Berkeley CSUA MOTD:2004:May:04 Tuesday <Monday, Wednesday>
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2004/5/4 [Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Motd] UID:29979 Activity:insanely high
5/3     csua wall is dying. so is nwrite, talk, and motd. how sad.
        \_ We'll all text-message each other on our CSUA mobile phones,
           which will have CPUs faster than soda and run *nix.
        \_ want to know what killed it? IRC (1992). ICQ (1994). AIM (1996).
           YIM (1997). MSN Messenger (1998). Mobile text messaging (2000).
           Eudora/POP/IMAP/Affordable desktop/laptops (now people don't
           have to log into soda to check email). And finally, lack of
           CSUA effort to 1) make a more friendly frontend for nwrite/talk,
           something that the better programmars at XCF have no problem
           writing and 2) get more members involved 3) tom scaring newbies
           from using soda.
           \_ Hi paolo!
                \_ paolo is sexy
                   \_ well he's mostly right.  -knows paolo
              \_ well he's mostly right.  -!doesn't know paolo
           \_ behold, kchang has risen from squishdom and is striking with
              righteous fury at his old enemies!
              \_ well he's mostly right.  -!doesn't know kchang
        \_ How is motd "dying"? It seems to get more posts than ever.
                \_ case u haven't noticed it's mostly from ilyas, tom, and psb
                   \_ I like that definition of 'mostly.'  For instance, let's
                      measure the fraction of the threads currently signed by
                      above three, versus all other threads. -- ilyas
                      \_ it's a dumb and obviously false statement even if
                         you only count signed posts.  since a majority of
                         posters do not sign, it's beyond idiotic.  just
                         ignore it.
                         \_ Obviously someone needs to take the time to
                            write a script that will record motd editing
                            frequency per account, and settle this argument
                            once and for all.
2004/5/4 [Consumer/Camera] UID:29980 Activity:nil
5/3     I remember this old comment in the archives (re: digital slr cameras)
        "Digital Rebel has some serious user-interface issue as a pedagogic
        tool to move user beyond point-n-shoot..." -kngharv
        What's the basis of that slam on the dig. rebel? Anyone agree with
        that sentiment?
        \_ http://csua.com/?q=digital+slr&start=0
2004/5/4 [Uncategorized] UID:29981 Activity:nil
5/4     Matrix Director's "Cut":
        http://www.azcentral.com/ent/celeb/0430sexchange.html
2004/5/4 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:29982 Activity:high
5/4     Sudan's deputy U.N. ambassador, Omar Bashir Mohamed Manis, said
        the United States had no right to accuse anyone of human
        rights violations, after allegations of abuses in Iraq (news -
        web sites) including mistreatment of Iraqis held in
        U.S.-run prisons. Images of the Iraqi prisoners "are fresh in
        the minds of all justice-loving people around the world," he
        said.
        \_ And how exactly would he know any justice-loving people?
        \_ The difference being that in countries like his shit like that and
           much worse happens everyday.  When it happens here and people know
           about it, it is stopped and the people doing it get jail time.
           People are people but our system is infinitely superior to the
           alternatives where torture is the status quo.
           \_ or, in his specific case, the status quo happens to be genocide
              right now.  of course, since it's arabs doing the genocide
              no one in the UN gives a shit, and since there's no oil involved
              the bush administration doesn't give a shit.
2004/5/4 [Reference/Languages] UID:29983 Activity:nil
5/4     The discussion below got me thinking: is there a standardized system
        for phonetic transcription of Arabic words into English, like the
        pinyin system in Chinese?  It seems that most people do not adhere to
        it, whatever it is, but it would be nice to know.
2004/5/4 [Computer/SW/Unix, Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Motd] UID:29984 Activity:very high
5/4     /csua/tmp is full.  Thanks tom:
293032 -r-xr-xr-x   1 tom       wheel  299905024 Jan 29 15:51 moab-munifest.avi
        \_ why post this to the MOTD instead of mailing me?  Oh right, you're
           an anonymous coward.  -tom
           \_ Because nobody likes you, everybody hates you, we think you
              should eat worms...
           \_ so do you plan to remove the file?
              \_ certainly not because of some MOTD posting.  If someone
                 wants to ask me directly, I'll consider it.  (It was
                 placed there at the specific request of another CSUA
                 member).  -tom
                           \- you know tom, this bit of pigheadedness
                              surprises even me. i dont think you are
                              being picked on here ... you own the largest
                              file there by a factor of two. has something
                              changed in your life to ratchet up your
                              bitterness level? it seem to jump up at
                              some point recently ... i only ask out of
                              intellectual curiosity. you can continue to
                              bray about the AMC but help everyone else
                              out by deleting the damn file. --psb
                              \_ Does 'pigheadedness' have etymology related
                                 to 'go stick your head in a pig'? -- ilyas
                              \_ Publicly-readable files account for only
                                 30% of the disk usage in /csua/tmp.
                 \_ do you think its usefulness to the other csua member
                    might have expired in the last 3 months?
                    \_ why don't you download it and see?  -tom
                       \_ i am beginning to understand this general animus
                          towards tom.
                          \_ the greater your level of contact the more you'll
                             understand.  he's just got a self esteem problem
                             because he never got a degree but is surrounded
                             by those who do or soon will.
