning, the wild mambo, the hunka chunka.
              AH: That is no longer done. The exchange of bodily fluids. Do
                  you know what that leads to?
              JS: Yeah, I do. Kids, smoking, a desire to raid the fridge.
              \_ Ah, Sly.  Always with the witty banter.
        \_ Some people prefer not to take any kind of  hormones unless
           absolutely necessary, including some doctors who would prescribe
           them to their patients.  Do you have any problem with rubber?
        \_ How long have you been dating? My experience is that the amount
           of sex I have decreases steadily throughout the first couple
           of years until it settles at a level we are both comfortable
           with. In my current relationship it is about 3 times a week.
           Sometimes it goes up, like on vacation, sometimes it goes
           down, like when we are upset with each other, but it always
           returns to this level. Are you having less sex than you
           would like?
           \_ part of the vast right wing conspiracy no doubt.
              \_ no doubt.
                 \_ You know, Gwen Stefani and her crew straight outta
                    Orange County secretly using their mind control "hits"
                    and concert/record sales to fund overthrowing the
                    government and replace Bush, Cheney, Rummy, et al. with
                    their minions raised straight from heart of Birch, the
                    postuberneoconservatives. Fear them! If they got to this
                    guy's girlfriend, they can get to anyone. When was the last
                    time your SO (or someone else's SO, since this is soda)
                    listend to No Doubt and wanted to have sex? 'Nuff said.
                    \_ Evubody present,
                       Hey hey.
                       Evubody present,
                       The people say.
                       Evubody's president at
                       PARTY TIME.
                       Evubody here
                       Have a good climb.
2004/5/17-18 [Transportation/Car, Academia/Berkeley/Classes] UID:30255 Activity:insanely high
5/17    MOTD Reverse Bragging rights poll...
        I am 4.5 years out of Cal (BS EECS) and make $52k (benefits/nostock).
        Can anyone beat that?
        \_ 5 years out, $60k/yr BSME.
        \_ I'm five years out and getting 20k/yr...that's grad school.
           \_ That may be out of Cal, but not out of school, you don't count.
        \_ Sometimes my pimp gives me two rocks instead of one! --motd BS EECS
           \_ but how many years out of college? If you graduated 2001-2003,
              that's to be expected.
        \_ How much does a senior lecturer at Cal make?
        \_ What do you do?
        \_ I'm 11 years out of Cal (BS CS with honor) and I'm still at the
        \_ I'm 11 years out of Cal (L&S CS with honor) and I'm still at the
           bottom of the corporate ladder.
           \_ It really takes BS (the other kind) skill to climb the
              corporate ladder. Do not feel bad. I am in the same boat.
           \_ 11 years but how much do you make?
              \_ ~$110k.  I have friends who either make the same with fewer
                 years out of school, or make more and are higher on the ladder
                 \_ Dude, this is the REVERSE bragging rights poll. You
                    are bragging.
                 with the same years out of school.
        \_ 7 years out with a BS, $60k -geordan
        \_ 12 years out with a BA, $60k
           \_ BA in CS or some other field? If it's CS, that's impressive!
              \_ English Lit.
              \_ Anyone here make over $100k and drive a car worth less than
                 \_ 65k, $800 car (I heard that since it runs I can get this
                    much at a monster truck rally).
                 \_ does it count if you don't own a car?
              \_ Why is this impressive?  And why does anyone care about a
                 difference between EECS BS and L&S BA?  -L&S BA, $70k, 7 yrs
                 \_ EECS & CS are on the same scale, but it isn't impressive
                    if someone has an English degree and makes $50/yr, that's
                    called being "well-paid".
                    \_ International Relations, 7 years out of school, very
                       well paid.  It's not what you graduated with, it's what
                       you do with the degree.  -John
                       \_ .ch!  .ch!  .ch is the STANDARD!  Country!
                       \_ Yes, but look where you have to live.
        \_ 7 years out of school.  Gave up 124k job to take 80k job higher on
           ladder and feeling good about it.  Driving car worth about $2500.
