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| 2004/3/30-31 [Politics/Domestic/California, Politics/Domestic/911] UID:12921 Activity:very high |
3/30 Chen permits recount to proceed immediately, Taiwan stock market soars
http://csua.org/u/6o4 (NY Times, password needed)
U.S. forensics team talks with doctors, note openness of investigation
http://csua.org/u/6o6
Same experts discuss common misperceptions about the ballistics
http://csua.org/u/6o3
Chen comments on China's predicted hard-line move in Hong Kong
http://csua.org/u/6o5
Moron complains about Taiwan election
http://csua.org/u/6o7
\_ CSI Taipei! Was David Caruso there?
Same experts discuss common misperceptions about the ballistics
http://csua.org/u/6o3
Chen comments on China's predicted hard-line move in Hong Kong
http://csua.org/u/6o5
Moron complains about Taiwan election
http://csua.org/u/6o7
\_ Given Chen's long history as a drama queen and the very close
vote count, the opposition's peaceful and orderly demand for a
recount and investigation into the shooting incident is totally
reasonable.
\_ You should talk to the DPP college student getting beat on TV
by 4+ KMT folks for speaking to TV reporters just outside
their rally.
\_ Is that the best you can come up with for a rally of
500k people? how many people did the DPP mobs beat
up in its many rallies over the years? These days,
in many places in Taiwan, if you don't speak Taiwanese,
you can get cursed and ostracized, thanks to DPP's
divisive politics.
\_ And how many of those people (who watch KMT-biased TV
coverage) believe in the faked assassination theory?
Your dismissal of KMT's televised violence is also
disturbing.
\_ feel free to post urls of any other violent
rally incidents from the multitudes of pro-DPP
newspapers as opposed to your so-claimed
"KMT-biased TV".
newspapers.
\_ This entire thing has missed a huge point. Extremely large
number of military personnel were denied their consititution
right to vote. And it turned out that there is no legal basis
for their detention. Thus, by definition, this election
result is invalid, and thus, the legimacy of this so-called
democratic government is in question.
\_ Are you talking about Taiwan or the US?
\_ First URL, a viewpoint not well-covered by the KMT-controlled
press: "The opposition Nationalist Party on Monday publicly
dropped its demand that the Taiwan military be allowed to
vote again after a disputed presidential election a week ago...
Mr. Chen and the Defense Ministry replied that the
alert had had no effect on voting, because staggered shifts
had made it possible for the servicemen and police officers
to vote."
\_ Contrary to what this guy is saying, KMT doesn't control
the press at all. Chen and DPP is the government in
power, and has systematically moved to control the press
to silence the opposition. Just recently, the owner of
a pro-DPP press told all its employees to vote for DPP
or be fired.
\_ URL? 'Cos the same rumor mill sez the KMT drinks the
\_ This is in the news a few weeks before the
election. Go ask a few people in Taiwan and you
should find someone who've read about it. Taiwan
related news sites don't seem to keep good
archives of older articles online, so I can't
find any url, unfortunately.
blood of babies.
\_ See "Formosa Betrayed" written by U.S. vice consul
during the 2/28 incident. obGoogle. There is a
similar book called "Formosa Calling". Both are
published way back.
\_ errr .... 228 incident is 57 years ago. Taiwan's
government, while under KMT, had admitted to the
wrong doing, and had compensated families of the
victims long ago. Taiwan has been under pro-
independence presidents for the last 16 years.
yet, DPP supporters like yourself constantly need
to bring up 228 for political purposes to fan
hatred against mainlanders and their descendants,
most of whom has nothing to do with 228, or
\_ actually, I just bring up 2/28 to criticize
the KMT as a political party. I think you're
being a bit prejudiced.
weren't even born then.
\_ http://tinyurl.com/3xwo6
Search for "station". You'll find other links on google.
Like I said yesterday, the KMT has had over 50 years of
total control of Taiwan to consolidate its power.
\_ snicker ... this starry eyed russian commentator has
no clue what he is talking about. he portrayed
putin and chen as heroes of democracy. I bet he is
real happy with putin and his rubber stamp parliament
and recent election. chen of course, could not care
less about the development of democratic principles and
institutions. he will bend all rules as long as it
helps him win. the commentator also portrayed Lee
Teng-hui as representative of the big-bad KMT. He
didn't even know Lee has always sympathized with
everything the DPP believes in, and made it his
personal life mission to destroy the KMT from within.
what a joke! Of all things, you chose this
clueless commentary to post.