                             \_ Except I personally know a few people who never
                                graduated, and don't have this problem...
           |_ /csua/tmp should be self-monitored. It's quite rude to leave
              huge files there, esp if you know that the filesystem is full.
                asshole.
                \_ It's also quite rude to insult someone in a public
                   forum, instead of asking them politely.  Asshole.  -tom
                   \_ i'll just note that bad behavior on one part does not
                      justify or excuse bad behavior on another, just as
                      rudeness on one does not justify or excuse rudeness
                      on another.
                      \_ Yes.  Unless it's tom.
             Speaking of resource abuse, whatever happened to the alumni
           donation thing? I'd like to donate maybe 50 bucks but I still don't
           see a PayPal link and what not. Maybe I should just donate to the
           Stanford computing facility.         -guy doing CSMS@Stanford
                         \_ there is a difference between what is expected
                            and what is justified.
                            \_ Being rude to tom is always justified.
        \_ since I ever met tom in 1992 he's been rude and inconsiderate.
           he has contributed very little except hostile, condescending
           remarks, and now this. It's not the first time, and it will not
           be the last. It has been 12 years since I've known him and very
           little has changed. I really think we should squish him.
           \_ "now this"?  I put a file requested by another CSUA member
              into a directory intended to allow CSUA members to share files.
              How horrific!  As for my contributions, I was CSUA VP for two
              semesters--what have *you* done?
              And there are files > 100MB which have been there for over 2
              years; why do you care about mine?  Oh, right, because you're
              an anonymous coward.
              Shit, I've been trolled.  -tom
              \_ I don't see what anonymity has to do with the size of the
                 file.  And I certainly don't buy into anonymity as a
                 justification for pointless ad hominem.  Chill, dude.  -mice
                 \_ Why are you talking about the file? The post tom responded
                    to is just an anonymous smear and request to "squish him".
                    You're fucking insane if you think his response was somehow
                    out of line. What ad hominem? Wtf is wrong with u people.
                    \_ Uhm, did you even read the post the guy is replying to?
                       Train harder, grasshopper.
                    \- because not removing the file is "out of line" with
                       arguing with the fellow in the motd. nobody is saying
                       tom should be squished or shouldnt argue with this
                       fellow. but he should have done something with the
                       file. his stubbornness over this makes him either
                       stupid or an asshole ... or possibly somehow psycho-
                       logically disturbed. --psb
              \_ Because yours was the largest file.  That was hard.  Try
                 engaging your brain occasionally.
                 \_ Irrelevant.  It's still a relatively small usage of the
                    filesystem.
           \_ FYI, signing as "guy doing CSMS@Stanford" does not count as
              de-anonymizing yourself.  You might as well not sign at all
              if you're not going to give your username.
              \_ I think that was about the donation part, not the tom part.
        \_ Speaking of resource abuse, whatever happened to the alumni
           donation thing? I'd like to donate maybe 50 bucks but I still don't
           see a PayPal link and what not. Maybe I should just donate to the
           Stanford computing facility.         -guy doing CSMS@Stanford
        \_ Why do you guys always pick on tom?  Just because he's a bit rude,
           hostile, and censors the motd like some nanny is no reason to abuse
           him all the time.  Seriously, I feel badly for him.  He's working
           as some IT peon at one of the greatest universities on the face
           of the planet and literally surrounded by people smarter and better
           educated than himself since he never graduated.  Of course he's
           bitter and hostile.  Why don't you guys just accept him as he is
           and let him feel important once in a while?  He'll mellow once you
           accept him as one of us.
                \_ hahahahhaaha this has got to be one of the best responses
                   I've ever read. It deserves the best motd post of the
                   week.
                   \_ you hypocrites sound like pathetic high schoolers
        \_ well apaprently there is space on /csua/tmp now, and moab*.avi
           is still there, so whatever.
           \_ So the moral of the story is:  Most CSUAers are helpful and
              cooperative, but tom is a jerk.
              \_ Here is what is going on:  Tom is proud of whatever is
                 in that file [thus the helpful suggestion "why don't you
                 dl it and see"] and he wants to keep it there to point to
                 or for people to stumble on.  If he were to delete it,
                 putting it back without "someone asked me to put it there"
                 would just look pathetic.  No, I don't know why he doesn't
                 just put it on a web page.
                 \_ It's really simple.  I'm not going to respond to some
                    anonymous coward's attempt to disparage me on the MOTD.
                    If someone wants to make it a personal request, I'll
                    consider it.
                    The file is a video made at the 2003 Moab MUniFest,
                    and I think it could be of interest to people, but
                    the original purpose of putting it in /csua/tmp was
                    that randal wanted to see it, and I don't have personal
                    web space where I can stick 300MB.  -tom
        \_ You guys are bad.  Tom picked on me once, but this thread is
           a little mean.
           \_ You reap what you sow...
2004/5/4-5 [Computer/SW/Graphics] UID:29985 Activity:high
5/4     Anyone know of a unix program/script to convert openGL model files
        to AutoCAD readable format (.dwg or .dxf)?
        Google turns up mostly methods to convert the other way. Thanks!
        Alternately, are there any simple to use freeware
        CAD programs that you'd recommend that can save as those formats?
        \_ OpenGL is an API, not a file format.  Converters "to OpenGL" will
           typically generate a .c file which when compiled will send the
           geometry through the OpenGL API. What are you really asking for?