2004/5/17-18 [Computer/SW/Languages/Java] UID:30256 Activity:high
5/17    Java ArrayList vs. Vector: method names slightly different, so what?
        HashMap vs. Hashtable: method names slightly different, so what?
        \_ So don't use a Hashtable, use a Hashmap. I mean, what are you going
           to say next, static vs. final, so what? Gimme a break. -williamc
        \_ the idea for ArrayList vs Vector is Vector implementation is
           unspecified... and HashMap is part of the Collections framework,
           whereas Hastable is not.  Also, one can store "null" and one cannot.
        \_ they ask you what the differences are during an interview,
           so what? (Yes, it's happened).
        \_ Java vs. JavaScript: names slightly different, so what?
        \_ RTFJavadoc
        \_ One is synchronized, the other not.
        \_ LOL, yep, RTFJavadoc.  But I agree without reviewing the doc, you
           wouldn't remember which is not synchronized, most of the time
           when you do web development, you don't really need a synchronized
           data structure.
        \_ As a rule of thumb, the stuff in java.util (Vector, Hashtable, &c.)
           is synchronized (which is usually not needed) and imposes a large
           performance penalty. Stick with the collections stuff if you care
           about performance. If you need max. compatibility stick with the old
           Vector, Hashtable stuff.
2004/5/17 [Politics/Domestic/Election] UID:30257 Activity:high
5/17    Of the remaining six veterans pictured in the photograph,
        "one is deceased and three do not wish to be involved
        in any manner; only two of the 19 are believed to support
        Kerry," the group said in a Monday press release.
        Swift Boat Vets Accuse Kerry of Vietnam Photo Fraud
        \_ i think we can all agree NEWSMAX is not a credible news source
                \_ Ok then go straight to their site.  But your're right
                   admirals and captains have no credibility.
                \_ if you have some time to blow, the forums
                   on that website are interesting. - danh
        \_ Amusing experiment.  Do a google search for: swift boat kerry
           Look at the links that come up.,,
 , and  This last one is the
           most interesting.  We do a whois and find the administrative
           contact is ted sampley.  We do a google for "Ted Sampley" and
           find this:
           He's a shill.  You're being played.  This whole story is
           manufactured.  Repeated enough times until it's "true".
                \_ So an admiral and the other members are lying that
                   they were Vietnam contemparies of Kerry's?  Go
                   to their website - its the same guy that
                   debated kerry in the '70s.  I think its you who
                   are being played.  They have given several
                   talks at the National Press Club now, all covered
                   by CSPAN.  Either they are lying / frauds or
                   you are full of shit.
                   Of course the media is ignoring them, its to
                   be expected.
                   \_ If you want to keep score, there are scores of vets
                      who have come out in praise of kerry, and a handful
                      that have ties to Bush's PR groups, many of whom were
                      the same names that popped up criticizing McCain's
                      record in the 2000 primary, coming out blasting him.
                      At the same time, even with a reward offered, no one
                      could be scrounged up to praise Bush's record.  You're
                      the one who's clouded, my friend.
                        \_ Bush is not running as a war hero, and doesn't  mention
                           Vietnam is every sentence he utters.  Kerry does.
                           \_ No, Bush is running as being good for national
                              defense by draining the treasury, playing
                              political games with funding requests, starting
                              wars under the name of fighting terror that
                              do more to foster it, and then turning around
                              and attacking Kerry's war record.  Pointing out
                              Bush's dubious war record is just icing.
                                \_ You have no comments about the facts
                                   in the stated  website, choosing instead
                                   to parrot vapid DNC rhetoric.
                                   Why waste your (or my) time writing such
                \_ salon is a left wing rag.  The author of this article's book
                   is described as: the seminal book on the vast right wing
                   conspiracy that attempted to undo democracy by trying to
                   impeach Clinton. The book, of course, is "The Hunting of the
                \_ Sampley deserves to be hacked to pieces with a hoe.