\_ Uh ... the point is that the KMT controls the major
TV stations, and stirs up anti-Chen sentiment in
order to get the KMT back into office.
I just want to make sure you see this.
\_ I am sorry, but if this Russian commentator is
so clueless about the above, you can't
expect anyone to accept his unsupported
assertion the Taiwan's media is controlled
by the KMT. Besides that piece of clueless
writing was from 4 years ago, kind of
outdated. I don't know about TV, but
contrary to your belief, most of Taiwan's
\_ So what would you say if I provided a URL
that showed the KMT controls the major
TV stations? Does it suffice to say that
most newspapers are pro-DPP, and most
TV stations are pro-KMT?
BTW, it was my mistake way above. When
I said "press", I meant to say "TV".
I just want to make sure you see this.
\_ snicker ... this starry eyed
newspapaers are actually pro-DPP.
\_ btw, someone broke http://csua.org/u see motd entries above |
| 2004/3/30 [Politics/Domestic/Election] UID:12922 Activity:nil |
3/29 I missed the thread on Kerry and Catholics and all that but I didn't
see anyone point out that Kerry is really a Jew, not a Catholic so
it doesn't matter what the Pope or anyone else says about his faith.
\_ He also is from France and has a history of pretending to be
Irish to attact voters in Taxachussettes. |
| 2004/3/30 [Politics/Domestic/Election, Politics/Domestic/Crime] UID:12923 Activity:nil |
3/29 http://www.fundrace.org/moneyindex.html This speaks for itself. \_ The little know issue of party fundraising is that the Reps. traditionally receive small donations from a large number of contributors. Dems on the other hand receive large donations from two primary groups - trial lawyers and unions. |
| 2004/3/30 [Uncategorized] UID:12924 Activity:nil |
3/30 I love how the freepers delete discussions as soon as they are
conclusively proven to be wrong.
\_ Actually, the deletions seem to be more of a self-pronounced garbage
collector. The freepers just stop responding.
\_ As the only person to post links from FR I can tell you I have
never deleted a thread but have had literally hundreds
deleted.
\_ No you are not. |
| 2004/3/30-31 [Computer/SW/Languages/Perl] UID:12925 Activity:kinda low |
3/17 In Perl, how do I make variables have static types and type check
for valid parameter/actuals? I realize that variables are untyped
in Perl ($var can be 0.001 or "hello") but I'd like to have more
strict checking so that errors would be caught ahead of run-time,
Thanks, -java guy
\_ use java. Seriously. You don't use perl if you want strong
typing. If you want to clean user input, use regexps. But
the closest thing perl has to typing is its data structures.
The content of those structures can be... anything. --scotsman
\_ Oh yes, as opposed to those lists of Objects Java has, where you
have to use instanceof and casting to get what you want. Java is
bad. Naturally any language in the ML family will work, as will
Lisp strangely enough. Yes, Lisp actually has a fairly powerful
type system that most people never use (using 'declare' and so
on). -- ilyas
\_ I only said "use java" because he signed as "java guy"
--scotsman
\_ You know, Ben, just because someone signs as
'heroin addict', doesn't mean you should give him bad
advice. -- ilyas
\_ You're always coming down on heroin, Ilya. -geordan
\_ That's "coming down off heroin," geordan. Get yer
drug lingo right.
\_ you don't use java much, do you. it's not great, but it's not
that bad either. i very rarely use instanceof, and 1.5 has
parameterized containers.
\_ You are right, I no longer use Java much, I am proud to
report. While I am happy you almost never use instanceof
and casting to get things out of lists in Java, it turned
out to be a common enough problem that made them add
templates. I mean my example is precisely the one given
on Sun's site to explain why templates are useful. There
are other problems with Java's types, for instance you can
google for 'type spoofing.' I won't even get to other
things wrong with Java. I think Paul Twohey has a long
rant stored somewhere on this subject, on everything from
primitive type handling to floating point. -- ilyas
\_ Java Generics are not templates...