           \_Would like to convert something like
                http://glv.sourceforge.net/fileformat.html to .dwg/.dxf
             It doesn't need to be GL oriented, but should be simple to
             hand-code. PostScript would be fine, but I'm not sure how
             to specify 3D coordinates in .ps.
             \_ On that page, the syntax is basically just a raw translation to
                OpenGL commands.  For instance, the "point x y z" translates to
                the OpenGL calls:
                glBegin(GL_POINTS);
                glVertex3f(x,y,z);
                glEnd();
                It is fundamentally state-machine oriented.  A translation
                would be nontrivial.  Frankly it's more common to translate
                structured geometry files to OpenGL because usually you start
                with the structured geometry.  Reversing the translation would
                be difficult--you'd have to reconstruct information that's been
                thrown away.  I don't think you're going to find anything like
                this, but good luck.
2004/5/4 [Uncategorized] UID:29986 Activity:kinda low
5/4     PacMan irl: http://www.pacmanhattan.com
2004/5/4 [Computer/SW/OS/FreeBSD] UID:29987 Activity:high
5/4     Can someone with a FreeBSD 5.2.1 system try out a couple of ports I've
        put together? (I haven't played with the ports before, so I'd like to
        know if these work properly for other people). tia.
        nmh 1.1RC3:   link:tinyurl.com/34xgu (untar in /usr/ports/mail)
        connect 1.76: link:tinyurl.com/3xc5y (untar in /usr/ports/net)
        \_ Yes, I could but I'm not going to install stuff from an anonymous
           person on my machine.  It's one thing to post anon, it's quite
           another to run your code on my machine.
           \_ Mail me if you are concerned that there is something in the
              port files that might damage your system. --ranga
2004/5/4 [Computer/SW/OS/FreeBSD] UID:29988 Activity:kinda low
5/4     FreeBSD5 question.  I see 4 ISOs in the FreeBSD5 distribution tree.
        What is the difference between "bootonly" "miniinst" and "disk1".
        The all appear to be bootable and take me into the install program?
        \_ Take a look at: http://tinyurl.com/3cnpm
           If you want to install from cd w/o d/l'ing anything at install
           time, just d/l and burn disk1.
2004/5/4 [Reference/History/WW2/Germany, Recreation/Computer/Games] UID:29989 Activity:high
5/3     Attention 3d 1st person shooter gamerz: Battlefield Vietnam, yay or
        nay?                      -BF1942 dude, alias "Nazi killing machine"
        \_ I'm waiting for the truly accurate military video game where you
           lay around terrified 98% of the time ... and then get insta-maimed/
           killed by a sniper or pipe-bomb.
        \_ BFV is much more immersive than BF1942.  Plus infantry actually
           stand a chance against tanks and helis.  The terrain is beautiful.
           \_ but should they stand a chance?  against a heli?  please....
              \_ With a Stinger, sure they should. If you want game
                 balance + realism, make stingers easy to obtain.
           \_ Well, this improves game balance.  All you have to do is whip
              out your RPK or M60 and start belting it out.  When they realize
              they are being shot at, they have to turn around, find you,
              aim their chopper at you and shoot.  Oh and in that time, you
              get to find a place to hide.  Most people are crappy chopper
              pilots and are not resourceful enough to pickup other players
              to act as door gunners.
        \_ I'm still waiting for Battlefield: Iraq
           \_ uh, desert sucks?
              \_ No!  Urban guerilla warfare!
           \_ it's been done in BF1942, the Red Army field (forgot the name)
              It's a nasty terrain.
2004/5/4 [Academia/Berkeley/Ocf, Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Motd] UID:29990 Activity:high
/54     Please come back to csua paolo, we promise to be nicer this time
                                                        -paolo #1 fan
        \_ we forgive you for the motd fuckup, please come back so that we
           can ridicule you again!!!
        \_ why did paolo change his name to pst?
           \_ he said something once that it was a good way for dealing with
              spam. It's not the first time he's changed his CSUA (and OCF)
              login.
2004/5/4 [Science/GlobalWarming, Politics/Domestic/California] UID:29991 Activity:moderate
5/4     On Cheney (Guardian UK):  http://csua.org/u/76f
        \- i wish that had been a better article. the success of dick cheney
           is a product of people valuing niceness over principle ...
           "well he might be an evil fucker, but he is nice to me" --psb
2004/5/4 [Politics/Domestic/Election, Politics/Domestic/President/Bush] UID:29992 Activity:high 88%like:30001
5/4     Economy up, Kerry doomed:
        http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/news/archive/2004/05/04/financial1419EDT0159.DTL&type=printable
        \_ Yeah, but Bush is a corrupt asshole.  I'd vote for an inanimate
           carbon rod over Bush.
           \_ Did you actually get to SEE the rod?
        \_ Is that why Bush's numbers keep dropping?
2004/5/4 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:29993 Activity:high
5/4     In perl, how do you know if an argument given is a scalar, hash,
        or array?
        \_ generally, the use to which it's being put.  And the behaviour
           you see if you use it as a scalar.  Maybe use strict or -wT
           might give you some helpful messages.  -beginning/intermediate
                                                   perl user
        \_ TYPES ARE FOR THE WEAK!