                   -son of Vietnam Vet
        \_ You know Swift Boat is a GOP front, right?
           \_ Only the Officer Corp should be allowed to vote.
           \_ part of the vast right wing conspiracy no doubt.
              \_ newsmax and swift boat are quite clearly
                 part of the vast right wing conspiracy
              \_ It's not a conspiracy when it's right out in the open.
           \_ So what are you accusing them of... lying?  17 or 19 don't
              want to be in the picture yet Kerry is widely
              distributing it.
        \_ So, Nam is important again? Can't people stop flip flopping on this?
                \_ John Kerry was in Vietnam!!!!?? I had no idea... he never
                   mentions it!
        \_ Notice that the entire swiftvets site never specifies anything
           wrong or bad that Kerry has done, aside from protest the V. War.
2004/5/17 [Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Motd] UID:30258 Activity:insanely high 66%like:32367 50%like:34149
5/17    "Best poll on the motd" poll:
        How much money do you make? : .
        Who should be squished? : .
        Which politician do you want to win? :
        NOUN you'd most like to VERB : .
        how big is your NOUN (penis, salary, car): .
        motdedit yay/nay:
        Best poll on the motd: .
2004/5/17 [Recreation/Computer, Industry/Startup] UID:30259 Activity:high
5/17    Long, but worthwhile (found on of all places):
        post the URL instead.  Okay: -- A simplistic
        but pretty concise explanation to the question: "Why do people in
        the 'red' states vote overwhelmingly for Bush when they always get
        screwed hard by his policies?"
        \_ Can't view fuckedcompany from work.  Care to put this in /csua/tmp?
           \_ /csua/tmp/fcompany
              \_ Thank you.
        \_ Not worthwhile.  Just another partisan rant, full of wild
           assumptions and faulty conclusions.
           \_ Okay, replace the word "republican" with "lawmaker".  It still
              holds true.
        \_ It's sad when the proletariat fail to see that they no longer have
           in their hands the means of production.
           \_ Help! Help! I'm being oppressed!
2004/5/17-18 [Politics/Domestic/RepublicanMedia, Politics/Domestic/President/Bush] UID:30260 Activity:very high
5/17    Time Magazine reviews "Fahrenheit 9/11":
        \_ Wow, before reading this I predicted to myself, "I bet Time
           gives it a great review, while desperately trying to spin his
           sad excuse journalism.  Remember, it's not libel, it's "Hard
           Hitting Journalism."  Man, I must be a prophet or something.
           \_ Ever heard the expression "people see what they believe?"
              \_ Yep, sounds like Michel Moore to me!  But seriously, read
                 this time "review" and tell me that's not exactly what it
           \_ I have not seen it either, but I have decided on the basis
              of no evidence whatsover that it is trash. In fact, I don't
              even need to see it, since I get all my opinions straight
              from Rush Limbaugh and Ann Coulter. I don't know why Time
              magazine is even still allowed to stay in print, it is so
              obviously run by terrorist loving America haters.
              \_ You have a village of people who only tell lies.  You ask
                 them about politics.  They make a documentory...
              \_ Ummm.. Pot, meet Mr. Kettle.  Just to make it clear for
                 you, the fact that I think Michel Moore is a partisan
                 liar, doesn't mean I don't also think Rush Limbaugh is a
                 partisan idiot.  I just predicted this "review" would be
                 Time giving Moore a blow job, and I was 100% right.  Does
                 that pickle you?
                 \_ Your words scratch the backs of my eyes.
                    \_ My feet hurt... with DESTINY!
                       \_ You killed my fish!
                 \_ why do you think he's a "liar"?
                    \_ Just like Rush, he puts his personal political
                       agenda before any kind of truth.  He twists facts,
                       figures, and statments to make his "documentories."
                       \_ yawn, all of us should rent his movie, Bowling for
                          Columbine, which I still haven't seen, and form
                          our own opinions.