Java Generics are not templates...
\_ Yup, weaker than C++ templates. Though you know,
the word 'template' is pretty ... generic. It's not
like it applies exclusively to C++ stuff. -- ilyas
\_ One way to find mistakes in perl is to 'use strict;' and to run
with #!/usr/bin/perl -wT. At least this way you can find the
obvious mistakes with input validation. Once you fix those, the
only other thing you can do is to perform input validation in all
of your subroutines.
The biggest problem I find with perl is the lack of prototypes,
which forces you to manually check @_ in every subroutine to make
sure that the correct number of args were specified. There are
extensions to perl that add this, but they aren't available on
every system which makes it hard to write portable perl code using
them.
\_ You make this sound so difficult. "warn if (@_ != n)"
\_ That doesn't do type checking for you. If you need the
first two entries in @_ to be ints, the next two to be
string, &c. its not do-able without manually checking
each entry in @_. Prototypes (ansi-c style) provide that
level of support for you.
\_ Irrelevant. This is perl. use something else if you
want typing.
BTW, for the java-types, sometimes you don't have a choice. Ex. if
you need to write a cli program java is a terrible choice due to
the jvm startup penalty, the resource requirements (jvm needs ~
10mb of ram compared with 700k or less for perl), and its lack
of integration with libc (using Runtime.exec() in order to change
file ownership, create symlinks, remove files, &c. is not workable).
\_ So write in in C and stop bitching about it. -williamc
\_ I used to write everything in C, but having to roll
binaries for every odd-ball os/hw type just became
a pita. Perl was a compromise, it is portable and
has just enough system support for the things that
I need to do.
\_ Um, prototypes are built into perl and have been for a while:
sub foo($$@) { ... }
foo takes two scalars and a list
\_ WHAT? What is the name of the variable then? It's a lot
more clear if you use "sub foo($a, $b) { ... }"
\_ The variable is, as always, @_. |
| 2004/3/30 [Uncategorized] UID:12926 Activity:nil |
3/17 What are some condescending sites?
there's slashdot, http://csua.org, what else?
\_ The Bay Area? |
| 2004/3/30 [ERROR, uid:12927, category id '18005#8.51625' has no name! , ] UID:12927 Activity:kinda low |
3/30 Kerry's family is an immigrant success story. Their history is
extraordinary:
http://csua.org/u/6oa
\_ Cool story, esp. when Kerry's brother "returns" to Joodaism.
\_ Why are Jews so concerned about bloodlines? That's pretty racist.
\_ Awww, no one is biting on your troll! Poor widdle troll.
\_ the only racist on board is you
\_ Cool story, esp. when Kerry's brother "returns" to Judaism. |
| 2004/3/30 [Science/Space] UID:12928 Activity:nil |
3/30 More space tourism:
http://csua.org/u/6od |
| 2004/3/30 [Uncategorized] UID:12929 Activity:nil |
3/30 Try to put http://csua.org in http://tinyurl.com, and vise versa. FUN!!!!! \_ Bored recursively, are we? Gotta admit, though, it's perversely addictive.... \_ Great, now http://csua.org is down. |
| 2004/3/30 [Politics/Domestic/President/Bush] UID:12930 Activity:nil |
3/30 Rice to testify in public, under oath:
http://csua.org/u/6o8 (BBC)
Bush and Cheney to testify in private.
\_ you mean not under oath?
\_ All under oath. Just Bush and Cheney are not done in public.
\_ Because it's executive privilege to lie to the public.
\_ [Thanks for the penny]
\_ [No, thank you!] |
| 2004/3/30 [Politics/Foreign/Europe] UID:12931 Activity:nil |
3/30 France goes socialist! Yes! Less foreign competition for US goods
and services now.
\_ Wait until Wednesday before casting aspersions.
\_ What happens on Wednesday?
\_ They reconstitute the government. The man charged with doing
so is unlikely to hold onto his position in the next
election, so he has an opportunity to do some radical
reforming.
\_ French product/services are competitive?
\_ French wine.
\_ Lots of big French companies doing well, like Vivendi.
\_ Airbus.