           \_ or for coders who don't know what they are coding
        \_ More to the point is why do you think you'd need to know in perl?
           \_ say you want to overload a method so it takes different
              arguments for backward compatibility. CGI.pm does that.
           \_ Don't know enough about perl to know, but perhaps for things
              like polymorphic function arguments? Perl is pretty ambigious
              about stuff like this... which is why I avoid using it for
              "real" code in projects.
        \_ in some cases you might be able to use ref($var) to find out
           what "type" of variable was passed: some of the return values
           are SCALAR, ARRAY, HASH and REF. (man perlfunc and search for
           ref).
2004/5/4 [Politics/Domestic/Election] UID:29994 Activity:very high
5/4     ...Kerry got bad press over throwing
        the medals (and just about every single charge of waffling
        I've seen) because there are plenty of hack journalists more
        than willing to trim stories to fit their talking point du
        jour.  --scotsman
        \_ No, Kerry got bad press because he earned it.
           \_ Just for the record, how.  Can you come up with a story that
              could reasonably be called waffling?  My favorites are the
              ones which take quotes from 20 years apart, or the ones that
              claim he's against noble goal X because he voted against a
              really shitty bill that had a line item about X.  --scotsman
              \_ I voted for the $87B before I voted against it.
                 I won't make Pres. Bush's service an issue.  Oh wait, I will.
                 Hell, just read that right-wing rag Slate:
                 http://slate.msn.com/id/2096540
                 \_ The $87B claim...  This falls squarely under part 2 of
                    my favorites. --scotsman
                    \_ Um no.  That was Kerry saying he VOTED for it before
                       voting against it.  What did he vote for?  An amendment
                       to the bill which would repeal some of the tax cuts.
                       He wants to have it both ways.
                       \_ God forbid someone should see shades of grey in an
                          issue.  I prefer all my politicians to have a black
                          and white view of everything.
                       \_ Yes, it is called the "balanced budget act" and
                          Kerry was voting to follow it. BushCo just wanted
                          to borrow the money, which is irresponsible and
                          reckless. No waffle here, just a Senator trying
                          to do his duty.
                 \_ Bush's service has been an issue since his governor
                    races.  It became more of an issue when he decided
                    to attack Kerry's service.  All I've heard from Kerry
                    on the subject is that they have no place to attack
                    him on it.
                    \_ John Kerry specifically said he wouldn't bring it up.
                       Then he brought it up.  I have seen nothing from Bush
                       about Kerry's vietnam service.  Furthermore, I wish
                       right-wingers would drop it.
                       \_ If not from Bush, it's come from Cheney, Karen
                          Hughes and any number of others.  I bet I could
                          find a Bush quote, though.
                          \_ Kerry has plenty of people to attack Bush for him
                             starting with Ted Kennedy.  It remains the case
                             that Kerry said he wouldn't say it, and then said
                             it.  It wouldn't be a problem if it were only one
                             thing, but this waffling is pervasive.
                             \_ Gotta love all these 100% recycled anti-Gore
                                talking points.  Who needs new ones?!
                                \_ Gotta love your ducking the issue.
                                   \_ That's the point, there's no issue to
                                      duck.  The "Kerry is a waffler" argument
                                      is a tired Republican talking point
                                      that has been around since Clinton in '92.
                                      There is no issue to duck because the
                                      accusation has no basis in facts, only
                                      in out-of-context quotes and creative
                                      use of ellipsis.
                 \_ Hell, why not just point to a freeper page and get it
                    over with.
                    \_ Uh oh, someone posted an example (two actually) and you
                       can't deal with the truth.  Hurts?
                     \_ He voted for the $87B by taking the money out of
                        the tax cuts.  That means he voted against taking
                        the money out of other programs.  That's not a waffle,
                        and claiming so just proves you are a tool and a troll.
                        And Kerry didn't make Bush's record and issue until
                        Bush someone thought he could makes Kerry's record
                        an issue.  That sort of changes things.
                        \_ He voted for an amendment to the bill, and then
                           voted against the bill (the amendment didn't pass).
                           He can't honestly say he voted for it before he
                           voted against it.
              \_ Reasonably called waffling by a troll like you?  No.  I no
                 longer feed trolls, anonymous or named.
2004/5/4 [Computer/SW/Unix, Computer/SW/Security, Academia/Berkeley/CSUA] UID:29995 Activity:very high
5/4     /csua/tmp has about 2.8 GB used in publicly readable directories.
        About 2.3 GB is random stuff from individual users.  The top 20 files
        in /csua/tmp are a total of 800MB and the most recent is 3 months old.
        Please clean out your old files.  --anonymous but trying to be polite
        \_ fyi, /csua/tmp/hozers has a list of directories sorted by size
        \_ Wow, I had no idea we had so much world readable crap on soda!
        \_ If you have any cool files in /csua/tmp please post the filename
           and a brief description here.
           \_ If you don't, root will delete your files in 24 hours.
              (Ok, not really, but I wish root would.  :P  )
            * Sims.mpg are virtual creatures evolved to moved around in
              different environs (water, on land, etc.)
           \_ crabvspipe1.mpg is an unlucky crab which gets sucked through a
              tiny hole in a pipe due to a huge pressure difference.
           \_ moab_munifest.avi is some dumb bicycling thing.