                          \_ Moore is a lot closer to PJ O'Rourke than
                             Rush Limbaugh.  -tom
                             \_ Moore seems to see himself as a world changing
                                moving and shaker and opinion maker of some
                                great importance.  Rush is first and foremost
                                an entertainer and sees himself as such.  You'd
                                know that if you'd ever actually listened to
                                his show.
                                \_ Moore makes movies, and has for a long time,
                                   and all of them from "Roger & Me" have tried
                                   to have a humor/satire approach, and they've
                                   all basically addressed aspects of "big
                                   greedy corporations" and their politician
                                   cronies. Rush runs a political talk show
                                   with constant commentary on everyday
                                   politics and unwavering support of Repubs
                                   and attacks of Dems. Your assessment is
                                   exactly reversed.
                                   \_ BZZZT!  I was talking about how they
                                      see and talk about themselves.  I said
                                      exactly that.  Try again.  The political
                                      talk show host primarily calls himself
                                      an entertainer.  The movie maker makes
                                      himself out to be a world changer of some
                                      importance.  (That was the recap for the
                                      semi-literate among us).
                                \_ do you have any idea what distinction I'm
                                   making?  -tom
                                   \_ tom, no one cares what you're making.
                       \_ Have you ever actually seen any of his movies?
                          \_ I was sick that day.
        \_ On an unrelated note, this is the first time I've seen a popup that
           got past both Opera and Firefox.  (Though Opera's "block all popups"
           stopped it.)
           \_ It's not a popup _window_, just a stylesheet layer.
              \_ I can't find the word "window" in my comment.  I _can_ find
                 the word "popup" in the source for the page.
        \_ I like how none of you possibly might have considered the idea that
           this is a _film review_, and thus is simply one person's subjective
           opinion about its quality as a _film_.  Even _Triumph of the Will_
           is considered a classic simply by virtue of its qualities as a film.
           Maybe if the movie was an incredibly gory retelling of the
           crucifixion, that would have occured to you?
           \_ It really burns the Right that the film has generated so
              many extremely postiive reviews from so many people already.
              \_ bah.  they're used to moore.  wait till next week when every
                 dingbat thirteen year old in middle america starts asking
                 his or her parents about catastrophic climate change.
                 then we'll hear some whinning from the motd brownshirts and
                 their ilk.
              \_ Not really.  It's standard liberal media anti-Bush rhetorical
                 self love.  We're used to it.  Why do you think we're
                 especially 'burned' by yet another example of the exact same
                 thing we get flooded with every day by your PR division?
                 \_ As usual, not a single real criticism of Moore's skill as
                    a filmmaker or polemicist, just bitching about the
                    non-existent "liberal media."
                    \_ I've posted tons of evidence of the liberal media.  The
                       better the links and the more detailed my criticism of
                       your drivel, the faster it gets deleted.  Go vote for a
                       self proclaimed war criminal and feel good about it.
                    \_ Which of course is par for the course on the motd for
                       both sides.  Moore is a lying bastard and a raving
                       nutcase, of course, but he can tell the Big Lie better
                       than most (including Franken, et al).  Conservatives
                       have the embarrassment of Rush to deal with as well as
                       others.  On the motd discourse is dead, and sound bites
                       rule.  It won't stop until it comes down to knives.
2004/5/17-18 [Uncategorized] UID:30261 Activity:kinda low
5/17    Ironically, indeed.
        \_ I wonder if anyone has read this link?  With nodescription I didn't
2004/5/17-18 [Computer/SW/Editors/Emacs] UID:30262 Activity:high
5/17    emacsexpert:  I am using emacs in text mode.  When I use tab to indent
        (only) the the first line of a new paragraph, it always uses the first
        space (i.e. the beginning of the 2nd word) on the last line of the
        last paragraph as the tab stop, even though that is not what the
        manual say about indent-relative.  I have the same behavior even in
        Parindent mode.  I can turn this off only by going into fundamental
        mode, but then I lose the other feature of text mode and this also
        seems contrary to what the Emacs manual say about the various text
        modes.  Did I misunderstand the manual?  What's the right way to do it?