\_ Ocaml! |
| 2004/3/30-4/1 [Computer/SW/Security, Computer/SW/OS/Windows] UID:12932 Activity:nil |
3/30 My spankin' new Windows 2003 Server doesn't come with the wonderful
"NT LM Security Support Provider" service, which is required by the
Message Queueing service, which I need. How do I install that
service? I don't see it anywhere under "Add or Remove Windows
Components". Thanks.
\_ Get yourself a real server OS.
\_ Call Microsoft. You paid for support.
\_ ditto above. don't expect community-style support when you
use Microsoft product. It's a cultural thing.
\_ USE LINUX! RIDE BIKE!
\_ I don't know how this originated but this is the stupidest
thing posted on the motd. Even if it was funny at one point,
the same joke told 50 million times gets old.
\_ ENJOY JOKE!
\_ It's there for a reason. It has a purpose.
\_ Whatever, Morpheus.
\_ dont listen to these twinks, microsoft website has newsgroups
found your answer in 10 seconds, but you must learn to google
\_ Here's a nickel kid, get yourself a real computer. |
| 2004/3/30-31 [Reference/Religion] UID:12933 Activity:low |
3/30 God's own lamb:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3572325.stm
\_ Mmmmh. Kebab. -John
\_ I'm sure you mean, "The Lamb of God"
\_ How much you want to bet someone drew that on the fur with some
caustic agent?
\_ Lamb of God, you take away the sin of the world, have mercy on us
\_ what about the cow born in idaho w/ GWB birthmark on it?
\_ I'm pretty sure that was yermom's ass.
\_ he said cow not mule.
\_ I thought he said asshole; oh, you're talking about the
animal, not the personage....
\_ Every cow comes with one asshole.
This cow came with two. |
| 2004/3/30 [Politics/Domestic/California, Politics/Domestic/911] UID:12934 Activity:nil |
3/30 English majors are all lefties!
http://www.frontpagemagazine.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=10762
\_ Starts out fun, but then launches into uncalled-for, irrelevant
ad-hominem attacks on authors championed by the liberal Liberal Arts
\_ No shit sherlock. It's always the dumb humanities kids who start
and take part in all the protests. Useful idiots indeed.
\_ Humanities students are no more or less dumb as a group than
engineering students. Propensity for blatant generalizations,
\_ prove it.
\_ Thanks for your comment, demonstrating that engineering
students can be just as dumb!
\_ can't prove your assertion, can you?
\_ I don't have to. The assertion that must be
proved is that humanities student --> dumb, which
is patently ridiculous.
\_ "patently ridiculous" means you have no factual
proof against the claim, right?
\_ Correct! There is absolutely no way to prove
humanities student --> dumb, its just small
dicked engineering student smug superiority
syndrome rearing its ugly head for the
zillionth time.
\_ how about entrance exam scores? or
relative performance in "neutral" classes?
or post college achievement? none of them
are perfect measures, but they would tend to
make claims of patent ridiculousness
silly.
\_ Yeah, but none of them would prove the
assertion at all.
\_ The assertion that humanities students
are dumb, or that they're no more or
less dumb? Certainly the first
assertion is the one requiring proof.
\_ by again refusing to answer the
question, i assume you realize that
while my suggestions would not
perfectly prove or disprove the
proposition, it would make your
claim of "patently ridiculous", well,
patently ridiculous.
\_ of course, you have completely misinterpreted
the post you replied to. a claim that dumb
humanities students do something does not
imply the claim that all humanities
students are dumb.
\_ Actually, the claim is that, as a group,
humanities students are as smart as engineering
students. To disprove this, you just have to
show, as a group, that one group is smarter than
the other, using some accepted metric
\_ great. what are the relative entrance
exam scores between the 2 groups? what
is their relative performance in "neutral"
classes? how do the post college achievement
of the 2 groups compare?
\_ Come to think of it, the claim is "no
more or less dumb". This implies the metric
is "common sense", not intelligence in
general. In this sense, it can be
reasonably claimed that humanities and
engineering students as groups have
similar levels of common sense (are no
less dumb than the other group).
\_ Why yes, that's pretty much what I meant.
At least someone gets it. For some
reason as soon as you say "intelligence"
some people here automatically assume
you must be referring to "ability to do
second order differential equations."
Sorry, I should have been more clear.