              \_ clearly you didn't watch it.  -tom
              \_ Wait for it...Wait for it...RIIIIIIIIIIIII-
                 \_ DELETE FILE!
                    \_ Don't you mean BALEEATED?!
           \_ theplay_long.ram is the highest quality clip I've seen.
              (thanks tom!)
        \_ any good porn? -hornyguy
           \_ Heavens I hope not.  The CSUA has had enough pornishment.
           \_ tranthra.avi-- dorm+hooker porn.  Not good porn.
              \_ So when is William "Hung" going to film one of these?
              \_ Ok root, I don't think anyone can argue if you delete
                 that.  (Not to mention it's a year old)
                 \_ It's a classic!
              \_ is this a ucb dude?
                 \_ yes. it takes place in the units.
              \_ Is this the one where some kid take a hooker with
                 flat breasts into his dorm room while his computer
                 camera on and they have some kind of argument about
                 why the computer needs to be on?
                 \_ Does that mean there's no actual sex in it?
                    \_ There's sex.  It's just not well-filmed or erotic.
           \_ It's a hilarious video. Not erotic but definitely humorous.
2004/5/4 [Computer/SW/Security, Computer/SW/OS/Windows] UID:29996 Activity:high
5/4     Anyone know of a way to send SMS message to mobile phone in China
        for free, ie, via the web? thx.
        \_ Find the service provider of the person you're trying to SMS.
           Then go do a web search for web-based and e-mail SMS gateways
           for that provider.
2004/5/4 [Computer/Companies/Apple] UID:29997 Activity:nil
5/4     M$ patents a new apple:
        http://news.com.com/2100-1008_3-5205574.html?tag=nefd.top
        \?_ Wow, they really are planning to take over _everything_.
        \_ Trying to license FAT format?
           \_ Actually, the new LO-FAT format.
2004/5/4 [Politics/Domestic/RepublicanMedia] UID:29998 Activity:high
5/4     Paul Krugman beats out Anne Coulter and Molly Ivans for
        "most partisan" http://www.lyinginponds.com
        \_ ok please point out the insanity in a krugman column,
          take for example http://www.nytimes.com/2004/05/04/opinion/04KRUG.html
           \_ He's MAKING SENSE.  Clearly he's insane.
        \_ Extreme partisanship is the New Way.  With the country so heavily
           segregated along political lines (google for the demographics on
           this), partisanship sells and Jimmy Carterish (or, for you
           Republicans, Rockefellerish) politics are down the drain.
           Also, the Democratic contenders (and in fact, Coulter herself)
           would all be kicked out of the top ten if they included talk
           radio rather than just syndicated columnists downloaded off the
           web.  Not to mention every second of Fox News.
        \_ Molly Ivins, not Ivans.  Sometimes Molly "I can't get two facts
           right" Ivins.
           \_ With a moron for a target, she doesn't have to.
           \_ What is truth?  Truth is optional when the cause is worthy.
2004/5/4 [Recreation/Computer/Games, Reference/History/WW2] UID:29999 Activity:high
5/4     Historical strategy games buffs, play these two:
        (a) Europa Universalis 2, (b) Victoria.
        Steep learning curve, but very fun.  There is also a WWII one using
        the same engine, but that's probably not for everybody. -- ilyas
        \_ Are either of these free or Free?
           \_ No. -- ilyas
2004/5/4 [Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Motd] UID:30000 Activity:high
5/4     I don't see any 9/11 controversial posts in the motd archive
        like kill arabs, fuck Afghan, etc. I thought that's the basis for
        the motd shutdown, which really didn't happen. What's the deal?
        \_ No motd archiver yet devised keeps a perfect record, especially
           with radioactive comments that immediately get censored.
        \_ The email sofia wrote to the officers had at least a sample of the
           quotes you're looking for, and yes, they were bad.
           \_ you can look on "kais motd " around the time following
              9/11. The problem with the quotes in the email is that they were
              taken out of context. As I recall, it was basically this one
              single person making the most extreme posts and those had plenty
              of the types of responses you'd expect to such trolls. Another
              example was lifted from a sarcastic reply, you know how sometimes
              someone pretends to agree in order to show how it's absurd, well
              sofia or whoever quoted one of those. (cf. jews posting "kill the
              jews!")
           |_ post please
           \_ post please?
           \_ someone post please?
                \_ I second that
              \_ don't you need permission from sofia?
              \_ Sorry, I don't have it.  The only thing I recall is that
                 1) There were posts that violated even the Supreme Court's
                    rules for free speech-- cf. inciting violence-- to say
                    nothing of the ASUC's less permissive rules.  Furthermore,
                    they weren't being deleted as often as you might hope.
                 2) John posted a file (a snapshot of the motd) that contained
                    the worst examples he could find, which was helpful-- except
                    that it was *nothing* compared to what one might have seen if
                    they were on a constant cycle of "reload cnn.  reload bbc.
                    check motd.  channel surf.  is nytimes up?  reload latimes"
                    The posts weren't "politically incorrect".  It was hate
                    speech.  Now pretend your last name is Hussein on Sept 11
                    and figure out if you'd be concerned.
                    \_ Now what difference would it make if CSUA never existed
                       and your last name was still Hussein on that day?
                       None.
                       \_ Wait, so your argument is that since some people
                          might have been saying horrible things, the CSUA
                          should provide a forum for them?  Should the CSUA
                          allow white power posts as well?