        \_ There's a blank line between paragraphs.
           \_ Yes there is, but even if I remove it, the problem remains.
        \_ you misunderstand the manual. use C-q TAB or create a keybinding
           for tab-to-tab-stop and use that for indenting.
2004/5/17-18 [Computer/SW/OS/FreeBSD] UID:30263 Activity:very high
5/17    How many of you actually use BSD or Linux on your personal notebook or
        desktop computer? If so, what flavor? oh and plz say what "desktop
        environment" you use. actually it would be interesting for everyone
        to just reply and say what they use. i'm on WinXP.
        \_ FreeBSD-RELEASE on my laptop (Thinkpad X31) although to be fair
           I am ditching it for Debian, as it has serious problems with ACPI,
           and various IBM PCI bits and bobs.  XP for desktop at home, and
           FreeBSD-RELEASE for server and firewall.  On the laptop, I
           actually use KDM/Enlightenment (only wm with a deskspace manager
           I've seen that actually shows miniature versions of the windows
           you have on that desktop.)  -John
        \_ FreeBSD-STABLE
        \_ does OS X count?
           \_ sure. is that what you use or were you idly curious?
              \_ in that case, 10.3.3 (Panther): ........
                 \_ OS X rocks!
        \_ FreeBSD-4.9, twm
        \_ debian testing, icewm
        \_ debian/stable(woody), enlightenment: .
        \_ debian/oldstable(potato), enlightenment: .
        \_ FreeBSD-5.0, ctwm
        \_ Used to, (FreeBSD, WindowMaker) but then the power board died.
        \_ FreeBSD-4.9, kde
        \_ Win2k for desktop.  Any *nix for serving.  W2k makes a great DT
           environment.  *nix DT sucks rocks.  W* server environment sucks
           very big rocks.  *nix makes great server environment.  --unix admin
        \_ I use OS X, WinXP, Win2k, Win2k, Win98, all on different laptops.
           But i'm going to load Solaris x86 and Sun's Java Desktop System
           Linux, which I hear is suse, on another two old laptops, just
           to try them out.
           \_ why would you need that many different laptops for your normal
              use? Which one do you use the most? Or do you just sort of rotate
              them daily?
              \_ he doesn't.  he unemployed and bored.  he only needs one
                 dumb terminal at the library to do a job search.
           \_ JDS is a basically SuSE 8.1 w/ some extra Sun stuff like SO,
              Evolution, Mozilla (rebadged with Sun Logos), a recent JRE,
              some sun mgmt support and non-yast update tool. Its not really
              all that interesting (esp. if are using a laptop, JDS is pretty
              bad on laptops). - sun guy
              \_ hey, me too.  which department?
                 \_ OPG. I used to work for Cobalt.
        \_ Fedora Core 1, gnome (will load FC2 soon)
        \_ Win2k and (FreeBSD + ratpoison).  Ratpoison makes me happy. -- ilyas
        \_ WinXP and Debian (via VMWare) --darin
2004/5/17-18 [Industry/Jobs] UID:30264 Activity:high
5/17    what pays more: sys admin or software developer?
        \_ Depends on your oral skills.
                \_ How well you blow your boss?
        \_ SA is less likely to get shipped over seas, however you get even
           less respect than devs, there are fewer jobs, the jobs require
           serious skills, the work is often repetitive and dull and the
           tech side in most companies is run by former software guys who
           don't know shit about SA, don't want to know, and treat that
           stuff like the plague.  SA tends to pay more.
2004/5/17 [Uncategorized] UID:30265 Activity:nil
5/17    Why does Michael Moore hate this country so much?  What did we ever do
        to him?  Make him fat?
                          \_ Rich too.
        \_ ^Michael Moore^George W. Bush
2019/01/15 [General] UID:1000 Activity:popular
Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2004:May:17 Monday <Sunday, Tuesday>