\_ Guy, you don't even understand that
the claim of stupid humanities kids
doing something is not equivalent to
a claim that all humanities students
are stupid.
\_ Does the common understanding of
"dumb" imply a lack of common sense?
Well, dumb originally meant the inability
to speak, as in "deaf and dumb". Does
that have anything to do with common
sense? "Dumb" came to mean, from WordNet
via dict, "slow to learn or understand,
lacking intellectual acuity". Does that
have anything to do with common sense?
Are you ascribing new meaning to the word
just to make your claim plausible?
\_ Someone please shoot this guy. His
pretentiousness is starting to make
my head hurt.
\_ Dewd, he already said sorry for not
being clear.
\_ Was he unclear? Or did he just
latch onto some non-plausible
excuse that would make his claim,
well, less "dumb"? I suspect the
latter.
however, can be found in almost any group of students. |
| 2004/3/30 [Politics/Domestic/RepublicanMedia, Politics/Domestic/President/Bush] UID:12935 Activity:nil |
3/30 Condoleeza Rice had a green monochrome CRT at her desk. retro cool?
\_ All the white cabinet members have at least CGA graphics.
\_ Even as parody that was in pretty bad taste. But, I guess
that's the idea of satire (if anyone these days could
remember the definition.)
\_ I'm not so sure about the bad taste, considering the real
life not-trying-to-be-funny bs that's been flying around.
There was a clip on the daily show last night of Bob Novak
asking a guest if he thought that Clarke was coming forward
now because he didn't like Condoleeza Rice, a black woman,
as head of national security. The guest was so shocked that
he asked him to repeat the question.
\_ Bob seems like he would be a perfect Monday night
football commentator
\_ Ann Coulter was the first to bring this up. Scary stuff.
\_ Sounds like they're taking a page from da Ali G Show.
"So, Richard, why do you hate black people?"
\_ Haven't the Republicans been complaining for 40 years
whenever the Dems try to play the race card? I guess
it just goes to show you that the Republicans can
be just as idiotic and craven when given the chance.
\_ More evidence that political language tends to migrate
from left to right.
\_ No, it just goes to show that there are partisans on
both sides of the aisle. Partisans of both major
parties should be exposed as useless groupthinkers. Bad
behavior in one group doesn't excuse bad behavior in
another.
\_ isn't it fun when the tables are turned? |
| 2004/3/30-31 [Computer/Companies/Yahoo] UID:12936 Activity:nil |
3/30 Has yahoo mail service been extremely slow and flaky for any of you
lately? It times out quite often.
\_ nope, but other websites seems sluggish. in fact, the net seems to
be quite flaky the past 2-3 weeks. |
| 2004/3/30 [Computer/Networking] UID:12937 Activity:nil |
3/30 I am buying a modem card for use while travelling abroad but I want
to test it before I go. I don't have any dial-in account. Are there
free 56K compatiable terminal line numbers that I can dialin to test
a modem? |
| 2004/3/30 [Computer/SW/OS/Linux] UID:12938 Activity:nil |
3/30 Tomehardware has a piece on switching to Linux. Thly shoud re-run
their CPU comparison test on Linux. It could now include the 386
and 486. http://www.tomshardware.com/howto/20040329
\_ Linux is for people who enjoy building, installing, and configuring
for its own sake.
\- and not doing any work since that has now soaked up all
your time. |
| 2004/3/30-31 [Computer/SW/Database, Computer/SW/Unix] UID:12939 Activity:nil |
3/30 How can I tell what has been compiled into my postfix binary?
For example, I want to see if it has mysql support built in.
\_ If you know what you're looking for, you can probably use
strings/grep (assuming you have just the binary.) Or you
could just roll your own... -John
\_ Try ldd if dynamically linked, or nm postfix | grep mysql
if static. --scotsman
\_ If you installed with a package it should say. If you installed
from source, look at the makefile and config files. |
| 2004/3/30 [Politics/Domestic/RepublicanMedia] UID:29886 Activity:nil 60%like:12909 |
3/29 What's the typical way to represent the GOP brainwashing in text?
\_ +-------+ +---------------------------+
| start |---------0------> | more Fox News and Freeper |
+-------+ +---------------------------+
\_ state transition table...