                          \_ No my argument is that I didn't find motd
                             any more offensive than on some other "usual" days.
                             Of course, if you show me a sample of the offensive
                             material posted on that day, I'll take my words
                             back (you know I wasn't monitoring all day..)
           \_ There is plenty of name calling and offensive things said on this
              motd every day. Someone with root access just decided to be
              "politically correct" on that day and shutdown it down. I didn't
              see anything abnormally offensive on motd on that day.
              \_ And someone else can't "shutdown it down" that axe they've
                 been grinding ever since.
                 \_ Free speech is more important to some of us than others.
                    \_ Free speech?!  LOL.  This the motd.  You must be this
                       tall to ride.
                        \_ Not all that tall, unfortunately.
2004/5/4 [Politics/Domestic/Election, Finance/Investment] UID:30001 Activity:high 88%like:29992
5/4     Economy up, Kerry doomed:
        http://tinyurl.com/2jloj (sfgate.com)
        \_ Yeah, but Bush is a corrupt asshole.  I'd vote for an inanimate
           carbon rod over Bush.
           \_ Did you actually get to SEE the rod?
           \_ In rod we trust.
        \_ Is that why Bush's numbers keep dropping?
           \_ No, that's the effect of the Communist Media.
        \_ http://www.forbes.com/markets/newswire/2004/05/04/rtr1358052.html
        \_ Wow, the economy is picking up after hundreds of billions of
           dollars of stimulus and 2 wars.  But we're turning into a nation
           of burger flippers/Walmart employees and rich CEOs with no one in
           between.
2004/5/4-5 [Consumer/Camera] UID:30002 Activity:high
5/4     Um, so I asked the question yesterday about the Canon digital rebel
        and what problems people seem to say it has that prevents someone
        from moving beyond point-and-shoot yada yada. The kchang link reply
        wasn't helpful... anyone know what the deal is?
        \_ While we're on the topic, does anyone have a good article that
           explains white balance. is this an issue only in digital or film
           as well?
           \_ It's an issue in film development.
        \_ Go to the forums @ http://dpreview.com. In fact, all digital camera
           questions should go there.
        \_ user interface.  Digital Rebel has terriable user interface to
           be operated manually (i.e. adjust both apature and shutter speed
           manually).  Having said that, the best teaching tools is
           go get a (used) 100% manual camera with a 50mm lens, and take
           black n white classes, you will be amazed how fast you improve.
           \_ I totally disagree; digital is a much better way to learn,
              because you take more pictures and get more rapid feedback
              about how they came out.  As for adjusting both aperture and
              shutter speed independently, how often is that really necessary?
              Aperture or shutter-priority mode with exposure compensation
              will handle almost all the needs of most photographers.  -tom
              \_ How often?  All the time if you know wtf you're doing and
                 want the best results.
              \_ it's two degree of freedom no matter what.  Digital
                 Rebel is not designed to tinker with both without pushing
                 tiny buttons to switch mode.   and, yes, Digital is much
                 more convinient than 35mm, but convinient doesn't equate
                 to better tool to learn.
                 To move beyond point n shoot requires dicipline, and
                 I've seen too many newbies lost his/her dicipline
                 completely with digital camera.  For beginners, it's
                 more important to *THINK* before shutter is pressed,
                 it's more important to use plain old center-weighted
                 meter to read different exposure situation (instead of
                 rely on AI).  Most beginner knows the existance of
                 exposure compensation, but they don't know when to
                 override the automatic meter.  Further more, B*W film
                 is known for unlenient latitude toward exposure.  Each
                 failed exposure means the image will not come out at all.
                 For digital camera, like all consumer product, a lot
                 of effort has put into software which automatically
                 making adjustments so the picutre turn out correctly.
                 That, combine with unknown characteristics of CCD/CMOS
                 exposure latitude, give newbies false sense of
                 security.
                 \- i really really hate this recent trend in cameras/lenses
                    that make changing the aperture a pain in the ass ...
                    worst are ass lenses like the nikon Gs which have no
                    control ring. even on high end cameras prefer you
                    to use one of the on-body dials ... which just seems
                    difficult handle while trying to take pix quickly.
                    i think most people just care about composition for
                    fairly easy shots to take. digital is sort of a
                    brute force approach ... bracket like crazy and pick
                    your shots later. if that isnt an option you need to know
                    what you are doing. it ise usefulto have EXIF info
                    but i think few people end up going over this stuff.
                    "taking better pix" != learning photography. for the first,
                    go digital, if you can afford it. for the latter,
                    canon f-1, if you can afford it. --psb
        \_ When I was looking for a SLR digital camera I spoke to some of
           the pro/near-pro photographers at work about which canon to get
           (10D vs digital rebel). They all said that the 10D was overkill
           for someone learning photograhy and that the digital rebel was a
           much better choice. One said that while the ui wasn't the best
           for full-manual shooting (the reasons given above, plus a few
           more to do with the focal points) it was good enough to learn all
           the aspects of good photography without getting bogged down in
           the minutiae of a "true" pro camera. One or two told me that they
           had a digital rebel which they used for personal photography
           mostly because it was lighter and smaller than the 10D (and
           similar).
           Personally, I feel that the digital rebel is a great camera
           (given that you get a pretty good lens w/ the camera for around
           $950 or so). I've learnt more about photography with it than I
           did with a fully manual camera mostly because it lets me take
           lots of photos and compare the results of my manual settings with
           those of the fully auto settings. I have played around with fully
           manual cameras (my dad is a photonut) but I could never get
           decent enough photos to stick with it and learn the nuances
           because it was too hard to get a decent photo (I would often
           leave my camera at home on trips, because no pictures was about
           the same as getting really crappy pictures, not so with the
           digital rebel). YMMV.
           \_ i read about someone german guy hacking the digital rebel ROM
                to unleash all the features in the more expensive 10d.
2004/5/4 [Politics/Domestic/President/Bush] UID:30003 Activity:nil
5/4     "There are no longer torture chambers or mass graves or rape rooms
        in Iraq." -- President Bush, 04/30/04
2004/5/4 [Politics/Foreign/MiddleEast/Iraq] UID:30004 Activity:nil
        0/3 dude!
        \_ "The pattern and practice of the Saddam Hussein regime was to do
           exactly what you said, to murder and torture, and the killing
           fields are filled with mass graves. And equating the two, I think,
           is a fundamental misunderstanding of what took place" at Abu Ghraib
           - Rumsfeld
           \_ Well, let's see.  We've got what looks to be rape at Abu Ghraib.
              We've definitely got the torture.  And we've now got a little
              mass grave of our own in Falluja.  So where's the
              misunderstanding exactly?
              \_ Don't be obtuse.  The people the perpetrated these acts are
                 going to be held accountable -- probably to an extreme
                 considering the current political climate.  This stuff is
                 regarded as morally reprehensible in our culture and society.
                 This cannot be said of Saddam Hussein's regime.       -mice
                 \_ I've no doubt that some of these people will be held
                    accountable, but I'm doubtful that the chain of command
                    that likely created the climate that encouraged this
                    crap will be held responsible.
        \_ "I am not a lawyer, but what I have seen would qualify as
           abuse, not torture, so I am not going to address claims of
           torture." -Rumsfeld (doesn't he sound more like Clinton every day?)
2004/5/4-5 [Academia/Berkeley/CSUA/Troll/Kinney] UID:30005 Activity:high
5/4     Kinney finally blogs: http://www.kuro5hin.org/user/ipex/diary
        \_ the CSUA motd was a blog a decade before the word was invented
        \_ how many other CSUA'ers blog?
2004/5/4-5 [Politics/Domestic/Election] UID:30006 Activity:insanely high
5/4     Some Vietnam vets slam Kerry
        http://csua.org/u/76i
        \_ Now (Iraq torturing) is probably not the best time to doubt claims
           of atrocities committed by US forces in Vietnam.
                \_ Taking photos of nude prisoners is not torture.
                   It is hazing - similar activities take place
                   is fraternities.
                   \_ And this illustrates why all the libruls are just brain
                      dead, if they had any brain to begin with.  Hazing is a
                      priviledge.  Even in America, very few of the incoming
                      students who beg for it would have the honor of getting
                      hazed.  To think the Iraqis are getting it for free,
                      witout even so much as asking for it, should make every
                      American green with jealousy and want to become an Iraqi.
                        \_ yawn, this is the best you can do?  I'd expect
                           more from a high school sophmore.
                \_ Kerry claims everyone in Vietnam did it (except him of
                 course)
                     \_ in all the 4 months Kerry was runner scumming in
                        his speed boat, he managed to kill 1 unarmed vietcong
                        and many innocent civilians
                        \_ How the heck do you know?  I'd like to. Link?
        \_ some guys have a beef with him from 1971, who cares.
        \_ '"I do not believe John Kerry is fit to be commander in chief of
             the U.S. armed forces," said retired Rear Adm. Roy Hoffmann,
             chairman of the organization.'
           My father served in Vietnam and Somalia, and he doesn't think
           W is fit to lick shit off a vet's boots.  So why should you care
           what either of them think?
                \_ Was your father Bush's commander in the Air National
                   Guard?  Some of the signees were Kerry's supervisors
                   in Vietnam.  Did Bush protest against Vietnam and
                   Somalia for political gain?  Nor does Bush portray
                   himself as a war hero, Kerry does.  Consequently
                   the opinion of Kerry's contemporaries is pertinent.
                   \_ One guy questioned one of his three purple hearts.
                      A few other didn't like him because he was anti-
                      war.  That's all they had on him.  Smells partisan
                      to me.
                        \_ How many times does this have to repeated???
                           An overwhelming majority of the veterans are
                           not condemning his participation or medals,
                           but his despicable actions after the war.
                           He was in the vanguard of leftists
                           undermining of the Vietnam war effort.  He
                           and his ilk are why a free Hanoi subsequently
                           fell and the millions fled on rafts.  All
                           of his behavoir is well documented if you
                           would bother to investigate:
                           http://ice.he.net/~freepnet/kerry
                \_ Bush is running as the hero/furer/messiah for 9/11+iraq.
2004/5/4-5 [Reference/History/WW2] UID:30007 Activity:very high
5/4     What important US event happened near the end of September 1776?
        \_ The first use of US-sponsored terrorism (the New York fire)?
           So google tells me. -- ilyas
           \_ Do you hate America???