\_ What do you mean by brainwashing? Everything they say is true. |
| 2004/3/30 [Politics/Domestic/California, Politics/Domestic/Crime] UID:29887 Activity:nil |
3/29 Take a political compass test. Also here's where those democratic
primary guys fell on their scale:
http://www.digitalronin.f2s.com/politicalcompass/usprimaries.html
Based on that scale, China does fall closest to fascism, since it's
authoritarian but economically going towards center-right.
\_ Check out the wording on those questions. Most impressive.
-- ilyas
\_ Well, they also have a FAQ. I think it placed me correctly
(slightly left and libertarian).
\_ "Why are you throwing tomatoes at yourself?" Let's look at
this gem of a 'proposition' as they call it:
"Many personal fortunes are made by people who simply
manipulate money and contribute nothing to their society."
Now, let's say I put in 'disagree.' How will they read this?
Will they read it as "I think many personal fortunes are NOT
made by people like that" ... OR "Manipulating money
contributes something (loans provide value)". The question
is so loaded and faulty that any possible response will likely
be incorrectly interpreted. Their test, btw, incorrectly
placed me as basically a moderate republican, which I am
certainly not. -- ilyas
\_ Right, well, I would hope that the intent of that question
would be a judge on economic left-rightedness, where
agreement implies that some control should be put on these
useless capitalists. Based on their rationale I don't think
it has to be flawed, but it obviously can't be perfect and
they likely have a bias anyway.
\_ Except this question does not judge any such thing.
I could be a card-carrying liberal and still believe
most personal fortunes are not made by manipulation
of money (in fact, I don't have handy statistics on
this matter). The question is stupid, as is the entire
test. You have to phrase things a lot more carefully
and 'wordily'. -- ilyas
\_ it didn't say "most" it said "many". Although many is
a relative term. Anyway though I agree, their agenda
appears to be to have right wingers take the test and
discover they're somehow actually lefties. But the
background stuff surrounding it seems sound. And the
bias they do have could be justified if it tests
discrepancies between what someone thinks they think
and what they actually think, if they haven't thought
about it much already. (notions of pol. correctness)
\_ See, you don't understand the nature of my
objection. A test like this only works when a
given response to a question actually
differentiates political views. I gave an example
where the same response could be given by both
a fiscal liberal and a fiscal conservative.
Anyways, it's late, and I am tired of explaining
the same thing three different ways. If you think
it's a good test, that's great. -- ilyas
\_ well you're basically quibbling with the word
"many" in that example. anyway, fine, motd
censor will clean this up before long, g'nite. |
| 2004/3/30 [Computer/SW/OS/FreeBSD, Computer/SW/OS/OsX] UID:29888 Activity:high |
3/29 I'm installing binaries for both OsX and Linux and I'd like all the
users to have /usr/bin/<files> to be accessible. I thought about
/usr/bin/<files> for generic stuff (like scripts) and
/usr/bin/<platform>/<files> for platform specific things.
What is the correct approach to this?
\_ there are obviously several ways to do this, and "correct" is mostly
relative. what you describe is probably the most typical way to
do it though.
\_ FreeBSD way: put all the base stuff in /usr/bin. Platform supported
stuff goes in /usr/local/bin (eg, ports and pkgs). If you're not
using the provided pkg management stuff, put it in /opt.
\_ multiplatform support is a sysadm nightmare. Enjoy patching?
Upgrading Perl/CPAN/emacs and all that crap? Now you've got
2X the problem. There is only one correct way to deal with this.
One OS, nothing else. The correct OS to use is FreeBSD.
\- while the above post begs the question, i think there is
a lot of be said for not worrying about having a shared
dir for "sharable" codes. disk is cheep so i'd just ask soon
a lot to be said for not worrying about having a shared
dir for "sharable" codes. disk is cheap so i'd just ask to
have disjoint os specific trees and not worry about duplication
or keeping them in sync. --psb
\_ Why would you want to do that? Darwin and Linux do not have RW
compatible drivers except for old fashioned HFS (no +). |
| 2004/3/30 [Uncategorized] UID:29889 Activity:nil |
Motd censor hazard level today: SOMEWHAT HIGH |
| 12/24 |