              \_ If you tell me what America is, I will tell you if I hate it.
                   -- ilyas
                 \_ That sounds suspiciously like what a Communist would say
2004/5/4-5 [Recreation/Computer/Games] UID:30008 Activity:high
5/4     I want to buy 'settlers of catan' online (because the idea of
        leaving the house is abohorent to me).  Also, i'm a cheap bastard
        is there some discount game place online :)
        \_ It's called "<DEAD>www.ebay.com"<DEAD> You might have heard of it.
        \_http://www.google.com/froogle?q=settlers+of+catan&btnG=Search+Froogle&scoring=p
        \_ http://tinyurl.com/yrlzz (froogle)
        \_ I got it and others from http://funagain.com, they were nice/fast
           \- funagain and fairplay are good in service and price.
              if you are trying to save $, you should try to cluster
              to amortize shipping cost ... like with catan you might
              get the 5-6pp set at the same time. actually if you are
              in berkeley, i might be interested in clustering a
              game order. --psb
        \_ funagain is good. fairplay is usually cheaper but i've never
           ordered from them... i just get funagain to match their prices.
        \_ Crypto fascist!
2004/5/4-5 [Consumer/TV] UID:30009 Activity:high
5/4     anyone know if there will be any dual layer DVD writers on the
        market? i am thinking of whether to buy a DVD writer now or
        wait for the dual layer ones (if any).
        \_ Yes, there already is one announced (I forget if it was Pioneer
           or not). Good luck, however, on getting media.
           \_ Sony
        \_ Only the Sony one for now, and both the drive and media cost
           megabucks ($4000/drive, $40/disc)
2004/5/4-5 [Politics/Domestic/911, Politics/Domestic/President/Bush] UID:30010 Activity:very high
5/4     What's the probability of Bush getting reelected? Will he stage
        something like the Taiwan president did? (ie, let one terrorist
        attempt be successful the week before election?)
        \_ You mean like 9/11?
           \_ on a much smaller scale. 911 again would be bad for Bush.
              \_ Another 9/11 would be great for Bush.  It would also result
                 in a draft, large scale mobilization of industrial capacity
                 of the US, and the summary squishing of most of the Middle
                 East, in my opinion.  Bush is at his best in squishing mode.
                 Nothing's scarier than a pissed off America mobilized for war.
                 What's happening now is scary enough, and we aren't even on
                 anywhere close to war footing.  -- ilyas
                 \_ Hmm. I'm not so sure about this. If it was Bin Laden again,
                    well, it doesn't look like there would be anything in
                    particular to do about it. I don't think congress would
                    jump on board a general "war on muslims" policy. The other
                    dictators are being pussies lately. Hell, Saddam was trying
                    hard to be a pussy until the end.
                    \_ Not 'war on muslims', 'war on fundamentalist islam, and
                       middle eastern dictatorships'.
        \_ You know, Oliver Stone foretold all of this in Wild Palms
           s/911/boca raton nuke/g and it's very creepy - even to the
           part about the "Liberty Bill"
        \_ according to John Zogby it's very close to 50/50, and he makes money
           off of being right, not off of being partisan one way or the
           other.
        \_ I'd be really curious what the oddsmakers have on it.  Can you bet
           point spread on elections or is it only up/down?
           \_ The Insider has it at 9/8, tradesports at 58/42. You can
              bet on total electoral votes on tradesports. Betting on
              elections is illegal in the United States.
              http://www.campaignline.com/index.cfm
              \_ What are the odds on the US "suddenly" capturing UBL in
                 October?
                 http://csua.org/u/76q
                 \_ The odds on him being captured by Set are 30/70, by
                    the end of the year 40/60.
2004/5/4-5 [Computer/SW/WWW/Browsers] UID:30011 Activity:high
5/4     Has anyone been able to use links (the browser) to view http://nytimes.com?
        \_ Yes, what seems to be the problem?
           \_ I can't log in.  It's as if it's not accepting cookies-- I
              put in csuamotd/csuamotd, submit, and it takes me back to the
              same page.
        \_ Do you mean lynx?  I have no problem.
           \_ links != lynx:
              http://artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz/~mikulas/links
2004/5/4-5 [Reference/RealEstate] UID:30012 Activity:insanely high
5/4     I am living in a house with a large garden around it. What's
        a good but cheap way to make sure that the ants don't venture
        into the house during summer?
        \_ when my roommates and i threw out the piles of rotting food, the
           ants left.
           \_ what about the maggots? WHAT ABOUT THE MAGGOTS?
              \_ FLYPAPER!!!!!!
        \_ Leave a trail of sugar from your garden to your house.
                \_ did you mean to say "from your how to your garden" (so
                   that the ants leave the house)?
        \_ Put ant baits at the windows and doors.
        \_ water your lawn before sun rise helps.  and, periodically
           check the seal between your house's fundation and the wooden
           walls.  The concret-like seal tend to break easily, and ants find
           its way in from there.
        \_ buy some chiton based pest control. it shreds the little buggers
           and doesnt poison the earth.
        \_ Dig a 3 foot trench around your house, fill with oil, light.  Refill
           as needed.
           \_ Ah, the Boys from Brazil are back.
        \_ "Grant's Ant Stakes". They work great when put around your house.
           I used to live in SoCal, where ants can be a big problem.
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